Transcript
Speaker: Hello and welcome to OTB, a Norwich City podcast, the Norwich City show that can do it. See? See? I'm Ryan Livermore and on the show tonight, long gone are the days of double game week defeats, calling for people's heads and anger at absent Americans. This is our Norwich City, back with nothing to speak about other than a perfectly serviceable run-of-the-mill championship victory.
Speaker: Just how we like it. Plus, Steve is back with a stat attack and Sophie Leaney has her one word say too on a week which thankfully has gone just fine. The usual regulars are back once again and who can blame them after? Saturday, it's all aboard the 114 point train for our Zoe Morgan. Zoe, has the train left the station?
Speaker: Choo-choo! Take that as a yes. How are you doing? I am good. Thank you, Ryan. Hope you are too. I definitely am after Saturday. Well, about after the first 20 minutes of Saturday anyway, but we're going to come to that very, very shortly.
Speaker: Also returning this week is our analogical influencer, Dan Brigham. Dan, how are you after Saturday? Hi, Ryan. I'm good, thank you. Can we really still get 114 points? We can indeed. That's loads. The rest of our game. many points.
Speaker: Loads. And we're going to score at least 200 goals as well. We might concede 199, but it's going to be fun. What a way to finish mid-table that would be. Oh my goodness. The most vanilla winning 23 games, losing 23, scoring 100, conceding 100. I love it. Slap bang in the middle. ah And I didn't know how to address you, Steve. So I put here, and our statistical slag, Steve's hundreds. Right.
Speaker: um Well, I'd say definitely not like that would be. No, I'm happy to slag it up for this podcast, as you know, Ryan, always. um I should say for the listeners, and without wishing to call out your intro, don't actually have a stat attack ready for the podcast. Right. If you were looking forward to that, then I'm very sorry to just stop listening now. But we do have, to be fair, it it shows to the listeners how hastily arranged all of this is on a Monday because we've got a different feature instead for you to look forward to. And you're going to love it more than boring numbers and stats anyway. So keep listening.
Speaker: That's right. It is a returning feature for this season. How exciting. Just a quick reminder that us at UTB and Norris City Podcast will turn up every week, even if the team doesn't. We are now on Patreon and Substack for all of your extra content, steering you through the 26-27 season. For just £2 a month, you can gain access to exclusive episodes and ad-free content on Patreon, and our free Substack will regularly be updated throughout the season if the written word is as much of your thing as the spoken. one without further ado kicking kicking us off this week it's zoe morgan's bongs
Speaker: well hey
Speaker: Following the Daily Mail's hate piece about Norwich City this week, Philippe Clément has apologised to staff, claiming they have no time to get a haircut. I forgot some people need those, said the remorseful Belgian.
Speaker: Former solution to England's left-sided problems Andy Hinchcliffe proves he's not the solution to England's blindness problems, with claims man trying to head the ball that's right next to him into the net isn't interfering with play.
Speaker: OTB wordsmith Daniel Brigham's description of Anthony Musaba influences the voice of Norris City, Chris Gorham. sapha well what What a brilliant sub to be able to bring on. He's like out of control speedboat, isn't he?
Speaker: And with that, Zoe, I'll come to you first, please. ah That's a bit more like it, isn't it? Oh, what a relief. ah It was, ah yes... so Such a relief, really, to see suddenly a team emerge from that first 20 minutes or so where it kind of looked like we were going to see more of the same that we've seen over the last few weeks. Our problems hadn't gone away. Things were maybe even worse.
Speaker: um Terrible 20 minutes. And then suddenly it was like they'd woken up and all remembered what they could do when they all play together um and when they really give it a go. um And it wasn't even that they just played a little bit better. It was that...
Speaker: It was really nice to see the same qualities that we saw in the team last season that we thought were there sort of hiding all along. And a relief that we had started to get better before Kenny came on, because I do think that that's important. to note that it wasn't just that we only got better when Kenny came on, although we did get a lot better than we had been when Kenny came on, but they they can do it without Kenny. They have to remember that. um
Speaker: And yeah, just nice to see some goals. Nice to see quality performance. Nice to see them keeping their heads towards the end with standing attacks. um Yeah.
Speaker: More of the same, please. I want to give them some credit, Dan, after the slow start, because it would be so easy to kind of assume after the last few weeks that Norwich were just bad. And yes, they they weren't great, but how much credit can you give to them? Because initially, Philippe Clement said that they expected Charlton to set up and press a certain way, and fundamentally, Charlton didn't do that, so Norwich struggled to get a foothold. But Whereas a few weeks ago, they might have crumbled under that. They actually did manage to adapt. And subsequently for the remaining hour, hour 15 minutes or so were in my opinion, anyway, comfortably the better team after that.
Speaker: Yeah, it was abysmal the first 20 minutes. um And as Clement said, after the game, we couldn't work out how they were pressing us. But it wasn't just that. When we did sort of actually break free as well from the press, we we didn't do anything ah particularly useful with the ball apart from Chris Gorin's one chance. um But yeah, for a team that's what we're on the back of six straight defeats in League and Cup,
Speaker: I think to pick be able to pick their heads up when going 1-0 down pretty early and playing that badly um to sort of work their way back into the game slowly and but surely get a foothold in into it, I think we do have to give um that team a lot of credit for that I do think it might have been a different story if it had been at home because you can imagine understandably sort of the crowd not quite sticking ah ah sticking with them in a way that an away support does ah stick with their team for for longer so I do think maybe it was beneficial that they were away from home and
Speaker: and yeah And then within sort of the last 10-15 minutes the first half, we had sort of glimpses of what we were good at last season. um And then in the second half, sort of it felt like a really sort of professional performance um with the big caveat that Charlton were absolutely dog shit um offered absolutely nothing going forward and we still looked pretty dodgy uh when they got into or pretty dodgy allowing them to get into decent positions and then they and then we defended our box pretty well and they didn't really make much of getting into those decent um positions um
Speaker: the The starting lineup, if you'd said that at the start of the season, that was going to be our back five. That was the stuff of nightmares where we've got our what we thought was our second choice right back, not one of our first two choice centre backs, our second choice goalkeeper in there as well. i'm not so I'm still not convinced that we'll probably see that back five too much this season going forward. But you can't argue, you know, after a couple of dodgy moments from Darling um and Grimshaw early on that, you know, they both also grew into the game and had a really positive effect on ah on a very decent performance.
Speaker: there are a few aspects of the selection I want to talk about, Steve. ah Most will come on to the defense in a, in a second, but most notably, uh, the, the pairing of a number nine and a number 10 has been up for debate through the entirety of this campaign because no one in particular can make that number 10 position stick. And on Saturday we saw Chris Garan as the nine Magoma is the 10. And I thought it was Magoma's probably his best game at a Norwich shirt. I thought he was all round excellent. Um,
Speaker: Is that the way to go from now on? Because we've we've spoken a lot as well about it being a Torre v Makama kind of debate. Obviously, Torre's injured. Makama hasn't quite got back up to speed. But Kvist-Goran does seem to almost offer something that those guys both do at the same time. But they they don't as well. Yeah, I'm...
Speaker: I suppose, well, we've seen it often and enough as Norwich City fans where the team goes on a bad run and the manager is just looking for solutions in terms of the starting line-up. And that might even have been, i just suspect there was some tactical element of it as well in terms of the line-up on Saturday, but that might even have been what Saturday was, just trying to find something that would work. It might be that we've stumbled upon it. I i personally don't think so.
Speaker: I mean, Magom been pushing for a start in the 10 for a while. I think he he got a game there against Swansea, but Slimani has not really been doing it this season. And actually, I think, and I may have said this before a couple of weeks ago, but i think Magoma just gives us more control because he likes to hold on to the ball a bit more. Slimani is much more a kind of neat touches and flicks and that kind of thing, which is good maybe when you're playing on the counter. But in a game like Saturday where we were looking to have control ball, Magoma is a much better suit um much better fit for for that kind of
Speaker: for that kind of style of play Chris Goran, yeah, he doesn't really seem Clermont compatible, but I'm not sure Makama's 100% fit at the moment. Still doesn't seem to be quite there. So Chris Goran deserves to have that shirt. And the thing that happens when you get finally get a good performance in a win after um ah run of of really, let's be honest, abysmal performances we're now in that position of, okay, well, go out there and do it again. That might be what we see against Watford because there's no real reason to change what we saw other than obviously, you know Kenny walks into the team always. um
Speaker: But those two really, you know, they weren't sort of brilliant for the entirety of the game, but they were good when it mattered. And that's sort of what Norwich need at the moment. So they've deserved to be in there again on Saturday, and I guess, until things start going wrong.
Speaker: Can I just add to that? Sorry, that um I thought it was actually a megoma and or a different pair of Magoma. Magoma and Brooks, that was um stood out for me. Now, I've not looked how many times they did actually combine, but from the eye test, it looked like they've got a bit of a natural synergy between them, a bit like Ahmed and Slimani last season, seemed to sort of enjoy playing with each other.
Speaker: I thought they gave us... a bit more sort of give and go around the box than we've had this season. to Two men who are sort of very comfortable um on the ball um and exchanging passes like that as well. so that And since the international break, that sort of disconnect between the front four has been and incredibly noticeable. So it was nice to see that there was some really nice connection between two of us with attacking ball, three of our attacking players, if you include Chris Gorin in that as well.
Speaker: Yeah, there was a point during the second half where um the broadcasters put up ah a graphic and I think Norwich had something like 46% of their attacks in the game went down that right-hand side and I noticed a lot that Magoma and Brooks would interchange as well. So I think if you've got the chance to kind of overload in those areas, particularly we give Jack Stacey a lot of flack on this podcast, but he when he is having a good game and can bomb um ah bomb on as well, you get a 3v2 down that right-hand side than a...
Speaker: I think yeah the opposition are in a lot of trouble. um Zoe, let's talk about the defensive selection. We we on this podcast all praised Hosde Cordoba as being the best of a bad bunch, admittedly, against ah against Portsmouth. But he was dropped for Harry Darling. um How much of a surprise was that? And ultimately, does the result justify that selection?
Speaker: I mean, it it was a massive shock. It was Cordoba's best game of the season, I think, in that in that last game. um So, yeah, to see him dropped after that when he could have probably legitimately been dropped at most other points of the season when he had played. um So it was a big shock. And I suppose the result would say Clermont got it spot on. um it That was the right call. um I mean, darling...
Speaker: Darling offers a lot, but is missing some of the things that Cordoba's got, right? He's not particularly enterprising. He's not ah um fast. um And there were a few times that it felt like he was going to get caught out.
Speaker: We had a couple of instances where it looked like he'd sort of stopped to leave the ball for somebody else to sort out or to to deal with, um which you know can really make you look a bit daft as ah as a defensive unit as well. um But they got away with it. And and he does offer a certain amount of solidity and that experience, I think, that when you are ahead in the game, um I think does potentially help keep you ahead in the game. Um, so yeah, can't complain too much. I think, uh, just going back to Jack Stacy, I thought he was excellent. I do know he gets a lot of flack. Um, lovely boy though. He does a lot of work in the community. Um, and he, I thought, yeah, he thought he played really well. Um, and I guess we might go on to talk about the goalkeeping selection, but the That was not something I was particularly impressed with probably when the teams came out. um But again, can't really argue with what happened during the game. So um I guess we've got to trust. We've got to trust Big Phil and got to trust the process. I think Darling for me is the one that if you were going to change something, again, apart from bringing in Kenny, which is obviously going to happen, and then that's that's probably what I would do purely because I think he suited, as Zoe kind of talked about, that game state where we had something to hold on to. And he is excellent, I think, in that situation. But my God, he was bad for that first time.
Speaker: I mean, the goal was not good. I still think, and I know you said this as well, Ryan, that Schwartau got a very lightly from the commentary team. ah if If I was going to rank who was at fault for that goal, I would have Schwartau number one, then Darling, and then Grimshaw, who, to be honest, I think just made a split decision and it didn't work out for him. But...
Speaker: ah ah it It's odd with the defensive players because I a sort of feel like long term, if we're going to have a successful season, you probably need Vlad, you probably need Fischer and you probably need Cordoba just because we've seen how good they can be.
Speaker: Right now, it might not be a bad thing for them to be sitting out for a little while. They don't really deserve to be in based on their performances this season. And I do wonder if part of the reason we won was because having someone one like Darling, who actually I think can, when he's good, make other players around him better, that probably did help. But I'm not sure his overall performance was that good. But then I've seen people on social media saying he was really good. So, you know, what what do I know? um But I think I probably would bring Cordoba back in before long.
Speaker: There was a point ah ah just after he'd given away the ball for the goal where he then chose to play everything long and it felt like it was going to irrespective of the short options around him. And that's sort of the, don't want to question his mentality because I think he did grow into the game as things went on, particularly as Norwich, but we're in the ascendancy. But there is that worry of when you do need someone to kind of calm it down and still knock the ball around and not sacrifice what you' the team are trying to do.
Speaker: um you you can't have someone who's going to kind of put that all of about out the window because they've made a bad pass you know but i mean it ultimately it paid off because norage won the game um so i did one of the uh great hoofs as well as the uh the dying seconds of the game just absolutely like both legs off the floor got that felt great didn't it literally i was going to talk about growing his game first minute he just let a ball go over his head left it for his center back partnership partner and uh charlton striker was in and then he finished the game by doing a scissor kick hoof into the stand it's amazing what confidence can do for a footballer i wish there was a closer microphone because i could i bet anything he just went decanio as he left it back High up into the air. um Let's go on to the goalkeeping situation, Dan, because Dan Grimshaw did start and I thought he did pretty well. I agree with Steve. I think he was the least culpable for the goal. I can understand why he did rush off his line. Was it the right decision make?
Speaker: No, but there are some instances where you put that pressure on the forward and they they do end up um skying it or doing a heavy touch. But I thought that aside, very assured in his handling. I thought his his kicking again was excellent. And we said it on the last pod as well. There's not really a reason to take him out of the team, is there?
Speaker: No, I think you're both being quite generous to that split-second decision because that's what you know what we judge footballers on and he's made a split-second decision that's cost us a goal. I would also put Schwarzau ahead of him in the blame game there though because he was so leaden um and looking back, at i think I think that's a fine pass for Darling to any centre-back to make into that area. is You see that happen a lot. Yeah. But yeah, ah I thought he he's been he has done what you expect of your goalkeeper. And unfortunately, we haven't been able to say that about Vlad this season.
Speaker: Vlad has not done what you expect of your goalkeeper in the majority of matches. Whereas last season, i think we all agree, he um he was generally very good and won us more points than he lost this season. Vlad has struggled. I really like that...
Speaker: um Although his kicking and passing stats aren't actually as good as Vlad's, I think Grimshaw finds players in better space than Vlad does on pretty small sample size because he's he's not played that often for us. But I think he starts attacks in a way that I don't really see with Vlad.
Speaker: His handling, yeah as you say, has been... Fine, because I don't remember him really handling anything in his Carabao Cup performances last season and earlier this season. he looks comfort he looks well He's certainly not um he's not your Jordan Pickford sort of scale of goalkeepers where he's just muttering to himself and slapping himself in the face all the time. So he is a bit more of a calming presence than Vlad.
Speaker: Has he got the ceiling Vlad has? i don't think he has. And I think if we're going to have a successful season, it probably, as Steve says, we'll end up with Vlad back in goal. But Vlad, the chasm between his good performances and his bad performances is enormous. And at the moment, we need someone who is putting in decent performances and Grimshaw has done that um and does and will deserve to keep his place, I think, in the next game.
Speaker: It's all very well saying that it's the right thing to do, but seeing Vlad on the bench, I just don't think it feels like he just needs, I don't know, you can't see this sort of brooding, beautiful man just being shackled on the bench without the ability to go and play. and practices craft uh it just yeah doesn't feel right so i hope he gets i hope he can work his way back in the team i do think he's in clement's ear ask like put me up top gaffer i was going to say what are the odds of him doing a david james and going up front for one game well we've not got uh medic anymore have we so uh you never know Just a couple more strikers away, injuries away from him. I did feel a bit bad for him when, I mean, nice for Grimshaw to get his name chanted by the fans, but I did think Vlad would have been thinking, I've been here for season and a I've saved three penalties for you, Bastard, and you've never chanted my name once. And Grimmy slides out the feet of a few Charlton strikers and gets it. But yeah, don't know what.
Speaker: nice Nice for Grimshaw to get some recognition from the away fans behind. Context is obviously important when assessing players and we're we're all guilty of it. But if Vlad had put in that Grimshaw performance, people would be slagging Vlad off for the concession. Whereas everyone's saying what an excellent game Grimshaw had. Some people giving him man of the match and that kind of thing. that That does not happen if Vlad makes the same mistake he makes, I think. But, you know, that he's only got himself to blame for that, really.
Speaker: Yeah, agreed, agreed. ah Steve, you've been tooting the Kenny Horn this pod so far. Does he come straight back in if Mattson and Wright are both fit?
Speaker: No, no, no. i' keep ah I mean, well... Perhaps the question should be who for then? that would Yeah, that is a good question. I suppose Mattson's fitness, like ah he went off with contact. Crampy hamstrings. tight like Crampy hamstrings, quote, Big Phil.
Speaker: So obviously, if that doesn't sound like a sort of major issue. That sounds like something they should be able to work out within the week. But who knows with our medical team? So obviously, depend dependent on that.
Speaker: And again, you kind of feel like a McLean-Matson partnership is too good to pass up on when it works well, which is a little bit unfortunate for Jacob Wright, who I also thought was really good on Saturday, much better than he has been in in recent weeks.
Speaker: But yeah, I mean, you just like, I think within sort of the first five minutes, Kenny kind of calmly picked up the ball, pivoted and and played a ah really accurate forward pass and and just adds that stability. you know, I know we were talking about, has it have his legs gone before the for the unfortunate moment where his his legs actually did go.
Speaker: but ah eight eight what more evidence do you need from the last few weeks to than what we've seen to suggest that he is our best player or our most important player for sure?
Speaker: And he he must start at all costs. I think, you know, his leadership, his calmness and his ability, I think more importantly than anything else, to pick the ball up and play through the lines, which are the rest of our midfield, a good though they are, just cannot do.
Speaker: It does make me think, you know, the man's going to be 35 in January. What is our long-term solution for this? I don't know if we'll have one by the time he leaves, but that's probably a problem for further down the line. For now, he must play and it's great to have him back.
Speaker: There's another man that you can't leave shackled on the bench. Those pointing those pointing fingers were ah unleashed as soon as he came he came on. He was pointing all over the place. yeah i think it's um I think that ah if you look at I mean, I didn't watch Kenny at Wright's and Mattson's age, but I think Mattson and Wright are probably further advanced than Kenny was at 20 and however old.
Speaker: Mattson is 23, 24. um So I do think those two players have a lot to grow and a lot to develop. But it was noticeable in the first half when Mattson or Wright were on the ball and had forward options but would take the safer sideways or backwards pass.
Speaker: and as Steve says, as soon as Kenny came on, one touch... beat like ball which took out a couple of Charlton players and got us on the front foot. And that's just what he is very, very good at. um Whether he was good at that at Wright and Mattson's age, I don't know, but I suspect not because he has got better at that sort of... that first time passing throughout his career at Norwich.
Speaker: But it's he is leading the championship stats for breaking the lines by absolute miles this season, Kenny is. It's um no coincidence that we have, in his absence, barely registered like any really great chances since the international break. um And I i know like it's just only really because of his age that we talk about this, but lots of teams rely on one or two really good players. And if they drop out, they suffer, like Kane and Bellingham for England, Buendia, Pukki for Farker's team, Hux for Worthington's team, Holt and Wes for um Lambert's team's. It's just natural. Most teams will have this and we are a better we are a better ah side with Kenny in it. um As evidenced by, I noted him down some, since returning to the Championship, Norwich won only two of the 27 league games in which Kenny hasn't been in the squad.
Speaker: um losing 23 of those 27. And on Sky, they showed that since then, since returning to the championship, our win ratio when Kenny starts is 42% and only 15% when he doesn't start. So he is an unbelievably important player at this level. And I don't think there's any shame in the fact that we are a better side with him in. But what I would say is I do think since Wright's come in, he has shown that it might not be this season...
Speaker: It might not even be next season, but I think his development could lead him to that position where he will take more risks on the ball and he will become that natural heir to Kenny McLean, potentially.
Speaker: I've seen a lot of people lamenting the idea that we haven't found a replacement for Kenny yet. And what infuriates me is I think that kind of does a disturb a disservice to just how good Kenny is, because if you're getting a player... That's what trying to say, but you've just said it much more elegantly than I And eloquently as well. But the thing the thing is, is is if you're if you want a player who's the age profile of let's say, 23 to 28, who does what Kenny McLean does, you are going to be paying 10, 15, 20 million pounds in this market for It's as simple as that. like i I think, like you say, Dan, it it's an age thing. I think it's the fact he's been here for so long that we kind of
Speaker: We're almost not taking him for granted, but we're used to what he does. But I think there are so many teams in this division that would love to have a player who can essentially coach their team through the game, who would love to make those progressive passes, who has that influence on and off the pitch, which i I think he's another one who, in a similar way, when we lost Teddy, we couldn't replace Teddy for ages. I think... When Kenny goes, you just won't be able to replace him purely on the basis of that. He has, particularly in his cycle at Norwich, become an excellent, an excellent championship player, if if nothing else. And one would argue could play in a team in a higher division with better players around him as well. It's no coincidence that Eckert at Stampton and Messina at Portsmouth have both sort of said along the same lines that we're you know lucky to have played against Norwich team without Kenny and he's because he sets our rhythm and he sets our tempo. yeah i mean, obviously he'll do something stupid every game, but we love him for that. And show me a Championship midfielder that or even a Premier League midfielder that doesn't. Yeah, 100%.
Speaker: And he apologises for it as well. Yeah, he he's very ah self-aware, isn't he? That's a good thing. Yeah. um Zoe, let's let's ah it wouldn't be a championship game without talking about the officiating. ah Charlton were incensed that Rory McConville's own goal was ruled out for offside, which when you break it down, sounds like a weird sentence to say. However, looking at it, it rightfully disallowed, right?
Speaker: It was definitely offside. um I was absolutely baffled watching it that there seemed to be so much discussion around it. think you could clearly say see that the Charlton player was in an offside position. They had the helpful um use of the six yard line to show when you know when you've got one person's foot that's on one side of the line and nobody else's, it's pretty clear indication. Plus he was leaning forwards.
Speaker: But yeah, the the the following discussion about whether he was interfering with play, you know, when you just sort of question everything that you thought you knew about the rules of football. I mean, I don't know that much, but ah I'm pretty sure I know that if you are literally trying to head the ball into the net, you're ah while stood next to the player whose head it does come off, that is interfering with play. There is no question about that.
Speaker: um And it did only seem to be Andy Hintcliffe that didn't understand that and some Charlton fans. But, you know, i imagine we'd have got a bit up in arms about it for no apparent reason just because we were upset about it. But if it had had been the other way.
Speaker: But yeah, absolutely mystifying. And then I enjoyed... ah when they went back to the studio and and started chatting to Robert Green about it, he was like, pretty clear, right? its it's like He's tried to head that in. So, um yeah, I mean, it wasn't a perfect...
Speaker: offfficiating officiating performance. um But that one, they definitely did get right. And and quite a you know a very good decision actually, given it's ah you know there's a lot of people put bodies in the mix, um you know going back to split second decisions. That was one they did get right.
Speaker: I really enjoyed McConville's ah face going from the one expression when he thought he had scored an own goal to exactly the same expression when he realised he hasn't scored an own goal when they can kick off again. His face just does not change whatsoever. He's got very deft eyes sometimes, hasn't he?
Speaker: but i think it's I think it's slightly insulting to Rory McConville to suggest that he would have just headed it into his own goal had Charlie Calderon not been there. It was a weird... I was what i mean, i guess we would say this being Norwich fans, but and I was sort of sitting in there thinking, maybe it's just me, but...
Speaker: I mean, my my my sort of Matt Letizier, Tim Foyle hat conspiracy theory is that um actually the the authorities is quite happy with VAR being in place because it's um you get this kind of you get this controversy out of things. And actually that gets people talking and the currency of football is is debate and is making people angry in the same way it is on social media. And I think there's a bit of that on Sky as well. Like, I'm sure that they lean into disagreeing with refereeing decisions just because.
Speaker: So I don't know. either andy Maybe I'm being kind to Andy Hinchcliffe here, but either he's doing that or he's just very thick and doesn't understand the rules of football. But you kind of think he must have been able to tell that man standing offside and interfering with play equals offside.
Speaker: i We got away with one in that it was a tight call and it could have gone the other way had it not been a good decision. But equally, could have had a penalty at the other end as well. so you know Both teams, I think, should have had a penalty. The Samfield pullback is an unbelievably obvious penalty. I can't believe that wasn't given. 100%.
Speaker: you want to hear my fun I-mugged-off-Andy Hinchcliffe-once story? Of course.
Speaker: met Andy Hinchcliffe at the hospitality of an England cricket game. um I was working. I was not there in hospitality. um And he was there with somebody I knew. um and I didn't know, I didn't recognise him because, you know, who knows what Andy Hinchcliffe looks like a few a couple of decades on. um So I said to him, I'll tell you who you look like.
Speaker: ah Former England goalkeeper Robert Green. LAUGHTER And he seemed quite annoyed because then it was like, well, actually, I'm former a solution to England's left-sided problems, Andy Hinchcliffe. I was like, oh, yeah, but you do look quite a lot like Robert Greene, though. Well, they've got always got very opposing views on what offside constitutes, and maybe that was why he was so annoyed.
Speaker: do Do you think he's regaled that story to the of the producers at Sky, and that's why they booked Robert Greene for that game? Well, just to really wind him up. His disappointment suggested it had happened before, i would say. as well Maybe they got confused and meant to put Robert Greene in the comments. Is that not Greene? Oh, it's the guy who doesn't know the rules. Oh, no. All right, shall we have Sophie Leaney's word of the week? MUSIC
Speaker: Belief.
Speaker: And returning for the second time this season is Kids Scorum. I'll hand it over to you, please, Steve. i mean, just have another jingle, everyone. Lansbury's Corner has gone all the way through.
Speaker: Chance! Blackton and Lion!
Speaker: It makes me so anxious. I thought it was my mic messing up again for a second. Yeah, I thought the audio was anxiety inducing enough, but that takes me another level. i Thank you, Ryan. and Yes, I believe the children are our future. Teach them well and let them lead the way. Not my words, but the words of Whitney Houston.
Speaker: And since he was here to cut the ribbon on our newest feature, Kids Gorham, a few weeks ago, it's become one of Chris Gorham's favourite quotes too, knowing as he does, that the importance of talented commentators is just as important to society as the next generation of doctors, police officers and high-performance keynote speakers. So what the hell is Kids Gorham then? Well, it's really bloody simple, actually. We put a child to work by asking them to commentate on a Norwich City goal, and the panel just have to guess which goal they're providing the commentary for. If they can guess correctly, the prize is the thing every child most covets, an imaginary friend. So... Eight-year-old Jasper has once again provided the excellent soundtrack to our goal with the help of the Lightning Seeds. um All I will say as a clue for this one is it's probably not ah like a classic Norwich City goal.
Speaker: but no So I'm really relying on Ryan for this one. No pressure though. and So take it away jasper Sardin tries to get in the way, less defender. He doesn't need to because Fisher runs in front. ah Shot blocked.
Speaker: Back on the half volley! And he slid it into the bottom corner. That is a beautiful goal. And the Norwich City fans in the Barkley end are going crazy.
Speaker: It is 1-0. So there you go. Which game and a weny cow had a cow in anything? Was it Anthony Moussaba? Well, the Portsmouth fans did bring their cowbell last Saturday as well, so it might have been from that game.
Speaker: I did tell Jepha not to record it in a farm. But no, the the cow noises were added on after, just in case anyone is confused, to disguise the identity of the goalscorer. Would you like it again?
Speaker: Yeah. yeah Cool. and Probably should have said this the first time around. Listen closely to the first few seconds. Sargent tried to get in way, less defender. He doesn't need to because Fisher runs in front. ah Shot blocked.
Speaker: Back on the half volley! And he slid it into the bottom corner. That is a beautiful goal. And the Norwich City fans in the Barclay end are going crazy.
Speaker: It is 1-0. So that was Sargent. Because I heard was Sutton, so that really... i heard I thought it was Sutton to begin with, and then I realised that I don't think they played in the same team. I think they just missed each other. gap Okay, my another clue, the Barkley were not going crazy. Well, maybe they were actually at the end of this game, but for a slightly different reason. Oh...
Speaker: and Goal against Leicester? Correct. Yes. The word Leicester was in there, but because Jasper was doing it quickly, it was quite difficult. Manning's last game.
Speaker: Also correct. I still can't remember the goal, but it's just the Barkley going crazy. Fisher was involved. Fisher was involved. and you Can any of you remember who scored the last goal? Ryan is nodding. I can. I can. It was Kvistgaran.
Speaker: It was Kvistgaran. So I think we'll we'll call that ah that's a joint effort. Dan with the assist. Dan with the Rory McConville cross into the box and Ryan with the the the header into the net. That was the answer. So, yeah, not a classic, if anything, a a reminder of truly miserable times, but maybe maybe helpful to um to remember that actually the slump that we were that we were previously on could have ended up that way. But it's not going to you now because we're just going keep winning. um So, yes, thank you, Jasper, for that excellent a bit of commentary. Thanks, Jasper. Thank you, Jasper.
Speaker: If you at home would like to have your child, or maybe you are a child, and you would like to feature soon-to-be award-winning podcast, and then please send your entries into ontheball1902atgmail.com. Should have checked this. I made a note to myself to check this before we went out.
Speaker: ontheball1902atgmail.com. Nod at me if that sounds right. No. Nobody knows. think it might have the word podcast in it. Oh, it is, yeah. It's on the ball pod. On the ball pod. 1992. Yeah, so ignore the one that I said twice and send it to that one instead. On the ball pod, 1902 at gmail.com. I told you the admin for this was all done last minute. If it's usable, then God knows we will use it. So thank you very much.
Speaker: It's the only way through. Chance! Black and white! It's going to be great!
Speaker: Gotta turn that down. I should say, by the way, excellent commentary from Jasper. They're very good. Yes, very good. bar high Overshadowed, though, by the fact that I'm pretty sure that MI5 used that jingle for a torture training. so Thank you for that.
Speaker: ah Hello there, Yellow Brick Road. Norwich City are back at home this All Hallows Eve for the midday visit of another side flattering to deceive for the most part as Watford visit Cowra Road. The Hornets are seeing a somewhat of a crisis club this season. A place below Norwich, one win in five. The joint lowest score is in the championship with just 10, one of those from outside the penalty area and just a single away point to their name so far this campaign.
Speaker: ah Zoe, Watford have had a lot of like club legends and icons come out recently, basically ah slating the way the club is run. And from a Norwich perspective, is it kind of the perfect home fixture to really build on the Charlton win?
Speaker: I mean, from one perspective, certainly from the perspective of ah we like to play other teams back into form. You might think ah the the worst possible team we could have coming along. um Watford, I mean, I've said this many times over the years on this podcast, we have this uncanny ability just to be sort of almost...
Speaker: within two or three places of Watford in the league at any given time, no matter what the league is. Um, and for that reason, they really do my head in. um and I do always have a sort of thing in the back of my mind of like, as long as we finish above Watford, that is one step we have taken. Um, they seem to be very bad. Um, I mean, that's how we've seemed recently. So, um perhaps that's no real measure. um But they did have that funny thing a couple of games ago where it seemed like they'd sacked their manager mid-game and then sort of changed their mind, or that wasn't quite true. So they do still have their manager, which is, it was quite something for them. um
Speaker: But I think it'd be a good, think it's a good measure of whether Saturday was a bit of a flash in the pan or whether we can get some momentum because it's a really good opportunity to try and build from Saturday and take it forward.
Speaker: It's another 12.30 kickoff. um Those have treated us well in the past, so hopefully that happens again. um And yeah, just...
Speaker: take the opportunity um and to try and build something um and just have happy fans at the end. i can't bear any more booing or telling people they're not fit to wear the shirt or any of that.
Speaker: We sort of alluded to it in the Charlton chat, Steve. ah How crucial is a fast start on Saturday? Because it feels an awful lot like had we had the start we had on Saturday at home, the result would have been very, very different. And is there a risk now that Carrow Road is a place that some of the players are perhaps quite intimidated to play at as the home team as as much as the away team might be?
Speaker: Well, I'd love to say a first start is crucial, but we scored in the first minute against Burrow and lost the first five minutes against Bolton and lost and conceded in the first 10 minutes on Saturday and won. So I have no idea really, but there's no doubt that, ah that our recent results at home means that we need to give the fans something to get behind and not scoring against Southampton and Portsmouth. Not ideal. I think we'd all agree.
Speaker: I, this is a, this feels like a massive game actually, Because the the game um the performance on Saturday should be a springboard, really. As Zoe said at the top of the show, we we were really good in that performance. It's the most we've looked like last season's Norwich City, I think, that after the first 20 minutes, we had control of that game. we We had more confidence. We defended resolutely. There were good patterns to our play. We looked good on the counter.
Speaker: So we really do need to take that into the next couple of games against Watford and Derby, two of the relatively few sides who are below us in the table. Nice to play Watford ah before they inevitably sack their manager as well.
Speaker: i I can never feel confident against Watford. I don't know what it is. As Zoe says, we're all they're always there or thereabouts. was just looking at our recent result. We haven't had any draws full stop recently, but it's 20 games today. since we last drew against them, either they're on a good run against us or we're on a good run against them. And they, they kind of, they did the double over us sort of by stealth last season without playing particularly well in either game, but they were 21st in form in the championship after they beat us last season. And I think, what are they 21st at the moment in the table as well? yeah Yeah. So they haven't been very good for a long time.
Speaker: We're at home. We've just won. And we look like we've got a bit of rhythm about us. We should be looking to win this game. And i you know if we sat here next week bemoaning a loss, it really would be quite disheartening because it does feel like this should be the moment where we kick it where we kick into our stride again.
Speaker: Dan, winning on Saturday won't repair the damage that has been done so far this season, but it feels like a necessary thing to get over the line in order to start repairing that damage. how Is it possible to overstate the importance of a home win? Because as as we saw last season, it can get very volatile very quickly at Carrow Road at points.
Speaker: Yeah, as I said earlier, I do think a start on Saturday, if it been at home, I think would have had a worse effect on the players in a way. Clement referenced it afterwards as well, sort of as he likes to say and sort of very knowingly say now, it's the youngest team in the division and one player going down from getting booed can then have a domino effect on on other players and throughout the team as well. That was a domino there, wasn't it? You didn't hear that. Oh, did I hear that? Yeah. nice to bring in some sound effects.
Speaker: um and um And I think, i as I've said before in the podcast, I think with such young team, confidence is big issue. It can oscillate pretty wildly um when teams are so young.
Speaker: um And we sort spoke about this sort of run of fixtures, starting with the defeat at Portsmouth being sort of kinder, in terms of table position anyway, um and an opportunity to pick up some points and not only points but confidence as well and we've seen what this team can do when confident we saw that under Clement last season um and we saw that in this especially in the second half on Saturday as well a team playing with more confidence who are sort of more sure on the ball um taking sort of bigger risks when going forward as well a bit more clinical with their passing and So yeah, I think it's, ah so as Steve says, it's it's pretty massive. I do think the next two games as well have proper along-come Norwich vibes to them because not only are Cardiff, sorry, we're not playing Cardiff, Watford winless away from home this season, but Derby are winless at home. So we're playing two teams winless essentially home and a away when we're coming up against them next. um
Speaker: And I was having a look at Watford's sort of numbers earlier and they are bottom of the XG table as well. So it's not like they sort of their performances are better than their results are saying. and Maybe that's why Elton's got involved. Maybe he's a big fan of XG and that was the final straw seeing them bottom of that table. so i do But i do think it's a proper opportunity now.
Speaker: um And I think a fast start is quite important to get the crowd behind them. We did not have a fast start against Portsmouth. It's Barry and Sipid, which is very disappointing, as we spoke about on last week's um pod. So I do want us to see us, I do you want to see us sort of come out of the blocks pretty fast. And I think if Kenny is starting, we we will see that as well.
Speaker: But like like both Zoe and Steve, they're such weird, niggly games against Watford. Maybe it's because it's we both play in yellow or something. So there's we on us we want to be the pride of the colour yellow in the in the division, but they never seem very enjoyable, games against Watford. But I do think we're probably they're probably in a more precarious position than we are. There's more pressure on them, which hopefully will aid our confidence as well.
Speaker: After you've said that, I look forward to our five four win. We'll take it. yeah ah Zoe, what do we think? Three points? Yeah, three points. five ne Good stuff.
Speaker: Steve? Yeah, I do think so. i do. but I did against Portsmouth and Bolton as well. now Yeah, ah let's say three points. God, it's the most unconvincing anyone's sounded about a win. Yeah, I believe that this team have turned a corner.
Speaker: Three for three, Dan? Yes, I think so. i know i we do play teams into form, like Zoe says, but you know we had the opportunity to do that against Charlton and pass that opportunity over. um So I do think we'll we'll go back to back.
Speaker: I agree, I think. 2-0 is my prediction. 2-0. We're not going to concede. Oh, clean she. I know. Clean she. Dan Grimshaw will get an assist as well. No, I'm not going to go that far. But he'll get a clean she. He'll get a clean she.
Speaker: ah That leads us on to Kenny, other business. Just the one thing from me, Norris city women won in the FA cup yesterday. Goals from grace, Riglar, faith, Harrison, Sienna booty, and a double from Izzy Moore secured a five to win over Reddit borough with the Canaries facing Bournemouth at home in the next round, as it was confirmed about an hour ago.
Speaker: ah anything else guys from the weekend? Yeah. I would like to say a happy retirement to Norwich legend Timu Pukki, who has hung up his boots. um A real, ah just ah and it our greatest free signing ever. I think, you know, people say that, but it's surely true.
Speaker: Brought a huge amount of joy. Seemed to have like ah such a strong connection with the fan base here. A man who obviously could look unbelievably miserable when things weren't going right, but so full of so full of joy when things were going well. um So yeah, go well.
Speaker: it It was incredibly Timu Pukki that he he put on his retirement statement that there were times when I have not enjoyed this. Do you guys remember Dean Smith? it's right Yeah, you didn't have to say that, but it's, you know, it feels on brand that you did quite finish that I don't know. Yeah, very finish. Kind of playing it down. Yeah, um I'll keep my powder dry just in case he comes up on our top 25. But I think probably maybe the championships best pre signing. Yeah, I don't have all of the championship pre signings.
Speaker: And as surprising as that may sound, but there can't be many who have had that kind of impact. Yeah, if you're interested, I've got him number moo in my list. but Also, Michael Bailey went out to Finland, I remember, to do a special piece on Teemu back in his heyday. So, you know, takes a great player. Whose heyday, Michael's or Teemu's?
Speaker: I think they coincided. It was before we got stuck in a vending machine. Michael, not Teemu. So... That piece is on The Athletic, if would like to read it, everyone. The vending machine. Michael Bailey, my 4,000 days in a vending machine. 4,000 words on 4,000 days. Delia's on the podcast trail. Lovely to see her and talking about some wonderful memories of Michael Wynne-Jones as well. She's got a book out. So, Delia, if you do want to come on... a nor of city podcast uh we are available um this one has got a woman as part of it so that's that's that's good um and if we were on the traitors we wouldn't have gone out first either so you know
Speaker: yeah uh we could get her to do her top 25 Oh, that'd be a coup, wouldn't it? It would be a hell of a coup. I would love to know who Delia's favourite Norwich City player is. i Well, I don't know about her favourite player, but I do think Alex Neal was her favourite manager. I do think she's she had a very soft spot for Alex Neal. What makes you say that?
Speaker: I don't know. She's just always, that there's all these stories about how she used she really looked after him when he came down. I think they saw it as like they'd taken this bold move and so they needed it to work. So they sort of properly looked after him. They looked after his family when they came down to stay.
Speaker: um I have the very vivid memory of Alex Neal hugging Delia's mum when we won at Wembley. Just, I don't know, there was always, it felt like there was a connection there. And when Alex Neal's spoken about Delia, it seems very fond. um So yeah, that's, I mean, based on absolutely nothing other than my speculation, I've always thought she cared a lot about Alex Neal. And how did he repay them? With a 240p video in his back garden.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I guess it's a one-way relationship, eh, Alex? ah We've had loads of questions this week, so thank you to everyone for sending me. Why are we surprised? I couldn't believe it either. I feel like I should really... We haven't talked about the Paris Maguimo celebration yet. Nick Dye has asked, was Paris' celebration a bit of a passive-aggressive Nelson Oliveira for not making the XI for a while? Which, maybe. don't know. is he just too cool to celebrate? Not sure.
Speaker: I thought ah some of it some of it was, ah as the kids say, aura farming. That was the worst thing I've ever said. For these old people, what does that mean? yeah Attention grabbing? Are we talking about cows again here? uming or a farming simulator it the newest yeah newest dad basically trying to look trying to look cool is is the the boomer way of way of saying it sure yeah yeah so we don't need to read too much into it as well but then but then people were saying maybe it's him kind of
Speaker: not giving a crap because of the instagram situation where he posted on tiktok as well where he posted videos of him driving or photos of him driving in his car and a load of people were kind of slating him for it in the comments and some were tagging the police in there as well it's like a bit of a a bit of a bit was he just aura farming then points farming Court summons Farming. Yeah. The last non-celebration from Norwich player I can remember like that was Wes at Aston Villa. And he definitely did have a point to frame. Oh, God. But might be reading too much into it.
Speaker: Well, Josh Sargent did not celebrate his last goal for Norwich City because, and, you know, those of us who can sense things knew something wasn't going right there. We definitely called it on this podcast, didn't we? Yeah.
Speaker: I think, well, I enjoyed Magoma's Motori tribute shot, um just absolutely leathering it into the goal. he He later posted an Instagram post that just had the caption, I am who I am in capital letters. He just, I don't know. I think it's all a lot of like, it's all a lot of blah from both sides, isn't it? As long as he plays well and he, like, he is, it does feel like he's our best choice in that position. So if everyone could just try and make everybody else happy, that would be helpful. It's it's a very Gloria Gaynor Instagram.
Speaker: I do feel like he's got a lot of unnecessary flack for posting selfies and stuff. like he's He's very much into his his fashion. it's It's a hobby.
Speaker: He's passionate about it. like what what's What's wrong with him posting his outfits on Instagram? He's got a bit of personality. yeah yeah agree like If you were at work, and you mentioned something you like to do outside of work and someone said, think it's unforgivable that you would say that you're interested in something else other than what you're paid to do. It's very odd to think that you could be slammed for not for for liking something else. It's also a lot cooler than what Mattson was. Was he studying but becoming like an accountant or a finance director?
Speaker: No.
Speaker: When I say it works, I run a numbers-based stats account. That's exactly the reaction I get. Also, we can't... What, a numbers slag? We can't U-turn as well. Let's champion what these guys do outside of football, too. That's a bit boring, isn't it?
Speaker: He could have an interesting topic. I could have worded that differently as in like, what is the difference between, you know, doing that, having a fashion line or whatever he has and, you know, studying to become a finance director. It's good for footballers to have stuff to do outside of work. But, you know, matters learning Spanish, obviously not because he assumed he'd play for Barcelona one day, but... It's nice when footballers have something, you know. People can't see us, so they can't see how fashionable we are, all four of us, but obviously we would hold that opinion about, you know, that sort of thing.
Speaker: I was in a dinosaur onesie recording last week, wasn't I? So, I mean... I rest my case. Barris, if you want any tips, and the please get in touch. A question from Amy Rust.
Speaker: To gain some of that magical community club feeling back, what event slash gimmick slash promo would you like to see the Atanasios take on? Could sharing a pint in the Lion and Castle rally us as fans?
Speaker: Could Mark Atanasio also become a friend of Captain Canary? feel like i should pass that one over to you, Ryan, first. Well, I would first of all like to say that certain Norwich City events do mean you can have half price car parking at Carrow Road now. So I think they're doing their bit for their community there. I've got my own thoughts on the car park thing. ah Steve, forgive me. It's absolute bollocks.
Speaker: mean should we take Should we take that one offline? Yes, Steve, why have you made people pay for their parking at Cameron Road? I don't want to talk about it. i just feel like people have been getting away with it for far too long. I did mean it more for the sake of you having to bleep the word bollocks. Oh, that's fine. but You've said it twice now. Twice now. I'm not going to go back and do it twice. Bollocks is pretty podcast friendly, isn't it? I think we could probably just cut the usage of it down to like one or two. Where's Houlihan said it on Sky? so you know I mean, ideally you do want two rather than one. Or three. Don't know what that means. We'll move on. um I think, yes, I would love the Atanasios to be friends with Captain Canary at some point. I'd love to see them do that. Although, to be fair, it would be them hiding behind a mask, really. so Yeah, that's it. They'd be the Canary fairy instead. Could they just be the new Canary Fairy? Well, they could. on the Yeah. Halftime challenge.
Speaker: yeah Well, I was going to say, get them in the Zorbs. i want You were going to say it or sing it? Get them the Zorbs. I've got glo Gloria Gaynor in my head. um Yeah, i've I mean, I've long wanted the Zorbs to come back. I feel like we could have a ah big relaunch with the Atanasios in them.
Speaker: Or instead of having them have a pint, you know, because I always find that a bit iffy when or weird when Americans are drinking pints in England. It it feels like they're putting an axe on. Hello again, sore American listeners.
Speaker: And, you know, America has a very ah interesting microbrewery culture as well, so I don't know why I think that, but they do seem quite naff when they're doing that. um So maybe they can go behind the bar for a game and dish out three pints or soft drinks and pies, etc. at halftime, serve the community.
Speaker: Which is wonderful, because in the Lion and Castle you can pour your own pints. Yeah. that's right you guys do that yeah um but hey if you can get the owners to pour them for you then why wouldn't you do that yeah final question from jonathan parker i'm taking my son on saturday to his first live game versus watford so um hope you enjoy jonathan jr am i being a kind or cruel parent I mean, this we're getting quite existential here, I think. oh but The most benevol benevolent of all of the actions is to give so your child something to fall in love with, surely, for their whole life.
Speaker: And this is it. And do you do you know what a kind parent would do? They'd get their kid to commentate on a famous Norwich City law for us to guess. I mean, we definitely could have gone out on Zoe's line, but I really like that you got a plug in there.
Speaker: Yeah, if you could, Jonathan, just save us a job, please. That'd be great. so just Just live record your child your son ah during the game. Which we score.
Speaker: Yeah, which we defeat the point of the game. Well, it's Watford at home, isn't it, Steve? I mean, come on. Yeah, very true. But yeah yeah, what Zoe said, though. That was nice. um I do have one thing to add as well is this week being another a reminder to not read the Daily Mail um because their revelations about Norwich City Football Club came down to ah some people get colds in October.
Speaker: ah People who work outside of a city struggle to go for a haircut during working hours um and that football club has to train on Christmas Day. ah What a waste of time.
Speaker: that piece was and what an absolutely like froth it got people into as well it was nothing revelatory in it whatsoever what what was the haircut thing i mean i i will do i'm happy to do research for this podcast but i will not be subscribing to the day mail in order to do it so i didn't i certainly didn't do that you just click on the little reader thing on the on twitter and it uh and it allows you to read it for free So down with modern tech. some A staff member complained they didn't have time for a haircut. any other one Any other person working outside of the city who has time to drive into the city to get a haircut?
Speaker: I am very much struggling to try find a date for my next haircut. um And I'm not being subjected to Big Phil's training regimes. um It happens to a lot of people. Are you not? You're weirdly obsessed with the bleep test, so I thought i assumed you were.
Speaker: I go around with all those pincers measuring people's body fat all the time. Oh, that's what that was. Better than what David Wagner did to measure body fat. It's just dirt honking people's boobs. He's a feel for it, a natural feel for it. Is that what he was doing? He was measuring body fat when he was honking? She has less intrusive ways. I mean, the pincer sounds better. yes i'm I'm glad I'm i'm enjoying the the process of finding out about what Zoe's headlines mean through the medium of this podcast. And I have to start explaining them all.
Speaker: I imagine like thinking it's revelatory that a football team didn't have Christmas Day off. Oh, it's... Like moaning that a vicar doesn't get Sunday off. It's ah just... but Footballers haven't had Christmas Day off for about 130 years. Yeah. They used to play on Christmas Day. Exactly, exactly. They've had it for the long the longest time, haven't they? It's ridiculous. what like Where did that article even come from, though? Did they just have a couple of really weak sources from inside the club?
Speaker: I've been probably asking the wrong people here, to be fair. Yeah. I imagine it felt like something that ah could have been written by asking just some fans of the club, which is ah what I imagine probably happened.
Speaker: Well, they can ask us next time, can't they? Yeah. yeah one Maybe they did ask us, and this is all one big ruse, like Zoe was the haircut. ah Yeah. I was outraged at their training on Christmas Day. That should be sacrosanct.
Speaker: Well, think that's all for this week's OTB and Norris City podcast. A big thank you to Zoe Morgan. Thank you, Ryan. Thank you, everyone, for listening. Daniel Brigham. Thanks, Ryan. Thanks all. And our statistical slag, Steve Sanders.
Speaker: Yeah, off to do something particularly slaggy now. Thank you, Ryan. Yep. And you didn't even prepare any stats for us, did you, your slag? so What a waste. What a waste of time. If you have enjoyed this week's episode, please leave us a rating on your podcast player of choice and follow us on Instagram. We're on there as at OTB underscore pod underscore NCFC. And as we mentioned before, we are on Patreon and Substack 2 as OTB, a Norwich City podcast. Until the next one, never mind the danger.
