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Writing, Ice + Arctic Foxes with Robyn Mundy
871 Plays4 months ago
An interview with the intrepid author of my favourite book in recent years, Robyn Mundy!
(Word nerds, snow bunnies, penguin enthusiasts and fans of the freezing cold, this one’s for you.)
Robyn is a Tasmanian author and adventurer, Arctic guide, Antarctic research assistant, and lifelong lover of snow and ice.
I picked up her book Cold Coast in the library on a whim, because it had a cute Arctic fox on the cover and came recommended by library staff.
It tells the true story of Vanny Voldstad, the first female trapper in Svalbard, who defied 1930s gender norms to claim her place in the perilous and male dominated world of polar bear and fox hunting.
Robyn’s sensitivity, intelligence, and reverence for wild nature shines on the page — and I suspected she’d be a wealth of Reskillient wisdom. (Correct.)
Even if you haven’t heard of Robyn or read her books, there are so many gems in this conversation — strong rewilding themes, advice for aspiring storytellers and the unmistakable call to adventure that might just have you booking a ticket on the next ship to Antarctica.
Robyn Mundy ~ The Nature of Ice
Favel Parret ~ Past the Shallows
Sound credit: klankbeeld on Freesound.org
***Join the not-culty-at-all Reskillience community on Patreon***
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Transcript
Introduction to Reskillians Podcast
00:00:03
Speaker
Reskillians! Hey, this is Katie and you're tuned into Reskillians, a podcast about the hard, soft and surprising skills that'll help us stay afloat if our modern systems don't. I'm gratefully recording in Jara country, central Victoria, and pay my respects to the Wedgetail Eagles, the Weebles, the Wattle, the Worms, the Warm Sun, the Rye, Foxes and the Wise Elders.
Fishing and Resilience in Nature
00:00:31
Speaker
Jordan and I only got home yesterday after a couple of weeks on the road and between family visits and long stints on the highway we did a lot of fishing. Jordan has recently become kind of obsessed with fishing spending every spare minute catapulting bite-sized chunks of bait into waterways and waiting for something to happen.
00:00:52
Speaker
For him, it's not about the sport, but the relationship with his food, the resilience of procuring wild protein and the never-ending questions about lakes and rivers and underwater creatures that a simple thing like fishing unfolds.
00:01:08
Speaker
I'm not obsessed in the same way that he is, but am happily fishing adjacent, relishing the opportunity to watch birds, write in my notebook, stare at the clouds and spring into action if the line goes taut and fish handling support is required. And apologies, I'm going to say fish a lot in this intro.
00:01:28
Speaker
Anyway, last week we did some fishing in Bellingen, which is an iconic hippie town in subtropical New South Wales. Bellingen is on the Bellinger River where the water is so clear you can see big lazy fish floating along the bottom like you're gazing into an aquarium. Jod was pretty stoked about this because he'd been trying unsuccessfully to catch a fish for days and it seemed as though in this mythical fishy paradise you could just about reach in and pluck one out of the water.
00:01:58
Speaker
but time and again he cast his line right under the nose of a fish, only to be emphatically ignored. We changed spots, we changed bait, we shifted our weight from one foot to another, waiting for a bite. And in the diminishing light, it really wasn't looking likely.
00:02:14
Speaker
Then out of the corner of our eye we saw a huge splash, like someone had thrown a boulder into the river, and we both turned to see an osprey, which is a coastal bird of prey flapping and struggling in the water, body half submerged and wings beating the surface.
00:02:32
Speaker
It eventually hauled itself out clutching a glistening prize, a big juicy mullet. The osprey flew low and proud along the river, parading its catch for all to see, because there were quite a few of us gawking and pointing from the riverbank, and then it turned around and flew past again in an encore performance before disappearing into the forest.
00:02:54
Speaker
As hunters, we were well and truly schooled. The sheer raw power of a bird slamming themselves into a body of water to snatch a creature they spotted from who knows what distance humbled us. And after a little more research, I found that unlike other birds of prey, which pluck fish from close to the surface, osprey go completely under, totally submerging themselves in the pursuit of a meal.
00:03:19
Speaker
They also have a third semi-transparent eyelid that they can close underwater that acts like a pair of swimming goggles. And they always reposition their catch so that it's facing forwards for streamlined flying, or maybe to give the poor fish a better view. What mad skills and what good medicine to stand in awe and deference and acknowledgement of our human feebleness in contrast to the mighty osprey. And in case you were wondering, we got takeaway that night.
Meet Robyn Mundy, Author and Adventurer
00:03:47
Speaker
Right, so let me tell you about today's guest who's bringing a decidedly literary flavour to the podcast. Her name is Robyn Mundy. She's a Tasmanian author and adventurer, an Arctic guide and Antarctic regular with an affinity for vast expanses of ice. I picked up her book Cold Coast in the library on a whim because it had a cute Arctic fox on the cover and came highly recommended from the library staff.
00:04:15
Speaker
It told the true story of Vonnie Voltstadt, the first female trapper in Svalbard, who defied the norms of the 1930s to claim her place in the perilous and male-dominated world of polar bear and fox hunting. The author's sensitivity, intelligence, and reverence for wild nature was palpable.
00:04:34
Speaker
and I suspected there'd be a fascinating human on the other side of the page. So I was delighted when Robin readily agreed to meet me for a yarn, to share stories about her adventurous life, her writing process, and the story of remarkable Vonnie Voltstadt, who belongs in the Raskilience Hall of Fame.
00:04:52
Speaker
Even if you haven't heard of Robin or read her work, there are so many gems in this conversation. You'll discover plenty of rewilding themes, advice for aspiring writers and the unmistakable call to adventure that might just have you booking a spot on the next ship to Antarctica.
Engaging with Resculience Community
00:05:10
Speaker
There's a One Resculient Thing activity from Robin that we chat about at the end of the episode, and I've also done a write-up on Patreon where you can engage with the resculience community who are proving themselves to be an uncommonly thoughtful bunch. That's at patreon dot.com forward slash resculience.
00:05:27
Speaker
Also, a huge shout out to new patrons, Tony and Madeline, who are now supporting and valuing this show, keeping it entirely listener funded, free from ads for metabolism enhancing mattresses, blue light goggles or powdered spinach. To all my patrons and listeners out there, thank you for being part of the conversation. And here's Robin Mundy.
00:05:50
Speaker
Do you feel some kinship with the spirit of Tasmania, not the vessel that goes between Devonport and Geelong, but the essence of Tasmania as an island of creatives and rebels and people who do seem to embody those semi-wild, semi-feral values quite unconsciously? Do you feel like that taps into something in you too, Robin?
00:06:14
Speaker
i I think so. and And I, you know, a lot of people are really connected with doing something outdoors. And I i suspect the reason is that Tasmania has always been quite a poor state out of all of the states in Australia. You know, it's got a low income and and people have always had to kind of make do with what they've got. and And I think that sort of connection with the outdoors and with nature is something that traditionally isn't expensive and is accessible and everyone has access to it. And you know if you go and camp anywhere in Tassie, say Fortescue Bay on the Three Capes Peninsula, you know it's really affordable for a family. You can stay for 28 days. And and so there's but there's still that kind of ah ability to have this
00:07:08
Speaker
really wonderful outdoor life without needing to be wealthy to do it. When I think about fellow authors in Tasmania, you know like Robbie Arnett and ah various authors, I think their sensibility really tunes into that simplicity of life, even even though you know i don't I no longer live that sort of basic life, um and nor do most people in Tasmania, but i I think it really taps into something cellular. I did want to ask you about Tasmanian literature and that flavour that is so prominent when you dip into a work like Robby Arnett's Flames or Favelle Parrot. It's like a surrealist dance with the natural world and the imagery that is evoked in those novels is is so very Tasmanian. Do you feel like that enters into the things that you're writing to even when they're not necessarily set in Tasmania?
00:08:07
Speaker
Oh, totally. But I also just wanted to to go back one step and say, you know, I lived in Western Australia for most of my adult life. I moved from Tasmania to go and live there. And I felt the very same way when Tim Winton published his first adult book. And, you know, that sense of place and that sense of ah coming from a childhood of living a very, you know, a very ordinary life on the outside, but an extraordinary life on the inside. And I think, um you know, that I think reading those earlier books certainly influenced me and what I read and ultimately what I wanted to write about. So yeah, when I read Fable Parish, when i when I read so many Tasmanian authors, I i know they're Tasmanian, you know, I know
00:09:04
Speaker
It touches me in a way that somehow speaks to an experience. o Yeah, beautiful. The sense of place is palpable. And that's what I experienced when reading Cold Coast. And I feel like it's such a low impact way to travel. I feel like I've traveled up to Svalbard and those like deep northern reaches without having to have left my cozy nook by the fire.
00:09:34
Speaker
And I know you have literally been to these places and I'm so excited to speak with you about them today. And you can probably see that I'm already just wanting to journey right down that writerly creative track with you. But I'm also intensely curious about your backstory, Robin, because I suppose as an author, you know, your work is out there in the world and That's what we are interacting with rather than you and your story.
Balancing Personal Life and Writing
00:10:01
Speaker
you know I guess we're so steeped in this culture of people being brands these days and bearing all on social media. And I'm actually really delighted and refreshed to speak with someone who produces works of fiction, but has a private world all of their own. And if there are things that you'd like to share from that world, I would love to hear them. And I'm sure we all would. so
00:10:22
Speaker
I suppose to really ground the conversation, I'd love to know a little bit about your backstory, where you grew up and what your childhood was like. Well, um Katie, probably touching on Cold Coast is a great ah is a great way into that because Cold Coast is set up in Svalbard, as you say, and it's set in the 1930s. And it's about a woman who was the first um female trapper and hunter in an era when polar bear pelts and Arctic fox pelts were exploited. And um when I said about, you know, starting that novel, I was absolutely terrified because here I was about to write about a woman that wasn't, you know, wasn't even Australian, was of a different time, was of a different culture. And imagining the life she lived up in Svalbard and the kind of living conditions she lived in,
00:11:18
Speaker
you know, eventually I just kind of gave myself this big talking to and just said, well, you know, I spent most of my childhood at a beach shack on the east coast of Tasmania with my family. And, you know, it's what I absolutely lived for. And at least for the first eight or 10 years, we didn't have electricity at the shack. We just had ah data built a safe that went under the the tank stand and So when we caught fish or crayfish or scallops or whatever it was, they'd, you know, if we didn't eat them straight away, they'd go in the safe for a day in a place where they'd stay cool. And I thought about, well, mum every day would have to kind of get the wood stove going to be able to cook dinner and to be able to boil the boil the kettle and all of these kinds of things, which at the time, you know, and of course she was the main
00:12:15
Speaker
person doing all of that. But at the time, it just seemed completely normal. And so I thought, well, would Bonnie Volstad, this woman who was the first female trapper and hunter, would her domestic life at least have been that much different? You know, she would have been faced with those same chores, but one step further, because every time she needed to boil a pot of water, she would have had to go out and get some ice and bring it in and melted on the stovetop but that that sort of early childhood I think gave me the courage at a time when I was absolutely petrified to take on the story um to be able to tackle it and so so much about growing up at Coles Bay which is this um this wonderful place on the east coast of Tassie where we spent every school holiday and every long weekend and you know we'd
00:13:11
Speaker
Dad would pack up the car with myself and my two sisters and our dog and our cat and the guinea pigs and whatever. And just life was was just, we have we just reveled in this place and being able to walk down the peninsula and being able to swim and sail and go out fishing in the dinghy. And I absolutely know that they the privilege of that childhood has made me the writer that I am. Yeah, that's a really beautiful way of explaining how you can tap into someone else's story who on the surface is living such a dissimilar life to your own. But actually, those scenes are all swimming in my mind as you speak. It's it's so very evocative.
00:14:06
Speaker
Vani and Anders in the shack way up there in the cold and it makes perfect sense that you can draw on those everyday experiences that you had as a young person to furnish furnish that that room in the book that you wrote. And I suppose it's a bit of a non non sequitur and off a little bit of this, your backstory topic, but what what arose for me too as you were speaking is one of the reasons I loved Cold Coast so much is because it didn't seem like it was passing judgment on any one thing, because I read earlier you know reviews talking about it being a feminist text, and I suppose there are plenty of you know deep nature connection and resilient kind of themes that lived that live in the book. But at the same time, you are simply telling that story and you spoke about
00:14:58
Speaker
the 1930s context of exploiting the polar bear pelts and the fox pelts, but you're actually, what it seems to me as a reader, you're not passing judgment on those things either in terms of making some grand environmental statement. So maybe there's a question buried in there around Do you see yourself as an environmentalist weaving those themes and messages into the the works of fiction that you create, or is it simply like a ah beautiful expression of your love for the wild world? um That's what I felt when reading Cold Coast, but I am really interested to hear how it feels for you when people call you know call your book one thing or another. Yeah, I'm not sure if that really makes sense, Robin, but there's a deep curiosity to to understand your process ah as a writer in there.
00:15:44
Speaker
Oh, look, I think that that's a great suite of questions. And I know when I set out to write about Bonnie Voldstad and her trapping partner, Andrew Satetel, you know, obviously a book that involves trappers and hunters is going to involve killing animals. And and I knew that I was taking an enormous risk that if if this book were ever to get published, that, you know, that that topic would be repugnant.
00:16:12
Speaker
to a contemporary reader. And I really had to kind of search deep in my soul because I wanted it to be true to a 1930s mindset. And that mindset was so different from what we now what we now know. and And yet the sort of irony of it is that so many of us are still hunters and trappers, but in distant you know distant ways in in terms of what we eat and um the kind of materials that we use and you know in our lives and so on and so um the first big decision was to honor those characters and their story and their outlook on life and ah do I the question is do I consciously sort of am I writing a subversive novel where what I'm really doing is promoting um
00:17:10
Speaker
you know, an environmental message or a feminist way. And and I think no, because ah I think the moment you start proselytizing, not only have you lost me as a writer, but you've lost the reader. And so what I hope what hope shines through in the writing is this abiding love and admiration for the natural world.
00:17:37
Speaker
while at the same time um expressing an element of fear or awe or discomfort that there is when you're in these environments, as ah as I imagine it would have been for Bonnie
Writing Ordinary Women in Extraordinary Circumstances
00:17:51
Speaker
Boldstead. And I was so fortunate because she wrote a memoir in the 1950s that was based on her years up in up in the Arctic. And it was written in Norwegian and published in Norwegian.
00:18:06
Speaker
And I had a Norwegian friend do an unofficial translation for me. And it was, it in some ways, it was so frustrating because she very rarely um sort of led us into her inner world. But she did offer this fantastic sort of everyday-ness of what it's like to be a trapper and a hunter. And you know like all of us, spending a big part of our day in ah in a routine, whether that be cooking meals or preparing the house or ah whatever it is. And so that really became the scaffolding for the novel. And um and in terms of the the inner world, I think what what I am attracted to with writing about women is
00:19:02
Speaker
is writing about ordinary women who are living an extraordinary life and that they don't themselves know that it's extraordinary. And and even if the extraordinaryness is 90% sort of domestic chores, that the inner world is extraordinary, that that what this person is experiencing is eat is on the inside extraordinary. And so I love writing about women who have had these surprising lives but who we'd look at as being completely ordinary.
00:19:40
Speaker
<unk> Yeah and I mean even we're looking into each other's lives a little here with the screens on and I can see that your life there's some coziness about it there's those beautiful timber beams you look warm and there's light flooding in but I also know that you are a woman in the wild and you are on the edge of things for part of your year I'd love if you could describe a little bit about those extraordinary and ordinary contrasts and seeming paradoxes that exist in your world. For sure. Well, you know, i I'm a writer, but i I can actually, I do not want to spend 12 months of every year writing and I'm lucky enough to be able to combine that profession with being a guide, a polar guide on ships that take tourists.
00:20:33
Speaker
adventurous tourists to both the Antarctic and the Arctic and a few other remote places and so for 23 or so years I've been working as a guide um in both the Antarctic and the Arctic. I do that about four months of the year other than the COVID dark years when we were all locked down and um so I have this life which is surrounded by people, ah people who are wanting to experience the polar regions and being able to share that with them. And part of my role as a guide is um to to be interpreting the environment, to be driving zodiacs, to be onshore with people and um to be, I guess, telling stories about the places that we're experiencing.
00:21:28
Speaker
And I've also been lucky enough to work with my partner, Gary. He's a seabird biologist. As his field assistant in the Antarctic, we had a five-mount summer at a Davis station.
00:21:40
Speaker
ah working on a particular seabird and then a year out of Mawson Station as a field assistant working on an emperor penguin project out on the ice. So I feel in some ways myself that ah I've had these remarkable moments of good fortune, which is surprising um ah which I guess mirrors the ordinariness of the characters that I write about, that ah that somehow I've just kind of snagged these fantastic experiences and and just feel so lucky to have had them.
Life on Matzaka Island: Isolation and Challenges
00:22:15
Speaker
And also too, have you been a resident of Matt's Ico Island? Yes. And again, you know, connecting back to my childhood at Coles Bay ah in that first sort of decade before we had electricity at our shack and even after actually, and dad would have this wireless, this this radio, and he would um you know turn it on at whenever it was at night to listen to the ABC News and always listen to the weather. And back then there were still lightkeepers on Matzaka Island. And I used to always tune into the weather from Matzaka Island, which is um a tiny little island on the southwest corner of Tasmania. It's home to Australia's southernmost lighthouse.
00:23:07
Speaker
And back until the mid-1990s, there were light keepers there and a weather station. And there'd always be these reports from that soccer island, which ah would you know be windswept and freezing. and um And I used to just picture what it would be like to live on this island and to be one of those light keepers. And that very much influenced me as an adult and when In Tasmania, there are many volunteering opportunities that involve being out in nature. And one of them is to be caretakers and weather observers at Mattsucker Island. And this is now post the lightkeeping era. And um so now the light itself is automated. ah it's It's a new different light up on up on the hill. The old light still stands, but is non-functioning. And so my partner and I went there for two stints. The first one was four months and the second one was six months. And that experience certainly informed and drove my second novel, which is ah called Wild Light and is partially set on that Sika Island and the ocean around it.
00:24:26
Speaker
And one of those characters is the young cray fishermen. And what is a typical day on the island so, so very far south? Well, it it in some ways it's quite routine and domestic because it always involves two weather observations. So the first one is getting out of bed very, very early to do the 6 a.m. weather observation.
00:24:48
Speaker
and some days when the wind is just absolutely howling you you are literally walking from the main quarters up to the little weather station and it's a tiny little hut that's sort of further up the hill you're just gripping hold of the handrails and I remember at one stage being blown over into the bushes and having to kind of crawl on my hands and knees the part of the way um So the day begins with two weather observations at 6am and then 9am. And then the rest of the day is involved in maintenance, a huge amount of lawn mowing and brush cutting because this island...
00:25:31
Speaker
This island is about two, two and a half kilometers long and it has a road, but the road is a grass road. So the entire road needs mowing as does all of the grounds around the three old lightkeepers cottages in the lighthouse itself. And on both stints we were there um in spring and summer at the maximum growth period of the grass and literally every two to two and a half weeks we would be mowing the lawn and Gary would take the bigger of the lawnmower which was a sort of geared thing this big old German lawnmower and he would do the road and I would do the grounds around the light keepers cottages and and for him it was like he would get to one end of the road and it would have taken
00:26:22
Speaker
um It would have taken almost a week to do and then he'd have a few days off and then he'd start at the other end and work his way back. so So that was a big part of it. And one of the lovely traditions of living on the island is that ah there's a wonderful vegetable garden. And in fact, when we were there, we built the second of two poly houses so we could grow things protected from the the wind because the wind just ravages the anything that grows there. And um one of the lovely traditions is that when you arrive, you arrive to a bounty of vegetables. even Even winter, you know, you can grow terrific vegetables now with the Folly houses. And then your job is, as well as eating those delicious vegetables, is to, from seed, grow seedlings, plant those seedlings and get those vegetables ready for
00:27:20
Speaker
ah six months time when the next caretakers arrive so that they also arrive to a crop of vegetables. so That's the most wonderful tradition and and on an island where it's so consistently windy, just it has the highest ah readings for for wind other than cyclones in Australia. And so it's always windy and just being in the in the poly houses, um working with vegetables is one of the wonderful experiences of that island as well as
00:27:56
Speaker
Just being out, it's just it's an amazing place in that it doesn't have any introduced species. It doesn't have rats or ah but it doesn't have snakes, not that they're an introduced species. But um that as a consequence, the bird life is phenomenal. And the island is home to three quarters of a million ah shearwaters that arrive in September from the northern hemisphere.
00:28:23
Speaker
They nest on Matsaka Island, they they live in burrows, and they begin their breeding season there. And they're there right through summer until April, until their chicks are fledged, and then they migrate back to the northern hemisphere. So the place is just a throng of bird life. And are you the only two people on the island at any given time? Correct, yeah. I mean, you do, when you when you first get there,
00:28:51
Speaker
um you have the TAS Parks and Wildlife people there to support you and train you and so on, and as well as the previous caretakers who you are handing over with. And often, a couple of times a year, there's a working bee where there's some tremendously industrious group called the Friends of Matzachar Island go over to the island and do maintenance on weed weed management and maintenance on the Light Keepers cottages. But other than those brief
00:29:23
Speaker
integrals you are totally on your own on the island. And I'm thinking about that extreme wind being buffeted by that and what it does not only to one's lips and skin but also mind and then that sense of isolation and complete remoteness from the rest of civilization. What happens if you need medical assistance? Yeah ah ah if you need medical assistance When we when we were there, the island did not have internet. And these days it has a so ah satellite dish and it has the internet. But when we were there, we had a radio phone which links to various stations on mainland Tasmania. And if you needed to, you could ring emergency and when conditions were possible, they could send a helicopter, which is about an hour, an hour and a half.
00:30:22
Speaker
ride from Hobart but during at least one of our stays the radio telephone cocked it so we had no telephone communication at all but one thing we did have was a VHF communication with a group here in Hobart that I'm now a part of called TAS Maritime Radio and they every day um keep watch they give weather ah They give the weather forecasts, they do what's called a scared where any of the boats that are ah working around the state call in and give their position or ah if they're in distress, TAS Maritime Radio um manages those distress situations.
00:31:06
Speaker
And so they, it was lovely because they would keep an eye on us and every day they would say, you know, are you there, Matt Syker? And we would answer and have a chat with them on the radio. And they were just such a fantastic support and continue to be to mariners around the state.
00:31:27
Speaker
Yeah, I suppose opening up the question to reference your work as an Antarctic expedition leader as well, what are some of the things that you need to be able to do when you don't have instantaneous access to an ambulance, even if some of those supports are a bit of an illusion in terms of how much safety we really have in our lives. But yeah, what are you drawing on to be in those wilder places?
00:31:56
Speaker
but Yeah, I mean, you've touched on the fact that safety is a is a priority with any of these um any of these trips that you're doing to the polar regions. And of course, you know, everyone has the first time of starting out. And so generally, when you have an expedition team, it's made up of a combination of very experienced guides and then people who are ah less experienced and who are learning and learning from ah learning from the more experienced people. But I suppose initially it helps if you're not prone to seasickness because some of the ah voyages down to Antarctica and up in East Greenland where I work, you do have some crossings that are that are quite lively. And if you can manage it, not that anyone is totally immune to seasickness, but if you can ah manage it
00:32:51
Speaker
If you can't manage it, then it's a miserable existence if you're having to encounter rough oceans on a frequent basis. And then I think the next skill, it well, probably a big skill is getting on with people and really enjoying people. And it's such a contrast for me because in my writing life, you know, I'm this solitary, sedentary ah person that really has
Skills for Polar Exploration
00:33:19
Speaker
very minimal contact with the outside world and yet on the ship you know I'm surrounded by people and they're all keen to learn and so part of the experience is giving um lectures and presentations about about where we're going and what we're going to be experiencing but once we're in Antarctica or the Arctic a big
00:33:41
Speaker
ah Part of the experience is getting out in zodiacs, which are you know inflatable boats with an outboard engine that seats about 10 passengers. and you know I grew up with boats. dead but Dad was a boat builder and and I feel so lucky to have had that experience of sailing and rowing. but when I started in the pole region. So I'd never really used an outboard motor. We'd always, we'd always just sailed or rode. And um so I remember when I started out, my first job was as the bartender in this tiny little ship. And when the passengers were ashore, the Russian boats, and it was all a Russian crew, he'd get out with me in a Zodiac and we'd do spins around the ship and practice coming up to the gangway and so on. and
00:34:32
Speaker
And then when I had enough experience, I was allowed to ferry passengers to shore and back only on calm days. And and then over the years, my skills my skill set became greater until ah I would regard myself now as as a strong Zodiac driver in any conditions. And sometimes the conditions can be quite lively. And so being being a good Zodiac driver is is key.
00:35:02
Speaker
ah or at least learning to become a good zodiac driver and knowing the limits of your abilities and and then being onshore and I think, you know, as well as um as well as the actual knowledge and sharing the knowledge is just sharing the love of what you're seeing and that might be zodiac cruising around icebergs or seeing a whale and and watching a whale from the zodiac and just ah just reveling in what is the most awesome experience even though you've had it with those experiences again and again. I think that's probably key.
00:35:44
Speaker
And what was your first experience like, whether that was Arctic or Antarctic? um I know you've written a book called The Nature of Ice, and I suspect that there is some special feeling that you get when you see that vast expanse of ice and that palette of colors, which I can't even really imagine as a person who hasn't been there. But what is it that you love so much about the ice and what was your first, was it love at first sight?
00:36:12
Speaker
My very first trip was as a passenger on a 10 or 12 day trip to the Antarctic Peninsula and the peninsula is the sort of spine of Antarctica that runs south of South America. It's a it's a continuation of the Andes mountain range so it's very mountainous and and snowy and icy and um you know I had dreamt of going to Antarctica my whole life from when I was a kid And so I went on this trip and you're quite right. It was total love at first sight. And I remember when I got home just thinking how, how you know, I've got to get back there. It wasn't like it was an experience that satisfied me for life. It was just this absolute urge to go back. And and thankfully, i a couple of years later, i'd got you know I got together with my partner, Gary, who
00:37:09
Speaker
ah who also works in the Antarctic. And the then owner of the company asked if I'd like to come on a training trip. And so that was really the start of my Antarctic and Arctic career. And if I think about what it is that really t brings me back every year, yes, I love the wildlife. I love the penguins and the seals and the whales. and the Arctic foxes and and the polar bears that we get to see, but it it really is the ice. it's There's something about being in the ice that for me is a meditation. And and I know it sounds kind of hackney and corny, but it's one of the few times, at least in my life, where I i feel fully in the moment where I'm not distracted thinking about
00:38:04
Speaker
what I need to do and what's going to happen tomorrow and so on and so on. It's just that this environment is bigger than me and and so I nothing can prepare you for the beauty of the ice. It's so magnificent regardless of what the weather's like whether it's a clear sunny day or a freezing windy overcast day. The ice is is absolutely intoxicating and for me that's what is the the draw card that is the magnetism. m Yeah, and it is so, again, obvious in Cold Coast, Vani's response to that environment too, the awe and wonder and
00:38:50
Speaker
breathlessness that she experiences upon looking out over that landscape.
Vonnie Voltstadt’s Trailblazing Arctic Role
00:38:55
Speaker
I'd love to bring her back into this conversation because I think we haven't quite done her justice and all of those remarkable things that she did that weren't common in her time. I mean, she was a pioneer in the 1930s being a woman out there on the ice.
00:39:12
Speaker
And I wonder if you can share a little bit more about why that was so extraordinary. And for people who haven't read the book, and I'm hoping that everyone gets their hot little hands on a cold coast coffee after this convo, but what are some of the things that Vani did and learned and that you discovered in in learning about her story? For sure. Well, ah part of my research, and and I try and do a huge amount of research before before I tackle a story. but um I spent a lot of time in Northern Norway, in a place called Tromsø, where Bonnie lived. I went out to the little island, Summer Island, Sommeroi, where she grew up. I spent a lot of time in the museum, and there's actually a fabulous polar museum at Tromsø with a room that's dedicated to her. So I kind of got to see that the big coat that she wore and a little piece of embroidery that she did in the winter months. and
00:40:10
Speaker
those kind of things. But you're right in that she was I think she was a woman ahead of a time without even knowing she was. I don't think she would ever have called herself a feminist, but in fact, looking back on her think she was some kind of proto-feminist where she wasn't going to let her gender stop her. And and that sort of ah drive was obvious even before she went to the Arctic because she took on owning the town's very first taxi. This is in 1930 and ah she would ferry the the trappers when they came back from working in the Arctic. There's a
00:40:51
Speaker
there's a wonderful pub there called Max Beer Hall. And that's where all the trappers would meet and you know talk about their season and and find a new partner for the next season. And and she would ferry them there and ah back and forth and she would listen to their stories. And something about those stories, and I think this is the power of story, is is it shifted something in her to make her want to go to the Arctic and to experience it for herself. And of course, this was an era where trapping and hunting was totally a male domain in the Arctic. I mean, there was no no other women, at least in the Svalbard part of the Arctic. I don't know about the Canadian. um And the one thing Bonnie had in her favour was that she was a championship shooter.
00:41:46
Speaker
She would go to shows and do target shooting and she won several championships. And ah she was able to convince the man, Anders Satterdell, who was ah a trapper and who needed a partner, that she was fit for the job. And he was desperate. He he was desperate for a partner. Things hadn't worked out for him with with whoever he was going to take. And ah he gave her a chance.
00:42:16
Speaker
He immediately regretted it and he he just felt like ah he was going to end up up in Svalbard, keeping this woman alive, doing the lion's share of the work.
00:42:27
Speaker
while she was going to be absolutely useless. And so he was pretty tough on her. And she, at least for the first part, had to prove herself. She she had never experienced Svalbard. And so she had to learn. And there was a huge amount to learn, just in terms of keeping herself alive in a territory where there were polar bear and crevasses and having to to row a boat um out to other locations where they had smaller satellite huts. um But her she she managed um over the course of that year to show that while she wasn't as physically big or as strong as as any of the male trappers, um she was smart and resourceful and and good at what she did. and oh so So that's the framework for the story. And that relationship between
00:43:26
Speaker
Vonnie and Anders is so tender and subtle and grows in a really ah beautiful and understated way. I wonder if that was, was it based on factual things that you you could dig up or was that the poetic license of a writer working there?
00:43:45
Speaker
it's interesting because I remember reading a you know people rate Cold Coast on Goodreads and they might write a review which is just always wonderful it's always so appreciated um but I remember someone writing well it's based on the life of a real man and a real woman but obviously you know it's ah fiction and it's very a very loose retelling and you know it was all I could do not to write no no it's so It follows so closely the historical record and and it really does in terms of at least what Vonnie wrote in her memoir, where, you know, many of the experiences that she sort of touched upon in a in a very blase way, I was able to to kind of imagine and and write about in a in more deeper ways. but
00:44:38
Speaker
In the way she spoke about Anders Satterdall, and again in a very matter of fact way, um I really did get sense that he himself was a man before his time. and And that while he was traditional in so many ways, he didn't see Vonnie's gender, at least once she proved herself.
00:45:02
Speaker
as being any kind of disability, that she was just as good as he was, but also that she was a ah fantastic cook and and ah really made the hut sort of transcend from being a very kind of primal place to being one that had a few little domestic touches. And while he at first resisted those, he kind of got to see that life that life felt that life felt kinder in a way and so I really do think that how I've represented him I hope is accurate and ah funnily enough when the book was published on Instagram, I got this text message from a person whose surname, Satadol, the same as Anda Satadol. And she asked if she could contact me and I'm thinking, oh my God, this is like a relation of Anda Satadol and she's going to criticize what I've written and tell me that no, no, no, it's nothing like that. And and i I should say that in my research, I desperately tried to connect with any
00:46:13
Speaker
and you know, any of the family and had been unsuccessful. But this ah wonderful woman who lives in Melbourne turned out to be the granddaughter of Ander Satterdell. And we we, you know, we connected on the phone and she she had really enjoyed Cold Coast and she'd given it to her mother to read. And um her mother wanted to know how I knew so much about and acetyl. How did I know the things that no one could know? And and and it was probably the greatest compliment a writer could get to think that somehow you've tuned in into the gaps that through research to research the things that you can know that somehow gives you a license or a privilege to imagine the things you can never know and and that that maybe
00:47:12
Speaker
yeah Maybe you are able to express that person in ways that are real and plausible.
The Writing Process: Challenges and Joys
00:47:22
Speaker
Hmm, I think I need to ask for my own sake and for any wordsmith listening, what is your experience of writing, Robin? Do you feel like it is entirely firings in the brain or is there something else going on for you to have that that perception, that intuition, as you say, the the gap feeling of a real story that unfolded?
00:47:48
Speaker
What what do you think is at work when we are in that creative flow and how do you experience the writing process if you'd like to offer some kind of summary of that extraordinary and and expansive space? I'd love to be able to tell you that it's all inspired and it just flows. But that would be a total lie. It's it's for for at least for me, for a big part of it, it's agonizing.
00:48:17
Speaker
and and it's not inspired. And at the you know at the moment I'm um in the early stages of a new novel and it it comes with a complete crisis of confidence.
00:48:31
Speaker
It comes with how am I going to find my way? How am I going to find my way into the story? Those first few chapters are so difficult and so vital because they hold they hold the key to the entire story.
00:48:47
Speaker
and And at least once you get into the story, if if you only relied on inspiration, honestly, you'd give up by about chapter three. And so then it transitions into and just into a slog, into a nine to five job or whatever hours you choose to write in, but into a discipline where there are occasions and flashes where something just and comes along and you feel really you feel like you're you're writing something maybe bigger than you are. But for the most part, it's it's it's a really slow, glacially slow in my part in my ah world, slow process of ah finding the story and finding the characters and and tuning into the glimmer of an idea and
00:49:45
Speaker
trying that out and sometimes reaching a dead end and having to discard that um but somehow miraculously at the end of it all and and my partner Gary is quite pragmatic and he says to me now listen Robin all you've got to do is write 300 words a day five days a week and in a year you'll have a full length draft and and I often remind myself of that because when you're in the midst of a novel or at the start of a novel it just seems totally impossible to think that you're going to write an 80 to 90,000 word story. and And then at some point, you're on the home run and you're nearing the end. And you know whether it's ah whether it's a success or or not, you've created something bigger than you are. And there's something wondrous and miraculous in in that knowing.
00:50:41
Speaker
Yeah, so comforting to hear that from a published author, the glacial pace of your work. I did want to just quickly backtrack to when we were speaking about the gendered world of trapping and hunting that Bonnie was within. I also wonder if that is somewhat replicated in, you know, the expedition world as we currently know it, as you currently know it. Is it a male dominated experience for you?
00:51:10
Speaker
heading up to the Arctic, heading down to Antarctica, are these places still mostly inhabited by men? When I first started, you know, 20 odd years ago, it was definitely um a much greater percentage of males and just a few females and females were maybe in ancillary roles like I was at the start as the bartender.
00:51:35
Speaker
and but it's really changed and ah thankfully it's really changed and there's now I would say an equal percentage of female and male guides but probably still a predominance of male leaders and um there are some absolutely tremendous female leaders out there and you know I think some of my my favorite experiences has been working ah with female leaders. And so it's a world that is certainly dynamic and has certainly changed in the last, you know, in the in these 20 years. And in terms of research in the Antarctic and the Arctic, I mean, here I am in Hobart. um We have the Institute of Marine and and Antarctic Studies
00:52:33
Speaker
And it is a population of the most switched on researchers, many, many of which are these impressive young women who are you know doing marine studies, doing Antarctic studies. And so I actually, at least in my own little world, I see, I probably see a predominance of women ah who are wanting to not only do the science, but live this um live this more of an unscripted life. And i I think that that's certainly a shift over these last 20 years.
00:53:10
Speaker
Thanks for that overview and also the notion of an unscripted life as a writer. I'm often using the story as a motivation to get me to do things that are uncomfortable or otherwise excruciating. I have a natural tendency to just want to curl up by the fire and perhaps we all see comfort and food in food and those basic realms of safety but like what is it that gets you out there, Robin, and is it the thrill, the the the pure thrill of it, or is there some part of you who knows you're actually feeding the stories that you want to write too?
00:53:46
Speaker
and i I think it's a combination. I mean, you know, one very sort of pragmatic reason is earning an income, you know, that's part of it. um but the But the other is, I think it's a big part of my identity now. And, you know, probably the time will come in the next You know, in not not so far into the future where I probably will retire from from doing from doing working on the ship. And I hope I can do so graciously. I hope I can step back from it because it has been and is such a big part of who I feel that I am.
00:54:27
Speaker
And ah and you're you're quite right in the the places that we go to become the inspiration for story and my new novel is set um in the New Zealand and Tasmanian sub-antartics and that's come about as a result of the last few years working in in those places on ships, ah taking taking adventurous tourists to those places.
00:54:52
Speaker
and you know, and and essentially just coming across the story of a particular person from an earlier era and that just absolutely peaking my interest. Is there anything Robin that I haven't asked you from that set of questions that i I regularly offer guests as a kind of scaffolding for what we may or may not talk about? And I sometimes I feel like you may have prepared responses that are really wonderful and we don't get around to speaking to them. So I want to make sure that there wasn't a certain thing that you would love to have shared in this conversation that um I didn't get to ask you before we wrapped up.
Advice for Emerging Writers
00:55:33
Speaker
ah I think the questions, it it has felt very organic and we've kind of, I think we've covered so much in such a short time, but I suppose if there were any listeners out there who are writers and especially those who are emerging writers, I'd just like to kind of give a word of encouragement and and maybe a tip that at certainly even even now that if you can if you can find yourself a couple of fellow writers to um to form some sort of writing group, that can make such a difference to your productivity and and your sense of ah sense of accomplishment. And you know it doesn't have to be a big group of people and now with
00:56:23
Speaker
with Zoom and so on you can you don't even have to be living in the same hemisphere but to be able to connect with at least a couple of other writers and to kind of keep one another accountable to have your next chapter written by the next meeting and blah blah blah and to have writers who are really invested in what you're writing about it it would be no good me ah forming a book club with crime writers because, you know, even though I'm a binge watcher of Nordic noir on television, um I don't read or write crime fiction, but at least to have writers who who have a connection with your writing and can offer ah candid candid feedback while encouraging you to keep going. and And I think that that can make all the difference um in your writing career.
00:57:16
Speaker
Absolutely. There's so much power in the group, the club, the huddle, the posse, whatever you want to call it. at That definitely, that is certainly something that has helped me tremendously. And Robin, there is something that I emailed you about a couple of days ago and you're extremely forthcoming in a response to that email. And it's a new thing that I'm trying and it's called one risk illiant thing. And you just made such a beautiful suggestion and I'd love if you could explain what that was and offer a couple of those stories that tied in with your one resilient thing. Well, i I thought the thing that I would take on, and if anyone wants to join me, I'd love it. and And in fact, I'd love to know what might come out of it. But the suggestion is to offer a random act of kindness to a stranger. And what got me thinking about that was um
00:58:13
Speaker
In fact, last year when I was on my way home from working on the ship after seven or eight weeks, I was in New Zealand and I went out for dinner and I was on my own. And I don't know if I look sad or lonely. I was probably just wiped out and exhausted. But suddenly this drink arrived at the table and I sit to the waiter. Oh, I didn't, I didn't order that. He said, Oh no, it's from the young couple over at that other table.
00:58:41
Speaker
And this young couple had seen me and for whatever reason had decided I needed a drink and bought me a drink. And I just remember thinking, oh you know, it was was so unexpected and so touch ah so touching. And then more recently, I've just come back from Norfolk Island where I've been doing some research toward this new novel.
00:59:05
Speaker
And when I arrived, the lady that that sort of shepherded me and picked me up said, look, Robin, when you're driving, um it's it's a courtesy. It's part of our culture that you wave to a passing car. It's called the Norfolk Wave. And after a week on the island, you know I'd waved so many times I'd lost count. And at first it felt a bit weird and a bit self-conscious. But then it just became natural and instinctive. and What I realized from that from that action was it wasn't necessarily the greeting of the wave, but it was just the act of being seen and being acknowledged. and And I think in the world we live in, we're so often invisible now. um we just you know I think about the number of people who pass me by without even even knowing, even acknowledging me, and
01:00:01
Speaker
So I thought maybe a random act of kindness to a stranger might be something that that I could take on. Thank you so much Robin and I've loved everything that we've spoken about today and feel really honoured that you made time for this conversation. Thanks so much for being here. Thank you Katie, it was an absolute delight.
01:00:24
Speaker
That was the wonderful Robin Mundy whose books I've linked in the show notes if you want to check them out. And those beautiful evocative bird calls that you've been hearing in this episode are actually oyster catchers and arctic terns and a few other coastal species. And they were captured in the field by Clank Build. That is the name of a field recordist on freesound.org who generously uploads clips like that that people like me can splice into audio projects to create a better, ah richer sense of place. So credit and kudos to Clank Build, who I am doing absolutely no justice to in the pronunciation department, but I will link in the show notes. And thanks to freesound.org for being a repository of wildness. Thank you so much for lending your ears to Resculience, and I'm really looking forward to sharing another hearty conversation with you in a week or two. Catch you then.