Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Julie Dietmar
40 Plays1 month ago
We talk about a proper tour around silicon valley; Yahoo, Walmart Labs, to starting her own company, OpenWardrobe.
Recommended
Transcript
From Engineering to INSEAD
00:00:01
Joe Waltman
All right, today we've got Julia Dietmar. Julia, thanks for joining.
00:00:05
Julia
Thank you for having me.
00:00:07
Joe Waltman
All right, same question. Refresh your memory. What were you doing prior to INSEAD and what have you been up to for the last 20-ish years?
00:00:14
Julia
Yeah, before INSEAD, I was an engineer, I was a software engineer for almost nine years. And I went to INSEAD for a career change, actually, wasn't sure exactly what
00:00:27
Joe Waltman
wo Give us a little more background. kind of like Where are you from? what Where did you go to school? Where were you working before INCIAD?
00:00:36
Julia
Yeah, yeah, sure. Yeah, I was born in Minsk, Belarus. And then when I was 18, my family moved to California and we've been in California ever since.
00:00:50
Julia
It's been over 30 years. um I went to Berkeley, i University of California, Berkeley for my undergrad in computer science and then spent the next nine years before INSEAD doing software engineering work.
Tech Career Beginnings
00:01:08
Julia
My first job out of college was visa. And then um I was teaching programming at for but some, you know, local kind of schools with Microsoft certification.
00:01:26
Julia
i was working, it was very, very early days of internet. I worked at a local energy company building their websites. And then I went into startups. So I was part of this whole Dot com boom and then subsequent bust.
00:01:43
Julia
It was very fun times.
00:01:45
Joe Waltman
all All in Northern California the whole time.
00:01:48
Julia
All in Northern California. Yeah. So it was all in San Francisco and San Francisco Bay Area. Yeah. yeah And it was a time in the in the mid nineties when.
Choosing INSEAD
00:02:00
Julia
It was really companies, I would join a company and literally five, six months later it would close down. ah It was that bad. um And then in 97, I joined a company in San Francisco bay Area that sent me to London ah to work on the project for Ford Europe.
00:02:25
Julia
And it was a fun project. And um during that time, I kind of decided that I wanted to get an MBA. And a friend of mine who went um to, he was actually an engineer also by by his undergraduate degree.
00:02:34
Joe Waltman
Thank you.
00:02:43
Julia
And then he went and got an MBA at Ecole de Pont-Achusse in Paris. And he told me, he's like, oh, it's such a great program. It's made for engineers. You should apply.
00:02:54
Julia
And I'm not doing any research about anything. um i applied to that school. And while I was applying, i needed a recommendation letters.
00:03:08
Julia
And one of the recommenders was the general manager of the company but where I worked. And he was an in Seattle. And he was telling he told me, like why are you applying to this school that nobody has ever heard of? like You should go to INSEAD. And i' like, what is INSEAD? Never heard of that.
00:03:25
Julia
um But that was kind of my journey. That's how I ended up with INSEAD eventually. um ah So yeah, it was um it was almost kind of, um was the only school I applied. i got into Pont de Chese, but then I decided to defer by a year.
00:03:42
Julia
And in that year, I did some more research and I liked INSEAD and I decided I'll try. If it doesn't work out, I'll go to that other school. But it worked out and um the rest is history, I guess.
00:03:57
Joe Waltman
All right, so now we're we're at INSEAD. How did – were you thinking of changing careers? how did how did that's all How did that all you know play into it?
Balancing Family and Studies at INSEAD
00:04:08
Julia
Yeah, i I decided that I wanted to stay in technology, but I did not want to be an engineer anymore. I didn't want to code anymore. um I wanted to be closer to business, and but I wasn't sure if I wanted to do business development or product management um and or maybe even venture capital. I was kind of all over the place.
00:04:31
Julia
So I went to INSEAD. um Experience was very, very fun. But I was one of the two crazy persons who I came with a baby.
00:04:44
Julia
So my son was two years old.
00:04:45
Joe Waltman
Oh, there's only one other person with with a kid.
00:04:47
Julia
So if you remember...
00:04:49
Joe Waltman
Hmm.
00:04:50
Julia
Yeah, Geeta Ponchapakesan was another, she's actually a friend and she also lives in California here. So her son was even younger.
00:04:56
Joe Waltman
hu
00:04:58
Julia
He was a year younger than mine. um But she was lucky. She came with the whole family. um i came by myself with the baby and then I hired a nanny. So there was a nanny living with me and my husband was traveling back and forth.
00:05:14
Julia
So it was fun times for sure.
00:05:16
Joe Waltman
You know, it's a lot.
00:05:17
Julia
Yeah.
00:05:17
Joe Waltman
That's lot.
Starting a Dental Software Business
00:05:20
Julia
Yeah, so ah yeah, and then when I graduated, um ah kind of was toying with the idea of staying in Europe, but then my family kind was really pressuring me to come back, and I had grandparents were alive at the time, and they wanted the whole family together, so went back to California, and it was, of course, 2003, economy was horrible, couldn't find a job.
00:05:44
Julia
it was um It was definitely... not fun at the time.
00:05:52
Joe Waltman
Yep, I remember it very well.
00:05:55
Julia
Yeah. um So yeah, so that that kind of led me to, I was consulting a little bit and then i had a, I still have a friend who graduated from Harvard Medical School and he was doing orthodontia. He was an orthodontist in San Francisco.
00:06:17
Julia
And um he's like, well, you can't find a job. And I just started my own practice. um I've been medically trained, ah but not trained in business, but I'm effectively running my own business. And I have so many friends in the same um same situation from from from the school.
00:06:38
Julia
It's like, let's start a company and offer services to dentists. And I'm like, okay, let's do that. Not knowing anything anything anything about how to run a dental office or anything.
00:06:50
Julia
So, um, so we started that company, we build a software for dental, uh, practice management. And basically we were offering that service and all the services around it Um,
00:07:07
Julia
basically everything except for treating patients. So hiring, firing, ordering supplies, all that kind of stuff. So I went, got myself certified as a front office dental office manager kind of person, figuring out how to file insurance claims and all of that so that we could build it all in the software.
00:07:24
Joe Waltman
Mm-hmm.
00:07:31
Julia
And um yeah, we had um um at the height of it, we had 11 practices under management, never became anything big. And then um that friend of mine who was my business partner, who was basically selling, he was the only person who was selling the services.
00:07:49
Julia
He had some pretty serious things going on in his personal life. So we couldn't concentrate on the business anymore. So that was closed down. And I went
00:08:00
Joe Waltman
I want to ask you because I've got a little person, a bit of personal experience, not not in dental, but related or in, in, in sort of medical stuff.
00:08:02
Julia
Yeah.
00:08:09
Joe Waltman
How did the, what you expected to be the challenging part of that business versus what was the actually challenging part of that business when you got
Challenges in Dental vs. Tech
00:08:16
Joe Waltman
into it? How did those differ or what,
00:08:18
Julia
Well, i expected I expected the software piece to be challenging, but the most challenging piece was actually dealing with people, and those are hiring people for dental offices and managing them.
00:08:30
Julia
was very challenging and very different from anything that I've experienced because the employees that I dealt with prior to that were more kind of professionals, right?
00:08:31
Joe Waltman
Mm-hmm.
00:08:42
Julia
And when you're hiring kind of lower skill ah workers to just answer the phones and order supplies, and it's completely, completely different ballgames.
00:08:53
Julia
People just, they don't feel like showing up to work. They don't show up to work. They don't even bother calling you. so that was that was the the the most challenging part.
00:09:03
Joe Waltman
Gotcha. Gotcha. Thanks. Now, and what years was this, was this dental startup?
00:09:07
Julia
This, we started it in 2003, right after, right after INSEAD.
00:09:08
Joe Waltman
When to when?
00:09:14
Julia
um And then we did it for three years. 2006 was when we stopped.
00:09:18
Joe Waltman
Okay.
00:09:20
Julia
Yeah.
Transition to Yahoo and Startups
00:09:21
Julia
And then I started working, I went to work for Yahoo, which was still pretty hot company at the time, but on the way down.
00:09:29
Joe Waltman
Yeah.
00:09:30
Julia
And I stayed there through the whole... drama of trying to sell to Microsoft, not being sold to Microsoft and just kind of going back and forth.
00:09:38
Joe Waltman
what What were you doing at Yahoo?
00:09:40
Julia
ah Product management. So that was my kind of first, it was technical product management. So my engineering background definitely helped, but um ah it was more kind of towards what I wanted to do eventually.
00:09:57
Julia
um So yeah, so I started working on uh like very much kind of a technical back-end platforms that powered yahoo shopping and yahoo personals and yahoo autos we powered a lot a lot of those things and it was it was a lot of fun actually stayed there for four years um and then um and then after that i um i left and joined a startup which got acquired by walmart
00:10:29
Julia
That was 2011.
00:10:29
Joe Waltman
Sure.
00:10:32
Julia
We were ah wal Walmart's first big acquisition. It was before their jet acquisition, but we were kind of the first big and kind of started this whole Walmart business.
00:10:46
Julia
Labs and the reputation of Walmart as being a cool company because prior prior to that, especially in the Valley, um Walmart was not a cool company. So no, no kind of self-respected engineer or or, or, product manager would just go there voluntarily.
00:11:00
Julia
Right. If they could find another job.
00:11:01
Joe Waltman
How many times have you have you been to Arkansas?
00:11:03
Julia
yeah Yeah. I have been to Arkansas many times.
00:11:06
Joe Waltman
Uh-huh.
00:11:08
Julia
um I've seen all of those little rooms that people talk about when it looked like interrogation rooms without windows when they squeeze suppliers to the last penny.
00:11:16
Joe Waltman
Yeah.
00:11:19
Julia
Yeah. um ah But it was actually a lot, a lot better than I would have expected. And I learned so much about retail.
00:11:32
Julia
um And Walmart was actually fun. And Walmart is a very, very, very good education for anybody who wants to learn retail. um Yeah, so so our team that got acquired, we became Walmart Labs.
00:11:47
Julia
And it was it was a lot of fun for the first two years. um It was very interesting to watch how we were integrated or not integrated into Walmart culture.
00:12:03
Julia
And what they, how they try to kind of bring the more of the cool startup culture into old organization like that. um So that was a very, very fun to watch the transformation.
00:12:20
Julia
Yeah. So that was, that was an interesting thing. um And then, um and then I stayed there until 2014.
00:12:30
Joe Waltman
Okay, okay, that was what I was about to ask
00:12:32
Julia
Yeah,
ThredUp and AI Exploration
00:12:33
Julia
2014. And then I left them for a company that was a startup at the time. um it was called ThredUp. um For those in the U.S. who are into women's clothing probably would hear about it.
00:12:49
Julia
it's a It was one of the first secondhand marketplaces for women's clothing.
00:12:54
Joe Waltman
that. Oh, cool.
00:12:55
Julia
so Sort of like eBay, but it's not peer-to-peer. you They actually acquired your inventory and resold it.
00:13:02
Joe Waltman
Cool.
00:13:03
Julia
So a very interesting business model, very challenging business model.
00:13:03
Joe Waltman
Cool.
00:13:07
Julia
They couldn't figure out their unit economics for the longest time, but now they're doing much better. They're a public company now. um So I was their first head of product.
00:13:18
Julia
um And then while i was there, I started getting more into AI space. um And we had a...
00:13:29
Joe Waltman
Back in, this would have been 14, 15? fifteen
00:13:31
Julia
That was, yeah, it was 14 when I started.
00:13:35
Joe Waltman
wow
00:13:36
Julia
um And then in early 2015, we had a challenge on our operations side where we were getting thousands, like many thousands of products every day that needed to be processed.
00:13:59
Julia
And, um, um, thread up because it dealt with clothing, um and it dealt with mainstream brands. It wasn't anything luxury.
00:14:11
Julia
um ah we had a hypothesis that if somebody sent us, you know, a Banana Republic sweater, there's a very good chance that there is another Banana Republic sweater that looks just like that already in our catalog, photographed, itemized and listed.
00:14:28
Julia
And we wanted to explore if AI could find it in the catalog just just by picture. um So that was before hype, of course, of AI.
00:14:41
Joe Waltman
Yeah, yeah.
00:14:42
Julia
So started getting into that space. And ah in in in that process, I found um a company called Vue.ai that that ah started to work with i was i think one of their first customers in the us and then i enjoyed working with them so much that i left red up and joined that other company they were teeny tiny startup um and i became their chief product officer and then with
00:15:14
Julia
started working on building ai for retail specifically. And back in 2017, we were doing Gen AI before Gen AI became a buzz.
00:15:25
Julia
So things like virtual try-ons and like more fashion-y stuff. A lot of our customers who were are in fashion and apparel and um that's where we focused.
00:15:38
Julia
Since then, they've um I left the company in 2021.
Founding Open Wardrobe
00:15:43
Julia
So just kind of in the middle of COVID because mobile.
00:15:46
Joe Waltman
and And this company was sort of like a service provider for fashion websites or they were trying to be their own fashion website.
00:15:51
Julia
No, no, it was a service provider, a retail tech vendor for brands and and fashion retailers.
00:15:54
Joe Waltman
Okay. Okay.
00:15:58
Joe Waltman
Gotcha. Okay.
00:15:59
Julia
Yeah, and a lot of the company um or a lot of employees were based in India. I had a team of 70 people who were, almost all of them were in India. So when COVID hit, it became very difficult.
00:16:12
Julia
Before COVID, I traveled to India like four five times a year.
00:16:12
Joe Waltman
Oh, geez. Yeah.
00:16:17
Julia
So that that became very challenging. So I left them at the very end of 21. And then I started my own company, which I am still working on.
00:16:28
Julia
So that's kind of my last 20 years.
00:16:30
Joe Waltman
tell Tell us about this company.
00:16:33
Julia
um it's ah It's called Open Wardrobe. We are a wardrobe management app. I went through several iterations. When I was in my last company, um lot of my customers were apparel brands.
00:16:49
Julia
And um one of their biggest challenges was information about wardrobe. customers, right? So the consumer, consumer insights. And the questions that we were asked over and over again was how do I know more about my customer? How do I figure out what they actually like and dislike because they come to my site once a season or maybe three times a season?
00:17:16
Julia
I only know what they buy from me, but what what else, what else do they own? And that's how this idea kind of was born to create this knowledge base of what's in people's closets. And initially I started thinking about it as a kind of industry consortium kind of thing.
00:17:33
Julia
You know how banks share information and then then the information shared back.
00:17:35
Joe Waltman
Yeah.
00:17:37
Julia
So I thought, okay, I would be kind of this clearing house and we would enrich customer information from everybody and return it ah back to the retailers or brands in an enriched format.
00:17:51
Julia
um But everybody loved it. I talked to many, many brands and everybody loved it, but everybody said the same thing. Get somebody else's data first and then we're going to give you ours.
00:18:04
Joe Waltman
Yeah.
00:18:05
Julia
So that kind of very fast became apparent that that's not going to happen. ah So then I decided I would try to get data a different way directly from consumers.
Open Wardrobe's Impact and Partnerships
00:18:17
Julia
So we created this consumer facing app. um Now it has like ton and ton of features. We have partnerships with resellers and retail alterations and repair services.
00:18:32
Julia
And of course it's AI powered and it has all kinds of kind of cool little things. And that's what I'm kind of been working on for the last three years now, four years of all, almost.
00:18:45
Joe Waltman
Yeah, I just took a peek at it. So it looks like it's it the the the the stated purpose is to sort of help me figure out how to, um i you know, arrange my wardrobe and i presumably what to wear each day.
00:18:58
Joe Waltman
is Is there something else going on behind the scenes that that were that?
00:19:00
Julia
Uh, yeah, yeah, this is, this is one of the things.
00:19:01
Joe Waltman
Mm
00:19:04
Julia
Um, so for consumers, uh, for consumers, it's yeah, you, you, you manage your wardrobe.
00:19:04
Joe Waltman
hmm.
00:19:09
Julia
Anything that has to do with you getting dressed, we can help with. We also can help with um ah figuring out what suits you. So for women, it's we haven't launched it for men yet. It's coming soon. But for women, it's um color analysis, what colors are good for your complexion and your eye and skin.
00:19:34
Julia
hair color, how do you combine colors? So we we don't necessarily tell you what colors to wear. We suggest which colors look best on you, but it's more about how to combine them.
00:19:47
Julia
you need contrast or do you need monotone? What silhouettes work for your body shape? What brands work for your personality? Um, so stuff like that. So it's, um, and it's, uh, um, um, all kind of available to, um help you make better decisions about how to shop mindfully, because one of the things that we're trying to tackle is, um, uh, sustainability aspect, but not from the point of view of,
00:20:19
Julia
um sustainable brands and materials, but from from the consumer side. So even if you buy or you buy Sheen or you buy which are not really sustainable brands, we show you how to increase utility of that piece of clothing so it becomes sustainable.
00:20:40
Julia
So that is that's kind of the mission. and Our AI helps you ah be more creative in putting outfits together.
00:20:51
Julia
So typically people, especially in men, you know, you they walk into the store, they see the mannequin. They're like, oh, that all looks good. I'm getting the whole outfit. And that's how you wear it um without really being creative. And, okay, I can wear this blouse with this sweater or I can wear, you know, different combinations and I can increase it utilization of my clothing.
00:21:15
Julia
And then after it stops working for you, we can ah we help you to resell it. We have partnerships with resellers because everything is already in the app. So one button click and you list it on marketplaces.
00:21:30
Julia
And then if you buy something and then it doesn't fit or it doesn't fit anymore, it needs to be taken in or it needs to be repaired. We have those services also available.
00:21:41
Joe Waltman
Very interesting. so i think I think I heard a couple different revenue streams. What are your more meaningful revenue streams?
00:21:48
Julia
Well, it's kind of a loaded question. We're still working through it, but we have three right now.
00:21:52
Joe Waltman
Okay.
00:21:54
Julia
We have three right now, um ah which it's probably going to be changing pretty soon. and So right now we have... um um ah commission that we're getting from the reseller partners. So items that are listed through us and then sold, we get commission from that.
00:22:11
Julia
um Then we have ah cut from old alterations and repair services, and we also charge a service fee there.
00:22:11
Joe Waltman
Mm-hmm.
00:22:20
Julia
um And the third one currently is a premium membership in the app. That will be probably changing soon. And then what we're working on, what we really want to do is a post-purchase platform for for apparel brands and retailers.
00:22:41
Julia
So B2B piece, which hasn't happened yet, but that's what I'm working on right now.
00:22:46
Joe Waltman
Oh, I see. So we're a retailer. We'll get you in the loop when somebody buys something from them and and you're helping
00:22:52
Julia
Yeah, so we're basically platformizing all of our offerings so we can white label. So on the retailer side, a customer can manage their wardrobe, it can be connected to their open wardrobe.
00:23:05
Julia
account. So, and then the retailer and the brand gets all of the data about the customer. They have much better ways to upsell them because they can suggest items from their catalog that work very well with what the customer already has.
00:23:24
Julia
um They can offer the services like alterations, repairs and resale and then either keep the cut of the revenue or um incentivize a consumer to not return it. So, you know, you order something, the trousers are too long.
00:23:42
Julia
Don't return them, alter them through us and then we'll get you, we'll give you a gift card and the amount of that you spent on the alteration rather than returning the item.
00:23:53
Julia
Cause that's just very costly.
00:23:54
Joe Waltman
Interesting.
00:23:54
Julia
Yeah.
00:23:54
Joe Waltman
Okay.
Fashion vs. Dental Industries
00:23:55
Joe Waltman
Last question about, about, about your, your, your startup, uh, which industry is more of a pain in ass to work with fashion brands or dental offices?
00:23:56
Julia
Yeah.
00:24:06
Julia
Different pains, different pains. So fashion brands, they're all very nice and they're all very willing, but the problem is money. They don't have money.
00:24:16
Joe Waltman
Uh,
00:24:17
Julia
Dentists are not nice um and they're very, very cheap.
00:24:22
Joe Waltman
yeah.
00:24:22
Julia
So, and then they will nitpick into everything. Yeah, it's kind of different.
00:24:26
Joe Waltman
I ask because i there's sort of a a joke amongst entrepreneurs that if I had known now what I – or if I knew now knew then what I know now about this industry I jumped into, I never would have jumped into it. And I've definitely experienced that myself.
00:24:39
Julia
Yeah, for sure. For sure.
00:24:42
Joe Waltman
um very Very interesting and but very very um you know i kind of compelling wave you've ridden through through Silicon Valley. um I ask a closing question, and if you don't have anything to say, just say you know move on, nothing here. it's no I'm not sure it's a good question or not, but um is there anything that we as a community could do to help you and vice
Networking and INSEAD Community Involvement
00:25:06
Joe Waltman
versa? Are you are you able to offer anything to to to us
00:25:09
Julia
Well, INSEAD community has been actually very helpful. So I've been in touch with Laurel VC. They actually have been pretty helpful. um one One thing that is very interesting about INSEAD community is we have a lot of bankers and consultants And not ah that many people in in the industry that have connections and can help.
00:25:28
Joe Waltman
Mm-hmm.
00:25:32
Julia
Like I need i need connections to retailers. i need connections to brands. If anybody's listening, please send them my way if you have anybody. um And I will definitely do the same. So for me, I mean, I cannot help any bankers or consultants unless you are looking for um insights into AI and retail tech.
00:25:55
Julia
Please ping me. i I'm more than happy to to talk to you. But
00:26:00
Joe Waltman
Yeah, you spent 10 years in AI. That puts you in a pretty rare company.
00:26:03
Julia
yeah yeah, that's true. that Oh, my gosh. I didn't realize it was that that long already. Yeah, absolutely.
00:26:10
Joe Waltman
Excellent. Well, Julia, thanks so much for your time. really Really nice catching up.
00:26:13
Julia
Yeah, thank you, Jo. Thanks for reaching out and and and offering to do this.
00:26:18
Joe Waltman
My pleasure. This is the best part of my day. Bye.
00:26:21
Julia
All right. Bye-bye.