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Strength, Softness and the Soul of the Enneagram 8 - The Challenger
42 Plays6 months ago
In this episode of STILL YOU, we’re diving into the bold, intense, and secretly tender world of Enneagram Type 8 — The Challenger.
If you’ve ever been called “too much,” “too direct,” or “intimidating,” this one’s for you. We’ll explore what drives the Type 8’s need for control, their incredible protective instincts, and the surprisingly soft heart underneath all that armor.
We’ll laugh through the classic Eight behaviors (because… we’ve all been steamrolled by one), unpack their light and shadow sides, and explore their wings — the firecracker 8w7 and the gentle bear 8w9.
Plus, we’ll talk practical growth practices that help Eights build trust, release control, and lead with love instead of fear.
It’s part funny, part deep, and fully Type 8.
Listen if you:
- Love a Type 8 (and are a little scared of them)
- Are a Type 8 who’s learning to soften
- Or just want to understand why your Eight friend can’t not lead every group project
Schedule a 1on1- Copy & paste link: https://calendly.com/bundy-katelynn/30min
Tiktok: @stillyoupod
YouTube: @stillyoupod
Resources: The Wisdom of The Enneagram & Personality Types by Don Richard Riso, Russ Hudson
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to the Podcast
00:00:09
KateLynn Bundy
Hey everybody, oh welcome back to the Still You podcast. The podcast for people who don't like being told what to do, which means today is definitely for people like myself.
00:00:22
KateLynn Bundy
Ah, you know who you are. And the ones who think every group project needs a commander, a leader, every role is absolutely optional. And every opinion feels... Like it deserves some sort of passionate counterpoint.
00:00:35
KateLynn Bundy
We're diving into why you have to be in charge even when you don't want to be. And why vulnerability feels like an ambush. Why your resting leadership face makes people just a little bit nervous. So grab your emotional arm. Nope.
00:00:51
KateLynn Bundy
You're setting that at the door, leaving that at the door for today, at least for the next hour,
Exploring Enneagram Type Eight
00:00:56
KateLynn Bundy
please. Because today we're talking about the powerhouse, the protector, the walking, don't test me sign, the Enneagram type eight.
00:01:08
KateLynn Bundy
Don't worry guys, this is not a takedown for our eights. You are safe here. So no one's trying to control you except for me, but only for the next hour. So deal with it. So if you haven't figured out by now, yeah, I'm an eight. I'm actually out of breath.
00:01:28
KateLynn Bundy
You'll find out why, but yes, this is my episode, my episode for my, I'm so excited. Okay. If you are an eight male or female, no innate dating one, probably divorced from one, this is the episode for you babes or for you to share. Please do so by the way, because i don't know how often i repeat this. um you know We're trying to do something here, but also share because eight are some of the more outwardly difficult types. I hate to admit it, but we need help. We need we need you guys. We need support, even if it doesn't seem like it. um And yeah, because this is me, the type eight episode, I will say that if this episode feels a little bit biased, Girl, I can't help it. I can't help it. It's naturally the one I know the most about and I want to just vomit all of that knowledge onto my other eights out there.
00:02:32
KateLynn Bundy
Mainly, I will say, mainly to my female eights because yes, we are the most misunderstood type of the Enneagram. Why? Because we have a masculine personality with titties. All right, let's get into it.
00:02:47
KateLynn Bundy
can't believe I said titties. But first, again, yeah rate and review, share, support the dream, turn this into my full-time gig because I am right now, I'm busting these out while I can. It's the holiday season, but once the new year hits,
00:03:03
KateLynn Bundy
We're going to be grooving much more regularly, so DM or email me if you want to if there's something like specific you want to hear or like a good subject you want me to cover. Or if you actually want to learn more about your type or learn maybe what your type is, you can schedule a one-on-one sesh with me and have it featured as an episode as well. All you have to do... like There has to be a better way to do this, but for now, just go to the show notes. There's a Calendly link that you have to copy and paste into your browser just to get the scheduling thing. But okay, ah now let's get
Characteristics of Type Eights
00:03:41
KateLynn Bundy
into it. Now let's start with our basics, the core blueprints of our type eights. Do you know that friend who refuses to let anyone mess with their people? Like someone insults you at the bar and that friend is like, who said that?
00:04:00
KateLynn Bundy
Who hurt you? Point them out right fucking now. That's an eight in action. See how effortlessly I did that? Oh, it felt so natural. ah It's that protective instinct locked in and loaded. They are the people who say, don't worry, I've got it handled, baby cakes. And then five minutes later, they fired up six emails, couple calls, and a Yelp review, whatever it is, they'll take care of it. Eights are not here for passive aggression. They are here for directness, honesty, and loyalty. Okay?
00:04:37
KateLynn Bundy
Type eights are bold, assertive, and protective and allergic to being controlled. Their internal motto is something like, only the strong survive and preferably I'm in charge of that. So if you've ever met someone who walks into a room and immediately changes the energy, like the air suddenly feels charged with purpose or maybe intimidation,
00:05:04
KateLynn Bundy
It's probably an eight. Eights value strength, autonomy, and truth. Think Chris Hansen taking down child predators as a full-time job. I'm obsessed with his TikTok account. I wouldn't be surprised if he was an eight wing nine or even a type one.
00:05:23
KateLynn Bundy
Either one. Those are good guesses, though. I love him doing the Lord's
Desires and Fears of Type Eights
00:05:28
KateLynn Bundy
work out there. But a type eight's basic desire is to be independent and to protect themselves and others from harm and then to determine their own course in life. And guess what their biggest fear is Being controlled, vulnerable, or betrayed. So their super ego message says, you are good or okay if you are in strong and in control of your situation. They have a built-in radar for power dynamics. So they can walk into a room and instantly sense, all right, who's in charge here? Do I trust them? If not, I got this.
00:06:08
KateLynn Bundy
So also, eights do not wait for permission. They are permission, which is important. Funny to me because one of my favorite sayings is don't ask for permission, ask for forgiveness. Because damn, you cannot rely on other people or wait on other people to finally make a decision. Like at the heart of the eight's worldview is a belief that the world is a tough place and you've got to be tough to survive it. So they build their armor, big, shiny, emotionally bulletproof armor.
00:06:45
KateLynn Bundy
When we dive into like the childhood dynamics of all our types, a lot of this, especially for the eight will start to make sense. So stay tuned for that. But the twist and under, with the twist in all of this, underneath all of that armor, I can't tell you how true this is. So please trust me, even if you're an eight and haven't gotten there yet, but underneath all that armor is the most tender, gooey cinnamon roll of a heart.
00:07:14
KateLynn Bundy
Ate's love deeply and fiercely and protectively. You might not see it right away because vulnerability to them feels like exposure to danger. And it sounds, I get how that sounds ridiculous and kind of too primal in today's world, but hold on, we're going to be talking more about that.
00:07:36
KateLynn Bundy
So instead of an ate saying, I love you, ate might say, Did you eat? You have better have eaten, or I swear to God, if you skipped lunch again, which roughly translates to, yeah I love you, and I just can't bear the thought of you being hungry or not taking care of yourself, so I'm here to help you, right? I think I shook the desk on that one.
00:08:04
KateLynn Bundy
But that's so accurate because I've seen people actively like react to that aggressive love when I say things in that manner or like that. And I always have to remind myself to soften my tone, soften my approach. But if you tell an eight that, that's like their kryptonite because they are the rugged individualists of the Enneagram.
00:08:29
KateLynn Bundy
And God forbid they change to make other people comfortable. Okay. And that's not what this is. Please trust me. It took me a long time to realize that I can maintain who I am, my autonomy, my individuality, and be able to operate in the world so it responds better to people and people...
00:08:50
KateLynn Bundy
around me that I actually care about aren't intimidated or walk on eggshells around me. Okay? Put another pin in that. get Get your pins out. There's a lot of pins going in on this level. But so they call the type eight the challenger for a reason. Because of all the types, eights love a good old test of strength, right? Whether it's pushing themselves to the limit or pushing others to rise higher. They thrive on intensity and forward motion, right? Apes are magnetic, magnanimous, they're bold and built with a kind of stamina, both physical and psychological, that can rally others to follow them into just about anything, whether it's like launching a business, rebuilding a community, running a family, waging war, or negotiating peace. Hopefully it's
00:09:46
KateLynn Bundy
The piece, piece one. But they have an incredible reservoir of willpower and life force energy. And they feel most alive when they're using it in some way or another to just move the needle, to shape the world around them and to protect the people that they love. So that drive to control their environment isn't just about dominance, okay? It's also about safety.
Leadership and Autonomy in Eights
00:10:14
KateLynn Bundy
If they're in charge, they can't be blindsided or betrayed, right? And at their core, eights have one primary rule. No one controls me, right? Their deepest fear is being at the mercy of someone else's power, whether it's emotional, physical, sexual, social, or financial.
00:10:37
KateLynn Bundy
Maybe not all of those, but maybe some, but it's likely all of them at some point in their lives. I know me, I've calmed down a lot on all that, um but financial one is still kind of big for me. It's just ego at this point. It's like, I'm fine. I'm safe where I'm at.
00:10:55
KateLynn Bundy
Love my partner. We're good, but that's we're not here to talk about me. Oh, wait. We are. I'm just kidding. um But yeah, so eights make sure to stay strong, independent, and in control of their world for as long as humanly possible. And you'll find eights leading in every arena, whether like some general in the army, gardeners, CEOs, a mom or dad, activists, right? Whatever they do, they do it with presence and authority, leaving their unmistakable stamp on everything that they touch. And so, as the true rugged individualists of the Enneagram, eights truly do stand apart because they want to. Eights, they value independence and refuse to be indebted to anyone.
00:11:49
KateLynn Bundy
Social norms? Optional. Approval? Not necessary. They have a way of charging ahead, fearless of judgment and unmoved by the disapproval of others. Even when they know others find them intimidating, they'll keep going. They don't give a shit.
00:12:12
KateLynn Bundy
They're driven by a kind of steely determination that can inspire people or maybe instill a little, you know, healthy fear, if you will. But eights um are usually kind of, kind of, this kind of reminds me of our type threes too, but eights are usually powerhouses of productivity. They're people who can outwork. outlast and outmaneuver just about anyone. But sometimes, obviously, this drive comes at a cost. They get so focused on doing that they forget about feeling. And while they're out there conquering the world,
00:12:53
KateLynn Bundy
the people closest to them will start to feel like ignored, right? Why wouldn't they? Which really can confuse the eight. And here's why. Because in their mind, they're like, I'm working my ass off for you. and how are you not impressed? Or how does that not make you feel loved? Right? Whatever it is. That might sound a little familiar to some of you. And it might sting.
00:13:15
KateLynn Bundy
I don't care. Get over it. So when this happens, eights often feel misunderstood, right? Like their good intentions are invisible to the people that matter to them. So what do they do?
00:13:28
KateLynn Bundy
they They have a couple of choices, but typically what they'll do is they'll pull back even more. And underneath that tough, unshakable exterior, there's usually a whole lot of hurt that they'll never admit to ever, right?
00:13:43
KateLynn Bundy
ever that's a It's a fortress up there. Because vulnerability feels like kryptonite. Even something as small as getting sick can feel like losing control, which is so true. I remember when I was um like in my mid-20s, which was my more average level of health era,
00:14:05
KateLynn Bundy
I refused to let my body win. I once, there was a time where I had strep throat seven times one year and I never missed work. Fever, swollen glands. I had like this gland here, this lymph node was as big as a golf ball for a little while. And I still went into work.
00:14:26
KateLynn Bundy
But i'd be I'd pretend, do everything I needed to do to look and appear fine because, and I'd hide it really well because God forbid someone think I couldn't handle the workload that day and send me home. Weakness?
00:14:41
KateLynn Bundy
That's not me, baby. Even if I was a walking Petri dish, I was not gonna miss work. Granted, there were some other reasons at play as to why i worked my ass off, um but I would have honestly been okay and survived whatever I was going through if I just stayed home and rested.
00:14:59
KateLynn Bundy
All right, enough about me. But so underneath all that strength is a deep fear, the fear of rejection hu or humiliation, or maybe both. Whether it's a breakup or getting fired or just simply being criticized in some way, eights protect themselves the only way they know how, by rejecting others first.
00:15:23
KateLynn Bundy
It's the emotional version of, you can't fire me, I quit, right? Right? been there. The problem is um that defense makes it almost impossible to let love in. So cliche. Because love requires vulnerability and vulnerability feels like danger. Mm-hmm. So the more eights armor up, the more sensitive they actually become to any challenge or slight. Even a small disagreement can feel like a threat to their authority or their self-respect. So they shut down even harder. And I've been there. When when my marriage was falling apart, i was a total shell of myself. I was stoic, ultra distant, and just planning my my exit before he could before he could make the next the first move. I don't think he ever would have, honestly. But all that to say, I've never been broken up with in my life because my ego couldn't handle it. Well, and probably still can't if I'm being honest with myself, but
00:16:30
KateLynn Bundy
If something was going to end, I was going to see the end first and therefore end it first. Okay? You're going to beat me to the punch. he Anyway, but when eights are emotionally healthy, right, it's so beautiful and so powerful in the best ways possible. That same fire becomes fuel for leadership, creativity, and more courage, right? They don't bulldoze anymore. They build. They they take initiative without crushing others. They lead with clarity, dirt fairness, and their heart. Healthy eights are great,
Instinctual Nature of Type Eights
00:17:10
KateLynn Bundy
right? They have a grounded confidence that makes people naturally trust them. And they can make hard decisions as well. They can take the heat and still care about the wellbeing of everybody involved. And when an eight is at peace, they don't just protect their world,
00:17:28
KateLynn Bundy
They improve it. And that's when their power truly becomes life-giving. So for our triad, where do our eights land? Okay.
00:17:40
KateLynn Bundy
um Go back to the second episode. If you don't know what triads are, okay, I'm not going explain it. But eights kick off our gut or instinctive triad, which are the eights, nines, and ones.
00:17:53
KateLynn Bundy
Type nine, we'll talk about next episode, but we've already did the type one. I decided to go in chronological order, just, I don't know, I just did. So what does that mean, this this gut triad?
00:18:06
KateLynn Bundy
These three types all react to life from the gut. They lead with instinct and try in all their own unique ways to keep the environment from you know affecting them or throwing them off balance, right? And eights do it by dominating it.
00:18:25
KateLynn Bundy
Nines, they just tune it out, which we'll learn about next episode. And type ones, of as we have learned, do it by trying to perfect it, right? That is the key difference between those types. If you're kind of feeling like you're in that triad, that might help you narrow it down. and yeah Excuse me.
00:18:45
KateLynn Bundy
Let me pause for a little minute. Okay, sorry, I had to take like a break. my heart I have a new fancy smartwatch. My heart rate is like above normal. I need to like calm it down, take a sip water. All right, where was I? all right, I was talking about the triads. Got it, okay, so for eights. eight have a raw, powerful connection to their instincts. It's what gives them that unstoppable drive and confidence. They don't always know why they're doing something or deciding on something. They just know it's the thing to do. And if it turns out to be the wrong decision or wrong move, well, they're going to deal with that later, right? And prefer preferably by sheer force of will, right?
00:19:33
KateLynn Bundy
Oh, Lord. It reminds me of like, because I got married really young. I got married at 19. And um of course, like when you go through a divorce, that's when everyone's opinions are, you know, coming out like I should have warned. I should have said something. And, you know, of course, my parents were all like, I should have blah, blah, blah. And i was like, no, like I wouldn't have listened anyway. i would have done it. I needed to find out for myself. That's the kind of learner i am. And I felt, I feel like a lot of eights are like that as well. Like I just, in my gut, even though it was wrong because i'm a child at 18 and I haven't experienced much of the world.
00:20:14
KateLynn Bundy
So we're not diving into that. But you see what I mean? Like, I even told my mom years later, i was like, it wouldn't have changed my mind. I would have gone through it anyway. Right? So and now I learned so many lessons, so much from that, that I can move forward in such a healthier way. Right. But boom on the flippity flip, the, going to touch on the arrows real quick. We're going to go into it, but I want to touch on it really fast, but the, the arrows for growth and then disintegration, like stress, those paths point towards the five and the two.
00:20:55
KateLynn Bundy
And I say this because from the five, right? The five is in the head triad. The two is in the heart triad. The eights are in the
Balancing Strengths with Other Types
00:21:03
KateLynn Bundy
gut triad. So what, I mean, what a better place to be in than having those little arrows that can help you evolve into such in a much better way. So the five being, oh Jesus, my cat just sneezed and it scared the shit out of me, Jasmine.
00:21:22
KateLynn Bundy
Oh my gosh, hold on. Okay, sorry about that. Her sneezes are super cute, but they come out of nowhere. um All right, so as I was saying, the type five being in the head triad, the eight can learn from them on how to slow down, to think things through and gather information before charging ahead.
00:21:44
KateLynn Bundy
And on the flip side, from the type two in the heart triad, they can learn to tune into their emotions, what which we're gonna get into. um They can tune into their own emotions as well as other people's emotions. So their power doesn't bulldoze their compassion, right? So pro tip. For my type eight, surround yourself with fives and twos, just the healthy ones though. Okay.
00:22:09
KateLynn Bundy
Trust me. That's a good move. That's smart. But out in the wild, eights are usually the easiest people to spot. They've got presents, baby. You feel them when they walk into a room.
00:22:23
KateLynn Bundy
But that same strength can make them a little tricky to deal with because getting their way often feels non-negotiable. Big emphasis on often.
00:22:35
KateLynn Bundy
But, and it's a big but, when they are healthy, all that confidence and willpower comes from pure magic. Instead of trying to control everything, They channel that energy into building something really good. They use their power not just to protect themselves, but to transform the world around them in bold, lasting ways. Okay?
Healthy Eights: Justice and Influence
00:23:02
KateLynn Bundy
That was a long intro. I don't care. So the let's talk about the fun stuff first, because why not?
00:23:12
KateLynn Bundy
and that And because also that intro section may have scared off the non-8s to ever encountering a type 8 ever again. If it sounds a little scary, it's not. um But yeah, so a type 8 can be easy to spot, but a healthy type 8, that's a different story. They may not be as easy to spot in the wild. Okay, let's get into it. So at their best, eights are powerhouses of justice and protection. A deep sense of right and wrong, right? Like Chris Hansen and oh my God, Nancy Grace is a classic type eight. I know I'm not wrong about that either. She is my absolute favorite and always has the best one-liners that will just shut you up.
00:24:01
KateLynn Bundy
I would be intimidated to like cross paths with her on some, no, ah i've they I've thought about that scenario so many times. Like, anyway, so these are the people who stand up to bullies. They defend the underdog and say what everyone else is afraid to say. It's my favorite thing in the world to do.
00:24:23
KateLynn Bundy
solely because of people's reactions it's so funny and kind of refreshing but there are the kids in class who tell the teacher yeah that's not fair but also me is not really me as a kid because I was the youngest of all boys who were type a like a as an apple type A personalities, and my father as well, who is also a type eight, eight, the number. um Yeah, I wasn't speaking up much, right? You can probably guess as a woman how that affected me. But as an adult, I have learned to step into this part of my personality. Because an an adult, you know, let's say you're in a business meeting, they can call out the hypocrisy or something, right respectfully.
00:25:14
KateLynn Bundy
Well, mostly respectfully. But healthy eights use their strength to empower others, not dominate them or bulldoze them.
00:25:24
KateLynn Bundy
Key difference. they They can look at you and just say hey, girl, you've got power too. You can speak up. Use it. Use your strengths to advocate for yourself.
00:25:35
KateLynn Bundy
oof Love doing that. So they're courageous, decisive, and honest to the point of refreshing. You never have to wonder what an eight thinks because they'll tell you. Sometimes even if you didn't ask. Sorry.
00:25:51
KateLynn Bundy
Eights are people of action and surprisingly sharp intuition. They don't just dream up the big old ideas. They make them happen. They've got vision and a deep satisfaction out of being constructive, both literally like building a business and then figuratively like repairing their relationship after burning it down in a heated argument. Okay.
00:26:18
KateLynn Bundy
But that's the magic of eights. Their creativity is practical. They love starting from scratch, turning chaos into structure, junk into potential. And they'll see like a garbage garage full of garbage and somehow like see the business opportunity in it. Right. And or they'll meet that little kid that everyone else has written off and then see a future CEO.
00:26:44
KateLynn Bundy
Right. They see potential in the dirt. Right. Eight's. empower. That's their key word and also their superpower, okay? They live by the saying, give him man a fish, he eats for a day, teach him to fish, and he eats for life, right? That's how the saying goes, you know what i mean? But most eights learn to fish by sheer necessity because they've been doing it solo since day one. Also,
00:27:13
KateLynn Bundy
Honor is a big deal as well. This, their, their word means something. When an eight says, you have my word, that says binding is a contract to them. They appreciate directness and they also expect it in return. I know that's hard, but they don't crumble if you don't like their honesty. Okay. They might just roll their eyes and think you're a loss. Okay. So, and respect is absolutely central for eights, both giving and receiving it, right?
00:27:44
KateLynn Bundy
um They feel injustice like a gut punch and can't stand watching someone get steamrolled. oh I hate that. They'll step in, they'll speak up or throw themselves into the middle of a mess if it means protecting somebody who's vulnerable. That's that soft heart under all of that armor. It's there, I promise. But here's the thing.
00:28:08
KateLynn Bundy
Control isn't actually the goal for a healthy eight. What they really want is influence. the kind that changes things for the better. The difference is ginormous. True power doesn't come from forcing outcomes or muscling people into submission. it comes from inner strength, from being grounded and unshakably yourself. And healthy eights realize that by trying... um No, healthy eights realize that trying to control everything is just another prison, right? Real freedom, that's when you when the eight trusts the world enough to unclench their fists and deal and lead with strength that's steady, not loud.
00:28:58
KateLynn Bundy
That's key. So I kind of spoiled it earlier, but I'm circling back to the little arrows for our type eights. So when an eight grows and starts to really level up in their life and they move toward that heart space of the type two, okay? And I got to say, type twos are basically the emotional support animals of the Enneagram.
00:29:21
KateLynn Bundy
Sorry, guys. Actually, they love it. Who cares? they The type two, a healthy type two really represents the eight's inner child, that innocence that was once lost, that part of us that actually cares, and dare I say,
00:29:36
KateLynn Bundy
loves love, I'd take a bullet for my type twos, seriously. But here's the thing, eights don't need to add anything to become more loving, trusting, or open. It's already there. They just need to reconnect with their heart and remember how much they actually care about people. Kids and pets are usually the ones who easily sneak past the eights defenses. Like, I don't know, i can be all all tough and mighty out in the world, but the second I'm around my cats, I'm just a different person.
00:30:16
KateLynn Bundy
ah But the kids and pets, they bring out this protective instinct that says you're just so small and little and innocent and I will destroy anybody who messes with you.
00:30:27
KateLynn Bundy
yeah It's beautiful and terrifying all at once. It's just chaos. But to really embrace that big heartedness, eights have to do something scarier than leading armies or starting businesses.
Compassion and Vulnerability in Leadership
00:30:41
KateLynn Bundy
They got to trust. Trust something beyond their own grit and control. And that means lowering the walls that they've spent a lifetime building because underneath all that armor, there's still that sensitive little kid who decided, I'll never get hurt again.
00:30:59
KateLynn Bundy
And that part never really dies. It just waits for permission to come out and breathe again. Okay. And when eights integrate onto this side, they become incredible leaders, the kind who lead with both power and compassion.
00:31:15
KateLynn Bundy
They have respect for people's boundaries and their own personal limits as well. They start realizing that rest isn't weakness, it's wisdom. They work hard, but they also know want know when it's time to eat something that's not just a protein bar and then like actually relax. They choose things that restore them instead of just chasing the next adrenaline spike or overindulging, right? And when that happens, their strength becomes magnetic, not intimidating, okay?
00:31:47
KateLynn Bundy
So next segment, you should have a little like swoosh, little sound effect. But yeah, so like every type, there's a shout aside.
00:31:59
KateLynn Bundy
This is where it can get scary for people, for the eights anyway, or the opposite. Anyway, so imagine an eight in a relationship. I'm about to expose myself here.
00:32:12
KateLynn Bundy
Their partner can say something like, hey, I feel like you're not really hearing me. And the type eight will respond like something like this. They'll go, oh, I hear you.
00:32:23
KateLynn Bundy
i just don't agree.
00:32:27
KateLynn Bundy
boy, the times I've busted out that line. But when a type eight is pressed, they might just shut down emotionally, not because they don't care. Okay. But because emotional exposure feels like walking into a battlefield unarmed, right? Which is true. I tend to shut down personally before versus just exploding with rage. My rage comes out in other areas of my life in a healthy way. um Put a pin in that because we got to talk about the AIDS anger problems.
00:32:59
KateLynn Bundy
Sorry. No, I'm not sorry. So it's not that eights don't have feelings. It's that their feelings are so intense, hence the rage, they keep them locked behind a steel door with a do not enter sign, right? And so when eights feel unsafe or betrayed, their protective instincts can turn into control, right?
00:33:25
KateLynn Bundy
instincts, right? They might get domineering, aggressive, even more confrontational, and they push instead of connect. And all that beautiful strength that's meant to protect and help others can start to hurt the people around them. And at their worst, they they be bulldozing. Hello, daddy issues.
00:33:48
KateLynn Bundy
Oh, geez. Yeah, my dad's an eight, like I said, but don't worry, we're not opening that can of worms right now. But their truth telling becomes steamrolling. Their leadership becomes my way or the highway. Okay. But what is really going on underneath all that? This is where curiosity really needs to come in. And with anything, like if you're in a disagreement with no matter what type they are, curiosity is a game changer in those moments.
00:34:20
KateLynn Bundy
So moving on, what's really going on underneath all that steamrolling and bulldozing and my way or the highway for the eight, it's usually fear. Okay. Fear of being weak, fear of being blindsided, fear of being, of depending on someone who could just let them down. And instead of admitting the fear, because that's vulnerable, they double down on power.
00:34:47
KateLynn Bundy
Eight's move through life with this deep instinct to protect themselves, which can quietly morph into a fear of depending on anyone, right? Four and eight, needing help can feel like losing power. Like you've just handed someone the keys to your emotional fortress. So they go into battle mode, always ready for resistance. Life starts to feel like one long wrestling match with people, systems, or traffic lights, which is so counterintuitive because the more you're ready for resistance, the more you're going to get it.
00:35:23
KateLynn Bundy
Think about that. But as long as the eights are calling the shots, they can breathe. But the kicker is like nobody's actually self-sufficient. Okay. Even the most independent of eights, they need people to build, to grow and to thrive. Okay. And if an eight could actually step back and look at their life objectively, they'd probably see that they've they're they're already deeply connected to and dependent on a lot of people. But that realization can trigger...
00:35:58
KateLynn Bundy
They're two big spheres and what are those? Dependency and betrayal. So instead of acknowledging it, they double down on the I'll just do it myself narrative and end up shouldering everything. Oh, what's that character, the Disney one in Kanto? What's her name? the The super strong one. That's such a really, really beautiful depiction of what we're talking about about right here. How she's just like carrying everything and like she's just really tired at the end of the day and scared of being weak.
00:36:31
KateLynn Bundy
Oh, that one got me. ah But um I just went off script there. But yeah, so... They end up shouldering everything, the type eight. They convince themselves they're the only ones pulling the weight and that if just others worked as hard as they did, the world would run a lot smoother.
00:36:53
KateLynn Bundy
Now let's talk about boundaries, okay? Because that word might as well be tattooed on the bicep of every single type eight. Boundaries are their oxygen. Like I am not joking. Eights love straight talk and get suspicious the second someone starts sugarcoating something, beating around the bush. And when other types start tiptoeing around feelings, eights are like, bruh, spit it out already. Land the plane.
00:37:23
KateLynn Bundy
Meanwhile... Other people can are usually often stunned by how blunt we can be, but that intensity is really about safety here. They need to know where the lines are. That's in what's okay, what's not okay, where you end, and where they can begin.
00:37:45
KateLynn Bundy
and trust me, Please trust me on this. It's figure out boundaries the hard way by pushing them. It's not personal. It's just data collection. Okay, please understand that. They test the limits to see how strong the connection is, right? If I'm in a relationship, I i love in a way, it sounds really toxic, but going toe to toe with somebody on something deepens my connection with them. Because I'm like, can they really stand up to this? Do they have a little?
00:38:18
KateLynn Bundy
heart of their own? they Can they muscle this around? That's what the eight does. This is one of the harder lessons I have learned in my life and still struggle with from time to time. i thought that being open about, like I would tell people, hey, I need to ask you certain questions, what I thought were the right questions, so I know where your boundaries are. And I would be very explicit and clear. um And so I'm asking what I thought were the right questions to figure out where this line is. But they often, eat one, didn't know or thought it was some other thing. So they may have answered my question, but realized they were wrong because I found it for them.
00:39:04
KateLynn Bundy
it gets me in trouble so much. or At least it did in the past, but that's the eight way. We find out where the line is by accidentally stepping over it. So for my non eight listeners, pro pro tip, find the strength.
00:39:21
KateLynn Bundy
Please find it somewhere in you to be equally as direct with them. That will shut them up. I promise you, if you can just be like, hey, that's not okay because of XYZ and don't treat me like that ever again. They'll be like, oh, good to know. Thank you. Like they're you're not shaking them. You're not hurting them. They'll have a new higher respect for you and your boundary.
00:39:48
KateLynn Bundy
God, please trust me. I'm not joking. ah But because of their communication style, they come off, they can come off as like angry, critical, or just like argumentative in a way. And problem part of the problem is that they don't know their own strength and use more energy than necessary for for too many things. And a good test of this, like, you know, tomorrow or whatever you're doing right now, um see, are are you writing something? How tightly are you gripping that pen? Or how much grip do you have sweeping the kitchen? Or do you are you clenching your jaw for no goddamn reason, right? Is it necessary to have that much tension for what you're doing?
00:40:37
KateLynn Bundy
Probably not. And that applies to how you approach life, people, and conversations. You can soften the tension and still be yourself. But the more unhealthy, that's not that kind of but, moving on but, the The more unhealthy and insecure a type eight is, the more likely they will be to aggressively assert themselves, ironically, creating more resistance and less cooperation in others. So on our diagram, the stress arrow for eight points to five, which is we already mentioned. So what does that mean in real life, though?
00:41:18
KateLynn Bundy
Well, even the most aggressive,
Stress Reactions and Solitude
00:41:21
KateLynn Bundy
assertive, take-charge eight can only push their usual problem-solving tactics so far before things start to feel too much for them. When life piles on, deadlines are there, or people won't cooperate, the eight can hit a wall, and that's when they go to that five. In other words, they retreat.
00:41:42
KateLynn Bundy
permit They strategize, they buy more time and gather information and they recharge those batteries before diving back in. And during these stress moments, eights can turn into solitary figures. They'll spend everything.
00:41:57
KateLynn Bundy
Hours hold up thinking, reading, plotting, and generally just brooding over how to handle everything without losing that edge, right? They demand privacy in space, which they see as essential for regaining control. Think of like that evil guy in their little den.
00:42:17
KateLynn Bundy
I should have thought of a fun character for that example. But like the type five, stressed eight can become hyper-experienced excuse me, hyper-focused on their plans and projects. They might seem quieter, more withdrawn, almost unrecognizable to anyone used to their really bold, passionate, and confrontational energy. And honestly, that sudden detachment can be a little disconcerting because one minute they're leading and taking the charge,
00:42:48
KateLynn Bundy
And the next, they're off in their own mental fortress plotting their next move. I remember when my marriage was falling apart, people would be around me. and They're like, they didn't recognize me. It just, I'm sure you've encountered people like that too.
00:43:02
KateLynn Bundy
But yeah, so I could keep going on and on with all this stuff, just like with all the other types. it' It's hard to know when to stop. But Future episodes, we'll dive deeper into these shadow types or shadow sides. Okay. So quickly, let's talk about our wings. This adds the absolute flavor profile for any type. um And for the type eight, your wings are seven or nine.
00:43:27
KateLynn Bundy
Not literally one or the other. you can be a little fluid, but you tend to like lean more toward one side typically. But so the eight wing seven, i and not the eight wing seven, but I relate to it a lot. And if I'm out on vacation, yeah. This is your girl. But eights, these eights are extra, extra fire. They're bold, energetic, fun, and a little, a little reckless. Picture the action hero with like a business plan or something like that.
00:44:01
KateLynn Bundy
Eight wing sevens say things like, rules are just suggestions, right? They want to make things happen now. And they've got the charisma to make people follow and make it happen. They're the let's build an empire kind of eights. High energy, passionate and magnetic.
00:44:19
KateLynn Bundy
Yes, queen. Downside though, they can bulldoze people and burn out super fast. Think Tony Stark. This is what, he reminds me of that. The eight wing nine is our bear.
00:44:33
KateLynn Bundy
This is where I'm at. The eight with the chillest vibe. And I'm not tooting my own horn. These are actual facts, guys. Seriously. These eights are calmer, steadier, a little more grounded, still strong, but with a quiet, steady power like a mountain, not a storm. They're more patient, more diplomatic, and a little bit harder to read. So think of them as the ah gentle giant version of the eight. But when they're unhealthy, they can become stubborn or really passive aggressive, like a volcano that's calm until it ain't. So like the eight wing sevens, they can walk into a room and be like, let's start a revolution and get margaritas after.
00:45:20
KateLynn Bundy
Which that sounds awesome. But the eight wing nine can walk and be like, all right, let's keep the peace, but don't test me. So accurate.
00:45:31
KateLynn Bundy
All right, so our type eights, we love to move forward, right? We need action steps. What
Practicing Vulnerability and Trust
00:45:39
KateLynn Bundy
now? What can we do to actually help our eights grow and become better people? Because for all of their strengths, the journey for the eight isn't about more power. It's about softer power.
00:45:53
KateLynn Bundy
Some of these practices are from my favorite book, The Wisdom of the Enneagram. So first off, you're not going like it. Practice vulnerability.
00:46:04
KateLynn Bundy
I know, I said it again, and I'm not going to stop. Vulnerability, it ain't weakness, guys. I know it's cliche to say that and in today's world, but it's courage. For an eight, saying I'm hurt or I need help It might feel like climbing Mount Everest barefoot.
00:46:23
KateLynn Bundy
Okay. But every time they let their guard down, they make space for real intimacy. Okay. Start small if you have to, instead of controlling every outcome, try trusting somebody with a piece of your heart or to-do list. Again, i know it sounds cliche to get in touch with your feelings, but it's so helpful for our eights. Rage or anger typically is the very first emotion a type eight has.
00:46:54
KateLynn Bundy
If you find that they have a short fuse. it can... so it can ah So it's usually like the first, I lost my train of thought. Rage or anger typically is a very first emotion innate has because it scares off what's hurting them, right? So I implore you that the next time you feel your blood boiling and you're about to explode,
00:47:18
KateLynn Bundy
not joking, literally count to 10. Take a step back. Let that anger and that rage come and go like a wave in the ocean and ask yourself once that, you know, you get to 10 or something, um what then? What are you feeling now? What's the next emotions that you're starting to feel? Are you hurt, sad, frustrated? Knowing the real Emotion in these moments will project you so much further down your path of growth. It's incredible. And then especially if, you know, in those moments you're arguing with your spouse and you can say, um sorry, exploded. Sorry about the anger. This is what I'm really feeling.
00:48:03
KateLynn Bundy
Talk about a game changer. Seriously. But that kind of vulnerability lets others know that they matter, okay? Then that you actually care about them. I'm not saying you should walk around with your heart on your sleeve, okay? Ew. But denying your hurt or acting out in anger is never ever the solution. Okay.
00:48:27
KateLynn Bundy
Next, notice your intensity. We touched on this. Eights don't realize how big their energy is. I have to remind myself often and other people remind me of it too. um Sometimes AIDS can think it's about them, they're just being honest, but others feel like they've been hit with like a truth grenade, right?
00:48:48
KateLynn Bundy
You can still say what you want to say. Just practice softening the delivery. The message can be just as strong without the boom, okay? You're not changing who you are to accommodate the feelings of others, right?
00:49:02
KateLynn Bundy
Okay. Alter your body language, your tone and gracefully deliver what you have to say i learned very young. I will say and learned very young that, um I would speak in like a factual way that had people being like, fuck you Like, I don't care what you're saying. Like they just wouldn't hear. i want what I was saying to be absorbed and considered. So I figured out this little trick.
00:49:32
KateLynn Bundy
It's so funny. The littlest changes to your vocabulary can have a huge difference. So I started being like, you know, I read somewhere or um I saw this TikTok video that said XYZ blah, blah, blah.
00:49:45
KateLynn Bundy
I'm lying out my ass because I may have seen it on TikTok or I may have read it somewhere, but I don't remember that. I'm just softening the delivery and being like, you know what? like And what does that tone sound like? It's curiosity of like, what do you think about this? Versus just being like, that ain't true. x y Z, this and that fact, okay?
00:50:07
KateLynn Bundy
But that the littlest little changes, man, I'm telling you. But also, moving on. Eights, work hard and play hard. Amen. That that glass of wine is gonna taste good. Guess what? So does the rest of the bottle. So question your need for intensity here.
00:50:24
KateLynn Bundy
Where does that come from? What would happen to you or your life if it were a little less intense?
Emotional Expression and Support Systems
00:50:30
KateLynn Bundy
For me, it came from being the youngest child of a big family and the only girl. And I had to be loud and I had to be really big just to get the simplest accommodations.
00:50:43
KateLynn Bundy
Trust me, I had the best childhood. i wouldn't change it for the world. But next, you're not going to like this one either. But grief work is extremely helpful for our eights.
00:50:55
KateLynn Bundy
We're not the kind of people to sit around feeling sorry for ourselves for too long, right? But if you are suffering, it is so important for you to find constructive ways of grieving your losses and your hurts. That tough shell of yours is there for a reason. So it might be time to explore what some of those reasons are. In my growth journey, I remember having a lot of really big shower cries, crying in the shower. And letting me, allowing myself to feel something from situations that happened way long before that, right? And letting it actually affect me before. And therefore, it's like, I'm relieved of them. The bucket's empty. The shoulders are lighter, okay? Yeah.
00:51:41
KateLynn Bundy
Next, find your inner circle. It isn't gonna be big. Eights generally have a really hearty sense of camaraderie and enjoy really good times with others, but that's not the same thing as intimacy.
00:51:56
KateLynn Bundy
okay Find your inner circle. People that you can really trust and those you can really talk to about what's going on with you or what you're struggling with. I have an inner circle and then I have even more of an inner circle of those who I can truly like word vomit onto without...
00:52:17
KateLynn Bundy
Without thinking and they hear me and they absorb it. It's not too much for them. Right. And they do it without judgment. And so if you have someone like that, um I dare you to open up a little bit more or to someone that you feel like would be a good candidate for this.
00:52:33
KateLynn Bundy
And don't also, don't presume that they don't want to hear about your struggles or feelings, okay? Okay. Lastly, um let's take a look at how you handle the idea of rejection. Do you catch yourself expecting people not to like you?
00:52:54
KateLynn Bundy
I've met people like that. Ugh, those fuckers. Or, Sorry. um Hey, you know what? i've We've all been there in some way, probably. But do you catch yourself expecting people not to like you or do you act in ways that try to um dodge rejection?
00:53:17
KateLynn Bundy
Before it happens, for the type eights, this underlying fear often fuels that sense of being on guard or alone. And if you're not careful, it's eventually what sparks your anger. Counterproductive, right? We all get angry or a little hateful when we feel repeatedly rejected. But the kicker here is that sometimes...
00:53:41
KateLynn Bundy
hear me out, the signals that you're sending out to others, your intensity, your testing of boundaries, your i don't need anyone energy can read as rejection to the people around
Overcoming Fear of Rejection
00:53:54
KateLynn Bundy
you.
00:53:54
KateLynn Bundy
Not because you actually mean it but because your own fear and self-projection gets projected outward. Okay. Basically you might be scaring people off while trying not to get hurt. Classic eight move. And this leads us back to and the vulnerability issue. The good feelings that you want are only going to touch you to the to the degree that you allow yourself to be affected.
00:54:22
KateLynn Bundy
going to say that again because I don't think you heard me. Okay. The good feelings that you want are only going to touch you to the degree that you allow yourself to be effective, affected.
00:54:37
KateLynn Bundy
Think about that. Chew on it. All right. All right. My fearless, opinionated, and beautifully overqualified eights.
00:54:48
KateLynn Bundy
We did it. You made it through an entire episode without taking over the mic because you couldn't. But I'm impressed you got this far and give yourself a little pat, okay? But in all seriousness, if you're an eight, hear me when I say this, okay? You don't have to hold the world up by yourself. You don't have to be the strongest person in every room. Your power doesn't disappear when you soften, it expands. You don't have to walk into a room at the level 10,
00:55:21
KateLynn Bundy
You can walk in there at the four or the three and still be who you are and let people in. Let yourself rest. Let someone else drive for once, even if it's to the grocery store. Because when you stop guarding your heart like a fortress, that's when your real strength shows up.
00:55:40
KateLynn Bundy
It's the kind that heals, not just conquers, okay? And to the rest of you, if you love a type eight, just remember behind all that intensity is the world's most loyal protector who would burn down a building, a village, ah city, the world for you lovingly. But again, if this episode hit home, send it to your favorite eight or the person you're slightly afraid might actually be one. If you think so, you're probably right.
00:56:13
KateLynn Bundy
And always remember, you're not broken. You're just still you. Okay? See you next time, friends. Start, try not to start any coups before then. All right?
00:56:25
KateLynn Bundy
Peace out.