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"Special Edition" Episode - A Chat w/ Cougar Great Reid Gettys on all things UH Basketball!
163 Plays1 year ago
Welcome to a "Special Edition" offseason Episode of the No Conference for Old Men Podcast.
The 3 Old Men had the incredible opportunity to sit down w/ all-time Houston Cougar Great Reid Gettys, to talk all things Houston Cougars Basketball. We cover his playing days, as well as his transition into coaching & broadcasting, & then get his perspective on the Kelvin Sampson era. Have a listen, Reid covers some stories that you likely have never heard before anywhere else!
- No Conference for Old Men is available for free via Spotify / Apple Podcast / SoundCloud & the GoCoogs.com website; we're also available via the Republic of Football Podcast feed from the folks at Dave Campbell's Texas Football as their only basketball-centric offering
- Intro / Exit music: Ground Zero provided by FreeBeats.io
- Please follow us on https://gocoogs.com/old-men/
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Transcript
Introduction & Special Guest: Reid Gettys Q&A
00:00:06
Speaker
Welcome, folks, to another special off-season edition, episode number 26 of the No Conference for Old Men podcast today, where three old guys have a special guest and former University of Houston Cougar great, Reid Gettys, joining us for a bit of Q&A. So it's another tip of the hat to old man, Bill Walker, who has a connection with Reid and was somehow able to convince him to come on our humble podcast.
Reid Gettys: Career Highlights & ESPN Analyst Role
00:00:29
Speaker
We've got some questions gathered up that we'll cover from back in Reed's playing days up until now, where he's become an incredibly insightful analyst broadcaster on ESPN for Houston Cougar Games. As always, Reed's been a model ambassador for the University of Houston throughout his career. And we're going to have a bit of fun, hopefully getting into some of the stories fans have not heard before.
Five Slamajama Era & College Memories
00:00:51
Speaker
Just as a refresher for some of the younger Houston and Cougar fans, Reed is a Houston Cougar through and through, former student athlete on perhaps the greatest Houston Cougars basketball team ever during the great five slamajama era of the early 80s, playing alongside both Akeem Olajuwon and Clive Drexler as a six foot seven inch point guard setup man.
00:01:12
Speaker
He still holds a ton of assists records at the University of Houston, including most career assists, most assists in a season, most assists in a single game, and the highest average assists per game both from a career perspective and in a season at an incredible 8.4 in the 83-84 season.
Post-College Career & ESPN Journey
00:01:35
Speaker
Reed was also drafted by the Chicago Bulls after finishing his playing days at Houston. And beyond his post-playing career as a successful lawyer, he continues to be connected to the sport of college basketball as an ESPN analyst for ESPN. Welcome to the podcast, Reed. And thanks so much for taking the time out from your busy schedule. Anything you wanted to say to our listeners to kick things off before I turned it over to Bill to begin the interview?
Podcast Appearance Surprise & Houston Big 12 Move
00:02:00
Speaker
Yeah, I guess I'm surprised. So when y'all first reached out to me and told me the name, no conference for old men, I thought, why haven't I talked to these guys before now?
00:02:12
Speaker
We do just, we kick this off as kind of an homage to our team joining the Big 12. Right. And we thought our program just deserved a dedicated basketball podcast. And we agreed that for three old guys that are either in retirement or close to retirement, that we're going to give it a go. So thanks so much. I certainly qualify for all those. So it'll be fun to talk to you. Yes. Yeah, absolutely. And thanks again so much for your time.
00:02:42
Speaker
You're back. All right. Well, I think, Reed, we've kind of got this set up from playing days and then getting into some U of H history and then the current team and the current makeup and so forth.
Unexpected Recruitment & Coach Lewis
00:03:00
Speaker
So Steve's kind of composed a lot of these questions. I'll probably
00:03:05
Speaker
but either butcher them or ad lib to some extent. But yeah, we'll get going here. And the first one has to do with obviously you going to U of H, the recruitment, and we're just curious about how you were recruited coming out of Memorial and the initial interactions with Guy V and how that all played out.
00:03:26
Speaker
Yeah, so interesting story. So my my dad and mom both went to Texas Tech. Yeah, my dad was a four year all American football player. 47 to 50 went both ways offensive and defensive tackle.
00:03:45
Speaker
And so I grew up, to say I was a big Red Raider fan would be an unbelievable understatement. You know, I mean, curtains, bedspread, pillows, t-shirts, you know, everything in my room was red and black and had a double T on it. So I grew up dreaming about playing at Texas Tech for Joe Myers. And Joe Myers was at Texas Tech when my dad was there playing football and they knew each other.
00:04:14
Speaker
And so I just always assumed that, you know, that's how it would play out. I wasn't, it's interesting because the, we had a playoff game my senior year and I hadn't heard much from anybody, heard a little bit from Arkansas, a little bit from SMU, hadn't heard from Texas Tech at all. And U of H wasn't even on the radar. They hadn't reached out to me. And the thought of a Memorial kid going over to U of H was, you know, was a foreign concept to say the least.
00:04:45
Speaker
And so we had a playoff game, and we were playing in hall finds, and we were playing Madison. And Eric Dickens was a McDonald All-American. Ended up being a teammate at U of H, but he was the superstar for Madison.
Scholarship Offer from Coach Lewis
00:05:01
Speaker
And as we were warming up, I looked over at the table, and Gerald Myers is sitting there mid-court, and Coach Lewis is sitting next to him. And I thought, man, this is it. It's all gonna come together.
00:05:14
Speaker
And so we ended up, we lost. Eric had a really good team and it was close. And afterwards, you know, my coach said, hey, you know, there's a coach out in the hall wants to talk to you.
00:05:28
Speaker
And I thought, man, this is it. This is so awesome. I got out in the hall, and Coach Myers is standing out there, and we kind of small talk a second. He starts off with how much he respects my dad. And this was really classy of him, because a lot of coaches wouldn't have a difficult conversation with a kid, and especially a kid that was kind of a legacy to Texas Tech. But he just said, look, I don't think you can play for me.
00:05:56
Speaker
I don't think you can play at our level and the way we play. And I just wanted to tell you that because I know, you know, I've had a lot of people reach out and I know you want to come here, but I'd be doing you a disservice. I just don't think you can play here. So, you know, that's devastating. You know, just my high school career just ended. I had no prospects on the horizon. Yeah, I go back in the locker room and I'm just almost numb.
00:06:26
Speaker
And Coach Coleman came back in and grabbed me again. He goes, hey, there's a coach out in the hall who wants to talk to you. And I'm thinking, well, I already talked to him. What else does he have to say? And so I walk out in the hall and Coach Lewis is standing there.
00:06:42
Speaker
And, you know, I'm a native Houstonian. I know Coach Lewis and I grew up going to games. And, you know, and one of my fondest memories is watching U of H beat Arkansas and the triplets and hall finds. And so it wasn't like I didn't know who Coach Lewis was. In fact, I was at the game of the century with my dad and two brothers. And so, you know, I was like, wow, I said, you know, hey, Coach Lewis, he goes, hey, I want you to come play for me.
00:07:10
Speaker
And I'm thinking, what? He goes, yeah, I want you, we're going to set up a time, we're going to come to your house, we're going to offer you a scholarship, but I want you to come play for me. And I said, hey, coach, I just talked to Gerald Myers and Gerald Myers said I couldn't play for him. And the guy goes, well, I think you can play for me.
00:07:32
Speaker
Nice. That's awesome. Yeah. That was it. So my recruitment came down. I had to decide between U of H and the Sigma Chi's at University of Texas.
Transition to College Basketball & Point Guard Evolution
00:07:44
Speaker
And so I had one offer. I didn't have a junior college offer. I didn't, you know, not Sam Houston, not HBU, not Steven F. Austin. I had one offer.
00:07:54
Speaker
That's incredible. And all in the same day, right? That's just crazy. All in the same day. And so it was cool. When Coach Lewis and Coach Swarrick finally came out to the house, they came. It was, I don't know, about three or four days later. But in between when I talked to him and they came to the house, there's a huge article on the front page. I can't remember whether it was the post at the time of Chronicle about a key.
00:08:18
Speaker
And so it was a picture and you know, I remember like it was yesterday and we had those, those goals, you know, that had kind of almost like monkey bars, all the pipes behind it. He's standing there and he's got his arms up like this, you know, and he's just arms and legs everywhere.
00:08:34
Speaker
There's this big article you know about a key melodia one and you know at the time he was you know they say seven feet he was six ten whatever he was but he weighed about a buck seventy five you know it is it is interesting because that I guess it may have been the same day cuz Lewis and cuz where I was sitting in my living room.
00:08:54
Speaker
and my mom and dad and any, you know, coach Lewis, they small talk a little bit and talk about how, you know, we're offering you a scholarship and I'm trying to act like I expected it. I'm thinking, why? And so I said, Hey, you know, they said, do you have any questions? And I said, well, I know everything about the school. I said, I do have a question though. That Alonjuan guy, can he play?
00:09:21
Speaker
Nice. They looked at each other for a long time. They were just quiet looking at each other. And then finally, Coach Lewis smiled and turned around and he goes,
00:09:35
Speaker
Well, we think he's going to be pretty good. I remember when a lot of them first came to campus without social media and all this, but people around campus were saying, is this guy any good? And some would say, yeah, he's really good. And others said, no, he can't play. So it was.
00:09:59
Speaker
Well, it's amazing because there were so many urban myths about him. And the reality is, he couldn't play very long because his back couldn't hold up. I mean, he literally weighed about $1.85. And there were a lot of stories out there about, you know, he came from a wealthy family, a concrete company and, you know, come on. That wasn't his background. And so he was finally, you know, eating steaks and he had changed his diet and
00:10:26
Speaker
It took him a while, took his body, his frame a while to be able to hold up to what he was trying to put it through. So I remember he actually got to the U of H a semester before and didn't play that spring semester. But I remember that whole summer and most of the first year, he was just trying to get his body under him. He would do freakish things in practice.
00:10:52
Speaker
But it was in between his freshman year and his sophomore year that he went from scrawny, strangling, looked like a baby giraffe trying to run down the court to a full grown man and turned into a beast. It was really almost felt like it was like a three month transformation.
00:11:16
Speaker
So, you know, one question I've always wanted to ask you, right, especially I'd read about you of H being your only offer. And for you to come in, and then the evolution of your own game over a very short period of time where
00:11:32
Speaker
you became a six foot seven point guard, which was unheard of back in those days. And I can't believe that you played point guard in high school. So how did that evolution occur to where you became a primary ball handler and pastor? And we're talking about at a time in the Southwest Conference where you're trying to bring up the ball against folks like Darrell Walker and Alvin Robertson, right? Some of the toughest guards even even compared to today's kids. And so how did how did that evolution occur for your game?
00:12:02
Speaker
You know, it's interesting. It almost out of necessity. So growing up, we were blessed at our church. There was a man who ran the Little League basketball program. And to this day, his name was Ralph Mills. Ralph Mills knew more about basketball than anybody I've ever been around. And so I'm talking about from the time I was
00:12:23
Speaker
eight, nine, 10, 11, and 12 playing for Coach Mills. He used to come to U of H games, and after the game, you know, I think I'm going to go to him, and he said, oh, you were so great. You know, and I'd walk up to him, he's like, why are you throwing bounce passes on the line? I mean, you know, it was like, oh, got you, Coach. But anyway, so growing up, I had a brother just one year older than me, who was kind of the same height, but was big, thick, and slow.
00:12:47
Speaker
And so Coach Mills early on in my development said, we're going to teach you how to be a point guard because your brother's going to be inside. So then I grew up playing point guard and then also played inside. And then when we got to high school, my senior year, we had a huge team. We had a 6'9 kid that ended up going to TCU. We had a 6'7 wing that went to Arkansas.
00:13:15
Speaker
Um, and we had a six five kid that went to Vanderbilt. I mean, we, we were loaded, uh, uh, and we were big, but our point guard son, I mean, he was just, he was, he puckered and he was scared to bring the ball up the floor. So, so inevitably, um, uh, in high school, I would bring the ball up the floor, hand it off to him and then we'd run the set, but I'd bring it up.
00:13:39
Speaker
So it's interesting because I went to U of H as a shooter. That was my job. I was a catch and shoot guy. And so for the first, I don't know, 10 games in my career, I didn't play much. By that time, I was stupid enough to be mad about that and not appreciating who I was competing with and against. But the competitor in me, it just made me furious.
00:14:10
Speaker
And my dad had, you know, was such a wise man. And after the, you know, I remember sitting in the, um, uh, uh, Bennegans over there all five, 45, um, after a game and I just, I can't even see straight, you know, I played like a minute 30. Uh, and I'm thinking this is stupid. You know, I'm miserable. You know, so my dad's like, you know, well, how are you playing in practice?
00:14:37
Speaker
Dad, I'm playing great. I mean, really, I'm playing as well as I've ever played in my life. He goes, well, how are you shooting? I said, I'm shooting great. I mean, I'm knocking down, I bet I'm shooting 65%. I said, I'm knocking down everything. And he goes, thinks a second, he goes, hmm, maybe that's not what he wants. I looked at him and went, what do you mean? He goes, well, you're telling me that you're shooting great and you're not playing.
00:15:06
Speaker
He goes, why don't you try something else? And I said, well, I'm a shooter. I was recruited to be a shooter. He kind of laughed. He goes, well, how's that going? And I said, it's not going very well. And he goes, let me ask you a question. He goes, is there anything on the team that nobody else does? I go, yeah, nobody passes. I said, nobody passes. And he goes, because I have an idea. Why don't you try to become the best passer on the team? That's brilliant.
00:15:36
Speaker
And it really was. It was like a light bulb went off. So the next day in practice, man, I was turning down shots, and I'm passing and passing. In a couple of weeks or two or three weeks, somebody got hurt. I can't remember who it was. But in practice, I'm running the second team point guard, going against Rob Williams, who was maybe one of the greatest we've ever had. But I'm playing point guard, and after practice,
00:16:03
Speaker
In the dorm, my high school coach called me, Coach Coleman, and he goes, hey, Coach Lewis called me today. And I was like, why'd he call you? He goes, he called me and he goes, did you know that Reid could play point guard? And I said, what'd you tell him? He goes, of course I knew it. I told him that we use it that way all the time, that you played all five positions for me.
00:16:25
Speaker
And so from that day forward, I, you know, I was a point guard and I realized that it didn't matter how well I shot, you know, Eric Dickens was a McDonald all American. He couldn't get on the floor. Um, we, we had guys that were, you know, it's a matter of saying, Hey, I gotta, I gotta find something nobody else is doing and make my, make it, make it to where it's really hard for coach Lewis to take me off the floor. Nice.
00:16:50
Speaker
That's brilliant. Hey Reed, was there a transition from high school to U of H as far as style of play from Coach Coleman to Coach Lewis? That's going from Bobby Knight to Guy Lewis.
00:17:05
Speaker
You know, we in high school, literally, we didn't dribble the ball more than twice. It was pass cut, pass screen, screen cut, pass. And it's funny because I really, around Coach Lewis and Coach Swarrock, you know, acted like I belonged and I'm thinking,
00:17:23
Speaker
So a quick story. So first day of practice, you walk in and we're scrimmaging before we get started. And I mean, the guys are just, it's just unlike anything I've ever seen in my life. Okay. So, so I've never dumped a ball in high school for, forget the fact that I'm six, six never dumped a ball.
First College Practice & Playing Own Game Lesson
00:17:41
Speaker
And all of a sudden, you know, I'm seeing Clyde coming down on the wing and he's got the ball by
00:17:48
Speaker
He's jumping up and he's pinning the ball above the top of the square and I'm like, oh, this is unbelievable. So we're doing a one-on-one drill and Eric Deggans is guarding me and I'm bringing the ball down the floor and I'm a right hand, left hand, crossover, protect the ball. And suddenly, man, I'm dribbling between my legs and I'm dribbling behind my back and I'm spinning.
00:18:16
Speaker
You know, somehow I get by him and I know how I got by him and I thought I'm going to duck it and show everybody I belong. I jumped up and stuck the ball on the rim. Feet don't fly out from under me. I'm laying flat on my back on the floor. You know, everybody's laughing. I'm thinking, oh my gosh. Coach Lewis calls me over and gets me. What was that?
00:18:47
Speaker
And I'm like, what do you mean, Coach? He goes, what was that? I said, that's just how I play. And he's like, that's how you play? I'm like, yeah, yes, sir. He said, I want you to do me a favor. He said, next time you get a breakaway while we're playing, I want you to dunk it. I want you to go in. I don't care if somebody's there. I don't care what. He said, I want you to go in and dunk it.
00:19:11
Speaker
Oh, yes, sir. Yes, sir. So we're scrimmaging and, you know, I see a lane open up and I start driving through the middle of the lane and Larry Michal, 6'9", 265, Mr. Mean on one side, and a king's kind of behind him. I'm dribbling in, I plant my foot, I jump up as high as I can. And Larry just goes like this.
00:19:39
Speaker
He doesn't even move and I'm thinking, man, I got him. A king doesn't jump. He doesn't stand up on his toes. He goes like this. He blocked my dunk flat footed and I'm sprawled out again for the second time. This is the first practice of my college career and I'm sprawled out again.
00:20:01
Speaker
And coach Lizzo is at the end of practice, he goes, you know, get a shower and I was seeing my office. I'm thinking, crap, there goes my scholarship. I'm one day in and there goes my scholarship. So I go into his office and he's like, well, I was all that. And I said, coach, that, and he goes, before you tell me that's how you play, that's not how you play. And I said, no, sir, it's not.
00:20:31
Speaker
And I said, he goes, well, then what was that? What were you doing? I said, well, when I got out there, that's why everybody else was playing. And I'm just trying to fit in. And he looks at me and it was one of the most profound lessons I've ever learned in life. He looked at me, he goes, I have an idea. He said, how about you just do you? And you let me figure out how to blend it all together.
00:20:56
Speaker
He said, you just play the way you play with your skill set and trust me that I can figure out how to put that with Clyde, McKee, and everybody else. He goes, you think you can do that? I was like.
00:21:07
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, I can do that. He goes, okay, let's try that tomorrow. Nice. Nice. So that was my adjustment. Nice. So I know before we started the podcast, we had chatted a little bit around your playing days after you have aged and believe you were drafted by the Chicago Bulls.
Brief Stint with Chicago Bulls & Experiences
00:21:26
Speaker
It made it into camp.
00:21:28
Speaker
I think one of the things that fans might find interesting was obviously you had a number of years playing with Clyde and seeing that up close, obviously one of the greatest athletes to play the game of basketball. But then you also had the chance to play a bit with Michael Jordan as well. A bit being the operative word. My NBA career lasted from Tuesday at noon to Wednesday at noon.
00:21:58
Speaker
So it's funny, my brother was always really, really supportive, an older brother, was always really, really supportive of me. And so he's driving me to the airport when I'm going to the Bulls camp. And he's like, give me this pep talk. You can make this team. They're not anybody you can't play with. You dreamed about this. You can make it. And he's going on and on. I'm like, he's going on too much. And I looked at him and I said, and? He goes, but just in case kid
00:22:33
Speaker
that that
00:22:52
Speaker
Mike Smrek. He ended up playing for the Lakers for a bunch of years as the number 13, 14. He's the only guy that made it. But it's funny, so I called my brother on Wednesday and he's like, what? I go, yeah, I need you picking up the airport. He's like, dude, you're already caught? I'm like, yeah. He goes, man, I'm so sorry. And he's dragging on. Then he goes, did you get some shirts?
00:23:25
Speaker
It's interesting because in the middle of that, so that was like literally Tuesday to Wednesday, Tuesday night, there were a couple of people in the crowd. You don't know who everybody is in an NBA organization, but there was a man who came to my hotel room.
00:23:40
Speaker
He was head coach of a basketball team that was part of Campus Crusade for Christ, a team called Athletes in Action. He was the head coach and general manager of the team. He was going around NBA camps and looking for guys for his team. This is before I'm cut, right? He gives me his card and he's like, when you get home tomorrow night, call me.
00:24:06
Speaker
I'm thinking when you get home, I'm not getting home, I'm here to stay. So anyway, I ended up calling him and had an incredible experience with them for about five or six years and then did one playoff season with the CBA and then that was enough. Wow. Yeah. And that was with Bill Musselman.
00:24:28
Speaker
Yeah, Bill Musselman was just, boy, I mean, we'd have to schedule another interview for the Bill Musselman stories. But he was, it was unbelievable. So I went from playing, from Coach Lewis, whose entire philosophy was simplify the game.
00:24:43
Speaker
We had one offensive set we ran against man-to-man, and we had two that we ran against the zone, and that was it. That was it. And so you knew all the options, you knew everything, but that was it. Within 48 hours with Musselman, I had a playbook of 66 different plays. And it was the exact opposite, right? It was like, how complicated can we make the game? It ended up playing with Michael Ray Richardson,
00:25:11
Speaker
Well, I'll tell you who else I played with. Our point guard was Sidney Lowe from NC State. So let's back up a second. So in the championship game, I'm guarding Sidney.
00:25:27
Speaker
And the scouting report was, Sid can't shoot. Sid may make two or three baskets, but he's not going to beat you. So I'm kind of roaming. I'm trying to take away driving gaps from Derek Wittenberg and doubling down on Cozell McQueen. And I'm just roaming. Sid jumps up and hits a shot. No big deal. He jumps up and hits another shot. No big deal. After he'd hit about his fourth one, I'm looking over at the bench like,
00:25:53
Speaker
You know, they're like, no, no, no, no. And then I think after he hit, you know, his fifth one, they were like.
00:26:00
Speaker
You know, so everyone remembers, you know, Wittenberg's air ball and the dunk, but the guy that killed us in that game was Sidney Lowe because he came out of nowhere. He ended up playing the NBA and coached, but he wasn't an NBA caliber player. So anyway, so Sid and I, we did not say one word about the game, not one word. So we're together for two months, you know, going through the playoffs and we're in Sioux Falls and we're sitting there and it's a series.
00:26:29
Speaker
And we just won a game and you know CBA you're taking 1 a.m. Flights if you're lucky if you're on a flight not in a van So he and I are sitting in an airport. Okay, we had not said one word not a joke not one word about it Sitting in an airport having a burger just him and I it's 1 a.m. Waiting on up waiting on a plane to get serviced or whatever ESPN you know pops up big huge screen TV and they showed the play
00:26:59
Speaker
And they show Valvano running around the court. All I'm thinking is, don't look at him. Don't look at him. Finally, I looked over at him and he reached into his bag and pulled out his national championship ring. What are the chances? It's New Falls Airport at 1 a.m. sitting there with Sidney Lowe watching the replay.
00:27:27
Speaker
That is crazy. So Reed, how was the locker room after that ending? You know, everyone responded differently.
00:27:40
Speaker
I don't know. Yeah. Everyone responded differently and I never wanted to judge anybody for how they react that I needed to get away from everybody. And so I was sitting outside the locker room on a stairwell by myself. Um, and so, you know, all the flopping on the court and wailing and all that is, you know, I didn't think was indicative of who we are or who we should be or how we should represent ourselves. Um, but yeah, everybody, everybody, you know,
00:28:09
Speaker
responded their own way. It wasn't like we had a big powwow. And I don't even remember coach talking to us. You know, I think we all remember how I reacted.
00:28:21
Speaker
I didn't think it was Sidney Lowe that killed you guys. I thought it was Terry Gannon with that bear hug on Drexler to get his fourth foul that was one of the worst calls I've ever seen. And Terry agrees with that. He laughs about it. He laughs about it on the air.
00:28:43
Speaker
It's interesting looking back and it's funny when they did the 30 for 30, not the one on us, but the one on them, it was interesting that the producer called our house and I was at work and he's talking to my wife and said, trying to get in touch with Reid, can I get his number? She does a good job of saying, tell me again who you are and what this is about.
00:29:11
Speaker
He said, well, we're doing a documentary on NC State. And she's like, yeah, I don't think he's going to be interested.
00:29:20
Speaker
And he goes, no, no, he's really trying to sell it. And he said, have you ever seen any of the 30 for 30s? She goes, yeah, I'm just telling you. He's not going to be interested in that. So he keeps going. He keeps going. He goes, look, he said, I'm an executive producer. The one I just put together was on the air last week, the one about Marcus Dupree. Well, my wife is from Philadelphia, Mississippi and grew up with Marcus Dupree.
00:29:47
Speaker
And so we watched that entire, the Marcus Dupree one was like my wife's entire life, you know, friends and high school coaches and principal. I mean, everyone in the, it was like her life story. And so it's funny. So the producer has no idea. And he goes, yeah, you know, I just did the one on Marcus Dupree. And she said, I grew up with Marcus Dupree. And the guy goes, well, did you like it? And she said, Reed, we'll call you in an hour.
00:30:22
Speaker
The film crew's in my house and they, as y'all can appreciate, the interview goes on for three or four hours and 90% of what you say ends up on the cutting room floor. But it was fascinating listening to the whole thing was being told from their perspective.
00:30:38
Speaker
In all the inaccuracies and all the urban myths and all the you know, it was crazy and Not surprisingly as I pointed out all that wasn't true didn't end up didn't end up in the final Yeah, I believe it hey just just to give you an idea I'm sure you were wondering about
00:31:02
Speaker
How demented my life is I could tell you that I watched Mike smrek play at Marist. Oh my gosh, man Yeah, how bad is that? Walking encyclopedia I'll tell you a funny story about that game. So about
00:31:24
Speaker
I don't know, maybe 10 years ago, maybe not that long, maybe five years ago. I'm a litigation attorney and I'm trying a case for ExxonMobil and we're down in the valley. And I can't remember what the case was. I think it was a harassment or a discrimination case. Anyway, we're trying this case and we got a judge and he's just, he's hard nosed, stickler, man, he's not cutting anybody any slack and he's really running a tight show.
00:31:54
Speaker
And so we went through about three days of pretrial hearings. It was about a week-long trial. And on day five, right before lunch, out of the clear blue, he said, I'm going to dismiss the jury early, attorney stay I need to talk to. The jury gets up and they leave. And I'm putting on our case. And the judge looks at me and he goes, Mr. Geddes, he said, I need to ask you, why stall? And I said,
00:32:26
Speaker
I said, judge, I'm putting witnesses on as fast as I can. I've cut three witnesses. I've cut my exhibits from 120 exhibits down to 70. I am not stalling. And he goes, no. Why stall? Like we've been talking about. In the middle of the trial. And finally, I looked up on him. And I knew he went to University of Texas. And it don't know me. And I said, NC State? And he goes, yeah.
00:33:02
Speaker
Is that crazy? It's unbelievable how that game's remembered. Hey, so Reed, maybe going to a less fun topic.
UH Basketball Program Decline & Challenges
00:33:14
Speaker
I mean, you've been involved with the University of Houston basketball program. You were there.
00:33:19
Speaker
in its heyday. You were actually an assistant coach there with both Foster and Drexler. And then we went through this long period of time where really the basketball program was completely off the map. From your perspective, being so close to the program and maybe having quite a bit more insight than the average fan, what happened
00:33:49
Speaker
to get to basically two decades of being in the desert from where you would argue when you were there, we were one of the best programs around, right? Certainly in the Southwest, we were the best basketball program when we were all there, so. Yeah. Well, you know, it's interesting. And I've given it a lot of thought. And the reality is, it's a really tough job. Because you got to win.
00:34:14
Speaker
You gotta do it with Houston kids, not all Houston kids, but you gotta do it with Houston kids, and you have to have the personality that the city, but more specifically, the fan base, embraces. And so if you think about all the coaches we had after that, Pat Foster didn't win and didn't have a personality and didn't do Houston kids, and that was a miserable failure.
00:34:43
Speaker
Um, the, the big, the, the, the short answer to your question is when they didn't get the job to Donnie swear on coach Lewis's longtime assistant. Um, the program was doomed to bottom out. And then the question was, you know, who can make it bounce back? You know, Penders won a lot of games. Um, but.
00:35:01
Speaker
But he wasn't embraced. His personality wasn't embraced. And he didn't do it with Houston kids. The person who did the best job was James Dickey. James Dickey came in and he's so stoic. But he's the one guy who wasn't just building team after team after team. He was building a program. And you remember when Kelvin came in, he lost Daniel House, who went and was all-conference in the SEC.
00:35:28
Speaker
He lost Tayshaun Thomas, who was also in the Big 12. He lost Joseph Young, who was MVP of the Pac-12. I mean, that's unbelievable. And so it bottomed out again. The Clyde experiment was the biggest disaster in the history of Division I coaching.
00:35:50
Speaker
And then it was followed up by Ray McAllen. And it's interesting because when Clyde said he wasn't, you know, whatever, when Clyde pulled the plug on it, I remember the athletic director was talking to me about taking the job. And at one point, and I can't remember who else was in the room, he goes, why do you want to do this? And I looked at him and I said, I really don't.
00:36:16
Speaker
I said the problem is we're all going to look stupid if we go into this like we didn't have a backup plan, a transition plan. If you think you're going to hire Ray McCallum to come in from Ball State to be successful, I'm just telling you it's not going to be. Nice guy, but just not going to be. I remember when
00:36:44
Speaker
Oh, it wasn't Mack Rhodes. Who hired Kelvin? It was... I thought it was Mack Rhodes. Was it Mack? Yeah. And then he left shortly after. So I've known Kelvin for 35 years. I watched him closely when he got to OU and what he did at OU.
00:37:04
Speaker
Um, and, and, and Matt called me when he was thinking about it. I say, Hey, he may have already decided and he was just trying to line up support, but he called me and he goes, Oh, I want to pick your brain about this, about something. I'm like, what? He goes, I want to hire Kevin Samson. And I said, you're never going to get him. I said, you know, once he went to the NBA and the success he was having and the reputation he built and established and, you know, the credit that Kevin McHale gave him and, and, and.
00:37:33
Speaker
I said, he's never coming back. He said, I think we can get him. I said, I don't think he can.
Kelvin Sampson's Impact & Program Revival
00:37:39
Speaker
And he goes, let me ask a question. Would you have a problem with it?
00:37:45
Speaker
If you have a shot, you ought to go put a tin up at the end of his driveway. You ought to be standing there with coffee when he comes out in the morning. Be there with a cheeseburger when he comes home. Not only do I not have a problem, I said the NCA stuff is funny now when you look at the NIL and all that's going on, when you look at what it actually was and impermissible contacts and phone calls and whether text messages turn, just stupidity.
00:38:12
Speaker
But I didn't dream that he'd come take the job. I didn't dream he'd take it. And I told the story a bunch. His first year, we're broadcasting the game. And I'm sitting there, my son's talent stats guy sitting there next to us. And in the middle of the game, I counted the crowd. In the middle of the game, I just started going,
00:38:37
Speaker
56 people at a game and transposed that picture to what we've experienced the last five years. Other than what Scott Drew did at Baylor.
00:38:51
Speaker
It's hard to come up with enough adjectives to describe what, what Kelvin has done. From your perspective, right? Cause you've had a closer view than us. How has he done it from the apathy and the facilities as decrepit as they were at that point to slowly build it brick by brick to get to this point where basically we're back to a top 10 program.
Current Success & Culture of UH Basketball
00:39:16
Speaker
So there's several touch points. I remember Rick Barnes used to talk about the importance of TJ Ford to what he built at Texas. He said, I needed that one player that could become our identity. And Galen Robinson was that guy for Kelvin. But when he got Galen and his personality, set the talent aside.
00:39:37
Speaker
But his personality and his infectious impact on people and his ability to be your best recruiter, that was the first touch point. The second touch point, and really is what led to the sustained success, is what he did with Quentin Grimes.
00:39:55
Speaker
uh... you know that that quinn is floundering and look i don't care what bill said what they say publicly he was run out of at kansas so he was going to clear hardship he was going to test the waters but they they gave away scholarship he didn't have one to come back to that it and what kelvin in kelvin and qualities and hollis did with that kid holy cow uh... you know that suddenly you're you're looking at you know what that turns into
00:40:23
Speaker
And let's go back to the things I said, you gotta win. Well, he's gonna win. He's got a personality that's gruff and mean and cantankerous, but you adopt it and you like it and you like how brutally honest he is. He's done it basically with Houston Kids, not totally, basically Houston Kids and a style of play.
00:40:50
Speaker
that embraces what our university is and what our city is. So you put all that together and it is literally, I can't, I just, I've run out of adjectives. The fact that we're in the exact same breath consistently with Duke, Kentucky, North Carolina, Kansas, that you're no longer surprised.
00:41:18
Speaker
It is one of the most phenomenal things I've ever seen. Agreed. Yeah. Which of his teams would be your favorite team? Which team do you think has been the best team so far?
00:41:32
Speaker
You know, that's hard, man. They all start running together. They've been so snake bit at the end of seasons, you know, with injuries and people hurt. I sat next to Kelvin and Karen when he got that alumni award about a month ago. And I just, you know, he and I were talking and I said, let me just share something with you. In all of my years around University of Houston basketball,
00:41:59
Speaker
I had never in my life been more proud of a basketball team than the six kids you had playing in that game against Duke.
00:42:11
Speaker
I mean, you looked out there and no JoJo and no Terrence and Jamal Shedd goes down and you look out there and said lots playing and Emmanuel Sharpe's playing is absolute hard out and you just go down the line and we're in that game with, I don't remember the specifics, but maybe even one possession.
00:42:35
Speaker
And when Jamal went down, I came to look at my wife, I go, look who's on the floor. And I'm not, I'm not trying to bash her or throw shade at those guys, but that's not a lineup you projected playing Duke to go, you know, to continue.
00:42:52
Speaker
And the heart that those kids played with, I just, it was almost emotional. I just, I told Kelvin, I said, forget anything else, forget Final Four, forget all that. I said, I've never in my life seen our school and been more proud than I was that night. Yeah. No, it was incredible. Yeah.
00:43:13
Speaker
We're the only team in the country that could have won that game against A&M, you know, especially when we went to overtime. We're the only team that could have done that. My son texted me and goes, Dad, look who's on the floor. Look who's on the floor. You know, but Malik steps up and Sid steps up and you just just go down the line. You know, Damien's guarding centers, you know, in power forwards and it was just.
00:43:42
Speaker
You throw the word around culture a lot. You know, you hear coach talk about it and if you want to know what it looks like, that's what it looks like. And there are there are three coaches on the planet who can who can produce that that kind of effort. And we had Ryan come off the bench, you know, to hit that key free throw that I think it went from a from a three point game to four point game. So we're guaranteed, you know, not to go to overtime again. That was
00:44:10
Speaker
That was unbelievable. It's kind of like the Rudy story. Rudy got in for one play. The Notre Dame kid, they made a movie about. And I kind of thought Ryan was like our Rudy. Well, don't tell Ryan I said this, because I've got a huge Ryan fan. Every time he checks in the game, my first thing I say is, hey, look, the fans are chaining like this kid can't play. I'm just telling you, he can play. He can really play. He can really shoot. And he's going to come in locked and loaded. And he's going to hit a couple of shots before he sits down.
00:44:39
Speaker
But but he was a free throw line and I'm thinking I'm pacing I mean I'm pacing in front of our TV and my wife's like sit down. He's gonna make one You don't understand he hadn't played he's been sitting over on the bench. He's cold. He hadn't played head warm She goes sit down. He's going to make one Where do you see where do you see
00:45:07
Speaker
this team, the future of the 24-25 team, especially now that Shed's gone and obviously Uzon's coming in. What do you think about him and what are your thoughts on the upcoming season? Yeah, so I don't know the kid. I saw him play once or twice. What I'll tell you is before he announced he was transferring that same event I was sitting next to Kelvin,
00:45:35
Speaker
Somebody came by and said, you know, we're going to be okay without Jamal. And he was like, oh yeah, we're going to be fine. We're going to be fine. The guy left, he looked over at me and he goes, trust me, we're going to be fine. And the kid was on campus at the time, you know, Lauren's there too. And she's texting people, where are they? And so they knew he was about to commit.
00:45:55
Speaker
Look, I'm not a big fan of hype and talking about, you know, things. All I know is I have heard more than one person associated with the program saying more talent than they've ever had.
00:46:12
Speaker
Yeah. And so, you know, process that one. You know, you put, you put a hair, nobody was playing better basketball than Terence Arsena when he went down. He was our best rebounder. And what he was doing from the wing was just off the charts. And then, kind of leaving, talking about baby giraffe, JoJo Tobin.
00:46:32
Speaker
I he did things that literally that that were were drexler ash and i mean his his ability to rotate contest cover take out a lane go back down but it's like you know you'd almost diagram me if i'm doing a telestrator it looks like this
00:46:52
Speaker
I mean, just unbelievable. And so I hear great things about the Miller kid that he is just a walking bucket getter. A lot like Caleb Mills where some kids are just blessed with the ability to put the ball in the basket.
00:47:10
Speaker
Um, and so if, if, if he can, if he can take the tough coaching, everyone says they can until you get to your first practice. Um, then, then you find out, um, but hopefully, um, uh, you know, a manual and an LJ and, uh, those guys can wrap their arm around him. You know, can take the role that Jamal did, um, you know, with, with, with kids as they come in. Do you know much about McCarty? Uh, nothing. No. Okay.
00:47:40
Speaker
So, I'm drawing a blank. I'm optimistic about... Look, I didn't dream Sedlock would ever contribute. And he can contribute. And the other kid that Redshirted, they're really, really high on that. He's Xavier Francis' skill set, maybe plus some.
00:48:01
Speaker
McFarland. Yeah. McFarland. Yeah. And then the kid from Fort Worth, he didn't leave, did he? Yeah. Yeah. He's still with the program. Absolutely. He's a, he's a prototypical Kelvin Sampson kid. Tough, strong chip on his shoulder, you know, plays with an edge. Um, I mean, they're just loaded. They, they're absolutely loaded next year. Yeah. It's going to be challenging, actually even finding minutes.
00:48:30
Speaker
For kids, I think that's a problem to have in this day and age of you know in IL and Transfers and all that but it's a good problem to have. Yeah, absolutely if we have injuries, you know, especially Well, you know we went into this year saying we're gonna limit We're gonna limit Jamal's minutes because we don't want him tired at the end of the year 48 minutes So I'll believe that when I see it, yeah exactly
00:49:00
Speaker
Well, I know we want to be really sensitive with your time. And you've been extremely generous with your time with us today. And we're extremely appreciative of that. Any kind of last thoughts from you that you want to impart with fans going into next season?
00:49:16
Speaker
You know, we've learned the importance of living in the moment, right? Don't take this for granted. This is unique. And this is a, I've told everybody, everyone wants to, you know, glamorize, you know, Elvin and his teams and our teams.
00:49:39
Speaker
And make no mistake about it, this is the golden era of Houston basketball. This is it. And what he's done year after year after year with the program.
Golden Era of UH Basketball & Fan Encouragement
00:49:50
Speaker
and where it is. Man, don't take that for granted. Buy tickets and go to games and support these kids. If you ever get a chance to get to know them, man, it just adds to it. If you get a chance to have a conversation and then suddenly you go, man, he doesn't recruit punks. He doesn't tolerate that. These are high-character kids and they
00:50:15
Speaker
and they want to represent and they want to get better. It's really everything that's good and right about college athletics. Man, we got it sitting right there in the Fertitta Center and we need to enjoy it.
00:50:29
Speaker
Yeah, completely agree. I guess the nice part of the program is for the first time, there's no tickets to be had at this point, everyone is taken, which is fantastic. We've got to get to the part where if you're not using them, go to a portal, put them somewhere and let people grab them and go to games because it's such a treat at the Fertis Center and there's just
00:50:54
Speaker
You know, I've been to a handful of games just as a, as a fan. It just doesn't matter where you buy a ticket. Doesn't matter where you sit. It really doesn't matter. Um, no, it's fantastic. I mean, uh, I didn't mention to you before I'm based out on the West coast. I've got season tickets. Bill's the one that uses most of them for me. And then I probably come in for five or six games a season and there's nothing better than going to the game live. So yeah.
00:51:22
Speaker
All right, guys. Well, thank you so much, Reed. We really appreciate it. And hopefully, fans will really enjoy this and really enjoy the insights that you provided today. And hopefully, we can
00:51:35
Speaker
invite you back at some point in time and chat some more if you're willing. Do it again. We'll pick up with Bill Musselman and Michael Ray Richardson. Awesome. Thank you so much. I'd love to hear more about Michael Ray Richardson. Yeah, definitely. Okay. Thank you so much. Go Cougs. Take care. Yup. Thanks Reed. Thanks Reed. Okay. We'll do it again.
00:52:00
Speaker
So that's it for this episode number 26 of the No Conference for Old Men podcast. Hope you all enjoyed it. And again, would really appreciate it if folks would follow, subscribe, or collect our podcast, depending on your podcast platform of choice.
00:52:13
Speaker
We're also available via the Republic of football podcast feed from the folks at Dave Campbell's, Texas football as the only basketball centric podcast. We're at the Goku's.com website for those that prefer to digest the content that way. We appreciate the continued support from all and please give us a follow on our Twitter account, no conference for old men. And it's shared before during the off season, we're into our monthly cadence. So please be on the lookout to download and listen as our next episode drops in June. Take care everyone.