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Joshua Stamper helps educators #teachbetter
50 Plays1 month ago
Twitter: https://x.com/Joshua__Stamper/status/1856845829254124032
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Music by AudioCoffee: https://www.audiocoffee.net/
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Transcript
Introduction of Hosts and Guest
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome to the Learner Centered Spaces podcast where we empower and inspire ownership of learning. Sponsored by Mastery Portfolio, hosted by Starr Saxton and Crystal Frommert.
00:00:14
Speaker
In each episode, we will bring you engaging conversations with a wide variety of educators, both in and out of the classroom. This podcast is created for educators who want to learn more about how to make the shift toward learner-centered spaces for their students, schools, and districts, or education at large. The Learner-Centered Spaces podcast is a member of the Teach Better podcast network.
00:00:40
Speaker
Get ready to be inspired as we dive right into the conversation with today's guest. We are very excited to have Joshua Stamper on the show today. He is the director of innovation for the Teach Better team, a multifaceted role that encompasses his talents as an author, podcaster, leadership coach, and education keynote speaker. With a rich background as a middle school administrator, classroom art educator, and athletic coach, Joshua brings a wealth of experience to his work and education. Joshua is passionate about implementing trauma-responsive techniques, exploring alternative student discipline methods, and promoting healthy leadership habits.
00:01:23
Speaker
He is deeply committed to enhancing leadership capacity through self-care practices, ensuring the educators are equipped to lead with empathy and resilience. As the author of Aspire to Lead and host of the popular podcast of the same name, Joshua continues to inspire and empower educators and leaders worldwide. Welcome to our show today. Oh my goodness, I'm so excited and honored to be on the program.
00:01:50
Speaker
I'm so excited to talk to Josh too. Josh, as we kick it off, can you tell us something about a moment that defined where you are right now in your educational journey?
Pivotal Career Moment
00:02:02
Speaker
Actually, I think it was when me and you had coffee last week. Yeah, I know how that can be. Choking star. Crazy good, right?
00:02:11
Speaker
No, i'm to be honest, I was an art teacher and I think it was my third year as a teacher. I went, because I was coaching, I came in at five in the morning to get you know everything ready for practice. And I went to get a cup of coffee and I was ambushed by my assistant principal at the time. And I say that word very intentionally because I was really just trying to get caffeine in my system when I got tapped on the shoulder and my assistant principal asked me if I had ever thought about being ah being a principal.
00:02:42
Speaker
And my reaction probably wasn't the best because I laughed at him um because I was really just trying to like figure out my role at the time as a teacher, as a coach. And I had never even thought about like my long-term goals. I was literally just trying to survive. And I felt like I was kind of getting comfortable in the role. So i I say that was the moment that changed everything because that's when I started to think outside of myself and started to have belief in some of the leadership qualities that you know he had shared with me that he saw. And that moment was when, I think about a month later, I got into a program for my master's in educational leadership and administration. And within two years, I was in the role of Dean of Students, which was administrative role there in Dallas, Texas.
00:03:32
Speaker
So to that end, Josh, thinking about that moment when you switched from classroom teacher to leadership, when we're thinking about learner-centered spaces, we're usually talking to classroom folks or folks who help people in the classroom. But as a new leader in a building, um either a system principal or a principal, like, what does it mean to support teachers who are developing learner-centered spaces? What does that feel like, sound like?
00:04:02
Speaker
give us Give us all the things that you would look for as as a leader in that space. Yeah. Well, I had the pleasure, both as a teacher and as an administrator, to go into classrooms and to provide feedback um or gather data. And for me, you know and maybe this is my art background, but there were certain things I was always looking
Creating Flexible Classrooms
00:04:23
Speaker
for. And and one, it was, you know for the looks like piece, as an administrator, I wanted to make sure that it wasn't like your typical You know, teacher desk is the focal point, rows, maybe desks really defining the space and making it more about flexible seating, allowing the students the flexibility to stand, to sit on the floor, to have spaces that were comfortable. I know for myself, I was not a very good student growing up and sitting in a desk for 45 minutes or longer was just excruciating for me. It was literally painful. um I had to move. And so I always wanted to create spaces and and try and
00:04:59
Speaker
assist teachers with that to make sure that it was more of an interactive space. so For instance, like you could have you know like ah learning zones where you had designated areas for you group work.
00:05:12
Speaker
individual work, more hands on learning spaces. And then sometimes too, like having like tech corners or, you know, where they can integrate technology. So making it more of a design space. The other thing is like having interactive tools, maybe some resources. But the main thing is like as an administrator, making sure that I was providing for the teacher because what I didn't want was I didn't want teachers to be out of pocket for all of these things. So for instance, like, you know, with that flexible seating piece, we constantly were looking for grants and finding ways to purchase, you you know, all of these different things. So for instance, like the standing desk or the, we had actually where you had the desk that work, you could sit on the ground, ah bean bags, couches, you know, we asked our families and our parents, like, if you have spare furniture that you don't want,
00:06:01
Speaker
really just to make it so it's conducive um for the kids and it's a space that they come into and they feel like they belong. And I guess that's more about the feeling piece if we're transitioning. So, you know, when a kid comes in, it's not a classroom that's stale, right? That it has some emotion to it. and It's welcoming, it's inclusive. Everyone comes in and has a sense of belonging there.
00:06:25
Speaker
um The other thing too that we used to of look for and talk about is like making sure that so the environment looks and feels safe and is supportive by the teachers. um Making sure that you're at the door and you're saying hello and saying their name correct and um making sure that you understand like who the kid is an individual. Doing check-ins with the kids to make sure that you can kind of get a gauge as to where they
Supporting Teachers in Learner-Centered Environments
00:06:50
Speaker
are within the day. So for instance like we used to do a number system or color coded system where you know we could find out if
00:06:57
Speaker
They were 10, meaning the best day of their life versus a one, meaning there they're having a terrible day, just to get an idea of where kids were. And we did this back in the day more ah with paper form, but as things progressed with technology, we used Google Forms for this, but it just gave us an opportunity to see where the kid was, maybe dig into their story of why they may be feeling that way. And then also like allowing them to get the resources they need.
00:07:23
Speaker
especially if learning wasn't going to occur in the classroom. So kids feel safe, they feel supportive. And then ah the last thing is that they're empowered, that they feel like they're a part of that environment. They're heard, they're respected. And then there's some type of control within that environment so where they have some choice. Because if you think about it in the school day, a lot of times kids are just told, no, no, no, no, sit down, be quiet. And they don't have a whole lot of and ambiguity to what's going on within their learning and in the environment.
00:07:49
Speaker
And the last thing is like, at least it sounds like, and that's more like, I want energy. I want it to be, you know, chattery. I know like when an administrator comes in, typically teachers get up from their desk and tell the kids to be quiet and make sure that they're quiet. And I guess what they think is engaged in that way. But for me, I want kids to be, you know, doing things that are student led, that are collaborative, that are allowing them to get up and demade or solve problems. and and you know, be more facilitators themselves in addition to the teacher being a facilitator. And again, it's getting away from that traditional role where, you know, the teacher is the primary source of knowledge and making it more about the students being more interactive in in that learning environment.
00:08:34
Speaker
So Josh, as an administrator, I wanted to ask how do you support teachers to foster that kind of environment in their classrooms? I mean, beyond just providing you know the correct spaces and the the furniture and you know expectations around evaluations, but do you send your teachers to professional development? Do you do that in-house? How does that all work? Yeah, I think it's more about just kind of shifting that mindset for the most part.
00:09:03
Speaker
I think some people are like, you're here are folks that are going to go out no matter what and do what you want or were your belief system as far as your administrative staff. And then there's others that are kind of apprehensive. And I think for our culture, we are just constantly um doing a variety of different things. One, bringing people in to to speak on this. Two, having teachers go into other classrooms to observe their peers, especially the ones that were kind of the ah first adopters of this. And then the last thing is doing campus visits where we actually would give our staff um in groups who kind of did it like where it was like a
00:09:39
Speaker
a variety of rotated groups that would go out to different campuses, either in district or out of district, to be able to see it firsthand. I think it gives a little more power to ah see something going on outside of your own district and outside of your own school um to see someone else do it in and modeling that for you. I think that changed a lot of people's perspectives because I think, you know, we get in our bubble, our four walls are where we command and that's our space. and A lot of times we don't get out of that to see what ah other people are doing within our campus, but especially not in other districts. And we always got such great feedback from our teachers when they were able to do a campus visit um somewhere else in a neighboring district to say like how powerful it was and how many things that they learned and then also were going to steal into their own classroom.
00:10:31
Speaker
I love that idea of going to see other schools and seeing other classrooms, whether it's within your own school or outside your district. There's so much to learn and it's not a very expensive professional development to do that. That's fantastic. Thanks for sharing that. um As far as, so we talked about the environment that kids are learning in. Can you talk a little bit more about assessment? How does a teacher assess that students are learning?
00:10:56
Speaker
Yeah, that's a great question.
Focus on Student Growth Over Evaluation
00:10:58
Speaker
I think for me, I think that's also another thing that we were kind of massaging into folks about really shifting from like evaluation to growth. Because unfortunately, like the system that we are currently in, a lot of times it's all about where students should be based on their age and their grade.
00:11:17
Speaker
And we sometimes forget about how much growth occurs during the school year. So for instance, like let's say in ah English or an ELA class, the student is at a fourth grade reading level well when they enter our campus and they should be at a sixth grade level. And let's say by the end of the school year, you know, they've gone from a fourth grade to a sixth grade level. That's a ton of growth.
00:11:42
Speaker
But typically we're like, well, they should be at the end of the sixth grade year, be ready for seventh grade. So they should be at a seventh grade reading level. And so we say that the kid hasn't done a very good job based on the level in which we expect them to be at. And we forget the fact that they just grew two grade levels in a short period of time.
00:12:03
Speaker
And so for us, you know as administrators, of constantly talking about, yes, it's we need to assess, we need to get that data, we need to see where the kid is and where they're going, but we also need to celebrate the growth growth that occurs. We need to not kick ourselves as a teacher or an administrator when the data shows that they're not proficient to the level that someone has put that label upon them. So our kids are growing at various levels and at different rates of time. And sometimes we get caught up on where we think they should be based on an age versus just saying, okay, this there's been a ton of growth and we need to celebrate that. The thing too, we talked about
00:12:40
Speaker
ownership, just allowing the kids to have um a chance to do some self-assessment. The other thing is goal setting was huge for us, so allowing kids to actually go through that process, that executive functioning piece of being able to see where they are and then get the skills to try to set goals, but then also the accountability piece of that, um the reflection process.
00:13:02
Speaker
trying to think what else we used to do personalized feedback to with like allowing the kids to not only give their feedback but then the teachers being able to consistently share out you know as far as the assessment process and how to get to that goal. um The other thing last thing I'll just say is as far as like demonstration. So for us a lot of times we were so focused on testing and only looking You know, at the high stakes assessments, the summative assessments, and for us, it was like, okay, let's.
00:13:35
Speaker
back that up and that, yes, that has a part in the piece of the puzzle, but at the same time, we also need to focus on the formative assessments and looking at the check-ins, looking at the exit tickets, looking at portfolios and prioritizing that over sometimes the high stakes because our kids, I don't know about you all, but we saw a ton of anxiety and the growth of that over the last couple of years and high stakes summative assessments only increase that. So finding alternative ways to still see that there's mastery occurring versus only focusing on one thing at the very end of ah the lesson. So I have a follow up for you, Josh, um thinking about your new book that's going to be coming out and what you were just saying about students and the way we feel about them during these assessment processes. Like I actually had like two questions while you were talking. One was about like, is this the whole school? Like as a leader, I would have died to have a person
00:14:33
Speaker
who was leading me, who understood these things, because when I was a teacher, that just wasn't the paradigm I lived in. So I'm first curious was, this is school-wide expectation. And when you were doing hiring, to did people's prior knowledge about these kind of things play into how you hired? And if they didn't have the knowledge they had when they came in, was there some onboarding process that helped them understand all of these kind of alternative understandings of learning and assessment as opposed to the traditional. And then the second part of that question is more about the social emotional piece, um about what you learn when you're doing these kinds of assessments with kids and how you adjust based on what you learn. Okay, I'm probably gonna have you repeat start the second piece
Innovative Hiring for Learner-Centered Values
00:15:20
Speaker
of that. But the first part, yes, as far as, you know, having it, it was overarching for the campus. And so
00:15:28
Speaker
It was a lot of professional development. And as you all know, like when you're doing anything, it doesn't happen overnight. As much as I would love to say that happens, it doesn't. Um, I was one that thought like when all of these things I wanted to change, it was going to happen. Like I was driving a speedboat and instead it was more like a cruise ship. And so it took like three years for things to really play out and going onto the hiring piece. We were very, you know, we're talking about alternate practices. We were very.
00:15:58
Speaker
set on changing the way that we hired also so we actually had teachers come in and yes they would answer questions but unfortunately what would occur was they would tell us what they thought we would want to hear we would hire them and then what would happen is that they didn't exactly Do what they said. So when we started to have these alternative ideas of how the learning environment should occur and then there was pushback, we were very confused because it was like, well, that's what you said at the table. So what we started to do is to find ways for them to come in, observe,
00:16:33
Speaker
And then also give a lesson in a classroom so that way we could see them and honestly start. We were looking for a lot more than just how they taught the lesson. It was more about engagement with the students about how they set up the classroom, how they built relationships in a short period of time. So we were looking for other things when we were observing.
00:16:54
Speaker
And of course, we're looking at how they you know need the content and whatnot, but that wasn't the sole thing you we're looking for. In addition, like once they were hired, yes, there was definitely an onboarding session and and multiple sessions.
00:17:07
Speaker
for them to learn kind of what we expect in the classroom, but then we also had a support system that didn't just stay with them for a year. We wanted them to have something for like three years and trying to build something so that it wasn't like, you know, you get your first week, you learn the procedures and the practices and the rules from the for the district and the campus, and then you never see them again.
00:17:29
Speaker
So it was about supporting beyond just that first week and beyond just the first year. Because as we all know, you don't get comfortable until about your third year and you still need to grow. That still happens, just like with our students. So we wanted to make sure that we had an opportunity for them to come and join a group of people to get that support. But then we also were very intentional about connecting them with someone to give them an opportunity to ask Any question they wanted. So essentially a mentor and trying to make sure that it was a mentor that was. Close and subject matter didn't have to be exactly the subject your matter, but I had to be someone that was.
00:18:10
Speaker
available to them often. And so we didn't want to make sure because a lot of times our leaders get just tapped on the shoulder all the time, like, we do this committee, we you do this, we do this, we be a mentor. And we want to make sure we share the wealth and making sure that we had a very intentional mentor that was attached to another person. I think that was was key in the development of this.
00:18:32
Speaker
That sounds amazing. And I wish I could have worked for you in my early days trying to figure all this stuff out. because I would have taken you in a heartbeat, Star. Trust me. I appreciate that. um So I mean, I guess the second piece, because i I wanted to give you an opportunity to talk about the new work that you have coming out and how it pertains to this sort of paradigm of teaching and learning, but also bring in that social emotional piece. So can you talk about how what you've seen in this kind of paradigm, how that is positively impacted students?
Impact on Social-Emotional Well-Being
00:19:06
Speaker
Yeah, so the project that I'm on is the language of behavior. We have a book that's coming out here soon.
00:19:12
Speaker
that myself and Charlie Peck have been working on for a while now. And that all was created because, you know, as an administrator, I, as an assistant principal specifically and the Dean of Students, like 90% of my job was working with students. And unfortunately, a lot of at times it was based on negative behavior and just trying to change the mindset of that. and i I talked a little bit about like when that first question about like the fields and what you see and whatnot was really trying to be proactive in the way that we constructed our environment, but then also the relationship practices that we implement into the classroom.
00:19:49
Speaker
Obviously, we want to make sure it's a safe space. And to do that, we need to make sure that there's routines and there's predictability occurring in that environment every single day. And there were plenty of opportunities that I saw as an administrator where teachers just did a phenomenal job of always being at the door and always saying in the kid's name and doing a high five or a side hug at the door. And they had their objectives on the on the wall and then come in, they'd have, you know, low lighting and they would have music playing softly and they would have some type of nice scent for the kids because, you know, the kids coming from gym don't always smell the greatest. And then you have like a song that they would sing and they would do like these hand gestures and all this, you know, just this beautiful routine. And the kids loved going in. They practically ran in with smiles every time. And it didn't matter if a kid had a traumatic background or one that was safe and secure at home.
00:20:39
Speaker
they all entered the same time and they all were energized to go into that space and for us it was like okay if a kid is engaged and they feel secure and they feel safe and they want to belong in that space then obviously learning is going to occur.
00:20:55
Speaker
And when there is something going on in their life, they're going to be more prone to be able to share that with a trusted adult. And for us as administrators, it was like making sure that every kid that came into our campus had someone that they connected with that was a staff member. And if they didn't have that, we're going to find that out and we're going to try and do our best to make sure that they trusted someone so that when the time came and as we ah probably all know that a lot of times trauma occurs more often than we realize that they are able to you know speak out and share what's going on in their life. So that way we can get them the resources and and the practices that they need so that the learning could occur.
00:21:34
Speaker
That's awesome. um Okay, so as what we usually do now, Josh, is we talk about um people you
Acknowledgments and Mentions
00:21:41
Speaker
want to shout out. So are there folks that you think people should be following who have positively impacted you as an educator and who have influenced the work you're doing now?
00:21:54
Speaker
Well, I'll shout out my my mentor. i She's not very active on social media, but you can definitely find her. Sandhya Pyiram was my administrator. um When I was the art teacher, she was the assistant principal and gave me every opportunity to learn. And she just did a beautiful job of of being very transparent and allowing me to be in spaces that I had no business being in. But because of that, I was able to gain the experience and knowledge to transition pretty easily into the next role. um So shout out to her. Todd Nisloni, Tech Ninja Todd, I think is most of his handles. I met him at a conference, TCAA, in 2017. And we just clicked. I don't know why, but he's one of my best friends. And due to his influences when I started the podcast and I started to write blogs and I started to do some of these other things that led into my podcast, which is
00:22:50
Speaker
Goodness. I think almost seven years in the making, um, a spider lead. So um I blame him for kind of lighting that fire inside of me to explore things outside of the campus and and try to support other people. I'm so glad you mentioned, mentioned Todd Nestleoni because he and I went to the same university, which I didn't know. Yeah. I didn't know that until way after.
00:23:13
Speaker
We graduated, so anyway. It's actually a new one. But still, it's pretty cool, and I think he's a really cool guy. um Speaking of really cool guys, um where could our listeners find you online um to find out more about your work?
Connect with Joshua Stamper
00:23:27
Speaker
For sure. If you go to joshstamper.com, that is my website, and you can find everything there that I do, um as far as books, podcasts, and other resources. And then if you're looking on social media, usually, let's see, X, Instagram,
00:23:42
Speaker
it's ah It's Joshua double underscore stamper. Let's see blue sky i just jumped on there. And I got my name. So I'm pretty stoked about that. So I'm at Joshua stamper there. So typically, I have to like, you know, do the double underscore to get my handle, but that one is just my name. So most often is Joshua double underscore stamper.
00:24:04
Speaker
Well, thank you for sharing that. And by the time this episode comes out, I'm very eager to see how blue sky is doing at that point. We will see. I think it's going to take off. You think so? Let's hope so. I like it so far. Me too. It has like that old Twitter feel. Yes, that's exactly what I feel too. Yeah.
00:24:25
Speaker
what we will see at this time of publishing. So ah thank you so much, Josh, for your time. We really appreciate it. It's been a great show and you've shared so many cool things for us as listeners. Thank you for having me.
00:24:38
Speaker
We hope you enjoyed the conversation as much as we did. If you'd like any additional information from the show, check out the show notes. Learn more about Mastery Portfolio and how we support schools at masteryportfolio dot.com. You can follow us on X at Mastery For All and linked to in our Mastery Portfolio page.
00:25:00
Speaker
We'd love for you to engage with us. If you'd like to be a guest in the show or know someone who would be an inspiring guest, please fill out the survey found in the show notes. And we'd love your feedback. Please write a review on your favorite podcasting app.