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Sticky Jazz interview Marco Pirroni
28 Plays4 months ago
There are "Legends" in rock & roll, great guitarists leaving massive legacies, then you have Marco Pirroni, beginning his career by getting booted from Siouxsie & The Banshees TWICE, and then getting roped into playing guitar for Adam Ant, then going on to play with Sinead O'connor for most of her career, you see a guy like Marco having done it all.
His guitar work is monumental, as I have probably got everything he ever recorded onto vinyl, and then CD, then MP3, his guitar collection is just as legendary. We talked about his guitars, the stories you never heard on the back end, and so much more. He told me he honestly got into playing, and had no future plans, just wanting to play, and well, he did really good for himself.
Personal conversations about Adam Ant, Sinead O'Connor, and even Sid Vicious, there was just a lot to cover and he made it worth while.
#adamant #adamandtheants #davidbarbarossa #glenmatlock #thesexpistols #sidvicious #siouxsiesioux #sineadoconnor #malcolmmclaren #bobgruen #johnlydon #punk #garyoldman #jennvix #jahwobble #shakespearssister #johngrant
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Transcript
Introduction & Dedication to Sinead O'Connor
00:00:00
Speaker
The opinions expressed on the show are truly those of Jeremy Hinks and Sticky Jazz podcast and do not necessarily reflect those of anyone else on this planet. Good day, everybody. I dedicate this episode to the memory of Sinead O'Connor. She shows up a lot in the conversation. I'm Jeremy Hinks and welcome to Sticky Jazz. This week I have Marco Puroni, the guitarist for Sinead O'Connor, Adam Ant he was in.
00:00:29
Speaker
He got kicked out of Susie in the Banshees twice, and he has more amazing stories that I just had to let him go and take the take the lead. You're gonna love this episode. Marco's got some great, great experiences to share and some great insights. So let's all sit back to the Sticky Jazz. I'm kicking this one off
Marco Puroni's Musical Journey
00:00:51
Speaker
with the my favorite Adam Ants song, Viva La Rock, and you got Marco cranking it out on that one.
00:02:52
Speaker
Look out! Rocky's goin' star wars!
00:04:25
Speaker
i
The Punk Scene & Iconic Collaborations
00:04:27
Speaker
are
00:04:38
Speaker
All right, everybody. Welcome to Sticky Jazz. I'm Jeremy Hanks. And this week I have the rock new wave guitar legend Marco Prione. Pieroni who I have been a if a fan of since I was about probably 10 years old. I've got a pile of vinyl that uh yet to be signed but I have lots of other autographs from band members that have the same records and so Marco has played with uh
00:05:15
Speaker
most notably Adam Ant, Sinead O'Connor, but the recently the Wolfman, there's quite a, there's you've got a lot in there, but. Shakes for sister, Susan the Banshees. Yeah, the the very first Susan the Banshees gig too, which that was, I guess you've been a stand-in member, friends with them for a long time.
00:05:41
Speaker
I wasn't friends with them when I did the gig. I've become friends with them since. well How did that story go down? because one movie We were all standing members. ah Okay. So, Malcolm McLaren decides to put on a hundred club punk festival. And after announcing it and booking the venue and everything, and and he wrote he realizes that there aren't enough punk bands in London.
00:06:11
Speaker
And there were only three. He got the pistols, the clash, Subway set, and hed then he ran out of bands. And then the second night was like kind of like a bit second string, as it was the band and the White Raiders, and car I didn't go the second night. So he decides that, um we just tell Susan and Steve that you are now a band and you're playing, and what you're told. And before they had a, ah you know, any way of getting out of it. I think Suji saw, cried at the Banshee with Vincent Price on TV and thought, oh, that's a good name, the Banshees. Also, ah the Banshee is also the name of Brian Ferry's first band at university, but I don't know if she knew that at the time.
00:07:01
Speaker
and And so it's just Malcolm McLaren throwing everybody in there and it it happened, huh? That just... Well, he didn't throw anybody in there. He was just pursuing Steve in there and and said, right, you're playing. And they said, there was only two of us. well I don't care, just find some other people. And um so they roped in Sid, who was up for anything, really. Right, yeah. He played drums that night, right? Yeah. And they roped in Billy Idol.
00:07:32
Speaker
he wasn't really up for anything because of all of us he was the only one who had some um He had written all these songs. He actually had an eye on the future. We didn't know what we were going to do in 10 minutes' time, but Billy was was was ambitious and had some plan for his life. We didn't we had no plans for our lives. We couldn't... It was 17, we didn't know what we were doing. We didn't know what we'd just done or what we were about to do. So... um
00:08:04
Speaker
He met me, we actually went to party at his house and he said, I actually knew him because because I played in a band with him about two weeks before they'd thrown me out.
00:08:16
Speaker
um So he said, oh, thank God, thank God you're here. And it's like, I don't want to do this bouncy thing. It's, you know, it's got to harm my career. I said, oh, you haven't got a career, have you? I mean, just like... But he he had he hadn't met with Tony in them yet, I guess, right? For Generation X or...? I hadn't met with Tony. that tony was Tony and John Doe was in the band that I was in. ah They weren't... ah ah kind We didn't even have a name. And then they went on to be Generation X.
00:08:47
Speaker
Um, uh, then, so, yeah, thank God you, thank God you're here. You can get me out of this. I'll do it. So I did it. I see that's, that is like, I love hearing these stories. Um, I, I'm a huge generation X fan. My Tony James story is is rather embarrassing because, um, like,
00:09:16
Speaker
But you know, Tony, so you kind of picture him. Yeah. So it was Sisters of Mercy tour. Oh, yeah. I remember him doing it. Yeah. to and And we were there and I'm talking to him. I met the Sisters of Mercy and I'm talking to him and I had a Generation X pin on my jacket. And it's like, oh, yeah, I love Generation X. I'm like, oh, yeah, man, huge Billy, Billy Idol fan. I love Generation X, love everything you did when we're watching we're talking. And Then I said, you know, ah yeah, when the Mission UK came through last year ah with the Wonder stuff. And I said, and then, this is, I was just a dumb kid at the time, right? So just give it to me for, I said, so we have it. And then Miles Hunt said, yeah, this one's for Mr. Hussey. And then they played all I want is some truth by Generation X. And Tony's like laughing at that. And I didn't know,
00:10:12
Speaker
really at the time until we said goodbye and they laughed and a guy said to me, he said, Hey, who was, I was like, Oh, that was Tony from the sisters of mercy. He goes, Oh, Tony James. I was like, wait, from generation X, that was the same guy. And I feel like such a Nimrod not recognizing it was Tony James there. Right. But, but so, but you get Tony, you know, he's just a very unassuming, I want to do my thing and kind of laugh at it all kind of guy. So I wouldn't call Tony unassuming, but I mean, sometimes maybe he can be, yeah.
00:10:44
Speaker
There in the sisters, he was just really great guy, really funny, and just, you know, hey, I'm here playing my bass, having a good time, you know? Yeah. so But so you you did that gig. Yeah. With Susie, and it's... I mean, it was it was that the... I mean, I'm sure you've done stuff with him since, but like was that the the first... Oh, no. You've done nothing with the Banshee since. ah so I tried to... what When John and Kenny...
00:11:14
Speaker
left the band I was brought in sort of audition um for a very fast audition to try and put it I thought they decided that they didn't want me in the band so I was trying out of the band again ah which was just which was absolutely which was actually a complete stroke of luck it's one of those things that went completely wrong but went completely right as well because you know a few days later Adam contracted me And then I, if had I done the banshees, maybe I wouldn't have done the ads. Oh, right. Yeah. Because you guys went, they were both two different paths, two different directions of sound and yeah and all that. Yeah. So Adam had just finished up Bazooka Joe, right? At that point and said. No, no, no, no, no. You haven't been in Bazooka Joe for years.
00:12:05
Speaker
Bazooka Joe was this kind of comedy rock and roll band that he had with his friend Danny well when they were at art school. so and oh Bazooka Joe supported the Sex Pistols. No, the Sex Pistols supported Bazooka Joe on the Pistols.
00:12:26
Speaker
but was the Pistols first gig ever at St Martin's School of Art. Yeah. And then, and then Bazooka Joe fell apart and he formed the ants. So the ants were going, I mean, you'll have to look all this up, I can't remember all that, you know, I wasn't involved really. um So the ants were going for a couple of years before, and then of course Malcolm again, you bring Malcolm into the picture and ah He completely fucks up in completely the right way. And they start rehearsing for a week. And then the at the end of the week, he throws Adam Ant out of Adam the Ants. So then he calls me up and says, look, I'm i'm not in the ants anymore. I said to me, you're not in the ants. You're Adam Ant. You can't not scream in the ants anymore.
00:13:25
Speaker
Anyway, I said, well, they threw me out. I was like, okay. And I want to do something else. I don't even know if I want to call it the ounce anymore. And I said, okay, let's meet and talk about it. And this was like two days later after being thrown out of the band shoes a second time. I mean, it's a sort of, I feel like Great Pride had been thrown out of the same band twice.
00:13:56
Speaker
Okay, especially someone as monumental as the Banshees, but yeah, because you went off to do some great, I mean, everything you did after that was outstanding. Yeah, I would, I think, you know, yeah, the Banshees were monumental, but at the minutes were more monumental. So I
Viva La Rock Album Insights
00:14:20
Speaker
made the right decision. Well, I didn't make decisions at all. It was made for me.
00:14:25
Speaker
Yeah, it is well, it sounds like it led in your lap and Adam just said, hey, let's go and yeah and make this happen. um Yeah. All of this reminds me of a line in the song, Wake Up You're Only Dreaming by Captain Sensible, where he refers to Malcolm McLaren's anarchy. that It sounds like there was so much chaos going on around that. just that that line is you know Everything I read about what McLaren was doing and all the different... yeah He had his thumb in everybody's pies. and
00:14:57
Speaker
yeah you know, playing the the scenes and whatnot. um But shoot, you guys became very successful, incredibly successful after that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It it took us what? It took us another year. But then, you know, saying then it was pop stardom, rock stardom. Oh, yeah, you guys were on the cover of Smash Hits everywhere and the NME and gigs galore, man. Yeah.
00:15:26
Speaker
It was a teen heartthrob there, man. like um Adam had been accused of being the reincarnation of Elvis in a lot of ways. you know He had so much- I don't think he thinks that. Well, no, but everybody else did.
00:15:46
Speaker
Everybody else did, they're like, he's the new Elvis and you know he's got he's got the hair, he's got the moves, he's got the swagger, he's got the charm, he's got that all up on stage. you know And it was it was just, I saw so much of Elvis in how Adam was performing. And i but when he was on stage and and his mannerisms that, yeah, I thought, wow, he's the dancing, the moves. He's not a massive Elvis fan.
00:16:16
Speaker
I mean, we all we all ah know that we want to be having this conversation with our hosts, personally. and ah And we all know what Elvis did and who he was and all the rest of it, but it wasn't a huge part of Adam's life. okay but He probably owned an Elvis Presley's greatest hits, because everybody does, but um it wasn't he wasn't a great, I don't think he was, I've never any discussion about Elvis Presley with Adam. Wow. ah That's interesting because yeah, the first,
00:16:52
Speaker
ah the The first, I remember watching you guys do Viva La Rock on Solid Gold. Yeah. It was just miming at the time, but it was still so cool to see, you know, when I was like, wow, here's Adam and doing the new Viva La Rock. And Stevie Wonder introduced you guys doing that. I remember it was like, it was, that was a ah moment there, but I was like, he, I just saw so much of this, the rockabilly,
00:17:22
Speaker
from that 50s just vibe just brought right up to the front in such a great way. Oh, thanks. Yeah. I mean, that was part part of the inspiration for for that album. was Oh, there's so much fun in that record. Actually, I started to cut you off there. Viva La Rocky is still my favorite record that you've ever played on. Oh, thank you. Thank you.
00:17:46
Speaker
I mean, there were themes, every theme in there, references to the movie Grease, Dr. Strangelove, you know, and so i mean it was just, and and you were taking on the Cold War, making fun of all the the geopolitical stuff. I mean, it was just, that album was a masterpiece. It was just a great social commentary as well. Yeah, we managed to get Blade Runner in there as well.
00:18:12
Speaker
Yeah, you did, yes, yes. and But the Dr. Strangelove part of when he was naming off everything, you get it you could have a whole lot to do with that. you know but just oh such a It was just a fun record to do. And it it it was one of those coming of age albums of my entire life that I still look back on and just have so many great memories to that album. Oh, good.
00:18:40
Speaker
Good. Yeah. We're big Kubrick fans. That's why all that stuff's in there. Oh, sure. i Well, yeah, that actually I hadn't seen Dr. Strangelove. I had memorized the monologues from the record. and then It was like probably two years, three years later when I saw Dr. Strangelove, I was like, oh, that was where they got this from. wow you know You can't fight here. This is the world.
00:19:04
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, gentlemen. Yeah. You can't fight here. This is the war. Just the, I mean, i what one thing that I thought was great was that you guys were able to just pull so many historical artifact concepts into what you were playing about, what you're performing about, you know, and, and you did make these things very timeless. Like I can still play, uh,
00:19:27
Speaker
Some of evil a rock today and it would sound like okay. This is 1985 or it's 1955, you know some of it it it just you You really did that well and and it could be played timeless today I get sticky in front of the Reverend Horton he did a rockabilly show and be like, yes This is this feels so right, you know, that's one of those great records that fits in a lot of places.
00:19:51
Speaker
Apparently, it
Influences & Postmodernism in Music
00:19:52
Speaker
was postmodernism. In fact, I had i had a stepdaughter until a couple of years ago and she went to school and she was studying postmodernism and came and said, my teacher says, you know about all about postmodernism but post moneyism because that's what you do. I start no idea what postmodernism is. and And there it is in the record. Yeah.
00:20:16
Speaker
The big difference is, well, there was a big hiatus between that and then say manners and physique. um I guess it, well, there was the big gap. Like Live Aid was the last time that you guys had all performed live for a while. yeah And then that was, um you know, i then you picked up with Sinead for a bit. Actually, I wanted to say the first time I met you,
00:20:40
Speaker
ah was when, yeah and and you smiled at the time. So I know that you, cause you said the other day, I don't smile as well. No, you did, you did smile. It was, Let's see, Adam came through salt Lake doing a record signing tour. Cause you were on tour with Sinead. And so he just came to a local club, signed a bunch of records. We all met him, got pictures. That's where I got all his autographs on everything. but And then I went and saw you guys, you were supposed to have played up in the mountain, but it was snowing. So they relocated you to the salt palace downtown in salt Lake. ah And.
00:21:16
Speaker
After the show, i hadn't I had front row seats. We had a great time. I hadn't planned on meeting anybody, but just conveniently I did. I met Susan. I met Sinead. She was you know very brief. And I remember just shaking your hand and going, that was a fantastic set. You guys really did a great job. And you smiled and said, thanks. I'm like, okay. So wait when you're like, I don't smile. I'm like, yes, you did. You smiled. You said, thanks. I do smile. Everyone says like that.
00:21:46
Speaker
Yeah, you you smiled that night. I was like, I remember him smiling that night. I'm one of those people, parties and people, girls come out and go cheer up. I'm chewy. Well, I mean, i you know, there's nothing wrong with me.
00:22:05
Speaker
So, but no, just when you said that, I thought, well, okay, that was funny. Cause I do remember very clearly that you, or you smiled that night. Um, were you at that St. Martin's gig where Adam and that lock had their, uh, that, that little bantering session between the two of them at that, that show was what got, you know,
00:22:26
Speaker
I mean, Adam and Glenn Matlock, you can't play and had you know, to become Adam to say what he did there. was I've heard a lot about that. What he There was a fight. There was a fight.
00:22:41
Speaker
yeah otherwise i' not I don't know what the fight was about, but the mean there usually was a fight. Oh, the Sex Pistols gig, of course there was going to be, but um that was when Adam said, you know, he was with Bazooka Joe and he he said something to Glenn Matlock to the effect of, this is crap, you guys can't play. And Glenn said, yeah, that's the that's the ideology of punk.
00:23:09
Speaker
you know and my I don't think Glenn would have said that as the ideology of punk. no be he He said, that's the idea of this, that you don't have to be able to play to play this. you know And then Adam said, that inspired me to go and do something else. Because I guess Bazooka Joe wasn't ah bazuu judge just wasn't really happening for him at the time. I think Glenn actually said, I think the story is that somebody said to Glenn, you can't play and he said so well.
00:23:39
Speaker
He said, so what, you don't have to or something like that. Yeah. Yeah. So what, you don't have to for this. And that was where Adam was like, I'm going to go and do this now. And yeah, you know, and but I got a lot of people who saw the pistols who had perfectly fine going, going along, living their lives. And then they're seeing the pistols and the next day everything was different.
00:24:06
Speaker
I mean Peter Hook saw them in Manchester yeah and with no... I'd never wanted to be in a band, I'd never wanted to play anything. Saw the pistols, next morning went out and bought a base and if you asked him why, he said I don't know.
00:24:22
Speaker
Yeah. No, he they talked about that where the guys in Joy Division were there just as friends. They weren't, they weren't, they were just, just mates. And they went and saw the sex pistols. I think they had Pete Shelley there as well. Um, yeah. Pete Shelley, Pete, Pete, Pete, Pete. And, uh, what's his name? Um, the other guy from the bus cops put it up. They, they put the the show on, the bus cops put the show on.
00:24:46
Speaker
Yeah, like they went they went down they went down to London, they went to the shop and they I think they saw the pistols and then they approached Malcolm and said, you've got to come and play in Manchester and we'll put it on, we'll sort it out, which they did.
00:25:02
Speaker
and then the rest is history because, yeah, i I'm being New Order of Joy Division, but actually I'm the biggest Peter Hook fan you're ever gonna meet, so I've got it. And you know him, obviously. I've never met him. Oh, wow. No, I know the bus stops, but I've never met any New Order. Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah. i live They live a long way away.
00:25:28
Speaker
Yes. Well, I think Peter Cook lives in Spain now, last I heard, but yeah, I'm like, ah getting for me, the first concert I ever went and saw live was New Order and Echo and the Bunnyman.
00:25:42
Speaker
right And I had heard the music and I was, and I loved the music, but it was what I actually saw. If you've seen video, right? Peter Hook up there, I was like, wait, that's how those sounds are made. Those aren't made on a keyboard. That's this guy on a guitar going down. on no yeah yeah And that was where I became, I was like, okay, I want to learn to play bass guitar and I want to learn to make music like that guy. You know,
00:26:09
Speaker
ah because it was so different than anything I'd ever, it was like, in catching that magical moment, that was my Sex Pistols concert moment, as what New Order and those guys did, when when they got Joy Division, when they saw that Sex Pistols gig. For me, it was seeing New Order like that and going, wow, you know, I have to buy a bass and learn how to play it like that. Yeah, yeah, it's funny how these things sort of like, it sort of spreads out, isn't it? Like, you know, from the Sex Pistols, you then buy a bass too.
00:26:38
Speaker
Oh yeah. And how many of us have, how many people have said, I bought that Velvet Underground record and decided I was going to start a band. You know, yeah like the,
Chaotic Punk Management
00:26:49
Speaker
the, the Velvets and Joy Division were the ones who inspired, sorry, the Velvets, the Sex Pistols, Joy Division. They're the ones who inspired so many of the bands that are alive today to to go out and and take their shot at it.
00:27:01
Speaker
Yeah, I think it's because, and yeah, and for me, it was the Link Ray. And when when I bought, I just bought this best of Link Ray. I've never heard of him. I just liked, just liked the cover. It was just a picture of him on the cover with a black and white leather jacket. And you put it on, you think, this is great. And then you realize, wait a minute, I can do this. I can do this. And he just picks up my guitar and I could play it.
00:27:27
Speaker
It's like no working out, no so no sitting in my bedroom alone, instant. instantly I could instantly play it. Well, that's you're also one of those musically talented geniuses though. I mean, i I don't think just anybody could have picked up a guitar and done it like you did. No, I can't i can't play anything. at top You can't play anything. No.
00:27:54
Speaker
so so I can't play the solo to beat it. ah By Michael Jackson? Yeah. I probably couldn't either. um i but Eddie Van Halen did it in like two, three takes.
00:28:12
Speaker
i Okay, I'm like going, is there, a okay, forgive me for a not remembering Michael Jackson well enough to know was there a guitar solo in that song beat it? Yeah, that was the great but was the great kind of like dance pop rock crossover, wasn't it? and when when Yeah, but well, okay, i was I was in fourth grade probably. I was nine, 10 years old when Michael Jackson made it.
00:28:40
Speaker
And then by the end of that summer, he wasn't cool anymore and I stopped listening to him. And so I've listened to Michael Jackson probably six times since the fall of 1984.
00:28:53
Speaker
right so i do I'm not not not a huge fan, I mean you know i thought you was a right yeah he I had moved into like listening to a lot of metal and punk and everything else and i I left a lot of the really fluffy pop stuff.
00:29:12
Speaker
You know, I, yeah, about 85, 86 was when I stopped listening to the most soul that was out there. Cause it was just like Whitney Houston and, and all that just really wasn't, I just didn't get much out of it after that. So yeah. yeah yeah um So let's see. ah So did you know Keenan Duffy, by the way?
00:29:36
Speaker
in and after yeah keen and justy ah ah the t-shirt guy The fashion guy. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. yeah yeah He was it. So i've I've had him on my show, interviewed him a couple of times. He's great. He was at that St. Martin's show and he was he's told me a lot of great back end stories. I bet you guys, you know,
00:29:57
Speaker
Together, if I was to collect your stories, you'd probably have. I went to a party. I was invited to a party, and it was like a 10-year anniversary of the 20-year anniversary of the 50-year anniversary of that gig.
00:30:10
Speaker
and It was really, and we went to St. Martin, I went to St. Martin's for this party, because I didn't hit that road, so I could just walk down and and the people the BBC was there and all these people, it was like, you know, I was interviewed by the BBC and they said, how was the gig? And I said, I don't know, I didn't go.
00:30:29
Speaker
ah yes But you knew them all, but you knew everybody that was there. um I don't know how many people's there, my students are 10 people. Right, but you knew the guys in both of the bands, you know? I didn't know. I didn't know. I knew the Pistols. Glen works in the shop, so I knew him. And I think somebody said, you know, Glen's got this band and they're playing. And I thought, oh, no, well, that bloke in the shop. I'm not going to, no, I'm not going. I can't be bothered to go and see that.
00:31:03
Speaker
Well, so because Glenn actually played on, he he played well he did he's played it with Blondie and he was also in Keenan's band. Keenan's got his band Slinky Vagabond and Glenn was in there too. and right yeah and and what what's most Most American kids these days, all they know about the Sex Pistols is Sid and maybe Johnny Rotten, but they don't realize Sid was only in there for the last six months, right? you know i thought no how long was it har long was in it Sid was only in for six months. um Glenn i was in up until then. and
00:31:40
Speaker
so I always go yeah Glenn the bassist for the Sex Pistols and they go I thought that was Sid you know or they're even when the kids go I thought Sid was the singer you know it's that that's the American kids just remember the icons like that but you've got you kind of got the hook now Sid because he's just ah in the band in the band for six months and destroys everything yes he did yeah um Actually, the the book, I don't know if you know who Bob Gruen is. The i'm not book girl yeah yeah photographer, his he told stories about Sid in his book and so did Johnny. you know johnny john da've And they they give a very, very different view of what the world saw of this kid.
00:32:31
Speaker
You know, and it's, it's, it's a sad story, but Sid wasn't this complete med maniac that everybody. wasn't No, I did. The heroin did that to him, but yeah he was otherwise he just did an incredibly shy kid. He was, he was, he was one of the funniest people I've ever met. He was, I mean, the word to describe Sid was sort of goofy. Yeah. That's really what, what he what he was. I mean, he was incredibly funny.
00:32:59
Speaker
Yeah, he was funny, but they said he was really shy. He was just, you know, he wasn't the image, you know? And I think that the movie Sid and Nancy, whatever, there was a lot that just gave a bad image of the guy that that just, most people just still don't understand very much about him. So I mean, there was one, ah I thought Sid and Nancy was okay. I mean, i mean um who's the actor? The famous actor. Gary Oldman.
00:33:28
Speaker
Gary I wasn't much like said but I mean you can't. I think it's impossible otherwise he'd be doing an impersonation of someone you've never met. I mean that's not's not possible. um It was one, one bit which was set to learn bass. He thought a good idea to learn to really learn bass because he was up against it. You know, he didn't have much time, couldn't really play bass. He didn't play anything, ah but um was to take loads of speed and just sit in the chair and just but and and just play blitzkrieg bop. And there's a scene of him doing that. And I thought, oh, my God, that's exactly what it was like. You're plonking away on this. You know, it's like hours on end.
00:34:07
Speaker
playing the same fucking thing, the same playing blitzkrieg bop. Yeah. that Like the the legends, the the stories, like everybody who was there, they said, no, they that movie got it all wrong. So much of what the world sees about that where they got all wrong. So um you were there for, you were there for enough of it. Yeah. I mean, I wasn't, I wasn't there in New York, thank God. But I think it's pretty,
00:34:30
Speaker
I mean, I don't like the first bit of the film, but when they get to New York and it's all the drugs and all that, and I think, I mean, you know, that that's really, really good, that thing. I think that's basically what happened.
00:34:44
Speaker
I mean, that was, I mean, just once Nancy was like kind of, um they wanted to buy some heroin off this dealer and she said, well, you know, we're failures, can't you give us a discount? I'm a heroin dealer, I don't need to give discounts.
00:35:01
Speaker
Well, in Bob Gruen's book, he was telling a story about how Him and Sid got ahold of, uh, some starter pistols that that you use at track races, you know? Yeah. And he said they were in some venue running around shooting these blanks at each other. They weren't real guns, but they looked like, you know, he said, it's so, or in there shooting around at each other, and he said, and I'm crawling along. And then all of it went into the, of the venue and I'm at the other, I'm crawling under the seats and I get to a set of boots and I look up and it's an Oklahoma state. trip
00:35:39
Speaker
You know, and like, that's a story like that's funny. That was his brilliant, you know, just the way he told the story about Sid like that it was it was a fabulous book but gave a very different view of of what had been going on there and i love talking to guys like you say yeah i was there at that time the vibe was coming well i wasn't on that American tour but what i said was completely and it was completely so Malcolm so Malcolm it's like and he really didn't understand it got fed up a bit he got fed out with being He got fed up being successful,
00:36:17
Speaker
which is a strange thing to manage to get fed up with. And for the American tour, I mean he didn't understand America at all. He'd only ever been to New York. And, you know, and they sort of, they, the agency gave him these tour dates in the American tour. And he says, you know, it's New York LA and he's going to love them there. And Malcolm thought, no, let's put them on a plate in places where people will hate them. I said them all down through the South. ah Yeah. People will really hate them there. It will be a complete disaster. But that's what Malcolm loved. He loved it when things got went wrong.
00:36:57
Speaker
He loved it. I mean, it's like my friend Nils, who's dead now, but he was a road manager and they went to Paris to play famous gig at the Geevers Club and ah made the mistake of giving Malcolm and the tickets, the plane tickets. And they missed three flights because Malcolm deliberately either hid or he threw the tickets away.
00:37:22
Speaker
or it just caused some consternation so they couldn't get on the plane. But he deliberately stopped them getting on the plane. Because he just loved it when things went wrong. He hated it when things went right. Well, because you have less of a scandal if a band shows up on time and plays a great set. Oh, he hated that. And everybody's happy, yeah. That doesn't sell. That's not sensationalism. No, that's boring. Yeah.
00:37:50
Speaker
Yeah. ah So that's a funny way to put it. now that youre really that that's um I'll have to just like take you offline and have you tell me a bunch of stories, man. they These all sound great. um And the thing about, oh, God, you when they first started you know and they played some gigs, and I went into a shop one day and he said, oh, hello. um Can you write a letter to the enemy? If I give you pen and paper, can you just write a letter to the enemy telling telling him, um I want you to say how shit the pistols are. it's just So he had all these people writing in saying, I hate the sex pistols. And you know um don't give them in any coverage and they're the worst band in the world. We hate them. And everybody yeah you know this is the worst thing ever to happen to music.
00:38:48
Speaker
And yeah did it stir the fervor? Did it make it more popular? Yeah, yeah, it all went wrong. And then, you know, and then desperately, desperately trying to get A&R mentioned big labels and trying to get trying to get journalists down from there. After Asia, they got Nick Kent down to the Hunger Club, persuading him to come down, please Nick, please come see the band, please come. And then got said to beat him up.
00:39:22
Speaker
And then they would put these this A&R man on the list, and then he would take them off the list so they couldn't get in. Oh, geez. yes
Guitars, Influences & Industry Experiences
00:39:34
Speaker
i've I've heard like, it was Kim Fowler who managed the runaways. Kim Fowler, I remember that guy. He sounds like he's only maybe he's getting his lessons from Malcolm. um so So... I thought he probably just fucked it up. He probably didn't ah deliver it. it's this These are some great stories.
00:39:57
Speaker
um okay let's see when uh when i i told you i said look i've geeked out with doug panic over from king's ex about bass guitars i also have with chuck from sticks right i'm the bass guy loves and uh i i said to you look i don't know if you want to geek out of about guitars Because okay if the listeners want to and you said, hey, fuck them and yeah quote me on that so yeah let's let's talk about your guitars for a moment. OK. First of all, how many do you have? I don't know. ah It's it's it used to be in that yeah I think I got up to 100. I think there's like 75 now, but we don't be too impressed because they're not all.
00:40:47
Speaker
you know, really like prime vintage pieces, some are kind of like broken down electrodes or Hothners or Vox Comtolentals, not Vox Northern, but, you know, Vox Phantoms and, you know, like kind of like trashy guitars. Because our our mutual friend, Jen Vick, she's like, oh, I believe she says, believe me, Jeremy, Marco's got a warehouse full of them.
00:41:13
Speaker
I don't have a warehouse. I don't have a warehouse. But it's not my warehouse. It's a warehouse that's got a section that I rent. It's not mine. It's not mine. OK. All right. Oh, he's got a warehouse full of guitars. So I really, really don't like. I haven't got. I mean, I've got a pretty big house here. But I don't have room for all the guitar. I mean, I could do. I could fill a room with them. But you know,
00:41:44
Speaker
ah My girlfriend insists that we actually have to live in this house instead of being surrounded by ants and guitars. Yes, I'm that with vinyl records.
00:41:56
Speaker
and and football jerseys, football shirts. I have behind that Swedish flag. By the Swedish flag, I have 233 football jerseys and several thousand vinyl records. And I always could have more, but my wife's like, you don't have room for them. So it's it's one of those, you know, I hear you on that. um As of late, you posted a bit about a a specific love interest with that Dwayne Eddie, right?
00:42:26
Speaker
ah that beloved I'm in love with Dwayne Eddy. Oh, I don't know what that is. You've posted several pictures of it, of that Dwayne Eddy guitar. yeah like Oh, that one looks really sexy. It looks fucking awful, that guitar. I've never seen it.
00:42:45
Speaker
Oh, because yeah you seem to have this, you have a bit to say about it, yeah like you posted a bit and have pictures of him playing it. I'm like, i that one, it's got so many knobs and whatnot in there. Yeah, my friend, my friend Richard Hawley is a huge Dwayne Eddy fan as well as I am. I mean, Richard actually, Richard and his band backed Dwayne Eddy. I went to see them at the 100 Club. They they played, but and Dwayne played, and richard Richard and his band back them up, so that's how big a fan but he is. um Anyway, he knows all about that guitar, but I can't remember what he said. ah ah He had it made and it didn't work. It's not going to work, is it? All that.
00:43:28
Speaker
Oh yeah, cause you had like, I was like, that looks like, i okay. When I found out how Bo Diddley had his guitars made, he had all the pedals and effects processes built inside the guitar and you never saw them. And he was always having to make sure that they would work and tweak. it Yeah, and getting electric shocks. Yeah. That Dwayne Eddie looked like the the one that had all of it mounted up on the outside. yeah i saw I was like, man, that looks like,
00:43:56
Speaker
If it worked, you could probably have a lot of fun playing it, you know. But it didn't work. It didn't work. It didn't play for very long. Okay. So that that's just a historical artifact. It's in all those pictures. It's not the real. Okay. It's like, man, if that worked, that would be such a bitchin' guitar, man. That would be...
00:44:16
Speaker
Tim Polkatt, Tim Polkatt, reckons there's a guy called Deke Dickerson and I've had a look at Deke Dickerson's page and he's got the best stuff. He really has got you really, really, really pucker gear. Fifties gear. Yeah. Well, I mean, just, but that was when when it was kicking off, you know, when the the when when rock and roll was really trying to push its limits and with all that I mean that was when everybody thought oh this is this is the this is it'll never get crazier than this and now look where we are you know yeah i know yeah i mean it's never gonna last rock and roll has got to go yeah i well i i went and saw a show the other day um a day to remember one of those emo metal bands right
00:45:11
Speaker
And they were up there, you know, they and then they'd have like fire and steam blasting out of these, you know, on the stage and confetti guns with each different note, something different was happening on the stage. Well, that's that's quite a lot to to to write in and all the technical stuff to do that, you know, they can actually play too, which was great because a lot of those fans out there don't. But, you know, <unk> we're getting to the like, OK,
00:45:38
Speaker
How far can we push things to go weirdly? you know Well, I mean, I saw Rammstein a couple of years ago and it it was an amazing show, but I kept thinking, well, get me out there. I wasn't not going near all that fire.
00:45:50
Speaker
I'm sure they've nearly killed themselves loads of times with that show. You know there's a Spinal Tap moment in there where somebody gets their hair set on fire. They get more than their hair set on fire. The entire body is set on fire. Most of the band catches light.
00:46:11
Speaker
Yeah, it's it's one of those like, yeah, I don't want to be the safety inspector managing that tour, you know, you know. Well, if the singer, ah whose name I cannot remember, has got, he's got, you have to have a license to do pyrotechnics, and he's studied pyrotechnics, and um he's got a license to do all that stuff, which I mean, that doesn't stop him him getting burned all the time. Sue gets burned all the time.
00:46:38
Speaker
Yeah, it's like the special effects guy on the movie set who's always blowing things up, right? You know that you know that guy's lucky to still have any fingers left. Yeah, but those things go wrong all the time. Yeah.
00:46:52
Speaker
um So let's see, you were in that revival phase, i do the revival, I don't know, what the re the re department X.
00:47:05
Speaker
Department X? Yeah. Your name was on Department X when they decided to get back together. Department S? Was it the Department S? Sorry, Department S.
00:47:18
Speaker
And there was the all-star cast. You had John Keeble, the Spando Ballet guys. You had Glenn Matlock back in there. I mean, I realized the family tree of all where you guys were and came from is is a pretty small family there. And everybody's playing in each other's bands. ah
00:47:40
Speaker
But that one, like yeah, what what what got you back into that one with with those guys? just because I knew the guitar player and they just asked, they said we're doing whatever it was, the great hit singer is Vic there, we're doing a version of Vic there, do you want to come play with it? And I thought, well, no, not really, ah but you persuade me to do it. And so I went down to the studio and none of them were there.
00:48:08
Speaker
I said, I don't know what you want me to do. It's like, there's no direction coming from anybody except in the industry. I don't know. Just do what you what you want. So you weren't actually part of the project. You just, you were there, showed up one day and recorded. Okay. No, I didn't know there was a project. Oh, cause yeah, they, they put your name on it was like, yeah, we had Marco doing this. Well, well I wanted my name on it. somebody But I wasn't part of the project.
00:48:35
Speaker
Okay, so you just recorded where nobody else was there. Did you have a backing track to play on top of? her Oh, yes, I can't. I can't just guess what I have to hear. it I'm not that good. So because I look at like yeah the products, the the projects that you get involved in are like they have an all star cast in them.
00:49:00
Speaker
You know, um, even when you did thats go why choose that's that's not why choose them, it just, it just, it just turns out that way. Right. You know, the best people and you end up working with them. I, that's how I see it. I'm like, cause if like, okay, the, I do not want record. Yeah. Joe wobble. You Carl Wallinger.
00:49:23
Speaker
You know, that, I mean, like I said, that album was a masterpiece. ah That album was Andy Rourke from, from the Smiths. I mean, everybody that you had on there were the top notch people there. I mean, that was the best of the best up there. And that's what made that record so good.
00:49:41
Speaker
I'm like, yeah, this is kind of where I see Marco is in these projects with all these great names. I'm like, man, these guys are all professionals. They get the studio. They they they know how they're going to. They know what they're going to do. They're going to make a great record here. Yeah, you know, we do know what to do. Yeah, we'll be doing it long enough. like Except when you show up for Project S and there's nobody there you playing on top of a track. OK. But completely forgotten about that. Well, that that's what happened one Sunday afternoon.
00:50:12
Speaker
Oh, cause they, yeah, they touted your name on this. Like, yeah. miss laco I know. So, um ah and this is one that I've, I noticed this. I found this a long time ago and I want to know if you figure, if anybody else has noticed this. ah Do you remember the brass versions of, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. By the pokes. ah and They, they, they nicked it straight out of desperate, but not serious.
00:50:40
Speaker
but they now never heard it. Yeah. I remember listening to, I'm a big pokes fan. I mean, I've met Shane McGowan and all that, you know, all these, it was just great. And then out of nowhere, I'm like listening to, to the, the new brass version of it that they had done on their greatest hits. And I'm like, they nicked that from desperate, but not serious. I mean, the whole, day like we every piece of that, you know, well, we nicked desperate was not, not serious, but but from a prairie roads by Roxy music.
00:51:08
Speaker
ah but it' so yeah So everybody nicked it from everybody else. oh yeah where everything you know Nothing's new, is it? Nothing's new. Everything's just a variation of something else. But you nicked from Roxy music, okay. So that's an interesting one. I'll have to go back and and do the comparison to that. It's not much like it, but that's how it started.
00:51:33
Speaker
So, I mean, one of the worst rip-offs I've ever heard was, if you remember that one headlight by the Wallflowers, they they nicked that from, it Do You Think I'm Sexy by Rod Stewart, you know? and was It was exactly that they just changed the words and it was the same song, you know? Well, I mean, that creep is like, you know, ah the air that I breathe by the hollies. By a creep radiohead.
00:52:03
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, I'm gonna have to go. look Okay, let's see. I'm gonna have to go do that one. Check that one out. So yeah, there was actually a court case about about that. So radiohead, obviously paid them off. Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah, radiohead live. I Yeah, I've done I've shot Tom York live. like That he's a bizarre cat. Tom York is one bizarre cat, man. I tell you, if you've ever yeah im little made you've ever seen him perform, he's like he's a Yeah, he's a weird guy, um the way he performs. and and Okay, um let's see, David Barbarossa, he wanted me to send his regards. you know he and i talked He said, hey, to send off Marco Maier regards next, if you talk to him anytime. And you and I had been chatting online at the time, I hadn't, we hadn't gotten this far to discuss an interview yet. So, but he he wanted me to tell you hello.
00:53:00
Speaker
Oh, I will tell him a lot. I was supposed to tell him myself, couldn't yeah I? Yeah, he just say said, Marco, my regards. um So. ah Let's see, I don't think but you weren't touring with Sinead back in at the ninety nine and ninety eight, right? Were you with with her at the Guinness Flaw? And that I saw with her in 1990, we went ah her great, you know, when nothing because he was everywhere. Yeah. That was the first time I met you was and and her um and her first that night. And I've met her several times since. But you you weren't part of a touring show after that. No, then she stopped touring for a while. And then she did different things. And she didn't want to go back and having didn't want to go back into having a big band and, you know, sort of this big
00:53:58
Speaker
She's, you know, she got sick of being a rock star, really. Yeah, no. it but she never she she never She wasn't the intention to be a rock star. what was her What was it for her then? I mean, because what she did...
00:54:15
Speaker
i i loved I loved everything. Like first I heard of her was when she did that single with the edge from U2 for that silly bad mystery movie that she was, that they did. um She did the single for that. That was what I first heard. That was before even any, she had had a contract. safe of your heart That one. No, this one, there was a movie called captive in 1986.
00:54:42
Speaker
And the ads from you two had her singing a song on that, which was just an amazing song. And that was when I had first gotten into her. So by the time you were on stage with her, I knew everything that she had ever done, you know. ah So you were on there at like the highest point of her career and playing some of the just some great, you know, like I i personally never liked nothing compares to you. It just it was just It wasn't even good for her voice, you know, but else everybody else in the world likes it. I know. I was like, gosh, this is really good. Look at like even even the first Mandinka and Troy, all good, great stuff. But then this was like, really? You know, it didn't even hold a candle to the rest of the record. Well, that was that was the big breakthrough record. I mean, no, no one was it. I mean, when she did it,
00:55:40
Speaker
I keep hearing stories of, of oh you know, she was forced to do it, and she wasn't forced to do it. um It was her manager. Fuck no, fuck no, Kelly, he was really, he thought this would be a great, I've never actually heard the original version, but it's not, Princeton did, it was a band called The Family, which is one of his offshoot bands. So fuck no, was it? Oh, okay. ah Well, um Yeah, I thought I heard it. I thought, oh, this would be great for Shanae to do. And he played it too. And she said, well, yeah it's OK. And but then he really, really pushed it forward. Is the last time I saw her, she was playing it and she looked like it was torture.
00:56:27
Speaker
having to sing it you know after that's what everybody wants you to do every night was yeah yeah yeah i mean it does get told i mean it does get told joe i haven't seen the same fucking thing over and over again particularly when you've only got one it's like there's most most bands you know when you get that thing you've seen like a pie chart it's like a pie chart of your income from the year and it's like usually it's like half of it or three quarters of it will be like kind of will be one track, it'll be your one standout track. I think probably for Brinton that is it's nothing compared to you. Obviously Sinead is nothing compared to you. I don't know. ah
00:57:08
Speaker
but spanned out by it will be true. Yeah. you for for For the police, bit every best every breath you take. Yeah. Yeah. but For Don McLean, it was American pie. Yeah, it was always being American pie. I just don't really know what else he did. I mean, like, he did that starry starry night about Vincent van Gogh. That's about it. I mean, you know, I can't remember anything else he ever did.
00:57:33
Speaker
um But Al doesn't like that. Al's has always got, you know, it's always standing the liver up in summer. It's like, it's all right like loads of it. It's sort of like, you know, we haven't got one, one massive standout track. Really? yeah Okay, because like, um ah room at the top probably doesn't make as much as say strip or whatever, but Again, there well, it depends. It's different years. You can't, you know, sure. It's always, you always get a thing. You say, oh, I, and you go, you know, Apollo 9 has done really well this year for absolutely no, you know, no reason that I can see, but you know, but it's just. Apollo 9 was a great song, but they well, okay. Like I think Dirk is the only album that I have that I don't have signed by Adam, but, um, I,
00:58:33
Speaker
from the collection standpoint, every song on strip and every song on Viva La Rock were perfect. I loved every song on there. There weren't one song better than the other. They were all just, those are the the records that I can't like skip songs. I just have to, once I put it on, I just play it all the way through. Cause they were just yeah everything start to finish, you know, was just great. Those were masterpiece records.
00:59:01
Speaker
Oh, thank you. And I mean, I hope they were as much fun to make and to record as as they because I mean, I've spent countless hours of my misspent youth listening to those two records, memorizing them. Were they fun to make? I mean, but ah albums can be very special, but um I generally, ah genuinely i mean I like, I miss the days when, you know you you you were okay, there's ah there's always that big chart in the the office wall and there's always a bit that's blocked out and it says album for six weeks. And you think, ah, you know.
00:59:43
Speaker
And then everybody decaps to the studio, all the equipment, all the crew, everything everybody goes to the studio. And it's a big deal. This this ah this is the highlight of the year. To make this album once a year, whatever album it is, that is actually your reason for living. That's your reason for existing.
01:00:07
Speaker
And I kind of, I really do miss that nowadays, whether, you know, the album is a secondary or even thirdly importance. Sure. Cause now it's
Legacy Reflections & Sinead's Impact
01:00:18
Speaker
the tour and how many shirts are you going to sell on the gig and your, yours your that 11 cents per month you get from Spotify. Yeah. Yeah. so yeah and and And the dreaded meet and greet.
01:00:32
Speaker
which I've never done. but you've never done him i've've i've That's how I met Adam was that first time there. ah Were you on the last tour with Adam? No. I was scheduled. I was out getting my brain smashed out of my head with an acoustic guitar at a Swans concert that night.
01:00:52
Speaker
So I was, I was, I was photographing swans that night and it was Adam and the English beat, but I had gotten the, the, the gig to shoot swans and and to to cover that one before Adam came online. So I was like, you know, so I missed that. I I've never have gotten to see Adam life, really but that Adam and them came through ah like two years ago or no, right. Like, where all you where'd you live I'm in Salt Lake city.
01:01:22
Speaker
ah so and insist yeah okay It was a place with a strange licensing rules. Yes. And so ah I believe you were at that show when you played at the depot because somebody snuck a camera through a curtain and took a picture of you and Adam, I think sitting at the table eating dinner was like, Oh my God, there's the royalty and everything. and But I i think i I don't remember. I was actually out of town, probably doing a different show that night. Cause I was like, every time Adam's come through salt Lake, I've never had the opportunity. I've always been booked out on something else.
01:01:55
Speaker
You know, yeah, I mean, thought us I remember sort of like cityy being a nice place. I mean, it's surrounded by mountains, isn't it? And yes, it's a very pretty place, but it's trying sort of like you can drink in here, but you can't drink over there. And and it's it's all that. well Yes. But you can't drink 16 feet away. You're not allowed to drink. What's this about? You know, well, there was there was one band that came through going to open for the ministry.
01:02:24
Speaker
But since the lead singer was 19, and they're like, oh, well, because there'll be liquor sold out on the floor in the venue, though you'll be on the stage and backstage, you you you can't play here.
01:02:40
Speaker
you know like So they there it was just this French industrial band, they they got booted from the bill that night because of weird liquor laws. Because the singer's 19 and is nowhere near alcohol and probably has no intention of drinking. He can't play. yeah they they were They weren't allowed to play, yes because they couldn't have an underage person. the The band had to cancel. They had to get somebody else. That's ridiculous. I remember that.
01:03:13
Speaker
But England used to have those stupid sort of laws up until about 20, 30 years ago. I mean, pubs had to close at three o'clock for no reason that anyone ever knew. And then they repealed that law. But the original law made sense because it was brought in during World War I so the workers They would go to the pub at lunchtime and then they wanted them to go back to work because there's a war on and we kind of need you to work. Yeah, go and build the ships. Yeah. Yeah. So that makes sense. So you had said you said you were going to be working later this week. Are you got musical projects that you're going to be i think think knewer just writing some
01:04:00
Speaker
TV music or some film music. It's the first stuff. I mean, ah the last stuff, i the last thing I did was end of 2019, which was Shakespeare's sister. So we did a tour with Siobhan who's one of my best friends in all the world. So, I mean, I don't hadn't intended ever touring again.
01:04:29
Speaker
although you touring I don't mind playing live I don't want to do. I hadn't intended ever playing another gig but she said I'll go on please so I did it and it went really well and it was painless and quite fun and she said what do you want to do some more and we're going to go to Europe and um I said yeah yeah sounds great and um I think dates were booked. I think dates were booked. Then there was like, you know, we're going to send you a contract. And I said, okay. And then do you want to do America? And I said, yeah, yeah, yeah. It all sounds good. It was going to be maybe another three or four months touring. And then obviously that was November 2019. And then right beginning of 2020, the entire world. Yeah, everything shut down. Yeah.
01:05:23
Speaker
Yeah, so no one could do anything.
01:05:28
Speaker
And so and nobody tried to pick that back up again, I guess. No, because it went on. It's just, you know, it was like a year before they could pick it up again. And by that time, Sean got off the idea. Uh huh. So right now, nobody could talk you into taking the road, not even Shakespeare's sister. No, she might be able to.
01:05:52
Speaker
except my pedal board, I spent so long programming for that. I've now unprogrammed it. ah i don't I don't know. I don't know. It has to be, you know, there's sort of like kind of, it has to be life-changing money. I mean, you know, kind of car-changing money or kitchen-changing money is not really of any interest to me if I need that.
01:06:22
Speaker
it's like It's like, you know, you you you do a tour and you can buy a new car and have a holiday and maybe use your kitchen out a bit. Well, no, no, really. Yeah, that's not worth it for you. But to buy a warehouse to fit all your guitars in a museum. Yeah. Well, I want to put in them in the house. So I'd like a bigger house to put my stuff in. I'd really like to move back to London. That's the i only that's the that's the only reason I've ever done something, you know, right.
01:06:52
Speaker
It's really to get the money to move back to London. Well, because the to what it would cost to live in London is insane. I mean, it's I know I used to live there. I lived there for 40 years. I lived there all my life until 10 years ago. And so where are you now? at Where are you? ah I am in Derbyshire. I am in the picturesque.
01:07:13
Speaker
I live in an idyllic big house with ah rock, memorabilia and guitars everywhere in in a sort of, you know, I don't live in a village, I live near a village um and we have stables and grounds and and it's fucking hell and it's just you know oh yeah it's like i said it's like you said the other day i sent you a picture of where i was and you're like oh no i'm a city guy i'm like oh i see i live in the burbs i live like you're selling suburbs i don't live in the suburbs yeah i live in the suburbs and then i'm a half a mile maybe a mile from the mountains you know no i live i live i used to live in the west end i used to live in bakes street were
01:08:02
Speaker
No, those are my puppies. Near Selfridges. And the only place I ever wanted to move to was to be further in, further into Soho. I mean, it didn't work out that way. The kind of circumstances... Come here.
01:08:21
Speaker
Circumstances sort of... It seemed a good idea at the time, but it just all went wrong. So... Oh, well. I... last time I was in London, I thought this is beautiful. It's great. And I see, you know, room for let there are a flat for let that was just ridiculous. I was like, that's $4,000 American, you know, doing the math in my head. I was like, that's, if you, I mean, I, you know, I do kind of online kind of fantasy real estate shopping. And, you know, for 25 million quid, 25 million quid in London, you get a big house. It's not even that big. It's a five bedroomed house. It's a nice house. But for 25 million quid in Manhattan, you get a proper rich person's property. You know, you get a proper penthouse with it.
01:09:19
Speaker
yeah swimming pool or a proper Elon Musk, Donald Trump type. ah For 25 million quid, yeah. Yeah, and twenty for 25 million quid, you get a house.
01:09:37
Speaker
A nice house, a white house in a nice area. But fuck that. I mean, it's 25 million quid. Yeah, no, I get it. when When I lived in France, if I wanted to by the the three bedroom flat I lived in in France. Oh, hey, can start. hey star Hello. Actually, you know what? My my dog's name is David Bowie Douglas. Yeah. yeah Since since Bowie died, ah there's most a lot of people's dogs are called, you know, a lad insane or ZZ stardust or Bowie or. Yeah. Yeah.
01:10:15
Speaker
but My daughter's name is David Bowie Douglas. they named um i wanted to stay i mean I know David Bowie had a dog, ah but I wonder that like when he thought I will change. When I die, there will be thousands of dogs named after me. It's probably not the legacy that he was thinking of leaving. i you know i In the later years, what I read about him and how when he was writing,
01:10:44
Speaker
the the lyrics for you know the end, right? and and his And they were like, well, what are you gonna say? What's this gonna be about? Or what' what's this lyric mean? He's like, oh, hell if I know, it'll just keep the fans perplexed for decades trying to figure out what it means. you know yeah he he just He just fucked it all off. He didn't care in the end. he was just like, I'm going to make this really depressing, painful record. and Well, but because he he was depressed. and and it it was It was a masterpiece, but wow, yeah, lyrically, everyone's like, he and he he said, i you know he basically he he was he wanted us to all be wondering what those words were about and there was no way we're going to there was no way we're going to know anymore.
01:11:31
Speaker
I saw an interview with Dave Grohl. Dave Grohl sent him an email saying, do you want to, he had some track he wanted him to do and Bo said, no, I don't want to do it. And he went, oh, okay, well, maybe I'll see you at your next birthday party. And he said, no, you won't. He goes, what, no more birthday pies? He said, no more birthdays. And Grohl didn't know what he meant, but obviously he thought that, what he meant. Yeah.
01:11:56
Speaker
I think he just held out for the birthday and then it was time it was like even even Brian Eno and Iggy were like shocked because they said you know we talked to him all the time we had no idea he was sick yeah you know like nobody knew he was sick his band members were sacred I don't know how I don't know how he kicked It's so secret. I don't know how, because he traveled to London, you know, because they had the the David Bowie is exhibition and he went to London to see the exhibition. He wasn't, you he donated all the stuff. He didn't have, didn't do any promotion for it. He didn't go to the party or it wasn't involved in it. And I don't know how he got there. I mean, he apparently got there by private plane, but still he has to go for an airport.
01:12:47
Speaker
And nobody saw him. like nobody knew Nobody knew any of it. you know no yeah as as say say you I'm really sorry about Bowie. That's how I found out about Sinead. You're just you really sorry about Sinead and you know what it means.
01:13:05
Speaker
Yeah, I was devastated. And again, I had met her and spoken to her several times, but not for a very long time. And I was devastated when she passed. But I did think of you, because I thought, you know, you two had been, you had been with her through, I mean, let's see, even IBU, you be me, I be me, you be you, which is, you know, some of her best work there too, you know. And I thought there was, I was celebrating that record.
01:13:35
Speaker
Oh, I still am because that was such a great album. You know, the The Wolf is Getting Married. The Wolf is Getting Married, I really liked. Oh, fabulous song. I thought she wrote that to her boys, to her kids. I don't know what it was about, i actually. ah No, she said. She she talked about it like in a cab ride in Egypt.
01:13:55
Speaker
That's why I said, what's this mean then? And she said, well, I got into this cat. And I was in turf. She said, I got into a cat the other day and the bloke said, and I said, oh, it's nice weather or something, or the red sun, red sun, or something. And the bloke said, yeah, the wolf is getting married tomorrow. And she said, what's that mean? And he said, it's just a phrase that means it's going to be a nice day.
01:14:19
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, it's gonna be a good day. Yeah, the weather is good. It's gonna be a good day. And I thought that is such a cool song. And and then she did that John Grant cover of Queen of Denmark on there, which is fabulous. thats That is the best fuck you song ever written. Yeah, that's quite that song. I really like John Grant. Yeah, I've had him on my show too, like two years ago, three years ago. Yeah, John Grant's a terrific guy. ah He's really funny. Yeah.
01:14:48
Speaker
Yeah, John Grant was great, but yeah, that whole record was good. I was not as into the last one that she did. um Probably need to go back and give it a listen to, but i it was very sad when she passed because I felt like she was finally getting on top of things, you know? I felt like she was. Maybe she was. I mean, she had a hard time, yeah.
01:15:15
Speaker
Well, that was, I mean, last year, Jordan viy westward and Sinead all in the same year. So I hope it just happened. It does happen in Threes and that's enough. food I don't believe in God anymore, but I lit a candle and said, you know, God, if you're still there, you know, just but let her know that she was loved, you know.
01:15:40
Speaker
Yeah, I but don't. I don't. Did she know that? I don't know. I don't know. She did. She knew that. I don't know. She. Yeah, did she had a rough time the last several years, and but but when she converted to Islam and I saw her up there, she's converted to everything. But when I saw her, but the Islam stuck, you know, Islam stuck and I saw her there.
01:16:06
Speaker
giving an interview and I'm like, you know what? She looks like she's got structure in her life. She looks like she's happy. Well, I hope it helps. I hope it helps. It gave her structure. It gave her like a process that she could get into and and work and it seemed to help. I'm not religious. I don't believe in God and I don't believe in religion, but there are times you think I wish I did. it I wish I believed, you know, that everything's going to be all right. hu I used to be incredibly religious.
01:16:33
Speaker
Really? know Yeah, I used to be. I was as I was as Mormon as you get. I served my my mission there over in Germany and all that. Yeah. Yeah. go with full you Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right. So that was me. But, um you know, not anymore. But I think I'd say like, OK, what are the cheekiest things Sinead ever did? And this was after she had converted to Islam. that This is just and I know you know her. So you'll you'll say, yeah, this is totally cheeky. She played the Auchian Belgique.
01:17:03
Speaker
right in in Brussels. And she came out and I don't remember which song she opened with, but she said, all right, everybody, thank you so much for coming. Just remember to clean off the sofa. that Just went right on with it. She did have a great sense of humor, which a a lot of people don't realize. Oh, yeah.
01:17:28
Speaker
Oh yeah. she if If I got her alone, when I was just alone talking with her, she was hilarious. she was Yeah. Yeah. ah Even when she was really anxious, I remember one time we were talking, she was really anxious. It was the Guinness flop back in 98.
01:17:45
Speaker
And I was backstage with Carl and them at World Party and their set had crapped out. because Did the pokes play? Shane McGowan and the pokes did. ah Was it in Finsbury Park? Yeah, yeah. No, I was there. Yeah, you were there. Okay. Were you were you on Sinead's band that night? No. Okay. Because I didn't see you. Yeah, I didn't see you that night. I was there. Well, there's a lot of people. he there all Yeah. but I remember I was backstage with Shane McGowan and Mike Scott from the Waterboys and I'm talking and everybody and I was over there talking to the guys in World Party. Their set had just crapped out.
01:18:23
Speaker
um They had Jeremy Stacy from the Bunnymen playing drums that day. I remember that. and ever It was just a fun, and and I'm goofing off with Carl and they're all laughing and giving me jabs about being Mormon and why I'm not drinking beer with everybody there. And Sinead just keeps walking back and forth.
01:18:42
Speaker
And I just walked up to her in the inner trailer. I stuck my head and I said, hey, can I say hi? She says, so hi. but And we just chatted for a bit. And she was like, you know, I'm kind of fucking nervous about this because they just grabbed out. And I don't know. I hope I do OK tonight. I really do because I don't I don't want to go bad tonight because I'm like I'm like the final set when the lights are out. You know, so, you know, and she she looked a bit anxious.
01:19:09
Speaker
that that day and then but then right before she walked up that gangway she was like shaking yeah no no she used to get real nerves i mean but real bad nerves it's like yeah i always say like what if i'm not only good tonight what if i'm not any good well you have a good last night so i can't see why you wouldn't be right and so but so you get it you've seen her with the nerves like that then she walks up the gangway turns to the left goes onto the stage and it was like what the hell is she worried about she brought the house down
01:19:41
Speaker
you know she on the echo ah i get like like get I get very nervous. I used to get very nervous going on stage. A lot of people do it. It makes no rational sense. You've done this hundreds of times. You've never been killed. this yes You've never hurt yourself. You've never had a terrible gig. You've never caused a riot. The stage hasn't fallen down. and what What is it? what's a what Why?
01:20:12
Speaker
And that night she pulled it off. It was magical. She was amazing. You know, I'd seen her a couple of times since then. Also just as great that like when they came out the very end, everyone was, the whole band were just all like this and they all sang into the one mic three babies and we were just crying. You know, I mean, she can bring you to your knees. She's, she was so amazing life. And yeah, I got to see you performing there with her one of those nights. You know, that was,
01:20:43
Speaker
Yeah, she was amazing and she will be missed. I think she's already missed. I mean, yeah, that was a good tour. That was really the last really big tour I did. Well, you're doing stadiums that tour. Yeah, yeah. So I've kind of now been spoiled and it's like every tour, it's like I only now want to do stadiums. I want to do stadiums for life-changing money, otherwise I'll ah I'll just be... I'll just... And you'll do music for film and soundtracks, I guess, all right. Yeah, all I want to do anything at all. And it's just, you know...
Guitar Gear & Studio Setup
01:21:23
Speaker
But you're one of those legendary guitar players. I mean, you're always playing, it sounds like, with that many guitars in the house. In your downtime, do you just play and jam very much? Yeah, of course. Oh, yeah. Of course, every day.
01:21:37
Speaker
Yeah, every day, that's in your blood. I haven't picked up a guitar today. That's because I was very busy walking the dogs this morning. and Yes, I know how it is. I have the dogs, a minor. Yeah. yeah No, no, but I did some guitar orientated tasks this morning, like sit in the studio and go through leads that aren't broken and try and find, you know, and just because I have all these cases where you're not a guitar player, where your bass players are maybe you're the same, you know, you sort of got you go through, maybe every guitar player goes, you have you have your big trunk ah of stuff and you think, I'm going to tie this up now, you know, this' one of that single string,
01:22:26
Speaker
there
01:22:30
Speaker
You know, I mean, this is this is going to be very boring to you and your listeners. But for me, it was a highlight I've had. and In fact, strange your mouth it was.
01:22:43
Speaker
I changed all the valves. Well, I didn't do it. something else I changed all the valves on that Sinead open the door. I changed all the valves in this messa boogie combo, which is upstairs. And I've had these valves for 35 years in a carrier bag.
01:23:02
Speaker
I was thinking, it's just got to my mind, shall I keep these valves? Because if I slow them away, I'm going to need them, aren't I? But I've had them for 35 years and you haven't even... you I am the same way with an electronic and recording gear, camera gear. Yeah, I'm um the... Yes, I totally... Yeah, I...
01:23:24
Speaker
I did it last night. I mean, maybe everybody does it. I did it last night. i was i was going through it You know those fucking awful USB leads. I've got fucking hundreds of them. I don't need hundreds of them. I just need like five or something.
01:23:39
Speaker
but every But you throw them away and then you get to a place where you need one. I threw it away. I went out to the you know went down the fucking path outside the gate and chucked them in the big bin. Then came back, and then I was replagging up my system upstairs. I was trying to get some find find some stuff that I had on some drives, and you think, oh, fucking, I need that one of those leaves, so I had to go back down the
01:24:09
Speaker
um the say I have have an entire storage bin of just cables yeah for everything. yeah and i have yeah i Right outside of the frame here, I have a hook with probably 60 cables hanging off it. Because I can just reach over, grab one, plug it. Yeah, um yeah i'm I'm that guy, man. so but yeah what is and You see, everybody is. And you always think, I must get rid of those fucking cables.
01:24:39
Speaker
Well, my wife is like, you got to get rid of some of this. No, I will eventually need that. Why? Because there'll be that archaic piece of gear that I still need to connect to. I've discovered reverb, the music thing.
01:25:00
Speaker
I I've I've I've never I've never bought by selling anything on on either eBay or either except I've had this pedal board. I don't even know what it is. It's like it's been lying in my studio. I have two pedals. Oh, OK. This is this is a flanger pedal that I can actually tweak to sound like Peter Hook.
01:25:24
Speaker
Oh, okay. but so I don't need to I don't need any of the fancy MIDI gear I can just hook into this, and I can do almost all Peter Hook sounds with this. so I had the remote pedal board that plugs into a piece of gear that I don't actually have anymore. And ah I've lost the lead, I've lost the piece of gear that it controls.
01:25:46
Speaker
For 10 years, for 20 years, it was it was in my studio in London. And then for another 10 years, it's been in my studio here, just leaning up against the wall. And I finally, finally, finally, last week, put it on reverb and sold it for 100 quid.
01:26:03
Speaker
Because you know some guy needed it. Some guy was like, oh, this is, yeah, yeah. ah In fact, the bloke did send me a message saying, oh, yeah, I lost mine. I haven't been able to.
01:26:15
Speaker
Well, it's there you go, mate. Give me 100 quid. It's yours. And your life is now complete. That is awesome. I don't know if it's the, pen well, it's the pedalboard four. You don't know which one you used it for, huh? No, I haven't got the, I haven't got, it was a rack unit and I haven't got the rack unit anymore. Oh, that is funny. No. Jeez, Marco, like we could go on. I got two pedals and that's it. You know, I, I, I,
01:26:43
Speaker
I had to go minimalist because I have literally the smallest room in the world here. And if I want to do, if I want to play the new order joy division stuff, I'll wire it all up and go through the headphones and just, you know, I had to do it this way. Cause I had kids when they were really little living right upstairs and you know, now it doesn't matter. But you know, I haven't advanced in my technical business as far as my guitar playing goes for a while.
Performance Mishaps & Minimalism
01:27:12
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, i when I was in the answer, I was like this massive, this guy called Pete Kaldish, maybe this massive pedal board with all these wires and lights and things like, but I never used it in the studio. I just, I had the pedal board, but then I also had the individual pedals as well. So I still got them all. I don't know what happened to the pedal board. It's completely huge and unwieldy. I don't know, I think it just gave it all.
01:27:35
Speaker
and Well, I do remember I was at a show, a punk show and the guitarist fancied himself to be like from yes, I guess. And he had all these pedals up there. He had like, I think he had like two big pedal boards and he would just be off there too. And it's, you know, and he was so into the technical side of things. And I just remember somewhere in middle of the night, some guy gets on stage and wants to dive off a,
01:28:05
Speaker
He steps right across, rips some of the leaves out, just oh ruined the whole evening right there. yeah Yeah, I mean those things are like, you know, it's hard enough putting those things together in your studio during the day when it's quiet and you're and and and there's no one around. Putting all the leaves back together again on on a stage in the dark.
01:28:29
Speaker
during the show, it's just impossible. I mean, i've I've always been a big admirer of John 5, you know, that guy who plays with Marilyn Manson and he plays with Rob Zombie. He used to be with Marilyn Manson. Anyway, he's got one pedal, he's got it's got one of those yellow boss distortion units, and he's got a battery in it.
01:28:52
Speaker
no ge
01:28:55
Speaker
It must be the the only stadium playing professional guitars to actually uses a battery. Who puts the nine volt battery in there? Yeah, that's that's funny. No, I I love these stories. I love the tech stories that most people don't ever hear.
01:29:15
Speaker
you know well now most people aren't interested that's what i'm hearing i mean one of the one of the best stories like with uh peter hook was talking about how their first tour of the united states they had pink floyd's transformer you know that pink floyd had been using for stadiums and they're playing clubs like you know the paradise garage and but in new york city right they said We had Pink Floyd's transfer, we'd turn it on and to power up so we could, you know, put our gears and half the city would go, di you know, like I read that and I laugh. I think it's hysterical and nobody else gets it, you know, or but most music nerds aren't going to get that and think it's funny. I thought it was hilarious hearing that, you know. Yeah, I, I, I sort of, yeah, know yeah it's not,
01:30:10
Speaker
It's like, do you ever ever look at the you know those big massive yellow junction boxes that I have on stage? Yeah. yes I always look at them and I'm on stage thinking, what would happen if I kicked it? Well, I'd die, first of all. I mean, that's the first thing around. It would light you up. You'd get lit up like both. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
01:30:34
Speaker
Yeah, I would die and that that would be the end of the gate, but not because I was dead, it was because of the electricity, the whole power would go down. The power would go down. And somebody would come after you and try and kill you for it, you know. Well, they would be dead. Yeah. So, hey, Marco, this has been an amazing conversation.
Wrap-Up & Musical Joy
01:30:53
Speaker
I've had so much fun just i I had all these questions and you took us in a lot of different directions. I had a wonderful time. ah Oh good. Thank you for your time. So what song that you played on, do you want me to play us out with? That's that's like your favorite. Play Wolf is getting married. Okay. Cause I was planning to open it with Viva La Rock. All right. And then, but Wolf is getting married to play us out with. Okay. Yeah. I mean, I was told
01:31:24
Speaker
that all my guitars have been replaced by somebody who played exactly the same parts. I'm very suspicious of this and ah it sounds exactly like me. I don't think they replace my parts at all. Well, your name is still on it for Wolf is getting married. Yeah, I know. Yeah.
01:31:44
Speaker
And but John, ah um my one of my bestest friends in all the world, John Reynolds, who married to Sinead, said, oh no, we took all your parts off. You took all your parts off? He said, yeah, that was shit. We took them off.
01:32:01
Speaker
Oh shit. So you can't play. We took it all off. We've got somebody who can play. Oh, God. We said, yeah, we met some guy in a pub and he was better than you. Oh, yeah, I'm just wondering who could be better than Marco Pieroni on guitar, man. That's just John. He was just taking the piss. Yeah, it's full of abuse.
01:32:26
Speaker
um All right. No, we took it all off because it was shit. Yeah, yeah. Actually, with the best song. Well, OK. Difficult to say what my fave song on that album was.
01:32:41
Speaker
just because that album, the whole thing was great. But yeah, that, yeah, fabulous song, man. So I'll play us out with that, everybody. This is, The Wolf is Getting Married by Sinead O'Connor with Marco playing the yeah the great guitar line on that. Maybe not playing. Oh, i mean i it it is rumored that Marco is on there. Well, I wrote it,-wrote it, so.
01:33:07
Speaker
Okay. And so everyone, thank you. This is Marco Broni who has been in rock and roll since, ah well, since the dwindling edge of the sex pistols, the beginning of Adam man's career and up until now. So Marco, thank you so much for your time. All right. Thanks a lot, Jeremy. And everybody else take care of, be good to each other and let music do awesome in your lives.
01:33:36
Speaker
And thank you, Marco, so much for your time. That was amazing. There was a lot there. Actually hit pause and we talked for another 45 minutes. um That was a great conversation, Marco. Thank you for all that. I hope you all enjoyed the stories. Special thanks to Berrien as a shriekback for letting us use the theme and title of Sticky Jazz. And enjoy it. This is The Wolf Is Getting Married, everybody.
01:37:42
Speaker
The wolf is getting matted and hit.