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S2 Ep96: Devil May Cry 5
82 Plays6 years ago
Grab your demon hunting sword, put on your most comfortable leather, and join Dave and Jake as they discuss whether devils have functional tear ducts in this week's episode!
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Thoughts? Comments? Requests for new episodes? Feel free to email them in!
SoapstonePodcast@gmail.com
Like our podcast? Like our podcast! We'll post when new episodes are uploaded!
https://www.facebook.com/SoapstonePodcast/
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Transcript
Remote Recording Challenges During COVID-19
00:00:28
Speaker
How's it going, everyone? Welcome to another episode of Soapstone. My name is Jake. I am joined by my co-host, as always, Dave. How's it going, Dave? It's going a little bit weird. Isn't it weird? It is definitely weird. I am joined by two dimensional Jake as we look at each other through Discord while recording audio remotely. Yeah. Why is that, Jake? Why are we doing that?
00:00:53
Speaker
I had to blow up your picture real quick because it just had you in a little window for a little bit. And now it's full screen. I can see my blemishes. The reason we're doing this is be the same reason that many people's lives have changed recently. We don't want to catch gay. So that's the risk. You know, you make sacrifices.
00:01:17
Speaker
Yeah, I stopped shaking hands with people years ago, just in case. And no proctology visits, you never know. Never know. And now we just don't go outside. But also viruses, I suppose. In particular, the coronavirus, COVID-19, it hit adulthood and just right out there into the world. So it screwed over people's lives.
00:01:43
Speaker
Yep. Um, but, uh, my wife is immunosuppressed, so I'm trying to minimize, um, contact with other people, social distancing, the, uh, the Mimi term, but also the actual thing. Um, so for the time being, uh, we're recording remotely, which is hecka weird.
00:02:09
Speaker
Yeah. As mentioned on a previous episode, we did try this early doors for our second episode, but I forgot to record the audio. And so quickly that idea was snubbed because we lived down the street from each other. We're like, oh, we'll just meet and record. Yeah. Call it that. Do we actually, that's true.
00:02:32
Speaker
We did test a remote recording first when we were literally that close. And now I drive like 40 minutes, 30 minutes to 40 minutes, depending on traffic to record in person. So we, it takes a lot to make us go back to trying a remote record. Yeah. So we apologize if there is any degradation in audio quality, but I'm sure you understand.
00:02:53
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, just deal with it, I guess. I mean, you're still listening, so clearly it checks out. You know, thanks. Thanks. Thanks for not leaving. Um, yeah, it's, it's a pretty, pretty big deal. Pretty serious business. We recognize it's impacting a lot of people's lives.
00:03:11
Speaker
Just earlier today, I got news that a close friend of ours has possibly contracted it, so they're going to be self-isolating and quarantining. Yeah. This is news to me as well, as I just am finding out about it.
00:03:32
Speaker
our friend down in Texas. So yeah, it's a rough time. But I think more like something I've been realizing is it's been made more and more real to me on an exponential scale. Like everything started out so normal. And then I keep noticing things that are just slightly weird, slightly off. Anytime I interact with like
00:04:00
Speaker
Like I ordered Domino's tonight, for instance, the guy was wearing gloves. Like when I went to Taco Bell, they had a card reader, they stuck outside the window so you could hook your card in and take your card out without like touching them at all. It's like a lot of stuff is changing.
00:04:20
Speaker
Yeah, it's a fairly surreal experience. I was talking to some family on the phone. Someone's like, you're on immunosuppressant drugs. Are you going to die? I'm like, no, probably not. And if I do, God bless you. So I was talking to my grandmother. I said, yeah, it's really weird. Because in my getting close to 30 years of living, there's never been a situation like this where it's like, hey, global situation. Everybody act accordingly.
00:04:49
Speaker
Yeah. And that's in my lifetime. My grandmother chimes in like, yeah, mine either. He's like, Oh shit. Yeah. My grandma's old. It's a larger scale.
Global Impact of COVID-19
00:05:01
Speaker
Yeah. There's, there's been, you know, there's been big deals, uh, large events, uh, tragedies, things like that in our lifetime, obviously. But I just can't remember the date of that tragedy. Right.
00:05:16
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know. 7-Eleven. That's what it was. 7-Eleven. Um, but for me, I was like really young when that was happening. And I was just like, Oh, this feels momentous, but otherwise life's not really changing for me immediately. Whereas this is like, you get used to going to work, you get used to interacting with people to go on the lunch, um, all of that. And,
00:05:43
Speaker
It all gets upset really quickly. It's like these things are no longer safe, you know, for you or your loved ones and you have a responsibility to society to try to slow this down, right? Yeah. So for those out there,
00:06:03
Speaker
I guess a generic well-wish. I hope everybody is staying indoors and can afford to stay indoors, not have it impact your life drastically outside of some inconveniences. And we hope that this is a brief respite as we talk about something very not serious.
Introduction to Devil May Cry 5
00:06:22
Speaker
Yes. Devil May Cry 5.
00:06:25
Speaker
Right. I was going to introduce this as a much anticipated demon slaying game. I was able to snag a copy of preparation for this episode. But yeah, it's definitely a great fight. We're probably, this came out like a little while ago. This was the last year. I think only about a year, right?
00:06:50
Speaker
Uh-huh. Uh, but a resurgence in the genre for big fans of the series, especially after DMC, which personally I enjoyed, but I'm like a filthy casual to these people. So, um, we're not aware DMC was a kind of a divergence from the cannon or a core arc. Yeah, it was like a retelling sort of, it was another fate arc.
00:07:19
Speaker
Oh, yeah, it was basically that. And people didn't like it because of the attitudes and the way they changed some of the characters. So this is kind of returning to the roots with four and things like that. Hmm. This is my first foray into Devil May Cry. I will not throw opinions out yet. We can get into some stuff more. Yeah, sure. It was definitely one of the most
00:07:49
Speaker
flashy anime type games that I had seen as far as like, this looks perdy. It's definitely got Capcom and Japan in full effect, right? Yeah, I agree with that.
00:08:09
Speaker
Like just from the get go, the characters are absolutely ridiculous. But anyways, definitely cry. If you've never heard about that is an action hack and slash type game, like jumping in the air, trying to build high combos, get your, your S double S or maybe even triple S rank.
00:08:27
Speaker
I didn't know that I went that high. I got it once while revisiting the game for this. I can't remember how I did it. Probably some sort of cheese. But it follows the tried and test tried and true story largely is repeated throughout the series of the main characters fighting demons, fighting each other, and then credits.
00:08:57
Speaker
I put a bit of Jake on that. What little experience I've had of it. What little exposure. We've played games that are similar to this though, right? Like we've played Platinum games in some ways. You could say like Killer is Dead has some similarities to it in the combat. Yeah, to a degree. But a lot of those things are more emphasizing like stylish combat.
00:09:26
Speaker
where it's like, hey, you might have a basic combo, but if you mix it up, it will increase your rank or meter and you get more points, which sometimes does convert into something. Other times it might just be bragging rights.
Character Gameplay Breakdown
00:09:38
Speaker
But it really does kind of emphasize the more unique fighting. Yeah, there's like, I guess killer is dead. Even though it's really flashy, it's still kind of for the purpose of combat.
00:09:56
Speaker
Devil May Cry is sometimes flashy just for the sake of flashy. There's a taunt button that you can press, and it gives you some style points when you do it. And the taunt will vary based off of what style tier you're in. And there's ones for the ground, and there's ones for the air. And it's not a minor throw-in. It's clearly part of their design philosophy for the game.
00:10:24
Speaker
If you've got it, flaunt it. So I would like to see like some footage of somebody who's actually good at the game. Like beat it on the highest difficulty and just, you know, roll enemies and bosses. Yeah. Because usually I find something that works in a game and then I abuse it so much. And we're going to spoil some stuff here. It's been out for a year, so it's not that big of a deal. Are we doing spoiler recordings again?
00:10:52
Speaker
The only reason I'm doing it is because I didn't think about adding it beforehand. And even though I haven't uploaded this, so I still will go back and add it.
00:11:02
Speaker
I was not sure exactly how much I wanted to spoil, but spoiling playable characters definitely makes sense. You were talking about someone who's really good at the game. I'm not. There's a little jump in with that. But I did see a clip of someone who is fighting the final boss and using Royal Guard to block a bunch of attacks and just stay in triple S tier, the whole fight, like just not getting hit, blocking every single attack.
00:11:33
Speaker
So what is Royal guard? Royal guard is one of the styles that Dante has. He's one of the, the three protagonists for the game. Yeah. And he's been throughout the series as far as I know, he's the, the OG, the one people were upset when they remade him in DMC. Yeah. He's very edgy. Mm-hmm.
00:12:00
Speaker
He's actually- He's too cool for school. He's definitely too cool for school. More so than Edgy. Yeah. He used to be more Edgy, but he's kind of just developed a pessimistic tinge to everything he does now where he's just like, I don't even care anymore. He's like the humble rogue reluctant hero type.
00:12:19
Speaker
He's the most likable by far. You say that as though there's a huge difference. There's some characters that you may not like nearly as much, Dave. Okay, so we got to talk about the first playable character, which is Nero. He's kind of like the
00:12:44
Speaker
I want to say younger brother type character of Dante. He has his own thing going on, but he's. I guess more of a student of Dante's than anything. He's nowhere near where Dante's at. He's kind of he's off doing his own thing, but he's he's incidentally following Dante's path, but he doesn't believe he's super cocky. He's like, and I hate cocky people.
00:13:11
Speaker
Yeah, he's kind of obnoxious for that. But he's kind of on his own hero's journey. I don't know if I would call him like a student of Dante. If he is, then he's like not realizing he's walking that path, right? Like he kind of disrespects Dante. Let me rephrase. He's below Dante, whether he admits it or not. Oh, yeah. As far as like ability. Yeah. But his playstyle is very much
00:13:40
Speaker
You have a sword or you have a gun. Yes. Or so his mechanics are based around the devil breakers, which because he's missing part of an arm, about half of an arm, he can have these attachments, which can be used to vary up your play style. Yes.
00:14:04
Speaker
And some of them are some of them are pretty cool. This is one of those games where because it's trying to cater to the old fan base as well as people coming into it, sometimes it misses the mark a little bit or it doesn't fully explain something. I kind of wish that there was a.
00:14:26
Speaker
a skippable tutorial that just requires you to pull off certain moves. There's like a practice range called the void, where you can just do whatever. It's just like move testing. But if you just jump into the game, you might not know how Devil Breaker works, for instance.
00:14:45
Speaker
That's me. Because as soon as I'm put on the path, I'm like, hey, here's a cutscene. I'm like, please let me skip this if I don't care. It's like, hey, here's the tutorial. I'm like, nah, stop. It needs to be built in intuitively for me to acquiesce to it. Otherwise, if I'm not in the right mindset, I just become stubborn and I want to ignore everything and just figure it out. Right.
00:15:11
Speaker
You're just like, oh, okay, blinders go up and you're like, I'm forging through this, right? If you don't tell me. Best quality, but I do realize it in me. So it'd be nice if it was a little more intuitive. Right. If they meet you halfway. Yeah. Yeah. Because basically I was using the Devil Breakers and they would break immediately. Yes. I think if you take damage while you're using them, they kind of just explode.
00:15:40
Speaker
There's two, so there's like, there's three functions for each of them. There's the tap. So for me, I'm using an Xbox controller, so it's tapping B, which is like, use the basic function of it. If you take damage during that, it breaks. There's overcharge, which is hold B until it flashes and then release it for like,
00:16:01
Speaker
a very powerful attack or a very powerful effect that does break it. Then there's a breakaway button that executes more quickly than the overcharge, but also destroys it for a semi-powerful effect. That's what I was probably accidentally doing. Yeah. But yeah, if you're charging or something, you get hit, it'll break. Nero keeps a stock of them on hand. I think you can have three max.
00:16:31
Speaker
You can upgrade it so you can carry more like throughout the game. So eventually you can have like six or seven or eight. Can you actually switch in between them? You can't. Yeah. Okay. So that's the other thing. And that's the trade off of, Hey, I can explode this one, kind of trash it, get some damage out of it, but then queue up for the next one that you want to use.
00:16:52
Speaker
And if you were super hyper-optimized in your route or this particular mission, you wanted to farm it or something, you're like, all right, I'm going to have at these points, this is the one I'm going to overcharge, then I'll switch to this one for general use, and then I'll go to this one or whatever. But I don't play the game that way. So most of the time, I just tried not to break them unless I absolutely had to. And as a consequence, they were just sitting there. Nero's not my favorite boy.
00:17:21
Speaker
No. Some of them are really cool though as far as the breakers are concerned and playing through with us. I did like punchline once I figured out how to use it by not taking damage because it sends out this flying fist that goes around and keeps like hitting stuff once you still have the option to go around and like beat some ass. So it's like a little helper. What it reminds me of
00:17:45
Speaker
Metal Gear Solid 5. Yeah. What was that? Hand of... Jigudi. Remember always saying Swiggity Swooty. Hand of Jigudi. Yeah. It's like an anime version of that. Very fast. But it's really nice for building up a combo. Or for maintaining a combo. Because you're just hitting a guy. And then your hand is off. Somewhere else. Flying around the air. Beating up on somebody.
00:18:10
Speaker
You can also kind of chain stun people in the air with it. So if you if you launch them up and then you hit them with the fist, it's just like air juggling them while you're dealing with someone else on the ground. So there's like there's different ways you can play around with it.
00:18:25
Speaker
All right. Props to the game for giving you other options. Cause I, as I've always said, I'm a very linear gamer. If I want them, I'll be like, if it works, don't change it. Yeah. And I'll get through the game that way, but I can miss out on a lot of things like that where you do the options to juggle.
00:18:43
Speaker
I think the one I really, there's a very basic one. Can't remember, I think it's Overture. It's not on my list here. But it's just like the first one you get, it's just an electric blast in front of you. But I liked it because I just used it. Yeah, exactly. I just used it as a combo ender.
00:19:06
Speaker
So just be like, okay, I need a little more damage finish off an enemy like blast There is literally one I can't remember the exact name of it But it's like a kami hami ha full laser beam if you overcharge it where it's just a gigantic Dragon ball Z laser it breaks because you're overcharging it but
00:19:27
Speaker
and you're locked in there. You can't jump out of it or like move or do whatever. It's just like, yeah, but I don't know. It's a really cool design. Some of them are like really strong punches, overcharging your gun or your sword. I just, the fact that they're consumable hurts me somehow on a deep level because I'm like, I love this and it's gone. Or I can't get to the one I want without breaking all of my stuff.
00:19:58
Speaker
I have something that's a little bit weird because I know most gamers, myself included, have the tendency to not want to use consumables because you're like, am I going to need this later? Is it okay to use it now? Or if you use them all now, you're like, yeah, that was a good fight. And it's like, and the boss is here and I have nothing to consume.
00:20:17
Speaker
Yes, exactly. So as a consequence of that, I enjoyed characters that didn't rely on that as much. And Nero is also just really obnoxious. He has to prove himself at one point early in
Plot and Boss Mechanics in Devil May Cry 5
00:20:30
Speaker
the game. And it's a super meme done in related videos. Dante calls him dead weight in a fight against... I don't think it's Uryl. Uryzan. Thank you.
00:20:46
Speaker
He calls him dead weight in the fight. And Nero holds that the entire game, where anytime he sees Dante again and Dante's like, hey, you should like fall back or go do this other thing or whatever. And Nero's like, oh, is it because I'm dead weight? You know, whatever. He just jumps on it. I'm like, I hate you so much. Yeah, he's he's a little piss pot.
00:21:10
Speaker
Oh, my gosh. He has he keeps interesting company, though. He has a like a support van with Nico, who's like the mechanic who who makes his arm and stuff. And they're all weird, like Japanese characters. It's. Yeah, but it's like a Japanese version of a real American type.
00:21:36
Speaker
Because she's very country, but her basic speech patterns, I'm like, who the fuck talks like this? Yeah, exactly. But she's very outgoing and crass. But she's super talented, because she's just like, oh, grab me that piece of thing. And then she makes a new arm piece for Nero, and you're like, all right, it's anime, whatever.
00:21:57
Speaker
you'd be like the first boss and she takes a piece of it, smells it and is like, all right, I'm going to make something out of this. You're just like, OK, this is just this is just how it's going to be, I guess. But then they have like the mystery mobile. Yeah, it's it's literally what it is. So like before a boss, you have like a phone booth, you'll call it the vandal appear from
00:22:20
Speaker
usually off of a rooftop and they kind of land near you. And that's where you can go and customize if you want to like, Oh, I want to change my loadout for this upcoming fight or like spend some red money. Yeah. Upgrade something.
00:22:36
Speaker
I like that though. I like that as you continue to get to like more infested demon areas, she's just like breaking out of the wall and like rolling the van and doing all this stuff to show up at the phone booth. It's just regardless of where you are, they show up there. It's kind of the arbitrary save point thing the RPGs have had for a long time, but they play into it. I do like Niko's stick.
00:23:03
Speaker
Yeah, so that's kind of Nero's support crew, but pretty early on. So the plot, I guess, or what exists of it, right? Is Nero and Dante are both working for a character named V to try to defeat Urizen. But I think at the beginning of the game, they didn't know they were both working together. He just hired them both and was like, hey, go kill Urizen.
00:23:32
Speaker
Um, and, uh, my screens just went black. I'm hoping, oh, we're back. Okay. Cause your favorite is no longer lit up by monitor glow. I'll have to periodically, I'll keep my computer from going to sleep. But the first fight, it's one of those, um, those fights you're meant to lose against yourism.
00:23:53
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know if you can win it. Because again, you can. OK. I saw a guy do it in an accelerated video that was like 10 minutes accelerated. You do not even chip damage. Yeah. And a lot of stuff is very punishing. And you don't have any upgrades at this point. He has like a shield. He has a shield crystal in front of him. And the shield crystal has its own health. It's an enemy. And his health bar is untouchable until the shield crystal is broken.
00:24:23
Speaker
Once you break that, he's attacking you through all this. Once you break that, he's vulnerable until he remakes the crystal. And so you have to literally just continue to chip down his regenerating shield entity until you can do damage to him. But you're meant to lose. Yeah, it's kind of like in Mega Man X.
00:24:43
Speaker
you have this fight against Vile, you get your ass beat, then Zero comes to save you, and you're like, oof, I want to become that strong. So when you do come back to eventually fight the boss again, you're like, look how big my dick is, and then you just need to kick their ass.
00:25:00
Speaker
I think the big difference here is he also destroys Dante for most of the fight. You're the second wave of attack. Dante's already kind of lost. Trish is lost. I think Lady was there and has lost.
00:25:15
Speaker
So it's a very old gaming trope. I just like have the bad guy beat you, you know, to start the adventure. And it works, I think. If you do beat him, though, it's a little aside. The credits roll super fast. It just zooms through all of them. It's just like, good job. Now, like, try again, because the rest of the game only happens if you lose. It's pretty funny.
00:25:45
Speaker
I hope they give you an achievement for that at least. Yeah. I think you, I think you actually, I think there's an achievement for beating him and you can get the achievement if you beat him on the first encounter, basically. So either way, I know. Right. Oh, there goes the arm. But yeah, he's also, oh, I'm sorry. Oh, I see your screen is starting to go. I also did the FK monitor. Shit.
00:26:12
Speaker
I was going to say you're as in his design is really cool though. Cause not only does he fight with like demon tentacles, he's really like, he doesn't care. He's just sitting there like the thinking man, basically lazy half grown into his chair, like biological matter and just does not care about the fact you're fighting him. It's like you're all nothing. Yeah. He's very like a one punch man boss. That's like actually,
00:26:39
Speaker
Like the, uh, the alien on the ship at the end of season one, exactly. Like I'm bored by all of this. I'm here to destroy because nothing can challenge me. Yeah. He's, he's interesting though. But now he's got like a nice good tentacle seed monster demon alien vibe. Yeah. It's like a lot of his design is overgrown demon roots and vines type.
00:27:10
Speaker
I like the demon designs and, um, they'll only cry, um, for like the true demons. There's like lesser demons, which are just like, this is like a spider bug monster thing, or here's like a wasp looking thing. Those are all fine. There's some that stand out are really cool. Did you, you encountered the, um, the ghosts that have like white masks and shears.
00:27:34
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Like, I like their design. That's pretty cool. But for the greater demons, like the people who are legitimately. Yeah, like knights. They're they're awesome. Yeah. You also have a hard on for terribly. So that's true. That's fair. It is kind of that very cool, like edgy. Like demon knights, like they have the most badass armor. I love it.
00:28:03
Speaker
It's like semi-biological plates and all this other stuff and it's freaking great. The main characters also have, two of the main characters have devil triggers, which unlock through parts of the game. And they kind of have, they have cool demon forms as well.
00:28:23
Speaker
But Dante in particular has a sin devil trigger. Cause usually their devil trigger is just like, oh, they get some like minor wings. They'll be like blue or maybe red. They kind of like have a demon carapace more or less. And their moveset gets cooler. But Dante has like a full unlock where he goes full demon and he's just like, it's so good. I'm just nerding out. I'm sorry. It's really good though.
00:28:52
Speaker
It's cool. There's a reason they don't let you stay in there very long. He just obliterates everything. Yeah, it does make all of your attacks way more empowered. His sin double trigger also has teleportation. He just instantly transmits to people and then, like, carves them up.
00:29:13
Speaker
One of the unlocks he literally calls like a chaos meteor down and just impact AOE Fireball damage. I don't know. I love it. So V is also a character. That's true, yeah. And V is much more of a... I mean, everybody in this game is a little bit edgy.
00:29:35
Speaker
but his thing is very kind of goth kid where he has a cane and a poetry book and he kind of summons like dark spirits to fight for him in the form of like a buzzard for ranged attacks a leopard yeah it's like a leopard panther it's all black it's made of like spirit energy yeah i think it's a panther yeah
00:29:59
Speaker
We're gonna go with Panther. That one's called Shadow, the ultimate lifer. I would have loved the game so much more. If one of his summons was just Shadow the Hedgehog. You summon him in. You are the faker. And then he also has a Golem, but that kind of uses his trigger gauge. Nightmare.
00:30:24
Speaker
Yeah, which I'm not crazy about his play style. It is really fun, though, because each button is kind of for a different summon. And then you have to interact with the buttons in like different ways to like combo. But like him, the himself does not actually attack enemies until they're like a weakened state. And then he stabs them with his cane. And that's how you finish off the enemies.
00:30:50
Speaker
Yeah, I love that mechanic though. Like his, his, uh, creatures are.
00:30:58
Speaker
for reasons basically, for the most part, not strong enough to kill things. They'll just weaken them a lot. But he and his cane in particular is really, really good at killing weakened demons. So he has execution moves on like everything. So he'll do this instant transmission, warp to a wounded enemy, impale them, then like fly off.
00:31:22
Speaker
Some of them are really cool where he just like jams the cane all the way into their forehead. He's kind of like trying to wiggle it out and then pulls it out and they explode.
00:31:31
Speaker
Yeah, one of the demons has like it's like a cyclops looking thing and he'll like he stabs through the eye, walks off a bit with the eye just on his cane and then spins and throws it back at the demon. It just explodes on impact and kills it. That's what happens if you throw somebody's eyes at them. A little known fact. It could be true. I haven't done it.
00:31:57
Speaker
I actually love V though, his play style, replaying the game a little bit. I enjoyed it maybe a little bit less, but I love his character design. His character is where they kind of branched out in this game compared to previous ones.
00:32:16
Speaker
His summons actually also impact his abilities. So he has a double jump. That's pretty quick and has some evasion. But the second jump is because the bird warps to him and he can grab it and like his talons and like hover a little bit. But if your bird is dead, also all of his moves are named after chess. If your bird is in. It's not stalemate.
00:32:45
Speaker
But anyways, whatever, there's a term for it. Appreciate the term. Then he doesn't have this double jump. And the same thing for his dodge. He has like, if you're targeting an enemy and you do a side dodge, he uses shadow to side dodge. But if shadow is dead, then you can't side dodge anymore. So if both of your birds, both of your pets are dead, you have no mobility. You're just like, hope that the boss doesn't hit me as I like wobble about.
00:33:14
Speaker
I actually encountered that once because I was fighting a demon knight. I kind of blew my load, so to speak, and my summons were down. So I was kind of jumping away awkwardly. It's like a guy in sandals, like, please stop waiting for them to kind of like take back up so I could resummon them. Yeah, a little bit weird.
00:33:36
Speaker
If you use the attack animation and you're not actually executing someone, his attacks rebound off of any enemy. It doesn't matter how weak they are. Like he just hit a wall in Dark Souls. He's just like, oh, oh, right. I'm just a guy. Yeah, I gotta say the coolest thing with his nightmare, which is the goal, is there is an upgrade where you can kind of ride the goal.
00:34:01
Speaker
Oh yeah, you jump on it. There is a, I got an unlocked move for that. His move, it's called illegal move is the execution, but it's back on the stick and then forward or double forward and then B.
00:34:16
Speaker
and you just warp out of existence on it and there's an aberration of distortion and then the golem and you just appear closer to the enemy like you warp towards them and then there's a skill you can unlock after that that if you press B the golem just like hunkers down and just shoots a gigantic laser like there's this a vertical and horizontal laser you can fire but this one's a massive
00:34:42
Speaker
blast. It takes like seven seconds to fully execute and the enemy's always moved outside of the middle. But it's so awesome.
00:34:53
Speaker
Terrence, Terrence, come over here and worry about what's going on. Yeah, let's take a smoke break over here. I will say in this playthrough, I changed his controls and that made him way better. So by default, the panther shadow is on the Y button. And the bird is on X.
00:35:16
Speaker
And if you have those and you have a standard controller, you know, like an Xbox controller, you can't hit both of those buttons at the same time or hold and press forward and back and all that. So hear me out. Yes, specifically for V missions. And I'm going to hold up the controller for demonstration. Instead of me doing like a dual analog, like thumb and thumb, I would have
00:35:42
Speaker
my left hand on the thumbstick and my right hand goes up like a claw for the different buttons. So for the listeners, he abandoned the look around thumbstick. The second stick never existed.
00:36:00
Speaker
Because certain attacks, like for the bird, I might have like a charge X does something. So I'd have to hold that down. Yeah, but that's hard to hold down X with your right thumb and then keep pressing Y. So I do with my pointer finger and then have my middle finger just like mashing the Y button so the panther could keep slashing. Yeah. And then every time meter built up, I'd press B with my ring finger with the claw. So this time I read out. It was perfect system.
00:36:31
Speaker
This time I rebound it, so the bird was on L1. And then I just move the double trigger down to the D-pad, which is where everybody else's double trigger is. And then I can just keep targeting and just like mash the bird button or hold and release for like the lightning strikes. And then keep doing Panther. And I didn't have to do anything wonky with the controller. I like how the fun never crossed my mind.
00:36:58
Speaker
I didn't think about it until like playing through this time. I was like, no, no, certainly the developers know what they're doing. But I looked up and people have, they're like, here's a much better control out layout for Nero, for Dante.
Game Design Critique
00:37:18
Speaker
And for Dante, I feel like he's one of the type of person that he, this is the OG character.
00:37:27
Speaker
He's got four styles. Like Royal One. Yeah. Gunslinger is one. Trickster is one. And what was the sword master? Yeah, sword master. And then you can have like eight pieces of gear. So like eight projectile or like four projectile weapons, four melee weapons.
00:37:54
Speaker
and just swap between them and they all have their own movesets. So I'm like, this is too much. I like him the most though, because I was going through and I was button mashing and sometimes be like, I want to do this. And instead of doing what I intended to do, I switched weapons or fighting styles. I'm like, okay, new things are happening. So it offered some very diverse gameplay. So I think to start, it's like,
00:38:21
Speaker
uh, swords and guns. And if you switch over, it's like, I'm going to be punching people a lot. I was like, okay, cool.
00:38:31
Speaker
They each have their own advantages, too. People that are really good at the game, he can change styles instantly in this one, which is very useful because Trickster gives you tons of iframes on your dodges. You can dodge really far and you can just stay in the air, basically. But you can go airborne with Trickster, switch to Swordmaster.
00:38:55
Speaker
Swordmaster has the ability to throw out spectral blades as well as your normal attacks. So now you're just like stacking DPS on. Like, uh oh, here comes an attack. Royal Guard defense. Royal Guard can guard in the air. Crazy game changer. That seems pretty good. I did not do experiment too much with each of the different styles. Yeah. So I think in like a few Dante missions before I got distracted by something.
00:39:24
Speaker
There was an outbreak and a bunch of other games were playing. I mean, it was Ori too. This is a pre-outbreak. An outbreak of Ori. Or a release, that's what they call those usually. I can't wait for a release. But he is cool. I think he definitely has some of the potential too.
00:39:45
Speaker
Um, if you put a lot of time into practicing the movesets, your combos, stuff like that, this guy's the limit for what Dante can do. I also get this guy's the limit. I'm like, yeah, he's done. Five miles up. But, um, did you, did you play long enough to get the hat to Dr. Faust? I think I was a little bit shy. I think I unlocked the motorcycle.
00:40:14
Speaker
Motorcycle is good though. How did you feel about the motorcycle? I'm getting some shifty eyes. I can see there's enough resolution. I just got it, but that was the last mission I played. Gotcha. I'm going to mention the motorcycle though, because this is one of the few things that we knew about from like the teaser.
00:40:36
Speaker
And the motorcycle is, I think it's a horse, a demon horse. You beat and you get like the piece for it or something. Something like that. But anyways, it's a motorcycle. He rides around, but it's also two giant like saw blades. And there's a bunch of switching back and forth between motorcycle and like buzz saws.
00:41:06
Speaker
in the middle of combat and swinging the motorcycle or the saws or your body. It's like, it's, I don't even know. It's anime. That is very anime. I know you don't have, I know you can't really say much about it because of that, but it's hard to explain how like anime it is. And the hats, the hats similarly. Um,
00:41:34
Speaker
I'm just going to quickly mention the hat. I don't want to go too in detail on it because I know I don't want to cover too much for people who may still want to play a game at this point. But it lets you risk all your money while you have it equipped. It's a scarf and a hat. You throw the hat.
00:41:50
Speaker
And every enemy that gets pinged by the hat as it's flying around you gets a little cowboy hat. They're all wearing it. And then if you hit them, they drop money and you collect it. But while you're using the hat, if you get hit, you lose money. Oh, so it's a risk-free situation.
00:42:11
Speaker
Yeah. And it's just a hilarious farming item. And the scene where you get it is very memorable and people should either play the game or look it up. I don't want to spoil that. Young Maestro's video, I feel, does this whole game justice. Whose video was it? Did you say Maestro's? Yeah, Young Maestro.
00:42:32
Speaker
Okay. I remember watching someone who did it. I didn't realize it was Maestro. It must have been. He has the dancing segment in there, right? Yes. Yes, he does. Yeah. How would he not? I think he has all like the most Mimi parts. He did a really good job of it.
00:42:50
Speaker
So I know that we've played a lot of games in this space. Like we played games similar, right? Like we played Killer is Dead. I made you play Killer is Dead. I made you play Revengeance. Killer is Dead. I played before long ago. I think you might have suggested it to me. We both had it. I enjoyed it. I'm not going to have to grudge you on that one.
00:43:18
Speaker
But we played similar action games like this. How does this game compare to you? Where does it fall in there? I've waited 42 minutes. I don't like this game. I really don't like this game. The moment-to-moment gameplay can be very fun, and the graphics are really beautiful. But for me, it has so many issues as far as game design, and it's also not my type of game. So that really adds to it.
00:43:45
Speaker
What would be the game design issues you have? Because I've ranted about what I love. It's time. Do the other half of the podcast. It's time. So basically, anytime that you have an animation that you can't skip past, I'm not keen on. This game has a lot of, hey, we're going to have a cut scene. Hey, we're going to have an animation.
00:44:10
Speaker
So one example is, as you're kind of exploring through parts of the level, which are also usually fairly linear, you'll have like a segment, and then a room that's a fight, and then a segment in the room that's a fight. You might have to go grab like a key piece, which is like a bug, and the design for that's really cool. But when you pick that up, there's an animation, and then you go find the door, and then you put it on the door, and then there's an animation.
00:44:38
Speaker
And it's not like, done. It's like four seconds each time that I have to press start to skip the animation to continue playing the game. And that for me hurts a lot. And that's just like one small example.
00:44:52
Speaker
I will give you that one because in prepping for this episode, I looked at options. I was like, is there a way to skip a little cut scenes between each section? There's not. And for the listeners, if you've played a Zelda game where spiked or barred doors come down behind you, that's basically the same thing as what happens here. Oh, the rune blocks. Yeah.
00:45:20
Speaker
Dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun.
00:45:37
Speaker
a golden orb, which allows you to respawn. I'd never use those, by the way, because... Right. Because you're good. No. Normal difficulty is actually just really easy in comparison. I think you told me that hard is the ideal difficulty. Yeah. I think that's probably, probably
Action Game Comparisons
00:45:56
Speaker
true. Looking back at it, I don't know if there's like Devil Hunter. Is that what you were on? Whatever was the standard one, what I usually try games on.
00:46:08
Speaker
Yeah. I'm going to look. But yeah, keep going. So when you get this golden orb for the first time, it's like, hey, here's what it is. Here's what it does. There's like a three or four second animation. You're like, cool. So the second time I got it, I was like, I already know what it is. You don't need to tell me. Just give me a little plus one at the top. Oh, yeah. And it's a little video every single time. Yeah.
00:46:36
Speaker
I don't need the interruptions if the core is the cool stylistic gameplay. Focus on that. Don't distract from it. But it just felt like padding in a way.
00:46:47
Speaker
Yeah, it's similar to like, going again to Legend of Zelda, you open a chest, Link holds up an item, you know? I also thought, I think it's similar to some other more recent games though, like Dark Souls does that as well too, right? Like you get an item and it's like, hey, the text is here at the bottom of the screen, at the next available moment, tap that X button to make it go away, right? I also want to give you credit because I looked at the difficulties.
00:47:15
Speaker
And easy as human, devil hunter is normal. That's what I played on. So if you haven't used any of the orbs, it just means you legitimately haven't died on the recommended four fans of the series difficulty. Joke somebody I might actually even play. I don't remember. It just something didn't come up. Because you're good. I am very good at video games.
00:47:45
Speaker
But that was like some of the main gripes for me. Also, because I am very stubborn and dumb, I didn't really get into the nuances of the gameplay between the different characters. And it felt kind of flashy button mashy. I mean, I could get away with doing pretty basic things and dodging. And you call it a day. And then you skip your 20 seconds of cutscenes, go to the next thing.
00:48:14
Speaker
It is definitely like comparing this to God of War. The enemies don't hit as quickly most of the time. And if you stagger them at all, then they take some time to recover before they'll come at you again. So I think like at the ground floor, if you're coming in, you don't have a lot of experience. You can get through it. But there's a huge difference between that and like really experienced players who just blaze through it. They're triple S ranks obliterating everything. They'll just clear the game faster because they're being more aggressive. Yeah.
00:48:43
Speaker
But I feel that if you are a fan of the series and you're already used to this type of game and this series of gameplay, I imagine it's only purifying the experience. I can't imagine Devil May Cry 1 was that nuanced in comparison. So I think if you like this game already, I think you're going to fucking love 5. Oh, yeah. If you're a fan of the series. If it seems like the best iteration of it to date.
00:49:11
Speaker
It's just, it's not my cup of tea. Yeah. Um, which is why at the beginning, I'm like, it looks real pretty. I had, uh, just a few more questions for you regarding your experiences here. How did you feel about the, um, the co-op sections or the co-gameplay sections, the linked gameplay? And did you know they happened?
00:49:38
Speaker
So I did see like, oh, guest appearance by, and I was just like, what? And then ignored it. I didn't realize that it was actually another player in my session as that other NPC, well, I guess other main character.
00:49:54
Speaker
Yeah. And you could be forgiven, I think, for understanding.
Future of Devil May Cry Series
00:50:00
Speaker
They don't tell you. Yeah, they don't really tell you. It says like starring and then whatever their name is. And I didn't realize the first time either because you don't interact with them. It's not like you're side by side fighting. There actually is a mission that's like that, I think called the three warriors that's later in the game.
00:50:20
Speaker
where you are just side-by-side fighting with the other characters and it's kind of great like it's two people but but otherwise they're just trying to they they're killing some of the enemies in your path or there's a part where V is opening up the path for Nero by killing some vines that are like blocking his path dropping a bridge
00:50:45
Speaker
And I didn't realize it until I was playing through the segment as V. I was like, wait, I already did this. Like, or I saw this area. And oh, this is where the bridge drops, you know, stuff like that. It's cool, but I wish they would have done more with it. Like, I would have actually enjoyed co-op, I think, in a game like this. And unfortunately, there's only you only get to fight together in like one mission. That's kind of weird that they threw it in there.
00:51:15
Speaker
I will say for, for this play through on the first mission, I had someone starring as Dante, uh, while I was Nero approaching the first boss. And I was like, wait, what does that mean? Cause I don't remember being able to fight the first bosses Dante. So like, does he have a secret mission or something like that? Like if he beats the boss or lowers his health and I show up, is that an easier fight for me? Or like, I don't actually know how that results.
00:51:45
Speaker
Because he was he was out by the time I got there. So who knows? Weird. Yeah, but I wish they would have done more with that. But otherwise, yeah, core gameplay. Pretty good. Did you check out Bloody Palace at all? Probably not. If you were still doing main campaign, it's just there in the in the main menu. Big, big shrug.
00:52:14
Speaker
Big shrug. TLDR for buddy palaces, it's just waves of enemies. You just fight until you either run out of time, you get time by killing enemies, or you die. Yeah, but you can get some money doing that. It's a challenge mode. It wasn't in the game when I last played it, so they definitely added it. I like the idea that if it, like trying to think if I would go back and do that for something like near automata. Yeah, because I'd say that.
00:52:40
Speaker
Combat is so fucking tight. And it's also done by Platinum Games. Fact check me, is this done by Platinum Games? DMC5. But typically they're known for having really tight combat in games.
00:52:56
Speaker
Um, yeah, I mean, I could, I think you could be forgiven for thinking so as I try to search without hurting myself. This is definitely better than devil in the cries in my opinion, but I know it's a different studio actually. Okay. I won't disparage a platinum though. Like I love pretty much everything they make. It should.
00:53:22
Speaker
It's one of those things where if you don't have the basics down, everything else feels kind of off, which is why when you're talking about platformers, you're like, oh, really tight controls are better responsive. So if you go and jump for something, you know exactly when you're gonna land when you do your inputs and when you stop your inputs. It's the same way if you're fighting. If you feel like you're buffering inputs and things are kind of weird, you're like, ah, it gets a bit of a jank.
00:53:50
Speaker
It definitely, I'm not the best at that. This is a game that rewards patient timing though. Cause if you look at the combos for each character, it's like one combo is press X or like press Y and then press Y and then tap Y repeatedly. They're like, okay, but that's different than just like tap Y five times. They're like, yeah, yeah. No, those are different moves. Like delays are essential for a lot of the moves.
00:54:19
Speaker
And I'm like, OK, I'll try, I guess, but I'm not good. I can appreciate it. It's part of it's part of what it is. Yeah, I'm sure like the timing of attacks of enemies is based on that as well. So even if you do have like three different types of enemies with different methods of attack, if you know what you're doing on that character, it will feel fluid. Yeah, I just did not get to that point. Yeah.
00:54:48
Speaker
Yeah, there's there's so much depth for how you can play it. And it just you unlock harder difficulties by beating the game. So the next one, Son of Sparta after Devil Hunter. I haven't made any progress there yet, but we're still talking about God of War or. Yeah, right. Sparta. Yeah, it's with a D. That's an important difference. Yeah, if you are interested in Devil May Cry lore, you can play any of the games. They all have the same plot.
00:55:19
Speaker
Do we want to spoil that anyway? As someone who enjoys this type of game, I personally do recommend it. I think it's good steps for the series, and I had a lot of fun with it. It should go on sale periodically now because it's been out long enough. And who doesn't want to kill some demons?
00:55:47
Speaker
I mean, I want to with guns and like, yeah. Yeah. Um, so yeah, I don't know how this is going to compare to doom. We can have the, the devil may cry doom comparison later. I mean, one of, that's a great question. Actually, I guess it depends on the engine.
00:56:10
Speaker
Well, here's a question for you, Jake. Since you've followed more of Devil May Cry than I have, what would you like to see them do in future games?
00:56:19
Speaker
I guess I touched on it a little bit, but like, so I love the introduction of characters like V. Even if he's not super popular with existing fans, just a different play style is fun. The ability to read poetry instead of jumping around with the sword. Why not? You know, throw it in the game. Might as well. But I would also like to see them expand on the co-op, sorts of mechanics and things.
00:56:42
Speaker
Even if their main audience isn't really into that, it's very obviously possible. They literally had a level where they did it. So, you know, why not give people that option? Yeah, I think just Capcom introduces new game modes all the time. I think that they have the ability to build that out a bit. And let me play Virgil. That's all I want. Just let me play Virgil. It's been three years.
00:57:15
Speaker
That's what I want from it, but they're making good strides. Yeah, I imagine their future games will continue to get better. People who are making it, they're like, we know our core audience and the type of game that they want, and they deliver every fucking time.
00:57:37
Speaker
Like I've not heard somebody who likes Devil May Cry where they're like, five wins, I don't know. Yeah. DMC was probably the closest thing to a mess. Capcom do make mistakes as a publisher and a developer. Dead Rising, you could just like watch their review scores drop off like a slope for every game that came out. But I think they'll get there in the end. Monster Hunter is pretty good. DMC is pretty good. Keep on keeping on.
00:58:06
Speaker
And you guys should keep on keeping on too. Stay safe, stay healthy, stay alive.
00:58:15
Speaker
That's not the end of the episode. As always, if you guys have feedback, you can send it in at soapstonepodcast at gmail.com or you could join the discussion on Facebook, which you can get on without getting the virus. So, you know, pretty good deal. Let's use the instant messenger app. Then you're pretty well, you're screwed then.
00:58:39
Speaker
So the Messenger app and Gmail are not saved, got it. Gmails would be fine. Messenger app, keep that off there. Drain your battery. Anyways, Facebook.com slash Silverstone podcast. And as always, we'll see you in the next one.