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00:00:00
00:00:01
Priyanka Salot (The Sleep Company) on Customer Obsession & Brand Building
0 Plays2 days ago
"We were not building a short term new age brand, we were building a very disruptive new age product. But we wanted to build a legacy brand."
Priyanka Salot shares a powerful insight: The Sleep Company isn't just chasing trends; they're building a lasting brand with a revolutionary product, focusing on long-term impact and customer loyalty over quick wins.
Priyanka Salot is the Founder of The Sleep Company, India's leading comfort-tech company revolutionizing sleep and sitting experiences. Before founding the sleep company, Priyanka has worked with P&G, handling legacy brands like Ariel, Tide and Pampers. A marketing expert, Priyanka did her engineering and MBA, post which she spent almost a decade in consumer marketing. With their patented Smart Grid technology, The Sleep Company has grown to a ₹450 Cr+ ARR business, opening experience stores across India, and securing patents globally. Priyanka's vision is to make India, and eventually the world, sleep and sit better.
Key Insights from the Conversation:
- Product-Market Fit: Prioritizing a truly differentiated product (Smart Grid) over a quick launch, spending 2 years in R&D.
- Customer-Centricity: Deeply listening to customers through multiple channels (reviews, surveys, direct conversations) and using feedback to pivot (e.g., launching Ergo Smart chairs).
- Omnichannel Excellence: Combining online discovery with offline experience centers for a seamless customer journey.
- Brand Building as a Science: A disciplined approach to branding, emphasizing consistent assets and a clear brand persona (science-backed).
- Sustainable Growth: Focusing on profitability and efficient marketing spend to build a long-term, financially healthy business.
- Controlling the Supply chain: In-house manufacturing, enabling quality control, customisation, and faster delivery.
Chapters:
- Priyanka's Origin Story \[00:18]
- Early Career and Inspiration \[01:23]
- Identifying the Need for The Sleep Company \[02:11]
- The Mattress Industry Before The Sleep Company \[03:38]
- Extensive Product Development \[05:14]
- Building a Brand vs. Selling Products \[06:38]
- The Importance of Solving Consumer Problems \[07:05]
- Books that Inspired Priyanka \[01:19:23]
- The Vision for The Sleep Company \[01:20:11]
- Taking the Plunge \[01:21:13]
Hashtags:
#TheSleepCompany #PriyankaSalot #FounderThesis #StartupIndia #Entrepreneurship #MattressIndustry #ComfortTech #SmartGrid #DirectToConsumer #D2C #Omnichannel #BrandBuilding #MarketingStrategy #CustomerExperience #Innovation #MadeInIndia #BusinessGrowth #VentureCapital #StartupJourney #FounderStories #ErgoSmart #SleepBetter #SitBetter #BusinessPodcast #IndianStartups #PriyankaSalotInterview
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Transcript
Priyanka's Journey to Founding The Sleep Company
00:00:01
akshaydatt
So, Priyanka, let's start with your origin story. You know, what ah looking back, can you connect the dots on what led to you becoming the founder of the Sleep Company? well What's your background? Where do you come from?
00:00:15
Priyanka Salot
sha Hi Akshay, hi everyone. Obviously glad to be here. I think um how the sleep company started is very interesting. Let me take that one and then maybe I'll talk a little bit more about my um journey and how things have been.
Formative Experiences and the Birth of The Sleep Company
00:00:30
Priyanka Salot
ah So I think, you know, I was born, I split my life into three phases, right? The first is I was born in Rajasthan. That's where I spent first decade of my life.
00:00:42
Priyanka Salot
Then, you know, the next decade was traveling away from home.
00:00:43
akshaydatt
Okay.
00:00:46
Priyanka Salot
which is all my education. i did my engineering like a typical kid in India who does engineering. And then I decided to go for my MBA. And that's what in MBA is where I met my co-founder and my partner in real life, Harshil.
00:01:00
Priyanka Salot
I think after, um you know, MBA, I decided to do marketing. I was with PNG. g That's where I spent almost a decade of my life. That's where I found two things.
00:01:10
Priyanka Salot
One, I found the fact that I love consumer brands. I love anything which is tangible, where you can really make a difference and maybe change lives of your consumer, right? I started loving what I was doing.
00:01:26
Priyanka Salot
But I think one thing I was always clear, i wouldn't say from childhood, but I think I was always clear, um you know, when i start ah when I went for my MBA that I wanted to start something of my own.
00:01:38
Priyanka Salot
and i And I think I always joke about it. I read lot of autobiographies and I think they played a huge role in me taking that
Discovery and Innovation in Mattress Technology
00:01:46
Priyanka Salot
plunge. um So I think when I was in PNG, I was always tossing around with a lot of consumer business ideas, right? A lot of products, lot of categories.
00:01:55
Priyanka Salot
And this category degree happened in a very, very interesting ways. lot of people ask me, you know, from selling, um aerial and tide and pampers, you know, why, why mattresses? And I think that's what um has been a little interesting.
00:02:09
Priyanka Salot
i Two things triggered, I think, why mattresses? ah yeah When, you know, in 2000, 2020, 2019, 2020, was pregnant.
00:02:21
Priyanka Salot
and i think um
00:02:26
Priyanka Salot
when ayan was born my my son when he was born Like any new mom, I think one thing I faced was sleepless nights. You know, I think you pick any mom and ask them what do they want the most when they just deliver a baby. The thing they will tell you is they want sleep.
00:02:41
Priyanka Salot
They really, really want to sleep, even a few hours of sleep. And that's what I was struggling a lot with. ah You know, I was I couldn't sleep at night. I was having a lot of back pain issues.
00:02:52
Priyanka Salot
And hence, I tried a lot of products um you know that were available in India. There were a lot of products that I was selling online and I tried a few of them. And I think coming from a consumer product background, ah it just stuck me that the quality of products that were available in India were far behind than anywhere else in the world.
00:03:14
Priyanka Salot
And, you know, I saw a lot of brands were trying to, ah you know, make the, I would say make the availability better by offline to online, but nobody was trying to change the product.
00:03:27
Priyanka Salot
And i I saw we were sleeping on form mattresses or memory form mattresses, which were there before even we were born, which were there even before our grandparents were born.
00:03:39
Priyanka Salot
So something and it just started something where you spend almost one third of your every day, which is one third of your life was still those old age form mattresses.
00:03:52
Priyanka Salot
And I think that's when I got obsessed with changing that. And I said the product needs to become better. ah you know, um and either the analog analogy I always give is, um you know, the mattresses were like, um you know, your feature phone versus feature phone existed. So, you know, before I was born, our phone became smart, our TVs became smart, our house became smart, right? The only thing that didn't change was mattresses.
00:04:17
Priyanka Salot
So I think that's when we decided to make our hands dirty. And we decided that let's change the product where we spend one third of our life. And that's how I think,
00:04:28
Priyanka Salot
You know, the R&D work on the sleep company started. I decided to leave P&G and I decided that I need to spend lot of time on R&D. And I think we were um lucky that we met Dr. Tripathi, you know, who's been in the industry for over 40, 50 years. We worked with him for more than two years on R&D before the sleep company was born.
00:04:52
akshaydatt
Okay, so Dr. Tripathi is like in like ah material science kind of a role, like or what?
00:04:59
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, yeah. So Dr. Vijayath Ripathi, he's our R&D head. He has worked with India Defense Labs, which is DRDO, as a scientist, as a material scientist for decades.
00:05:10
Priyanka Salot
Right. We were lucky we got in touch with him. We told him the brief, very simple, that we need to make the mattresses much better. We need to make the mattresses that can make people sleep better.
00:05:21
Priyanka Salot
ah Right. And then we worked with him for two years. We worked on literally thousands of formulations thousands of products of multiple multiple trials and so much back and forth for those two years and I tell everybody actually those were the two years which were the most difficult years we didn't know will we be able to crack it um and right and I think after two years when we saw the product we did lot of trials and we launched it and after that I think it's been a fabulous journey
00:05:53
akshaydatt
ah You know, you are from a marketing background it wouldn't have been too hard for you to launch with a product which is not a 10 on 10 because you would have been able to do the marketing for it why did you wait two years what what were you looking for that you got at the end of those two years in terms of the product but why not start with you know most founders do like start with a six on ten and then build your way up bye keep iterating uh
00:06:23
Priyanka Salot
Yeah.
00:06:26
akshaydatt
So I'm just curious why you
Development and Launch of Smart Grid Technology
00:06:28
akshaydatt
took that approach.
00:06:28
akshaydatt
What was it that you were seeking?
00:06:28
Priyanka Salot
Yeah.
00:06:30
Priyanka Salot
Sure. So I think the easiest route actually was to take a product that existed in the market. Right. You would see hundreds of brands doing that. Pick a product, just package it with your brand name and sell it online.
00:06:44
Priyanka Salot
That was the easiest thing. And as you said, that could have been done literally in a month's time. You know, you get a website, you list on marketplaces like Amazon Flipkart and you just what you need, you just need your brand logo and your packaging.
00:06:57
Priyanka Salot
And that's what we realized everybody was doing. But I think one thing I credit to my experience at PNG, g I always tell people this, I think one thing I learned in that decade of handling amazing legacy brands was that if you want to build a long term brand,
00:07:13
Priyanka Salot
and right You have to have a product which one actually solves a consumer problem, which is differentiated, which is truly, truly superior, differentiated and solves consumer problem.
00:07:26
Priyanka Salot
And that is the reason we spent two years on R&D before we launched the product. Because what I always tell, I don't want to create a new age brand.
00:07:37
Priyanka Salot
I want to create a legacy brand which can stay for decades, which consumers love and which actually change our consumers' lives. And that is the reason we decided to spend two years on R&D. We wanted to be sure that we have a product that can make that happen.
00:07:54
akshaydatt
ah From a technical standpoint, what was that product? What did it do at the end of two years? What did you achieve? What was about software?
00:08:00
Priyanka Salot
Sean, so let me...
00:08:03
akshaydatt
What like?
00:08:03
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, sure. Let me maybe a little bit step back and tell you a little bit about the mattress category, right? If you see mattress category, old age, hundreds of years back, you would see people using cotton mattresses, right? Cotton mattresses evolved to something called coir.
00:08:18
Priyanka Salot
Coir is the scrap of coconut trees. And right after coir, you started getting form mattresses, and right? Then you started getting little bit evolved form of form mattresses. Form is polyurethane form, and right? People would say high density form.
00:08:33
Priyanka Salot
HR form, then some buzz came memory form. Memory form was found in 1960s before I'm sure anybody in this room was born. Right.
00:08:44
Priyanka Salot
And it was not formed for the purpose of sleeping. It was developed for the purpose of scientists in NASA. Right. So and that became the buzzword. Right.
00:08:56
Priyanka Salot
And after 1960s, you've truly not seen any any innovation. What we did was invent a completely new material type in this industry.
00:09:06
Priyanka Salot
And that material type, we call it smart grid. smart and So you see this blue grid structure, right? You would see this in across all our experience centers. and i So we developed literally Asia's first and only smart grid mattress, which is made from a polymer.
00:09:26
Priyanka Salot
And what is the properties of this polymer? Let's understand this. Why is this better than a form mattress or a memory form mattress? right It's a polymer which is organized in the form of a grid.
00:09:37
Priyanka Salot
What it does, two things very, very differently compared to a form or a memory form mattress. One, because of the grid structure, our body is not a straight line. You have a head which is popping out. You have shoulders which is popping out.
00:09:50
Priyanka Salot
But then you have a back which is a bigger surface area. This grid structure changes the softness and firmness depending on what body part is it. right On smaller body part, which are curvatures, the grid will be soft, which means you get pressure relief.
00:10:08
Priyanka Salot
Whereas on a bigger surface area like your back, you know something which is like, for example, a bigger surface area, the grid will be firm. No mattress can be both soft and firm, which is what this polymer based smart grid mattress can be.
00:10:24
Priyanka Salot
Right. I think that's one thing. So doesn't matter what your body shape is. You know, are you a fat person? Are you thin person? Are you tall person? And doesn't even matter what your sleeping position is.
00:10:36
Priyanka Salot
Are you a side sleeper, back sleeper? The grid will adapt and change the softness and firmness basis your body needs. which a typical firm mattress cannot do.
00:10:48
Priyanka Salot
right So I think that's one thing. Second, the grid is 90% air. you know It's a typical king size mattress has more than 2500 air channels, which means when we sleep, typically a firm mattress will retain body heat and get little suffocating and hot.
00:11:07
Priyanka Salot
A grid is a very cooling material. Third, which is very, very important to understand, most mattresses sag over time. That means they become little bit uneven. They lose their support properties.
00:11:20
Priyanka Salot
A grid is a very, very, you know, it's ah it has high longevity. It's a very, very durable material, right? And that's the reason I always say that the two years of work work. Today also, every single day, we continue to work on on how to Keep on making our products better.
00:11:37
Priyanka Salot
Right? Superior products is really the DNA of the sleep company.
00:11:42
akshaydatt
ah Okay.
00:11:47
akshaydatt
How does it become both firm and soft? ah I didn't understand that part. Like if you can go a little deeper into the tech.
00:11:54
Priyanka Salot
Yeah. So Akshay, can I get the material to show you how does it work? Take it when you ask me.
00:12:04
akshaydatt
Yeah, let me just start that question from the beginning.
00:12:06
Priyanka Salot
sure
00:12:06
akshaydatt
So I want to understand how does it achieve this firmness and softness both ah depending on which body part? like Can you go a little deeper on that?
00:12:16
Priyanka Salot
oh sure i would love to and you know we also demonstrate the same thing to all our customers who visit our experience centers we have something called a sleep lab ah which we keep in all our experience centers this is just to make sure that we educate people and it's proof of pudding, right?
00:12:36
Priyanka Salot
And to show consumers how the smart grid works, right? Let me just show you with a very, very simple demonstration of how this works. So actually, if you see this material, right?
00:12:47
Priyanka Salot
This is what is we call smart grid. And this is what goes in all our mattresses, right?
00:12:53
akshaydatt
Okay. Ah.
00:12:53
Priyanka Salot
If you see this material is a very, very stretchy kind of a material, which is not the case with a form mattress.
00:12:54
akshaydatt
Hmm.
00:13:01
Priyanka Salot
Right now, let me tell you how this works because of the grid structure. Right. Let's say your head, it's a curvature and it has a smaller surface area. Let's say when you press it, you have only few walls under your surface area and they buckle down because it's a very elastic and responsive material.
00:13:18
akshaydatt
ah
00:13:22
Priyanka Salot
It goes down. Can you see?
00:13:24
akshaydatt
Yes, yes, yes.
00:13:25
Priyanka Salot
But now let's say let's look at your spine and your back. It's a much bigger surface area. So now let's imagine, you know I'm taking a book to show how this works. Imagine this to be your spine or your back, which is a much bigger surface area.
00:13:40
Priyanka Salot
That means much many walls come under that surface area. So you need a lot of force. Actually, under force also doesn't go down.
00:13:49
akshaydatt
All right.
00:13:50
Priyanka Salot
That means on a bigger surface area because there are more walls, they withhold the pressure and they give you more support. So it's like they give you support where you need support.
00:14:02
Priyanka Salot
They give you cushioning where you need cushioning.
00:14:05
akshaydatt
Okay, okay, understood.
00:14:17
Priyanka Salot
Or either it will be very, very hard, which one could say is good for the back, but very, very uncomfortable.
00:14:23
akshaydatt
Okay, this ah grid is like a layer in the middle with foam on top and bottom, or is it on top, or how is the construction done?
00:14:31
Priyanka Salot
So... Yeah, so we've got different type of mattresses, um you know, different variety of mattresses depending on, you know, do people like a little softer version, do people like a firmer version.
00:14:42
Priyanka Salot
So grid, most of our mattresses is always the top layer, right?
00:14:46
akshaydatt
okay
00:14:46
Priyanka Salot
Because that's what your body gets in touch with. And that's what provides either support or pressure relief.
00:14:54
akshaydatt
okay okay okay and there is a form base uh underneath that okay okay okay okay understood so uh you know
00:14:55
Priyanka Salot
Yeah.
00:14:59
Priyanka Salot
Yes.
Strategic Branding and Market Positioning
00:15:05
akshaydatt
You had that advantage of coming from a consumer brand, which is P&G, one of the ah best known global consumer brand companies.
00:15:17
akshaydatt
How did that advantage translate into how you launched the product and you know the approach of selling it, your go-to market?
00:15:33
Priyanka Salot
Right. So let me talk the second part. So I think when I launched and it was a digital first brand, we launched in October 2019 and we launched, ah you know, we created a website on WordPress and which took us few weeks to do. And then we launched on Amazon and Flipkart.
00:15:51
Priyanka Salot
And I still remember my early days and I was lost on how to reach consumers. Right. Because I had worked on legacy brands, detergents, diapers, where you reach your consumers, mostly through TV.
00:16:05
Priyanka Salot
and Right. Digital played a very, very small part of our media mix. And I used to wonder that I've spent 10 years in marketing. And I don't know how to reach my consumers. You know, is Google the right touch point?
00:16:19
Priyanka Salot
Is Meta the right touch point?
00:16:19
akshaydatt
Mm-hmm.
00:16:21
Priyanka Salot
And I was so lost. And I think and that's what you learn. You learn. And every brand is different. I always tell people every category is different. Every brand is different. right So there is no fixed recipe that works for on how to reach your consumers.
00:16:37
Priyanka Salot
um How much money should I spend on Google? How much money I should spend on Meta? So one thing which is very, very important and specifically, ah you know, as you start up and even through the journey, having that experimentation is very, very important. You know, you make sure you're doing 100 things, right? Even if 90 fails, that's okay.
00:16:57
Priyanka Salot
But you will learn and you will know what doesn't work. And the 10 succeeding will tell you what works. And i so I think even though I had 10 years of experience, I was equally lost. But I think what I would say, which really was a big, big benefit, and I would completely, um you know, credit it to my experience,
00:17:16
Priyanka Salot
um And I think I think of brand building, how do you build a brand to be more of a science and not art or creativity? um and Right. And I think that's that to me is something my experience taught to me. And we are very careful about how we look at the sleep company as a brand.
00:17:38
Priyanka Salot
And, you know, um and, you know, how do you build a strong brand? I think that's what I would say ah is is more of a science.
00:17:48
akshaydatt
What is, can you, how did that philosophy that brand building is a science, not an art, how did that translate into real world actions at the Steve Company over the last ah five, six years?
00:17:58
akshaydatt
Like, can you give me examples of, you know, how branding is a science?
00:18:00
Priyanka Salot
Yeah.
00:18:04
Priyanka Salot
Yeah. Yeah. ah Maybe, maybe let me, let me, you know, highlight three, four things that we are very paranoid about at the sleep company. Right. And why I say ah brand building is a science. Right.
00:18:16
Priyanka Salot
I think let's, let's look at when you, anybody launches any brand, right. First, I think it's very, very important as founders, because you know, what you think of your brand is what will translate.
00:18:27
Priyanka Salot
As founders, we need to be very, very clear of first what kind of a brand is it that we want to build? And what do I mean by that? Think of your brand to be a human persona, right?
00:18:39
Priyanka Salot
Let's say if your brand was Akshay. yeah Right. What kind of tonality your brand needs to have? What kind of a look and feel your brand needs to have? For example, when I say tonality, right, is your brand a more professional, serious brand?
00:18:53
Priyanka Salot
Is your brand has a tonality which is more witty? Right. Is it um is it more science led? Is it more emotion led? Right. I think that clarity can only come from founders and write on what kind of a brand you want to build.
00:19:08
Priyanka Salot
build and you need to be very very clear on that right so i think we were very clear that we wanted to build a brand which is based on science right a brand which has understood human ergonomics human body develop products which are patented which are disruptive and hence our dna was superior science led products And that is the tonality of the brand, right?
00:19:34
Priyanka Salot
Second to me is, um you know, who is it actually you want to sell your brand to? Who's your target audience, right? And which will define actually your tonality of the brand as well. I think very, very important.
00:19:45
Priyanka Salot
Who are you targeting? and And I tell people, you need to make be, you know, we sell consumer brands. So what is the first word is consumer, and right? So you need to place the consumer at the epicenter and then design everything around it.
00:20:03
Priyanka Salot
Third, very, very paranoid um about something I call consistent assets. and i Let me tell you what do I mean by consistent assets. And, um you know, when I say consistent assets, everything you do, it doesn't matter. Is it a Facebook post?
00:20:19
Priyanka Salot
It doesn't matter. Is it a Google display ad or is it a 30 seconder YouTube video or a TV copy? What are the one or two things which will go everywhere in your communication?
00:20:32
Priyanka Salot
Right. Those consistent assets are very, very important. For example, one thing that you see, the blue that you see at the back. Right. The blue is the blue you would see everywhere from the sleep company. And it's not shades of blue.
00:20:44
Priyanka Salot
Right. Let me give you an example. Coke bottle, Coke log logo. Right. It's red color. Do you see that changing? No.
00:20:51
akshaydatt
no
00:20:52
Priyanka Salot
Right. Do you see different shades? ah Suddenly they become bored. And, you know, do you see an orange shade there or a lighter red there? No. Right. Brands are built with consistent assets, communicated over decades and decades.
00:21:06
Priyanka Salot
And i sometimes I feel ah so sad when I see some brands, new age brands and their Instagram pages. You know, one post is red, one post is yellow, one post is blue because, you know, they want to look because maybe, you know, and this was a joke at PNG. And I'll tell you, and once my manager told me that we marketeers get bored of a communication, but go meet your consumers, even if 10% know what you stand for.
00:21:37
Priyanka Salot
you know It's a win, which doesn't happen. It takes years to build that.
00:21:42
akshaydatt
Mm-hmm.
00:21:42
Priyanka Salot
and i Fourth is very consistent communication. I'll give give you an example. From day zero of our launch, we've been saying we are India's first and only smart grid mattress.
00:21:53
Priyanka Salot
And we have been communicating the same thing for four and a half years. Every single communication that we have has that same tagline for four and a half years. I think it takes and I always say we want to build a legacy brand. We want to build a brand which will stay for decades to come, which will make Indians sleep and sit better.
00:22:15
Priyanka Salot
right And where people which consumers love. right So we are not building ah short term, a new age brand. We are building very disruptive new age products.
00:22:26
Priyanka Salot
But we want to build a legacy brand.
00:22:30
akshaydatt
Okay. I want to zoom in on some of these things. ah Is it possible that you could have, and hypothetical question, is it possible you could have selected a wrong persona?
00:22:41
akshaydatt
Like you said, you you need to, what does your brand stand for? You've decided it stands for science-backed product.
00:22:47
Priyanka Salot
Yeah.
00:22:48
akshaydatt
ah So is it possible that a brand could have selected a wrong persona and then it's okay to change it and change
00:22:55
Priyanka Salot
Absolutely.
00:22:57
akshaydatt
Okay.
00:22:57
akshaydatt
How do you validate that? Is this the right person or not? Like, have I selected the right positioning of the brand?
00:22:57
Priyanka Salot
Right.
00:23:03
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, so I think that depends something, you know, you would hear the word a lot, Tam, right? What is your total addressable market size, right? And I think that today's generation, it's easiest to check product market fit, right? And obviously, what you're communicating, who you're targeting, is that the right target audience for your product?
00:23:24
Priyanka Salot
And digital gives you that, right? You can launch a product online, right? Like literally in weeks, if not weeks, even in days. Right. And then you you don't need to be PNGs or Unilevers. You don't need to have a store network of millions of store to test something.
00:23:41
Priyanka Salot
Right. Or that kind of money to test something. You need to be passionate. You need to have a product that you believe in. right And you can launch it online and very quickly by listening to your consumers, by talking to your consumers, by seeing how the early trends are.
00:23:56
Priyanka Salot
right You can easily learn one, if the product is right, two, what you're communicating is right or not.
00:24:04
akshaydatt
And,
00:24:04
Priyanka Salot
And if you feel that it doesn't work, you need to change it. And I'll give example. In the first three months of our launch, You know, me and Harshal, we literally talked to every single consumer who bought our products.
00:24:18
Priyanka Salot
Lot of consumers who were based out of Bombay, we went for the deliveries. We used to talk to every single consumers. We made hundreds of iterations literally in the first three months of our launch. and Right. And that's what that it's always a iterative process. Right. Today, also any new product we launch, I wouldn't say they're success on day zero.
00:24:39
akshaydatt
Okay. ah Is there a science to how you listen, how you listen to consumers? Like, I know big companies use like focus group and all, ah but for a startup founder, what advice do you have on how to listen to your consumer and figure out if your communication is resonating, if what the brand stands for is resonating or you need to change it?
00:25:02
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, I think there are multiple things, right? I wouldn't call it science, but I think there are multiple ways to do it. um ah Right. And I'll tell you some of the things that we use at the sleep company to do it.
00:25:14
Priyanka Salot
One, I think, and that's the best part of being in today's ecosystem, which is so digitally led. um ah Right. And the ah today, you know, though our business has a lot moved to, I would say, Omni, consumers still find us, discover us online.
00:25:30
Priyanka Salot
So how do you make sure you listen to your consumers? And there are few things that we at the sleep company do. One, today we make sure everybody in our team, not just, let's say, customer experience team or the team which are responsible for managing online reputation but every senior leader even harshal and i we would make sure we talk to consumers every month we would make sure we are reading reviews online we're reading comments which people are leaving online i think that is one of the best ways i would tell you to understand how consumers and what consumers are talking about you and i'll give you some examples of that right two obviously there are tools that you can use
00:26:11
Priyanka Salot
which are available in the market, which gives you an understanding of, for example, word cloud on the digital ecosystem, right? What people are talking about you more, what people are talking about your less, your positive ah word cloud, your negative word cloud, right?
00:26:27
Priyanka Salot
Third, I think, which we do.
00:26:27
akshaydatt
and This is like reading the product reviews, the comments on posts and all like it is that and then it creates the work.
00:26:32
Priyanka Salot
Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. But I, yes, but I think I'm a hardcore believer that as, as leaders, as founders, ah you know, we need to be very, very close to what consumers are talking about it and digital enables that two way conversation.
00:26:35
akshaydatt
Okay.
00:26:49
Priyanka Salot
and Third, that we do a lot, we do a lot of quantitative and qualitative consumer work, which is a typical old world, I would FMCG way of doing lot of consumer work. right We talk to at least qualitative focus group, at least 100 consumers every month.
00:27:08
Priyanka Salot
right We would do a lot of quantitative survey, not just see how consumers are liking our products, but also to see what more they want to see from the sleep company. I'll give you an example and I think two very strong pivots that have happened in the sleep company journey.
00:27:24
Priyanka Salot
and One, we started as a sleeping product brand like mattresses, right? Make people sleep better. You know, we realized our customers started to tell us that we love your products. We love the tech.
00:27:36
Priyanka Salot
But I spend, you know, half of my day um on a chair. Can you make that comfortable? and Right. And we again started R&D. We said, how can we make sure that we make this polymer, of this grid,
00:27:51
Priyanka Salot
you know, even the chair is more comfortable with this because the properties are pressure relieving properties, right? Which is even, you know, when you sit, it's on your body. So I think that, you know, from making people sleep better to pivoting to making people sleep and sit better is all consumer feedback.
Product Expansion and Market Adaptation
00:28:08
Priyanka Salot
Second, I think very early in our journey, we are just a four and a half year old, ah you know, brand. We realized consumers wanted to touch and feel the products. You know, you're buying a mattress for typically seven to 10 years.
00:28:20
Priyanka Salot
And you want to make sure you touch and feel and specifically for our technology, people wanted to see what does it look like. We went only very, um ah you know, actively ah in our journey and that was all because of consumer feedback.
00:28:35
Priyanka Salot
Right.
00:28:41
Priyanka Salot
organization. Those processes we need to set up in our organization. For example, what I would always do, well I'll just give you one idea. In my, let's say, business review meetings, I would tell every single team, not just, let's say, a brand team, that everybody has to travel to the stores or meet consumers every month and come and present your learnings. Doesn't matter which function you are from.
00:29:06
Priyanka Salot
Right. And then we take those learnings and we action them immediately.
00:29:10
akshaydatt
Okay. Okay. Interesting. The chair you are currently sitting on, which has that ErgoSmart label, or it this is a sleep company chair.
00:29:19
Priyanka Salot
Yes. So absolutely. We launched this brand called Argo Smart by the sleep company. Right.
00:29:23
akshaydatt
Hmm.
00:29:23
Priyanka Salot
So it's a new brand, which is actually designed for, again, very disruptive new designs, new chairs, only for, you know, office chairs and home chairs.
00:29:34
akshaydatt
Okay, very interesting. So I will do a deep dive on this brand extension piece in a bit. There are a couple of questions I want to ask first.
00:29:38
Priyanka Salot
Sure.
00:29:41
akshaydatt
ah Can you do a little 101 on qualitative and quantitative listening to consumers?
00:29:48
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, sure. So I think let me do the typical. See, qualitatives are when you are either doing one on ones or you do multi on one. Multi on one is your focus groups.
00:30:00
Priyanka Salot
And I always tell people before you go for quantitative, do qualitatives. What qualitatives help us understand? Let's say I have a business problem. Okay. I want to understand, um you know, what are, um let's say, ah what are the spaces to play in office chairs?
00:30:17
Priyanka Salot
You know, is it long lasting comfort? Is it, um you know, I don't know what are the spaces that I could play in. what I do is first do qualitative. Deep dive where you're talking to consumers, don't try to understand only the category you want to focus on. First, understand your consumer. What does his or her life looks like?
00:30:35
Priyanka Salot
You know, what does their day look like? um You know, their other category behaviors, right? And then obviously get into your category. What qualitative help you do is form three or four hypotheses.
00:30:48
Priyanka Salot
you know Seems like, let's say, from a chair, people expect long-lasting comfort. Or seems like people expect back support. Or seems like ah people want more cushioning.
00:31:01
Priyanka Salot
Qualitatives help you get um you know three or four hypotheses. But now I don't know which one is a bigger space. You know, do I want to play and design a product which helps with long lasting comfort?
00:31:14
Priyanka Salot
Do I want to design a product that stands for back support? Now I got the spaces. Now you do quantitative, right? And you could meet 200, you could do a survey with 200, 300, 400 people depending.
00:31:27
Priyanka Salot
And then you figure out out of these four spaces that I got from qualitative, quantitatively which one let's say has the highest either TAM addressable market or which one creates a better you know purchase intent or you know which one is not cluttered where I could establish my brand and right so I think that's how we look at qualitative and quantitative
00:31:47
akshaydatt
Okay, okay.
00:31:52
akshaydatt
Okay, okay. ah When you launched the ah mattress, ah did you understand what is the time for this and like what what were some of those early learnings?
00:32:04
akshaydatt
ah And like when did you feel you've got PMF?
00:32:06
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, I think.
00:32:10
Priyanka Salot
Yes, no. So I think early learning, obviously, when we launched the product and before even we went into the R&D, right, I would say not even when we launched the product, but even before we decided that this is the category we want to venture into. Right. I think two things were very important.
00:32:26
Priyanka Salot
One, can we get a product um that can solve the problem? right That we knew will only time will tell after we start R&D. right But before we start even the R&D work, is this a market which is a big enough market where let's say you want to venture into?
00:32:42
Priyanka Salot
And we saw that, um you know just to give you a context, mattresses in India is a $2 billion dollars market. Mattresses globally is a $40 billion dollars market.
00:32:53
Priyanka Salot
and Right. So it's a huge market. We saw a few things happening in this market, which were very encouraging signs. One, I think, which is happening in lot of categories, you see people moving from unbranded to branded, which, you know, you call from, you know, unorganized to organized, which is the consumer behavior got a lot triggered with COVID.
00:33:12
Priyanka Salot
and accelerated with COVID. today So that was one. you know I don't want to buy these local made mattresses. I want products which are better. I want products of you know known brands.
00:33:25
Priyanka Salot
So I think that was one change, consumer change we started to see but before we ventured into the industry. Two, I think a change that we've seen in this industry over the last five, six years, which is also very encouraging.
00:33:37
Priyanka Salot
People want to buy products that are good for them and their family. and i I am okay to invest in products that I feel are good for my health or my family's health.
00:33:48
Priyanka Salot
right And I think that consumer behavior change in India in lot of categories you are seeing, which I think is very, very good for the category. So I think understanding the time, understanding the category was the first step.
00:34:04
Priyanka Salot
right Second, even in the category, for example, we saw that the experience of buying a mattress in India was very bad. 90% of the consumers will still go to this 100 square foot retailer outlet where you don't even see the products. You see those small mockups and you know the experience of buying is is is is not good. You have hundreds of products. Retailer is pushing the product where they get the maximum margin.
00:34:31
Priyanka Salot
So I think that whole experience was bad. Product was bad. Market seemed like a huge market. And we said, let's crack the product. How do your second point? How do you, you know, when did we figure out product market fit? Right.
00:34:45
Priyanka Salot
I still remember and it used to be a big surprise for me in the early days. Right. um So when we launched on um you know Amazon and we had our website, the sleep company dot I.N., you know, we would talk to every consumer who were buying us and we started to see lot of reviews coming in and we start we used to take a lot of feedback from consumers even on the call.
00:35:06
Priyanka Salot
and And I always joke about me and Arishir were the first literally a call agents at the sleep company. And, you know, I remember reading the reviews where people used to say one, two, three things have been stuck in my head since five years. Right.
00:35:20
Priyanka Salot
One review was that it's the best medicine to cure insomnia. and right if you ah One people said that my cervical pain has reduced drastically, my spondylitis has gone.
00:35:24
akshaydatt
Well,
00:35:33
Priyanka Salot
And in the beginning, I used to wonder that, you know, um like really like amazing. And we would talk to those consumers, we will call them back. We would understand in detail and we realize realize the product delivers.
00:35:45
Priyanka Salot
So for the first one year, we were bootstrapped. And you know and we were ah and but I think within a few months when we saw one great feedback coming from consumers, two, we started to see numbers grow drastically.
00:36:00
Priyanka Salot
I think is when you realize that, OK, the product's working. Now, depending on, you know, every founder has a different vision for their company. We wanted to make sure that we become one of the leaders in this country.
00:36:13
Priyanka Salot
And hence we wanted to make sure that every single consumer can try our first knows about our product and can try our product. We decided to go. more aggressive and that's when I think we decided to raise our first round of money right because we wanted to drive
Scaling the Business and Investor Insights
00:36:28
Priyanka Salot
a lot of awareness and and we got our first brand ambassador also right we decided that we needed to drive awareness and educate our consumers on smart grid technology and um and you know I think yeah that's how then the next set of our journey began
00:36:46
akshaydatt
Okay, amazing. When you raised your first round, what error were you at at that time? I think 21 is when you raised it, right? 5 million.
00:36:54
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, so I think um and twenty June 21 is when Fireside Ventures came on board. um i think when we we always say that when we sign the term sheet, ah we were doing around one and a half CR um a month, right? So 1250, 18 CR ARR.
00:37:14
Priyanka Salot
I think within three months, by the time the term sheet was signed, Or by the time the final money came in, we were doing around 50 CR ARR.
00:37:25
akshaydatt
Wow.
00:37:25
Priyanka Salot
Right. But that's how in 21 we were. yeah
00:37:30
akshaydatt
Amazing. Amazing. And after that, you had a Series B within a year, I think, about roughly $20 million. dollars
00:37:38
Priyanka Salot
Yes. Yes. We got Prengi on board and we think of ourselves to be actually... you know we were very clear what the business objective in 21 was and in 22 was and that's why i think we say that for us both our investors were literally a match made in heaven and you know we got very very ah high quality of investors um and fiscal 22 which is around ah august september 22 is when preem g invest came on board and we did our series b we actually just did the cdc in october where you know preem g and
00:38:13
Priyanka Salot
Fireside Ventures both wanted to invest and ah you know make sure they could put in more money and we raised our CDC from our existing investors.
00:38:21
akshaydatt
Wow, amazing, amazing. ah In what way were both these investors are like a perfect match? What did each of these bring to the table?
00:38:29
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, so I think in early days, Akshay, when we were just one year old, right we were a digital first brand. And I think what we wanted was two things. We wanted, obviously we any founder wants money, right? You want money to grow the business.
00:38:43
Priyanka Salot
Other than the money, what is it that we wanted? We were clear that we wanted an investor, one who understands consumer brands. You know, who can understand what is it that we are trying to build.
00:38:55
Priyanka Salot
um And um ask anybody, I think, who runs a consumer brand startup, they would tell you Fireside is at the top. you know, to really understand consumer brands.
00:39:02
akshaydatt
Right.
00:39:04
Priyanka Salot
I think that was very, very important for us too, which was important for us as founders when you, you know, specifically when you're a first time entrepreneur, you know, we wanted to make sure that we get access to learnings, resources of what other digital first brands are doing and how are they building their brands, right?
00:39:23
Priyanka Salot
Those playbooks, ah you know, the thing that I said is meta the right thing or is Google the right thing? Obviously you learn, on your own, but learn, you know, some if you see what other brands are doing, you know what to experiment as well.
00:39:36
Priyanka Salot
And I think that's why I say Fireside the perfect fit, um you know, after one year of our journey, you know, in 22, what changed and why, ah you know, I think Premji was the perfect fit who came on board.
00:39:49
Priyanka Salot
I think that June, around June 22, we decided that we wanted to go Omni. and i And what do I mean by Omni? It's a very loosely ah used word today, but I'll talk more about that maybe later.
00:40:06
Priyanka Salot
We decided that we needed to open our own experience centers. And we didn't want to go the distributor, retailer route. That was not our DNA. We decided we wanted to open experience centers. And Premji obviously comes with huge experience of investing in brands that are a lot, let's say, offline focused.
00:40:26
Priyanka Salot
right and i think that's when we decided we've launched our first experience center in bangalore in nu june 22 to just learn on how the experience center or omni route work for us and i think that's how i say premji was a perfect investor for us to bring on board for our omni journey
00:40:48
akshaydatt
okay okay okay interesting uh you uh had once uh little back spoken of keeping consumer in the epicenter of everything you do ah can you give me examples of that like what does that make it
00:41:01
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, sure. I think everything we do is for the consumers and lot of examples. We designed the product, right? We decided to get our hands dirty and not do what everybody was doing, keeping consumer in the center, and right? We didn't launch a form mattress, which we could have launched in one month, right? We decided to spend two years um to develop a product that can make consumers sleep better.
00:41:27
Priyanka Salot
Two, I think um you know when we decided to go um offline, if you look at mattress industry, Akshay, as i was telling you, it's a $2 billion dollars market, um you knowm very unorganized.
00:41:39
Priyanka Salot
If you see the branded players, most of the branded players sell through dealers and distributors. What does that do? We were selling online. So we were selling direct to consumer. We could talk to every consumer of ours. We could control ah how is the experience before they buy and how is the experience after they buy because it's our consumer. We have access to the consumer.
00:42:03
Priyanka Salot
Now in this industry, most people sell through dealers and distributors. What does that do? Two things. One, dealers and distributors care about the margin they get.
00:42:15
Priyanka Salot
and the industry operates at a 30 to 40 percent margin. So as a retailer or a distributor, I would push a product which gives me the maximum margin. I don't care about the product. I don't care about the technology.
00:42:29
Priyanka Salot
Right. We cared about the technology. We cared about the product. So it just didn't fit the DNA. Right. I think that was one thing.
00:42:34
akshaydatt
Mm-hmm.
00:42:36
Priyanka Salot
Second, we realized the customer experience of shopping, in these stores is far, far less like it's really bad.
00:42:47
Priyanka Salot
yeah he should actually go and visit some of the mattress stores and you'll realize it how how the experience is. And I think our DNA being digital first was we wanted to make every single consumer delight, delighted, right? We wanted to delight every single consumer.
00:43:02
Priyanka Salot
So I think we decided it to go the harder route. We decided we need to open our own experience centers.
00:43:09
akshaydatt
Okay. ah Can you tell me about your pricing journey? What is the... ah How did you...
00:43:13
Priyanka Salot
Sorry.
00:43:14
akshaydatt
Yeah.
00:43:23
akshaydatt
Let me start.
00:43:23
Priyanka Salot
Yeah.
00:43:25
akshaydatt
So ah tell me about the journey of ah figuring out pricing. What price point did you launch at? Is it still roughly the same price point? And how does your price point decide your time?
00:43:37
Priyanka Salot
Yeah. No, so I think for us, we were clear. one First was two for us to crack the product, right? um The way we calculated the price point, we have a certain product and there is a certain cost of the product.
00:43:50
Priyanka Salot
And if you look at your P&L, there is a certain gross margin you need to operate at. If you don't operate at a certain gross margin, you cannot build a long term sustainable business. Now leave the brand, right?
00:44:01
Priyanka Salot
But you need to build a business that can pay out for its shareholders, for its consumers, for its employees, right? And I think it was simple that what is the category gross margin? What is the gross margin we need to operate And hence, I think that's how we decided the pricing.
00:44:19
akshaydatt
And
00:44:19
Priyanka Salot
And then you learn with time that is that pricing and product. And that's what I think is a big part of product market fit, right? When you launch a product in the digital ecosystem at a certain price, are consumers ready to buy your product at that price for what do you deliver to your consumers?
00:44:36
Priyanka Salot
I think that's a big part of product market fit.
00:44:39
akshaydatt
what price did you launch it?
00:44:41
Priyanka Salot
So I think when we launched a typical king size mattress, ah which is your six and a half feet by six feet, a six inches thick mattress was around 24, 25,000.
00:44:53
akshaydatt
And how does that compare to other similar, I mean, obviously every mattress has a different technology behind it.
00:45:00
Priyanka Salot
yeahp
00:45:01
akshaydatt
How does that compare in terms of, is that like at the pre or?
00:45:03
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, so if if you look at the offline market, which is 90% of the mattress category, of any big but brand, any you know any brand that you would take, which has been there for decades, TSE is very, very competitively priced.
00:45:05
akshaydatt
or
00:45:19
Priyanka Salot
And the reason is because we send our products directly, literally from our manufacturing unit, from our plant to consumer houses. right So we can offer far better technology and quality at, I would say, little lower or competitive prices. Whereas lot of other brands, as I was just telling you that it's through dealers and distributor, they end up paying such a huge 30-35% margin to dealer distributor, which automatically will be passed to the consumer and consumer is being penalized for it.
00:45:52
Priyanka Salot
and Right. So I, yeah,
00:45:56
akshaydatt
You know, this thesis of direct-to-customer is eliminating middleman and giving consumer better pricing is, i mean, as far as I understand, is not really true because d two c brands need to spend on marketing. So it works out to be the same.
00:46:13
akshaydatt
Like your customer acquisition costs will replace what you would have otherwise paid to your dealers.
00:46:19
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, so I'll split it into two points, Akshay, and I'm glad we're having this chat. Okay, um so it depends on category to category, right? Let me take an example because I've spent time in FMCG and maybe i'll I'll give you an example.
00:46:33
Priyanka Salot
Let's look at a typical beauty personal care brand from FMCG. Okay, you have a dealer, distributor, retailer margin of around 10% plus minus, right? It's not a high margin, it's a 10%.
00:46:54
Priyanka Salot
right which becomes total 20% expenses now when you're building a digital only brand and right you're right digital is not a cheaper medium to drive marketing and it's it's the cost of acquisitions are high right lot of brands would be spending around 25 to 35 percent which is yes you're right five ten percent higher than what a typical company would spend and maybe with scale you can drive those efficiencies and hence pass those efficiencies to consumer I think that's how you look at a typical category. But let me tell you mattresses and why is it a little different?
00:47:30
Priyanka Salot
In mattresses, it's one of the categories that at least I have seen where the margins are very, very high. And I'll tell you why the margins are high. It's 35% margin, which is not a typical consumer product margin.
00:47:43
Priyanka Salot
And the margins are high, I'll tell you. And without naming, maybe let's look at the market leader in this category. you know A market leader in this category does around a thousand CR business.
00:48:01
Priyanka Salot
no And hence the throughput per outlet is very, very low.
00:48:13
Priyanka Salot
Otherwise, if I don't make any money, I'm not going to sell your product. Given the sale per outlet is so less because it's so fragmented, the margins are very, very high.
00:48:27
Priyanka Salot
And hence today for the sleep company, I'll give you an example. and And that's where I would say Omni also really helped us. Because of the Omni, because today our marketing costs are far lower than that.
00:48:40
Priyanka Salot
Right. So the Omni route is actually helping me with better efficiencies. And that's the reason I don't spend so much on marketing. Right. And that's the reason one, we run a business which is very, very sustainable.
00:48:53
Priyanka Salot
And two, we can ensure our products are given at a pricing which is far, far competitive than any other legacy brand in this country. Right.
00:49:04
akshaydatt
interesting why is uh why is the sale per dealer so low uh is it that uh they are selling multiple brands one of them or what is like
00:49:13
Priyanka Salot
Because you see
00:49:17
Priyanka Salot
two reasons. One, you see a dealer every 500 meters.
00:49:21
akshaydatt
okay because it's a very high product you can't deliver longer
00:49:26
Priyanka Salot
That's how the category has been created. has been created very hyper local. But we decided that can we change that? right Can we focus more on the product, the consumer experience ah right and make people travel at least 15 minutes of distance?
00:49:42
Priyanka Salot
right So I think that is what we decided and we've seen amazing success, um obviously, long, long way before we make India sleep and sit better. But I would say, um you know, making sure that we don't have a middleman, making sure that we can delight our consumers, we can educate them on our technology.
00:50:00
Priyanka Salot
Right. As I was telling you, all our experience centers have a sleep lab. You can go and see for yourself, how does the product work? And today's consumer, trust me, and I tell this, today's consumer wants to do lot of research before they buy the product, um you know, for themselves or their family. And that's what I think, you know, we decided to offer them.
00:50:22
akshaydatt
Yeah, because this is a long-term investment for a consumer. It's not a and like a consumable item. It's an asset. I mean, you you spend on it like you spend on an asset, basically.
00:50:32
Priyanka Salot
you spend 26, literally calculating 26 years of your life on a mattress. So you better be sleeping on the right one.
00:50:38
akshaydatt
Yeah.
00:50:42
akshaydatt
What percentage of your... What is your marketing cost percentage? Like you said, typical D2C brand is about 25% to 35%.
00:50:52
Priyanka Salot
So actually we are much lower than that, ah right?
00:50:55
akshaydatt
Mm-hmm.
00:50:55
Priyanka Salot
Because we see, um you know, very good conversions and we see, um you know, ah so as we we run our business in a very, ah I would say efficient way.
00:51:06
Priyanka Salot
ah We want to make sure this year we become profitable and we want to create a long term brand and a business. So I think for us, the costs are And, you know, we are, yeah.
00:51:21
akshaydatt
What is working for you in marketing? What all do you spend on? ah How much of this is performance marketing? How much is education? ah Like, just help me understand.
00:51:29
Priyanka Salot
Yeah. So I think for us, what we realize, we, you know, we consumers discover us online and, you know, then they read about the sleep company, they read about the technology, the smart grid technology. And, you know, then they want to go to our experience centers and touch and feel the products.
00:51:47
Priyanka Salot
and They also want to figure out that from the range of ah six, seven mattresses that we have, what works best for them.
00:51:54
akshaydatt
Mm-hmm.
00:51:54
Priyanka Salot
Right. So since it's a digital discovery, we spend, you know, bulk of our marketing spends are online. And it's mainly two things. As you said, one is awareness and education ah where we leverage lot of YouTube.
00:52:08
Priyanka Salot
um Right. um The second is performance marketing, which is about people who are searching for mattresses. How do I make sure, you know, I come, I make myself discoverable.
00:52:19
Priyanka Salot
And that's where Google plays a very strong role for us. So I think two mediums that play a very strong role for us is one is YouTube and second is Google.
00:52:28
akshaydatt
Okay, so YouTube is essentially like a content focus where you have ah like either customer testimonials or explaining the ah technology behind the mattress or things like that.
00:52:41
akshaydatt
Like like what kind of content do you do on?
00:52:43
Priyanka Salot
Both things, both things. One, I would think of it to be a more awareness driver so that I can make more and more people aware about the sleep company and the smart grid technology.
00:52:55
Priyanka Salot
Right. Two, A very strong role in the bottom funnel where, do you know, lot of people before they buy, they want to know how the product is, you know, what how, you know, what are the features of the product? um how what does How does the product work for back or how does the product work for overall body or how smart grid different from memory form or form, right?
00:53:17
Priyanka Salot
That is little long format content. So I think we do both a lot on YouTube.
00:53:23
akshaydatt
Okay. You know, when I did my MBA, which is about 20 plus years back, we learned, and I didn't specialize in marketing, but obviously in first year you do everything.
00:53:27
Priyanka Salot
Yeah.
00:53:34
akshaydatt
ah We learned about marketing as ETL and BTL are the two ways to do your marketing spends, which today i think is converted to bottom of the funnel, top of the funnel, middle of the funnel.
00:53:34
Priyanka Salot
yeah
00:53:43
akshaydatt
Can you just educate me on what is a modern marketeer's approach towards marketing? What spend do you do for what objective?
00:53:52
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, so, you know, the way I look at it is either not ATL, BTL or not even top funnel, bottom funnel, right? I think today's consumer is very fluid.
00:54:03
Priyanka Salot
What do I mean the consumer is very fluid is It's not that I first see you on Google, then I go on YouTube, then I go and see a print and then I will open my TV and I will see a TV.
00:54:16
Priyanka Salot
Today I can enter from any place and exit from any touch point. Right. And I think the simple logic is you need to be where your consumer is. You need to surround your consumer across the ecosystem.
00:54:32
Priyanka Salot
to drive either your awareness or consideration for the brand. Right. And I think that's how we look at. We have certain communications which are driving awareness, which could be, for example, you should know what the sleep company is and what the smart grid mattresses are and to driving consideration why you should buy the sleep company or smart grid mattresses.
00:54:54
Priyanka Salot
um You know how they are. What are the ABC they offer? and Right. Or, you know, you got 100 nights trial. um You know, and if you don't like your mattress, you get 100% refund.
00:55:05
Priyanka Salot
Right. So I think you need to see what is it that drives awareness and what is it that drives consideration or purchase. And hence, you need to target consumers with different communications on different touch points wherever your consumer is available.
00:55:22
akshaydatt
Can you go a little deeper on this? Give me examples of awareness spends and examples of consideration spends.
00:55:28
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, so I think for us, we do around, you know, 35-40% of our spends on, I would say, very hardcore video driving awareness for the brat. And rest we would do on performance marketing, which is about, um you know, people who are actually looking for a mattress.
00:55:46
Priyanka Salot
How do I make sure, you know, they can see the sleep company popping on Google? Right. And how once they come on my my website, how do I retarget them and drive purchase intent?
00:56:00
Priyanka Salot
Right. Now you are aware of me, but I need to read. Because, you know, what we've realized that the people do research for anywhere between a week to two weeks before they actually make a purchase.
00:56:11
Priyanka Salot
Right. So I think it's important for you to then educate your consumer on what are the features or what is the technology and, you know, oh why buy me?
00:56:23
akshaydatt
So ah performance marketing is a consideration spend.
00:56:27
Priyanka Salot
Yes.
00:56:28
akshaydatt
Okay. And.
00:56:29
Priyanka Salot
Anything that drive performance marketing is anything that will drive purchase, you know, where you are optimizing things for purchase.
00:56:33
akshaydatt
Okay.
00:56:36
akshaydatt
Hmm.
00:56:36
Priyanka Salot
Awareness is where maybe you're optimizing things for views. I want people to view my ad. I want people to be aware of me. and Right.
00:56:45
akshaydatt
Hmm.
00:56:45
Priyanka Salot
You're not worried about, oh, is this going to translate into sales or not?
00:56:50
akshaydatt
Hmm. So that. typical ATL like ah TV print.
00:56:55
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, you could take that as a TV.
00:56:56
akshaydatt
Hmm.
00:56:57
Priyanka Salot
Exactly. There's no way for you to qualify. Does TV, how does TV directly translate into sales? Right. But you do TV to drive awareness. ah Let's say typical FMCG word. I drive TV to, you know, I put TV to drive awareness. Now people are, let's say, aware about a brand aerial.
00:57:14
Priyanka Salot
Right. Now I go to, a you know, D-Mart or a big bazaar and i so I'm aware of the brand. And then what do I how my experience is, what are the features I see, e etc. will drive consideration. And, you know, so I think that's how we look at it.
00:57:29
akshaydatt
Okay, so ah I think your ARR today is 200 CR plus, right? i think 250 or something like that was.
00:57:36
Priyanka Salot
450 CR plus. Yeah.
00:57:37
akshaydatt
should be Wow, okay. um For a founder, ah what advice would you share in terms of when you're in that 0 to 100 ARR, what should your spend be on?
00:57:48
akshaydatt
And when you are in that 100 to 500, what should the spend be on? And then when you cross 500, what do you think that spend will be on?
00:57:55
Priyanka Salot
yeah I don't think Akshay one answer fits everyone, and right? Specifically on what where your spends should be on. I think it's very different for every single category and every single brand, right? But I think what I would tell the founders is, it doesn't matter which part of your journey is in 0 to 1, 1 to 10, 10 to 100.
00:58:17
Priyanka Salot
I think first thing is what works in 0 to 1, 1 to 10, 10 to 100 could be different. Right. So don't get stuck up that, you know, this was working till now. And, you know, and hence keep on doing the same.
00:58:30
Priyanka Salot
My point is keep on experimenting is very, very, very important. and Right. So because the different things can work in different parts of um the journey. So I think making sure that you keep experimenting with whatever you want to do, which even YouTube, Google, Meta, even even if you want to do, you know,
00:58:50
Priyanka Salot
non-digital which is let's say your tv your print um you know holdings test things but make sure you understand when you're testing you're very clear on how you're going to measure it that's very very important otherwise you'll just spend money and you wouldn't know if it's working or not working So I think that experimentation, agility is super, super important. We all you know are in an ecosystem of startups.
00:59:14
Priyanka Salot
and right So I think that's very, very important. Two, I think it's very important, whatever you do, and I think going back to your question of keeping consumer at the epi epicenter. Talk to your consumer. You know, even if you're doing, a you know, make sure that you're running, um you know, whatever quality it is, quantity it is to understand how your consumers are discovering you so that you know what's working.
00:59:38
Priyanka Salot
So I think staying close to the consumer is the secret sauce for everything.
00:59:44
akshaydatt
What were some of the pivots you went through? Like when you realized that at our stage now, we need to change our approach. That's something which was working earlier.
00:59:51
Priyanka Salot
I think... Yeah, I think lot of pivots not on how to build the brand in terms of communication, but how to reach consumers. Right. As I said, you know, till last year, our online business was our majority business.
01:00:07
Priyanka Salot
ah Right. We were a lot um even on marketplaces. or direct to consumer website. Today, realized offline or only business is ah big chunk of our business. right So that's a big pivot. so you know So how do you make sure that you drive awareness for your stores, that you know the sleep company has experience centers within 15 minutes of your driving distance? That becomes important.
01:00:32
akshaydatt
more hyper local advertising.
01:00:32
Priyanka Salot
um
01:00:36
Priyanka Salot
Yes, absolutely. Right. Because I want to make sure that, you know, somebody who's searching for me in, let's say, Andheri or Bombay knows about my stores in Bombay. People who are searching for me in Bangalore knows about my stores in Bangalore. Right.
01:00:47
Priyanka Salot
So I think that is so how you reach your consumer can keep on changing. Right. Today also we're experimenting with a lot of things. But I think it's important for us to understand what is paying out and what is not paying out.
01:01:01
akshaydatt
How do you measure if a sale was generated through offline or online? Because it could happen that someone walked into a store, but then bought it online. Or like how do you how do you classify like this purchase as attributed to a store or is an online purchase?
01:01:17
Priyanka Salot
Yeah. No, you... no You know, it's difficult and I'll tell you, we we understand our consumer journey very, very good. We have a lot of ah tools that we have created in-house where we understand. So I don't think we need to attribute is it offline and online because as I was telling you, it's not black and white. No consumer would either just spend time offline or just online. Very few of them will be doing that. Most of them are fluid.
01:01:42
Priyanka Salot
i come online, I see you two, three times. I come offline, I see you two, three times and then I will decide where I want to buy. So I think it's important to understand what is the role that online is playing?
01:01:54
Priyanka Salot
What is the role that offline is playing? Basis that you do your go to market, not about, oh you know, is this consumer bought? Is this consumer an online consumer and an offline consumer? We don't worry too much about that.
01:02:08
Priyanka Salot
I think we're very clear. We want our consumers to find us online and we're very, very happy. And we want them to go to our experience centers, touch and feel our products, see the smart, great technology, experience amazing, amazing products in our centers. and um And then, you know, they can buy wherever they choose to, where whichever is convenient for them. We don't worry about that.
01:02:31
akshaydatt
What are the investments you made in marketing technology? You said you built some in-house tools. Just take me through your MarTech stack.
01:02:41
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, you know, we do a lot of things there, Akshay. One is, um you know, all our tech stack, which is for our Omni, um right? Because we wanted to ensure from day zero, when we opened our first experience center, that the customer journey doesn't matter, they buy online or offline, has to be exactly same, right?
01:03:01
Priyanka Salot
And hence, we want we developed our own proprietary tools to make sure that Even if a some consumer is buying offline or online, the order is treated exactly the same way, dispatched from the same warehouse, delivered in the same exact way, exactly same message going to the consumer so that the journey is seamless.
01:03:20
Priyanka Salot
um and right So I think those that is one tool that I would say. Two is, as you told me, you know, understanding how the consumer journey, even let's say post purchases, you know, did I find first, did i um go on your website and then visited the store or did I first visit the store and visited the website? So your CRM systems, that's also something that we've developed and, um you know, which really helps us understand the whole consumer journey.
01:03:45
Priyanka Salot
You know, what what is the first point of contact? What is the last point of contact? Average number of contacts, right? So I think, you know, we use lot of data internally to understand what's working on the business and what's not working on the business.
01:04:01
akshaydatt
okay and when a consumer is visiting a store you are able to identify that this is the ka consumer who has gone to the store and then ah able to also map that he also visited our website like okay but like you make him fill out a like a form with his number or or how do you how do you
01:04:13
Priyanka Salot
Oh, absolutely.
01:04:19
Priyanka Salot
See, it's a very high intent purchase, Akshay, right? As you said, people are buying this for at least 7 to 10 years. And, you know, a typical consumer actually spends around half an hour in our stores.
01:04:33
Priyanka Salot
And, you know, we've got a team of great, ah you know, store managers and we call them sleep experts at our store, right? Their job is to make sure that they can...
01:04:46
Priyanka Salot
understand the consumer needs, they can educate the consumers, they can make them experience the products and make sure that they get the best product for their body type or their body shape.
01:04:57
Priyanka Salot
Right. So I think we focus a lot on education and experience. um And I think, you know, that's that's what we see consumers love us for.
01:05:08
Priyanka Salot
And, you know, and that's what is the DNA of the sleep company.
01:05:13
akshaydatt
Okay. How do you, you know, I want to go on the supply side of this. Like, how did you build the supply for Do you manufacture in-house or is it third party? And ah how is it, how does it reach the consumer's doorstep?
01:05:28
akshaydatt
Yeah.
01:05:28
Priyanka Salot
Yeah.
01:05:29
Priyanka Salot
and So something we're very proud of Akshay from day zero, it's endto end to end in house. And the reason is twofold. One, we had a tech or we have a tech which is very proprietary.
01:05:41
Priyanka Salot
Right. And we have patent actually for a smart grid technology. We have multiple patents granted. We have patent granted in India. We have patent granted in Japan. We have patent um granted in Saudi. We have patent granted UAE.
01:05:57
Priyanka Salot
Right. So we have and, you know, in multiple countries like Europe, US, our patent should come in any time. right So we have patent granted in multiple countries. So I think for us, it was important that you know things are managed in-house.
01:06:11
Priyanka Salot
Two, I think when you are doing things in-house, specifically you're manufacturing your supply chain, you can control customer experience far, far better. Today, I'll give you an example. Because of that, in mattress category, it's little complicated. You have standard sizes, which are typical your king, queen, single sizes. And then You have infinite non-standard sizes, which are custom sizes, which is what the sleep company also does, right?
01:06:38
Priyanka Salot
You want the 76.35 inches into 61.75 inches, right? ah Which is all non-standard sizes. So today, because we control the supply chain, let's look at top five metros.
01:06:54
Priyanka Salot
Any standard size, we can deliver in 48 to 72 hours to your doorstep.
01:07:00
akshaydatt
so Okay.
01:07:00
Priyanka Salot
right even our non-standard size because we make it in-house we can make sure it is dispatched in 48 hours right If we didn't have our own manufacturing, our own supply chain, I don't think we could have delivered a great customer experience.
01:07:16
Priyanka Salot
um ah right And so I think that's why for us to ensure again, going back again to make sure we delight the consumer. I think owning the manufacturing supply chain internally is very, very important. And we've been doing that from day zero.
01:07:31
akshaydatt
And do you own the delivery also? Or is that with a...
01:07:37
Priyanka Salot
No, we don't own the delivery. Actually, this category is a heavy and bulky, ah right? So I think with heavy and bulky, there are a lot of challenges that come in the delivery ecosystem. Now, I think India ecosystem has evolved a lot thanks to companies like Amazon, Flipkart. You have tons of partners out there.
01:07:54
Priyanka Salot
We work with very, very strong quality players in this category. and you know we which are our 3p partners and we make sure we leverage them to deliver our products to customers what we have done internally which i think is a again to ensure we have a great customer experience we have a team of um you know delivery experts that we call them ah which is a control tower these people literally hourly are monitoring every single um order of hours right and ensuring it is delivered as per the commitment we made to the consumer right and I think that is very very important and you know if you ask me are we able to deliver 100% on time if I say yes it's a lie right it's it's today because of the ecosystem it's you know let's say truck something happened on the road it just didn't reach or whatever so I would say
01:08:31
akshaydatt
About anything.
01:08:50
Priyanka Salot
We deliver more than 98% of our orders on time. We do have 1 to 2% orders that we are not able to deliver on time. But we make sure that we get those learnings. We make sure that you know we talk to those consumers, very transparently communicate to them why it got delayed, even if it was a one-day delay.
01:09:10
Priyanka Salot
right And we learn from those mistakes and we try fix them.
01:09:14
akshaydatt
Wow, amazing, amazing. I think delivery is typically where customer experience is affected with a lot of other D2C brands, which I think through the delivery expert team, you have managed to make sure that that doesn't happen.
01:09:26
Priyanka Salot
Yes. Yes.
01:09:29
akshaydatt
Okay, okay. You've got patents in multiple countries. Is there a plan to global?
01:09:35
Priyanka Salot
Yes.
01:09:36
akshaydatt
ah
01:09:38
Priyanka Salot
Yeah, so absolutely long term. Yes, absolutely. We want to become world's best comfort tech brand. You know, it's not just India, which is sleep deprived. The whole world is sleep deprived.
01:09:48
Priyanka Salot
And that's sadly the part, right? I mean, if you read any survey, reports, world is becoming sleep deprived. You know, something which is which was taken for granted, something which is so important, sadly, is very, very difficult to get sleep.
01:10:05
Priyanka Salot
and i And we believe with our patented product, with our technology, ah we can um you know make create a made in India global business. But I think today our priority is India.
01:10:17
Priyanka Salot
we keep um We are experimenting with one or two countries and we will see how it pans out and then we will go more aggressive. But I think today the focus is India ah um grow continue to grow exponentially um and then we will definitely go more aggressive internationally.
01:10:34
akshaydatt
yeah there's lot of headroom in india still uh ah you know so from sleep tech to comfort tech this uh will this need some sort of a rebranding uh i mean even the name itself uh is the sleep company now you're also doing chairs what what is the approach there will you
01:10:37
Priyanka Salot
Oh, yeah.
01:10:54
akshaydatt
treat them as separate brands and like ArgoSmart as a separate brand for chairs or is it better to have one single brand so that both categories benefit from that awareness because otherwise the awareness spend will double right
01:11:08
Priyanka Salot
Yeah. So I think it depends, Akshay, and, you know, what is the challenge for us? You know, we have two brands. You know, the sleep company is for products which are about sleeping, which is, let's say, our mattress smart grid mattresses, our smart beds.
01:11:23
Priyanka Salot
um We've got smart grid pillows, right? um ah So that's the sleep companies for that, right? Because as you said, the name suggests sleep. The need that the consumers have from products that can help them sleep better is very different from the need that consumers have from products that can make them sit better.
01:11:41
Priyanka Salot
And ArgoSmart is our brand which is for sitting products. right Today we've got office chairs. right smart grid We are world's first smart grid office chair. We've got smart grid lounger.
01:11:55
Priyanka Salot
Right. So I think we have two different brands. The way to drive efficiency is today both our brands sit in one experience center. um ah Right. And that's where they discover both the sleep company. Consumers discover both the sleep company and Argo smart by the sleep company.
01:12:14
akshaydatt
Okay, but you will keep them as separate brands.
01:12:15
Priyanka Salot
Yeah.
01:12:17
akshaydatt
ah
01:12:18
Priyanka Salot
Yes.
01:12:19
akshaydatt
Okay. Okay. Okay.
01:12:20
Priyanka Salot
But the way to halo or the way to drive, I would say, efficiencies is it's ArgoSmart buy the sleep company, right? Because the technology is the same, right? We want to make sure that the same we have the same brand values, right? Very tech-enabled, science-enabled, disruptive products, patented products, very advanced technology that can actually make people sit better.
01:12:45
Priyanka Salot
right We spend almost eight hours every day on an office chair, seven to eight hours, right? and That needs to be comfortable. but So I think the but brand values are exactly same. The go-to market is same.
01:12:57
Priyanka Salot
And hence for us, it doesn't drive inefficiencies.
01:13:01
akshaydatt
ah Do you see ErgoSmart as an upsell or as a business of its own?
01:13:08
Priyanka Salot
As a business of its own.
01:13:10
akshaydatt
Okay. ah Isn't it too early to invest in two categories? And I mean, wouldn't you spread yourself too thin in terms of resources? Okay.
01:13:22
Priyanka Salot
Akshay, this has come from consumers. They wanted us to launch this product. It's doing phenomenally well, and right? today um Today, D2C, the consumer direct, see, chairs again is a very, very fragmented market.
01:13:34
Priyanka Salot
It was more of a B2B market. You know, you have a lot of old age brands selling B2B. What I think happened with COVID is lot of hybrids started. People started to think about chairs. People started to buy their own chair.
01:13:49
Priyanka Salot
That's how this category evolved. Today, if you check in the D2C consumer chair brand, ErgoSmart is the biggest brand in the country today.
01:14:00
akshaydatt
Oh, wow.
01:14:01
Priyanka Salot
Right. Already the biggest brand in the country today. I think now for us, the intent is how do we make it make more people aware about it and we drive it. Right. Because there is a need for a better designed, a more comfortable chair out there.
01:14:17
Priyanka Salot
right Because earlier it was, for example, you know the HR of a company or some team, admin team purchase department is sitting and deciding the chairs in the office. Today, when I experience a chair, I can influence what chair is used in my office. right And there is a need for better quality, better designed products that can make people sit far more comfortably for the long sitting hours that we all do. Right.
01:14:45
akshaydatt
OK. What percentage of your ARR is from ArgoSmart?
01:14:50
Priyanka Salot
So I think today around 20% of our business is on ArgoSmart.
01:14:54
akshaydatt
Wow. So it's almost like a 100 crore ARR category.
01:14:57
Priyanka Salot
yeah
01:14:58
akshaydatt
Wow. Amazing. Amazing. ah You spoke about signing up your first celebrity. Talk to me a bit about celebrity endorsement. When does it work? At what stage?
01:15:10
akshaydatt
ah What is the most efficient way to use it? Because I know a lot of brands spend on celebrity endorsement and they don't get bang for the buck. ah So, you know, what's the to think about that?
01:15:20
Priyanka Salot
Yeah.
01:15:22
Priyanka Salot
I think we think about it in two or three ways, right? And for I think every brand is different. ah ah ah Every category is different, right? Now, the way is first, you need to be very, very clear on what is it that you want from a celebrity, right? Are you trying to break the clutter, get more eyeballs and drive awareness for your brand?
01:15:41
Priyanka Salot
Are you trying to drive some voice of authority, voice of um authority on your brand and drive um you know or are you trying to drive some trust some credibility whatever so I think that is very very important to understand I think where it doesn't work for a lot of brands you take a celebrity just because it's a famous celebrity you put it on you forget the brand actually the celebrity becomes the ad right I think And you know for maybe some it would work, for some it wouldn't work. right
01:16:12
Priyanka Salot
I think we were very clear that we wanted to get somebody on board for two things. One, drive education about smart grid technology and drive awareness about smart grid technology.
01:16:27
Priyanka Salot
Two, we were very clear the product has to be the hero, and right? We sell a very disruptive, we sell an amazing product which we wanted consumers to see the smart grid mattresses, how it's great for your back, how does it release pressure on curvatures, how it has got 2,500 air channels, right?
01:16:46
Priyanka Salot
And we want so product was always the hero. We wanted to bring out, keep stay true to science, but bring it out in a way that can be delivered in a credible, trustworthy way to consumers, because that's what the brand values are. Right.
01:17:01
Priyanka Salot
And I think that's where we found a great fit with Anil Kapoor. um and i he He goes very, very well with the brand ethos. um ah right Very credible, very trustworthy, could deliver science in a very strong way for us.
01:17:18
Priyanka Salot
um right And I think that's where we've been now um you know working with him for the last three years. And and you know as I always say, I'm a big fan of consistency.
01:17:29
Priyanka Salot
and right Even if you do the same thing for 10 years, it's going to help the brand. Unless and until you say the thing is not working, right? Then you change. and i So I think that is the reason that literally um within one year of our launch, one, one and a half year of our launch, we decided that we wanted to bring somebody on board to drive education about our products.
01:17:52
Priyanka Salot
But product first and then the Celeb, right? And you have to make sure that the Celeb has a strong sync with your brand. and right Otherwise, nobody will know which product ad is this.
01:18:04
Priyanka Salot
I think that's how we decided on Anil Kapoor and we continue to work very strongly with him.
01:18:13
akshaydatt
and Okay. Who's your ideal customer profile or, you know, which demographic are you targeting?
01:18:21
Priyanka Salot
um Multiple, but I'll give you who's my, you know, um I would say the core prime prospect. I think we, you know, we look at um males typically in the 30 to 40 years of age, working couples, you know, the new millennium, but millennial population, um staying in the top 30, 35 cities, ah you know, evolved, doing lot of research, wants products which are good for them, their family is what I would say is our prime prospect.
01:18:38
akshaydatt
Okay.
01:18:50
akshaydatt
Right. They would also have the ability to spend a little more for like to look at it as a long term investment and not a functional.
01:18:58
Priyanka Salot
Not just that. No, I wouldn't say that because I'll tell you, I'll just give you an example. Today, the sleep company products, amazing mattresses, smart grid tech are available at twenty five k Actually, they're going last you for 10 years, right? That's a typical lifetime that people say. So that's like...
01:19:15
Priyanka Salot
2,500 rupees per year.
Valuing Quality and Entrepreneurial Inspiration
01:19:17
Priyanka Salot
Right?
01:19:17
akshaydatt
Right.
01:19:17
Priyanka Salot
Think of a phone that all of us use. We spend almost more than 50k on a phone, which people change every two to three years.
01:19:20
akshaydatt
but
01:19:23
akshaydatt
Yeah. Right.
01:19:25
Priyanka Salot
So it's first, I don't think it's a high investment. Even if you get a local made product, you know, it's It's not that low anymore.
01:19:36
Priyanka Salot
Two, my point is you're getting a product which is going to be great for your back, which is going to be great for your spine and will make sure that you have a peaceful sleep after a tiring day.
01:19:36
akshaydatt
Hmm.
01:19:46
Priyanka Salot
and Right.
01:19:46
akshaydatt
Hmm.
01:19:47
Priyanka Salot
So I don't think pricing is a problem that we see. I think it's more about what are you delivering to your customers for that price. Right. And how is it worth for the 10 years of my life?
01:19:58
akshaydatt
Right, right, right. Got it. Okay. ah Let me end with the this. You said you read a lot of autobiographies. What are some people that you've been inspired by?
01:20:10
Priyanka Salot
I think a lot of them, but maybe I'll i'll point out too and I'll tell you, um I think those two really forced me to the fence. Those two books really forced me to the fence to, ah you know, get out of a cushiony job, which was very secure.
01:20:24
Priyanka Salot
You know, I always say, um you know, P&G and companies are amazing, but they have a bubble, right? Where you feel very safe, very secure and you're happy. ah But I think the two books that made a change, one was, um you know, Phil Knight's book, The Shoe Dog.
01:20:39
Priyanka Salot
um You know, and I still remember this, ah reading this dialogue, which said that, you know, once he says that I didn't know what I wanted to do, he said, I knew only two things. One is I didn't like to have a boss.
01:20:51
Priyanka Salot
And two, you know, I didn't want to be no one. And I think that's what we really believe in the at the sleep company. You know, what is it that you're going to leave behind that you can be remembered remembered for? And at the sleep company, we want to build a legacy brand that can make millions of people sleep and sit better.
01:21:11
Priyanka Salot
And that's what we want the sleep company to be known for. Right. So I think Phil Knight was the shoe dog was one. Two, I think that really, really motivated me was I think the whole reading about um Amazon and the Jeff Bezos, I think really made my mind, you know, this that digital is the, you know, is is the place.
01:21:35
Priyanka Salot
and right When you're not in the ecosystem of startups, your ecosystem is very different and you don't really realize the power of digital. right And I think that book changed my perspective and made me realize realize the power of digital. And we said, okay, we are going to build something great. And I think that's when I decided.
01:21:54
Priyanka Salot
This category stumbled on me and, you know, I took the plunge. um I always tell entrepreneurs, if you want to start something, anybody, you know, doing a job, anybody, if you want to start something, just take the plunge. Don't think of, you know, the idea is not there. My co-founder is not there. Just take the plunge and things will happen.
01:22:11
akshaydatt
And Amazon is also, of course, like the role model for customer obsession.
01:22:17
Priyanka Salot
Absolutely.
01:22:17
akshaydatt
That's the other thing
Conclusion and Reflections
01:22:18
akshaydatt
that they're known for.
01:22:19
Priyanka Salot
That's the only way to win.
01:22:20
akshaydatt
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Thank you so much for your time, Priyanka. It was a real pleasure.
01:22:25
Priyanka Salot
Thank you Akshay. Absolutely loved my conversation. Thank you so much.