Transcript
Speaker: Welcome to Blind Love Skeptics, where we dissect the highs, the lows, and the downright jaw-dropping moments of Love is Blind.
Speaker: I'm your host, Leah.
Speaker: I'm Dr. Greg.
Speaker: Buckle up, because we're about to dive deep into the roller coaster of emotions of Love is Blind Season 6.
Speaker: You know, I'm glad that we're at the season finale and the recap here of the entire season.
Speaker: I think I probably will watch it again.
Speaker: There was lots going on in the reunion.
Speaker: You changed your tune.
Speaker: You changed your tune because you weren't going to watch it like three weeks ago.
Speaker: That is true.
Speaker: That is true.
Speaker: I think for the sake of the lessons that we can learn about like healthy relationships and what we shouldn't be doing.
Speaker: Totally.
Speaker: Lots of gems there.
Speaker: Where do you want to start?
Speaker: I want to start with Sarah, Anne and Jeremy, cause that's where they started.
Speaker: And I just have lots of thoughts.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Kick us off.
Speaker: So, well, so yeah, I have lots of thoughts there.
Speaker: So they're together.
Speaker: We learned they're still together.
Speaker: He hasn't, you know, I always want them to kind of grow on me.
Speaker: I always want them to kind of like redeem themselves or like, you know what I mean?
Speaker: Like have some quality where I can get on board.
Speaker: I mean, I mean, that's not the reality of reality television, but I was really hoping there was something about, you know, we really did connect.
Speaker: It was a really hard decision.
Speaker: I handled it poorly.
Speaker: You know, we shouldn't have connected via messaging.
Speaker: I was really hoping for some, some connection.
Speaker: Some remorse, some apology, like authentic apology, none, no, no remorse.
Speaker: Neither of them really had any empathy for Laura, like very, very minimal.
Speaker: And that was really hard to watch.
Speaker: And I don't like, I've mentioned, I don't love Laura.
Speaker: Laura is not my, my favorite.
Speaker: Who would?
Speaker: I mean, she likes to call people names.
Speaker: I mean, this is the thing that strikes me from her.
Speaker: But do you think it would be – basically, there's like cognitive dissonance going on with these two.
Speaker: It's like it's hard to acknowledge how the relationship really got going again and feel good about it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, and it's funny because then Chelsea chimes in and she's like, you've been broken up a couple of times.
Speaker: And like, I mean, neither of them are standup people, it seems.
Speaker: And so I don't know.
Speaker: I don't desire to be in that relationship, but who am I?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: The question is, is there, I mean, is there any
Speaker: Is there any space for Jeremy to have actually been there while he was engaged to her and talking to this person who he had a romantic connection with until five o'clock in the morning?
Speaker: No.
Speaker: There's no.
Speaker: And again, I think that's what someone said, does it make you feel better that they didn't hook up or they didn't kiss or anything?
Speaker: No.
Speaker: There's no good reason.
Speaker: I think...
Speaker: anyone in any normal set of circumstances wouldn't be okay with that.
Speaker: I don't think that's, it doesn't matter if they touch physically, if they hugged, if they didn't touch at all, it doesn't make a difference.
Speaker: Cause they're like the, the set of circumstances and what you said previously in a different episode, I think it was one of our first is like, this isn't a, this isn't a normal situation.
Speaker: They all dated each other.
Speaker: It's not even like someone like a mutual friend, right?
Speaker: It's like, this was a actual full-blown relationship.
Speaker: And yeah, no, I,
Speaker: they bother me.
Speaker: It was uncomfortable.
Speaker: They both like just kind of like
Speaker: honestly insufferable.
Speaker: It felt very hard just because there was no redeeming quality.
Speaker: Usually with Clay, which we'll talk about, I don't hate Clay.
Speaker: I don't hate him.
Speaker: There was just nothing that made me feel like any type of support for that relationship.
Speaker: Not that we need my support or anyone's support.
Speaker: You said that there wasn't really an apology.
Speaker: They did recap a conversation that Sarah Ann had with Laura and
Speaker: at the lake, which was one of those episodes in the previous.
Speaker: And I guess she was like talking out of both sides of her mouth.
Speaker: I mean, she was like, she was apologizing, but like, I really don't give an F. You know what I mean?
Speaker: I wanted him, so I was pursuing him.
Speaker: I'm sorry, that kind of sucks.
Speaker: It felt performative.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Because then she doubled down with AD, right?
Speaker: So it was very performative because she apologized, kind of, and then with AD, she kind of doubled down.
Speaker: It was like, I'm not sorry.
Speaker: No remorse.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So yeah, bottom line is if you're in a romantic relationship, there is no space.
Speaker: We can't create space.
Speaker: We can't have sort of profuse boundaries, romantic interests in the past, unless-
Speaker: There are certain circumstances where maybe you were, I mean, we have to talk about this.
Speaker: And I think in the case of Jimmy, maybe in terms of like relationships with previous women and like how much do we let those people stay in our lives?
Speaker: But yeah, in this scenario, bad choices all around.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I have nothing else.
Speaker: I think I just started with them because they started with them and, you know, he wore his Hawaiian shirt, which...
Speaker: He stayed true to himself.
Speaker: So he was, he's been consistent, like consistently him.
Speaker: Like we know who we, you know, you know, we, we know who he is and yeah, I'm not, not thrilled.
Speaker: What are you thinking?
Speaker: What are, where, I think we should pivot.
Speaker: Well, where do you think we should pivot?
Speaker: I wouldn't pivot to AD and clay.
Speaker: Let's go there.
Speaker: Let's go there.
Speaker: You tell me your thoughts.
Speaker: Cause you were a team play.
Speaker: I'm, you know, I think I'm still team clay.
Speaker: And I, and I think at some point,
Speaker: We got to stop giving such props to men for just doing simple things like scheduling an appointment with a therapist.
Speaker: You know what I mean?
Speaker: But for right now, and maybe the next 10 years, I don't know, five years, we can still do the whole thing where, you know, the fact that he's out there talking about his growth, he's out there talking about
Speaker: becoming a better version of himself and being very explicitly vulnerable on TV, as the host suggested, you know, is good for him and for the world.
Speaker: I didn't like, this is what I didn't like most about their interaction during this
Speaker: reunion and it was the fact that he was very like explicitly or directly saying that he loved her that she was his first love of his life and then communicating that he would you know date her again basically i i why i don't like that is because i it almost seems to me like he knows that the door is closed on that
Speaker: And it sort of just like makes him feel good that he's maybe sort of kind of opening the door there, but it's just ultimately confusing.
Speaker: I mean, did you actually think that he was wanting to get back with her?
Speaker: I think he may have once he recognized that she's a fan fave and she's amazing.
Speaker: Like, I feel like it almost took
Speaker: the public, like the viewers and their excitement and, you know, everyone adores her.
Speaker: Like it's, she's, she's like, again, a favorite.
Speaker: And I think maybe there's remorse.
Speaker: I do.
Speaker: I mean, like it's hard, honestly.
Speaker: And we can talk, we'll talk again about like Trevor, but like, it's hard to say now that there's season six, it's hard to, to see,
Speaker: or to really be unsure if there's an authenticity to these interactions at all anymore.
Speaker: Like it really feels like the first season, kind of like the earlier seasons of The Bachelor, there is an element of like they're on TV and they are entertainment.
Speaker: There are some performance qualities of it, but –
Speaker: he seemed like i mean i do think there was something when he said he referenced um oh my gosh that couple i can't remember tiffany and brett um but i don't know he also said he like didn't he say he didn't watch it and then out then he did watch it and then he saw we watched it afterwards he watched it afterwards he's like records and i think he watched it afterwards and maybe he watched that
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I was like, nothing made sense.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I'm not, I think, I think he has remorse.
Speaker: And I think part of the remorse is like, this is what I think.
Speaker: I think he's like, he thinks when he said he was not madly in love with her, I think he has an idea of what love is supposed to be.
Speaker: And you and I have talked about it at great length that love isn't really, I mean, love is passionate, but love is also peace.
Speaker: And I think that peace,
Speaker: piece that they had wasn't enough for him because I think he was expecting it to be like fireworks all the time.
Speaker: That's my take on him.
Speaker: I think he thinks Madeline love, which our culture perpetuates of like being obsessed.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And like it's it's almost very unhealthy.
Speaker: And I think he was looking for that.
Speaker: That's kind of my take on him.
Speaker: Like, I think he loved her.
Speaker: I think he and I think we're all guilty of it, of wanting this thing that's super like specific.
Speaker: But, and you do want to be excited about your partner, but it's not obsessive and like mad about someone isn't necessarily healthy in my opinion.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But so then here's my question.
Speaker: Obviously we can't analyze these people so much because again, we're sort of force fed certain angles and we're pursuing those narratives here on the show.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But he talks about, am I a good person?
Speaker: Am I a bad person on this reunion episode?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so what does he actually mean?
Speaker: When you say you think that he wasn't feeling the fire, like that intense, whatever,
Speaker: did he do you think like in the in terms of what he was saying that he like felt bad for like not wanting to commit to her or not seeing himself with her for the long term because of that or i think he felt bad because i think he i think he's like recognizing he's a product of his of his childhood and of his experiences and he's so fixated on like you know this aspect of commitment and like in dragging her kind of like
Speaker: he even said like she's like i needed her to help me navigate this and she did and he let i think he felt guilt for letting her down okay about i think for like her being so committed and navigate like like being willing will her being willing to navigate it for him like to like hold his hand i think he felt like oh shit like this is a solid person who's willing to like go above and beyond for me i think there's i think he just i think she's amazing and i think
Speaker: He's realizing and I think, honestly, I really do think that probably the viewers has helped him see she's a catch.
Speaker: Yeah, maybe he wasn't able to completely see.
Speaker: I really think so.
Speaker: I think it's like that hindsight's 2020 and you're like, oh, shit, like the one that got away.
Speaker: I mean, I don't necessarily believe that, but I think I think that there's an element there of like everyone loves her.
Speaker: She's actually really great.
Speaker: You know?
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: I mean, what also strikes me is that he really confessed like right after that.
Speaker: We talked about this in the previous episode.
Speaker: He confessed that like, oh, this is not the love of my life.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But then to come back on TV and kind of say that it just seemed a little.
Speaker: No, I don't keep the door open.
Speaker: Close the door.
Speaker: And I think A.D.
Speaker: did a good job there.
Speaker: You had your chance.
Speaker: I'm not and I didn't want to see myself or be your mother.
Speaker: I didn't want to be parenting you.
Speaker: I didn't want to.
Speaker: And no one should be wanting to parent anybody.
Speaker: And even body language, I'm not an expert, but them sitting apart, like, and just kind of, you could tell there was a strain and she was just like, there was not an aversion to him, but like this feeling of like, ugh, like an ick kind of, of like, okay, like done this dance with you, we're done, she's over it.
Speaker: I do think we have to talk about, now that we're talking about AD,
Speaker: the red flag is that she walked towards a red flag again, which is Matthew.
Speaker: And she went on two ish dates with Matthew.
Speaker: And I was so bummed to hear that.
Speaker: That wasn't what I was expecting at all.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, I mean, there's like, there's a parallel here.
Speaker: Uh, and I want to come back to, to, to, you know, sort of plays ultimately idea about the impact of not having a role model.
Speaker: I want to come back to the role model thing, but, uh,
Speaker: Yeah, AD with Matt is like Trev saying he was gonna go experiment with,
Speaker: Like there is a, and his girl, the woman he was dating saying, okay, you can go and experiment on the show and whatever happens, I'll take you back regardless kind of thing.
Speaker: I mean, ADO, like what?
Speaker: I know.
Speaker: Why did you allow that man back into your existence after you clearly understood it was wrong?
Speaker: And by the way, what do you think Matt's-
Speaker: You know, I'm making more differences here.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: What do you think Matt's agenda is here?
Speaker: He's got good PR now from 80 on live television.
Speaker: Oh, it's so annoying.
Speaker: When I was thinking about because that's wrote him down like that wasn't one of the main things I want to talk about is her going back to to Matt again, like this girl who's like, I keep doing the same thing.
Speaker: She knows it.
Speaker: She's had this insight.
Speaker: I keep doing the same thing.
Speaker: I keep going for this guy.
Speaker: like unavailable men basically is what she's, she's, she's told us.
Speaker: And she goes back to him and it was so annoying and frustrating.
Speaker: Cause you're like, okay, right after this failed marriage alter moment, you go back to this other guy who's in a different way, in different form unavailable.
Speaker: And it's just that, that was so disappointing to hear.
Speaker: I, I will, the other thing I was going to say too, is
Speaker: I didn't want to even mention him.
Speaker: I'm like, we're over, Matthew.
Speaker: I don't want to keep giving him a platform of any kind.
Speaker: But I think she was just like, he was cute.
Speaker: That was what she said.
Speaker: That was the rationale.
Speaker: That was the rationale.
Speaker: And that was really frustrating because I was- Breaking her own boundaries, basically.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And she was saying, usually it's about the physical, right?
Speaker: I'm always in these relationships when it's strictly about the physical.
Speaker: And so-
Speaker: She's like, well, we tried love is blind.
Speaker: Didn't work.
Speaker: So I'm going to go back to my old ways.
Speaker: It was strange.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: And I, so I was disappointed.
Speaker: I mean, I still love her, but I was like, all right, hopefully in this last year, this hopefully since Matthew, you know, round two, she's, she's found another way.
Speaker: Cause it's, I was, he politely declined to come, which cause he can't face it.
Speaker: Cause he, he, he knows there's like no, there's no way to justify anything.
Speaker: No.
Speaker: And he already got the benefit.
Speaker: Like I said, she says, well, we went on this first day and he apologized, you know, and he comes off at looking a little, you know, cleaner than he did when he went into this thing.
Speaker: But yeah, listen, when we set boundaries, let's stick to our boundaries.
Speaker: I think you and I agree with that in general.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Don't choose people who choose us, not people who reject us.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Who reject us.
Speaker: And I always tell this to clients and I,
Speaker: If it's hard from the get-go, if it's hard from the beginning, life's hard.
Speaker: It's just not going to get much easier.
Speaker: I think the same thing, I tell my clients the same thing, I preach the same thing on TikTok and elsewhere.
Speaker: When does that start though?
Speaker: When, when, when can the hard stuff start?
Speaker: I was thinking about this the other day, like, can it start like a month and a half in or like, should it, should it be like five months or six months before the, you know what I mean?
Speaker: Like when, when.
Speaker: Good question.
Speaker: That's a good question.
Speaker: Well, I think like the hard meaning, like if like, for example, I feel like the waiting and the guessing, will they text me?
Speaker: When will I hear from them?
Speaker: You know, we're supposed to have plans.
Speaker: Are they like kind of the guessing game and the, like the play, the,
Speaker: If it's like that from the beginning, I'm sorry.
Speaker: Like, and some people will disagree with that.
Speaker: They still think you need to play hard to get that you need to be unavailable.
Speaker: There's still this kind of belief system of you have to play this, like, play it cool and be coy.
Speaker: I don't believe that.
Speaker: And the thing is, is when I see people agonizing from the beginning over not hearing from someone or someone being angry.
Speaker: dry in their communication or not super receptive, like not even through text, but like, you know, they'll, they just don't feel like there's a level of investment.
Speaker: I'm like, why are we staying around for this person?
Speaker: And the thing is, I get it.
Speaker: Cause when you haven't done the work and you feel, you know, insecure and have low self-worth, or you haven't had good role models, like it makes it really hard, but
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So when it gets hard, I think like life things, I mean, hard, like in arguments where you have like differences in opinions or expectations, that's when it gets hard.
Speaker: And that's okay.
Speaker: That's a different- That's okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But I think like, if it's like, you know, with my past unhealthy relationship, it was like, everything was a battle, everything.
Speaker: Like it was, and I, it took me a while to realize like,
Speaker: this is literally everything.
Speaker: Everything is terrible.
Speaker: And you couldn't make a decision without there being some argument or conflict or being picked apart at.
Speaker: And that was different.
Speaker: That shouldn't have, you know, I don't know.
Speaker: I mean, as even, you know, as a couple of psychologists, you
Speaker: who teaches his clients how to communicate deeply about important, meaningful things.
Speaker: I also agree with you that I recognize in the beginning of a relationship, we really ought not to be really stuck in this meta conversation about our attachment and stuff.
Speaker: We really should be in the moment experiencing each other, having fun, being focused on the connection.
Speaker: And if stuff comes up, we talk about it, but not to the degree that you're talking.
Speaker: Really, you're in the weeds very early on.
Speaker: Yeah, we don't really want to see that.
Speaker: You know what I mean?
Speaker: Yeah, I agree with you.
Speaker: And it's funny, I don't know, like, I mean, I think people are excited to, very excited about attachment theory, very excited to understand themselves and like how it plays out into their dating.
Speaker: And I get that, but I do think like, yeah, enjoy, get to know each other first.
Speaker: And then we can really talk about compatibility if it's relevant.
Speaker: Because if you have an awkward first date and you're not feeling it, why do you need to talk about attachment?
Speaker: You don't.
Speaker: Not at all.
Speaker: Don't even answer the question.
Speaker: Have fun.
Speaker: Focus on having fun with the person that you're with.
Speaker: And if you're not having fun, that's the thing you pay attention to.
Speaker: Wait, I want to go before we go on with anybody.
Speaker: I want to go back to Clay just really quickly.
Speaker: I know you're team Clay.
Speaker: Well, team Clay.
Speaker: And also just I have, you know, I have a thing about being a man and the idea of the necessity or not of having a male role model.
Speaker: loving in the way that we want to be loving.
Speaker: So he makes a big deal about, which is understandable and there's nothing to refute, that divorce and having a father who is unfaithful to their mother is going to have some kind of impact, right?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: We understand that.
Speaker: But even his lived example, the father's lived example was that he saw what his father was doing and he did things differently, right?
Speaker: So we might not even need the example of necessarily, I would suggest we do have good skills and we can learn those skills, but to do things better.
Speaker: So I just don't, what do you think?
Speaker: I mean, is it- Do you feel like it's a cop-out, you mean?
Speaker: Like a cop-out?
Speaker: I think it is a little bit, like-
Speaker: I don't even know if that had anything to do with him and her.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: It could have been a cop-out.
Speaker: And I think there are people that use their past, and I talk about this with clients a lot too, is using their past to justify their lack of commitment or their abusive behaviors or their avoidance.
Speaker: And I think it is a cop-out.
Speaker: So it's one thing to own it and then work through it.
Speaker: I think the thing is he just kept –
Speaker: throughout the whole thing was like, I don't know.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Like, this is my past.
Speaker: This is my, my destiny because of this.
Speaker: And, but so the level of accountability, right.
Speaker: Wasn't there.
Speaker: And that's the difference I think is what you're saying is like, you can, you know, our past informs our, it does inform our present, but it doesn't have to dictate our future.
Speaker: And he was kind of using it as like, well, and like, I was there when he cheated.
Speaker: So like, I inherently will do the same.
Speaker: Cause I was there for years and it just, yeah, I agree.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: I think it's a cop-out.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: And the same goes with mental health issues.
Speaker: This is my view, maybe controversial.
Speaker: Like if I've got PTSD, I'm not gonna, and I've worked with many, many couples.
Speaker: I'm a combat veteran myself, I've worked with combat veterans.
Speaker: And I'm not gonna say, well, I'm not engaging with you in the way that I know will feel better or be better for us because I'm hypervigilant or because whatever.
Speaker: I recognize what's going on.
Speaker: And so I do something different.
Speaker: You know what I'm saying?
Speaker: I'm actively engaging.
Speaker: actually working with what it is that I'm dealing with.
Speaker: Versus responsibility, right?
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like, I mean, I, again, I'm someone who's had anxiety my whole life and was diagnosed at OCD at a young age.
Speaker: And, but I know it's my, it's my mental health to manage and it's not anyone else's responsibility.
Speaker: And while it can show up sometimes,
Speaker: it shouldn't dictate all my decisions.
Speaker: It shouldn't dictate my relationship.
Speaker: It shouldn't be, I shouldn't impose on other people.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Cause it's my, it's, you know, I always say like we can understand someone's behavior, but we don't have to let it excuse a behavior.
Speaker: And so I feel very similarly, um,
Speaker: you have to do the work yourself and you can't put it on your partner.
Speaker: It can't be an excuse.
Speaker: And I agree with mental health.
Speaker: I think sometimes it can be more extreme.
Speaker: And it also too, there are communities or people that don't have that awareness, whether there's no real education about it.
Speaker: But once you do have education, it shouldn't be used as an excuse.
Speaker: No, no, no, no.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: I mean, let your partner know what's going on and eventually and let, you know, but no, let's keep striving to be our best selves, whatever that looks like and however that comes up.
Speaker: So what is your thoughts on Trev?
Speaker: Like, was that shocking to you, what we learned during the reunion?
Speaker: So I had heard, it's funny, I tried to actually stay off, like not get all the like dirt and like the tea and like not read all this shit that was coming.
Speaker: Can I say that word on TikTok?
Speaker: Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I, I, I was trying to keep my distance and really have like, I didn't want to be tainted.
Speaker: I wanted to like see this, see everything with fairly like fresh ice, which is strange, but like I did.
Speaker: So I, I, and I thought it was fine from the beginning.
Speaker: I wasn't like team Trevor.
Speaker: They said everyone was like protect Trevor.
Speaker: I was like, he's, he's nice, whatever.
Speaker: I wasn't, I wasn't blown away, but, um,
Speaker: I mean, again, like I think people are going on it, which they acknowledge for the, for clout and for like to build a platform and to have opportunities.
Speaker: And I do think that was what he was obviously after.
Speaker: And he tried to lie and kind of create this thing where I'm sure that relationship was toxic if, you know,
Speaker: if his partner was saying, yeah, you do this, this thing, date people, lie to other people and come back to me and I'll take like, and that's the kind of partner that there is toxicity there for sure.
Speaker: But so I guess the one thing I will say, he couldn't even lie.
Speaker: Like he couldn't, he couldn't justify it.
Speaker: And I'm glad he didn't.
Speaker: Like if we had Matthew not to bring about a Matthew in the hot seat,
Speaker: he would have doubled down.
Speaker: And the thing about Trevor, which, because, you know, people tend to throw around narcissists, I think, way too much.
Speaker: Trevor's not a narcissist.
Speaker: He's probably has a lot of ego, you know, self-involved and just like made a mistake and realized he hurt people and that it was not well received.
Speaker: Matthew would have doubled down.
Speaker: So I do think Trevor even just like saying, can I leave?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: He's like, okay, I'm done.
Speaker: I know.
Speaker: And I was, cause he knew like he even, he was like, he was out of work.
Speaker: He could, he had nothing to say.
Speaker: Wait, wait.
Speaker: So you think, so you're, it's your impression that he faked the funk, like the whole thing or, so you weren't buying what he was saying that he like legit.
Speaker: Were you buying it?
Speaker: I mean, what I was interested in was the idea, which I've seen before, and this is why it was somewhat believable to me.
Speaker: The idea that people are like having a FOMO and then they're telling, I mean, I have folks who are going through this right now, who I'm working with, where they have FOMO and they're like, do I really want to commit to this person?
Speaker: And they're asking, and then sort of like asking their partners for permission to step out and then we'll see about it.
Speaker: Like to open it or take a break and see what's out there.
Speaker: This is not something new to me.
Speaker: This is actually happening in the real world.
Speaker: Well, I know that, but why go on Love is Blime?
Speaker: No, no, no, no, of course not.
Speaker: I mean, there's all these benefits, as you mentioned, in terms of clout and whatever.
Speaker: And he's like this big dude and what, I don't know how many followers he has on TikTok now at this point, but I don't know.
Speaker: I think, I think I am for the, I'm bringing it up.
Speaker: I may be going back to it for the point of like, Hey, listen, if you're in a relationship with someone who says to you, they want to break from you.
Speaker: because they're not sure about that commitment and they're gonna go see about something else, let that be the end of the relationship and say goodbye.
Speaker: Like, forget about you, forget about you.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: I mean, I agree with that in general, right?
Speaker: I think what's hard, and again, I don't think this applies to Trevor, but I think there are couples that get married at a really, they meet and get married at a really early age, or they just like commit to one another.
Speaker: Like, you know, they meet at college and they are like college sweethearts and they miss it on dating.
Speaker: And I can see where sometimes they're like, oh, like,
Speaker: I never got to date.
Speaker: I never had these experiences and I, that's human, but I think it's a difference in being like, can I step out and like, like either end the relationship, which is fair and you're right.
Speaker: And, but I, I do think it's, it's not cool, responsible or respectful to like, be like, can I dip out for a few months and see what's out there and come back?
Speaker: And, um, I think you mentioned this, like breaks, like consistent or like having breaks in a relationship is not a great sign.
Speaker: And I think there are cases where it's
Speaker: like it can make sense but yeah I don't love that and so right if that was the excuse well he said he was kind of like it's toxic anyways it's relationship ended so it's toxic and I don't know I don't buy it though like I get what you're saying I don't know I bought it a little bit I bought it a little bit
Speaker: Well, and she has she has a presence, right?
Speaker: So then my friend who was watching the reunion with like found her like Instagram and like she's like she has a platform.
Speaker: So I think maybe they both really thought this was like a way to make themselves more relevant or known.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I can't.
Speaker: I mean, I don't know.
Speaker: Alas, people chasing clout.
Speaker: No, thank you.
Speaker: So interesting to me that Jimmy and Chelsea, like they didn't really spend any time with them.
Speaker: I mean, I don't know.
Speaker: That's what I found.
Speaker: It was like Jimmy and Jessica, Jimmy and.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Why do we spend so much time on Jimmy and Jessica?
Speaker: Why do we give Jessica?
Speaker: I know you love Jessica.
Speaker: I mean, I was happy they selected her for this other reality TV show.
Speaker: I mean, I don't know if I'll watch it, but yeah, she's a good reality TV personality, that lady.
Speaker: No, she is.
Speaker: She reminds me of a Bachelor or a Bachelor contestant.
Speaker: That's what I see.
Speaker: And she's like perfect for that.
Speaker: But I think they spent too much time on that.
Speaker: I don't really have a whole lot of thoughts on it.
Speaker: I think...
Speaker: I don't think he, I don't know why I'm giving Jimmy so much benefit of the doubt.
Speaker: I think because she was pretty much saying he was creating this narrative and this story that served him.
Speaker: I think he was trying to make Chelsea feel better because it sounds like they become friends.
Speaker: So I think he kind of tried to create this
Speaker: story that made it very clear why he chose chelsea and why jess wasn't a good fit and then so he like embellished there that that date that they clocked is like two hours 23 minutes or something like that and he was like it was 10 minutes i don't know um i think he was trying to i think there's a friendship with him and chelsea and he was trying to protect her that's kind of what i got out of it i don't think he's like evil though like everyone
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: It's very strange.
Speaker: Everyone's really like hates is hating on him.
Speaker: And I don't really I don't again like he made some silly decisions.
Speaker: He he had some moments with AD that probably weren't appropriate.
Speaker: He like, you know, seems a little bit emotionally immature in some ways.
Speaker: But there are a lot of 27 year olds who who also do that.
Speaker: And I didn't hate him.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I mean, it was just, it was a very, I get your point also about, there's like a clean cut narrative that he has about, okay, well, I ended my dream of being with you, Chelsea, when you brought up, you know, me having sex with my friend kind of thing.
Speaker: It was just too clean of a thing.
Speaker: I mean, go back to my, you know, original hypothesis that he wasn't super in turn to begin with.
Speaker: Here's the thing, the one thing I had a problem with and I just want to make a statement about publicly.
Speaker: I hope the one thing people never don't understand what I believe is a healthy love, right?
Speaker: And what's right and what's wrong.
Speaker: This guy explains why he's got this, why he's spending so much time with these women and particularly the one he had sex with.
Speaker: And he sets it up as this sort of false choice.
Speaker: I don't know if you heard this, but it stood out to me.
Speaker: He's like, I have all these guy friends, but I can't be emotional with them.
Speaker: I can't talk to them about vulnerable things.
Speaker: So therefore I have to like maintain this,
Speaker: this friendship with this woman I had sex with.
Speaker: It's like, like- Oh, I don't think he was saying, I thought he was using that explanation for why I thought, well, and I could rewatch it.
Speaker: I was gonna, I thought he was saying that in terms of why he had her on camera.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Like why they were filmed for that scene of meeting the friends, you know?
Speaker: Cause that's part and element of the shows.
Speaker: You meet the friends, you meet the family.
Speaker: And I thought he was saying, I brought them because- That's specifically for that context.
Speaker: That's what I, yeah.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Well, I mean, that's the case.
Speaker: It's a different thing I thought.
Speaker: Bottom line is like you can't, I don't think this is a good excuse for any man to suggest either A, that he's only talks about things with women because they're the ones, you know, if women friends, in other words, because his guy, whatever, that's a cop out again.
Speaker: It's like, no, go create some kind of connection with your guy friends so you can have those conversations.
Speaker: That and the idea of like leaning towards
Speaker: only on our female, our girlfriends, our wives for emotional support and whatever else.
Speaker: I agree it's a cop out, but don't you think this is a product of toxic masculinity and they're in the South and there's like this understanding of what I really think that, I think I'm wondering if it was like in California, would it be the same?
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I think, again, I'm not Team Jimmy, but I keep defending the guy.
Speaker: I think he's just a product of his environment, his age.
Speaker: He's off the hook, Leah.
Speaker: Off the hook.
Speaker: There's only one couple that we haven't talked about tonight, Leah.
Speaker: I know.
Speaker: And there was also not a lot to say of Brittany and Kenneth.
Speaker: Oh, no, I'm sorry.
Speaker: There's two couples that we haven't talked about.
Speaker: Amy and Jimmy.
Speaker: Oh, that's right.
Speaker: My favorite.
Speaker: Oh, wait.
Speaker: Amy and Johnny.
Speaker: Oh, yes.
Speaker: Johnny.
Speaker: I don't have much to say about Amy and Johnny.
Speaker: They're just cute and they're functional and I think they're a healthy dynamic.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Do you have more to say?
Speaker: I do have.
Speaker: I do have.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Well, first of all, I didn't like they sidestepped the condom question.
Speaker: He really did not answer the question.
Speaker: They're like, couldn't you use condom?
Speaker: And they're like, okay.
Speaker: Well, what I learned from this experience was that I didn't know a lot about contraceptives, but he didn't answer the question.
Speaker: Like, why didn't you want to use the condoms?
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: And I wondered what actually got resolved.
Speaker: Like, did his anxiety about finances get resolved?
Speaker: So like they're having sex without a condom now.
Speaker: Because they're married.
Speaker: Like what's like what is actually what is actually transpired here?
Speaker: I also think again like he looks he's just very boyish to me.
Speaker: And I feel like asking the he got like beet red.
Speaker: I think asking the question on like not Nash because you know in front of an audience.
Speaker: I think I think he's like a boy like he they're very sweet with each other.
Speaker: But like he's like like a he reminds me of like a.
Speaker: 13 year old for 14 year old like bashful boy who's like condoms I thought it was a hundred percent but I learned you know like I don't know like isn't there like a point one percent of not working and like I don't know I got I that's my vibe from him yeah I don't know why he looks at he looks at her and he's like look she looks great and she's like he's sexy like you know what I mean like that kiddish boyish yeah he's
Speaker: But I think she adores that.
Speaker: They're very sweet.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Again, I had no notes.
Speaker: I mean, I hear you.
Speaker: But that felt very on brand with him.
Speaker: The bashful and like, I don't know, let's talk about sex in front of this audience.
Speaker: That's weird.
Speaker: There was just this weird energy around it because he's a 13-year-old kid who you can't say 69 without him laughing.
Speaker: Oh, no.
Speaker: I just laughed.
Speaker: I'm a little kid inside too sometimes, I guess.
Speaker: Wait, let me ask you a question.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: The idea of having sex, this has nothing to do with this couple, but it does have to do with sex and condoms.
Speaker: And it just popped in my head.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: The idea of having sex without condoms with your sexual partner,
Speaker: Is there meaning to that for you as a woman?
Speaker: Or do you think there's meaning to that for women?
Speaker: Meaning.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like what is the choice to do that versus wear a condom and having sex is there?
Speaker: Do you see any significance in that in terms of the depth of a commitment or...
Speaker: Yeah, I think there has to be trust, obviously, right?
Speaker: Because you have to know what would happen.
Speaker: Like, are we being proactive together and making a decision together?
Speaker: Or is this just like, we're just going to, I think it's usually, well, my understanding is you, there's like a understanding.
Speaker: So you know, someone's on the pill or you know, someone like you have an understanding of how you're going to
Speaker: do it safely if you're going to, and you don't want, you want, don't want an unplanned pregnancy.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Or, um, yeah, I mean, is that what you mean?
Speaker: Like, I think there's a mutual understanding typically in like, you're, you're, you know, you, you're exclusive.
Speaker: Well, not everyone, but like
Speaker: usually like you hope to be exclusive, right.
Speaker: For your own sexual health.
Speaker: Cause if you're, you know, having sex with your partner without condoms and they're having sex with other people, your sexual health is at risk.
Speaker: So I think there's just an understanding where there, there should be, I don't want to say should, but like in a, you know, a monogamous relationship where you're both communicating expectations.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: And I feel like it's one of those things where,
Speaker: People like adults still don't talk like I mean, I taught sex ed to these kids like are they really using that?
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Like I don't know if people are as communicative as we would hope.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: What do you think?
Speaker: I think there's I think it signifies the fact that they're having sex now they're married, they're having sex, probably without a condom.
Speaker: This is what I'm presuming, although it wasn't very explicitly said.
Speaker: But it probably is, you know, it's about the commitment.
Speaker: It's about shared expectations.
Speaker: Like you said, it's about trust.
Speaker: And I would, I would suggest there's the, in the acceptance of the vulnerability around the potential for like, if both people are fertile, the potential for that to happen, right.
Speaker: Is in itself like a deepening of the relationship.
Speaker: I think there's something deepening about it.
Speaker: having sex without a condom.
Speaker: Anyway, thanks for that conversation.
Speaker: I thought you were like, does it feel good or not?
Speaker: And I was like, I don't know where to answer that.
Speaker: I mean, like, I think most people would say it does feel better.
Speaker: I think most people would say it feels a lot better.
Speaker: But anyway, what do you think about?
Speaker: See, I did write a couple of things for these folks, Amy and Johnny.
Speaker: What are you about this?
Speaker: This idealization of a relationship without any conflicts.
Speaker: I don't want to do that.
Speaker: Without condoms, without any conflict.
Speaker: Conflict.
Speaker: I didn't bring condoms up.
Speaker: That's the last thing I'm going to say about condoms, right?
Speaker: Oh, when they said that, it's funny.
Speaker: I think they have conflict, but it's like, I think they're both...
Speaker: I think they're both very agreeable is kind of the vibe I get generally.
Speaker: Like I know he had very, you know, he like this anxiety about finances and he was like trying to be like, we need to be frugal so we can retire at 50 and, and all this.
Speaker: But I think they're both very agreeable.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: That could be a conflict that could come or can result in conflict in the future if they're both disagreeable with one another and like nobody wants to really make a firm decision or express their needs, right?
Speaker: If they feel like it's, if it's at odds with their partners.
Speaker: I mean, I think they have conflict, but maybe they don't.
Speaker: I bet it's more of like a, are we traveling, you know, on a Friday or a Saturday?
Speaker: And he's like, Saturday, so I could do this thing.
Speaker: And she's like, oh, but I was thinking Friday.
Speaker: And then he's like,
Speaker: Okay, I guess we could do Friday.
Speaker: No, like, I don't, I don't feel like I feel like it's the conflict is like, that's kind of what I when I think she was trying to say like, yeah, I think they're just very optimistic.
Speaker: I mean, I think that exists where
Speaker: there's just some level of optimism and general agreeableness maybe.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: They seem like such agreeable human beings.
Speaker: I mean, I don't like idealizing that.
Speaker: I would love to idealize a fierce, healthy love.
Speaker: For me, a fierce love is one where
Speaker: We have two different people who like there's going to be tension points and it's, it's really about how we navigate those things.
Speaker: Like, would you do this?
Speaker: And so the fact that they're both gentle, that's cool.
Speaker: They're tough.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But yeah, I, I don't like, they said, they said they wanted to go through an experience of like conflict so that they could, I don't know.
Speaker: see that they could do it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I'd rather idealize that those people.
Speaker: And even as parents, like I would rather, and I think you probably would say the same, you know, a child to see parents resolving something effectively and showing affection afterwards.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Then just like parents who like, I don't know, hide all of the things that they, all the conflicts.
Speaker: I agree with you.
Speaker: No, I agree with you.
Speaker: And I think, um, uh,
Speaker: I mean, maybe they just haven't had, I think, I feel like because they're younger.
Speaker: I feel like they're just young and like, they're like, the world is our oyster.
Speaker: And like, I don't know, there's something just like Disney about them, you know?
Speaker: Like, I don't know.
Speaker: Like, is it, is it, is it, like, is that the reality of life?
Speaker: No, but like, they're living in this, in this Disneyland fantasy world and they're cool with it.
Speaker: We'll leave them alone in their little love bubble.
Speaker: They get to exist there for as long as they'd like.
Speaker: Yeah, so the last couple we've got in our final episode of this limited time series.
Speaker: I know, we should have ended with them.
Speaker: I know.
Speaker: I know, I know.
Speaker: We're ending with Brittany and Kenneth.
Speaker: They weren't their friends.
Speaker: It's their friends?
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And they talk a lot.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Who knows?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And, you know, he was saying this, and this is what I was kind of saying in our last episode of like, you know, there are some people who don't express emotion in the same way.
Speaker: They're more reserved.
Speaker: They're more like they're, they, they go inward or they like will process it, you know, with a friend or they will like leave the room to cry and especially males.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: I still don't think we got the answers we needed for that scene.
Speaker: And I guess in a clip, again, my friend showed me, they had mentioned having a real conversation about it not working and the cameras were like, we need to film it.
Speaker: And so then they had another conversation.
Speaker: Either way, though, he still didn't take accountability.
Speaker: And so even just again, like we said, for acknowledging his feelings that were absent, he wasn't feeling the craver.
Speaker: So
Speaker: but he's saying he was having a hard time and we just didn't see it.
Speaker: I was like, also, okay.
Speaker: I know he's a principal, but like, he looked like he was scrolling.
Speaker: Like he looked like he was just like scrolling, like on TikTok doing whatever.
Speaker: I didn't, he didn't look, he was writing emails.
Speaker: Like he looked bored and just like, kind of like that detached look.
Speaker: Like, I don't know.
Speaker: It's like what a lot of us do, right.
Speaker: We're waiting in line, like at the grocery store, just kind of like scroll.
Speaker: Like,
Speaker: It felt mindless.
Speaker: There didn't seem to be a lot like he was doing on his phone.
Speaker: He was like, I can't, you know, occasionally smirked at his phone.
Speaker: Like, I don't know.
Speaker: It was strange.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, how much, I don't know how much email are you going to do on your phone?
Speaker: I mean, if, if he's trying to stay in contact with like the entire community, which he was making it sound like.
Speaker: I imagine he'd be on a laptop, like sending those emails.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: It did.
Speaker: Yeah, go ahead.
Speaker: I was like, I don't think I also want to minimize his role as a principal at a middle school, but I just felt like, why was he on it?
Speaker: Like, at like, it's, he's always like, he's on his phone constantly.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Emailing?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, the one thing I think is, was he 25 or something?
Speaker: 25, 26?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like maybe it's his first leadership role and he's super immersed in it and whatever else.
Speaker: But the bottom line is, and they didn't talk about, like you said, in this reunion, they didn't really talk about
Speaker: him in any of this, like him not showing affection.
Speaker: Like they didn't talk about it at all.
Speaker: But I did like the point that she made
Speaker: about like not needing to have like penetrative intercourse to know whether or not you want to have that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I like that too.
Speaker: One, cause like she had said earlier, like, I want to still like be intimate with you in a different way.
Speaker: Like until she, she wanted it, she still knows there needs to be attraction, right.
Speaker: And chemistry and like, she was never saying there, like, I did get what she was saying and she's well-spoken.
Speaker: I just like, I felt like she just,
Speaker: like is a class act and he, I just can't put my, I just can't figure him out.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: We, we, we shouldn't have ended on them.
Speaker: They're kind of just like, there's like, what are your biggest takeaways?
Speaker: What are your biggest takeaways from this season?
Speaker: You've been watching this show for a while.
Speaker: What's your biggest.
Speaker: Can you see all the OG couples?
Speaker: So I liked.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: My biggest takeaway is that Nick and Vanessa got the memo.
Speaker: They, they got the notes and they knew how to stay very confined to certain topics and to just like ask the questions that viewers wanted to hear versus their own opinions and like, whatever.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: I think I didn't – I didn't love them paying all the questions with the OG couples.
Speaker: Like I could care less.
Speaker: I mean I could care less.
Speaker: I just – I was like why are we spending so much time?
Speaker: I remember the Colleen and that guy who I think still look kind of miserable together.
Speaker: Like maybe that's just their resting – they have a resting bitch face, but she looks like she's unhappy.
Speaker: And we have Gigi who is a mess with this other guy who's a reality –
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I didn't feel like it was necessary.
Speaker: I do like that they brought on the couples again, like Brett and Tiffany who were like, like able to express like kind of the, the, the life after that felt a little, that felt more relevant because it was more recent and, and Clay connected with Brett.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So I felt like there was that, like, that was kind of cool, but I was like, we don't need this.
Speaker: Like, I don't know.
Speaker: I like the live audience too.
Speaker: I like seeing people's responses.
Speaker: I like both those things new or no.
Speaker: The audience is new.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I didn't know that.
Speaker: The audience is new.
Speaker: And the OGs, yeah, no, the OGs are, that was new.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I was like, I don't need to hear, I don't need to see you all.
Speaker: I'm not one to follow these couples online.
Speaker: I mean, I mean, let them live, you know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I didn't know any of those stories.
Speaker: So I wasn't, and I, and I imagine the entire episode, that last episode could have been like 30 minutes long.
Speaker: Cause they kept going back to the OGs.
Speaker: I was like, can we wrap it up?
Speaker: And also I was like, I wanted more, like we said on Chelsea and Jimmy.
Speaker: So I felt like that was anticlimactic and it was like, what are we doing here?
Speaker: I don't need to hear about this couple who looks miserable.
Speaker: I just don't.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I was thinking about that when I was watching that you have no idea who lots of these people are.
Speaker: So yeah.
Speaker: Oh my gosh.
Speaker: So are you going to watch the next season of love is blind?
Speaker: Probably.
Speaker: Probably.
Speaker: Of course.
Speaker: I, but you know, it's funny.
Speaker: I was like, I hope.
Speaker: And this is just me being, they're going to bring on these personalities like Trevor, like Matthew, like Jeremy for the sake of television.
Speaker: Cause I was thinking, you know, maybe with Chelsea, that girl, you never saw their season, but like, maybe they're like bringing on these people who like, well, you know, select people with the best intention.
Speaker: But I'm like, no, that's reality television that we're, we're going to get some, like some bad apples.
Speaker: Um, no, of course I'm going to watch it.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Sounds like you are.
Speaker: I think I probably will.
Speaker: I probably, I probably will.
Speaker: And who knows?
Speaker: We might do another limited series.
Speaker: I'm doing a recap.
Speaker: This was a lovely experience.
Speaker: I think we're still skeptical though, right?
Speaker: Oh yeah.
Speaker: Is love blind?
Speaker: Love is not blind.
Speaker: Love is not blind.
Speaker: Well, I was not blind.
Speaker: The reason I think that the ones that are making it in this season, Amy and Johnny, is they're like similar level of attractiveness.
Speaker: Like they're both kind of average, attractive people.
Speaker: I think there's probably some consensus around that.
Speaker: and i don't think they're very different there's not a significant difference in their level of attraction i think if if we found that i don't know i don't know if that would have worked i think it just worked out because like like i think if we were to have like 30 people in a singles event i think there would have been like
Speaker: at least two, one or two couples that would have like hit it off, like maybe not get married, but would have found each other and been like, oh, okay.
Speaker: Like if we had that crowd, I think that, I don't think it's about the pods.
Speaker: I don't necessarily.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's about the individual characteristics and the match and compatibility when it comes out.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: On all of them.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Maybe they should just do that.
Speaker: Just throw them at a bar and just like, let's just, I mean, why hasn't that been a TV show?
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Let's propose it to the level of people and see if they fight.
Speaker: Well, Leah, this has been absolutely a ton of fun.
Speaker: I appreciate doing the series with you.
Speaker: And let's do another one.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: So fun.
Speaker: Until next time.
Speaker: Until next time.
