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Al Lewis says education is a sandbox.
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Podcast Introduction
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome to the Learner Centered Spaces podcast where we empower and inspire ownership of learning. Sponsored by Mastery Portfolio, hosted by Starr Saxton and Crystal Frommert.
00:00:14
Speaker
In each episode, we will bring you engaging conversations with a wide variety of educators, both in and out of the classroom. This podcast is created for educators who want to learn more about how to make the shift toward learner-centered spaces for their students, schools, and districts, or education at large. The Learner-Centered Spaces Podcast is a member of the Teach Better Podcast Network.
00:00:40
Speaker
Get ready to be inspired as we dive right into the conversation with today's guest.
Meet Dr. Al Lewis
00:00:46
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We are so excited to have Dr. Al Lewis on the show today. He is the recipient of the 2024 NASS Excellence in Small School District Leadership Award. Dr. Al Lewis has a proven track record of principled servant leadership and bettering the lives of children across South Jersey.
00:01:05
Speaker
Throughout his career in education, Dr. Lewis has put students first, created people-centered work environments, protected teachers' instructional time, and facilitated innovation through job-embedded professional development. A proud alumnus of Rowan University, Dr. Lewis earned bachelor's degrees in elementary education and history. He was a goaltender for the profs men ice hockey team.
00:01:29
Speaker
The Lewis family loves to go to Disney World and they love reading, enjoying nature, and playing board games. We are so excited to have Dr. Lewis on the show. Yeah, thank you so much for having me. I'm really excited to talk with you both today.
Dr. Lewis's Educational Journey
00:01:44
Speaker
So can you tell us about a defining moment in your educational journey?
00:01:49
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. And there have been so many and it's it's humbling to look back at all the pieces that, you know, you're you're living your life and you're young and you're just making these decisions and and you know now I can look back and say, um you know, these things have pointed me in the right direction.
00:02:05
Speaker
I loved working with kids. As you mentioned, I was a goaltender for the Rowan men's ice hockey team, Go Profs. I coached youth hockey oh while I was an undergrad and um actually was a pretty long major. And through coaching ice hockey, I just loved working with kids. I loved being able to make a difference in their lives.
00:02:24
Speaker
And I switched majors from pre-law to elementary education, which at the time I thought was just choosing a more fun career. and But now I can say, you know, obviously it was a ah pretty foundational decision that I made at 18 years old. um And then as a teacher, you know, I had colleagues that pointed me in the direction of administration. And um I actually was offered a position like a lateral move while I was a curriculum supervisor. And um the superintendent at my, um What would have been my next district actually told me um that one of the reasons they wanted to hire me was he thought I was a future superintendent and that was totally not on my radar. And um I can just remember thinking at the time yeah that it didn't make sense and and then it sat with me and I went back and got the certificate to do it. And and here I am as a superintendent in my third year.
00:03:13
Speaker
um But beyond that as a kid, you know, I had teachers that were great to me. I was raised by a loving single mother and my teachers were everything to me. I spent, you know, a ton of time with them and they ah always cared for me and helped me through the ups and downs of my life. And it's amazing to see how it all coalesced into what I'm doing today.
What are Learner-Centered Spaces?
00:03:31
Speaker
That's amazing to think about that journey, um which, because we don't usually have superintendents on here, I'm kind of wondered, from your level, what does a truly learner-centered state, like, what does a learner-centered space feel like?
00:03:49
Speaker
you know What do you want to see when you go into classrooms and how is your lens on student learning different maybe than a building level leader um or a classroom teacher? Yeah, that's a great question. you know Admittedly, we look at things through a different lens, you know not being a day-to-day manager of um you know individual employees at times. like Even in my previous role, I was a central office supervisor, so I moved around among 11 buildings.
00:04:18
Speaker
um You know, i I tend to think of them more as people-centered spaces, and I liken that not only to the classroom but to, you know, school buildings and wanting to care for the whole employee just like we care for the whole child. ah To me, learner-centered spaces are flexible. They're adaptable, right? Because everybody's an individual. No two kids are alike. No two teachers are alike. No two principals are alike.
00:04:40
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um So there has to be that flexibility both in seeding and lighting and the purpose of furniture, um you know the purpose and the flexibility of the curriculum materials. I often say you we're creating sandboxes, right? We're creating sandboxes for adults to make decisions and sandboxes for children to construct learning.
00:05:00
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And within that sandbox and those you know guidelines that we've created, we want kids and adults to play and experiment and grow. And that has to look messy and it has to look ever-changing, that like whole model of controlled chaos in an elementary classroom.
00:05:17
Speaker
um you know that To me, that's the biggest thing is it it doesn't feel like or look like or sound like any one thing. um it It should be fluid and it should be flexible because people grow and change and sometimes that has to happen over a long period of time and organically and then other times, that you know, you catch lightning in a bottle and and something really clicks but either way, um you you want people to feel like they have the freedom ah but still have that support of the flexibility.
Balancing Assessments
00:05:45
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And ah being ah being a teacher myself, and um i've I've served as an administrator a little bit, I know that the question of assessment can be a really big one. And probably at the district level, it's an even bigger question. So what are your thoughts on balancing the high-stakes standardized testing, which I know that superintendents definitely have to deal with that, and also the informal assessment that you see in the classrooms in your district?
00:06:16
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yeah I can say from like the macro perspective, um you know the New Jersey Department of Ed involves a lot of stakeholders, superintendents included in the development and refinement of our standardized exams. I sat on the New Jersey Department of Ed's Science Advisory Council and we analyzed test items for the grade 5 science standard exam.
00:06:36
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um So we we have a lot of input and we have a lot of utility that comes out of those scores. But they're just one piece of learning, right? I mean, they are a big piece at times, but they're not the end-all, be-all, right? And that's where the informal assessments add another side to that lens that you're looking through and the teacher's observations and anecdotal records, the curriculum assessments.
00:06:58
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um you know, social intakes, IEPs, all the pieces that inform us about how a child is doing. And then from the higher perspective, how teachers are doing and how buildings are doing. And we and we certainly do look at longitudinal trends in performance, but they're just one piece. um The same as we would treat a student, we treat a teacher, right? Not every year is is going to be a light the world on fire type of year. There's going to be ebbs and flows to the data. um And you know, it helps you point the teacher in the right direction hopefully like from a professional development standpoint um but you just have to realize the lane that it it comes in right it's it's just one piece of the puzzle you know the other thing i would say to that is.
00:07:38
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if If the test is valid, right, if the standardized exam is aligned to the instructional standards, it's culturally responsive, it's an authentic, you know, engaging assessment, and it's aligned to valid instructional standards, it is absolutely appropriate to align instruction then to the standards and to that assessment. It's when we overemphasize the actual test taking and it takes on a life of its own that we're no longer really centering it on what students need.
00:08:06
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Students need to learn, they need to achieve those standards, and the standardized exams are just one measure of how they stack up to that. Well, thank you for sharing that. um I have spent most of my career in Texas and standardized test standardized testing is a scary word to me, probably because you've heard of Texas standardized testing, so it's it's quite infamous.
Advice for School Leaders
00:08:28
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um What advice would you have for another school leader who is maybe looking to foster that messy, sandbox-y type of environment um that you seek out in your district?
00:08:42
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um Well, the the answer to everything I feel like I say, and I'm a bit of a broken record, is the first thing you have to do is tie it to your mission and vision. And you have to go back to you know what are the core values of the district or the building. And then you have to bring in your stakeholder groups and set that vision. And if your vision is to change the culture and change the instructional schema for your building,
00:09:04
Speaker
to make it a more learner-centered environment. One, that's amazing, right? It's evidence-based that children do better when we care for the whole learner and when we focus learning on the individual. The secondary to that, though, is you have to include everyone, right? If you just go in and say, this is what we're doing, we're going to be very learner-centric here, um it's going to ring hollow if you're not including folks and letting it be a group effort. And then likewise, if you're not allocating resources to where they need to be.
00:09:31
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You're not just going to change a classroom overnight. You know, if you're going to go from 30 traditional desks and say it's going to be more learner centered, you need to give folks like a practical roadmap for how to change things. You need to put the right resources in place, staffing, furniture, um curricular resources. All the pieces of the school are going to have to somewhat shift as division shifts to make sure that you are centering on actual individualized learners and letting them take more agency of their, you know, of constructing knowledge.
00:10:05
Speaker
If someone wanted to go in that direction though, like what what is the first next step? Everything you just said is great, but it's huge. but and what would What advice would you give?
00:10:19
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for like the first next step. Yeah. I would say you bring that stakeholder group together and you make an action plan, right? You give give people a chance to describe how they view learner centered leadership and learner centered instruction. And then you actionize that and say like, all right, well what pieces can we own? What can we change tomorrow? What can we change in a month? What can we change in a year? And then who's going to own those goals and who's going to get us there?
00:10:44
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And what do we need to get the job done? um you know And I think some of it from the leadership perspective is putting the right resources in front of folks. Because when you say learner-centered space, for some people, that's very abstract. For other people, um you they may have a very you know not a not and on purpose bias. But they may just have something already in mind that they believe is what it should look like. And again, it it really is individualized, both from the learner perspective and from the instructor's perspective.
00:11:11
Speaker
So I think having those conversations and setting a common language, but then practically actionizing what needs to take place has to come next. And you're right, it is huge. I mean, it's not something that, you know, any two buildings is going to do the same, nor should they. um But you're going to have to somewhat at some point put rubber to road and put boots on the ground and say, if we want this space to be more learner centered, what does that look like for us in our local context? And then how do we get there and start building that roadmap?
Acknowledging the Support Network
00:11:40
Speaker
Who would you like to shout out? Somebody who helped people we should be following or people that you go to when you're trying to inform your decisions?
00:11:52
Speaker
Yeah, so I am blessed with a really, really robust support network. um you know My colleagues at NAS, the National Association of School Superintendents, we have a ah you know nationwide network of folks that I can call and or email and say, hey, this is what I want to do, or I'm thinking of making this decision. What do you think? um So yeah we have a great group there. Glenn Robbins is in my my state and in New Jersey. And yeah he's ah big on LinkedIn. and he's um just a genius and i go to him and i asked for some innovative ideas and he just always has these amazing ideas and i like was my good friend and and colleague jeffrey christo we've worked together for the past fourteen years now and ah jeff is my go-to guy um when i have a decision to make or
00:12:38
Speaker
I'm trying to brainstorm some ideas, and I want to bounce ideas off of him. He's just so good at, one, he's just steeped in leadership knowledge, and two, he um you know hes he's just somebody who can say, like, no, that's crazy, or maybe I would do it this way, or you know have you thought about the unintended consequences here? And Jeff always says,
00:12:56
Speaker
ah yeah His like personal motto is, if we're going to make school work for all kids, all means all children, each individual. It doesn't just mean some, it doesn't mean most. It has to genuinely mean all, even the most difficult to reach children, even the ones who come from the worst of circumstances. They still have a right to a robust education, and we owe it to them as the professionals in the field. So um you know I would say Glenn and Jeff are are definitely big pieces of ah my support network who I go to for advice.
00:13:27
Speaker
You have such good content, such good things to say and know our listeners are probably going to want to follow you as soon as they hear this episode. So where would you recommend our listeners find you online?
Professional Engagement
00:13:38
Speaker
um So LinkedIn is probably the the best place to find me. If you're looking online, you know, try and stay active on LinkedIn. It's a great networking.
00:13:45
Speaker
tool and there there's lots of good ideas out there and I always love to engage with folks who who reach out to me and I certainly reach out to them. We're also our school district and my like my personal office. The office of the superintendent is on Facebook and on X which used to be Twitter. um you know we're We're real big on social media engagement for our school community. That's how our folks in our school community like to consume information. Like most people, they they get their news, they get their um You know, they get their information from social media. It's quick. It's easy. It's a quick sound bites. And we like to engage in that and engage our community in two-way social media interactions. So LinkedIn, Twitter, Facebook, um you know, come find me. I'll be glad to have conversation with folks about learner-centered spaces. Thank you, Al. I think our listeners are definitely going to want to follow you and learn more about the great things that are going on at your district. So thank you for your time today. Yeah, thank you. It was a pleasure. Thanks, Al. Thank you.
00:14:43
Speaker
We hope you enjoyed the conversation as much as we did. If you'd like any additional information from the show, check out the show notes.
Closing and Social Media Links
00:14:50
Speaker
Learn more about Mastery Portfolio and how we support schools at masteryportfolio dot.com. You can follow us on X at MasteryForAll and LinkedIn in our Mastery Portfolio page.
00:15:05
Speaker
We'd love for you to engage with us. If you'd like to be a guest in the show or know someone who would be an inspiring guest, please fill out the survey found in the show notes. And we'd love your feedback. Please write a review on your favorite podcasting app.
00:15:23
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