Transcript
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Hello listeners, welcome. I'm Bridget.
Caroline: And I'm Caroline.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: You are listening to Hearth Home and Homicide, a family production about family murders. Caroline and I research and narrate each story. Andy is our producer.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Caroline and I try to figure out what is going on with this family at the center of the case. We know that the ripple effect of family murder never ends for the victims.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: families. We see how a killer in the family is responsible for immeasurable destruction and trauma. So listener discretion is advised.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Caroline, we do have a humdinger today that happened in Australia and it just happened.
Caroline: Yeah. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And most of our listeners have heard about it. Some may know a lot about it. And we hope to give those listeners something new to comprehend.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But we're talking about Erin Patterson, the Death Cat Mushroom Killer, who killed her mother-in-law, her father-in-law, tried to kill her husband, but his husband, you know, was smarter, too smart for her.
Caroline: yeah
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: killed her aunt by marriage and killed her pastor who's married to her aunt in law.
Caroline: why
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So
Caroline: I think he survived. The pastor survived. But he's forever damaged because his liver.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: yes.
Caroline: He has to have a liver transplant now. and like he
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: ah yeah Oh yeah. He, yeah.
Caroline: It was no just seed poisoning.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And I've seen him give brief messages. He's not verbose. He just says when um Heather died, i I, you know, I'm now leading half life.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And, um you know, he doesn't talk about what it's like to be a liver transplant per recipient.
Caroline: god
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But what that means is that he is very compromised all the time.
Caroline: all the time.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: um And, you know, it's very sad. and And after the trial, he even told all of the people on the stoop of the courthouse wait when he came out, he just said, I hope everyone can just be kind to one another.
Caroline: Oh yeah he's faster.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: You know, ah he's a pastor. He's a Baptist church pastor.
Caroline: Well, and it's shocking. It wasn't like a car wreck. It's not like a i mean, when I think of poisonings, I'm thinking of medieval sort of like fake Game of Thrones type movies, which I know that the medieval times were real.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Right.
Caroline: But I mean, to me, it's so far removed from reality. Or, you know, Russian spies or whatever, like some espionage from some other place ah besides a place like Australia. I don't know. It just is a little bit scary.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: It's very scary. the Now, we have covered some poisonings before.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: The woman who poisoned her ex-husband, her former husband, and then her new husband, and tried to blame that murder on her daughter.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: That's right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: i mean, you know, we we've heard but about diabolical before. we We seek them out.
Caroline: That's true.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: We're diabolical, heat-sensing rockets, but... Really, I've never seen anything of this heinousness,
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: um lack of empathy, just the diabolical ah evil. I mean, these are words I don't even really don't come close to how bad this woman is.
Caroline: right
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So let's get started. As I said, today's episode is a is a recent case of family murder occurring in Australia and followed all around the world.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I believe it attracted worldwide imagination because if Erin Patterson were to be truly guilty of this family murder, then that would make her at the top of the creepy, vicious murder heap.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And she was. she i mean, it's saying a lot to be at the top of the creepy, vicious murder heap.
Caroline: Yeah. Mm-hmm. yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But, you know, she she was convicted of triple murder and attempted murder. of one of her family members, but four victims, well as we know there are so many other victims, but four direct hit victims.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She poisoned members of her family she claimed to love with death cap mushrooms. Death cap mushrooms are responsible for 90% of worldwide mushroom poisoning throughout the world.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So,
Caroline: Mushrooms are are fascinating to me because they seem like much like honeybees, like one of the central core stitches of the universe. You know what I'm saying?
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yes, yes.
Caroline: and And yeah, in the spectrum of mushrooms, there's capacity to absolutely ravage your body into death.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Right. Well, death cap is the worst.
Caroline: Or...
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: It's the worst.
Caroline: Yeah. Or there's this other end of the spectrum where you just get this euphoric brain opening spiritual awakening. I mean, it's just interesting. I'm just going to throw that out there about mushrooms.
Caroline: They scare me. I'm not going to lie. I don't prefer them for food, but I i also don't dabble in them because of this kind of stuff.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: No, no, I'm not going to eat a mushroom.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Absolutely, death cat mushrooms wait several hours after eating to strike. And when they do, they tear your entire body to bits.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And then there is a reprieve, like, oh, I'm going to get better, followed by death, by its victims' liver dissolving, and then all of the organs ah in the digestive system dissolving.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And probably every organ in your body starts to dissolve after that.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So it is just so sinister. It defies my vocabulary to explain how horrendous these things are in terms of a way to kill someone.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So, i mean, it's just awful. For Erin Patterson to use these mushrooms to feed to her mother-in-law, her father-in-law, her mother-in-law's sister, which would be her aunt, she also tried to murder her aunt's husband, who is a pastor of the Baptist Church where Erin went to church.
Caroline: Thank you.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Erin's murder spree with death-capped mushrooms is almost incomprehensible to the human mind. Just zero empathy. You know, like lack of empathy is an understatement.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: You got the opposite of empathy.
Caroline: Right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Cruelty. just You know, diabolical long-term planning. Nothing about her plot put her off. She never hesitated.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She felt only revenge and glee in the horrors awaiting her victims. So she's like those villains on TV. They have the long fingernails and they have very bony long digits and they're putting them together under their chimney like that.
Caroline: right
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I mean, just almost, almost literal. it It's hard to believe that a literary bromide like that character could be real.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: ah Right. But we've I've seen more than I thought I ever would.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: yeah Right, right. Only the pastor survived, but not easily. he is greatly compromised, spending two months in the hospital.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: He has to live with a liver transplant and the loss of much of his family. So, now, Caroline, these people are in their 60s and 70s.
Caroline: And out of nowhere.
Caroline: They're, oh, he's lucky he survived, truly. But he might not feel that way, but.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Well, he might or might not see it that way. No. So why did she do it? Who is Erin Patterson before becoming the world's most cruel and diabolical family murderer?
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Erin Trudy Patterson was born on September 30, 1974, in a town called Waverly, which is a suburb of Melbourne, Australia. Her maiden name was Sutton.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Her father was a government worker of good repute. Her mother was a university professor. So she was in a family, Caroline, who had the means to raise a family well-nourished in body and in mind.
Caroline: Well, yeah, those are great gigs. ah You know, government work, I think, is really commendable because it's a work typically geared towards service. And then university professor, you're saturating yourself with the growth and learning of other humans.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: oh Absolutely.
Caroline: I mean, these are really good. These are solid professions,
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah, so, I mean, you know, how could this person arise from the midst of that beauty as a couple? She had one sister, not as lot is but known about her, although she did testify in court.
Caroline: Right. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But anyway, Aaron was nothing at all that screamed... psychopathic killer or malignant narcissist. She didn't do any dog and cat killing that I could find.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I mean, she didn't, you know, ah lie all the, wait, she did lie all the time.
Caroline: right
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Psychopaths, typically you can find that in their past, but more central to psychopathic behavior ah would be a child who is starting out on dogs and cats and rabbits and things like that.
Caroline: yeah
Caroline: Right, yeah. Yeah. yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: There's just torturing them. So I'm going to move off that subject because it's hard for me to think about. But she didn't have any of those bits when she was young. But while she was mostly awkward and peculiar, that's what people thought about her. She grew up to be, you know, a fairly well-adjusted adult.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But there was always always away something kind of weird and edgy about Erin throughout her life. That's what everybody says about her. There's plenty of weird, edgy people.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I am drawn to weird, ja edgy people.
Caroline: I was it just going to say, this is what makes it difficult.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: She's got none of the malignant narcissist tendencies in the childhood like we see after. It's like one the, this is the example of where you don't, you can't apply any of the stuff we know until an after event because this
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah. And, you know, maybe she was doing things that she hid very well.
Caroline: That's it. Right. That she was able to hide really well. But I mean, I i like, I'm with you.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: So far, you've described someone I want to hang out with.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: Awkward, peculiar, super smart.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah, sure. sure Why not? Why not?
Caroline: But, yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Sometimes people who are bookish and they're kind of solitary, well, they live in my house and I live alone.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So there you go.
Caroline: Exactly. Exactly. I come over sometimes and then you have two of them. Just kidding.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: ah Yes. ah Yes, that's true. We have our little, but ah ah what is that called? A sorority of two.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So she seemed to be drifting as a young college student. I mean, she got into college very easily. She's whip smart.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And as a young adult, she was kind of moving in and out of different degree programs. She was very smart, but she was feckless. She never could self-direct. She never could make show of her
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: ah good show of her ah tenaciousness to stick with her goal.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She just sort of, you know, was flopping around and um she just didn't seem to have the capacity to commit to anything for very long.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She wasn't cozy with anybody in her groups. I mean, she was actually mean to groups that she was in history shows.
Caroline: Mm-hmm.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So, for example, in college, she drifted from one major to another. She did well, and whatever she undertook, she just didn't fit in. She was rude to people. She would get...
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: far down the academic path and then lose interest, and she didn't get along with any of her cohorts in her classes. So, okay, today's students were going to put you in a group of four, and everybody's just praying to whatever deity they have in their lives to say, please don't put me in a group with erin but Aaron Scudder or Aaron Patterson.
Caroline: Yeah. Yeah.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So in 1992, then Erin Scudder was accepted for a science course of study at the University of Melbourne, a prestigious science course.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Later, she switched to accounting. Okay, what?
Caroline: that weird
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So she's a promising science student getting into a very difficult program. Oh, never mind. I think I'm going to be in accounting.
Caroline: Yeah, I wonder how much of that is like fear of committing to something. You know, like there is this trend with her where she, other than the, think you're going to talk about, you know, she tries all these things, but like she doesn't ever actually finish anything.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: No, no, she's, yeah.
Caroline: Which is like, is she afraid of that piece of it? Does that expose something that she's managed to hide this whole time? You know, like you're saying, we don't see her as being these narcissistic, tend maybe this is part of that.
Caroline: Like then then when she's got to apply some knowledge, because she, this meanness is all, it has been interesting to me. Like why, why default to be such a horrible person for others? Because we've all met someone like that.
Caroline: So it's not a foreign concept to me.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Rude people, rude people, people who are just fine putting you down.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: it
Caroline: Hmm.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I don't know. I mean, toward the end, I sort of feel like I... i I maybe think that she's somebody who resents other people utterly, and she um doesn't want to be in this situation anymore.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So instead of giving herself a pep talk and looking at the pros and cons of sticking with her program, instead of doing that, um or realize that sometimes emotions are fleeting,
Caroline: Yes. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Instead of doing that, she just quits. She's a quitter.
Caroline: ah yeah yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And um so anyway, ah so she wants to be an accountant. So she goes down that path for a while. Then she drops out of college and she decides out of nowhere to take a course in air traffic controller, which requires a certification.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: This is one of the most difficult professional certifications to pass in the world.
Caroline: Well, thank God for that. Because it ought to be. Make it harder every year. Because, oh my gosh, it's one of the most important.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yes.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Erin Patterson was able to pass that certification without breaking a sweat.
Caroline: Yeah, see, she's super smart.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And she went to work as an air traffic controller. She was a menace, not because she's she's not good at her job.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She was most definitely competent. Following her graduation, she worked as an air traffic controller with Air Services Australia in Melbourne between February 2001 and November 2002.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So, a little over a year, basically. Well,
Caroline: Just under two.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Almost two years, yeah.
Caroline: Yeah. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She was very cruel to her co-workers, scheming all the time, arguing with anyone and everyone about anything and everything. She was rude.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She was deceitful. She was rude and deceitful, aggressive, and generally toxic.
Caroline: oh
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She's what we would call today a toxic co-worker.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She ran a scheme, for example, she ran a scheme by which she pretended to be a co-worker calling in sick, thereby knowing that she would be offered the shift by default.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And then when she would show up for the shift, the other person would show up and they would be sent home because they called in sick.
Caroline: Because they were ill.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And they would stand there going, no, I didn't.
Caroline: That's...
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Well, you're sick, so you probably don't remember.
Caroline: Oh my god. That's really diabolical. That seems like a scene from a movie. Almost it seems too... Too treacherous.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I mean, her motive, apparently, i don't think she feels motivated to be rude. I think that she is wired to be rude.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And she's not scheming to be scheming. She is hardwired to be scheming.
Caroline: Right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And she did this particular scheme to get better shifts. So she decided what shift she wanted, figured out who was on shift, and called in sick for that person.
Caroline: just I mean, this is wrong, but this is that slippery slope I'm talking about because this is that innovation. Like it makes me think of the scene from the movie where Will Smith is like pursuit of happiness and he's like, I don't put the phone down. i just click it with the one finger and dial. He's like, I save a second per phone call. That means I get to make five extra phone calls per day. That puts me up. but I mean, it's not a wrong methodology for success. It's just then you apply it like she did here.
Caroline: You're hurting other people, you know, as a means to accomplish it.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Well, you know, I don't know about this particular employer, but I was in human resources for 40 some years total.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And I don't think I ever met a manager who wanted to confront a mean, nasty employer because they're afraid of the backlash.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: Absolutely.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So they just have little talks and
Caroline: Yep.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And then they give a warning. And then they give a second first warning.
Caroline: I love those.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Then they get a third first warning. This has either changed or radically since I left nine years ago or and retired.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: aunt Or it's still going on today.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Managers and supervisors Just do not want to confront a nasty, nasty, nasty, scheming, lying employee.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: Yeah. yeah I think that's, that yes. And I think it's it's not even just in the employment context anymore. I think in public, we don't want to confront these people.
Caroline: I think in our worlds, we just want to just get them the hell away from us so that we don't have to deal with it.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Oh, God, yeah.
Caroline: You're right. You're right. no but Yeah, nobody wants to deal with that.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: In 2004, Erin worked as an animal management employee. She still goes by Erin Scudder. She's not married yet, but she's fixing to be married. 2004, Erin worked as an animal management employee for RSPCA Australia at the Monash City Council's headquarters.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And in that same year, she began dating Simon Patterson, who worked as an engineer at Monash City Council. Now, Simon liked Erin because she was had a great sense of humor.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: i would say dark, but anyway, a great sense of humor. And she was so intelligent. He was really drawn to that. They had two children together after they married. And after they started having kids, you know, things kind of didn't go that well.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Before those kids came along, though, Erin came into a very large inheritance from her grandmother's estate. We're talking millions of dollars, Caroline.
Caroline: Really?
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah, I need a grandmother. Anyway, so before the kids, Erin and Simon decided to use some of that money to travel extensively.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: They lived for a short time in West Australia, And Aaron owned an old bookstore there, and then they went to, like, Darwin, and then they went to Europe, and then they went.
Caroline: Fun.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I don't know where all they went, but they traveled and they spent some of that money.
Caroline: would cheer me right up.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: It would cheer me ah up, too. They also acquired some property and stuff like that, so they were well off. Over the ensuing years, Aaron and Simon would split up, get back together, split up, get back together, over and over and over. Basically, they temporarily separated a lot until they finally separated for good in 2015.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Sort of. I say sort of because in 2015, they finally did it for good. But they still went on family vacations together.
Caroline: I mean, this is, you know, the new normal.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: They... Well, I can see that, you know.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: If you have a good relationship, you can do that. They went to South Africa with the kids. They went to Botswana with the kids. They went to Darwin. They went to New Zealand. They went to South Australia. They went all over.
Caroline: That's cool. This sounds really nice.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: On vacation. Yeah, it does.
Caroline: and
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Then in 2011, Erin's father died. And in 2019, when her mother died, the vast estate of properties and wealth that they had was split between Erin and her sister.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: This furthered Erin's wealth, of course. And she just did whatever she wanted to do. She would enroll in this, enroll in that, start the studies, quit the studies, raise the kids, try different things.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She was just, you know, she had a lot of money.
Caroline: I mean, it sounds like a really nice lifestyle. Honestly, it sounds a little bit akin to one of those bored housewives in the 50s and 60s kind of lives where you, you know, that can go dark real fast when you're bored intellectually.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: You know, most, most human beings, all over the world probably, but ah we'll just talk about the ones that we've researched. Most human beings seek ah stasis, stability, for things to kind of stay the same.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Then you break it up. It's called a vacation.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: then you might have a midlife crisis and you go into another field of study because your kids are in college or maybe even out of college.
Caroline: Right. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But I think this sort of marks Aaron as being, you know, unstable.
Caroline: Yeah, she's like you said, feckless all over the place and has been forever. But she's mean while doing it, which is which I'm I guess I'm finding a conflict there.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Oh, yeah.
Caroline: Typically, feckless people are in my totally stereotyped mind, cool, chill people that just simply don't know what they want to do. But like, right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Right, yeah. Like la-di-da-di-da-di-da.
Caroline: And they're all smart.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah. Yeah.
Caroline: But like, she's uber smart. And could literally pick anything, has interests maybe. I don't know. She's feigning interests. But then pivots, like you're saying. Just like that the two aren't meshing for me, the two behaviors.
Caroline: I don't know.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And what's dangerous about this, in my opinion, is that she has it in her mind that she is impervious to the forces of life as a human being on planet Earth.
Caroline: Yeah, like karma, right? Like the good energy out, good energy back, bad energy out, bad energy back kind of thing.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah, well, I'm talking about the fact that, ah you know, she is her she's training her brain to not be accountable for normal social mores and norms.
Caroline: Yeah, yeah, right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And whereas, ah you know, most of us feel like we want to belong to a larger community.
Caroline: Right. Yeah. Yeah. yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And um so anyway, back inside, ah back back in the story here, story here Because inside of Erin Patterson might be a world record of resentment and revenge urge.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I think she has revenge on her mind all the time against imagined or real, you know, insults, um this divorce.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: You know, she made her husband... pay for a lot of stuff with those kids until somebody in the court system told him she is independently wealthy. You do not owe her any money.
Caroline: Aww.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And yeah, she owes you money, you know, that kind of thing.
Caroline: Yeah, I was going to say, the court needs to step up and help people in these areas more.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: That's right. That's right. Anyway, let's talk about the events prior to the murder. In 2022,
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Aaron and Simon's relationship deteriorated after he filed a tax return, which was the first one he'd ever filed that he listed as being single.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And why would he do such a thing? Due to this change in his relationship status, which I just mentioned a minute ago, Aaron became ineligible for government child support payments.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: with Simon being told by a federal government agency to stop paying for his children's school fees and medical fees, while Simon claimed that this change in status was the result of a mistake by his accountant.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: He didn't want Aaron to be mad at him the
Caroline: Isn't that funny, Steve? bunny see even he's a ah afraid to confront this.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: him. Oh, yeah, oh, yeah.
Caroline: He doesn't.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: The incident did, though, damage the couple's relationship. And why would he do something like this and then blame it on another person, this ah fictitious or maybe real accountant?
Caroline: Mm-hmm.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Fear, maybe?
Caroline: Totally.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Well, there's I'm going to so i'm goingnna state as a matter of fact in my head that exists. I don't know for an investigative process fact, but I know for a fact.
Caroline: Right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: The reason that he is scared to death is because between November 21st and September 22nd, so we're talking almost a year, Simon was hospitalized three times with gastrointestinal symptoms that were very mysterious, with the second incident resulting in him being in a coma and requiring life-saving surgery.
Caroline: god. Oh my god.
Caroline: Uh...
Caroline: ah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: He had to get part of his intestines removed, Caroline.
Caroline: I think we just found the red flag making factory in this story.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Uh-huh.
Caroline: Like, oh my God.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yes. Yes.
Caroline: ah She's, she's, she's, I'm sorry.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yes.
Caroline: I'm looking at the dates and she's a, she's an air controller at this time. So she's hating everyone. and like, she's trying to kill her husband.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I don't know.
Caroline: Oh my God.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: a medical and medical expert report commissioned for the trial of the killings stated that Simon's symptoms were consistent with the ingestion of barium carbonate, an ingredient in rat poison.
Caroline: jesus jesus yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: These incidents were not pursued once Erin was arrested and charged with triple murder and attempted murder of ah her one surviving poison victim. So it gets kind of complicated, and I am going to give you a timeline in a minute.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: In the two years leading up to the family lunch on July 29, 2003, where death was on the menu, Erin's relationship with her in-laws had become estranged.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Erin missed several family events, attending some others only briefly. briefly Erin believed that she had been snubbed when she received a late invitation to her mother-in-law Gail's 70th birthday celebration around May 23.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Erin had also posted several social media messages to her friends online criticizing her estranged husband and her in-laws. So she's peeved that Simon is not doing what she says to do anymore and he's not giving her money anymore and these in-laws are snubbing her because probably they think that she tried to kill him three times.
Caroline: Oh yeah. Oh yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah, so she is seething with private rage and revenge motives and And ah the world is going to see that when the trial comes along.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So let's bring it on. Let's talk about the the deadly lunch and the deaths. And I first want to say she murdered loving, caring, community-based, beloved people.
Caroline: so yeah
Caroline: Well, she lured them with a false love as well. She it just is nasty, bad, nasty, bad.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yes.
Caroline: Diabolical and evil, like you said, don't even rise to the occasion here. What?
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: No, ah you know, it makes you want to go back to burning witches at the stake. So anyway, Erin had moved into the countryside because she's loaded with money and she built her own home now that, you know, her ex-husband is going to actually act this way.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And she had just finished when her mind turned to murderous revenge. I'm in this big, beautiful home. This is my big, beautiful home. I have my children half the time, and I love my children, but I don't want them half the time. I want them all the time.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And I'm reading her mind here, so obviously this is just my opinion, but I believe that she just put it in her mind.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I don't want this family any anymore. They don't treat me right. We'll see what they think of me now after I do what I'm fixing to do. And I believe she began to think like a murderer, act like a murderer, and she became a murderer.
Caroline: Well, it does make me question whether she actually did or did not kill any dogs or cats early in her life because this poison stuff is serious. I mean, this is very hidden. This is very diabolical, like because it is so hidden.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Oh, there's no worse death.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: No worse death.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So months before the murder, Erin was interacting with a large group of YouTubers and Facebookers. She spent a lot of time online, which is great for her trial because she's making comments up the gazelle, you know.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Anyway, she told all of these people that she's, you know, speaking to she told them about her glorious interest and skills and success in identifying and foraging mushrooms. Now,
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Why this? So in Australia, julia during lockdown for COVID, which was 2020, citizens could take two hours a day to go and do things like shop or go outside.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: They still had to social distance, but they had to stay indoors the rest of the time. So Erin took her kids mushroom picking and was enthralled with this new love.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: telling her online community that she pulsated mushrooms into a powder and put them in her kids' brownies and they couldn't tell.
Caroline: Dangerous.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: um God. She smack-talked online with her ex-husband. I mean, about her ex-husband. She smack-talked his family savagely in between her little nature romps.
Caroline: Hmm.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And then on one of the websites she frequented about mushrooms, Erin saw what she needed to accomplish her murderous plot.
Caroline: m
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: There's a site called iNaturalist. It's a web-based repository of information about the natural world. And on the mesh mushroom front, people would post their findings where they found this or that mushroom.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Aaron noticed weeks before the murders that death cat mushrooms had been found in three regions under oak trees where they grow. This meant a warning to all people about the deadly horrors of consuming death-cap mushrooms.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: People all over were dispatched as volunteers to go and pick and destroy these death-cap mushrooms if they were found. And the government picked put up these huge signs where the mushrooms were found to be liking to grow around the oak tree.
Caroline: Oh, wow.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: They only grow around oak trees.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: um And they put up these signs so if anybody just, you know, serendipitously came upon this site and found these mushrooms, there was a big sign telling them, don't eat these mushrooms.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: They would know. Don't touch
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Don't eat any mushrooms in this area.
Caroline: I mean, not the work of the noxious weed folks in all communities across globe is really difficult. It's difficult work.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: It is difficult work. Erin did research on her laptop and how many death cat mushrooms were needed to poison one person fatally.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So then she found another website with a mathematical thing where you could say how much you needed of something and how many would you need if there were five people.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Like, you know, if you wanted to put ah this spice in a food,
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: how and how much would you need for five? And then she would just put in the kilograms of what you, you know, she just, it was online what she was doing.
Caroline: I know. And you, forensically, they can really piece together almost everything that a user is doing online, picture by picture, frame by frame.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She was...
Caroline: But they don't, I think the only things that they're limited on is to see like what area on the page you were focused on. Right. So if it's like a series of links, but otherwise, yeah, they would have known she's 20 minutes.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: i mean, she was on a... She was on single-purpose pages, believe me. I mean, she how much does it take to kill you times five?
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: That's so crazy. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah. Erin Patterson arranged for a lunch. She indicated to her invitees that it was just vital that she meet with them for a special lunch in order to discuss her recent health diagnosis and how her children will need help.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: you know, so and so forth, and please help her determine the best way to tell them, given their tender ages of nine and seven at the time.
Caroline: Uh-huh.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: The kids would not be present. The invitees were ex-husband Simon Patterson, his parents, Don and Gail Patterson, her aunt-in-law, Heather Wilkinson, who is Gail's sister And Gail's sister's husband, Ian Wilkinson, who was also the preacher at the Baptist Church where Erin once attended before she and Simon had split.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But, you know, coming of easing up to this invitation, she went to the church.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She went to the church in person and asked the pastor in person to come with his wife to this lunch. I really need your guidance.
Caroline: she
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I have a serious illness.
Caroline: It's like a nurse ratchet over here. Just oof.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Worse than that. Erin made a big deal about how she is learning how to make this important lunch of beef wellington. You know, I'm going all out. I'm going to make beef wellington.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Now, beef wellington is a juicy flank of beef covered in finely crusted, dried, and powdered mushrooms and spices of all sorts.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And they then it's slipped inside of a puff puffy crust.
Caroline: who
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And once done, it's got you've got this long, puffy, you know, yummy thing that is usually, so you know, sliced into and
Caroline: Looks like bread, but then you... Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: cuts and it's very pretty when it's cut and put on a plate, and it's very tasty. She was also planting mashed potatoes and green beans, very traditional with this dish.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So weeks before the meal, Erin spent a great deal of time hydrating her death cat mushrooms and some other non-lethal mushrooms and sought out all the spices needed to mix with the mushrooms.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Then came the test of her, you know, plan because Simon texted her and told her in this text, I've decided not to take you up on the lunch that's for the 29th because I just don't feel comfortable.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She told him, hey
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I have slaved over this beef wellington. I have spent a ton of money on this beef and all the spices and everything. And I really need you to be there. I expect to see you.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I expect to see you. But he did not come. So he's starting to break away from her grip.
Caroline: well
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: but not her in-laws. Her in-laws were kind of like, you know, this is good. I mean, we can kind of get back together and, you know, we don't need to bust up the family. For the children, we really ought to maybe give it a go.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: i mean, that was the discussion. These are good people, forgiving people.
Caroline: um Yeah, I mean, they're the grandparents. They are probably up for walking through whatever kind of fire they need to with this lady in order to have and maintain that relationship with their grandkids.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Sure. Absolutely. Absolutely.
Caroline: That's pretty normal. But Simon's over here like, I've seen things in my coma. So no, thank you. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I'm starting to come to life again now that you have failed at killing me.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: um So the kids are out of the house. Erin told her in-laws that she had made them each individual beef wellingtons.
Caroline: Now that's weird, right?
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: What?
Caroline: Like that's not, I've never seen one on a Martha Stewart TikTok or anything.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Oh, yeah. Right. This is like somebody saying, would you like a stick of, would anyone like a stick of gum? And everybody says yes. So you go get a knife and you cut your stick of gum into these little pieces?
Caroline: Right.
Caroline: Like what?
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: That's ridiculous. They come in a pack.
Caroline: It's weird.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Idiot. So anyway, Beef Wellington is supposed to be this long, gorgeous, you know, browned, know, and you cut it into these slices.
Caroline: Right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But that's not what she did. Each Beef Wellington serving was was not sliced from a whole. mean, to me, this is... Like a Beef Wellington pizza roll, I guess it would look like.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: You know, your own little... I don't know.
Caroline: ah that might be good though actually like as an appetizer that sounds kind of good
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: You could no more get me around a Beef Wellington now, knowing me that it has all those pictures in
Caroline: I know it is I love watching them be made though not gonna lie that is a classic to watch
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: it. Yeah, well, I'm going to wear my mask. Anyway... You know, her guests all wanted to see her new house. They were being very courteous, and they didn't want to let her down.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: The other thing they wanted to do was see her pantry, which they knew was, you know, palatial, but she wouldn't let them in.
Caroline: Yeah. Interesting.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She wouldn't let them in to her pantry.
Caroline: Now, you always you always told me never eat at a restaurant where you cannot see the kitchen.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: What's in that pantry?
Caroline: Same science.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: That's right.
Caroline: Where it operates here.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yes.
Caroline: If somebody's not letting me in their pantry, but they're offering me dinner, mmm.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I know, they didn't, they should have called me. She served them lunch on tan plates, or gray plates, I think the media calls them, kind of off-white plates.
Caroline: Mm-hmm.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But then she served them all, had them sit exactly where she wanted them to sit, even though this is family. But you're, you know, you're just putting them, this is your place, this is your place, this is your place.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And then she got a brown and orange plate, smaller, and she put a serving on it. And um she took ah one of the, you know, one of the pizza roll looking things that are should have been just a sliced car.
Caroline: Yeah. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So in other words, she made her own.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She sat down and they all ate. She told them that she had ovarian cancer. How do I tell the kids?
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: What am I going She knew they would devise a plan right there at the dinner table having beef wellington. course, she's having somewhat beef wellington.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And they all were raving about how good it tasted. And they told her how much they loved her. They prayed together with her about her
Caroline: Yeah, I see.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Soon her odyssey of cancer treatment. And um they plan to support her. And now she knew she wasn't ill at all.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And she knew that they would not find out that she lied about being ill because they would all be dead.
Caroline: This is what makes this like an exceptionally scary diabolical evil because she lured them in with a known trap. You know, it's no different than Ted Bundy putting on the cast and asking for help, you know, from these young unassuming women.
Caroline: Same thing.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Absolutely. um Now I'm going to talk about some difficult things. I'm going to talk about the few days that it took for people to die. And I'll sum it up briefly. There's a lot more out there on the internet that you could read.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But when you ingest death cat mushrooms, you are mindless for a few hours before feeling the first signs of what is going to happen to you. Sometimes you don't feel it until the morning after.
Caroline: Right. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: All of Erin Patterson's victims... ah raved to Erin about what a great job she'd done with the Beef Wellington. And they expressed such gladness that their relationship with their grandchildren, their nephew, their niece, whatever the relationship was, their congregant, etc., could be restored post-split with Simon.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And they're probably secretly thinking, now that this probably means she's going to leave Simon alone too.
Caroline: Fingers crossed.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: In a few hours, they would have felt very ill, though. Vomiting, diarrhea, that in enormous seizing and pain in the gut.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: on Never imagined kind of pain. According to the physician trying to save all four of them, all four of them presented to the hospital with severe symptoms and were treated by a team led by Dr. Stephen Marilau, who is director of intensive care at Austin Health.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And this is in, then they sent them to a different a hospital where they can get even more than treatment. But the doctor team went with them. That organ failure began in their livers, which is the toxin from the death cat mushroom targets first.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Dr. Marilau said that it's just the beginning of a horrible ordeal for all of the victims. Once the liver fails, it tends to drag down all the other body organs with it, he said.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So whilst the liver is the first organ to be affected, what soon follows is kidney failure, circulatory failure, and more general metabolic failure, and then death.
Caroline: Wow. Geez. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: You go into a coma, which happens to people in active dying. um you know toward the end.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So whilst the liver is the first organ to be affected, you can see the dominoes fall. The blood sugar in the patient's blood collapses. They get a buildup of ammonia, the same as using a floor cleaner.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So it's very serious brain toxin. And they then develop a profound coma and really the whole body starts shutting down.
Caroline: wow
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: In the end, steve see Simon's parents, Dawn and Gail, Heather Wilkinson, again, she's Gail's sister, and Gail's husband, Ian Wilkinson, faced death.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: All went into a coma eventually and died, all but for Ian. He was near death, and they were able to find a donor for a liver transplant.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And they put a new liver inside of him and crossed their fingers. He was two months in the hospital before they were so sure that he was going to survive. So, of course, now this meant that the undoing of this diabolical assassin, Aaron Patterson, was going to be outed because now he knew everything
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: He could walk through what happened. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: He can recount everything that happened. Apparently on the way to the hospital, his wife said to him, she ate on a different plate.
Caroline: That's smart to say out loud in a, you know,
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: That's all she said. And he, she was, you know, in delirious pain.
Caroline: I thought the same thing when you were reading it. Did she wipe these mushrooms on these white gray plates as a fail safe in case someone said I'm a vegan or something?
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: No, i think she knew their robust appetites for Beast Wellington would be a certain way to kill them. Now, Ian could have been a picky eater, but I doubt it.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She probably would have made another, you know, all indications to me are that she had ah ah self-assurance that this was going to lead to death.
Caroline: Something. Yeah.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Remember, she did the math.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So Erin now knows, imagine her panic when she realizes that there's a survivor.
Caroline: That's true.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: Yep.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Erin immediately realized she needed to get rid of that dehydrator so she could take, so what she did, she took it to the tip. Now the tip is like the transfer station or the dump.
Caroline: yeah I mean hello you purchased it anyway they're going to see you purchase one
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She took it to the tip. Did she think for one minute that they might have cameras there?
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She realized she needed to claim that she too was ill. So she's putting it together like, I have to pretend like I've got the same thing.
Caroline: that way if they come back to my god diabolical
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She took herself to a hospital with faux diarrhea and vomiting. The hospital wanted to test her for death cap and also her children. She came and went from the hospital several times.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She stopped at a gas station and feigned terrible stomach trouble and set it up so that she could be picked up by a TV inside the station when she marched to the restroom.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: That'd be a great ruse except for the fact that she was in there only nine seconds and it didn't occur to her that that TV is still going.
Caroline: Yeah. It's going to time.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: This is a lady who only thinks about herself. She does not think about the perception of others or really thinking through that she is not the king of the world, queen of the world, excuse me.
Caroline: Right. Right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Then after she you know ran out of that bathroom after nine seconds, she purchased a whole lot of snacks. Now, they're called snacks in the literature, but she I'll tell you in a minute what she purchased, and they're not snacks.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: They're like one meal after another.
Caroline: Good
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So all of that is caught on TV. And the press began to haunt her. A doctor called the police. to tell the story of the three deaths, the near-death Ian, and the check-in and check-out behavior of Aaron Patterson.
Caroline: for that, doctor.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: He said, that's weird, and I'm going to let you know that...
Caroline: Absolutely. I think doctors ought to get more involved and I just want to tell a story of what happened to me today.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Well, they have to contact they had to contact the police once they realized it was Death Cat Mushrooms, but that took a while because of toxicology.
Caroline: Oh, okay. Okay.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So police got a search warrant for Erin's house when this came in from the doctor. Eventually, she was arrested. A word about the care team in the hospital is in order here, Caroline, because before I leave the hospital, I want to tell you, this is what the lead physician said about the victims.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: He said all of the family circled around the victims as they clung to life. Quote, they were remarkably gracious and dignified throughout their attention and love that they expressed toward the critically ill.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: They never left their sides. And he said for everyone around, knowing that death was the end of their ordeal, it was very inspiring to just see the outpouring of love.
Caroline: Thank
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: They always expressed considerable gratitude and thanks for particularly to the bedside nursing team and the medical team who worked so hard to try and save their lives of their loved ones.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And he stated that all at the hospital who were involved in this are haunted forever. Because remember, during this process, they have a rebound and they start thanking everyone.
Caroline: Yes.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Oh, thank God. Thank you, God. for Thank you so much, doctor, for helping me. And the doctor knows what's going to happen next.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: Oh, geez.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So it just was a horrible thing. So let's talk about the conviction and sentencing. And I think that the way that I want to tell this, because, I mean, you know, this trial took nine weeks.
Caroline: Seems kind of fast.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And then she was, oh, it was long. It was long.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: On April 18th, this is what led to her being found guilty, is my point.
Caroline: This timeline kind of.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Here's the timeline.
Caroline: OK.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: April 18th, 2023, a post on iNaturalist, a website for tracking plants and fungi, records death cat mushrooms growing in the loch area.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Three different sites in this area on the map called loch. April 28, 2023, Erin Patterson's mobile service records indicate, you know how they can track you on your phone, where have you been, where the car has been?
Caroline: The tower pings. Totally.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: it indicated a possible visit to lock the two out of the three places, according to the telecommunications expert, Dr. Matthew Sorrell. Erin Patterson also buys a food hydrator from Hartley Wells Beta Electric store in Leongatha, where she lived. That's the name of the little town.
Caroline: Okay, so in April, she knew what she was trying to do.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yes, that's why i say diabolical.
Caroline: Yeah. Yep.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: May 21st, 2023, another post on iNaturalist shares the exact location of death cat mushrooms growing in a place called Outram.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She went there too.
Caroline: Wow.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Erin's mobile phone data suggests she traveled to Locke and Outram both.
Caroline: In May. Oh my God.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: On July 16, 2023, Aaron Patterson attends a service at the Caramboro Baptist Church and invites Don, Gail, and Simon Patterson and Ian and Heather Wilkinson to the lunch on July 29, 2023.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: two thousand twenty three Simon Patterson messages Aaron Patterson saying on July 18th, 2023, Simon Patterson messages Aaron Patterson that he will not come to the lunch because he feels too uncomfortable.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Five minutes later, she replies, that's really disappointing. I've spent many hours, but blah, blah, blah, blah. I spent a small fortune on beef eye fillet. making beef wellingtons because I wanted it to be a special meal and I may not be able to host a lunch like this ever again because I'm seriously ill. It is important for me that you are all there tomorrow.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Simon did not reply. The lunch was held at Aaron Patterson's Lee and Yatha home on the next day, July 29, 2023.
Caroline: Thank you.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: three and ah Erin Patterson hosted the Fatal Mushroom Lunch at her home in Lean Gotham. I've already talked about that. And her in-laws, Dawn and Gail Patterson, Gail's sister, Heather Wilkinson, her husband, Ian, arrived just before noon.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: They share in pleasant conversation before Erin Patterson tells the lie that she's been diagnosed with ovarian cancer and asks for advice on how to tell her children.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: The guests give their advice, offer their well wishes, and they pray together. Later that night, Don and Gail Patterson and Heather and Ian Wilkinson become incredibly sick with what they thought was gastro.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: July 30, 2023, the day after the deadly lunch, the day after the deadly lunch Don and Gail Patterson go by ambulance to Corumbore Hospital in the morning before being transported to Danganong Hospital in the evening in Melbourne.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: That's a Melbourne hospital. It's not a local hospital. It's a regional hospital.
Caroline: Oh, yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Simon Patterson takes Heather and Ian Wilkinson to Lee and Gotha Hospital. These are his parents. His parents.
Caroline: And he probably knows, he probably knows right away what has gone on.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Can you imagine how... oh
Caroline: He knew it.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yes. And that very day, Erin Patterson says she suffers from diarrhea and nausea that began on the evening following the lunch as she drives her son to a flying lesson, which was later canceled.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And then CCTV shows her at the service station where she spends nine seconds in the bathroom before purchasing, here it comes, the little snack, a ham and cheese toastie, a sweet chili chicken wrap, and some lollipops.
Caroline: Oh my gosh, that's so Aussie. Lollies. Some lollies. Mommy can't have some lollies.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yes.
Caroline: hu
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yes.
Caroline: Wow, those are milk that you said.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She then, she she says she then serves her children leftovers from the beef Wellington meal, although that is doubtful in my mind. She says she's scraped the mushrooms off because the kids don't like mushrooms, but they never had symptoms of any gastro distress.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And at the trial, it came out that, you know, the scientists are saying you can't scrape off something that's been cooked on top of.
Caroline: Yeah, right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: You know, the toxins would have just seeped right into the beef.
Caroline: That's it.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So on July 31st, 2023, Erin Patterson goes to Lee and Gotha Hospital about 8 in the morning, leaves about 8.10 before returning again at 9.48. Then she was later taken to Monash Medical Center by ambulance.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Her children were also brought to the hospital as a precautionary. A local police officer is sent to get the beef wellington leftovers from a bin at Aaron Patterson's home, and they are later sent to the Royal Botanic Gardens in South Yarra by taxi to be investigated and find the toxins.
Caroline: Wow. Wow.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So Erin Patterson is discharged from Monash Medical Center on August 1. On August 2, as seen on CCTV, Erin Patterson drives her red car to Kunawara Transfer Station and landfill and dumps her food dehydrator in an e-waste bin, environmental waste bin.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Monash Council begins attending Asian grocery stores in Melbourne's southeast to try and find mushrooms matching Erin Patterson's description. So when the police called her in she they said, where'd you get the mushrooms?
Caroline: Right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: First, she said, i don't eat mushrooms.
Caroline: Oh, stop.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Then she said, okay you know, they tell her, well, we know that there were mushrooms because that's what is killing these people. And she said, okay, well, I did i got them. Now, okay, yeah, now I remember.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I got them back in the, you know, back in the spring from an Asian grocer.
Caroline: Um.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And I i'll also foraged some near my house.
Caroline: Well, yeah, I mean, she is a forager. So it's not that was a hobby she picked up. and So to say I don't eat mushrooms is like a weird thing to say.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Well, she's a liar.
Caroline: Obviously, given all the circumstances, wouldn't you squirt your brain?
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Like lying is her go-to. She thinks everybody is just a cardboard cutout of a human and she's the only human.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: Right.
Caroline: Right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And this is what humans humans do to the cardboard.
Caroline: Right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: You just lie to them. They're never going check that out.
Caroline: They'll be dead if they do, so don't worry.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah, right, right.
Caroline: Right.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Now, you know, I'm speculating.
Caroline: Right. That seems pretty spot on.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But I mean, you know, if it's puddled outside, I'm thinking, well, before I went out, it was raining. So I am drawing a conclusion of my own.
Caroline: Right. The deduction.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yes, yes, thank you. So Victoria Police's Homicide Squad launches an investigation into the lunch. They find a handbook for the Sunbeam Dehydrator in a drawer, and they can tell it's new.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Erin tells them that she never foraged for mushrooms. They take her phone and computers and find plenty of evidence to the contrary.
Caroline: It's just so weird.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: They examine the video from the trip. They find her there on video. They discover the dehydrator. They find the toxins. They found a whole lot of other evidence. But needless to say, this and many other lies came together, and the jury found her guilty ah four felony murders and one attempted murder, lying to the police and so forth.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Her trial was very long, She took the witness stand. She was very good until she had to explain all these lies, and then she made up reasons why she had to lie because she felt so bad and so guilty about foraging or finding or buying or whatever she did, these mushrooms.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But the, I mean, you know, yeah, yeah.
Caroline: Wow.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: the um The fact that because of Ian's survival,
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: They knew about the separate plates.
Caroline: Yeah. Yep.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: They then found out during the trial that um Simon had been hospitalized previously, but they couldn't say that it was, they knew it wasn't Deathcap or he'd be dead.
Caroline: for like
Caroline: right
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: um but she definitely gave him that carbonate what sodium carbonate or whatever that is, the rat poison stuff.
Caroline: from the rat poison right
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But they didn't go into that. They had dropped the charges, but they did let it in that he was hospitalized three times in this period of time.
Caroline: Well, yeah, I mean, he's a great witness as a potential invite, too. And him saying no the night before and resisting the bullying and the gaslighting abuse that she threw at him, that's big.
Caroline: And one could say like, oh, yeah, he just really doesn't like her. Nope. It's because he's got this actual trauma from a previous attempted murder that he deep down. and now again, I'm just deducing because I do live in the human world and have had people pull the rug out from under me.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: You just carry that with you in a way that you may never say it to anybody, but you will never get yourself in a room alone with that person again.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: You know, like so he.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Right. And the other thing that hurt her in trial was these nasty grams she sent to everybody about her family.
Caroline: Not due. So doesn't pay to not be authentic in as many of the spaces as possible.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Okay, I'm going to do my Erin Patterson imitation. what it you made a You said a word there.
Caroline: Authentic.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: what What does that mean? Is that like a spice? i mean, I'm sorry.
Caroline: It's poisonous.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Her trial was very long. And the verdict, you know, they stayed out for a long time. and they went through everything. And the things that they could not believe about her were that they led to obvious evidence was the throwing away of the dehydrator, the fact that the dehydrator tested positive for the poison, the fact that her kids were out of the house, the fact that um she had been so demanding of Simon being there, um and the fact that she...
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: went to all these hospitals and then withdrew and then went back and then withdrew and then went back.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And then the video of her in the store saying she had all this horrible gastro evidence that, you know, her meal was off, but she stayed nine seconds and then she was going to eat.
Caroline: Yeah. A bunch of fast foodie foodies and lollies and stuff like.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Uh-huh.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah, two sandwiches, a wrap and a sandwich and whatever else.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And meat. I mean, good God. So her trial was very long. The verdict was very clear. Guilty, guilty, guilty, guilty, guilty. Guilting of felony murder, which means premeditated.
Caroline: Well, yeah, I mean, she. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: The judge, when he sentenced her, He went down. You got to watch this, listeners. It's out there on the Internet.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: You you know, the judge's entire talk from the bench, from start to finish, of all the aggravating circumstances.
Caroline: Wow. o You didn't like her.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: No mitigators.
Caroline: Oh, wow.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: None. Zero. zero
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And um he sentenced her to... Now, bear in mind, murderers usually get 10 to 15 years there.
Caroline: Which is so shocking.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: They don't have long terms. They don't have long terms.
Caroline: Yeah, that's kind weird.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Yeah, it's very weird. Serial killers and stuff, different. You know, you're going to be locked up forever.
Caroline: Oh.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She was given a life term, but the judge decided to give her parole eligibility after 33 years when she will be 82, and
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And he did that because he said, your prison experience will be worse than anyone's can ever say they have had. Because you are so notorious worldwide,
Caroline: oh
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: we you will probably serve your entire prison sentence in solitary.
Caroline: Wow. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And so, to me, i just want to say that our victims today really don't deserve me laughing at the horrors of what this lady did.
Caroline: right
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I'm not laughing at the horrors of what she did.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I'm laughing at her like legendary, now worldwide, tops every chart of how diabolical, non-empathetic, only think about yourself.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: In fact, i've I've got a note here that I wrote to myself. that when I listen to Dr. Grande, which I listen to all the time, he covers some true crime and other current events, but he na he listed so many traits that she had of you know, malignant narcissism, vulnerable narcissism, psychopathy, all these things.
Caroline: You love Dr. Grande.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I only wrote down a few because, you know, he was talking kind of fast, but he said she was eccentric and from the gut From the go.
Caroline: From jump.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I mean, she was all she was difficult,
Caroline: Yes.
Caroline: From jump. Yes.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: constantly lying, very aggressive, very hard to get along with.
Caroline: yeah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Her purpose for murder was because she just didn't want to be part of this family anymore.
Caroline: Well, that, right? ah She doesn't, she doesn't want, she wants to be ghosted by people. and the only way to do that is to kill them.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So she's she's deceptive.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: She's deceptive. She's irresponsible. She's manipulative. She's erratic. She's reckless. She's pessimistic. Everything about my life is bad.
Caroline: Right. 100%. Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Vindictive. She has a sense of entitlement. And then he said, on his creepy scale, When she was arrested, he made a video and he said that she was midline creepy.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: But after she was sentenced and the court case had progressed, when I was listening to him, said that she was at the matt just met top, the maximum creepy that you can be as a human being.
Caroline: Yeah.
Caroline: Wow. You know, and honestly, mom, what scares me about it she reads just like your average quote unquote Karen. I mean, I kind of hate that term, but I think people recognize what it is. it's It's a person who's vindictive, going out of their way to make others miserable, like needs attention, feels entitled, you know, like so literally could be anybody.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Needs attention.
Caroline: That's what scares me about it.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So, may you rot, Erin.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: You did this to these people and you did this to yourself.
Caroline: Yeah.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And I'm going to live another 33 years just to make sure that you don't get out of prison.
Caroline: Nice.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I don't even live in Australia.
Caroline: Okay. ah
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I'm moving to Australia when I'm, let me think, 103.
Caroline: three Yeah, 103, which is great because then you get all the centenarian benefits, right? There's a swag bag for that, right, America? Centenarians? Centenarians?
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: I'm going to say yes.
Caroline: Centenarians?
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: There's a swag bag for being 103. You betcha. Okay. Here December. here endeth today's ah episode.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And ah this is our next to our last episode in our season three. And we we're going to do another um a very recent case of another diabolical group of people in two weeks.
Caroline: Mm-hmm.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: So stay tuned for our season three finale. Our research is solely based on public documents, including legal documents, articles, and books about our subject. This episode was pretty easy because it was all over the world.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And it's air our episodes are aired every other week. Please tell your friends to join us. Give us a review and subscribe. This helps listeners find us.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: And thank you for joining us. if We really appreciate you, especially for this one. Now, one other thing. Don't forget. to live and let live.
Andy, Bridget and Caroline: Bye-bye for now, Caroline.
Caroline: Bye-bye.
