Go Get Your Ghoul: The Haunting (1999)

Transcript

Speaker: How you doing? how's How's your October going? Oh, lovely. it's The leaves are starting to fall. It's beautiful outside. It was too hot yesterday. But other than that, it's mostly been, then not feels like fall in Chicago, which is amazing.

Speaker: The month of October is fall in Chicago. Yeah. Because winter starts on Halloween. Halloween Easter. That's winter in Chicago, baby. Yep. I remember the first Halloween I spent back in Chicago when we had had our apartment. And Charlie was like being... We got into this giant fight because Halloween's not a thing in the UK. I think I've told you this story before. know.

Speaker: Halloween's not really a thing in the UK. And I really wanted to like celebrate Halloween and do spooky things and like dress up and go to a party. Yeah, like a normal person. Like a normal person. And he was like, oh, I don't know. i don't like all of that. Can we just not? Can we not? And that we got into a giant fight. I was like this close to getting an Uber to going up to my parents and just like divorcing him that night. Oh, shit. i was 23 and dramatic or 24. Halloween is very important.

Speaker: You were married 23? Yeah. Wow. I know. I was a baby. it was 21. was 23. He was 21 when you got married? Yeah, i mean, I knew he was younger than you, but damn, that's very young. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I was 25. Yeah. I guess it's not actual but that's not much older.

Speaker: Not much older. i mean, like, in in reality, in the world of, like, living those first few years outside of college and then and that like makes you grow up a whole bunch but like we did them together as a married couple which was messy and you know same same with me and we were together since college so Yeah.

Speaker: So it's like, it's weird, but yeah. So like Halloween's not really a thing in the UK and he just didn't understand why I was so upset. And I was so upset. I was so mad. I was just like, I just want to celebrate Halloween and I just want to do Halloween things.

Speaker: And he was just being a stick in the mud. And so went out to get a drink at our local bar, um, F.O. Mahoney's in Boys Town. Shout out to F.O.

Speaker: Mahoney's. And we were sitting there and it was a terrible weather. It was like rain and snow at the same time. Was this Halloween? This was on Halloween. Okay.

Speaker: This was on Halloween. It was like rain and snow at the same time. And you saw everyone walking around Boys Town in their costumes with like coats and or like trying to like brave it. Yeah, you wear something slutty and then like a big coat over it. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Typical, typical but Halloween. ah But he we were sitting there having a drink and then he all of a sudden does a 180 and he goes, you know what, we should go to your friend's Halloween party.

Speaker: And I was like, but we don't have a costume, what? And later on he was just like, I just didn't realize how big of a deal it was. And then I thought it was just for kids. And then we're sitting there and everyone was in costumes. yeah And I just, I guess I understood at that moment that like, this is a different, this is a cultural difference.

Speaker: Yeah, I think it's become much more of a thing in the UK since then. Yeah. um I think Halloween has really grown in at least like your your English speaking countries. Yeah. I'm not sure about like continental Europe, but yeah, it's weird because it's not a, it's not an American holiday originally. It just kind of...

Speaker: got really big here. Yeah, we just capitalized on it because of capitalism and candy. Crazy. That's something America is usually known for. but That's so nuts. That's so nuts. um Speaking of Halloween, are you watching the Carrie show? The Carrie remake? No, I haven't watched it yet. um Probably too spooky. We'll see. Really? That's too spooky?

Speaker: i like I love I love Mike Flanagan, but you know, very spooky and very alone in the apartment. I know. i will say it's not so spooky. So did you watch Dr. Sleep?

Speaker: Yes. There's a lot of vibes from Dr. Sleep in it. Where you're like Stephen King. Yeah. Yeah. It's Stephen King and it's Mike Flanagan because I think he did Dr. Sleep. yeah ah And there's a lot of like vibes in it where you're just like, oh, Stephen King created this whole like subgenre of people who are in their own club, their own psychic club. And it includes, you know, um what's his name from The Shining and Carrie. And um like, there's a lot of that in it and a lot about bullying. I think it would make you more sad than it would make you. Yeah, I mean, I've i've seen the original movie and I read the book. So like yeah yeah, yeah, it's not so much spooky as it is disturbing because of the reality that we live in.

Speaker: Yeah. um You've seen Mike Flanagan's Haunting of Hill House, right? Of course, I'm obsessed. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The good version of this story. Okay, okay, okay, okay, okay. okay okay okay i've got hi ah The Haunting of Hill House. Let's get into it. I mean, famously featured in this film. That's right, guys. The Haunting Hill House. The Haunting of Hill House. ah You guessed it.

Speaker: This is Go Get Your Goo. Oh. Oh.

Speaker: That's thunder. yeah You got to explain it. They won't know what it is. Every time. um This is the podcast where Emma and Katie decide or they're a part of some sort of, you know, unique.

Speaker: What's it called when you can't sleep? um Insomnia. Insomnia study yeah ah led by this very handsome Irish doctor who just randomly decided to run this study in a giant mansion in the Berkshires. And we go and things are a little spooky at this house. The scariest mansion anyone's ever seen. yeah The scariest mansion anyone's ever seen that was um designed by a deranged child man who looks like a Muppet. He looks like a monster. he looks like...

Speaker: Mr. Hyde is what he looks like. He does not look like any human I've ever seen, regardless of time period. um No, but yet there's portraits of him all over the wall. And ah we I'm just going to put us as two of the people in the study. um and And we're there with like some other people and the research assistant, all of a sudden she gets her, you know, face sliced open by a piano ah the first night and has to leave. and And then things just start going downhill from there. And everyone starts thinking that this one chick called Nell is crazy because she keeps talking about all these insane theories that you're like, what the fuck is this bitch talking about? And we're also doing like puzzles and things. And also so there's just, I mean, let's be real guys. We don't really care about the insomnia study. What we do care about is the insane architecture of this house.

Speaker: One of many things that makes no sense in this movie. Why is the fireplace the size of a garage? It certainly is. It certainly is. What fireplace is the size of a garage? And why is there a flue the size of a battling ram?

Speaker: We don't know, but I will tell you, it it creates some damage. Yeah, it's it's this it's like the size of a a small car. It's crazy. Yep. It's insane. um There's also a carousel mirror room, um a hallway that's a brook with books. In your next apartment, I'm really looking for one of the the hallways that's that's a river with just a river book lily pads that you have to walk on to get through. Exactly. like Nobody comments on any of this shit. They're like, oh yeah, we'll just go through here. no problem.

Speaker: No problem. Skip, skip. Oh, watch your step on the book lily pads. Yep. And also all the beds have these weird cherub babies that also sometimes talk. Don't worry about it. If went into a house and saw that bed, would immediately be like, absolutely not. No.

Speaker: I would never in my entire life sleep under something that had just like wooden spears that just were right on top of rear my face. Yeah, it's like you're like sleeping on a mandolin or something. there's like yeah it's the The spikes are right above your head. It's crazy. Absolutely insane. Anyways, that's right, guys. I'm Emma.

Speaker: And I'm Katie. And today we are talking about... oh Oh, go on. today we're talking about the bad one. we talked about the good one. um Was it last year or two years ago? I don't remember. It was last year. It was last year. Last year we talked about Robert Wise's 1960 horror masterpiece, The Haunting.

Speaker: Yes. And today we are talking about the 1999 version that they didn't need to make.

Speaker: Directed by Jan de Bont, the director of Speed. Twister. hu Tomb Raider 2. And then nothing since that he Hollywood was like, no, thank you. Hollywood was like, he did the haunting that 1999 version. That movie's a masterpiece. Let him retire. No one said that.

Speaker: But before this, he was a very he was a very big cinematographer. He he shot Die Hard, The Hunt for Red October, Basic Instinct, and then like went on to like Direct Speed, which was a huge blockbuster in the 90s.

Speaker: And Twister also was a hit. But then I think the one-two punch of The Haunting and Tomb Raider 2, The Cradle of Life, was... was enough for for either because it's like he doesn't even have TV credits. It's like, Nope, we're done.

Speaker: No more quit. He's still alive. I think I'm done. I'm telling you, he doesn't even shoot. that Like he stopped doing he stopped working as a DP.

Speaker: Like when he directed speed. Oh, well, yeah, he's still alive. He probably it was just like, well, I did. i did the my best work on the haunting. So bye bye. No, I don't think so. you sure and't I don't think that anybody thinks that. This is one of those Blade 3 opinions where you're the only one who has this opinion. And that's that's fine. I'm not trying to make fun of you for it. That's okay.

Speaker: Listen, I have wrong opinions too. There's lots of things that I but i like that are bad. Yeah, I mean, I'm not saying that I like this one more than I like the original. I think that I like them the same amount, which is not really the case for anybody. um And here's the thing.

Speaker: I know this movie's bad. I am aware this film is bad. You saw it when were very young. I did. This was my hook. This was my, this was my, yeah, it was my hook. It was that movie that you watch when you're very young and you just fall in love with it. And then you convince yourself that yes, you also have great grandmothers who are trying to reach out to you as ghosts and tell you about this magical, beautiful magic for you. I see. It was romantic to me. The amount of times that I would. know she dies at the end, right? Yeah, it doesn't matter. Okay.

Speaker: It was the fact that she was special. Doesn't seem that romantic to me. Well, little Emma thought it was the most romantic thing ever. And like the amount of times I would like find a locket or a necklace and be like, this was my grandmother's.

Speaker: Okay. All right. but that's That makes sense. You know, it's like, it's part mystery. It's part thriller. It's part spooky. It's part attention. It's part attention. um I will say as we're watching this, Charlie had never seen this before. And um the entire time he lost interest real quick.

Speaker: Yeah, it's pretty boring. It's a rough watch. It's also like two hours long. um But like he kept saying like every time he would glance up her from his phone, rude, number one, because he couldn't say that he fully experienced the 1999 haunting. Listen, I was on my phone a bit during this one as well.

Speaker: He looked up and he goes, this is like a Disney ah horror movie. What is this? Is this like Hocus Pocus? It's very, it is. It's very, it's almost like for kids. It's yeah very tame. Yeah. Until it's not.

Speaker: It's very. Until it's not. it's It's so weird. It's such a strange movie. Like who is this for? Besides 12 year old Emma.

Speaker: ah I think just me. I think this was actually made as a um a sign and a signal and a message from my great, greatg great, great, great grandmother. From Yon de Bont. From Yon de Bont to let me know that there's a mansion in the Berkshires.

Speaker: yeah there's that I need to go to. Scary castle that's actually in England. yeah that man Slash a giant soundstage. This is the first of Emma's Fun Facts. Emma's Fun Facts. so The exteriors were all a mansion in England. um Some of the interiors also. They don't have these in America. i mean They do, but they're very rare and they're tourist attractions. They could have shot this at Biltmore. They could have shot this at San Simeon is that the castle in California i don't remember what it's what it is but there's there's not that many of them and they're all like well known yeah England and the rest of Europe they're just everywhere it's just Spooky castles for miles. Spooky castles for miles. But the interiors, the insane interiors.

Speaker: Oh, you mean those rooms weren't real? Those rooms weren't real. Katie, I hate to be the bearer of bad news. Those rooms were fake. Those were sound stages that were built and they yeah spent an exorbitant amount of money on them. This movie cost $80 million dollars in 1998, which is very expensive. very expensive. um Some of the like sets, they needed an area so large they had to build the sound stages on an airplane hangar.

Speaker: Yeah, that's um that sounds right. it's It's one of those things, it's like, why, was anybody reading the script? Was anybody watching the dailies? Why was this allowed to continue? And the only guess I can come up with is speed and twister like this was a dreamworks movie and dreamworks had only been around for a couple of years at this point so for those of you who aren't aware steven spielberg jeffrey katzenberg and david geffen decided to found a new studio which there has been a new big studio in hollywood for like 50 years at this point and kind of go off on their own and there was a there were a lot of

Speaker: A lot of crazy swings in the early DreamWorks era because they had a lot of money and yes wanted people to do what they wanted to do. and Nobody reeled them in. It didn't last long. It didn't go well. And DreamWorks is still a shingle. So you'll still see the DreamWorks, thing you know, like DreamWorks animation and all that. It's under Universal now. It's changed hands a couple of times.

Speaker: I believe because I had to watch this on Peacock, the best streaming network. honest Of course. The official streaming network. You should sponsor us, Peacock. Go get your girl. Sponsor us. I think that DreamWorks is still owned by Universal at this point. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. um I will say, so I'm sure you've probably, you'll go into it, but I have a theory about this movie, which is, because I was reading all the fun facts, I think this movie was cursed. Yeah.

Speaker: Oh, really? i did not i I did not read the IMDb facts. Okay. Well, I think that this movie was cursed. First and foremost, because of the amount of times that it like changed hands script, screenwriter-wise. It's only credited one, yeah.

Speaker: Yeah, it's only credited one, but I will... Let me get that out. Let me get out the rest of the intro real quick. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, so, yes, that is Yon de Bont. The credited screenwriter, it's based on a novel by Shirley Jackson, obviously The Haunting of Tell House. Obviously.

Speaker: ah David Self is the screenplay. This was his first screenplay. Then he wrote 13 Days, Road to Perdition, two pretty well thought of, like, slightly slightly artistic blockbuster kind of movies. Yeah.

Speaker: And then many years later wrote the be the Benicio del Toro Wolfman. And then 15 years after that wrote a movie called Desert Warrior. And then nothing, no TV credits, nothing else, only that. So it's very, it's very strange. Like this movie convinced these guys to, to not really work much anymore. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. See, like a bunch of people like didn't work after this movie. um Originally, the first draft of this movie was written by Stephen King. um and then really? He dropped out and reworked it into Red Rose, which is great.

Speaker: Red Rose. It was his made for TV. Rose Red. Rose Red. Sorry, red Rose Red. Yeah. Rose Red, 2002. And then it changed hands director-wise several times. Wes Craven was supposed to direct it, um but then he dropped out to make Scream. Steven Spielberg was supposed to direct it, but then Tom Cruise became available. He dropped out and so that he could direct him in Minority Report. um and um and yeah it was originally supposed to be with dimension films um like tons of people because dimension is miramax so it did so it moved from uh from there to dreamworks at some point yeah

Speaker: Yeah. But yeah, it was just sort of like it changed hands several times. People kept dropping out for better films. um And also Steven Spielberg was so disgusted by the quality of the final product of the film that he removed his name and ensured that the credit made no single mention of him.

Speaker: Reasonable. Reasonable. I mean, I don't know It's pretty bad, Emma. I don't know. so we open with...

Speaker: We're in Boston. Yeah. Well, it opens with a house, right? And then it has the title. And then we go to to Boston. Yeah. and Then we go to Boston. Nell, who you'll remember from the original haunting, is a pathetic loser. Yep.

Speaker: Who hates her mom. Played this time by Lily Taylor. Well, it's not it's so funny. Like the mom thing disappears like halfway through. Maybe even a third of the way through this movie. They forget about the mom thing. And and then they try to bring it back at the very end. It's very bizarre. it's it's Yeah, it's like a bunch of screenplays got stitched together. um Yeah. Because it's cursed.

Speaker: Well, it starts off pretty pretty realist, pretty... um Faithful to the book. Faithful to the book. ah For the first like 20 minutes or so, it's a little bit more faithful to the book. Yeah.

Speaker: As far as Nell goes, so we have Virginia Madsen as her evil sister and her brother-in-law who are like, we're going to sell this apartment out from under you and you can be our maid or you can be homeless. go fuck yeah stuff Go fuck yourself. Also, we thought you should have the car. And she goes, so you're getting rid of the house that I live in and giving me a 20-year-old car. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. Cool. Yeah, it's like a gremlin or something. It's crazy. Right? Right? I did have a little bit of a problem since rewatching the original and, you know, trying to read the book. um Like, my issue rewatching this now is that they do make Nell so sympathetic that I think that like, there is a nice variety in it when she is an annoying asshole. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah, yeah. She's much less likable in the book and in the original movie. In this, they're like, she's so great. Yeah, it's weird. It's a lot of Hollywood script rules and stuff, I think, that happens. She has to have these heroic moments at the end. It's not earned. It doesn't make sense. Do what exactly? Does she have to save the cat?

Speaker: She, I mean, she doesn't really, because I mean, you're supposed to save the cat early. I mean, I guess the idea is that like, you're supposed to feel sorry for her because her family is evil and are going to try to evict her. Yeah. And we learn about the, um, her mom and how she took care of her mom. And she says, I've been in purgatory for 11 years. Yeah.

Speaker: And she's like 30. So she's been like taking care of her mom since she was a kid, basically. Yeah. um which is very sad. Yeah, well, her sister got to go off and get married and have kids and or will have a horrible child with a horrible man. Yeah, the the the child is also evil, just like the original movie.

Speaker: Now, she sees she gets a phone call and we don't hear the voice on the other end, but it's like, look at the newspaper. There's an ad. Call it. And she's like, okay. Yeah, we meet she does. We meet Liam Neeson's, who is... Liam Neeson's...

Speaker: William Neeson's is um a is particular set of skills. Is Dr. Mero, very reasonable name for a person like, oh, Dr. Mero might be up to bad news. you think so?

Speaker: o I don't know. I don't know why. i mean his name is Montague originally. I don't know why they changed it Oh, I can tell you that. I can tell you that. It's another reason why this movie is cursed. um So they couldn't go with the original character names um because, oh my gosh, where is it? that did do Well, Nell and Theo are the original. Nell, Theo, and Luke are all the original character names. They are, but they had to change some things.

Speaker: because they didn't have the rights to the, because the movie had. edit Okay. Strictly speaking, this is it not a remake of the Robert Wise classic. So they couldn't make it a remake of the class of the movie. They had the rights to the book, but not the movie. Exactly. The rights to the book, but not the movie. So they could not recreate any of the shots from the original 1963 film. um And it sort of they made they altered a few things they made things a little bit more crude um and they changed some of the characters ah like the dr montague became a yeah much younger man dr mark way in the 1963 film and here is altered further becoming a very dubious and immoral character called dr marrow yeah so they um they changed the character

Speaker: Yeah, he is um an insane person who wants to do some bad psychology. And he's arguing with another professor at his university or whatever. And he's like, yeah yeah, so I put out this thing for insomniacs, but really I want to test fear. And I want to see how people work if I put him in the scariest house anyone's ever seen. And his friend is like, you can't you can't do that. like that but He's like, you can't publish any of that. You can't conduct this research ethically irresponsibly. And you've leered them here under false pretenses. And he's like, and he's about to start an argument and then they just fade out. They just like, ah, who cares about that scene? We're not going to. And he's like, eh, okay.

Speaker: Bye-bye. He just cut to her driving to the house. It's like, ye why was this even in here if you weren't going to engage with it? like I don't know. It's very half-assed. It's like somebody's like, yeah, but what if? And then just whoop, fade out on that. Nevermind.

Speaker: I like to think that he had a really strong argument. It's just, it was too long for the final cut. Yeah, we just cut over it. Yeah. His very reasoned argument is just not in the scope of this film.

Speaker: um So Lily Taylor arrives at this castle, which is massive, spooky, gothic castle in God knows where in England. Yeah.

Speaker: But it's in the Berkshires. Yes, but it does look cool. I will give it that. This movie in general has pretty cool production design. um ah it's It's shot.

Speaker: It's pretty. like Things look good except for all the special effects. like All the special effects look like Dog water. are you talking about the CGI baby ghosts? Even for 1999. Like, the Mummy came out in 1999. Star Wars Episode I came out in 1999. There's good CGI in 1999, and this movie is not bothering with that. No.

Speaker: they They took a bunch of, you know that, like, alien... like early 19 early 2000s late 90s like alien gif they sort of took that and then made it a baby and then they were like whoa yeah it it looks really bad every time and we'll we'll get into it we'll get into it um we have we have bruce dern as mr dudley the caretaker yeah yeah still alive by the way he looks like he's a thousand in this movie that that came out 27 years ago but he's still around

Speaker: modern yeah um and they go into the house and it's like it's full of horrific statues it's like screaming people holding screaming babies like yeah the the the fountain in the greenhouse has like this has yeah like looks collapsed in the fountain and this this grimace of pain on their face it's like Why would somebody make these statues? like There's a bunch of like giant bronze lions and eagles just around the house. They're bigger than a human. um The whole thing is so big. It's so, and like, that's what they, spen they decided not to spend the money on the CGI. They decided to spend the money on the biggest sets you've ever seen. Yes. Which which are so fucking cool. Which is cool. Like they're cool sets. It looks, it's big. It's so big. This is very like late nineties. Like this is the last time you could do this. yeah like They didn't have many many more years of being able to to build big ass sets like this. Yeah. um Because then it all became about CGI for about 15 years. And then they, and then Marvel came around and it it doesn't matter. Yeah, it doesn't matter. they but But man, the the CGI looks... They should have split... It's so bad. Because there's so much CGI in this movie, they should have split up some of that funding because it's really laughable.

Speaker: Or they should have just like kept some of the CGI not CGI and just had like a person in a fucking... Just use some real practical effects. like Have a person in a curtain... I don't know. It's it's hubris. It's it's yeah like 1999 is such a great... mean, first of all, it's maybe the best year for movies ever. Yeah. um But also, like, you know, they have all this money and CGI has become really big, like, especially after, you know, the the Terminator and a bunch of other, like, huge hits in the early 90s. And they're like, we can use CGI to do anything. Anything. We

Speaker: it we We are on top of the world and we can make anything with CGI. Do you want to see a scary man? Let's take that scary man and make him look a little bit like King Kong.

Speaker: he is He is a little monkey-like. He is. um a like they yeah they they just They thought they could do it at all with CGI, and it took them Hollywood a few years to figure out they needed to dial it back.

Speaker: Yeah. um Because, I mean, the most successful like CGI movies have so much practical effect, so many practical effects integrated with the CGI. I mean, Jurassic Park is the best example, where those were big animatronic dinosaurs that they...

Speaker: use CGI to make look more real instead of, so the actors are involved with something real. The actors are never looking at anything real in this. Nope. And they're too tired to bother trying to act like it is real. Like everybody ye is sleepwalking in this movie. Lily Taylor, I would say is probably the most awake, but everybody, like all four of our main characters are like,

Speaker: They know this movie's bad. Like they are. Yeah. We've Catherine Zeta-Jones. We have Owen Wilson. We have Liam Neeson. I'm going to do it again. Liam Neel, Liam Neeson.

Speaker: Neeson. Neeson. Liam Neeson's. Neeson's. Liam Neeson's. No, it's Liam. It's Liam Neeson. It's a key and peel bit about Liam Neeson. That's what that's from. Liam Neeson's. We have Liam Neeson's.

Speaker: You're like my mom trying to say social security. Social security. um and We've got Lily Taylor. We and like this cast is fucking stacked and everyone is Todd Field in a tiny role where he has a couple of lines playing the character Todd. Yep. Who at this time must have been directing. He must have been making the movie in the bedroom because that came out like, I think the same year, maybe it came out in 2000, but Todd field who would later make the movie tar.

Speaker: Um, he is, uh, he's like the assistant who has like a few lines in this movie. He's like, we got to get her to a hospital. And then they drive off and then they drive. ah Okay. Okay.

Speaker: We drive off. Mm-hmm. At night. We're getting ahead of ourselves a little bit. Yep. I just, I have- You think about it, and we'll get there in a second, and we can come talk about it. Okay.

Speaker: um ah Yes, we have Marion Seldes, like the super famous theater actress from like the 50s, playing the evil Mrs. Dudley, who hates all of them.

Speaker: She hates everyone. And was like there's so many statues of evil smiling men. that We have the Red Room, which is, of course, from the book. Yep. And then she's like, dinner's on the sideboard at 6 p.m.

Speaker: I leave afterward. Me and Mr. Dudley do not come to the house at night. We will be in the village nine miles away. No one comes close to the house at night.

Speaker: No one can hear you. knife Yes, if anything happens, no one will help you. And Lily Taylor is like, sounds normal. Yeah, it sounds normal. So good. That she even like repeats it verbatim. And then we meet Theo, played by Catherine Zeta-Jones, who is super hot, as you may expect. Fucking peak Catherine Zeta-Jones, man. Yeah.

Speaker: Who is somehow less gay than Theo from 1960. It's crazy. Even though she explicitly is like, yeah, so I have an issue with commitment. My boyfriend thinks so and my girlfriend thinks so, but they can't get along. She's like, why can't we just be a throuple? It makes so much more sense to be in a throuple. And Lily Taylor's like, cool, cool. This is normal. Yep.

Speaker: And that's about the last we hear of it. Like Theo doesn't, doesn't come on to her nearly as hard as she does in the 1960 version. He really doesn't. Which makes sense. I mean, they don't want the like predatory lesbian trope that existed in the 1960 movie, but also like,

Speaker: The book is much more explicitly lesbian and the 1960 movie is more explicitly lesbian than this movie that took that that happened almost 40 years later. It's kind of wild. yeah Where they explicitly made her bisexual. They did, yeah yeah. They verbally said it and then they were like, and nothing else for Gretchen Wieners. Yes, exactly.

Speaker: She does, yeah, she flirts with her a little bit right at the beginning but after but when when she starts going nuts she's mostly just concerned for her like as a normal person would be. Yeah, she acts like her big sister.

Speaker: Yeah. um Lily Taylor talks about her shitty apartment like it's nice, which is also from the book. Yeah. Her made up apartment. But like in the in this, it is her apartment. Like her mother left it to her, but it's in probate or something. So they're going to take it away from her.

Speaker: Oh, I thought she was just describing a different apartment that was a lot nicer. that was Oh, it is nicer. Yeah, yeah. She's explaining, she's describing a nicer apartment. But in the in the original movie, like she is her sister's maid and house. Oh, She's like, this this movie is like before she's accepted that role, kind of. It gives her, I guess they wanted to make her a little less pathetic. i don't know.

Speaker: Yeah. oh oh Didn't really work. No, no. I, either there's, there's, why would anyone would stay in this house is crazy. Like, there's iron doors that are like Rodan, the Rodan sculpture, get the gates of hell. yeah And Lily Taylor's like, no, it's these children who are, who who are in purgatory and the demons won't let the children leave.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. And she's like, this is normal. Look at this beautiful artwork. I understand purgatory. i i was there for 11 years. Yeah. That's what Theo says. Were you, did you study art? she goes, no purgatory. I was in purgatory for 11 years. And she's like, yeah, like just blank, just blank.

Speaker: Oh man. I will say, so when watching this when I was younger, it was around the time that we, we lived in Connecticut at the time and we had gone to new, have you ever been to Newport?

Speaker: No. So Newport, Rhode Island, for those that don't know, is this beautiful seaside town where all the rich, powerful people in the turn of the century, 1900s, would go and build their like summer mansions. Sure. It's where the Newport Folk Festival is.

Speaker: Yeah. And so there's, they're all now museums, these like beautiful, gorgeous mansions that you can tour because they're extravagant and they're insane. And I remember we went to Newport, we went we toured a bunch of them. And there was one that reminded me of this house so much that, cause like they had a mirror room there was a straight up mirror room but it was it was the dining room and the you walked in and every single wall was a mirror and it was just so spooky and weird um yeah so haunted yeah theo and uh and now find a mirror room they have it's one where they have the fake mirrors too where it's like looks like it's a mirror but you can walk you can move it's just like a a frame

Speaker: Yeah. And then they find the carousel room. That's the mirror carousel before they get to the actual mirrors, I guess. but Oh, yeah. Yeah, there's this calliope music starts playing and they start like dancing with each other.

Speaker: and they're like, look at how great this house is. It's so fun. i don't know, man. It's all real spooky. um and that's when we find the how the hallway that has a river running through it with the lily pads of books you have to jump across yep which makes no sense nobody talks about it nope yeah everyone that acts like it's normal and it's like oh just go through the hallway with the books and then we meet um i meet owen wilson wow wow and he literally says wow you're so dominant he immediately starts flirting with Theo and, yeah um, he is. and And again, like he's not the heir of the house in this, like in the book, in the and previous movie, he it's his, his house. We never explained who owns this house. Like there's no mention of it.

Speaker: No, I think that they just are renting it for this experiment. Well, they ruin it. So yeah, the deadlies do not seem to care. ah Dr. Mero is going to have some explaining to do. Yep.

Speaker: and Then we have Todd Field as Todd and then Mary is the other one. Yep. The assistant who immediately is like, hey, this seems fucked up. You're like, listen yeah to Mary.

Speaker: Right? She's like, this is like a little bit too spooky. Yeah. um This is when Lily Taylor talks about, they all talk about how they can't sleep and Lily Taylor's yeah like, oh, the reason I can't sleep is because my whole life my mother banged on the door on the wall yeah constantly. where So I'd have to bring her something a million times in the middle of the night. so now I don't sleep.

Speaker: Yeah, because I'm constantly hearing it. and ever She's like, I don't have insomnia. I just can't sleep. I'm not like you guys. I'm not weird. um So then Neeson tells them the story about Hugh Crane. So Hugh Crane was this industrialist who owned these textile mills and he wanted to fill the house with the sound of children's laughter. But his wife couldn't. um They had a bunch of stillborn babies. Yep.

Speaker: And then his wife died. And so he- Mysteriously. Yeah, he built this giant house for for children, which is crazy because it's terrifying and- Yep. Very dangerous. Like, it's full of sharp edges and, and like, high stairs. He didn't have kids. He didn't know about childproofing.

Speaker: Well, yeah. they didn didn't They didn't really bother about childproofing in the 19th century anyway. Yeah. and And then he, after his wife died, he kept adding on to the house. It's a little bit like the Winchester house. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker: He went crazy. Some people say they can hear the sounds of children in the house. Even there were no children. Because he's trying to scare them. Like, that's his ulterior motive. Like, he's trying to put them in this scary location and, like, study fear without, really, we don't know what his thesis is. We don't know what his idea is. He just wants to generically, like, study fear and i'm like yeah i mean think there's a lot easier ways to do that right like i feel like there's movies around this time that have had similar plot lines where they like have even just like four lines trying to describe the science and the reasoning behind it and he's just like nah i'm gonna study fear i have a particular set of skills yeah this movie is not it's not interested in any of that No. Mary is starting to freak out and she's like, we got to get out of here. And she's been, she was playing the harpsichord earlier. Yeah. And we see the harpsichord peg like loosen itself by itself, like a ghost. And she walks over to it and the string breaks and like gets her right in the eye.

Speaker: Yeah. And like almost takes her eye out and she's bleeding and screaming and they're like okay, it's time for her to go. And here's the thing. They get into a car and go to the hospital.

Speaker: And they leave. The doctor, Dr. Neeson's has the key to the gate. Yes. He does. He locks it behind them.

Speaker: Yep. Yep. yep And like, why would you lock the gate in the first place? That seems like a fire hazard. I feel like yeah in addition to- Well, and Nell says that to to to Mr. What's-His-Name when she comes. She's like, wow, that's a lot of locks.

Speaker: He's like, it's a sense of security so that people feel safe. and No, that's the opposite of the truth. um I mean, I guess it's full of artwork and stuff. They don't want people to like break in and steal stuff. But my God, um yeah you can't lock yourself in to a a big spooky mansion, even if there were no ghosts. Like, I mean, hey, he does. just It's asking for trouble. Anyways, the main point is that he has the key.

Speaker: And then that's the last we hear see of said key. Yes. He doesn't even like later on when they're trying to get out. It's not like he's like, oh, i lost the key. Yeah. No mention of the key. No, one they're they're just like, don't remember. Forget how the first two people left the house. Yeah. Everybody forgets. Everybody forgets about it. The movie forgets about it. um My guess is they probably shot that part first.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely ridiculous. Luke. ah So Neeson goes to Luke and he's like, hey, don't tell the women. Yeah. The women folk. But there's a story I didn't tell you. And of course, this is intentional. He's like, yeah um Renee, his first, his his wife killed herself.

Speaker: And we immediately cut to Luke going, hey, yo hey you want to hear something weird? but Immediately goes to tell them. He's like, yeah, Renee, she she killed she ah she killed herself.

Speaker: You sound like Jodie Foster. You know, there's ah there's a continuum between Jodie Foster and Wilson. Yeah, there you go.

Speaker: Oh, wow. Wow. Um, Katowl.

Speaker: And she's like, Azulie Taylor's like, how did she kill herself? He's like, oh, I don't know. I was okay, time for bed. Yep. And then they're like, okay, time to go to bed. And then they go to bed and noises start happening.

Speaker: We get the noise scene we have like the boom, boom, boom. We have a split diopter, first of all, which you know how much I love a split diopter. Yeah, you do. It's weird, though, because there's nothing else in the frame. It's just the rest of the room in the frame. Yeah. Which I guess they just wanted to keep the room. My guess is, they much like the superior Mike Flanagan house on Haunted Hill, they wanted you watching the back of the room because you thought something was going to move, or they thought you would see something in there, which is which builds tension. But it's also like, I'm too distracted by the split diopter to to really pay attention to to... to be scared do any of that yeah because it's like it's him is the the close-up part is him on his dictaphone recording and he's like well and i i told luke to not tell them about the plan is going great and of course he he's going to immediately that was the plan and but then but then the back of the room is completely in focus as well because of the the split and it's um it's just odd and they don't do it again it's just the only yeah

Speaker: Yeah, maybe that they like tried to do something from the um original film and then they were like, no, no, no, you can't do that. You're right. I mean, one of the great things about the Flanagan miniseries is that when you watch it again, you notice there's like so much stuff in the background. It's so great. So many times someone will walk into a room and there'll just be like somebody standing in the background. Yeah. It's so fucking scary. I just got chills thinking about love it so much. The logic Hill House is so scary. I can't take it. I fucking love it so much.

Speaker: It's really good. It has yeah less to do with the book than this does. it really just kind of imports some of the character names. Yeah. And they have the red room and and the door that unlocks and all that kind of stuff. But yeah in a lot of ways, I think i think the story is- from a Yeah, but the story the story' is better than the yeah than the original. I mean, the book is good. I read the book. I know it's a masterpiece or whatever, but like it's a very different thing.

Speaker: it's yeah the The book is very subtle and psychological, and it's you're not supposed to know if if she's mad or if it's the ghosts are real. And in the stories where the ghosts are real, I just i really think that the Flanagan miniseries is top of the pops. like Yeah, like it's great. It's one of the scariest things I've ever watched, yeah for sure.

Speaker: Yeah. um The Bent Neck Lady episode. Yeah. god and now i'm gonna think about it tonight when i'm going to sleep it's too much right it's so fucking and like he stole that from another movie and he admits he did yeah um but he does it better like i've seen that i've seen like have you seen lake mungo the movie that that that idea is stolen from like caitlin and i were watching it a couple years ago and we're like oh it's the bent neck lady while we're watching while we're watching it and like Maybe if we had seen that first, like it would, it would have a bigger effect on us. Yeah. like when you watch that and partially it's because it's a low budget Australian movie that's, you know, an hour and 20 minutes long versus an eight hour high budget Netflix miniseries. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker: he has more room to like build it up and like add a lot of like yeah pathos to it. And you really feel for that character when it happens, but it, he really perfects the gimmick of that movie. And like for Pete, for listeners, you know, who maybe haven't seen these things, I don't want to necessarily explain it, but it's one of the coolest things. Yeah. it's one of the coolest, most frightening kind of ideas I've seen in a horror movie. yeah yeah yeah So we've got to give credit to Lake Mungo for coming up with it. But he did. He iterated on it and made it better. Yeah. Yeah. He really he Lake Mungo walked so that Mike Flanagan could run. Yeah. And like he is saw an interview where he's like, yeah, I totally ripped off Lake Mungo for hunting a hill. Yeah. so it's And at least he admits it.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's what you got to do. Exactly. Anyway, none of that is here or there. Oh, this is when, yeah, Theo and Nell are in their adjoining bedrooms, which is somehow not sexy. Like, it's- There's, for for her to be so, like, protective of her and, like, hey, here's this pashmina. I thought it would look nice for me.

Speaker: Like, it's somehow, like, there's no chemistry between them. And I think maybe that's what it is. It's so dead. It's yeah so dead. It's just, like, you can see Catherine Seta-Jones trying. Yeah. But, like,

Speaker: also not trying. They're just sort of like, hey, I thought you would like this. Yeah. Okay, bye. no homo though. I'm gonna go take bath. Bye bye. It's, um yeah, it's very odd. It's all very cold. The whole movie is very cold and kind of reserved, which is a difficult way to do horror. Like, yeah, because you don't end up caring about these people because there's two different ways to do horror. Like you don't have to care about the characters to enjoy horror. I mean, like, yeah, Friday, the 13th franchise and the Final Destination franchise like go do very well. Yeah, you disliking the characters and wanting them to see them killed in terrible ways. They all suck. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker: um But the ah but the and the other way to do horror is to to care about the characters. And so you want them to not be, you know, murdered by ghosts. Yeah.

Speaker: But you just don't here. This doesn't take a strong stance on on that either way. It doesn't take a strong stance in a lot of things, which is... Yeah. You know, that's not how art goes. No. And then it just sort of like throws a bunch of plot points at you and then you're like, wait, what?

Speaker: what gets so... the movie gets more and more confusing. And I have to assume it's just from a bunch of different screenplays cobbled together. Like they oh absolutely they must have shot stuff on different scripts on different days and kind of put this together in an edit. But I just, I can't, to hear Spielberg take took his name off, it makes sense. But like, I just have to imagine like the the rest of the people at DreamWorks, like how did they release this? Like, I mean, I guess it costs so much money they had to, but my God. didn't really have a choice. Yeah. And they it was at a time that they could like,

Speaker: Because if you think 1999 to like 1963, it was at a time that it would be nostalgic for people to go see a remake. ah Yeah, yeah. I remember like, you know, I mean, I i saw this movie in the theaters because like I had already seen the original haunting because my parents had shown it to me. Same.

Speaker: And I remember like we saw that movie, this movie and we're like, oh God, this sucked.

Speaker: yeah I think I've called it 1960 movie a couple times. It is 63. Yeah, that's okay. I mean, 1960, 1963. The ra its difference is three years. yeah was say It was actually a big hit, though. like Budget of $80 million, box office $180. I guess that's... unless that's if that When did it 1999. I don't know. If that's worldwide, that's not good. But if it's domestic, that is good.

Speaker: No, that's worldwide. So that is not good.

Speaker: I mean, it's okay.

Speaker: So domestic $91 million dollars on an $86 million dollars budget, according to Box Office Mojo, which, you know, is not the best website anymore. Office Mojo used to be cool.

Speaker: um So worldwide gross $177.3, which is... Okay. That's not good. It's not great. I mean, it's it's not like a huge disappointment, but it's... um Yeah, 91 on an $86 million dollars budget. That's not good.

Speaker: you know oh I think well probably it probably opened well. Some of those were my dollars. And then bad word of mouth, probably. like Yeah. Well, I enjoyed it. The Matrix was out. The Mummy was out. The Blair Witch Project was out. The Sixth Sense was out. Okay, okay, okay. Well, if you wanted a horror movie, you could take your kids to.

Speaker: I guess. I mean, if you wanted them to fall asleep. ah um ah i didn't fall asleep. I loved this movie. I'm happy for you. Thank you. there's a bunch of children carvings on her bed, which like... Terrifying little cherubs. They look like garbage. They're very they're very clearly, um you know, computer designed.

Speaker: I don't know, some of them are real and some of them aren't. yes And it cuts between them and it's very obvious when they're real and when they're not. Yes, they make faces. They make, oh God, it looks so funny. It's so funny.

Speaker: What? That's the way it's gonna make it. Especially, like a long time they don't move. Yeah. But once they start moving, it's very hard not to laugh. Eleanor! It's not supposed to be funny. They're these little tiny like cherub faces and sometimes they're like, when they cover their eyes. yeah It's awful. It's so bad. They go, Eleanor, no!

Speaker: Eleanor! This house is kind of low-key obsessed with Eleanor. it likes it is. um It's whispering. there So she hears her name being whispered like, Eleanor, Eleanor. Eleanor!

Speaker: And then a little baby curls up in bed with her. um Yeah, like CGI under the the sheets and stuff. like And again, I think that they had the technology in 99 to make this look better because it looks bad. But it's kind of a good idea. Like having them always move through the curtains and through the sheets um until they don't at the end. But it's a good idea and it's just not executed very well. And maybe I'm wrong. Maybe they didn't have the technology and they were just pushing it. But I feel like

Speaker: I think they've they blew the budget. Yeah, I think they blew the budget. Yeah. And it was a very high budget. this is the this is that They kind of redo the famous scene from the movie where they' they're just trying to get in the door and the two of them, she runs into Theo's room and they're in the bed together and there's banging on the door. Something's trying to get in.

Speaker: And... um And then it's like, oh, it's then they run into her room and it's like, oh, it's in my room. And it's it's trying it's like this this moment of tension, but then like it goes away and Luke shows up and they try to investigate and there's nothing there.

Speaker: Yeah. um but But Theo definitely and experienced this too. And one of the things, yeah the other reason this movie fails is that they don't have any ambiguity about whether or not...

Speaker: this is real like it's the original movie and in the book you it's it's it's left up to to the the reader or the viewer to decide whether there's actually something going on or if it's all in Nell's head and in this movie it's straight up ghosts it's very very unsubtle like yeah it's straight up ghosts it's one of those 90s hubris things where it's like we're just gonna make giant CGI monsters attack everyone at the end of this movie. I mean, why not? It really goes big in a way that I don't think is successful for it.

Speaker: It takes some swings. And here's the thing is when you take some swings, sometimes there's going to be some misses. yeah And this one, unfortunately, um it struck out. Yeah. um They start saying, find us, Eleanor. Find us, Eleanor. have a lot of shots of these little baby cherubs and a lot of shots of like little bloody footprints trying to lead Eleanor around the house to be like, don't.

Speaker: There's so there's a secret you have to find out the secret. They don't think it looks bad is the thing like the people who made this movie think that those those cherub carvings look cool. And I can't describe to you how not cool they look.

Speaker: They look very lame. Okay, Katie, I'm giving you one more bad thing to say about the cherub carvings and then you are not allowed to mention them again. Okay, I don't think I have anything else to say about the cherub. Okay.

Speaker: um a The next day So it's so another thing is like like It's the next day and like during the day Nothing really spooky happens Because it only happens at night At night At night So Luke is like I bet that Crane was running a sweatshop And yeah that's why there's um Spooky stuff happening And then it's like, but but nothing makes nothing makes sense. Like they try to they throw out all this stuff and yeah never really comes together because oh this is the fireplace scene. This is when they find the giant fireplace, the fireplace that's the size of a room. Why is it so big?

Speaker: i mean, I guess because the house is, that because that room is big and they need like a big fireplace to heat it. I mean, i get I've seen mansions that have giant fireplaces, but I don't think I've ever seen one quite that big. I was going say, this one is insanely, absurdly big. It's taller than all of them. Like they can all walk into the fireplace very comfortably and there's a lot of room over their heads. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. It's like a little garage. it is yeah like garage is a great way to put it yeah it's insanely big um and she's hearing some noise and there's some spooky things some spooky uh wind going through the chains and then she's like she freaks out and she's like oh my god things i so oh no wait the the face comes out the face comes out she sees the face in the in the chains which is definitely the flu like it is the lion face of it is the flu yeah And she brings everybody in there to take a look at it, and then they find it, and then the flu comes flying down. Insane.

Speaker: I'm not a chimney scientist, but I don't think that's how flus work. It i doesn't look big enough close anything. Like, is that...

Speaker: Is that ah is it a counterweight? Is it a counterweight for the flue up inside the chimney? Is that? Yeah. So like the that's the like the there there's like a flue with like a stick.

Speaker: And so like the stick part, you like push it up to close and then it drops down when it's open. But that thing is too big to to yeah handle. Like it's not the handle. Like that's no bigger than a person. Like you can't. It's insane, which is why it makes no sense. You can't use that as a lever. No. So my guess is I wonder if there if it's like a pulley system and that's the counterweight.

Speaker: Maybe. Maybe. Like maybe there's chains or something you have to pull to close the flue and that's the thing that comes down when it's closed. Here's the thing, Katie. They designed this, not meaning for it to be an actual fireplace. No, they didn't think about it.

Speaker: We're thinking about this more than they did, for sure. We are. it doesn't matter. This is Chekhov's flu. ah It comes down and nearly kills somebody, but not yet.

Speaker: Nope, not yet. a handhand Hint, hint, hint. They find the ash pit underneath and it's like full of ashes. Yeah, which makes sense because it's a big fireplace. It's a huge fireplace. yeah Yeah. So you're like, oh, well, that makes sense. Like I saw the ash pit and I was less suspicious of the ash pit than I was of the flu. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The ash pit is normal ish.

Speaker: This is when they the the painting has desecrated. Yeah. It says, welcome home, Eleanor. Eleanor. And everyone accuses everyone else of doing it. And also nobody really pays attention to how Crane's face has been replaced by a skull in the paint. Yep.

Speaker: Nope. Nobody notices that. That seems to be um a skill issue that is not brought up. Like, which one of them has the ability to do that? I don't know. Well, also, nobody else mentions the fact that whoever wrote Welcome Home Eleanor didn't space out their letters well. No.

Speaker: Welcome. Huh. Ma. Eleanor. yeah Like, it has to skip a chunk in between a word. It's like that horse drawing meme, you know?

Speaker: um What? Oh, it's like a meme of this, like, it's ah it's a sectioned out, like, it's a beautiful drawing of a horse, and then as it goes on, it looks worse and worse as they try to cram it the space it provided.

Speaker: They did a Game of Thrones thing, too, where it's like they're writing out Game of Thrones, and they run out of space, and it's like, and it's like, this is what the TV show was like. Oh, yeah. Yeah. um Nobody notices the red footprints leading away from it either, which is like. Except for now.

Speaker: No, she doesn't. She doesn't notice. Oh, she doesn't see those? not yet. sees the other ones. Yeah. this is It's like the next, it's that that night where she sees them leading away from the bed. They're like child footprints in red paint. Yeah, but it's blood. They're bloody footprints.

Speaker: um Whatever, man. there'ss There's a greenhouse full of dead plants, and this is where the spiral staircase from the book is. Yep, and the creepy ass drowning man in the little pond fountain.

Speaker: Absolutely insane. is This is where the best lines in the movie where they're like, Violets, someone must have died here. What wrong with you, bitch?

Speaker: and then she's like And then she has the lines from the book, which is like, I want an adventure. And like and she's like so excited about being here. and that is But it's so it comes and goes for Nell. Again, it's it's shot out of sequence and shot from different scripts. In some scenes, she's like happy to be here and excited. And in some scenes, she's not. And it's not consistent at all.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. It's very confusing. You don't know which Nell to like focus on. but She's like, I can be the victim or I can be a volunteer. And I wrote, the face of the painting is a skull now. This is dumb as hell.

Speaker: So that night is when she finds, she's woken up um and she sees the bloody footprints and they lead her to a bookcase secret passageway. Hell yeah. Secret passageway.

Speaker: Love that. Because this house wasn't weird enough. We love a bookcase secret passage that leads her down into a spooky little study. And this is when she's narrating everything. Yeah. And she's just like saying it out loud. She's like, what? Dead.

Speaker: Dead. Dead. She's like, this must be his study. This is his. Look at this. No, these ch dead. 10 years old. 12 years old. They all died so young. I'm like, who are you talking to? Herself.

Speaker: She's talking to herself. It's one those, it's like they just thought the audience was going to be too stupid to follow unless they they really laid it all out. I mean, hey.

Speaker: And then she takes the ledger where all these child's names with their with their ages on it are crossed out and she goes to tell everybody and they're like, you're being hysterical. Yeah. She's like, no, the children, they all died. That's what happened to them. I think that that he he brought the children here. Like, you have no evidence that he brought the children here. You're really making some leaps.

Speaker: Yeah. But they don't look at the book. Nope. He could have also just been abusing his child workers at the mill. I he definitely was. i mean, it was the 19th century. like Yeah. It was a sweatshop. there were everything Everything was a sweatshop. And there were no child labor laws. Their delicate little hands were good at, like... you know, stitching together textiles. Yeah.

Speaker: And they're like, you need to go to sleep. Yeah. yep there You need to sleep now because you're being hysterical. You're talking nonsense. She's combing her hair like Marsha Brady. Yep. And... Because that's how every girl goes to bed.

Speaker: Like, I... Not the curly girls. And... It's um the the the ghost try to start braiding her hair and she freaks out and she notices a painting of a woman Who has like ah the the braid. Like she's got like an updo on the side kind of thing But it's like a weird braid. Like I've always thought that this hairdo was weird because it's like it's like a weird braid like oh oh my god. You know like the Alps. Like it's almost like a space bun. Like one space bun. And then just like wrapped around. it's It's very weird. It's very very weird. Excuse me while I brush my hair like now. You straightened your hair today. Yeah.

Speaker: um So that so she is like, oh, they're trying to make me their mom or something. Yeah. She's like, we're family. This is yeah, she makes a lot of leaps that she that did does not come from any kind of evidence whatsoever.

Speaker: Nope. And she's like, oh, I'm listening, children. And then she goes to find Dr. Mero, but instead she finds his dictaphone where he's like explaining everything. And this is when they find out that it's all like nonsense. She just so happens to press play on it and he's like, Nell's a crazy bitch. Yeah. Did did he rewind? Because normally on a dictaphone, if you press yeah play, like, cause he must've rewound the tape himself to the incriminating part and left it there. Yeah. He wanted to rewind to hear himself and call out now for being a crazy bitch. ah

Speaker: Like, let that is literally what he is saying. Not literally, but like, it is what he is saying. He's like, no psychosis is going out of control. And yeah I don't know why it's Scottish. Yeah.

Speaker: She thinks she didn't write the painting, deface the painting. But she did. Yeah. Yeah. yeah um This is when um she ah she sees, they're in the, the the oh, this is before they figure it out completely, but he yeah this is when she's talking to Luke and and Theo in the greenhouse, and she's like he's like,

Speaker: If you thought that that any of this was real, why would you stay here for a second? And she's like, because they need me. or so Home is where the heart is. is why she's Home is where the heart is. She keeps saying these like creepy things about how this is her home and and like how this is her family. she's like, the children need me. The children need me. Also, let it be known that these ghost children are supposedly the children from mill. Yeah.

Speaker: yeah they're not her children they're not They're not her children. They're not her family. But she keeps calling them her family. And she's like, they're my family. I have to protect my family. Home is where the heart is. Hi, grandpa. like and It doesn't make any sense.

Speaker: She finds a bunch more books and photo albums. And then she realizes that Ukraine had a second wife yeah who is named Carolyn. And she pulls that name from thin air. Yep.

Speaker: Nobody knows. She doesn't see that anywhere. She just knows the name is Carolyn. Yep. And ah she sees the pictures of Carolyn become a flip book and it like points to the fireplace. It's like, go to the fireplace. And like, I'm laughing. Like, I'm just laughing. Like, it's so dumb. It's so like, it's the opposite of scary. Yeah.

Speaker: They're trying to do that thing from the ring. had the the ring hadn't even come out yet. No, the ring. I mean, the Japanese ring had come out, I think. But, like, man. Yeah. yeah It is. It's goofy. It's goof. It's goof troop times. It's goofy fun.

Speaker: Goofy, spooky fun. And she starts poking around the ashes and realize realizes that it's a bunch of bones. There's bones! Child bones, human bones, tons of bones. They don't look like child bones. like She later describes them as like children's bones, but that's a bone.

Speaker: big femur like i don't know if they're adult skulls i thought it was i thought it was uh the wife at first but then she later describes that it's all a bunch of children's bones um because she knows somehow the children lead her to this room that she can't get into which is from hill house and um she's like what's that smell and then

Speaker: big hand comes out of the door big hand goes whoa man door hand hook car door guys like she's leading up against the door and this big like like the abyss kind of hand like pushes her down out of the door and comes back and i'm like whoa spooky we just yeah this is when they decide that subtlety is dead like we're not we're not doing this anymore and it's like You have... it is its It is... I'm going to say talk about it again. of It's like the hubris of Hollywood because like everybody... It's 1999. Everybody should know by this point. like The less you see of something, the scarier it is. Doesn't matter. like Jaws has proved this and you know Alien doubled down on it. like There are

Speaker: What you don't see is scarier than what you do see. You want to to to limit the sight of the monster as as much as possible. That builds tension. And CGI really influenced these people to be like, yeah no, that's for suckers. We're going it's going be all show it now. It's going to be all visible goes, but especially in ghosts, movie especially in ghost movies like.

Speaker: I know you ever seen Casper. Ghosts are scary. We would from when you don't see them. I don't know. Casper's pretty spooky. You straight see those ghosts.

Speaker: You do see the ghosts in Casper.

Speaker: This is when she figures out everything seemingly telepathically and goes to tell everyone. And she's like, he killed the children. He killed them. Why did he kill the children? We don't know. i i have another theory that maybe he was a pedophile. That's what would make the most sense of like, he was abusing these children and then killing these children. Because like, oh the theory is, what you're led to believe the way she describes it is that they wouldn't, they would grow up and anytime they got past the age of 10 or 11, they were too old for him, like Michael Jackson. and Oh, okay. And he would kill them when they reached that age because they were no longer children. But that that doesn't actually make sense because in the in the logs, the he's the logs are faked where he's claiming the children died in the textile mills because he's crossed them off and it says like 10 years old, 12 years old. But I think the idea is that he would say they died in the mills and then take them back to the house and

Speaker: But and then by that point, they were already too old. So how long did he have them in the house? You know, like two years. Yeah, maybe. Yeah. Like once they turn like 13. Yeah, it's very it's very underexplained. Because like all she says is he wanted the house to be full the laughter of children, but he killed them.

Speaker: But he killed them. And then Carolyn, the second wife, found the bones. Yeah. Is this when we get the spooky reflection where with the fake teeth? Oh yeah, that's creepy. That is creepy. um that is And it makes no sense. That is one of the few genuine scares in this movie where she's in the looking in mirrors. I think this is around the time where she's in the finding the portraits and stuff where she's looking these mirrors and it's like her, but it's not her.

Speaker: Yeah. It's like her, but like smiling evilly. And there's this one thing where she smiles and she has this like dead tooth. right right Yeah. it's did that's That's pretty spooky. It's spooky. And then is is this also when she's in the the carousel room and she looks in the reflection and she's like, I'm pregnant. That's a little bit later. That's a little bit later. Yeah. Which again, makes absolute no fucking sense. No, this is when um she's like, they're all locked together in there and I have to to help them. Now he wants me And then Liam Neeson's is like, none of this is true. It's not true. Like I made this up. This whole thing is a fear experiment and I'm sorry yeah I lied to you.

Speaker: And then she's like, just go look in the fireplace ashes. And nobody is interested in doing that. Yep. Nobody wants to do it. And then he like starts screaming and he's like, I'm trying to help people. Yep. And he's like, I want to understand why people feel the way they feel. And Catherine Zeta-Jones slaps him and she goes, you don't feel. Yeah.

Speaker: i I wrote very poor in my notes. You know. um He goes to look in the fireplace um on his own and he can't get it open. So he's like, ahsh she must be crazy.

Speaker: Yeah. She's a crazy bitch. And here's where the special effects get real bad. um This is like, here's where this is the well, there's there's just so much more of it now. Yeah.

Speaker: This, this was, she's in her bed and like faces are forming in ice on the windows and it's his dumb face. It's his dumb face. If he had looked better, this wouldn't be as bad, but he's got this big, he's got this big Shrek looking Yeah, with mutton chops that go all the way around. yeah he's He looks like if if King Kong and like a Civil War soldier yeah had a baby, that baby grew up eating only like cabbage.

Speaker: That is what Ukraine looks like. Yeah. yeah That's what this man looks like. It's it's rough. um And he keeps like his face keeps showing up and he's coming after her. And then we have wrote there's shadow octopus.

Speaker: Yeah. And then the bed abducts her in a sexy way that comes over. And this is where like the windows become a face. And it just looks so goofy. And she's like, like Lily Taylor, not a scream queen does not have a good scream. She's just kind of got this sustained yell. She's like, ah and it's real bad. Like,

Speaker: You gotta to have a good scream, y'all. What what were we watching where someone was practicing their scream? i don't remember.

Speaker: can't remember. It's, ah yeah, so she, and the bed spikes start coming down, and she's just like, refuses to move. and She doesn't move. She just lets it take her. It's a bit like the guy in Austin Powers who is um getting slowly run over by the steam, steamroller going, no, me cut, and it's like,

Speaker: He's like 20 feet away. doesn't need. That's very much what this is like, where she's sitting on the bed very slowly. The spikes are coming down towards her and she's just like, yeah, this isn't real.

Speaker: This isn't real. This isn't real. No. But then they like bonded her up in a sexy way. And I'm like, why? The face coming out of the ceiling looks so bad. It's it's all. And the thing is, it it kind of is inspired by the the reaching through the the walls from the first movie. But that looks cool. And this looks lame. like Well, they couldn't recreate any of that, Katie, because they didn't have the rights.

Speaker: Still, like, they could have come up with something. Like, you could have hired so they did some creatives in ah the the special effects department to come up with something better than what you did. was to say, they did.

Speaker: This is what they came up with. It was bad ideas. Um, then the children's face, cuts to the children's faces, but they're screaming now. And it's so funny. They go, ah! The little cherub's going, woo!

Speaker: And then the the strangest thing, like, she, this is what they, um, she she gets up and she says, um, who was holding my hand? That's like, we, that's a line from the original one, but no, you didn't act like anyone was holding your hand. like Exactly. Like, you just, you said that apropos of nothing, Lily Taylor.

Speaker: Yep. It comes out of nowhere. It's very random. Makes no sense. this We actually skipped ahead. This is not where the bed is coming down to crush her. This is where she escapes and goes to the carousel room. And then she sees herself pregnant. yeah And the the children are like, only the doors can hold him.

Speaker: Only the doors. This is when she goes to the catwalk in the greenhouse. She's going to where, um what's her name, hung herself. And they find her. And Liam Neeson is coming up the stairs after her. And the stairs collapse. so yeah It's a very poorly made spiral staircase. It's only held together with rope. And he just keeps climbing it despite it all collapsing behind him. And he's like, come get on the stairs with me. And like, she's way more stable than you are. Right.

Speaker: Like, don't do that. And then she somehow pulls him her Yeah. rescues him from the stairs. And then he puts her to bed and this is when the spikes come after. Yeah, this is when the spikes come out. And when do we get the fountain pouring blood? That is right there. That is where Theo takes her to bed and he's alone in the greenhouse and he turns around and then the drowning man statue grabs him, yeah pulls him into the water, blood starts pouring out and then lets him go for no reason. Yeah, there's no reason. It's just to spook him.

Speaker: And he's like, oh, that was normal. Yep. And he's like, whoa, who what? Just really brushes that off. um She becomes obsessed with the children needing her.

Speaker: Yep. She says the children need me approximately 300 times by the end of this movie. Yep. Yep, yep, yep. um The children need This is where...

Speaker: He's like, oh yeah, they he's talking to the dictaphone. He's like, oh, they're all manifesting. The experiment's really successful. They're all manifesting um um pathologies of trauma. And that's what the statue, but I need to get them of here. That's when the statue grabs him. Yeah.

Speaker: she's like crushed in the bed they break open the door and see everything that happened now so now they believe finally now they're like okay well now we're all fucked i guess we should have been listening to lily taylor this whole time they free her from the bed cage um the sexy bed cage and then she's like why did you call me about the ad and he's like i didn't call you about the ad yeah the first time i spoke to you was at the house and you're like uh-oh So Hugh Crane called her on the phone. Yes, Hugh Crane called on the phone. With his weird mutton chops. Yeah, he's like, hello? You should take a look at the news newspaper. Yeah.

Speaker: of They can't get out of the gate Liam Neeson doesn't mention the key at all like Nobody mentions the key They're like we're going to hit the gate with a car It becomes a whole huge plot point Where they're like we're trying to get out Of this gate because we're Locked in because we can't leave Because the Dudleys or whatever They're nine miles away in the dark yeah night In the dark in the night And no one can hear you in the dark In the night So Owen Wilson's like hey we're going to crash the gate y'all Well, my favorite part of this is that he goes, we're going to crash the gate. Nell, can I borrow your car? Yeah. It's like, Nell, you've got the worst car. Let's use yours. They all drove here. But he turns to Nell and he takes her car. Yeah.

Speaker: And he he crashes into the gate and it doesn't work because, of course, it doesn't. It doesn't work in real life. Like, you can't crash open a gate with ah a locked gate with a car in real life.

Speaker: Nope. Don't do gate falls on him, trapping him in the car, and they have to pull him out, narrowly escaping death once yeah more. Yep. But while they were getting him out of the car, they noticed that fucking Nell's gone back into the house. because she's She's like, no they the they need me.

Speaker: The children. the door is open, much like in the actual book and and used to terrifying effect in the Flanagan Hill House. You just get that cut where the doors open. And of course it's a nursery just like it is in the book.

Speaker: And she's turning the crank on an old photograph and she has this like... Well, it's a nursery slash her mom's room. ah Carolyn's room. No, no, no. Her mom's room.

Speaker: Because it has the same portrait as her mom's. Oh, yes, it does. You're right. And it's got the, like, the oxygen tank and, like, the cane and stuff. It's just her mom's room put in this nursery. It's like and she's manifested it. Yeah. she And she's, like, doing the crank. And I'm like, this...

Speaker: and She not noticing this. is She's in her. She's like, well, I mean, she is noticing she's in her mom's room. She's like, I'm finally home. Yeah. Ha ha. carolyn She's like, Carolyn ran away with the baby and she was my great, great grandmother. yeah like And we're all related. like How did you piece this together? Like, what are you talking about? the children told her This is the children are my family and this is where I belong. The children. they're not your family, though. They're strangers. Yeah. They are.

Speaker: And she's like, he's still haunting them. But if I'm here, he can't harm them. You need to leave. You're not safe. And all the doors start closing on them. They can't get away. yeah Luke grabs something and is attacking the painting of Crane. And like, oh, you better not do that. Which is a straight up skull nobody has realized still. Yeah. This is when he gets pulled into the fireplace and then stands up and he's like, oh, I'm okay. And then he gets beheaded by the flu. Yeah. This is the like biggest jump scare of the movie. Yeah. It's- Oh, man. Yeah. And we just have a beheaded man going. mar And they're just like, OK, let's leave.

Speaker: Yeah. And they're like, and we out. And then. Oh, yeah. And then the ashes like explode and all the bones yeah go flying and out. And then she's like, guess there were bones. She goes, he played hide and seek with them. That's why he built the house. We have to hide. And then Nisen's screaming.

Speaker: What does he think? This is some kind of game. Yes, he does. So funny. It's such a funny line read. Like, what are what are you doing, guys?

Speaker: Getting a paycheck. the The bird statues come to life yeah and start attacking them. And then this is when Nell becomes like a hero and she grabs like this candlestick she's like beating the bird statue. like, run, I'll hold them off.

Speaker: Yeah. And the like lion statues are coming to life and like everything's coming to life. And then he comes in and this big wave of smoke, we get our main ghost man, Well, she calls him out. She's like, so she gets calm and she sees a a portrait of Carolyn and she realizes that she's got her necklace. And then she gets like, she gets super calm and she's like, Hugh Crane, I'm not afraid of you anymore.

Speaker: and then this giant CGI ghost, which is like, you don't want to show the CGI ghost guys. No, but they do. It makes it not scary. Yeah. yeah And she's like, they're like, bring him to the doors. And you see like the big giant, like 30 foot tall iron doors. And it says like, stand before ye and be judged or something. Which is like, he built this house. So he built those doors. You would would assume so.

Speaker: Yeah. These magic doors. Big CGI ghost looks like shit. She's like, I'm not afraid of you. The children. Grandpa. And I'm going to set you free, grandpa. Yeah. That's my favorite.

Speaker: Yeah. All right, grandpa. and she's like, I'm family, grandpa. And I've come home. And he comes towards her and she's like, purgatory is over. You go to hell. Yeah. And the statues on the door come to life and grab both of them and pull them into the door.

Speaker: And then like Theo and, and Neeson's come in and she's in the statue in the, the statues have her and there's like, she's lowered to the ground. Yeah. And then all the ghost children are like going to heaven. Yeah. The little CGI ghost children go.

Speaker: She dies too. And like the ghost comes out of her, like a, like it's a Looney Tune or something. She can finally rest. i She didn't need to rest. She was fine.

Speaker: He's like crane is in the door. Like he's trying to get out of the door and the children like the the statues grab him and the children like thank you Eleanor. Thank thank you Eleanor. Thank you. The ghost goes with them. It's so cheesy. It's so fucking funny.

Speaker: love it so much. Neeson's and Captain Jones kind of look at each other and like well how are we going to explain this? Yeah. Yeah. Like I, I straight up turned to Charlie and I go, that man is losing his medical license. Oh, big time. Yeah. They, we cut to Bruce Dern driving to, to the the gate in the morning. yeah yeah Catherine Zeta-Jones and Liam Neeson is just kind of standing there shrugging.

Speaker: With the car. Into the gate. And they open, lock the doors. And, um, Mrs. Dudley is like city people. yeah Bruce Dern is like, well, doctor, did you find out what you wanted?

Speaker: And that's the end of the movie. And that's the end of the movie. That's it. And you have to you're led to believe that they maybe were trying to like set up something if that they could potentially do a sequel, which is very 90s move with the like him being caught in the door of like he's being released again. Yeah, but no one would make a sequel to this because I don't know, Katie.

Speaker: What do you think the follow up to our first screenplay is going to be? I think it's going be The Haunting 2. The Haunting 2. Double

Speaker: Haunted. Double Haunted. Hauntings on Hauntings.

Speaker: And that's The Haunting. Amazing. That's The Haunting. Don't watch it. It's not worth it. Or watch it. Have a good time. Laugh your little butt off. Be spooked. um ah how did what was How did Charlie feel about the the movie as a whole? He thought it was dumb.

Speaker: Yeah. yeah that makes sense he thought it was dumb we finished Charlie agreement yeah he's like can we re-watch the the haunting of hill house tv show please instead it really makes you want to watch the the good one yeah yeah it's yeah it's some of the these shots even are reminiscent of it because like they're you know descriptions from the book and it's like oh man remember how good the haunting of hill house was the man in the top hat like Too scary. But the thing is, too scary. so scoy Too scary. yeah

Speaker: I mean, like, that's how I felt about The Descent. Too scary. Yeah, too scary. Too scary. So yeah, so he did not enjoy it. What are we doing next week? Next week we are continuing on our trend of movies that are the blank. We did um we did The Witch.

Speaker: We did The Descent. We did The Haunting. And now we're doing The Thing. Yeah. people did We did an all-girlies movie and now we're doing an all-boys movie.

Speaker: Yeah. Is this our final go get your goal? This final go get your goal. This is going to the day after Halloween. November We went from September to November.

Speaker: I mean, spooky season's all year round. yeah But don't worry, guys, because November, we're going to continue it the same as last year. We're going to some ha ha ha.

Speaker: When spooky season ends, hoa hoa hoa season begins. Yes, it does, baby. master So we're announcing two episodes, I guess. After the thing, we will be doing New Moon. Yes, we will. buddy. Which have not seen.

Speaker: You know this. I haven't seen any of them except for the first one. Yeah. Ugh. Yeah. Okay. Okay. I'm so excited. Anyways. we're gonna schedule We need to schedule that for a night record maybe so we'll have plenty of time. Yeah. Yeah. And so I can have a glass of wine and really, really lay into the lore with you. Okay. Okay. Fair enough.

Speaker: So strap in for a long one, y'all, in yeah two weeks. But next week, we're doing John Carpenter's masterpiece, The Thing. Which I've never seen, so I'm very excited. it's This one is gross. It is not as, it's it's cool and fun, and I love this movie very much. I don't think it's as scary as it is gross. So prepare for that. yeah Okay, I shall prepare.

Speaker: yeah Shall we outro? Let's outro. Okay. Thank you for listening to Go Get Your Ghoul. If you like us, please like and subscribe. Or you can follow us on oh my God.

Speaker: and Now I'm b blanking. I tried to do it from memory. you doing this was. And then i i I thought too hard about it. And then i was just like, oh no. Rate and review us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker: We'd really appreciate it Thank you for listening to Go Get Your Girl. If you like us, tell your friends and please rate and review us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. It helps out a lot and we would really appreciate it.

Speaker: Thanks to Andrew Milliken and Nick Savota for our theme music and Elena Henderson for our artwork. You can follow us on Instagram at gogetyourgirlpod or email us at gogetyourgirlpod at gmail.com. You can follow me and only me on social media, Emily M. Pizza.

Speaker: Until next time, we're just two ghouls standing in front of the internet ah asking it too to scare us.

Speaker: That's thunder.