Transcript
Lindsay Franklin: Hello and welcome to Quilling It. I'm Lindsay Franklin.
Paul Regnier: And I'm Paul Regner.
Lindsay Franklin: And today we are hopping into our time machine and we are going to go back in time. and give advice to our younger writer selves.
Lindsay Franklin: So what were the things that we wish we had been told when we were just starting out in our writing careers?
Paul Regnier: yes this is our chance to hop back into the past
Lindsay Franklin: So. Yeah.
Paul Regnier: and warn ourselves.
Lindsay Franklin: but
Paul Regnier: Don't mess up. um No, I do have... like it's the classic thing where you say like oh if i knew now you know Or if I knew then what I know now, like what would I tell myself?
Lindsay Franklin: he
Paul Regnier: That kind of thing, but applied to... this writing journey. But before we get started, I do want to mention, um which we never mention and we should. um Everyone that's listening, we're very grateful for you.
Paul Regnier: But we would like to please invite you to like, subscribe, you know leave a review. all that good stuff we keep forgetting to do this lindsay and we We really need to reach out more. and And. beg people for Reviews.
Lindsay Franklin: it's you know It's true. And I don't think we've ever said it on the show, but um it really, really does help boost the show in the algorithm to try to reach people who might find it helpful.
Paul Regnier: No.
Paul Regnier: who
Lindsay Franklin: And so likes, comments, subscribing, all of that is is super helpful for that. So we really, really do appreciate it. If you are one of our listeners who enjoys the advice that we give, that is super helpful to help.
Lindsay Franklin: us reach other people who might be helped by what we have to share.
Paul Regnier: For sure.
Lindsay Franklin: so
Paul Regnier: yeah yeah yeah
Lindsay Franklin: yeah
Paul Regnier: um So cool. So with what we're doing with our writer time machine. Um,
Lindsay Franklin: isn
Paul Regnier: Lindsay, I'm going to let you start this off. if If you could look back and travel back to your younger writer self. What would be something you'd tell yourself? now that you've learned this wealth of information.
Paul Regnier: You're so much wiser now.
Lindsay Franklin: ah hu
Paul Regnier: about this whole publication career.
Lindsay Franklin: Well, I think I'm... cheating just a little bit, because I'm actually my my go to advice for this question is actually a piece of advice I did get early in my career. So it's it's a little bit of a cheat because it is something that I had the benefit of hearing when I was very, very new in my journey. um And so just to be clear, because we've done an episode before about advice to young writers, meaning like...
Lindsay Franklin: teen writers and there was there was probably a lot of advice in there for anybody who's starting out as well but that was specifically talking to chronologically you know young writers um and this episode's a little different where it doesn't It doesn't matter how old you are when you start.
Paul Regnier: Right.
Paul Regnier: Amen.
Lindsay Franklin: We're talking about when you're early in your journey or young in your journey. And for me, I was 27 or 28, I think, when I started in the business. So ah now I feel like that sounds young.
Lindsay Franklin: But at the time, I was a mom of three already. And so and I was like homeschooling full time and everything. So it didn't feel young to me then. But I felt very adulty. But it does sound young to me now, now that I'm middle -aged. But very early in my journey, my mom happened to be on a cruise.
Lindsay Franklin: And on this cruise, there was an author. And i I get the impression he was there doing some kind of event, like it might have been a signing or something like that. And I don't know who this was. I really wish I did. But she didn't tell me his name at the time. And she certainly like I don't think would remember now. But um this was a prolific like author. He had written a lot of books. He had been in the business a really long time. And so she decided she was all excited that I was getting, you know, getting into this industry. And so she went up to him and said, my daughter is.
Lindsay Franklin: trying to become a published author. She's like just starting on her journey. And what is your advice to her?
Paul Regnier: And he said, don't do it.
Lindsay Franklin: He said, run away. No, that is not what he said.
Paul Regnier: ah no
Lindsay Franklin: He said, um tell your daughter that the biggest difference between the authors who make it. in quotes and those who don't. is perseverance.
Lindsay Franklin: So in his experience and his observation and all of his decades in the industry, it was not about talent. It wasn't about luck. It wasn't about anything except.
Lindsay Franklin: of persevering and sticking with it um because this business is really hard. And there's some statistic out there. I can never remember what it is off the top of my head, but it's like 80 % of Americans say they have a book in them that they would like like to write a book someday. It's this huge number, like a big majority of people say that, feel like they have a book in them and they would they would love to write that book someday. But very, very few of those people are actually going to A, write the book.
Lindsay Franklin: um Even just just get it written and then B, go on to publish it and keep going until they do that. And an even smaller percentage. is gonna like do it again and again and again and to him that was like That was the difference, just people who decided to stick with it through all of the hardship, the rejection, and the difficulty that comes in this business. um So that's always my first go -to when people ask this question, because I really took that to heart.
Lindsay Franklin: I was like, OK, it's going to be hard. And if I really want this, if this is my dream and I'm i'm passionate about it and feel like there's something I'm supposed to do, then I just have to keep going and and stick with it. And now, 16, 17 years later.
Lindsay Franklin: It's like, yeah, he was right. He was right.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: And it was a great piece of advice. So that is the first thing I want to continue passing that advice down to um others who are new in their their journey, because that was really meaningful for me.
Lindsay Franklin: And I'm glad I received that that ah little nugget of wisdom early on.
Paul Regnier: Yeah, well, for sure. And especially because sometimes it takes a while to get that sort of reciprocal. you know, ah confirmation that you're on the right track. I think I told you before, like if let's say you did a trade, you went through a trade school and you learned to be an electrician or a plumber.
Paul Regnier: It's like you're done with school, you get a job and boom, it's like this direct. correlation between, oh, I've trained. Now I'm putting the hours in. Now I'm making good money.
Lindsay Franklin: Mm hmm.
Paul Regnier: you know it's like oh okay yeah that makes sense but with writing it's like Hey, like I studied and I'm writing books and where's the money? You know, it's like, you don't get that, you know.
Paul Regnier: And especially like your early stuff, you may even get like no money and like negative reviews or or kind of mediocre kind of feedback. And then everyone asks, why are you still doing this? So that perseverance like. part is huge you know or else like it's too easy to give up it's It's just, you know, especially if you're looking at it like a normal.
Lindsay Franklin: Yep.
Paul Regnier: like career path because it's not. you know, most most authors have a day job or at least a part -time job or something just to kind of keep things going. Um,
Lindsay Franklin: Absolutely.
Paul Regnier: But yeah, that's that's actually... That's probably the best advice of the podcast right there. And you put it right up front.
Lindsay Franklin: ah Oh, man. Now you guys are all going to leave? Oh, no.
Paul Regnier: It's all downhill from here.
Lindsay Franklin: We have other things to share.
Paul Regnier: No, no, no.
Lindsay Franklin: ah
Paul Regnier: And and ill ah I'll tease that I have...
Lindsay Franklin: yeah
Paul Regnier: I have a warning that I would give myself, right? this No, actually, it's not a warning.
Lindsay Franklin: Ooh.
Paul Regnier: this I have advice that I wouldn't give myself. This is something I'd keep secret. Um, But I'll save that. for the end OK, so for me, like one of the things that I would go back and I would tell myself is.
Paul Regnier: Um, Like when when I remember when I was first starting to seriously think about it, which was kind of like in college. Cause I'd always like. you know, enjoyed it as a kid, like just having fun with it like any other hobby.
Paul Regnier: ah short stories and fun things like that. But then it wasn't until college where I thought like, oh man, it'd be cool to actually do this. And at the time. I was doing like a TV film major in college. So I thought, oh, maybe I could write screenplays. So that's kind of.
Paul Regnier: That was my initial. thought of like maybe i could make this work But. During those times, I really almost treated it like. okay, maybe I'll dip my toe in. And if I get a good response, then maybe I'll continue, you know, like I wanted it to prove itself to me rather than me just kind of like grinding away until.
Paul Regnier: you know something happened um so i kind of went into it with a little bit more of a not lazy, but just ah too casual of a mindset, I think. where it's almost like, okay, prove to me that you're you know worth. Because I remember I even tried, like there was certain writing jobs. I'm like, okay, well, what writing jobs are out there? What can I pursue? And I remember.
Paul Regnier: One was like doing coverage for screenplays where you're kind of like that first round. person for all the slush pile and you kind of go through and read and put your notes and then you send it up to the next level of person that makes decisions um and even that it's like it paid very little and then it just it was kind of competitive and then it was like oh do i have to move to hollywood to do this i don't want to do that
Lindsay Franklin: m
Paul Regnier: So it was all these things where I'm like, I don't see a lot of pathways. to make this work. So I almost like. killed it before I really pursued it, just because I i didn't see a clear path.
Paul Regnier: because a lot of careers have very clear direct paths and writing especially back then this was before like indie publishing was
Lindsay Franklin: he
Paul Regnier: a lot more you know easy to do it was just it just seemed like a maze to try to even make it work so Um, So I definitely pursued it in a very kind of late, again, not lazy, but just.
Paul Regnier: a casual way for a long time.
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah.
Paul Regnier: So i would I would love to go back and say like, no, just write like. do the best stories you can and craft them and even save them on a shelf if you have to, because later on you'll be able to publish them or.
Paul Regnier: or fix them up as you get better and then publish. and So that. For me, that's like... you know And that's when I see young writers like teenagers or early twenties and they're just like, oh yeah, I already published my first book and I'm writing my second. I'm like, man.
Paul Regnier: you're killing it. Like you're doing so like, keep going. Like I'm so inspired by them.
Lindsay Franklin: Mm hmm.
Paul Regnier: because then I think, I wish I would have done that.
Lindsay Franklin: Hmm.
Paul Regnier: Like I was way too casual about it. i just thought like oh it'll all work out and i didn't realize no you gotta like really pursue it. You got to go after it. um So there you go. There's my first bit of advice.
Lindsay Franklin: That's awesome. I love that. And I think that. Probably a lot of our advice is going to be. Kind of nuts. like a little bit specific to our personality types, right?
Paul Regnier: Hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: Where, you know, for for some, I think they probably lock in a little too hard, right?
Paul Regnier: Hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: Like are a little too, you know. um too dialed in maybe to try to like make it be a formula where if I do this, then I'm going to have this type of success.
Lindsay Franklin: Whereas if you're a different personality type, then you you need the advice, lock in and, you know, like, like focus and and get so um that's.
Paul Regnier: Yeah, true. All right.
Lindsay Franklin: That's something important, I think, for our listeners to consider as well, that if you um that if you have kind of Paul's type of temperament, that is an excellent piece of advice.
Lindsay Franklin: And if you are the type who is naturally just going to like dial in and go so hard on everything you do, then maybe you need the advice to like take a step back and breathe a little bit and have fun and like it's okay.
Lindsay Franklin: so But I love that that piece of advice for those out there who are approaching like they're serious about it in that they would love to do it, but are approaching it.
Lindsay Franklin: maybe a little too casually or um not giving it quite the amount of attention that it deserves or space in their life that that it deserves. If it's something that they're like passionate about and gifted with and everything like.
Lindsay Franklin: yeah, go hard on it.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: You know, I love that.
Paul Regnier: Which is weird because that's what I do now.
Lindsay Franklin: I love it.
Paul Regnier: Like now I'm like.
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah.
Paul Regnier: i go after it you know i'm just like writing and writing and like i don't even care oh that book didn't totally break through.
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah, 100%.
Paul Regnier: It doesn't matter. I'm on the next one. I'm halfway through already.
Lindsay Franklin: Next one.
Paul Regnier: You know what I mean?
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah.
Paul Regnier: It's just like... Nothing will stop me. So now, I mean, I do have that mindset. I just, I think at the beginning, I just, I didn't know, like, how does this work?
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah.
Paul Regnier: Like, does this even work? Is there even a pathway here?
Lindsay Franklin: anything
Paul Regnier: I just couldn't see it. Like, and I didn't have anyone.
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah.
Paul Regnier: around to tell me like oh yeah like yeah you could do it like here's what i did you know i didn't know any writers so yeah it was just weird it was it was just like too mysterious for me.
Lindsay Franklin: Ow.
Lindsay Franklin: And I think that like... indie being an indie author I think is something that you are so well suited to like you are are just born for that. I feel like it's like everything that you just need, I think to kind of, you know, do that and and take that.
Paul Regnier: I think so, yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: path, I feel like you have those things. And so that could have been why in the beginning, just the timing of when that happened, just the era that we were in, it was different.
Paul Regnier: Oh, yeah. Right.
Lindsay Franklin: When you and I started in this business, indie publishing is not the same as what it is now.
Paul Regnier: Bright.
Lindsay Franklin: And so that could be why it felt sort of nebulous to you then. Like, how do I even do this?
Paul Regnier: Right.
Lindsay Franklin: What is the way forward? Because your path, your indie path was still like being forged. I mean, it was like in early, early days back then.
Paul Regnier: Yeah. And when I found out about all the gatekeepers and the traditional publishing path.
Lindsay Franklin: so but
Paul Regnier: I was like who are these people? Why did they get to decide, you know?
Lindsay Franklin: How dare they?
Paul Regnier: How dare they That's the Indy. Publish mindset like get out of my way.
Lindsay Franklin: That's right.
Paul Regnier: I'll do it myself
Lindsay Franklin: Right?
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: That's your indie heart. I love it.
Paul Regnier: Mm hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: Oh, that's so great. And i I always say it is such a, there are things that are very, very hard about being an author in the business in this era. There's always challenges, but I think it's a wonderful time, historically speaking, to be a writer, to be an author.
Paul Regnier: Mm hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: There is so much more open to us than there was 30 years ago.
Paul Regnier: Yep.
Paul Regnier: For sure.
Lindsay Franklin: and So yeah, we're we're blessed to live in the time that we do and to have the options that we have is super cool.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: I love it.
Paul Regnier: ah Agreed agreed.
Lindsay Franklin: um Yes.
Paul Regnier: All right, Lindsay, second piece of advice. What would you say?
Lindsay Franklin: Alright. but
Paul Regnier: Fire the time machine up.
Lindsay Franklin: I don't know Ooh.
Paul Regnier: Go back.
Lindsay Franklin: this is That's the moment where I will put the DeLorean, you know, like driving across the screen.
Paul Regnier: That's right. 88 miles per hour.
Lindsay Franklin: but but Oh my goodness. So this is definitely a piece of advice that I think might be. tailored to people who are built like me, but we'll see. We'll see um how this lands. But um I would definitely...
Lindsay Franklin: give myself a little bit of a warning that this industry this business, this pursuit, all of the things that it is. um is going to demand a lot. emotionally. and spiritually and sort of it demands a lot of you as a person in a way that Not all jobs. In fact, most jobs.
Lindsay Franklin: do. I don't. I think that a lot of jobs demand our time, our energy, our heart, you know that sort of thing. but The creative.
Lindsay Franklin: fields are a little bit different with this pursuing the arts it's a little bit different where it's like pouring yourself onto the page and you know now that social media is a thing as well we also have to show up online for our readers or we should show up online for our readers and connect with them there and everything and there is a lot of pouring out of yourself as a person that no other job that I've had has quite that same demand even even my job as managing editor at Enclave, which I love, and it demands a ton of my time, a ton of my attention and a ton of my brain. It does not demand my heart and soul the same way that my author career does. And I was not.
Lindsay Franklin: prepared for that. When I first got into the business, I you know approached it like I would any kind of work or, you know, I was like ready to work really hard.
Paul Regnier: Hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: And I took that, you know, perseverance advice very seriously. And I was like, okay, i' locked in, let's go. I'm going to work super, super hard, but I was not ready for the emotional demands. So.
Paul Regnier: Hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: That's something I think I would warn my my younger self about, like that it's going to demand a lot.
Paul Regnier: Ooh, a warning. The first warning advice.
Lindsay Franklin: but The first warning advice, and it wouldn't change things for me if I had known exactly what it was going to be like going in. I would absolutely still do it. um
Paul Regnier: our time Our time travel movie is getting darker as it goes that on.
Lindsay Franklin: We've taken a dark turn.
Paul Regnier: ah
Lindsay Franklin: But um yeah, it just was something that I wasn't quite ready for. And I've had to adjust on the fly. And and that's been it's been fine. It's been a lot of opportunity for growth.
Lindsay Franklin: um And I would have had to have that same growth, even if I knew that it was coming. But I just think I would have been a little bit better prepared. if I had known.
Paul Regnier: Hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: So. That's my second one.
Paul Regnier: Hmm. yeah how do you even prepare for that you know it's like Gosh. It's almost like... the process itself prepares you in a way, you know, I do remember like, just to speak to that, I do remember.
Lindsay Franklin: Yep.
Paul Regnier: Um, getting to the point where just normal life stuff, I had kind of grown more of a thick skin. But then when I launched my first book and so and like started to see.
Lindsay Franklin: mm -hmm
Paul Regnier: Like I think when the first negative review came in, like it hit me like a lot harder than I thought. than I was prepared for.
Lindsay Franklin: Mm hmm.
Paul Regnier: I'm like, whoa, wait a second. like I... normally insults or whatever. It's like, I just, they roll off my back.
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah.
Paul Regnier: And then I realized is because like the writing. was so... like personal to me.
Lindsay Franklin: Mm hmm.
Paul Regnier: You know, and and you know, when you're writing, you're kind of like you're being a little more vulnerable. Right. And you're putting your art out there for critique.
Lindsay Franklin: Yep.
Paul Regnier: So it's like it hits harder than if you were to just. you know, let's say you did a project at work and it's just like, okay, it's just a project I turned it in and oh, whatever, you know, it's not connected to you. in a personal way, you know.
Paul Regnier: at least most work projects.
Lindsay Franklin: Exactly.
Paul Regnier: Like, oh, here's the budget. You know, you're not going to get like, how could they not like my budget? You know.
Lindsay Franklin: Right.
Paul Regnier: So.
Lindsay Franklin: It doesn't feel like an attack on your identity or, you know, if somebody doesn't like my, you know, marketing plan or my, you know, whatever that I'm drawing up.
Paul Regnier: Yeah. Right. Yeah.
Paul Regnier: Right.
Lindsay Franklin: It's just it's not the same. And it's not to say that we don't work hard in other fields. My my husband works in tech and he works insanely hard. He was on a call till almost midnight last night, you know, because his business is 24 -7 global.
Paul Regnier: Right.
Lindsay Franklin: You know, when they have incidents and problems, he's like. there having to work and, you know, he'll work a 14 hour day, a 16 hour day. So it's not about the amount of work or how hard somebody is working.
Lindsay Franklin: It's the type of work that makes it just a little bit different.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: So, yeah.
Paul Regnier: Yeah, yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: That's fine, yeah.
Paul Regnier: For sure.
Lindsay Franklin: but
Paul Regnier: Um, okay so my second what's a what's the second piece of advice um so another thing i would tell myself is to... um Be a little more confident with my own style and don't try to be anybody else
Lindsay Franklin: Hmm.
Paul Regnier: um That was a big thing. it It took me a little bit to overcome because, you know, normally when you get into writing, you do it because you love reading. And you have all these like.
Paul Regnier: favorite authors, right? And then you when you start, you know, you're kind of emulating them a little bit. You know, it's like you're not fully yourself yet. You're kind of not a copycat necessarily, but, you know, it's a little too close, I think.
Lindsay Franklin: mm -hmm
Paul Regnier: and initially. um and then you And then I think we almost do that because... It's, um... Like it's a security thing, maybe like, like, oh, I know they're good.
Lindsay Franklin: mm -hmm
Paul Regnier: So if I kind of write like them, it's like. this nice security blanket like then i'll be good you know kind of thing And your stuff is untested, so you don't. No. But um if I could.
Paul Regnier: Like go back and tell myself like. you know, be confident in, in your own style. like people will like not everyone's gonna like it of course not everyone likes any you know, author, no matter how big they are, there's always going to be detractors.
Paul Regnier: But. um Yeah, just to be more confident and to lean into it more. Um, not to be like afraid to just like. Go full tilt into your style.
Paul Regnier: and um And, and, and. practice more so that your style gets more and more locked in.
Lindsay Franklin: Mm hmm.
Paul Regnier: um And that took me a while. It took me. Probably. like so many short stories and even like maybe a book. to get to that point where it's like, oh no, I want to write like me.
Paul Regnier: Because sometimes those mentors you have.
Lindsay Franklin: Mm -hmm.
Paul Regnier: aren't even the style you're going to end up writing. Like I think I told you before, I really like Michael Crichton.
Lindsay Franklin: Yep.
Paul Regnier: I'm never going to write like Michael Crichton. I'm just, I'm a completely different. type of author. I could still like totally enjoy reading his stuff, but if I tried to write like him, it wouldn't work.
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah.
Paul Regnier: Um, So that's another thing, just like find. who you are as a writer. And. like lean into it and be confident in it. um And don't let anyone try to like, oh, you need to.
Paul Regnier: write more flowery descriptions like so and so it's like No, I don't do that, you know.
Lindsay Franklin: Nope.
Paul Regnier: just
Lindsay Franklin: Be you.
Paul Regnier: Be you. Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: Be you.
Paul Regnier: Be yourself.
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah. That's right.
Paul Regnier: So there you go.
Lindsay Franklin: ah I love that. And that's actually. I think we've talked about that before, like how important that is in like bringing that into your. work, bringing that into your fiction, that you -ness, because that's what sets each of us apart and makes us unique.
Paul Regnier: Mm hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: And the people who are our readers out there, that's what they're looking for. And it's not going to be everybody, like you said. We are not going to connect with everybody, just like when you go out into the world, not everybody is your immediate bestie or gets you or you have that.
Lindsay Franklin: You don't click with everybody. It's the same with our fiction. But it's... the people who you are for. you're really going to be for them if you can lean into what makes you unique and what is is really true to you.
Lindsay Franklin: And um I think that's... incredibly common. early in our careers, exactly what you said, where we're emulating kind of our um our favorites and the the people we love to read.
Paul Regnier: mean
Lindsay Franklin: I think that you're right. It's a security blanket thing. I think it's also how we learn, where we're we're just kind of learning how to get words onto the page and we're learning how to tell a story and probably at the same time learning about other craft elements and how to plot and how to build characters and all of that.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: And so it's it's normal. to do that. But at some point, you have to And I think this is something that holds a lot of people back where they can't seem to break through to that next level.
Lindsay Franklin: And they've maybe been doing, they're they're like stuck in that loop where they're continuing to kind of um mimic their exemplars a little bit rather than breaking into their own their own thing and finding their own you unique identity.
Paul Regnier: Mm -hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: They can get really stuck in that loop and and not ever break out to the next level. And so it's really important. to... Own it.
Lindsay Franklin: Own your voice.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: Own if you're if you're weird. Own it. Lean into it. It's OK if you're funny. Own that, lean into it. If you are a beautiful lyrical prose writer, amazing, lean into it and just be you, you know?
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: um So I love that. Love that advice.
Paul Regnier: Yeah, I remember I had like... um an editor look at an early project of mine, and one of the comments he made, I just, I'll never forget, he said like,
Paul Regnier: I'm seeing, how did he phrase it? i I'm seeing... A fun. voice. just peeking through.
Lindsay Franklin: ah Oh.
Paul Regnier: Yeah, and I think that was where I first started to find, you know, what they call your voice, my voice.
Lindsay Franklin: Yay.
Lindsay Franklin: Mm.
Paul Regnier: And it was almost, I was just like doing it tentatively, you know, like just little bits, and but he he he saw it.
Lindsay Franklin: Love that.
Paul Regnier: Like he he, oh yeah, it's right there.
Lindsay Franklin: Mm.
Paul Regnier: Yeah, I think he said it was bubbling under the surface or something like that.
Lindsay Franklin: Oh.
Paul Regnier: I'm like, okay. Oh, so that's a good thing. And I think I was kind of holding back a little bit because I'm like, oh, I don't want to be too like whatever, like too silly or too whatever I was doing.
Lindsay Franklin: yeah
Paul Regnier: um And then I'm like, okay, cool. So he likes it. And that's a good thing. Because again, like I told you, I just sort of launched into this and I hadn't read. a whole lot of writing craft books initially you know since i've read a bunch but like I didn't know all about voice and all these kind of things. so Yeah. But.
Paul Regnier: Yeah. There you go.
Lindsay Franklin: I love that That's such an awesome. like. pivotal moment. I wonder if he realized as he was like giving you that comment, what, what a major moment that was going to become like, that's a turning point in your career.
Paul Regnier: Probably not.
Paul Regnier: ah Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: That's, that's amazing.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: I love that.
Paul Regnier: Yep.
Lindsay Franklin: um That's so cool. And for me, that moment was stepping outside of my genre. um Oh, my goodness.
Paul Regnier: Hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: Recently. Just like this past week, I opened up. I have not done this in probably over. 10 years at least, I opened up. My first.
Lindsay Franklin: like series that I wrote that the first book of that series actually did get me agented but it's like it's some of my very early early work and I opened it up and started reading it and I was like oh no this is uh oh no like it's
Paul Regnier: Oh really? yeah
Lindsay Franklin: Yikes. um And especially. My my agent, my... future and now current agent for the last 16 years. um She got book one that had been, you know, revised, polished and and everything.
Lindsay Franklin: But what I was reading this week was like. books two and three and four that I had written in that series. So those did not get the benefit of all of the craft stuff that I was learning after I got into the business.
Paul Regnier: Hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: These are like pretty raw green drafts. And I was reading that and it's something that stuck out to me aside from just it being kind of cheesy and just not up to, you know, it's not publishable.
Lindsay Franklin: We'll just put it that way. um But something that really stuck out to me was how stilted and weird, my voice sounded, it didn't sound like me.
Paul Regnier: Mm -hmm.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: And you'd see those moments where I would write a joke in there that I would totally write now, you know, and it was like, that was the little like voice peeking out.
Paul Regnier: Right.
Lindsay Franklin: And it's
Paul Regnier: there it is yeah
Lindsay Franklin: Right? It's just boop. peeking out and it's not that my whole, my books are just. full of jokes and just constant, you know, whimsy and fun or whatever.
Paul Regnier: Right.
Lindsay Franklin: No, it's, it's not that, but it's like, those were those little moments of, you know, where it was bubbling up a little bit, but I wasn't, I wasn't quite leaning into that fully. And for me, I had to step out of fantasy land and go write a contemporary piece because if I'm writing contemporary.
Lindsay Franklin: for some reason that helped me break out of this idea that I needed to sound very something like I needed to sound like a fed.
Paul Regnier: Right. Very. formal and fantasy.
Lindsay Franklin: Fantasy. ah Yes.
Paul Regnier: You are in the court of the king. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: Yes. And probably because what I was reading was a lot of like mid -century fantasy authors.
Paul Regnier: Right.
Lindsay Franklin: And so um that. That was like, I was very stuck in my mind with that and had this very old sort of style that wasn't, it didn't sit comfortably on me and it wasn't, it didn't sound modern and everything.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: So writing a modern YA contemporary piece where it just, my natural voice. just could flow through.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: That's what broke through that for me. So very cool.
Paul Regnier: That's interesting. When I go back and I read my early stuff, I have the same thing where it feels very rigid. It feels very like it's all closed up and crunched up.
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah.
Paul Regnier: I'm like, I'm afraid to break through.
Lindsay Franklin: but
Paul Regnier: You know what I mean? It's just stilted. That was a good word that you used.
Lindsay Franklin: but
Paul Regnier: it's just But isn't that weird? So if you're ever starting to feel like that's what you're writing, it's got to. Let loose. Like I would even say like write some. fun short stories and you know
Lindsay Franklin: mm -hmm
Paul Regnier: fun. I don't know. I'm a My type of writing is fun, but maybe you're not a fun, maybe you're a more serious writer, but. maybe write a short story that really leans into like.
Paul Regnier: what your interests are. you know, and what you really want to write. and just to experiment with like letting loose like almost say like okay no one's ever gonna read this and i'm just gonna like let myself go Like that's the best place to kind of like experiment and be like, okay, this feels good.
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah.
Paul Regnier: I'm loose, you know? Um,
Lindsay Franklin: Yes.
Paul Regnier: That's a good place to be as a writer, I think.
Lindsay Franklin: I agree.
Paul Regnier: Is it your, are you, do you have another? I think it's your turn, right?
Lindsay Franklin: Yes. I think so. Okay. So. Oh. See, I wrote down, I had three that I had written down and then I wrote a fourth while we were talking.
Lindsay Franklin: And now I'm like, which one should I say?
Paul Regnier: That's okay. I have a fourth one too.
Lindsay Franklin: Oh, good.
Paul Regnier: I have two more.
Lindsay Franklin: We'll see if we have time.
Paul Regnier: I have one good advice and one that I would never tell myself.
Lindsay Franklin: ah come
Paul Regnier: A secret.
Lindsay Franklin: Okay. So I think that I'm going, okay, so. Always stay hungry is what I wrote down on my list here. And what I mean... by that is.
Lindsay Franklin: never feeling like. I have to be careful the way I phrase this. Never feeling like you have arrived. craft -wise.
Paul Regnier: Hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: Okay. And that you have to be careful with that because we don't want to be. caught in a loop of never feeling good enough. That's not what I mean. I don't mean never feeling good enough or never feeling like it's acceptable or or anything like that, but just um never quite feeling like you don't have something else to learn.
Lindsay Franklin: Um, And. I feel like there was a moment in my career where I kind of... not intentionally, but I sort of fell into that place where I thought, okay, well, now I know the things, you know, now I know the things.
Lindsay Franklin: And so I'm going to go do the things and, you know, oh, like at a writer's conference. Yeah. Okay. I love being here to connect with people and to, you know, do the thing and whatever, but like, oh, do I really need to go sit in that workshop or whatever?
Lindsay Franklin: And there was a piece of me that was like, oh no, I already know all of that.
Paul Regnier: Hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: Like, no, don't don't let yourself fall into that. place because there is. always something. Now, whenever I have the opportunity, I will go sit in whatever beginning writing workshop, like anything that I have access to, I will sit there and listen to that if I can, because I... Always.
Lindsay Franklin: take away something that is so valuable and so useful. And the bottom line for me is that ah none of my books is ever even close to approaching perfect and none of them ever will, but there are always going to be weaknesses and things that I can do better. And that's something that...
Lindsay Franklin: appeals to me, um maybe a little bit as an overachiever, but just it appeals to me as a creative to always be ah sharpening my skills and thinking, okay, what can I do better next time? How can I make book six better than book five was? Like, that's where I'm at right now. What are my what are my craft weaknesses that readers have identified over my last five novels? And how can I tighten those things up and make the next book?
Lindsay Franklin: even better for them. And so that's kind of like, I think that that type of fire is something I've see, I lost it for a while. And I see a lot of my colleagues in the business lose that as well. And that can make you really stagnate at a point if you feel like you've learned all there is to learn. And you just are the novelist you are, and that's it. And you're just going to keep, you know, repeating that process. I think you can do that. But I think there's an opportunity to just continue.
Lindsay Franklin: growing and getting better and better and better as we go. So I would say don't lose that fire and that hunger.
Paul Regnier: Yeah. Always be learning. Yeah, yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: Yes.
Paul Regnier: A little bit of humility. Yeah, agreed, which is good for any art.
Lindsay Franklin: Yep.
Paul Regnier: Yeah, that's true. Good. That's a good one. Okay, um my last one. Before my. want secret One.
Lindsay Franklin: The dire warning.
Paul Regnier: You grow on. The dire warning. um My last one is... And I don't know this. Cause you said like, sometimes it comes down to like. personality. So maybe this is a little bit of my personality, um something that...
Paul Regnier: I don't want to say bugs me, but... um There are... a lot of teachers out there. that teach classes or that have online you know, lessons that you can buy or whatever. um And sometimes it comes down to...
Paul Regnier: There's a personality type out there. that when they talk, they talk with a great amount of authority.
Lindsay Franklin: Mm hmm.
Paul Regnier: Right?
Lindsay Franklin: Yes.
Paul Regnier: so when they talk it sounds like oh my gosh they know what they're talking about they're experts and I'm using like quote mark. um They are experts, so I better listen to everything they say.
Paul Regnier: And... It's not always true. And, and then, so it took me a while, like in my twenties, I would get real in teens, probably I would get almost.
Lindsay Franklin: Mm hmm.
Paul Regnier: um I would get very persuaded by people that were extremely confident and talked boldly with the i like, oh, wow, they talk. like they're an authority on the subject.
Paul Regnier: And then sometimes you'd get to know this person or you'd hear them a little bit more and you'd be like. they don't know what they're talking about, you know, or they don't, yeah, they don't.
Lindsay Franklin: Yep. but
Paul Regnier: It's, and it's funny when, when you start to see the holes, you know. um then you're like, oh, okay, wow, I was really, why did I believe it? So. This applies to writing too. Sometimes you will come across people that are saying, Do this.
Paul Regnier: Don't do this. this is the way it is so when they're talking in this in these grand sweeping authoritative you know bits of advice, I would always say. like put on your caution you know antenna.
Paul Regnier: And like, just. you know. Be careful with what you receive and go on. And I will give you a specific example because this is probably seen. a little hazy and theoretical so I read this craft book and this craft book is. probably about 15 years old.
Paul Regnier: And. the lady that was doing it was like a literary agent she'd been a literary agent i think she said for decades with and she listed these top tier big five publishing houses whatever and And it got to this part in the book where it's like, okay, here's a couple real quick.
Paul Regnier: you know things do's and don'ts in writing. So if you're... about to do a next project, here's do's and don'ts. And one of her don'ts. This was amazing. One of her don'ts says,
Paul Regnier: Don't. ever write a book. where the main character gets stuck in a video game and has to play a video game. And she's like, these are never going to sell. These are just, so I've seen so many of these and I immediately. you know, trash them.
Paul Regnier: And this was like 15 years ago. was when the lit rpg space and game lit space was exploding and it's still exploding
Lindsay Franklin: ah
Paul Regnier: And so I remember reading this because I read this just a couple of years ago. So she wrote it at the beginning and I'm reading it now that I i know this is a hot genre. And I'm like, oh. Why would she put this in there?
Paul Regnier: This like just destroys all her credibility. like Why would I listen to anything else?
Lindsay Franklin: ha
Paul Regnier: And now then I was questioning and everything else she said, right?
Lindsay Franklin: h
Paul Regnier: All that to say, like... just be a little cautious of Because it's like when you're a beginning writer, you're just you're like a sponge. You're like, tell me more. I'm going to absorb everything. you know and And you'll hear all different kinds of advice.
Lindsay Franklin: Mm hmm.
Paul Regnier: So just like... so try to sift through it and don't take anything as gospel truth. And I really love people that are. when you talk to them.
Paul Regnier: um number one you see oh they have a proven track record they've written a number of books,
Lindsay Franklin: Mm -hmm.
Paul Regnier: And, you know, they've they've done they've got, you know, good lots of reviews or, you know, they've sold pretty good or. you know i read i read their book and they're a great writer
Lindsay Franklin: mm -hmm
Paul Regnier: And then you get their advice and then they're like, well. they're like yeah i do this and that and you know but this isn't you know, 100 % all the time, but this is normally what I would advise, you know, that kind of answer.
Paul Regnier: That's what I like, because then I realize, kind of like you said, they're still humble.
Lindsay Franklin: Mm hmm.
Paul Regnier: They're not acting like they figured it all out. And um there's humility. in in their approach to their art. Which to me is this is a sign of someone, oh, they're an artist that's continuing to always improve and stay humble and and teachable.
Lindsay Franklin: Yep.
Paul Regnier: And I'm babbling, but does that make sense?
Lindsay Franklin: It absolutely does.
Paul Regnier: I'm like going on and on.
Lindsay Franklin: No, I love that.
Paul Regnier: Okay.
Lindsay Franklin: That's great. And I love that we did not plan this, but I just said. learn, keep learning. And then Paul says, don't take everything that you learn as gospel.
Paul Regnier: Yeah, right
Lindsay Franklin: like Those are really great companion pieces of advice because that they're both so true.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: And I agree with you 100%. You can tell when a teacher really gets it. I feel, um because they acknowledge that in.
Lindsay Franklin: storytelling and novel writing there. It's not black and white. There there aren't, there's no formula.
Paul Regnier: Right.
Lindsay Franklin: that works 100 % of the time. And it's shocking to me that an agent would put in writing so something or or an editor, any industry professional, speaking as an industry professional on the publisher side of things.
Paul Regnier: ver
Paul Regnier: I know.
Lindsay Franklin: That is wild to me because We never know. We never know what's going to hit or what genre is going to become big if they knew.
Paul Regnier: Right.
Lindsay Franklin: If people in the industry knew, we would never have flops. We would always be we wouldn't even have a mid list. Everything would be the like top best selling whatever. like it just So that's wild to me, especially a whole genre.
Lindsay Franklin: genre um to just say that this is never going to take off.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: You never know what's going to take off. So that's that's crazy to me. And I don't blame you one bit for questioning her credibility after that, because like it sounds like she's had a good career and like that's great, good for her.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: But that doesn't mean she's somebody you want to take advice from, because what she's saying may or may not be like really sound ah takeaways for everybody if she's giving that kind of like blanket.
Lindsay Franklin: advice about a whole sub -genre.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: So I think that's very wise, very wise advice um to to be careful and to test test everything that you are are hearing and make sure that you're learning from really um good, trusted sources and that, you know, what what you're receiving in and really taking deep.
Lindsay Franklin: ah deeply to heart is is solid and not just somebody who speaks with confidence because there's a lot of like
Paul Regnier: Right.
Lindsay Franklin: There's a lot of snake oil salesmen out there, especially like these days on on the internet.
Paul Regnier: Mm hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: You can just, anybody can set up a course and sell their course. Anybody can write a craft book and and sell that.
Paul Regnier: Yep.
Lindsay Franklin: If there's money involved with the the instruction that you're getting, if there's an exchange of money there, and this is not me saying teachers should not be paid. Absolutely, they should be paid. But there's always going to be that danger of somebody who is just...
Lindsay Franklin: capitalizing um on, you know, people who are hungry to learn. And, you know, some, I have seen some teachers giving really bad advice where the teachers are not necessarily predatory. They don't even realize they're giving. not the best advice. They just don't know.
Lindsay Franklin: what they don't know yet. they think they have it all figured out.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: And so they think they're sharing good advice, but. They're not. I'm like, spend another 10 years in the business and then go talk about that thing you're talking about because it's like the perspective is too narrow.
Lindsay Franklin: So they think they're giving good advice. But yeah, that's an excellent one.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: I... I like that one. Oh.
Paul Regnier: All right. Our final, our final advice. Final trip in the time machine.
Lindsay Franklin: All right
Paul Regnier: What do you got, Lindsay?
Lindsay Franklin: Final trip. Okay. So. I think that it is important. As you go in your career. to Be open to redefining what success means to you.
Paul Regnier: Hmm. That's good.
Lindsay Franklin: I think a lot of us start out with this idea that we're going to get this type of publishing contract at this type of house, or we're going to be an indie author and sell this many copies, or we're going, you know, we have these very like.
Lindsay Franklin: defined ideas of what success is. And I think that if this is something you are gifted with and passionate about. that it is important to be flexible with what success means.
Lindsay Franklin: all all along the course of your career. And that's not settling. That's not settling for less. That is, I feel. kind of treating this more as the gift and the heart work that it is rather than something that is formulaic. Like if I just do XYZ, I'm going to get this result and I'm going to be able to be a New York Times bestseller or whatever it is um that is that big, you know, mark of achievement or whatever. um I think that.
Lindsay Franklin: I needed to. I never had huge sales aspirations. That was not what it was for me. um It was, I think, more about... I don't know quite how to phrase this, but like.
Lindsay Franklin: I think that kind of recognition that comes from maybe like awards or five -star reviews or whatever, that's more what I was chasing, kind of that achievement type, you know, like.
Paul Regnier: Hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: like wiring that I have in my brain is chasing that. It's like the A plus in the class, you know, that's what I'm.
Paul Regnier: I was just going to say the A -plus on your paper.
Lindsay Franklin: Yes, it's like that Hermione complex, you know, just like going for that. That was kind of more like, okay, that's going to be success for me. And um I just, i I realized after I started hitting some of those.
Lindsay Franklin: things that I thought were success for me, as well as getting the the other side of that which is like the one star reviews and everything um I realized that.
Lindsay Franklin: I was chasing the wrong thing. all along. And I needed to redefine like what what is it actually that refills my soul um when when it comes to my creative work?
Lindsay Franklin: And so it's not about the number of five -star reviews or any kind of like achievement marker like that. It's when I hear from readers that they loved something about my story.
Lindsay Franklin: And it doesn't have to be every reader who picks it up.
Paul Regnier: Yep.
Lindsay Franklin: It doesn't have to be hundreds or thousands or millions of readers. It's just that like one -to -one connection where it's just like. this story mattered to me, even if it was just this story. like really cheered me up and made me laugh.
Lindsay Franklin: Or I just loved getting to be in this like whimsical, ridiculous forest that you wrote in, you know, ah the Ravenly sphere or whatever. Like, even if it's just that the story mattered to somebody.
Paul Regnier: Mm -hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: That's actually what success is for me, no matter how many awards I do or don't win, how many copies I do or don't sell.
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: And so I think um it's totally okay to have goals or targets or things related to some of those other metrics. Totally fine, especially if you're trying to do this full time as your your income, you really do have to like treat it like a business.
Lindsay Franklin: So that's completely okay and not at odds with what I'm saying, just that we we kind of have to be flexible in what success means, I think. so
Paul Regnier: Yeah, no, that's that's great.
Lindsay Franklin: that's That's, yeah, my last one.
Paul Regnier: Yeah. and And it doesn't help that like every TV show or movie about an author, they're like one book and they're a bestseller. You know what I mean?
Lindsay Franklin: Right? Right?
Paul Regnier: I was just where I was watching this TV show and one of the characters. writes like a memoir, essentially. And then he's like, oh, I'm going on a book tour and blab and my publisher.
Paul Regnier: And I'm like, oh, that all happened really fast. you know i've
Lindsay Franklin: Wow.
Paul Regnier: Right, yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: ah Yeah.
Paul Regnier: And then they they do a scene later where they go to support him at the... at his he does a book signing at this book and there's a line out the door and i'm like okay
Lindsay Franklin: Of course.
Paul Regnier: Unless Stephen King's in there.
Lindsay Franklin: Of course.
Paul Regnier: This ain't happening. like Have you been to a book signing from someone who wrote their first book?
Lindsay Franklin: Right.
Lindsay Franklin: Right.
Paul Regnier: you know.
Lindsay Franklin: And especially a memoir, like if it's not a person who's famous, right?
Paul Regnier: Yeah, it's a memoir. And they're not famous.
Lindsay Franklin: Like how?
Paul Regnier: they weren't They weren't even, the character wasn't famous in the show.
Lindsay Franklin: Right. Right.
Paul Regnier: So it's like.
Lindsay Franklin: Right? Like how often does that happen? Very, very rarely, right?
Paul Regnier: Never. Never.
Lindsay Franklin: If ever. Oh my gosh.
Paul Regnier: You go to their book signing and it's like their mom and their best friend.
Lindsay Franklin: Right.
Paul Regnier: yeah so Not a lion out the door. But yeah. So these depictions are not helping set expectations.
Lindsay Franklin: It's not accurate, you guys.
Paul Regnier: which Which leads me into... The advice I would not share. I would hold this back, which is funny because this is the thing that drives me crazy in time travel movies where they go back and they tell someone and they're like, why didn't you tell them?
Paul Regnier: the thing that really could have helped them and then like at the end they're like oh you didn't tell oh you weren't ready to hear it or something like some lame excuse and they're like
Lindsay Franklin: ah
Paul Regnier: well why don't you let them decide because that was probably really important information So. This isn't. like that. But I think what I would what I would not.
Paul Regnier: tell my younger self is how hard it is and how long it takes you. to go and go and go. especially if you're trying to be like a full -time career kind of thing because you know, not that many people do it. So that's the harsh, the harsh reality is like, it's it's difficult to earn a full time.
Paul Regnier: income. doing strictly this without balancing it with another.
Lindsay Franklin: Yep.
Paul Regnier: job. Um, Or like you you have a good thing because you have. a job in the writing field so it's kind of cool it's like you're still It's almost like you're, you're working on your craft as your. you know, as your secondary job, which is which is really good. I think that's probably an ideal place for an author to be.
Paul Regnier: Um, but But yeah, I think I would probably not. tell my younger right because my younger writer himself had all that like energy like okay let's do this this is gonna happen you know maybe it'll take a year or two but Um,
Paul Regnier: i't I wouldn't want to squelch that enthusiasm. you know because that enthusiasm is kind of what takes you to a certain level you know, it gets you to a place and.
Lindsay Franklin: mm -hmm
Paul Regnier: um Otherwise, it's kind of discouraging to tell them, like, it's really hard and you got to work at this for years and years and years. um Because on the other side of this, you're like, I'm so glad I did it.
Paul Regnier: You know, it's it's totally worth it.
Lindsay Franklin: Yes.
Paul Regnier: I love this. This is like my favorite thing career -wise that I do in life.
Lindsay Franklin: Yep.
Paul Regnier: and whether or not I'm selling millions of copies.
Lindsay Franklin: Yep.
Paul Regnier: It doesn't matter. It's kind of like you said, the success is. is the impact. And.
Lindsay Franklin: mm -hmm
Paul Regnier: the feedback and someone got encouraged someone you lifted someone up at a hard day or you know whatever it was it's just um and and just the fact that you get to write and publish your stories that are rolling around in your head and they're not just like sitting there um You know, I've met
Lindsay Franklin: It's a privilege. It's it's a privilege.
Paul Regnier: It is.
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah.
Paul Regnier: It is a privilege. And I've I've met writers and like.
Lindsay Franklin: Yeah.
Paul Regnier: They have the story and and something happens where they never publish it and it just breaks my heart. You know what I mean? like Either life gets too busy or they're just like, oh, yeah, I don't know if I really totally want to do it.
Paul Regnier: um anymore or And especially like if you see talent, if you see like, oh my gosh, they're so good.
Lindsay Franklin: yeah
Paul Regnier: Like, why would they, so if they stop, I should for sure shop stop, you know?
Lindsay Franklin: ah
Paul Regnier: But like, I've seen people like stop and and I've seen their, they were so good. And I'm like. Don't like, why don't. don't like you're so good at this, but you know, again, it it's a little bit of both, right? It has to be.
Paul Regnier: the talent, which doesn't have to be natural. You could develop it, but it also has to be that. that, um, passion about this storytelling pursuit, which I love and you love.
Lindsay Franklin: mm -hmm
Paul Regnier: And it's just like, we love stories and we love. writing our own and putting them out there. and um So yeah, there we go. did i put Did I put a positive spin on that at the end?
Paul Regnier: because That seemed a little negative at first.
Lindsay Franklin: You did ah the positive spin. On the dire warning.
Paul Regnier: Yes. Right.
Lindsay Franklin: You know, and I just thought of if I had known, I'm sitting here thinking, is there anything that I would have been like, oh, never mind if I had known going in. um And honestly, if I had known how big a deal. doing social media.
Lindsay Franklin: It's going to be.
Paul Regnier: Oh yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: for like getting your book out there and being known as an author that might have. turned me away or early on because and and it's like it happened gradually and I'm I'm glad it's kind of like what you're talking about where I know that would have scared me off
Paul Regnier: Yeah.
Lindsay Franklin: 17 years ago. Now I'm glad that I've done it because I actually love getting to connect with people online and getting to like. Talk with readers is really cool on social media.
Paul Regnier: Mm hmm.
Lindsay Franklin: um So I'm not sorry that I'm there. But if I had known that going in that, oh, you have to, this is something you're going to have to do. If you want to be a professional storyteller, I would have probably opted out and been like, it's fine.
Lindsay Franklin: This will just be my hobby that only my family ever reads my stories. And that's okay. I'm good with that because I'm so introverted. And so it's very weird that I am in a job where I'm ever in front of a classroom or on the internet showing my face or filming videos or.
Lindsay Franklin: or anything, you doing a podcast. Like it's just weird because I'm a very introverted and previously extremely shy person. And so that definitely would have.
Lindsay Franklin: scared me off for sure so i'm glad i didn't know i'm glad i didn't know Ha ha!
Paul Regnier: See, there's there's a whole side of things we're glad we didn't know at the beginning.
Lindsay Franklin: that's right it That's right.
Paul Regnier: Because we always think we want to know it all. Give me all the information.
Lindsay Franklin: and Oh.
Paul Regnier: well Very good. I think that covers it. I think that covers our time travel advice. Hopefully this was helpful to everyone out there. Um, If nothing else, it's a time travel story. That's always fun.
Paul Regnier: But... So yeah, it again, thank you everyone for listening. Please remember to like and subscribe and all that good stuff. and uh Just um we'll see you next time.
Lindsay Franklin: Bye. bye
