Transcript
Speaker: Hello and welcome to OTB, the podcast that has forgotten how to talk about draws anyway. Because Norwich City don't do draws these days, not even when they're level going into injury time. One of the greatest games and one of the worst games in recent years, a mad and maddening seven-goal thriller at the Riverside on Saturday.
Speaker: Tory again, ole, ole. McCalm are back among the goals. Jacob Wright, excellent again from the bench. That's the good bit. Less than idea will be going behind after seven minutes, having been in front and allowing your opponents three touches in a row in your penalty area from a set piece in injury time. Just two of the reasons Norwich City left the North East empty handed last weekend.
Speaker: Four defeats in seven, but we're in the top half, but we're very open, but we're great fun to watch. Should we be worried? Should we stop worrying about whether we should be worried? Luckily, we'll quickly get the chance to bounce back at, checks notes, Manchester City. Nothing like facing a Petro State funded club to get you feeling good about football again. That will probably lead us to talking about rotation. Why can't these players just run really fast and hard all the time? Plus, offside goals that were and onside goals that weren't. The blad's bad fad and demanding one of our panellists to make some seriously big decisions. like he's in the government or something we're basically reviewing a basketball game this week and luckily it's nothing but net with our panel this week firstly he's sharp he's thorough he watched us lose at borough fresh from flicking the v's from the away end at the riverside it's dan brigham good evening to you dan hello steve hello everyone how are you very well thank you how are you and are you emotionally drained
Speaker: um not um No, not really. um But my ears are just recovering because once again, the Borough fans, I i do really think they're the loudest in in the division. um Just to shame that like last season when I was also there in the away end that we're on the receiving end of of their loud cheers.
Speaker: Yes, they were very good last season and apparently apparently continued to be... It sounded loud anyway. I thought when you said your ears were recovering, it was going to be a comment about my levels, my sound levels. Wouldn't be the first time. No, they are perfect, Steve.
Speaker: Thank you so much. I was just fishing for that compliment. um And like Norwich City, we're resting some of our regulars, but we have powerhouses coming off the bench, one specifically... fresh and ready to sprint around his home office like a greyhound on speed, it's Craig Draycott. Craig, welcome back.
Speaker: Hello, good evening both. Great to have you on. how How have you been? Yeah, very well, thank you. Yeah, just enjoying watching the up and down of Norwich at the moment. I think I said to you midweek that we don't yet know if we're any good, but that's better than last year when we knew we weren't any good at this stage of the season. That is a very good point. I think none of us know, none of us really know whether we're good or not, but that that is a step up. It's good to have some perspective on these things, isn't it? um So yes, let's start on a positive.
Speaker: Yep, I've said it before and i'll probably say it again. We are providing extra content for our Patreon subscribers this season. So if you haven't subscribed it and you'd like to listen to a little bit more from us about our top 25 Norwich City legends, just not Dan and Zoe so far, and imagining Holti and Wes solving mysteries in a care home and more, then please head over to Patreon, search OTB Norwich City and sign up for as little as £2 a month. We don't have anything for you this week, but we will be back. next week and there'll be plenty more good stuff to come thereafter that is a promise plus as i've said before we're not taking away from the main podcast it's just a small extra anyway as we know the news cycle doesn't stop for anyone apart from when zoe's not here when we ditch the headlines and we go back to this old favorite
Speaker: so
Speaker: It was all very entertaining, but Norwich City left Middlesbrough with an empty feeling. I guess a bit like going to Thailand and watching one of those ping pong shows. Probably, I wouldn't know. um It was the wrong big Phil celebrating at the death as far as Norwich City were concerned with Ashley Phillips scoring a 91st minute winner to make it 4-3 to the Borough. Dan, as as I said, you were there. You watched the whole thing unfold inside a very loud stadium. imagine there were lots of different feelings throughout that game. So do you want to just spend the next 25 minutes talking us through your emotional process or at least at least assessing how that game went for you? Well, it it was like a basketball match, as you referenced, obviously. But, you know, good because it's football, not basketball. um It was ah every time we played Borough, it seems it's a pretty like friend frenetic...
Speaker: ah High quality match. like You think back to last season, if even though it was only 1-0 at the Riverside to Borough, that was back and forth. Both teams on a really, really high level.
Speaker: think back to the three all under Thorup as well when we came back from 3-1 down and managed to not give away a stupid free kick and then concede from that free kick. We're going to spend obviously the next 10 or so minutes dissecting it. It's a difficult one because... Obviously, it showed some very good things.
Speaker: ah Most importantly, that a lot of hearts had to come back, possibly at the hardest a place to go to in the championship this season. ah At the Riverside, to come back from two goals down to equalise it, and to equalise, show a lot of um control in that second half and then look like probably the team that were more likely to win it. It was really heartening on the back of you know our performances against Birmingham City and Sheffield United, which both also showed a lot of um ah intensity, i think. Obviously, our attacking ability was on show again as well, a really good front four, creating lots and lots of chances.
Speaker: um however you rot in and rotate in or rotate out that it's ah a front four that's going to create a lot of chances especially you know the wide men and and the and the number nine two brilliant finishes from our number nines Torres finishes live I didn't quite appreciate it because i wasn't right quite at the right angle but he's got to put it in like millimeters where the keeper can't even make a save i there aren't many finishers who can put it away like that and veering into hyperbole here, but ah Harry Kane-esque in the way he puts his foot through it and has that little so late swerve on it. And then an excellent finish from McCarma to get out of his feet. um And so nice to see him back amongst the goals as well. um
Speaker: But obviously there's the downside as well. And we're we'll go on to talk about this, I'm sure. But we were, particularly in the first half and not for the first time this season, very, very open. Our midfield two, Kenny and Mattson, have got to cover so much ground at the moment, more than they were having to cover last season. and Whether that's because we're playing higher up the pitch with the number 10 getting closer to number 9, whether our wingers are sort of more direct wingers, whether our right back issue is me means we don't get as much control in midfield when they step into midfield.
Speaker: I'm sure we'll discuss the sort of ah issues with around that. But yeah, that that's a relatively sort of bubbling, concerning element, I'd say, how open we were. But... I'd take the you know i' take that sort of performance way over a team that sort of doesn't quite know how to ah create chances, doesn't quite know how to um get the ball from back to front effectively, um like we've seen before, because I feel like the sort of more defensive off the ball stuff is something that is easier to work on than creating chances at this level. so Despite the defeat um and despite the sort of horror of losing and injury time, you go away thinking, like actually, we've just been part of a a pretty outstanding or entertaining game of football. And you can and the positives maybe just outweigh the negatives from that 90 minutes.
Speaker: Were you in your seat for the Toure goal at least? you didn't You weren't still in the bar having missed the first minute or anything? Like you got there in time No, yeah, I saw it ah unfold. I'd already seen Middlesbrough miss a very good chance before we'd gone one ill up as well and then was very much still there to see us go B2-1 down suddenly a few minutes later, thanks to a whole myriad of issues.
Speaker: Great work. um I love the optimism of thinking that we'll be able to assess this game in 10 minutes. That will be a level of brevity we've never managed on this podcast before. um Craig, Borough to me looked very good, as as Dan has already said, um and we knew this was going to be a tough game. Does that make this any easier to stomach or is it even more annoying handing over three points to a team that ideally we would like to be challenging with?
Speaker: Well, I think Middlesbrough are clearly just like a step ahead of us at the moment in terms of their progression. Like they've been on, like last season, for example, they were, although they changed manager halfway through, they had started the season very strongly. Kim Helberg's then been able to start from better foundations ultimately than Philip Clement got the chance to, given how bad we were at the start of last season. And then they've gone into the summer and spent so much money. So I almost think I wouldn't,
Speaker: worry too much about the fact we didn't beat middle score because actually we for large parts could have beaten them we definitely could have been on the end of a a victory i think we certainly deserve to draw so i actually would take more from the fact we got this close to them that we could have beaten them than the fact we ultimately lost because theoretically given the amount of money they've spent and how good they were for most of last season they should be beating us at home um And I think there were a lot of positives from the performance. We obviously scored a lot of goals. um
Speaker: It's just, yeah, I think more concerning is the the defensive frailties and and the issues in midfield. I don't think Kenny or Mattson have been at their best this season as a duo. I think they both had individual games, but i don't think we've seen them at their best as a pairing yet. And then...
Speaker: there is this just disconnect between the defense and the attack. Like there's so much space between the defense and the attack that having to cover so much ground. Mattson did that excellently last year, but we've then asked him to cover even more. And it seems that for whatever reason, whether it's fact he's not actually in the top team because he's been pulled out, but Fisher doesn't seem to be drifting in centrally as much as he did. So then it's leaving even bigger gap. Maybe that's because he started fairly poorly this season and we've kind of asked him to go back to basics. um Or maybe it's because the 10s pushing up higher. But then if you're playing a Slomane in there, I'd expect him to drop deeper than if you're playing a Paris Magoma, who you would expect to be a bit closer to that striker. But I think we struggle to retain the ball. We don't seem to always know what to do when we have the ball for long periods of the time. So like if we're playing out from the back, we'll often rush it into the the final third or into their half of the pitch and then kind of just get stuck there. and you see a lot of hesitation, I think, especially from Mattson, who is often the one who is receiving it in those spaces. What I've sort of noticed him doing in his poorer performance this year is he'll get the ball, he'll pass it really quickly, make a wrong decision and give it away. Then next time he gets the ball, he'll try and hold on to it for much longer, but he'll hesitate and then ultimately end up slowing down the game.
Speaker: And then he kind of like repeats that process when he's not at his best. So I think we need to find a way to use the ball better with purpose when we're holding onto it. We're obviously excellent when we're we're going forward and on the counter and driving at them with pace, but it's almost in those periods of the game where they're letting us have the ball. We need to know what to do with it better. Or if we're trying to hold onto draw or a lead, again, just knowing how to kind of like control the game a little bit.
Speaker: Yeah, completely grim. We'll come back to some of the tactical stuff. ah But Dan, I haven't written this in the script, but i've I've just remembered how annoyed you were at Jack Stacey. And i I'm assuming that's down to the winning goal. It might not be, but perhaps now's an an apt time to be talking about that.
Speaker: Oh man, I don't... It's going to be like kicking a dog. Now I've calmed down, obviously. I don't want to get... Because it's not the fault of one player that we lost that game. No, it's really not. I was... It was the injury time double header of him giving away that free kick sort of needlessly. Because he once again, he'd been sort of caught in no men's no man's land. But more than that, it was...
Speaker: After they'd scored, which Stacey probably should do better on that ah contact, but it's certainly not his just his fault in the box that they score that free kick. It's an absolute disaster in there with Krizeny, McConville and Kenny all at the back stick, leaving two borough players on the penalty spot, basically. The only one he doesn't seem to um ah disgrace himself is Cordoba there. But it's the last seconds of the game where Stacey's on the right and pops it onto his left foot and curls across miles out of play. And it's just like, how is that the right decision to make there? I've never seen him cross with his left foot before. And I kind of don't want him to see him cross with that foot before as well. But yeah, i mean, it's easy to pick on. pla my my McConville obviously had a disastrous first 10 minutes. um
Speaker: The giveaway for the first goal is, you know, is just one of those things that can happen. But the second ah the second goal, which obviously people are sort of putting on Vlad a bit, and I agree that he probably should get... a strong hand to that but equally mcvont McConville is sort of opening up his body rather than getting close yeah to the goal scorer and just essentially lets him have a shot um yeah so lots of individual errors led to that goal but really it was a ah collective as we've just sort of spoken about in terms of um midfield issues and the gaps between defence midfield and and midfield and attack but
Speaker: I think at the start of the season, we all asked who we'd spend the most of the season swearing at. And I did say Jack Stacey. And I took that to a sort of apocalyptic levels, unfortunately, on on full time, to which I'd like to apologise to anyone around me.
Speaker: let's get Although they did all seem to be in agreement. So there was that. maybe Maybe he was listening to the podcast thought, well, let's give him something to swear about. It's not often you get your preseason predictions right. So know it' ah's's he's done you favor there, at least. While we're on the subject of scapegoats, Craig, this seemed to be the moment when online, at least, a lot of fans decided to turn on ah Big Vlad.
Speaker: For the goalkeeper's view, ah please go over to our sub stack and read Ryan's excellent written piece. I think you can probably guess which side of the argument he comes down on. um For now, they've got three absolute chances deciding whether he's any good or not. So on that note, Craig, over to you. where Where do you stand on Vlad and on our goalkeeper position at the moment?
Speaker: um um mean, I don't think he was a problem against Middlesbrough. I think the defence really did kind of let him down. I mean, so often... they just didn't seem to be able to track their markers. Like that final goal, the play they was like they were they were completely split. You had their attackers on one side, all goal side, and ours were just so far back. And you're just thinking, is this ah some kind of clever free kick routine? But it wasn't. We did just let them stand in front of the goal. So I i don't think he's the problem, but he's also not the solution. i think last year, once Declan Rudd had come in, we we did see a real improvement in Vlad's. in the areas of the game where he particularly struggled. I mean, one of his biggest faults, for example, I think was his inability to come for crosses. I think everyone thought he needed to improve that. And he did seem to improve it towards the end of the season with the help of Declan Rudd. I think we also saw a decrease in the number of errors he was making.
Speaker: I wouldn't necessarily say he's regressed in those two areas this season, but I do think what's changed is that he's maybe not making saves that a top keeper at this level would. I think that's maybe where he's regressed to an extent.
Speaker: I think he's not winning us any points. And I think for a team who wants to fight for promotion, you need a keeper who's going to win you points. Someone like Victor Johansson at Stoke, every time we play them, he seems to like earn them at least a point.
Speaker: And Vlad will still come out every now and again this year and he'll make an acro but acrobatic save that looks great on the eye. But I think there's a there's a type of goal that is not easy to save, doesn't require acrobatics, but the top level keeper will get. And that's where I think he's not doing enough for us this year. And think ultimately it's concerning that we're having this conversation over a year into his Norwich career. like I'm not entirely sure I could tell you what he's good at consistently.
Speaker: He makes acrobatic saves. He might be an eight or nine out of 10 one week, but consistently, what does he do well? And I don't think there is His form fluctuates much. He is a good shot stopper. Perhaps hasn't proved it recently, but I think generally, like he has made a lot of good saves for us in the past that I think other goalkeepers that we've had wouldn't necessarily have been able to make. Dan, I don't know whether you feel um with you know whether you feel he's he's had a bad start to the season.
Speaker: Um, ah not bad, but poor, I suppose not up to the standards as Craig was just saying that he was sort of setting at the back end of last season. Um, when it was clear that to me that he was, he'd been an upgrade on Angus gun from the previous year. Um, the stats sort of bear that out as well. He was but fifth in the table, um, of goals prevented last season. Um,
Speaker: But this ah there's been sort of issues with him getting down for low drives, I think, that he's not maybe ah like the Bamford finish and the second goal Borough scored on Saturday. It feels like last season he'd have been getting a hand to those.
Speaker: It reminds me of you know John Ruddy, who we talked about on last week's pod, has been part the top 25 vote. um post-injury Ruddy also struggled to get down really low. Obviously, Kovacevic hasn't had an injury that we're aware of, which is quite rare for our squad. um So it it is early days, like across the last sort of three months of last season, I think he was proving himself and ah a really effective goalkeeper at this level, not a brilliant goalkeeper, not um a guy you might associate with, you know, a team that's top two, but certainly,
Speaker: good enough for a team that's got aspirations of top eight this season. um But I do think sometimes when you get emotional goalkeepers like Vlad, and bless him, he is very emotional.
Speaker: I think it that really heightens errors. They become a lot more visible, I think, because you don't quite have that same trust in an emotional goalkeeper because they've always got what you think isn't like an error in them.
Speaker: um And the poor bloke at the start of this season has had to face ah an awful full lot of shots on his goal. An awful lot of shots from inside the areas as as well, um which you know is not down to him. Although I guess his poor his poor kicking, which really has seemed to regressed at the start of the sea start of the season, means that teams can pick up the ball and go again. Yeah.
Speaker: But I don't know i if he's still if he's still putting these performances in 15, 16 games into the season. And that's when i I start to worry, I think. But right now, i think he's got enough credit in the bank like McConville does as well. um So to suggest he's a good enough goalkeeper for what we want to achieve this season, I think.
Speaker: Yeah, I mean, I think for me, it's it's a small sample size still really on on the Vlad front. And I don't know what the solution is. I think if people are expecting us to go out and buy a goalkeeper in January, you know, I think his form would have to regressed severely for for that to happen. i also I also think people forget how mad like Tim Krul was in the 18-19 season yes and how many goals he cost us as well. But because, you know, we were good at just banging in the goals um that year, that's kind of forgotten. But when you've you, know, so you what, four defeats out in seven games, keeper comes out under the spotlight yeah a bit more. um
Speaker: And I think maybe, you know, when hopefully we flip that and start winning ah more matches, then the spotlight will go off him a little bit more. It's the absolute absolute opposite of what I was expecting from him, really, which was we'll get some brilliant moments, but also some absolute howlers. I can't really think of an absolute howler that he's had in his time here other than like maybe that Watford goal where he just palmed it onto Kieran God's head like about...
Speaker: at Vicarage Road kind of nearly a year ago. i don't think he's had any really bad moments, but at the same time, yeah, he hasn't had as many. Well, at the Riverside last season as well, it the their winner is, although Hackney's banged it in from 25 yards, Kovacevic has just kicked it straight to them.
Speaker: And obviously that was, he did fall over the ball in that in the 80th minute or whatever it was on Saturday. Sorry, yes, when I say howlers, ones that were directly responsible for a goal. But apart from that one where he kicked it straight to Hayden Hackney, sure, sure, yeah. Of course, there's those, there's those kind of things. Which keeper in the Championship and in the Premier League that that don't have those moments, you know.
Speaker: Martinez had a couple of those moments in the World Cup just gone and he know he was one of the best goalkeepers in the world until very recently. Yeah, I mean, Bournemouth goalkeeper at the weekend just literally passed it straight to a Brentford player and he's Premier League. So, um Craig, gump Dan's going to definitely agree with me here when I say it's it's been another up and down week in what's been an up and down season so far. There's four defeats in seven now, no clean sheet in 16 games. It's not a disaster. It's still early days, but...
Speaker: as we're saying that there's definite issues to resolve defensively. We've kind of touched on them already, but like, if if you could make, and it's um it's difficult because i'm asking you to pitch your tactics up against our managers here, but like, is is there a fix that, that we could make just to make ourselves a little bit tighter? It was a great game on Saturday, obviously.
Speaker: but we certainly approached it in a way that was fairly gung-ho against a good team. Are we all ah are we all okay with this? Is this the right way to go about it? or Or could we just maybe make some slight tweaks here and there, do you think?
Speaker: I mean, I do still believe that based on what we saw last season that we will improve. We are definitely easier to play through and I think that's something we need to try and get on top of. that we We need more bodies in the midfield. I don't know whether that is like Fischer or even Krasena kind of dropping in a little bit more or whether...
Speaker: um you need your 10 to be more of a Jacob Wright or someone who is actually in the midfield. Like maybe, I don't think it's something that Phil Clement is going to do because he he does seem to pretty rigidly stick to his 4-2-3-1, but maybe it's changing to ah a 4-3-3 and then you have that those bodies in the midfield, so you're giving your defence a bit more protection. especially at a time in the season where McConville, Cordoba, Fisher, like are all struggling more than I think anyone expected. like i I didn't think we'd be having a conversation about those three. it It seemed like they would just come in and improve. But then I also didn't expect Darling to start the season. So maybe they're just feeling their way back into that partnership while also experiencing the difficulties in front of them. I still think that they'll work it out. And I wouldn't necessarily change anything defensively or or tactically. I think we will just generally improve.
Speaker: Dan? Yeah, I don't think you really don't want to lose the but like too much of the balance the other way, do you? Because we are so potent going forward. You don't want to see us suddenly you know play five at the back or um go more you know rigid without as many men forward. I think maybe also...
Speaker: ah I am in favour of the rotation policy, given in ah given an the amount of injuries we had last season and trying to bring back players, get them up to speed, make them more robust. But one knock-on effect it can have, I think, especially in that front four, which has rotated so much, is that maybe the pressing isn't quite a sort of um as sharp or on point as it is. will hopefully grow into because you are always changing your wide men, you're changing your number 10. So they're not sort of pressing as a collective. And that obviously has a knock-on effect of the gaps between midfield and attack and midfield and defence, which puts more pressure on your defence.
Speaker: So I think that might have a might be a real contributing factor. um Also, as Craig sort of suggested there, I think that back four hasn't really played together as a unit. So obviously with Darling starting the season, and also Fisher and Stacey being rotated because a Fisher obviously had that knock in pre-season, but B, neither of them are really impressed on the right and obviously on the left, Chris Eni and Young were sort of rotated a little bit as well. So it does still feel like this squad is as a unit and as a collective is still taking shape. And I think only when it's taken shape, um kind of, you know, they they press as a a unit. And if they can press as a unit, then... um
Speaker: then they suddenly become you know much more effective at the back as well. And also, i would yeah none it's interesting that Toure and Salahni have both started i've started all four away games in the league, I believe, um because they don't offer much...
Speaker: respite when you're just trying to desperately play out of pressure. As great as Toure is in behind, he's not Makama levels of just having that ball stick and being able to ping it to one of the wide men or to the number 10s. And i don't know, like, Slimani, who, you know...
Speaker: has it is a central midfielder it said essentially that has been moved to number 10 is not displaying this season any of the sort of standout qualities that you'd associate with someone who grew up as ah a central midfielder he's easy to bully off the ball he's sort of running like he's wearing wellies at the moment it's just he just looks massively off the pace and I think obviously Not having that extra body in midfield makes us wider open as well. So we'll get on to it, I'm sure. But I think ah certainly Wright deserves a chance because he was outstanding, I thought, when he came on and was noticeably dropping deeper than Slomani was, which again, you can do when you've got McCama up top with you rather than Toure because McCama can hold the ball up better. um And Magoma as well, who can sort of drop into midfield and and run from ah deep as well. And Shortell can. So i wouldn't be surprised if we see, you know, maybe Slomani dip out for a little bit now just to try and retain ah a bit more control in central areas.
Speaker: Yeah, and i mean, for and know asking the cook just asking the questions, but for just um for for my tuppence worth on this one, just just having look at we are we are the highest pressing team in the league in terms of how high we we win the ball and and attempt to win the ball. And we have won the second most in the opponent's third of the pitch behind Swansea. so But I also think our biggest strength is in another way, a weakness. And I think you you touched on this before, Craig, but playing Brooks, who's possibly been our best player this season so far, he's been he's fantastic on the press. But obviously, the higher you go, the more space you leave him behind. And I think that has meant that Fisher has to play
Speaker: slightly more orthodox, which means that Kenny, whose form has not been as good this season as it was last year, and Mattson have been more exposed. And then I think the other thing that you hit on, Dan, is, yeah, Slimani is good for many things. We saw against Sheffield United how, with a little flick, he was able to open them up, and that kind of ultimately helped us win the game. But when Wright and Magoma came on in the second half, we just had more control because we had two players who wanted to be on the ball, who were comfortable at holding the ball and having it at feet um in that front four.
Speaker: So yeah, I think there is work to be done. if it, like when it works, it's brilliant. We have the second highest XG in the league. So we're clearly creating a lot of chances.
Speaker: It's just keeping out at the other end, but Hey, we're not, we're not championship managers. So, and only four teams have worse XG against than us as well, which is yes on actual goals of what only one team scored more than us and only two or one have conceded more as well, which is Burnley, weirdly. Um,
Speaker: But yeah, so there's always got to be a little sacrifice, hasn't there? Either you sacrifice a little bit of width by bringing in sort of, you know, more of like the players who like to come inside a little bit more and don't play as high, or you sacrifice centrally, which is what we're doing at the moment. So it's it's um that's why managers get paid a lot of money to try and sort that out. And as Craig said a little while ago, I've very little doubt that he will be able to sort that out because we we saw that last season.
Speaker: And I think a lot of the errors we saw against Middlesbrough as well, or the goals that we conceded, maybe came from like a player losing their man or like the free kick in the end where so many of their players were just allowed to go free. and i don't think that the issue of the midfield is what like where those goals came from. And again, if you do drop... Like Slomane, as you said, is a natural kind of central midfielder. So you've got to think that regardless of how well you think he's doing the role, he's been asked to play higher up the pitch. So if you then ask him to play deeper, you maybe lose that pressing element where like that's where the...
Speaker: the Torre's goal came from, for example, Brooks winning the ball fairly high up the pitch. If if you're asking your wingers to drop deeper, if you're asking your 10 to drop deeper, you do lose that.
Speaker: And it's funny, obviously, that um I felt like for a big part of that first half, Middles were actually schooled us. And what, they're second in the table, maybe? I just got it in front of me. They're fourth in the table, point off the top. But, you know, if you imagine the equivalent to podcast to this on Teesside right now, they're probably having similar conversations, right? Brilliant going forward, but kind of open centrally as well. So, you know, we're having same conversations as a team that are rightly one of the favourites get top two this season. So we're not we're not far off being a side that can start to motor, I think. Yep, well, we're five points off the top of the table. so um But if all else fails, then bring back Liam Gibbs onto the right wing. That's that's what i do I think. I mean, I haven't seen any of the highlights, but I looked at the Preston result and the line-up was he was playing right back for Preston. And they lost 1-0 at home. Yeah, so maybe he was the answer. Maybe yeah he was the answer all along for us. If Liam Gibbs is the answer, then what was the question? um Well, well done, everyone. A good tight 10 minutes there. ah we can We can make some time back with some quick-fire stats.
Speaker: The numbers coming, so you better watch your back and get ready for the stat attack. I say quickfire. I did not ah post at all after the Borough game. Outrageous. Went to watch the Odyssey. So just to prove to the listeners that I do occasionally leave the house. um So i will that means we've got we've got a veritable feast this week.
Speaker: It was the first time that Norwich City have scored three or more goals and lost in an away game since Hull away eight years ago. who scored a hat-trick that day? Anyone? James Madison. James Madison as a Norwich City midfielder. Well done, Dan. Point to you. um It's the earliest since QPR at home in August 1998 in a Norwich City game that three goals have been scored. So three in the first seven minutes. August 22nd, 1998, the UK number one was no matter what by...
Speaker: Boyzone? Correct. Oh, no. Almost immediate. Sorry? Almost immediate. I thought we would need Zoe for that, but clearly you you you'd be right in there jumping in with the 90s pop hits. and Top grossing film was about a board game. Anyone want to Jumanji.
Speaker: Very good. Very good. There go. Boyzone and Jumanji. I don't think culture got any better than that. did Motore, the only player in the last 50 years and probably beyond, to be honest, to score three Norwich City goals in the first minute of a match.
Speaker: I don't, that feels like it's not just coincidence. He is just outrageously explosive at the start of a game. um it's the only It's only the third time in our history that subs have combined for two Norwich City goals in the same game.
Speaker: West Brom in the Cup in January, Slimani to Krizeny and Slimani to Toure. So maybe he's better just coming off the bench, Slimani. And then randomly Cardiff away in August 2008. A dreadful season, but ah Lee Croft set up Arturo Lupoli twice in that game.
Speaker: ah We have had 11 different... Sorry, in our entire history. Yes. Well, I guess we are aided by the fact now that we have five subs. And Clement does seem particularly good at using and yeah gets them on early as well, doesn't he? So they've got plenty of time to make an impact.
Speaker: 11 different goal scorers in nine games this season. Last season, it took us 29 games to get and into the new year to get 11 different Norwich City goal scorers. And I think maybe six or seven different goal scorers in the last three games. Not bad going. Is that our entire front four rotation? Has anyone other than our front four scored?
Speaker: Has Krizeny scored? Yes, Krizeny did score against MK Dons, although it sort of hit him. Oh, yes. But yes, other than that... Pella Mattson scored, hasn't he?
Speaker: Who did Mattson score against? Dear me, this is not a good standstill if I can't remember scores from the last two months. I will quickly go through them. Ture, Slomani, Krizeny, Brooks, Kvistgoren, Sienac, Musaba, Svartal, Diallo, Makama, Wright.
Speaker: Wow. So apart from Krizeny, basically all of our rotating front four have scored. That's nice. Yeah. Keep the rotation going. It's clearly working. Why don't we just play them all? you know It can't be any more end-to-end than it is at the moment.
Speaker: um And finally, a bad omen to finish. In the last 15 years, Norwich and Middlesbrough have been in the same league eight times. And seven of the eight times the home and away results have been mirrored. So Borough won twice, then Norwich did the double, then Norwich did the double again, then Borough, then Borough, then two draws, and then last season, Borough.
Speaker: So if that continues, and don't bother going to the game at Carrow Road. Although it does mean we might win at Wembley. It does mean we might. Yes, that's the odd one out. is the is the Well, the odd other one out is that Burrow did the double.
Speaker: And then that was when this run started. And we yeah absolutely kicked their ass at Wembley. so So what I've learned from that. Yes. All of that is that Torre should start like the first 10 minutes and then just get McCammer on after that, because it seems Torre is at his most effective in those first few minutes. Yes, and then we're giving Makama loads of time as a sub, with our subs that do particularly well, to score loads and loads of goals.
Speaker: I would love to see Motore's face when he gets hauled off after 10 minutes having scored a goal for us. After banging in a hat-trick.
Speaker: Yeah, first ticket to Hull in January, I reckon. think um oh What I'd like to know is, if we did play all of our attacking players, where in the XI would you play if you stuck to a traditional formation? Who would go where?
Speaker: um Good question. I mean... Sinatra's got a feel of a centre-back, right? McCalm has got the feel of a centre-back, for sure. Surely you'd want McCalm in goal, though.
Speaker: Oh, yeah, good point. Yeah, could he dive around, though? Could he get to a low shot better than Vlad could? I don't know. Magoma's got like the elegance of a ah classy fullback, I think.
Speaker: Yes, although not not scored this season, so couldn't couldn't make the 11, unfortunately. um Right in, where would you play our 11 goal scorers and who's going in goal? But good question, Craig. Not one, unfortunately, that we're qualified, well, probably fortunately, that we're qualified to answer. And we're we're definitely veering away from stats now, so I'm closing this feature off right now.
Speaker: Put the word out there to the other podcasts. We are not afraid of putting our panellists on the spot on this show or resorting to despicable means of intimidation to make them answer. Here's Dan Brigham after this jingle with Gun to the Head.
Speaker: Gun to the Head
Speaker: Has a dog been added to the jingle? Or is that was that and coming from someone's audio? It's okay, everyone. The dog is safe. No no one is... No dogs were harmed in the making this podcast.
Speaker: Phew. Right. Thank you, Ryan. ah No, Ryan's not here. Thank you, Steve. It's a dog called Ryan.
Speaker: um Right, now it's time to find out how Craig reacts with a gun to his head. So we ask an either or question like cats or dogs, ah but football related, and then wait for Craig's considered response. So let's get straight into this.
Speaker: Craig, would you do prefer 1-0 losing one nil or losing four three
Speaker: Absolutely losing 4-3. If we're going to lose, I'd much rather be entertained. And kind of as we've said already, but there's plenty of positives we can take away. The amount of goals we scored, the chances we created. So you can almost ignore the negatives a little bit.
Speaker: Whereas, yeah, if I think if you lose 1-0, you come away having not enjoyed the game of football. And with no real positives, you've just got the negatives of conceding the goal. Whereas at least we had three positives from the game.
Speaker: Was it Dean Smith who said his favourite result was a 1-0 win? Does that make his his least favourite result a 1-0 defeat or his favourite defeat a 1-0 loss?
Speaker: a Probably losing 1-0, right? I mean, i I was going to say i am i would consider myself to be a massive dullard, but even I would rather lose 4-3 than lose 1-0. But maybe Dean Smith is a level of dullard even above me.
Speaker: so kind of fits I reckon if you'd like. Isn't it like something about 1-0 that's ah that number number nerds are like your good self like? The binary element of it? Yeah well um we did actually against Borough we had a long run of winning 1-0 against them and not guilty which was quite satisfying but um other than you know weird statistical sequences which I'm thinking nobody else is going to appreciate there's there's not much benefit to it although I guess if you're a manager there's always that you know the kind of
Speaker: when a when a manager wins 4-3 in that post-match interview, they'll kind of do ah a sort of yeah semi-chuckling say, well, it was a lot more fun for the fans than it was for me. My heart rate's still not back to normal. So ah maybe that's why Dean Smith prefers a 1-0.
Speaker: I always think as well, like football's all alright football iss about moments. And if, yeah, if you've lost 1-0, you haven't had a moment, whereas at least with with a 4-3, you've given the fans three moments. They've had that belief that they can come back into it.
Speaker: Yeah, that old saying is, ah I just want to see a goal at least when you're going away. just just want to celebrate a goal. um Next question. Daniel Farker's parka or Philippe Clement's very strange, tight, long-sleeved shirt that makes him look like a waiter from a 1980s French bistro?
Speaker: That's where I've seen that outfit before. The 1980s. Café Rouge in 1989.
Speaker: I'm not a Parker man myself, but I would definitely choose the Parker over the the very tight outfit, not least because it just looks quite uncomfortable. Like he must have to spend an awful amount of time in the game just almost sucking in.
Speaker: I don't know how he gets away with no sweat patches as well. nice Extraordinary scenes because it it looks um like it's sort of been sewn onto him, doesn't it? so clingy. good prince housing thing yeah The ordinary person, like if you've had even like a few bottles of water, it might bloat you a little bit and suddenly then that's quite an uncomfortable outfit.
Speaker: And then you're in danger of losing a few buttons there as well, aren't you? Pinging onto the pitch, taking the fourth official's eye out, getting sent off as a result. And those trousers look like they could split any moment.
Speaker: i mean, knowing our luck with left back injuries, one of them would get like yeah injured, get a button in the eye, Ben Kriveni would end up being out for six weeks. At least there's no need for a belt though.
Speaker: That's true. Very good point. Yes. Just plaster it on. Next question. Squad rotation or muscle injuries?
Speaker: Squad rotation obviously a very hot topic at the moment, but I think it was Connor Southwell who put it on X recently that we'll never know how many injuries it's prevented. And I think that's probably quite a good way to look at it.
Speaker: Steve, you you prefer muscle injuries? I love a good muscle injury. Yeah. You're just plugging your own plugging your own tweets now, aren't you? Because this was a direct question. You said you can't have both. you You may not have both. Yeah, that's where I heard it before. I think it's weird though, isn't it? ah You know, not wanting to go back too far into our um early season dodgy form, but we were better with the muscle injuries than we have been with the squad rotation. I'm not saying squad rotation doesn't work. I would rather have that. But yeah, it's weird how when we had this threadbare squad that our results were really, really good. Maybe that's still to come.
Speaker: actually had a conversation fairly recently with some Rangers fans and they i unfortunately made the same point. that when Clement was there, he was better when he had fewer players to work with. Like when his squad, and I hadn't actually raised the point, but they they asked the question and they said, yeah, when his when he had more options to choose from, he did seem to struggle a little bit more. Right. Muscle injuries it is for me then. Yeah. Hopefully the other side of the international break, a few of them will will come back with bad calves, hammies gone, that kind of thing. That is absolutely going happen now, isn't it? It's all your fault. Yeah. And it'll be, ah that if I take the blame for that, I can take the credit for when we're lifting the title then, come me. Yeah. All right. Deal. ah
Speaker: Excellent. Next question then. Now, Craig is a, ah works in F1. So got to have an F1 related question. The roar of Formula One cars on the start line or the roar of a last minute winner in football, as long as it's not against your team?
Speaker: I think it has to be the roar of a last minute winner just because that is associated with winning the game. Whereas the noise of an engine, no matter how great that is, that's the start of a race. You don't know whether your favorite driver, your favorite team has done particularly well yet. At least with the last minute winner, it guarantees success.
Speaker: Yeah, nicely put. Has someone asked you that before? No, weirdly not. That was a very PR answer, I think. Steve, how about you?
Speaker: and Well, um I mean, I know nothing about Formula 1 other than the start is the best bit of Formula 1 because you've got more chance of seeing a crash. Isn't that right, Craig? Yeah. Yeah, that's the best part about Formula One when they crash.
Speaker: Absolutely. Thank you very much. that's That's the opinion of a man who knows nothing about Formula One. I'll i'll take the roar. Even, i mean, there's something slightly sadistic about it, but even that the borough roar at the end, you know, obviously you're gutted, but like, I don't know, you know what that emotion feels like and you know that that is absolute elation for thousands of people. I've got, if if it was a different, i've I've kind of got nothing against borough, so it's fine. um but yeah that's the that is the best that's the best feeling in football and the best noise in football isn't it and obviously ah ironically borough's winner was a a total car crash for norwich as well in that penalty box they were queuing up on the grid the other side of the back post uh five subs or three subs allowed craig
Speaker: So this changed in what, 24 during COVID, wasn't it? You're going to forward, did you say? four You're going to go down the middle. packet I go back and forth on this one. I thought you said you're going to go forward as well. ah It obviously benefits us, I think, in the championship at the moment because we do have the squad depth, like in the same way Man City love to rotate and use all of their subs because they have this embarrassment of riches to bring off the bench at championship level. So do we, when you compare us to some of the smaller teams in this division. So I think the this year it benefits us when we go up to the Premier League. I'd probably say the opposite and say three but for with five.
Speaker: let's go with five Interesting. and Good answer as well. I agree. I think anything that benefits ah the strat bigger teams is a bad rule change. um But, you know, if we're getting Makama coming off the bench for Torre, then and I'm all for it. Injects energy into the game. Like if you've got tired players, the game maybe calms down. Like if you bring it on, like ah against Birmingham, when we brought on Makama and Sernac, they just seemed so hungry and it really did just add that bit more energy in. And I think that's what helped us see the game out.
Speaker: Yeah, I guess on the flip side, sometimes it can players it can come come a bit disjointed as well, can't it it doesn't flow as well if you've got suddenly got five new players on the pitch from both teams. What what do you think, Steve?
Speaker: I'm a three subs guy for sure. A dinosaur. Zero subs. Is is that really proper football? Yeah, yeah exactly. you You absolute pansies. Just get up and carry on playing. um i i Three just felt like the perfect amount. And I do get that with five, they have brought the rules in so that you can only make it at certain number, have a certain number of stoppages any, you know, across the across the course of the game.
Speaker: But three just felt the right amount not to disrupt the game overly and feel like you're watching a different team by the end of it. I mean, I know that is literally our game plan now. And Clement uses the five subs thing very, very well. So maybe I'll bring it in.
Speaker: After the end of this season, ah I was doing like a bit of ah just a plug for a piece that I'm doing on on our worst injury time ah goals or can goal concessions. And the I mean, this is going back some now, but Man City when we the let's be have a new game in 2005.
Speaker: Robbie Fowler scored the winner in injury time and a nearly 30-year-old Robbie Fowler playing 90-plus minutes in the Premier League now seems like utterly unthinkable to me. just would not happen. He'd be off after 55 minutes. at the Was he only 30 then? I know, yeah. I looked at him. My memory is like a wizened 38-year-old. He's an Ashley Barnes. He a tough pose round.
Speaker: He had a tough something. i don't know what it is. yeah, he definitely um he definitely went early. He'd he dream of the career Ashley Barnes has had post-30, Robbie Fowler would. And finally, and we'll talk about this in more depth, but win in the Cup on Thursday or win in the League on Sunday?
Speaker: I mean, as fun as a win in the Cup against Man City would be like, it would be one of those games that you would remember for years. But in terms of our actual aims for this season, it does feel like the Bolton game ist is an excellent opportunity, A, to carry on scoring goals against the team who I think Stephen Schumacher said in midweek,
Speaker: that he isn't going to change the way they're playing, even though they're playing quite an attacking round football. So theoretically it plays into our hands, but also I think it's just a good chance to get a clean sheet.
Speaker: Going to play this one back next week. In this scenario, we are guaranteed a win. You offered me a win. Yeah, good point. Very good point. Yeah. And you're also getting a little bonus clean sheet out of it as well. Yeah, nice work. ah Well, I think we'll get a clean sheet on Thursday, so we wouldn't be worried about it by then. I'm taking the cup win.
Speaker: we'd remember it We'd remember it for, well, at least a few weeks, probably months and years. And it didn't wouldn't really matter whether we went out. ah are we Am I still allowed to take a draw in that Bolton game or have we lost that?
Speaker: Okay, well, that's what I'll do then. Let's win in the cup and then we can drop a cup against Bolton and we'll be sad during the international break and then win at Swansea. um We'll know, i think, who we might play if we um do shock Man City. um So this aren' this is probably, you know, depending on whether we have to go away somewhere again or whatever. But you've got to take the glory all the time, right? there's where There'll be still another 39, 38 games to go in the championship. But beating Man City again, you know, this ah this century or in the last 15 years would be ah would be pretty incredible. So um i think I'd take that. I'd just take the glory, I think.
Speaker: yeah If we can get a 0-0 draw against Bolton, I'll take a Man City win. A double clean sheet. Okay, think we've worked that one out then, haven't we? Excellent. Well, thank you very much for your answers, Craig. That has been Gun to the Head.
Speaker: Thank you very much, Dan. You'll never guess the two games we've got coming up this week. We don't do draws anymore, but we do do cup draws. You'd have to say we didn't do the last one very well. It's quite an unappetising tie away at Man City on Thursday, or of course, one of the greatest cup victories in our history.
Speaker: The inexplicable day of the week for a game of football that is Thursday has meant Bolton has been pushed back to Sunday lunchtime. Straight back to you then, Craig. Never a great time to play Man City. They've won their last five, though, so this feels particularly bad. So that this midweek game looks like a big old free swing. So our our dear old friend Rotation might be coming into play again for the Cup.
Speaker: um I mean, Dan's touched... ah on this player already, but feels like one for Jacob Wright with his good performance going back to his old club, that's got to be one, hasn't it? um And anybody else you you'd like to see come in?
Speaker: Yeah, I'd love to see Wright given a chance, whether it is as part of the me midfield too or or in the 10, which seems like it's more likely to be his position at the moment. and He's obviously a very talented player and...
Speaker: for a short period last year looked like he might be the answer in the 10, but then that experiment kind of went awry. And then this year, I think he said himself quite recently that I think, well, after the Middlesbrough game, some quite interesting comments about his positioning being better in that, in that 10 role now. So I would like to see him given a chance there.
Speaker: I fear though doing so against Man City, he might not see too much of the ball anyway. so I'd love to see what a Makama or a Torre could do um against a yeah against a Man City. like Would they get a chance? like If they get a chance, are they going to finish it? So I definitely want to see one of those two. Maybe it's a good one to bring Makama back in. I'd love to see a little bit more of Diallo.
Speaker: And other than that, I think just general rotation to maybe save the squad. But you also don't want to rate rotate too much that you then end up embarrassing yourself against Man City. I think ultimately it's probably a game we could do without, but I guess Clamont will see it as a great chance for him and his players to kind of test themselves against the the very best.
Speaker: Yeah, or the you greatest cup victory in our history, as we've already said, could be either. It's got to be midweek Matty, hasn't it, up front? He's dropped from the squad entirely after quite a good performance on on Wednesday, I thought. Dan, looking in particular at our two centre midfielders, just going to come to a couple of questions that we had from listeners.
Speaker: is Well, I'm not saying that you answer yes to this one for Thursday, but is Mirko Topic the answer to our midfield? Should he come in for Kenny with Wright in the 10? That's what Greg asks, but maybe that's more long term. Jonathan Parker says, should we have brought in a better quality midfielder to challenge slash cover Mattson and McLean? Wright is looking like a number 10 now, which leaves us very short of viable options. I guess this is more for kind of league, you know, for the season as a whole.
Speaker: But i suppose it does leave us looking at those two positions for Thursday and saying, can those two players go again? And if not, who are our options going to be? Yes, I sort of repeat myself from earlier, but I do think it's more of a a collective issue than a personnel issue with Kenny and Mattson with the ground they're having to cover.
Speaker: I'm very interested to see how Topic will play on the inner Philippe Clement side, but I just think he's he's probably miles off and from being a ah potential starter. Yeah.
Speaker: we've all seen how like ah long players come back, you know, from take to come back from ACL injuries. He's a couple of months behind Sienaac and Sienaac has only been, you know, trusted with minutes here and there. So he I think he's a a while off that. Um,
Speaker: Yeah, the one i thought our business was good in the summer, but I did say the one area I did want to see us sort of maybe recruiting was a proper number eight, someone um a bit younger and someone being burgled. Is it another dog? I keep hearing thudding. Is there a dog burgling your house downstairs, Craig? That's what we're wondering.
Speaker: Not that I'm aware of, but then I am locked in the room, so i guess I wouldn't know. That's true. Just going to be poor. i haven't heard a dog. I think the dog came from outside. Have you been locked in your room against your will, Craig? By a dog. Do you need us to call anyone? The dog is keeping me hostage.
Speaker: ah Yes, right. i mean i yeah i Personally, I see him as still as a central midfield option. and I thought in pre-season in the MK Dons match, he looked more robust, covered ground better than he he had been. um I would like to see him playing in central midfield, um when we're especially against low blocks when we're seeing a ah lot of the ball and we don't necessarily need Mattson and Kenny's ability to ah cover a lot of ground and break up play. um But I do think maybe really yeah ah a little bit light in in that area, but equally, don't know, there'll be very few teams outside of you know maybe West Ham and Wolves who won't be light in
Speaker: some area and my issue is that we're probably light in the most important area on the pitch in central midfield but I do think it's probably a collective thing and when Clement sorts out that sort of unit we'll see Kenny and Mattson showing how good a pair they are as they were at the end of last season I guess Field kind of being bombed out. Oh, yeah, him too. Yeah, at the den. There we go. know, is that the Russell Martin play badly at the den and never get seen again moment for him? Or is he going to come back on Thursday?
Speaker: Yeah, I mean, um other than that, like, will it's probably going to be a high, heavily heavily counterattacking game. Do we have any hope for Thursday at all? Or are we ah are we all saying out in the cup and then three points on Sunday or or eddie any advances on that?
Speaker: Well, I'll tell you what I'd like to see is our set pieces, i'm going to use the word again, not being apocalyptically bad as they were on Saturday. ah Our attacking set pieces, I mean, Middlesbrough scored, nearly scored from all four of our corners in the first half on Saturday. And that's not hyperbole. They literally created chances from all of them. um And then Wright came on second half and our corners were suddenly a lot better. Fancy that. and So I'd like to see a hint of that at least on ah on Thursday. and then the corner, sorry, Dan, for us in the first half? Was it Kenny? Kenny, yeah. Okay. Yes. um
Speaker: Yeah, i' i'd like but i yeah you just, you cannot see anything happening at Man City, obviously. Okay, different question then. In what minute will we concede the first goal?
Speaker: Opportunity to look like an absolute genius here. ah Whichever minute we have our first corner. Okay, right, right. um I'm jotting it down. Remember this one, listeners. We're clipping that one up for Thursday night. Craig, what do you reckon? I think Torre gets a goal inside 30 seconds and then they eat.
Speaker: they equalise within about 10 seconds of that. While we're celebrating. so we are we Classic Premier League bias. Two goals within the first minute, one either side.
Speaker: It is going to be a lot of quite interesting squad management, this, because there will be a lot of players in that Norwich squad who will be desperate to play on Thursday night. um You know, players who may not have played against opposition sort of that good before. um Whereas I imagine, you know, if we're playing Preston a away way on a Thursday night in the Carabao Cup. they might have their eyes on the league, whereas a lot of players, I think, and and fair enough, especially the younger players will be wanting to start in that game. So i just hope we don't burn ourselves out on Thursday.
Speaker: Yes. Would you rather play Man City or Bolton? it's ah It's a tough one. one OK, well, I think that that wraps up next week. Now, you thought that I'd forgotten about Sophie's word of the week, didn't you? Well, if you had thought that and you thought that Dan had reminded me in the chat and you're dead wrong and that is slanderous. Because here it comes. There will undoubtedly have been a few choice one word responses to Burrow's late winner on Saturday. But fortunately, Sophie, who is our special contributor this season, is somewhat more erudite and will be giving us a more considered take on proceedings for her word of the week.
Speaker: Or maybe she won't and it'll just be shit. You're going to find out in about 13 seconds as we discover Sophie's word of the week.
Speaker: goals.
Speaker: Getting more and more literal, isn't it? Well, that takes us to Kenny Other Business. And there's only one place to start, which is Paul Clinchy, Clinch, who asks, in light of Shane Duffy getting someone to dress up as Katie Price, and thank you very much for framing this question so we don't have to talk about it genuinely, which Norwich City player would you want someone to dress up as and why?
Speaker: So if you're going to a fancy dress party, who would you like, which Norwich City player would you like to see there? um Don't say that you'd never go to a fancy dress party. That's not that's not allowed. Yeah. yeah Oh, clinchy there. I missed out the context of where you're seeing this person dressing up as Norwich player. Yeah, well, yes, I've invented the context. So that it could be someone dressed on Prince of Wales Road. It could be when you go to your nan's for Sunday lunch, someone's there dressed as Paris Mycoma. So ah any any suggestions from the current crop?
Speaker: Well, the current crop, I was going to say... Oh, yeah, that is not stated, I was going say Brian Gunn because you can just stick a little slap head, bald skull thing on the head, put on his iconic 92-94 jersey. That's probably an easy box to tick, isn't it? um I mean, the for Halloween last year, I went to a party dressed as Greg Wallace and I just put a bald cap on and and and a lab cape. And everyone thought you were Brian Gunn. Yeah.
Speaker: What are you doing here, former mayor of Norwich? No, no, no. I'm just that wrong and he used to be on MasterChef. Well, you could take the mayor theme and do either Brian Gunn or Kenny, obviously. That is very true. You can just bring a bottle of Mad Dog and put a hat on. The mayor's hat on and have a bottle of Mad Dog and suddenly you've gone from Brian Gunn to Kenny McLean. Two Scottish legends. Exactly. just One a Scottish accent for the whole night. um Craig, what do you think?
Speaker: I would like to see someone coming across between Vlad the goalkeeper and Vlad the impaler. Oh, that's good. Which elements from both would would you like to see in this?
Speaker: I'll leave it up to their imagination. How how how are you um dressing as Vlad the impaler? What's your weapon? What's your instrument of impaling? ah Well, he used to put people's heads on spikes, so I think it would just be a head on a spike. Not a real head on a spike, obviously. yeah yeah Some kind of paper mache creation, I think, would be best. But yeah, a head on a spike, and then maybe you'd go with goalkeeper gloves, shorts, and football boots.
Speaker: Okay, so a combination of both. And you could do the, what's the thing that Vlad does where he puts his finger to his temple and, you know, like the kind of meditative thing. You could do that with the spike, but obviously not the sharp end.
Speaker: Or the sharp end, but very, very gently. Yeah, yeah. if You don't want to impale yourself. do you do Do you think the lady that Duffy got to dress up as Katie Price also asked, what's your implement of impaling?
Speaker: Maybe i don't think we have to say allegedly either do yeah It's been reported in in the press But allegedly and There may not have been any impaling instruments So that bit is alleged And was she at the game with him the other week? That's what I want to know i Possibly, could have been in the away end Or maybe Katie Price was in the away end We just don't know um I don't think I would want to go Dressed as Shane Duffy though No Or see anyone dressed as Duffy Especially if you were driving there, because you might be tempted to um to drive back home afterwards as well. I'm just looking at photo keys photo photos of Vlad. Obviously, there's no photos of Vlad the Impaler. looking at graphic illustrations of him, and boy, did he have an incredible moustache.
Speaker: i guess it it go It's very thin and curly, but it's no, sorry, not thin, but very long, thick and curly, but not straight. And it kind of comes out further than his ears, say either side.
Speaker: So it's essentially like he's put like a couple of cigars under his under his nose. Well, you know, people said he was just about the impaling, but obviously did a lot for male grooming as well. That's before the days of, you know, moustache wax, presumably. so Yeah, it looks pretty waxed in this. Good on him. Well, good luck with that then, Craig.
Speaker: Lots to work with. Yeah, stick that in your costume. And you can add the Dracula elements as well, given that's who he was inspired by. My God, you know a lot about Vlad the Impaler. Someone's done some Googling. yeah but You have, Dan. Yeah. Just the me doing it off the top of his head. um I think that's probably enough Norwich City players, but do please let us know yours. We've definitely missed out some legends ah over the years, of course. The only other thing I had is Magoma and Musaba both being called into the Democratic Republic of the Congo squad, which was news to me on base er in both shouts. but You think news to them as well? yeah
Speaker: Yeah, so didn't didn't particularly want to go, but so sure, now you've called us up. There's two muscle injuries right there for the international break. I had one, um a real visceral reminder on Saturday how much I hated the USA, USA chant when Josh Sargent was at Norwich. And I said that when he was here as well. I found it very embarrassing. And being on the other side of it, and Millsborough got a couple of players from the US, including one apparently that Claremont said we were in for in January in Berhalter, who I thought was very good, um really did ram home.
Speaker: ah I don't know that if there's been a worse, apart from, you know, hate speech, there's been a worse chant infiltrating English football than the USA USA one over the last few years.
Speaker: None that spring to mind. Try harder at least. Did see Sargent got his first career hat trick at the weekend? Did he? I did not see that. No, we'll cut that out, to be honest, Craig. I don't think we need to. We don't need to know about that.
Speaker: Yeah, it always makes me cringe when you see US fans trying to mimic British chant or like, let's let's say traditional football chants, wherever they're from. So I don't really think we should be doing it the other way around either. We're better than that people. Yeah, back ourselves. We're good at them. Yeah, yeah. if we don't don't This is one area where we do not need to copy US culture. it's good Take everything else from them. um Anyway, I think that that probably wraps us up for this week. Just a reminder that our sub stack is going to be sub stacked this week. Ryan's already written a piece on Vlad. I've already plugged my utterly miserable top 10 later in the week. And we will have something on our numbers 23 and 22 in our top 25. Countdown to bloody big blokes.
Speaker: Just search OTB Norwich to find it and please do subscribe while you're there. Or the Twitter and Instagram at OTB underscore pod underscore NCFC for the much shorter form stuff. But just follow it all. We'll love you for it forever. And what's better than relentless unrequited love, Dan?
Speaker: ah Sorry, I'd zoned out. That's right, nothing. And that will do then for today's podcast. Thank you very much to our guests for tonight. and Dan, thank you for concentrating right up until the last moment there.
Speaker: Yep, no problem. um With you for the full, was it 104 minutes all the way. Try and say something nice, don't know why bother. And Craig, thank you very much for joining us. Lovely to have you back on, mate.
Speaker: Always good to be back on. We'll have to make it not quite so long next time. Thank you everyone for listening. We shall be returning barely 24 hours after Bolton has finished. Until then, never mind the danger.
