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Episode 213: Hey Seanan we just wanna talk (about Krenko?) image

Episode 213: Hey Seanan we just wanna talk (about Krenko?)

Goblin Lore Podcast
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Hello, Podwalkers, and welcome back to another episode of the Goblin Lore Podcast! Today Alex and Taya are rejoined by Seanan McGuire to discuss the Murders at Karlov manor story. Did we just talk about Krenko for an hour? You’ll have to listen to find out.

Also check out the DVD Extras for Seanan's Stories as they play heavily into today's conversation!

We also finally have a Linktree with all of our discounts/resources

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As promised, we keep Mental Health Links available every episode. But For general Mental Health the National Alliance on Mental Illness (NAMI) has great resources for people struggling with mental health concerns as well as their families. We also want to draw attention to this article on stigma from NAMI's site.

If you’re thinking about suicide or just need someone to talk to right now, you can get support from any of the resources below.

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Opening and closing music by Wintergatan (@wintergatan). Logo art by Steven Raffael (@SteveRaffle)

Goblin Lore is proud to be presented by Hipsters of the Coast, and a part of their growing Vorthos content – as well as Magic content of all kinds. Check them out at hipstersofthecoast.com

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Transcript

Introduction and Guest Overview

00:00:29
Speaker
Hello, Gobwalkers, and welcome to another episode of the Goblin Lore podcast. We are excited to have Seanan McGuire join us again to talk about the story of murders at Carlisle Manor that those murderers will plural because there are lots of bodies in the set that show up. This is a 10 episode story arc. This is awesome. I'm so glad we got all the story.
00:00:57
Speaker
And I hear we're going to get possibly some more story after some puzzles are solved. I don't know something cool going

Hosts and Guest Introductions

00:01:03
Speaker
on with that. I haven't heard exactly what's going on, but there's apparently puzzles out now that the whole set has been spoiled and I don't do puzzles. So I haven't been paying attention to that, but yeah, my name's Taya. You can find me at Taya transcends on blue sky for the like 10 people that follow me there and use blue sky.
00:01:26
Speaker
And my pronouns are she, her, or they, them. And then I'll pass it over to Alex. Yeah, I'm Alex. I'm found on Twitter at Mel underscore chronicler, though I'm down to about once a week. I've nearly kicked the habit, but I'm still there for now. And my pronouns are he, him, and Hobbs couldn't make it tonight. But as Tia said, Seanan is here. I'm very excited to talk about the story here.
00:01:56
Speaker
So welcome, Seanan. I'd like to introduce yourself. I'm sure everybody knows you. You're so awesome. You only say that because I know where you live. But yes, hi, I'm Seanan. I am here. I'm never sure where to introduce myself unless people say, hey, Seanan, introduce yourself. I wrote the magic fiction, the magic story that went with murders at Karlov Manor. And that is why these lovely people have me here to be chattery with them.

Hypothetical Crime-Solving Teams

00:02:24
Speaker
Great.
00:02:25
Speaker
So we always have a question of the week and seeing as this story was a detective story, I thought the question should be similar to that. And we all know that Proft is the greatest detective in the multiverse. So excluding Proft, which characters in a multiverse, which characters would you team up to solve a crime? And I picked Raffine and Jace because I figured that a
00:02:52
Speaker
Sphinx that could tell the future and a mage that could read anyone's minds would be very good at solving a crime. Yeah those those seem like good options. I went in a different direction because that's just the direction I tend to go to. Probably less good at it like a
00:03:13
Speaker
active crime like the murders we had in this storyline. But I chose Tamio and Quintorius because they both seem very good at looking for the details. Like Quintorius, with a lot of his work with archaeology sort of things and Tamio knowing stories, I felt like those two could pry apart some details that most people would overlook.
00:03:40
Speaker
Oh, yeah. I mean, if I could have picked a dead character, I definitely would have picked Dak Faden because his ability to read artifacts would have been really cool for a detective. Yeah, as well as I did pick a dead character there, but sorry, how about yourself, Sean?
00:03:57
Speaker
You know, if we have to set the crime on Ravnica, if the idea is here's a Ravnican crime that for some reason Proft couldn't be involved with, I would actually bring Azor home and just have it be Azor and Atrada trying to solve the mystery of who killed Lazev, who
00:04:16
Speaker
Of course, like he has a cog in the set. He's not fricking dead. And you know Etrada knows that, but you also know that he could be standing in front of her in his underpants eating ice cream out of the tub, and she would continue to insist that he was dead. So while they are attempting to solve the crime, she is sabotaging the crime at every step to keep Azor from figuring out that her guildmaster is still alive, kicking and probably giving orders.
00:04:44
Speaker
Now, if I don't have to set the crime on Ravnica, if I can just go anywhere, I'm going to go to Innistrad and have Soren Markov trying to solve a crime with Giza Sasani, because that is the closest I'm going to get to a Batman Poison Ivy team up in Magic Universe. That would be awesome. It would be hilarious. Yeah.
00:05:08
Speaker
And since Hobbs isn't here, I did want to add his team up whenever there's an option for team up is always Nicole Bolas and Squee.

Storytelling Process Insights

00:05:21
Speaker
He loves the idea of a buddy cop movie with the two of them. I know we talked about that at some point in the past. Today, well, I was after he was kind of talking about that, I was thinking about it. And it's like, you know, depending on the circumstances, Nicole Bullis, earlier in the story before before the recent Dominaria story could probably have gotten gleaned a lot of information about a murder just by killing squee over and over again, just to like, try to replicate it.
00:05:49
Speaker
Yeah. Like let's try to replicate this blood splatter pattern and do some analysis. That's what immortal sidekicks are for. All right. Well, anyways, we have 10 episodes of story to talk about. So let's dive right into that because that is a lot of story. I'm so glad they let you write 10 episodes of story. Oh, me too. I was genuinely overjoyed.
00:06:16
Speaker
when I found out that we were going to get to have the space to do this properly. Also, I write kind of ridiculously fast. So we were able to do more passes to make sure that everything synchronized internally that is normally built into the schedule, which I think really helped. That's awesome. And I mean, if you're listening to this, you're probably in the story and have already read them.
00:06:42
Speaker
But if you haven't read the stories, go read them. If you've read them, read them again. Yeah. And spoiler alert, we're going to cover the stories, but just go drive some traffic to the story website. Cause that's how wizards know that we love reading the stories and knows to hire people like Seanan to write more stories for us. Just a random question now that I'm thinking before we get started, did, was it announced beforehand how long it would be? Or did I, did I just miss that?
00:07:12
Speaker
It wasn't super announced. What happened was episode one dropped. And then there was a big gap before episode two. And when episode two came up, they published a schedule saying how long things would go on that included story continues. And now normally you have five mainline stories and up to five side stories, which are just things to flesh out the setting a little bit.
00:07:39
Speaker
And this time we didn't have any side stories coming, so they got a little bit more loosey goosey on letting us admit how long the story was going to be. But it was less formal announcement and more we have a cat in a bag. Let's see how much we have to shake the bag before the cat gets out.
00:07:55
Speaker
Okay. No, it's, I mean, and honestly it worked for me because I was expecting somewhere in that like five ish range. So once we got to five and it wasn't done, every episode was like, Oh, is this the end? Well, how is this going to end? And so that, that kind of kept the mystery alive more for me just cause I didn't know how long it was going to go.

Ravnica's Complex Politics

00:08:11
Speaker
Yeah. The story just got rolling at episode five. You know, we were just getting the wheels going. And so it was, uh, it was great to have that kind of room. And I also want to say,
00:08:24
Speaker
Seanan did a set of what she called DVD extras for this story, which was some behind the scenes commentary on all of the episodes. I'm actually going to be pulling a lot of her thoughts from that into this as I ask about some of these
00:08:41
Speaker
scenes and some of these questions in using Seanan's own commentary starting points. If you haven't read that, go read that too because it's really good just getting into her mind as she wrote this. And did you write that as you were reading it again as a published final?
00:09:01
Speaker
I had to. So one of the things about working with Wizards, and this is a totally reasonable thing and it's part of my contract, is that they can rename stuff at any time and they can copy edit even after I have signed off and excused myself from the project. So commas can change, that sort of thing. Several characters actually changed names between my final draft and the publication.
00:09:30
Speaker
And in order to sync up with that, I was having to wait with everybody else for the story to drop every day before I could pull copy it and do the DVD extras. That's really cool. And you got those out fast. Like you said earlier, you're a fast writer. And I think it's pretty obvious how fast you are. Yep. All but one of them came out within two hours of the story dropping. And the one that didn't come out within two hours, because I was on a plane home from San Diego. That's impressive.
00:09:59
Speaker
All right. So I hit right off. Do you have anything you want to ask about Alex specifically, or do you want to just hit in as I go through, um, kind of the story in order? Um, I think it's good to go through. I can jump in if it comes up first. I want to just thank you for describing. Is it as the, uh, red, blue guild of blowing stuff up real good, you know, as.
00:10:26
Speaker
One of my favorite guilds, I think that does them a real service. You know, they do a lot of other stuff, but they usually do it by doing that. Yeah. I mean, technically they're the guild of civic engineering, but that's not that much fun. So let's explode some shit. Yeah. And I think one of the themes throughout the stories was just how.
00:10:52
Speaker
negative the view on Planeswalkers were on Ravnica. It's pretty much everybody is blaming them partially for the invasion, despite what the Planeswalkers might have been doing elsewhere to stop the invasion or what they did even on the plane to stop it. Like there's an early thing in the first one
00:11:15
Speaker
or the first story talking about why Ralph's Eric wasn't there and that it was probably considered unfashionable to invite a planeswalker unless you had them properly leased. And that continues throughout the story and it's just, it constantly irritates Kaya to be othered or called a planeswalker or seen as the bad guy when they kind of gave everything to stop the invasion and how much they paid and their friends paid to stop the invasion.
00:11:46
Speaker
and how they're viewed. Was that a point that was something driven by wizards or was that something that you brought to the story?
00:12:00
Speaker
It was kind of a combination of the two. I think I love Planeswalkers more than any other creature type in Magic, you know that. But I think it's really easy when we're focusing on the Planeswalker kind of as the player insert character and as who we're supposed to empathize with to forget that we have context.
00:12:21
Speaker
Ravnica has no context. What Ravnica got was War of the Spark, was dicked over nine ways from Sunday, and then there's this huge multiplayer invasion. Nobody popped home to tell Ravnica this was coming. Kaya didn't take two seconds to zip over to Ravnica and go, hey, guys, invasion en route, sorry. But Vraska certainly came back in a big way. Jace didn't show up to help them. Now, he had good reasons.
00:12:51
Speaker
But it's kind of like when you're having a child and you're at the hospital and your best friend doesn't show up on time, you find out later that it's because they were in a car accident. You don't know that while you're getting angry with them. And there hasn't exactly been any sort of organized, let's sit down with the leadership of these planes and explain what happened in a way that they can understand and accept.
00:13:16
Speaker
Ravnica, because it's been so central, has a remarkably high number of planeswalkers that have risen to these extremely elevated positions in the guilds. And from their perspective, yeah, the planeswalkers did dick them over. They let them down. I had a responsibility to the oars off and she didn't show up.
00:13:38
Speaker
Yeah,

Legal Intricacies of Ravnica

00:13:39
Speaker
it wasn't just Kaya. There was a couple of people that said Ral's there. Vraska directly led the invasion of the plane, and Ral did what he could to fight back, but that wasn't much. Yeah, so for most Ravnicans, even after War of the Spark, they probably didn't know what a planeswalker was, unless a planeswalker had led directly to the death of a member of their family.
00:14:04
Speaker
This happens and afterward people are trying to explain it to the man on the street as it were. And what keeps coming up is this new word, this terrifying word that as far as you can tell applies equally to the missing leader of the Orzhov and the big white scary lady that ate your kid. Yeah.
00:14:27
Speaker
We also get our early introduction to everyone's favorite goblin who acquired his invitation perfectly through legitimate means. Cranko gets introduced real early here. We find it amusing is that he becomes one of the... He's not a major character in this story, but he's one of the reoccurring minor characters.
00:14:54
Speaker
But he's put on the same footing as a guild leader in this story. And for, you know, a guild-less goblin, he's got some pretty big recognition here.
00:15:16
Speaker
You know, was this another, was this, you know, something that you chose to do or was this a, we're gonna, it was, you know, Cranko really popular and given to you as a, let's get him into the story. That was absolutely not something that I chose to do because, and I wish Hobbs were here to argue with me on this one, but Cranko's fans kind of worry me. Like seriously, he falls into the box of character I would prefer not to write because no matter how I write him, I will get yelled at.
00:15:46
Speaker
And that's actually not fun and means that I would not select him if I were setting up my own cast list. But Cranko is popular. You know, he's the face of goblin typo on

Character Dynamics and Humor

00:16:00
Speaker
Ravnica. He was going to have a card. They wanted to make sure that he was present in story. And to be fair, he did play enough of a part because over the course of writing this, we had to basically build a full map of what the invasion looked like on Ravnica.
00:16:17
Speaker
Outside of what rascal was doing and I don't know how much i'm allowed to talk about that. So yeah That's fine until it's published. So, you know, don't ask me about that Right, but it means that we knew what krenko had been up to during the invasion And he really did go fairly deeply into debt to tasa And is probably very happy for like 10 seconds thinking he's not going to have to pay that Yeah You know, I I don't think
00:16:44
Speaker
Anybody knows how the Orzhov works. Yeah. 10 seconds, maybe as long as you think that. Yeah. Cause Tomiks still alive and, but he didn't go into debt to the Orzhov. He went into debt to taste it. Yes, but they come back. Exactly. They do come back, but he probably had about a 10 second period of just going, Oh God, I can breathe. Yeah. Oh wait. No. Yeah. Speaking of characters that.
00:17:14
Speaker
aren't or weren't necessarily I mean even less so than Krenko but weren't known and didn't have any story before was using a Trotter your choice or was that given to you so the general thing with with magic story is they develop the cards first
00:17:34
Speaker
And while we can make changes, characters that are created during the process of writing story can wind up, getting cards can get added to the set at late points. For the most part, that all comes from Wizards. So they knew they wanted to use Atrada as kind of a profts girl Friday, as it were. She was an existing Ravnic and legend. She was Demir, which was part of what they wanted. But as you say, she didn't have a lot of story.
00:18:02
Speaker
So we weren't going to have to fight against a pre-established voice to basically make her a Profts Watson. And she just, she looked cool too. She already had the look, so. Yeah, she already looked super cool. Yeah. So that was a cool choice. Yeah. So that makes a lot of sense why she'd be there. I did like this early bit that you had between Irelia and Kaya.
00:18:29
Speaker
where Irelia is saying, you know, there's a dangerous killer on the loose. There's not a time for amateur detective work. The Legion will take over from here. The guilds will handle this as we always have.

Murder Mystery Unveiled

00:18:39
Speaker
And she's like, did you feel that way when you let the, or, you know, talking about, there's no one to really replace you with the first opportunity. The guilds are Ravnica. And then it's like, you know, well done Ravnica. Do you have any idea what happened here? Are you as clueless as the rest of this? And this is like, this is just Irelia, you know, reinforcing the guild or trying to reinforce the guilds
00:18:59
Speaker
sovereignty or superiority over all of the guild lists, which, you know, as we've discussed in the podcast, the guild lists are the majority of Ravnica. And Aurelia is kind of a jerk. And that goes throughout the story. And I'll get to it now. Our listener question was, why was... Let me get the exact wording of this, because I want to... This just brings it up right here.
00:19:29
Speaker
Why was Irelia such an asshole? She seemed more I am the law than I uphold the law. Because everyone in this story with the possible, everyone in this story with the possible extremely small exception of Kellen, who is a golden retriever, has PTSD.

Emotional Aftermath and Themes

00:19:52
Speaker
You know, during the invasion, Irelia failed.
00:19:57
Speaker
You have to keep things in context. Again, we're not coming in on a cast of characters that was just created that didn't just live through watching people they loved and people they knew get taken over by zombie Borg virus and then fall apart when there was no clean wind here. A lot of Boros died in the invasion because the Boros were trying to uphold the law.
00:20:24
Speaker
So from Aurelia's perspective, even though arguably more Golgari died by numbers, and right now the official party line is that all of House Demir died, but from Aurelia's perspective, none of the guilds suffered as badly during the invasion as the Boros. They made enormous sacrifices to try and save Ravnica. They were unable to save great swaths of Ravnica.
00:20:49
Speaker
And now they have to deal with their survival, survivor's guilt. They have to live through that. We didn't really have a lot of time to focus on Aurelia, even with the expanded word count that we got for this story. But as to why she's such an asshole, it's because she needs therapy, just like everybody else on Ravnica right now.
00:21:12
Speaker
My answer to this was she always has been, even going back to her first introduction in Gatecrash with her and Gideon, she was a complete asshole to Gideon when she was introduced. So I didn't see this out of character to her, but your explanation really fills in the, she has a good reason to me. Yeah. Like I worked with Jay and Ellie and everyone else to try to make sure that I was treating existing Ravnic and legends.
00:21:36
Speaker
true to their pre-existing lore.

Support for Magic Story Content

00:21:39
Speaker
And I did read all the old Ravnica stuff, but there's only so much I can hold in my head at one time. So a lot of it came down to where would these people be after what they've just been through. Right. Yeah, and that makes a lot of sense. So
00:21:56
Speaker
Yeah, and I think you kind of helped set that tone early too with, there was, we did an episode kind of talking about burnout and there's a line here from Judith talking to Kaya to say, there was just a moment where, I think the line here was, there was a wall behind the planes walker's eyes that hadn't been there in their last meeting, an unbreachable barrier keeping Kaya out in the rest of the world, Kaya in and the rest of the world out. And so it's just, it's a great description of that
00:22:26
Speaker
And I think that helped to set that tone of this place is suffering, these people are suffering, and that is helping to set the tone of their response to these events that are happening and going to happen. Yeah, I have a lot of pullouts that kind of follow that burnout that we talked about, Kaya, a couple of episodes back.
00:22:52
Speaker
You know, it's like Kaya is very much at the end of her fucks reserves and not giving up time to build more. She is, she just- Oh, through this entire story, Kaya is 100% dealing with active PTSD. Yes, she absolutely, and it just gets worse. There's just more and more compounding it for her. Yep. Being the one to find tastes not good for her. No, she did not need that at all.
00:23:21
Speaker
There's a bit when she first gets matched up with Kellen and he or when they're walking back to the agency and he asked about Oko and she's concerned about and you know, maybe she has to tell him that Oko got Frexian ice and killed and I was just like I was Maybe you know, maybe it was even more so she if she had known him that she didn't have to say Yeah, I knew him. He was a jerk and I stabbed him between the eyes So, you know that could have been even worse to say
00:23:50
Speaker
Yeah, no, that's a good call too. I forgot about that moment, but yeah, that moment where she's relieved. She's like, nope, I've never heard of him. It's just relieved that she hadn't heard of this person. Yeah. It's like one less thing she had to worry about, but I, eventually Kellan is going to run into somebody who knows him. And I know you can't speculate on future story, but it's just, he's going to run into somebody who knows Oko and is going to get just like, wow, what a freaking asshole.
00:24:20
Speaker
Oh yeah, he's totally gonna hit that wall at some point. That's not even speculation, that is. The gun has been loaded and cocked and sitting on the mantle for several sets now. There's no way that doesn't happen. But Kaya is genuinely relieved not to have to be involved with it. Yeah.
00:24:41
Speaker
You know, we get the we get the little early preview of the spider hanging around in the cell, you know, popping up here and there. And I'm sure they're just there for a fun time. Right. Mm hmm. Totally not there to spy. That would be silly. I would 100 percent waste word count on a spider that didn't matter. Yeah. More of the. Kaya burnout and I liked this.
00:25:12
Speaker
This whole section is, she's so tired of Ravnican manners. She, you know, once she was down here, maybe she'd go to call time for a while where no one was worried about insulting anywhere else, unless it was a fist of the faith or Innistrad, far less adequate and proprietary involved. And then your comment was Kaya, who is very much dealing with PTSD all throughout the story, is having a panic attack. You know, I love the image of Teysa's words holding her up as much as they were shutting her out. Teysa is supporting her even now. It's,
00:25:39
Speaker
you know, Kai is just totally messed up here. And she just found the body of one of her best friends. And before that, you know, in that statement right there, before that, she was just dealing with someone, you know, calling her planeswalker again and, you know, having to deal with tipping them and being polite to them. And, you know, it's all of this together. It's she can't deal.
00:26:08
Speaker
It's just too much. It was actually after the fact that I realized that because we had explicitly stated that Tessa had wards that would keep Kaya from just walking through walls and floors as much as she wanted to, that when she completely freaked out and the runaway kicked in, she wouldn't fall through the floor. And that was absolutely delightful to discover. Yeah.
00:26:37
Speaker
And that comes along with a bit later that I also want to mention that I thought was a similar delightful bit. I did like the bit that when she's talking to the ghosts in Kaya's room, that it's like, yeah, we'll testify on your behalf that you didn't murder Kaya. That's, you know, it's perfectly reasonable witnesses on Ravnica. Yeah. It's, it's, it's great. Just world building.
00:27:08
Speaker
Yeah. And then we had, we had Kellen's insert where, you know, if Tace is dead, she's a ghost. You should just be able to summon and ask who killed her. And that's, you know, just, just writing out what everybody's thinking. Kellen asking the good questions. Yeah. Yeah. It is kind of the useful thing about being able to have Omen Path characters kicking around. Now on the most, for the most part, I don't like it, but in this context, it was very useful.
00:27:37
Speaker
Right. Because that, that is honestly the first thing that I thought of when I saw this set set on Ravnica, a plane known for its ghosts is why can't we just ask who killed them when the ghost shows up? That was my very first thought when I saw this murders set on Ravnica, because it is just known for its ghosts. And even the original Ravnica story is Argus Koss working with
00:28:05
Speaker
a ghost to solve his own murder. Right. But, you know, even on Ravnica, if Tessa had come back immediately and been a focus suck for the rest of the story, she still wouldn't have been able to say who actually killed her. Right. Yeah, because it was just some rando. Yeah. Right. So with the way the story worked out here. Yes.
00:28:31
Speaker
But, you know, think about how often that would be the case anyway. You don't necessarily have eyes in the back of your head if somebody hits you from behind. Ravnica is just a place where learning how to murder people while they're facing away from you is very important. Yeah. And speaking of Agra's costs, I'm so glad you got to insert them into the story because I love the original Ravnica story set.
00:28:55
Speaker
and then describing him as dedicated burrows investigator, very, very dead, too old for this shit, also too dead for this shit. Yeah. He just, he thought that when he died, he'd get to quit. Yeah. And he, you know, first he had to work for the Azorius and then he got redrafted by the Boros and the dude's been dead for like 80 years at this point and he's still working.
00:29:23
Speaker
Yeah, it really isn't. He's, you know, the guy needs to be allowed to retire. Yeah, and it's not even, you know, in one of the guilds that that's a normal thing for. Right, like when you're Orzhov, you kind of expect it. You might not be happy about it, but you are resigned. Yeah. He kicked off and thought he was going to get to go see the Ravnican equivalent of the Elysian Fields, and then what the actual fuck. Yeah.
00:29:51
Speaker
Yeah, but I was glad to see him make a return appearance as an old-school Ravnica fan. And I think Agris is actually part of why it had to be set on Ravnica. You know, I know that Mark Rosewater has talked about originally wanting it to be on an all-original plane, possibly somewhere new, possibly a return to someplace we haven't been in a while.
00:30:18
Speaker
but it kept kind of tilting back toward Ravnica. Well, the nice thing there was that we not only have this huge cast of characters to play with, we had to spend virtually no time establishing who most of them were.
00:30:31
Speaker
Mm-hmm. I love the cast of characters that got selected for this storyline It we just had a quick recap and off we went no need to build anybody And that is not laziness. That is word count speaking Because the biggest hindrance to magic story regardless of the set is that we are in such a tightly constrained space And that can be wonderful and you know give rise to incredible creativity But it can also be really frustrating because there's all this stuff you have to leave on the cutting room table
00:31:01
Speaker
Yeah. Well, it lets you like budget that creativity too. You reuse some characters, it gives you that space, that word count to do other things with. Right. And like when I'm writing a novel or something for myself, if I have to cut something out for length or pacing, I can save it and use it again later.
00:31:22
Speaker
I had to cut so much of the villain's big rant, the big motive speech, because she had a completely valid to her reason for killing basically every single person on Ravnica. And that just gets old after a certain point. So I had to cut it, can't do anything with it, can't even release it as a DVD extra because it doesn't belong to me. So I would rather have the space to do things that will get kept. Yeah.
00:31:52
Speaker
Yeah, it's a lot where when you're working another IP that you have to deal with that. And it's part of the gig. You know that when you sign up, so I don't mind it. But yeah. But it's a fact, especially on a world like Ravnico. And I don't know if this is maybe an aside that is irrelevant, but I was thinking about Ravnico is kind of unique in Magic's worlds. When they do color-based themes, you almost never get a full set of 10. You get five.
00:32:22
Speaker
And so when you have to deal with, not deal with, but when there's space in this world for 10 guilds, that's just a lot more space being taken up by people who are relevant and important to the story. Right. And no matter what you do, you're always going to have people going, why wasn't this character that I care about featured more heavily? You know, out of out of all the guild leaders, the one that I want to spend the most time with is Rao. I love Rao.
00:32:50
Speaker
Yeah, and he got no real time in this story. He only showed up in the story, that one I will take credit for. He only showed up because I insisted that there was no way to have a gathering of all the guild leaders and not include Raoul. It doesn't matter how anti-planeswalker they are right now, unless the Isit have unseated him, he's going to be there. Yeah.
00:33:15
Speaker
I do have another bit that I really liked as a, uh, a Rakdos aficionado. I liked when Kaya showed up at the club and was trying to get in and, uh, basically went stabby stabby with the doorman and was like, you know, Judith would offer me honorary guild membership if I made the splatter artistic enough, which just was like, yeah, definitely. And I would.
00:33:44
Speaker
I would enjoy a Mardu Kaya. Yeah, that would be a lot of fun. Yeah, she wanted to work out some of her anger issues in a not healthy way. I mean, it's non canon, but as far as I'm concerned, she did immediately she left Ravnica and fucked straight off to Kaldheim to go fishing with Tyvar. Yeah.
00:34:11
Speaker
And that was actually the most, are you okay? Criticism I got on the story was I had somebody just, just one person that I'm aware of that was really like, why does Kaya keep bringing up Tyvar when he's not in the story? And I'm like, when I'm under stress or being traumatized or forced to stay in a situation, I don't want to be in, I think about my friends. Yeah. I saw that in your, your, uh, postscript DVD extras.
00:34:40
Speaker
Yeah, of course, it's, you know, think of your friends and they don't want to call anybody out by name, but it really was just out of everyone that we know Kaya is friends with and we have seen her being friends with who is basically okay right now. Full stop. So
00:35:05
Speaker
Yeah, no, he just comes up a lot because Kaya is flailing and looking for something to latch on to. And oh, Tyvar is OK. I could I could go crash on Tyvar's couch for a month. He'd be cool with it. Yeah, he would totally, you know, they'd have some real parties. Like he's going to wingman her up one side of Kaldheim and down the other. They're just going to have a splendiferous time.
00:35:33
Speaker
I do, and this comes up for both the Trotter and for Massacre Girl, but neither of them like being used and not being paid. They don't like their professional pride being challenged, which I definitely feel for them is they're real professionals. They don't want someone taking advantage of them. The difference between a murderer and an assassin is payment. Yeah.
00:36:04
Speaker
And that's probably drawn fairly heavily. I say probably because you don't always know your own influences for sure. But it's probably drawn fairly heavily from Terry Pratchett's Discworld, because that is also how the Assassins Guild works in Ankh-Morkork. Yeah. And on the subject of Assassins, the kill your friends and family rate was phenomenal.
00:36:27
Speaker
The only thing we left unanswered, and that is an exercise for the reader, is, is the friends and family rate more or less? I would assume it's more. As would I. Yeah. We get a little bit on the visit to Vitagazi, where it talks about Oba being front and center. We get some foreshadowing there if you notice the first time. I did not notice this. You totally got me on The Killer. You absolutely got me.
00:36:58
Speaker
Good. But people, and I'm glad we didn't cheat. Yeah. We get the whole bit. And this is another thing as a old school Ravnica fan and a Rakdos aficionado, the bit from the Guildpact appendices about Rakdos causing murderous rage and citizens and randomly random slaughter and
00:37:28
Speaker
Stuff that that was a new bit of Rakdos lower that Was that something you came up with or was that more world built world building background
00:37:41
Speaker
So Rakdos used to do this is something that was given to me as world building background because we needed a good reason for looking at the guild pact to cast suspicion on Rakdos. I got to write an actual part of the guild pact. I'm so excited about that. Like that is really cool. So the very broad strokes were given to me and then I filled in all the details there. Nice. Yeah. Because, you know, I.
00:38:11
Speaker
I do love my sleepy demon. He's- I just love that he spent the whole fricking story in bed. I mean, that's what he does. He just naps. And then he wakes up and, you know, kills a bunch of people and goes back to sleep. Yeah, when you got a- And when I'm playing him in Commander, he gives me a bunch of free Eldrazi.
00:38:40
Speaker
I don't like that part so much. Does Rakdos have the best work-life balance on Ravnica? This is just occurring to me. Yeah. Quite possibly. I'm pretty sure he does. I mean, other than Niv Mizzet, who doesn't seem to work at all at this point. That seems like a good balance too. Niv is busy doing other things.
00:39:08
Speaker
Niv learned from Jace that once you're the guild pack you're not expected to actually do any work. That's fair. Then we have the we have the attack on Kaia and Kellen and we get the the moss suicide pills which are that was impressive. Those were nasty. That is you know that is nasty.
00:39:31
Speaker
And again, we have some more foreshadowing here because we get the moss with fur mixed in, which is more pointing in a specific direction, although a little bit of misdirection towards the Golgari with the moss, but the fur definitely points towards our wolf-riding friends.
00:39:59
Speaker
I thought that is a hell of a way to go and very not fun. Then we get Irelia again back for some more screaming. Yeah, with Massacre Girl in tow, who normally I don't think would have a problem with being chained up if it wasn't Irelia holding the chain.
00:40:26
Speaker
Notably, she did kill 10 of the guards first, which should have been enough to kill Irelia in the process with the minuses, but Irelia somehow escaped that chain. I guess maybe the... I'm guessing Meth, her girl, did get a new card in this set, probably, so it doesn't have that same chain effect. I haven't read all the cards in the new set. Yeah, but she does have a new card in this set. It looks really cool. Yeah.
00:40:50
Speaker
I just always go with card mechanics and character mechanics and fiction don't match perfectly. Yeah, I know they don't. I'm just like, I like it when they do line up. Alex and I are both mouth though. So when card mechanics and lower lineup, we're just both very happy people. Yeah.
00:41:11
Speaker
I mean, the main issue with that is, again, they do so much, the story and the cards are still going at the same time by the time we get to writing story. Right, yeah. It's hard to make it happen, but sometimes by chance it just happens perfectly. And then there's poor timing. The new Tomic is a perfect example of a Malthus card to the courts. The new Tomic is absolutely gorgeous. Although I would like people to stop making sex jokes.
00:41:39
Speaker
They're not gonna stop, but I would like them to. Then we get introduced to is it computers, which is terrifying. You know, next thing we'll have is the Ravdikin internet. There are times when I am not sure certain things were thought all the way through before I was told to make them canon. Yeah.
00:42:02
Speaker
I did a long-term D&D campaign on Ravnica where we, just for sake of ease in the game, we had smartphones, essentially, and magical smartphones. And yeah, introducing computers to Ravnica turns out to be a really bad idea for multiple reasons. Yep. At least right now they're pretty well confined within the agency. Yeah. No. Because that's totally going to last. Yeah.
00:42:32
Speaker
Doctors were confined to the Azorius at one point too. Yup. Maybe Ravnica will be more responsible with the internet than we have been. No. No. No, there's going to be so much goblin porn on Ravnica. Oh, there's already so much goblin porn. Yeah, but now it's going to be online. Oh, no.
00:43:01
Speaker
I'm just trying to get a pokeball. That scene was hilarious, just sticking the god back in the pokeball. Get in the ball! I love him so much.
00:43:17
Speaker
And that is a difficult statement to make because for most, like talking again about how wizards can change things after everything is locked and that's totally okay. I agree to that when I signed my contracts. Anzrag was a female god through most of the writing process, which is why the pronouns for him switch periodically in story. But yeah, no, the rampage mole. He's a harvest god, honest.
00:43:47
Speaker
I mean, just mowing things down. Yep. Yeah. I mean, there are harvest themed cards that blow up lands. So. But he's the mole in the agency. Yep. Did you just get that? Did not register previous.
00:44:16
Speaker
Had to be said out loud. Yep. Yep He's the mole agency and I appreciate the fact that once he's boxed up again and things are actually explained to them in a Relatively calm manner the growler like girl girl girl, whatever rule rule are like, you know what? We're not happy that he's in a box, but you didn't kill him. So we're cool with you Yeah We get more of poor Argus
00:44:45
Speaker
You know, he finds out Rakdos is still napping and then immediately gets put into a Pokeball himself. Basically, yeah. Yeah. The poor guy. It's just nothing has ever gone right for this guy. He's he's had three books of his own and then he gets he gets in two stories this time and nothing has ever gone right for him. I don't know. I figure Agris is taking this time to nap.
00:45:13
Speaker
Hopefully he is getting a little vacation out of this. Yeah. And we get a little meeting with a Sony, which they finally figure out the powder is some kind of natural spore like thing and not natural known anything naturally on Ravnica. And then prof gets bonked on the head and has someone rummaging through his memories that we don't know anything about other than they're a cloaked figure.
00:45:42
Speaker
That is true. That does happen. Yep. And we won't get any answers to this for probably a while. So that is also true. Yes. And that is why if you pull that particular story into a notepad file or WordPad file, you will find that it's about 800 words longer than any other installment in the story. I basically held my breath until I turned blue in order to get more words. The description of
00:46:12
Speaker
Prof's mind as basically being the same way as his magic was really cool though. Yeah. I didn't think I would, but I actually really like Prof's magic and like the way that it all fits together. Yeah. The way that like literally digging through his memories by going through a file cabinet. Yeah. I always love when we can get like different, just, you know, magic represented in different ways within magic.
00:46:42
Speaker
Again, it's one of those sort of world building or maybe universe building, in this case things, it just makes it feel more rich that we have this idea of how the game works based on the cards, but it's like, well, within the fiction, within the characters, they all have this different way that their magic can work. And I was enjoying when that can get in there. The most fun of dealing with Ezrem, who, you know, is basically somebody shoving a briar horse into a My Little Pony stable.
00:47:10
Speaker
is getting to deal with the fergonomics of it all. How does this have to look? How does this have to work? Because that is a thing that we as bipedal creatures that live in a world of mostly other bipedal creatures don't think about enough. But that I use to drive my D&D GMs insane. And then we get one short line, which I know is really important to you.
00:47:39
Speaker
Doney got a message for you. Yeah I'm entered it's the first character I've named ha ha The first one I got a card at least right they got a card. I'm delighted about that I didn't know they were gonna get a card. I'm Really good card really good card. I'm kind of entertained that they went by that so I was not trying to I've gotten shoot out because apparently magic has
00:48:08
Speaker
too much casual they them representation without enough representation from other varieties. The chewing out was by a random person on Twitter, so I don't feel too bad about it. But the reason that I used they was that I was trying not to have Kaya assume a child's gender. We didn't actually get in story how Delmi
00:48:30
Speaker
thinks about themselves and now since it's on the card that has been canonized as deli uses they them pronouns and that is fantastic but i wasn't trying to do anything i just didn't want kaya to be a joke online we did not get a chance to get their pronouns yeah but i'm not like for the people for whom that is very important which includes a lot of very dear friends of mine i'm not trying to take anything away there their pronouns are they them i just didn't do it on purpose this time yeah
00:49:00
Speaker
But yeah, you got to name a character who got a really awesome card that is going to go into my Elesha deck and a lot of other decks. Apparently a lot of decks judging by its pre-order price. I kind of wish their card wasn't so great because it means I won't have a shot at the original art. Yeah. I'll just have to wait for another Tivar. Yeah, you can just yeah, you can fight for the Tivars.
00:49:27
Speaker
I mean, just because a card is good in standard does not necessarily mean the art is going to be expensive if it's a generic card that happens to be good in standard. I'm guessing it's standard playable, which is why it's so expensive. Yeah. Standard play does not correspond to art value. Oh, I know. And then we move on to gathering up all the leaders to find out who the killer is.
00:49:55
Speaker
because nothing says, I love you. Like making me write a scene with 30 distinct people, all of whom have their own opinions about the situation. Yeah. And proffed just proffed has to, you know, be the center of attention and tell everybody who is, but we have Franco once again, being the, uh, the voice of reason here is like, so if whoever's been hunting, guilt leaders wanted to finish job in a hurry, all they need to do is sit veto Gazi. Right. Yeah.
00:50:25
Speaker
You know, as you put it, Cranko's asking the important questions. You know, that's definitely it. And it turns out, you know, we do find out who's the one hitting or trying to kill everybody. And it's me. Yeah. Well, at least Oba, one of the faces of Tristani and.
00:50:52
Speaker
What do you know? All the guild leaders are there so she can just try to kill all of them at once. Thank you, Prof, for putting them all in one place. It is a hallmark of the genre. Yeah, certainly is, except she is very powerful and they are all inside of a giant tree that she can control, which is usually not a hallmark of the genre.
00:51:17
Speaker
No, and that part proffed really couldn't account for in his calculations. Yeah. So she goes murder rampage and starts rearranging the tree with everybody inside of it and pinning people down with branches and wrapping Cranko up and Rael tries to fight back with his lightning gun, but it's not super effective against trees and
00:51:48
Speaker
Turns out it was Yasmir from the gruel is actually doing a fairly good job, but then he almost gets stabbed, but Atrata takes a hit for him. And there's a lot of comment you wrote. I think it was a really good comment. We kind of skipped over Oba's reasoning for all of this though. Oba basically was using the
00:52:14
Speaker
world's vegetation system to listen in um all everything that was happening on the guild during the invasion they're all the guilds but only was getting pieces of what they could listen in on so like sorry go ahead i was gonna say so like she heard the phyrexian or heard tasa using the phyrexian bits but
00:52:39
Speaker
Tasa wasn't cooperating with the Phyrexian. She learned Phyrexian from the ghosts and was using that to feed them bad information. And Atrata confirmed that because Atrata was working with Tasa. So really the message of murders at Karlov Manor, if you step back and look at the motivations for everything, is that you need to get context on stuff. Context is important.
00:53:07
Speaker
Anti-planeswalker sentiment is a result of missing context that makes perfect sense, but is still missing. All of Oba's actions, I'm sure, because she was killing for weeks before she started targeting guilt. Right. And that's another thing that she was killing for weeks, but there are people that weren't important to the guild. So nobody noticed. Right. Cause who notices one more murder on Ravnica, especially when you're grabbing real assassins to do most of the jobs. Yeah.
00:53:37
Speaker
If Massacre Girl kills somebody and she was paid to do it, it's not illegal. Yeah. As long as it doesn't interfere with guild business. As long as it doesn't interfere with guild business, yeah. So the issue isn't that, I mean, the issue is that Oba was killing people. That's terrible. But when you pull back a little more, the issue is that Oba was killing people for the wrong reasons. She was killing them because she had heard a rumor. She had heard gossip. She had heard, oh, these people are bad.
00:54:07
Speaker
and just decided that she got to do something about it. And the normal people of Ravnica heard that planeswalkers were behind the invasion. They don't know how to prove that. They have no context for it. And they just went straight to, oh, planeswalkers are bad. Let's treat them badly.
00:54:27
Speaker
Yeah. That's, I think also kind of contributes to the whole thing that this plane is still hurting, which I think is a microcosm of every plane is still hurting to some degree or another. Every plane is still in pain. Yeah. And it's a lot and it's just. And this is one of the after effects here, one person with power.
00:54:53
Speaker
decides to do something without the proper context, but I suspect we're going to be seeing more stories that shows kind of these after effects in other places and what's going on there and how these people are those people and those planes are reacting and
00:55:09
Speaker
I think we'll definitely see some of that. We're not going to see much in the same vein, even though logically the same thing would be playing out with variations. Because magic does have to balance having a coherent and compelling story with being a card game that we want people to buy and care about. So we can't necessarily sit with, here's 20 sets in a row about Planeswalkers with PTSD. Yeah, that's true.
00:55:35
Speaker
There's a few passages that Hobbes highlighted I wanted to bring up. And first, I want to see, I loved how you defeated Oba with the magical police tape. That was fantastic. That's a great way to defeat a big bad. But right after this was defeated,
00:56:00
Speaker
There's this line where, in his cage of roots, Ral begin to laugh and after a moment, Kaya did the same. They laugh not because they're amused, but because they're alive. And sometimes relief can look a lot like joy when it's seen in the right light. Everything depends on how you're looking at it. You know, like things in flight were like, you know, everything's so traumatic at some point. All you can do is laugh because you can't deal with it any other way. Yep. And you know, again, back to the overall theme of context that runs through the whole story. Yeah.
00:56:31
Speaker
What, Callie? You want to be on the show today? And then there was a bit that actually started before the fight that he highlighted that I want to bring him. Krenko back deeper and deeper into a corner looking for something. He uses a weapon against the violence. His whole understanding of danger was telling what erupted at any moment. He knew something was about to go down. I think it was pretty obvious to everybody, but Krenko
00:57:00
Speaker
you know, knew a bad situation when he saw one and he's used to having goons to do work for him. Yeah. Cranko without, I wouldn't say Cranko is a coward, but I would say that Cranko without any other goblins to call on is definitely someone who is very aware of how exposed he is. Right. And that, I mean, that goes to our regular saying that, you know, goblins like snowflakes are only dangerous in numbers.
00:57:31
Speaker
Yeah. And particularly in that room, too, at that time, you have some of the most powerful people on that plane. Politically, all the most powerful people. But some of those politically powerful people are also very just powerful. Yeah. He's a 2-3 in a room of 5-6s.
00:57:55
Speaker
Yeah, he is not going to draw attention to himself, but he is going to try to find something he can use to not die. Yeah. Yeah. And then we just have the last one, you know, where we have, uh, another face of Tristani Sim talking about, you know, drawing in on themselves and Emma Tandris will speak for the conclave while they're in communion. And whatever happens will be the will of Metzlesnia, you know, and
00:58:25
Speaker
then says the other face says that, you know, everything ends. And if it's Matt Slesny as well, their time will be done, too. So, you know, Ova doesn't really isn't going to get punished because you can't punish her without punishing the other two innocent sisters. So they're essentially going to go into hibernation and let their pay room determine what their punishment is going to be. Right.
00:58:56
Speaker
I wanted to kill her. From a narrative standpoint, she should have died. The only path forward from here really is Tessa politically destabilizing Ravnica. This is an insult against the Orzhov that cannot be allowed to stand. What is the blood price of an Orzhov guild leader? Only everything you ever thought you owned. Right. Yes.
00:59:25
Speaker
Yeah, and that's the line you have in the last story. Intend to make the argument through an army of accountants of financial bylaws to archaic, Azor wouldn't be able to comprehend them. The price of assassinating Azor guild leader is everything you thought you owned. If they want her alive, well, her death would have been far less expensive.
00:59:48
Speaker
Like, Tasa is not necessarily pissed off that she's dead. She's pissed off that she was killed for a stupid reason by someone who didn't understand what was going on. And to a degree, she is mad to be dead, because one of the things that I tried to focus on without harping on it too much is that even for the Orzhov, being a ghost is not the same as being alive. Right, yeah. It's not. Tasa is never going to get laid again. Yeah.
01:00:17
Speaker
She's never gonna drink another cup of coffee. She's never going to exercise and get endorphin burns. Those things are over now. She wasn't ready to give them up. They were taken from her. And I think she's in the right to be a little pissed off. Yeah. And that bit I referenced earlier when we talked about how cool it was with the words of
01:00:45
Speaker
Kaia, with her ability not falling through the floor, the part that I wanted to relate to that was just, you know, how cool it was that she was still able to hug her dead friend because of her power set. Yeah, that was really essential that Kaia be able to have some closure with Teisa, because she didn't get closure with anyone they lost in the Phyrexian invasion. No. And really, everyone that died on Ravnica
01:01:12
Speaker
died because of the invasion. They are among the last of its victims. So even if Tessa didn't need that, Kaya needed it so badly, I would have screamed until they let me put it in. Yeah, but it's one advantage of being a ghost form is being able to hug ghosts when you need to.
01:01:34
Speaker
which I hadn't considered that. I actually had to read that section and then, oh, right. That's how she's doing it. Like she hugged Tessa and oh, right. That's. Yeah, that's, that's one of those things. It's hard for the card game to, to represent, but that's why having the, the, the fiction in addition to it. Yes. I was so happy when, uh,
01:02:01
Speaker
when we verified that Tessa was coming back. And also when they went with the Doyleist explanation and let her keep her cane. Yes, that was so great. I do love that because they had that card a while ago with the sculpturists who basically you
01:02:25
Speaker
He had a missing arm, but then you get a version of him where he's a spirit or something in his arm's back. And I was like, oh, that was kind of lame, but I love that they let her keep her cane in death. Well, as a cane-using person, if I die and get to the afterlife and I still need my cane, I'm going to track God down and punt him in the balls so hard that he kicks me down to hell.
01:02:52
Speaker
like just period, I don't want that. But from a Doylest perspective, from we live in a world where there is minimal disability representation and very few positively disabled characters in a setting like magic, Tessa needs to bow to the needs of the real people for whom she matters. So her keeping her cane is very important. Yeah, and I don't even see it as needing it as a disability aid. It's just hard to embody.
01:03:22
Speaker
It's part of her body and it's a power symbol for her. It's... She didn't keep her murder wound, but she kept her murder weapon and she will... Yeah. No. It's just, it's part of her... She's had it for so long, it's part of her persona. It's just been there for so long and part of her life that it's...
01:03:50
Speaker
I don't know. I'm glad they kept it first. Me too. I actually insisted on it. Yeah. Yeah. So that is, that is the speed run version of the 10 episodes. What is it, Carlo of Mana? Yeah. I was going to bring up. So yeah, we just talked about Arkane. I had your epilogue, um,
01:04:20
Speaker
up here so long and we already talked about Tyvar, which I thought was good. So we already covered the two things I had, Mark, to talk about in your epilogue thing. I'm talking about their friends. Of course, Kyle wants to go talk about Tyvar because she doesn't have many positive people to talk about. She lost so many people.
01:04:43
Speaker
Kaya is not a character that has been given the opportunity to build a large supporting cast of people that she spends time with and is close to. And the Phyrexian arc did not really make up for that. I have issues with Kaya sometimes because I really loved the Boom comics where she was a central character. And that version of Kaya is so different than the actual canon version of Kaya.
01:05:13
Speaker
You know, I had people complain that in the story, she commented that she and Raoul's Eric were not really close friends, but in the comics, they are. Well, the comics, Raoul voluntarily leaves Ravnica occasionally. The comics are not the canon. I wish they were, because then my Nahiri one shot would be canon, and I could yell at all the people that say that she's nothing but a psycho bitch, but they're not, so. Yeah, no.
01:05:45
Speaker
But, all right, you have anything else you want to ask about Alex? Not really. No, that hit kind of the few things I had. And other than I guess, thank you for coming back. We always appreciate you coming on, Sean, and then talking to us about story and getting- I'm genuinely always happy to. Anytime Taya asks me, I'm pretty much here. Yeah.
01:06:11
Speaker
Thank you. Yeah, thanks a lot. I appreciate you spending your time on a Monday evening with us. It's all good. I appreciate you continue writing the story and I look forward to hopefully Wizards having you back in the future.
01:06:28
Speaker
Thank you. I hope so too. And just thank you for doing this podcast. You know, you mentioned early in that people should go and click the link and engage with Story. Well, that is incompletely true. Story is basically an advertising mechanism right now. It does not make Wizards any money, but it costs Wizards money because they have to pay the writers and they have to pay the editors and they have to pay people every step along the way.
01:06:54
Speaker
So it'd be real easy for the people at Hasbro that control layoffs to look at us and go, well, this is a waste. It's not having an immediate material return. And the only mechanism we have to fight that is clicks. So yeah, you heard her. Go read the stories again. Keep clicking. If you've already read them. Keep clicking. Yeah. Tell the bean counters at Hasbro that story is important to us.
01:07:23
Speaker
And it is because that's basically the only way I'm engaging with magic right now is stories and secret layers because they created a cats and dogs secret layer, which basically spoke directly to me and I wish I would have bought more copies of it.
01:07:41
Speaker
Yeah. And the story is one of the biggest things that I'm engaging with actively as well. It's, especially now that I'm sort of back to the story with, uh, the, the wonderful, wonderful stories that were going on during the Frixian arc that I had, I had some struggles with, but now we're back after that. And I'm definitely engaging with the story a lot now. You are free. Yeah. Maybe someday I'll come on and we'll all be here.
01:08:11
Speaker
Yeah, hopefully, you know, miss you, Hobbs. Hope you're feeling better. Yeah, do miss you. I'm glad that Bill is able to be here this time, but please feel better. Yeah. All right. And that's our show. Good night. And that's our show for today. You can find all of the hosts on Twitter for now. Hobbs can be found at HobbsQ, Tay can be found at Tayatransends, and Alex can be found at Mel underscore chronicler.
01:08:40
Speaker
Feel free to send us any questions, comments, thoughts, hopes, and dreams to the Goblin Lore Pod on Twitter or email us at goblinlorepodcast at gmail.com.
01:08:50
Speaker
If you would like to support your friendly neighborhood gobsugs, our link tree can be found on our Twitter account and in the description of today's show. This has everything from various discount codes to the link from our Patreon. The music for today's show was by Wintergotten, who can be found at vintergotten at bandcamp.com. The art was done by Steven Raphael, who can be found at Steve Ruffle on Twitter. Goblin Lore is proud to be presented by Hipsters of the Coast as part of their growing Vorthos content.
01:09:18
Speaker
Check them out on Twitter at hipsters MTG or online at hipstersofthecoast.com. Thank you for listening and remember goblins like snowflakes are only dangerous in numbers.