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Power-ranking potential Sounders stadium locations
2.7k Plays6 days ago
Yes, Jeremiah and Aaron discuss the most recent Sounders’ loss, but they also unveiled a new feature they’re tentatively calling ‘power rankings’ in which they choose a topic surrounding the Sounders and … rank them.
In their first power ranking, the look at potential sites for a new Sounders stadium. Spoiler alert: they are not really loving the idea of moving from downtown Seattle to Longacres.
They also talk to Kelyn Rowe about playing for Ballard FC in tonight’s U.S. Open Cup match against Spokane Velocity.
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Transcript
Sponsorship and Wine Background
00:00:02
Speaker
This episode of Nos Arietes is sponsored by Full Pull Wines, a Seattle-based wine retailer and proud sponsor of Nos Arietes since 2011. Full Pull was founded in 2009, is based in Seattle, and is owned and operated by longtime Sounders supporters.
00:00:16
Speaker
They offer the best boutique wines of the world to members of their mailing list, with special focus on their home, Pacific Northwest.
Podcast Host and Guests
00:00:25
Speaker
Hi, I'm Will Bruin, and I was just recognized as a Seattle Sounders legend. Now i get to do voice reads for the Sounder at Heart Podcast Network. Come on!
00:00:36
Speaker
Hey, O'Shea! Let's go! I'm sorry, Mike Fry! The Seattle Sounders have done it! I don't know!
00:00:57
Speaker
sounder that has come niola so
00:01:31
Speaker
sounder hard commentary that we didnt take o
00:01:41
Speaker
welcome back to another episode of no aatdi on the center her podcast network We are sponsored by Full Pull Wines and our subscribers. Today is March 18th, 2025, and I am your host, Jeremiah Oshan. Joining me today is my co-host, Aaron Campo, and our engineer, Lickett.
00:01:58
Speaker
Later in the show, we'll have an interview with new Ballard FC player, Kellen Rowe, who will be playing in the U.S. Open Cup on Wednesday.
Sounders vs. St. Louis Match Analysis
00:02:06
Speaker
Well, pretty bummer of a week ended with a relative thud on Saturday when the Sounders lost 1-0 to St. Louis City.
00:02:12
Speaker
It wasn't so much ah that they lost, but more how reminiscent that loss was of last year's struggles. The Sounders mostly dominated possession, were active defensively, but couldn't find a goal and really weren't that dangerous.
00:02:25
Speaker
So, Aaron, I guess the question is, how freaked ah out are you basically off of two bad games? A week ago, we were flying high. Yeah, we were rolling.
00:02:36
Speaker
Yeah, it's ah you know, the Cruises will game um was deflating, but kind of, you know, whatever. I mean, we we talked about it, I think last week because we were right after the game. Yeah. um So it's just i'm never going to get too broken up about losing to what I think is frankly a better team ah in the Champions League, especially that early. But the St. Louis game.
00:03:02
Speaker
I'm also not going to freak out too much about, um, St. Louis is an exceptionally good defensive team. They got really lucky to get a free they did. They've not allowed any goals in four games. Not allowed, to not allowed to go and a goal in four games. You're right.
00:03:15
Speaker
Um, they got really lucky to get that free kick where they did. I think Jackson Reagan made the smart play there. Um, that's if not a goal, that's as close as you're going to get to ah goal, um, without seeing how it ends. I think, uh,
00:03:31
Speaker
I guess unless you're the Timbers and, ah you know, stoppage time. um And then, you know, a fantastic free kick that on first watch, I thought Stephen Fry maybe could have done a little better with on repeat watches.
00:03:44
Speaker
Don't really think there's anybody to blame for that one. I mean, he... like Like, let's talk about that a little bit. That was a really nice free kick. And I was surprised at how many people were like, oh, the wall barely jumped and Fry got off, got a bad, in it like, i don't know, man.
00:04:00
Speaker
He bends that thing over the wall about as well as you can bend, like as you can get it up and down. I mean, that thing has so much top spin. And and it basically hits the side. And then when you beat the wall like that, the goalie is always at a disadvantage. Like the the reason the wall is set up is to keep them from going near post.
00:04:21
Speaker
And once they beat the wall, the it's it's always going to be tough for the goalie to make that save. It is. Yeah. And I mean, it's there's not a lot you can do. It's definitely a tip your cap situation when somebody hits a free kick that well.
00:04:36
Speaker
Even if you're nitpicking and you can say, oh, maybe he should have have gotten a slightly better jump. Maybe the wall should have, you know, jumped a little earlier, earlier, whatever it is. It was about as inch perfect as a free kick can get.
00:04:49
Speaker
And, you know, that was relatively early in the game. I thought the Sounders looked pretty, pretty good in the attack early on. And from there on out, St. Louis had absolutely no interest in and attacking.
00:05:00
Speaker
And hey, that's their prerogative. um Olaf Melberg is a guy that that I love dearly, and he is going to coach his the teams really well defensively. And he did. And, you know, with the the guys the Sounders were missing, um the the fact that they had just played midweek at altitude It was always going to
Sounders' Recent Challenges and Injuries
00:05:20
Speaker
be an uphill battle. And then I think just with the circumstances being what they were early in the game, given up kind of a flukish kind of goal, it was always going to be a long road back. And that doesn't mean not a frustrating result, because I do think that I think people are underrating St. Louis.
00:05:36
Speaker
But I do think that's a team that the Sounders are more than capable of getting a result against. But also, you know, it's it's a game that in isolation I'm just not really too worried about. You're not going to win every game.
00:05:49
Speaker
i don't think the team is going to compete for a supporter shield. I think Miami is going to run away with it again, based on the way things have gone so far. ah And, you know, so not a big deal. Right. But I think in the context of the injuries, the Sounders have had losing that game, you know, for one, even going back to the Charlotte game, i think that if the Sounders had won that Charlotte game and not drawn,
00:06:14
Speaker
even that makes things feel better, even though it was what, like a month ago. I'd say, yeah. um Now you're in a situation where you've won one game all year. You've, you've, you've got four points from four, four now, um four points. And that's, you know, but yeah, that's, that's not horrendous. They've got a reasonably light schedule coming up, but I think people were so ready to be excited about this team.
00:06:39
Speaker
And, especially after the LAFC game. I think people thought that it was, you know, back to champagne football and back to easy street. And now it's not going to feel it. Not, not quite as much feeling that way. And I think even if the Sounders are able to be competitive to pick up some points, pick up some results,
00:06:56
Speaker
if the way the St. Louis game went as any indication, maybe it's not going to be as much fun as the LAFC game was, or even the Charlotte game was right. So that's kind of a bummer. um But hopefully guys can get healthy on schedule and and the Sounders can kind of grind it out in their absence. And we're not in too deep of a hole once things are back to full strength.
00:07:15
Speaker
Yeah. i'm I'm like, I wouldn't say I'm pressing the panic button at all. And I, I would even say the prospects of them. getting some results in the short term or not that remote.
00:07:30
Speaker
I think what has, which was so tough about this week was sort of the real, as especially the St. Louis game was sort of this slap across the face of, you know, it, it might not be fun.
00:07:44
Speaker
Like this is a team who I fully expect to make the playoffs, who I expect to be good. once they're everyone's playing together and I, I still like this team when healthy, but for the next month, at least they're probably not going to be remotely full strength.
00:08:04
Speaker
You know, they're Jordan and Pedro are two big pieces of this team and, and they just aren't going to be there ah for, for that time.
00:08:14
Speaker
And, and they're part of a big part of what makes this a fun team to watch Now, could that change if Jesus comes out on Saturday and balls out?
00:08:25
Speaker
Hey, I'm ready to start over again, I guess. But I think what's so tough about this week was sort of this. It was just like dragging you back down into the muck of, well, they get results, but they're but.
00:08:41
Speaker
They aren't always fun to watch. And I really genuinely thought this was going to be a different team. And it obviously still could be. But I think the negative emotions around this team, like I'll say this.
00:08:55
Speaker
ah Someone said, hey, if they don't give up that free kick, that's a that's a ah good result on the road. And I think there's some truth to that. That is a good result on the road, but I don't think the freak out would be any different.
00:09:08
Speaker
I think people are mostly reacting to just not scoring. It's not that they think this is a bad team. It's just that it's not a very fun team and they weren't that, and they just weren't a fun team to watch.
00:09:19
Speaker
You know, if Obed gets, gets that penalty, and they score it and you come out with a late equalizer, i think you maybe feel a little bit better about it, but it's that zero that really just hangs over you.
00:09:31
Speaker
And i don't have a, I don't, other than to say, hopefully we get, we feel different after this week. I don't have a real, a real response to anyone who is just frustrated with playing sloggy football right now.
00:09:50
Speaker
Yeah, I totally get it. And I think it' it's unfortunate for many reasons, but it's unfortunate that these injuries happened when they did, because I think if the Sounders had played the kind of football they played against LAFC and Charlotte to some extent for an extended period of time, and then you lose these guys for a month yeah or six weeks or however long it's going to be, you have the proof of concept over time. right So when you say...
00:10:16
Speaker
look, like, it's not exciting right now, but that's because we're missing the horses. But we know that this team, when it's at full strength, is really good. But we've had one and a half-ish games of seeing that. And I'm still a believer that they that they can be that.
00:10:28
Speaker
But I don't blame anyone else for being skeptical. And also for just, like... Being like, all right, well, I guess I can start paying attention and, you know, August or whatever. Right. um Yeah. And it's it's a bummer. It's really unfortunate. So I'm hopeful that they're obviously not going to be as much fun to watch as they are with Jordan and Pedro.
00:10:46
Speaker
But I'm hopeful that, you know, with with a full week of training with I'm assuming either Jesus playing at the nine or Jesus kind of understanding a little bit more what his role is going to be without Jordan and and Pedro.
00:11:00
Speaker
um that they can, you know, get some cohesion because I did, I did see a lot of decent stuff happening that just fell apart towards the end. Yeah. And, and I think there is something to to be said for the fact that these guys hadn't had a chance to practice together with Jesus playing at the nine, barely at all, if at all.
00:11:19
Speaker
um And you know, that he's still kind of one day of training, two days of training, right. Right. And he's still, I mean, getting integrated into the team in the first place. um So, you know, I'm hopeful that they can be a little more fun than they were against St. Louis, who, you know, again, on the road, really good defensive team, short rest um at home against Houston. Maybe it's it's a different story. Maybe they can come out a little more positively and if not be as exciting as they have been show some basic competence in the final third would be would be a start.
00:11:53
Speaker
Yeah, that would be that would be a good start. You know, and and i do it is important to note, this is still an Albert Rusnak who has looked good, frankly, most of the time that he's played this year. he he's he's he was good He's been good in most of the games. or he's been I guess he wasn't great against RSL and he wasn't great against...
00:12:15
Speaker
against St. Louis, but he was really good against LAFC. He was really good in the Antigua games ah when he played at least. So I don't know. I'm, I'm, I'm on the fence a little bit. He was good against ah Charlotte.
00:12:30
Speaker
I'll add. So, you know, i i am still hopeful. I am. i really am. And it's going to be interesting. seeing how much Georgie plays as well.
00:12:42
Speaker
This is a player who it's funny because it's really easy to get excited about him in short spurts because you just see him going at tired legs.
00:12:53
Speaker
yeah Even when he was, when he started this year, it's been, I guess he's been up and down in the, in his starts, but when he's, he he is a player who you, you see what's exciting about him. It's not, it's not hard ah to appreciate what he does well.
00:13:10
Speaker
But when he starts, you sort of see the bigger picture and how there are holes in his game and how he doesn't quite have the polish that you really want to see. And he's, i think, hugely improved this year.
00:13:24
Speaker
He's got, you know, the fact that he has three assists already is, I think, a really positive sign. But this is a player who has never put up big numbers at any level. And so three assists is a step forward.
00:13:37
Speaker
But like, I think maybe the best example of the the yin and yang of his game was, you know, he had this great run through the middle of the field. yeah in the second half, I believe.
00:13:51
Speaker
And he, or no, i guess was, that was in the first half and he has Ferreira on his right all alone. And he's not a selfish player. So I don't think this is a thing where he's, but for whatever reason, he he decided to shoot
Player Focus and Team Training
00:14:05
Speaker
and he did not,
00:14:07
Speaker
put it very close to goal. And if he had just sort of laid it off to Ferreira, that would have been a much better chance. And I, you know, this is the kind of player kind of mistake you, you expect to see somewhat from a inexperienced player, but I would hope that in the future, they're just finding each other better that, that he is, you know, cause this George gegie iss going to be a big part of this team for the next month. It's, or is at least I would think.
00:14:35
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. It's, it is, it is, uh, it's why I think I always want people to pump the brakes when they start talking about the ceiling of, of guys like Georgie, because I think the more tape teams have on him, the, uh, you know, the more, uh,
00:14:51
Speaker
they're going to be able to adjust to what he does well. And I think when he's not running at tired legs, like you said, when he's coming in and playing against guys who are full strength, it's just going to be tougher to make that stuff happen. And his decision-making, as you alluded to, is is still a work in progress.
00:15:05
Speaker
ah But he's so close that if he can figure out that stuff, you know, if he can, if he can find another move beyond just beat guys to the end line, and if he can get a little better in his decision-making that is going to unlock a pretty special player. And so maybe that's the upside of him getting, you know, the sort of forced play time over the next month, six weeks or so, is that he's going to get those real world reps and opportunities against higher level competition. ah Because he hasn't started very much in MLS. I i think, what, like three or four games at most, I ah would imagine. So without looking it up.
00:15:41
Speaker
And, you know, I think just getting those reps is precious. MLX Next Pro just isn't the same no level of competition. And so stuff that works there is maybe not going to work in MLS. And I think, you know, having a chance to get that run out um is either going to give us a much better idea of what his limitations are or give him an opportunity to sort of break through those limitations.
00:16:04
Speaker
So my other big sort of big, bigger picture takeaway from that game was Ferreira playing as a number nine. I think like most people, ah came away from my first viewing of that game pretty down on him and thinking like, okay, maybe this is why the Sunners have used him mostly not as a nine.
00:16:22
Speaker
They mostly used him sort of sitting underneath ah usually as a dual 10 and nothing from that game. I don't think it disabused me of thinking that he is better when he's got the ball at his feet a lot and he just did not have a lot of touches in this game.
00:16:39
Speaker
But what the difference I noticed in the rewatch was, is he was making those runs. He was trying to get in behind and he was sort of looking for service.
00:16:50
Speaker
It just was, he wasn't, they weren't finding him for one reason or another. You know, sometimes they they attempted the pass and it just didn't make it through. A lot more times they just didn't attempt the pass. And i guess my takeaway was, look, he's a different kind of number nine than Jordan.
00:17:07
Speaker
And maybe having more training reps with each other will just make him better. ah And I don't think that's an outlandish thing to hope for. you know one One of the things that Christian talked about after the game was they arent they basically don't get to train better.
00:17:24
Speaker
two days in a row. They, at most, their most extensive training is getting two consecutive days of training, but that's almost never real training where they can do go all out. It's a lot of, you know, trying to impart little concepts and doing the bear, you know, trying to maximize limited time because they, they aren't able, they're usually recovering and then prepping and recovering and prepping. There's not a lot of like tactical nuance that they're able to,
00:17:52
Speaker
impart on players. And so they're having to go through film and sort of do it on film. And in that way, i do think it it creates challenges. And that's another part of this upcoming stretch where that's not going to be an excuse anymore. They they did get three days off this week, but then they're going to have three days of training. And then it's going to be regular training sessions after that. They're going to be, you know, one game a week, basically for the next three months, they should be able to make some improvements.
00:18:22
Speaker
And, you know, so I think that there is reason to be hopeful. I just am understanding of why people are a little down in the dumps right now. Yeah, absolutely. i mean, it's it's easy to understand why people feel like they've seen this movie before.
00:18:39
Speaker
And the protagonists are different. Maybe um sporting cast is mostly the same, but some the some of the protagonists. characters are a little different and the circumstances are a little different, but it's still the same formula. Right. And I, I totally get it.
00:18:55
Speaker
And, you know, I, I am hopeful though, that this team is built to weather the storm a little better than last year's words. And instead of grinding their way to draws,
00:19:06
Speaker
they figure out how to win some games, especially at home. um Because that was the part I think that was so frustrating for people last year. It wasn't just that it wasn't the most exciting team to watch. It was that they weren't an exciting team to watch and they were dropping points in really frustrating ways.
00:19:23
Speaker
And I think if they can avoid that for the next six weeks and play well at home and grind out results on the road, they can probably get through it with the vibes mostly still intact.
00:19:34
Speaker
Yeah, well, all I think that's a good place to sort of end on a hopeful note for this segment. We're come back. We're going to talk to do a brief conversation with Kellen Rowe about playing for Ballard FC and and sort of he explains where that all came from.
00:19:49
Speaker
And then we're going to try out a new segment on the show that we're just vaguely calling power rankings right now. This week's power rankings, we're going to talk about power ranking potential Sounders stadium locations, because this promises to be a big story over the next seven or eight years, I suppose, ah next decade, really.
00:20:10
Speaker
And we might as well a good start on that now. ah With that said, I'm Jeremiah. This is Nosadietes. We'll be right back.
00:20:27
Speaker
All right, well, we're we're joined by Kellen Rowe, former Sounders legend, Federal Way legend, and now ah Ballard FC player for the Open
Kellen Rowe's Journey with Ballard FC
00:20:36
Speaker
Cup. ah Welcome to the show, Kellen.
00:20:39
Speaker
Yeah, it's it's been fun. It's been a while for us, huh? Yeah, it has. tell me how this came up. You're you're playing in this U.S. Open Cup. i don't think Did he even play in the U.S. Open Cup for the Sounders?
00:20:52
Speaker
I did, yeah. I played two games for the Sounders in Open Cup. Obviously a bunch of them in New England. Right. But, yeah, it was pretty interesting. I got a call from Lamar and Sam and posted a group text.
00:21:04
Speaker
And it was like, hey, you know, if you guys are available, we'll... We'd love to have you out. And so, you know, Lamar and I laughed about it. um James Riley and I laughed about it. And then when he came down and he took brass tacks, it was like, you know what, this would be a lot of I think I could, you know, provide something and be that old, that kind of that old guy mentor these young ones. And so,
00:21:25
Speaker
we gave it a try and it fits. So I, I don't know if this factors into the decision at all, but this doesn't seem like it was something that was all that common until relatively recently. And now all of a sudden, you know, like with Sasha playing last year and then he's gotten this whole, like kind of former MLS all-star team together now.
00:21:43
Speaker
ah Does that make it a little easier for a decision like this? Or did you, were you even aware of all that stuff going on? Yeah. I remember it last year because they gave us a call. Um, last year, Sasha gave me you a call. And then this year he did as well.
00:21:55
Speaker
And he goes, if you're willing to play and I go, you know what? i got to stay true to my roots and stick with Ballard. It's probably not a good, not a good look. You know, you buy into San Diego and you go to play somewhere else against them. so No, Sasa gave me that call, and i think it's so cool. i You know, I think for a game, two games, three games even, um when these teams are accepted into the Open Cup but maybe not can't field a team and they want to bring excitement to their town, I think what Sasa's doing, bringing those guys together, is just a really cool thing for fans, for those guys to get one last run at a competitive game, enjoy themselves, but also, you know, kind of bring awareness to that town and that team.
00:22:37
Speaker
And so are you are you also a part owner of Ballard FC now? Yes. Okay. And so I guess that does make it a little easier. You know who to call and to... I've got some speed dials.
00:22:50
Speaker
Right. Exactly. Exactly. So have you ever actually played with Lamar? No. We never played with each other. We only played against each other. and it was... when he I guess when he was in D.C., Montreal, and then back when he was a sounder as well.
00:23:05
Speaker
I've got a photo. I've got to find it somewhere. It was Zach Awani. It was Lamar. It was, I think, Brad and myself all in the same photo. It was pretty funny.
00:23:16
Speaker
So was there were you trying to talk Lamar into playing too, or is he too far removed from playing at this point? too far removed. We did make jokes at him. Yeah, I told him if I played. If he played, i would play. And he he he gave me a a hell no.
00:23:29
Speaker
ah So how many like how many training sessions have you actually been able to do with Ballard? Close to six. Okay. Yeah, and a few scrimmages. And so does it feel like does it feel pretty natural for you? How how would you describe? i mean, like I'm assuming you've been playing some pickup. I think I heard that you maybe were playing with Washington Athletic Club for a little bit too.
00:23:50
Speaker
Yeah, there are some pickup games that I'll jump into ah just to kind of get – honestly, it's especially for us guys are retired recently, it's a it's a bit of a therapy session just to kind of get our – you know, we're we're used to stepping across the line and the world doesn't matter anymore.
00:24:05
Speaker
And so that little bit of playing, even if it's a Thursday, late night Thursday pickup, it's a whack, it's a little bit of a therapy session. So this seat even bigger, it allows me to kind of give my knowledge and give everything I can and step across that field again and the whole world outside goes away.
00:24:21
Speaker
So as you probably know, there's not just, uh, there's actually two open cup games in the greater Seattle area going on this week. There's obviously you guys are hosting Spokane on Wednesday at inner Bay stadium. And then there's also, ah the Tacoma Defiance are hosting Washington Athletic Club at Starfire on Thursday.
00:24:43
Speaker
ah Was there any consideration of you potentially playing for, you mentioned, did you consider playing for Washington Athletic Club too, or was it kind of like, if you're going to play, it's going to be Ballard, that's how it is? I got asked to do so.
00:24:55
Speaker
um Just, yeah, because we played a Thursday night games together as ah a kind of a pick up. ah or I guess a men's league, they call it. But um yes, there was an opportunity, but it was it was one and all. It was going to be Ballard or nothing.
00:25:08
Speaker
And so what is your expectation going into this game? Obviously, Spokane is a professional team. They're a USL League One team. ah Last year, Ballard played them about as tough as they could play them before ultimately falling.
00:25:20
Speaker
But you go into this feeling like, yeah, why not? Why can't we win this? Oh, absolutely. there's ah Just from playing with it, and obviously me being a little bit on the outside looking in, um when I watch this team, it's pretty we've got some talented players.
00:25:33
Speaker
It's pretty incredible. So I'm hoping that I can just add on to that, add a little bit of experience to their they're fast twitch legs and that are continuously running. So it's it's going to be exciting. and I watched that game last year, and and it could have gone either way, honestly. I think that would really put it to them.
00:25:51
Speaker
And I hope that this year we can we can actually win it. So are there tickets still available for Wednesday? i believe so. And what kind of crowd are you expecting for this for this match?
00:26:02
Speaker
Full house. Rain or shine, and Ballard shows up. Yeah, and so this is like ah ah about a 1,500-seat stadium that they they're playing in. Plus standing room. Plus standing room.
00:26:13
Speaker
And a beer garden behind the goal. Yeah. No, it sounds like I still need to get out to a game. Maybe I'll be able to get out there tomorrow if I can tell. it's cool. it is It is. Honestly, it is very, very cool. ah the Intimate experience, that's for sure.
00:26:24
Speaker
Well, awesome. Is there anything
Kellen Rowe's Post-Playing Career
00:26:26
Speaker
else? that You're obviously doing, you're still doing Sounders stuff too, right? You're doing... Yeah, so yeah i'm I'm doing there on the radio um most games with the Sounders and then i'm actually um going to start with some rain stuff too, but that's not solidified yet.
00:26:40
Speaker
And so, and how are you finding your post-playing career? Is this been kind of, are you enjoying it? i It's going to be very busy here soon, but yeah. And you've got the, you still have the wine, the wine club?
00:26:54
Speaker
Yep. And I actually just signed an offer to be an insurance broker at USI as well. So I've got about four jobs going on, um but busy is fun. So we'll see. Well, congratulations, Kellen. It was great catching up with you. And I guess you're getting ready to go out to training, so I don't want to keep you any longer. Thank I really appreciate your time. And ah thanks.
00:27:13
Speaker
Yeah, no problem, Jeremiah. Thanks. all right. You're listening to to No Sardeges, and we'll be right back. Thank you for listening to the Sounder at Heart Podcast Network, which now includes Nos Anietes, Lobbing Scorchers, and The Cooler Guild.
00:27:26
Speaker
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00:27:36
Speaker
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Speaker
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00:28:09
Speaker
It's getting to be that time of year when you need to figure out how to watch Sounders games. If you're an a Alliance member, you are getting a free subscription to MLS Season Pass and you're covered. Similarly, if you're a T-Mobile subscriber, you're also covered.
00:28:22
Speaker
But if you're going to have to pay for one, you may as well give us some of that money. By using the link sounderathart.com slash MLS Season Pass, You'll help support independent media while also getting access to every Sounders game, every other MLS game, MLS 360, and all sorts of other content.
00:28:39
Speaker
Just to make things extra easy, we'll put a link in the show notes too. Thanks.
00:28:46
Speaker
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Speaker
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Speaker
That's H-A-X-A-N-F-E-R-M-E-N-T-S dot com. And right now, if you use the code sounder at heart, that's all one word.
00:29:28
Speaker
At checkout, you will get a free hot sauce with your order. Again, go to hacksandferments.com, use the code sounder at heart at checkout for a free hot sauce with your order.
00:29:41
Speaker
Hacks and Ferments is a proud sponsor of that Sounder at Heart podcast network. Welcome back to Nos Adiates. So hopefully you enjoyed that little interview with Kellen Rowe.
00:29:52
Speaker
He is just a reminder. They are playing on Wednesday against Spokane. Velocity. ah I guess you can still get tickets.
00:30:03
Speaker
at At least Kellen seemed to think you could still get tickets. ah They're playing at interbay stadium games also on YouTube. And then on Thursday, Tacoma defiance are hosting Washington athletic club at star fire.
00:30:16
Speaker
That game is also on YouTube. There are definitely tickets for that one. And in fact, if you are an Alliance member, I believe you get in free. If you show proof of your Alliance membership, I guess is how it works.
00:30:29
Speaker
ah And otherwise it's like a $5 donation the the rae foundation. So good reason to go out and watch some open cup, especially with the Sounders not in it. But Aaron, we, uh, speaking of, uh, South, the Renton Tukwila area, but i wrote about this last week. It's not news news. The Sounders have been saying that they want their own stadium for couple of years now.
00:30:57
Speaker
ah Very, they, and they've said they, they want they're at least exploring the possibility of moving to long acres and, But I thought that one of Adrian's comments about the forcefulness with which he's like, no, we really need our own stadium was probably the most straightforward he's been in that broad desire.
00:31:17
Speaker
And he didn't say that, oh, well, it's going to be at Long Acres. But all indications are that the Sounders are looking very, very closely at Long Acres and.
00:31:28
Speaker
I guess maybe I'll give my power rankings and then we can talk about it from there. I guess that's maybe the good format of this, but I'm going to, going to rank sort of like my top five spots where I think the sounders could be playing and I'll start with the bottom.
00:31:48
Speaker
And honestly, number five might be long acres. I I'm not saying long acres would be a disaster, But let's start here.
00:32:00
Speaker
or no, i'll give I'll give my whole list and then we can kind of go through it. Number five is Long Acres. Number four would be Lumen exactly as it is now while you're a secondary tenant and you are ah stuck in a sort of no-win situation.
00:32:18
Speaker
i think I still think I prefer that to Long Acres. Number three is Some other location, like honestly, any other location in Seattle.
00:32:32
Speaker
That might even be. Yeah, three would be any location, any location in Seattle. Two would be. Lumenfield, but it's the Sounders. They're the primary tenant.
00:32:44
Speaker
And one, i suppose, would be something like, and I don't have a location for this, but a purpose-built stadium in an area that is connected specifically to light rail and has similar, if not quite the same, levels of access to ah as Lumen does.
00:33:06
Speaker
So anyway, so to recap, number one, a purpose-built stadium in Seattle on mass transit lines. Number two, Lumen, but it's the Sounders.
00:33:18
Speaker
Three, some random place in Seattle. Four, Lumen as is now. Five, Long Anchors. What do you think, Aaron? Yeah, i yeah
00:33:32
Speaker
I can't find too much to argue with there. um I think... I agree with your order unless I am thinking in, unless I'm putting on my Adrian Hanauer hat.
00:33:45
Speaker
I understand why Long Acres. Yeah. i do It's a nice hat. Yeah. I understand why the Sounders would rather play at Long Acres than Lumen with the current situation. I do get it.
00:33:57
Speaker
um Yeah. To a certain degree, i don't really care and I don't blame other people for not caring. Right. Because ultimately they're not the ones that are in charge of making the business decisions for the team.
00:34:10
Speaker
yeah But I do think that if the Sounders are going to stay competitive for the long haul, and especially if people want them, you know, to to loosen up the purse strings a little bit, I think longer term, they're probably going to need to have their control of their own revenue on game days.
00:34:30
Speaker
Yeah. And on game days too. Yeah. Yeah, and I think there's a valid argument. I think there's a totally valid argument to be made to flop but four and five. Because, and i'm I'm not going to do it because I don't feel like i need to do Adrian's job and it's his job to come out and make this case.
00:34:48
Speaker
But I can imagine a case where it makes sense. and i Because I do think ah um MLS is moving rapidly in a direction where they want every team to control their own venue. And I think that makes sense from a business perspective.
00:35:02
Speaker
I think Chicago is probably going to end up in a purpose-built stadium, probably in in Chicago. New England is already moving towards getting their own stadium. And then that basically leaves Atlanta, who at least controls their stadium, even if it's not purpose-built for them.
00:35:20
Speaker
Us and beat and the Whitecaps, who are up for sale and probably can't exist long-term in, i guess, Charlotte to Charlotte is a similar situation as Atlanta yeah where they are playing in a football stadium, but they at least control it.
00:35:37
Speaker
And then Vancouver, which I don't think BC play. Like I love BC place as a, as a visitor, but I don't think that's a viable long-term home for them.
00:35:47
Speaker
And when you look at it like that, i can understand why and MLS is like, no, the Sounders are, if they're a marquee team, they they got to be in their own facility. I get it. There's a lot of reasons to want to be in your own facility.
00:35:59
Speaker
I don't think the Sounders have made a particularly good case for why Long Acres would be a suitable stadium though right now. Like they, it's, it's on, it's technically on the train line,
00:36:12
Speaker
But it's not really like it's not real mass transit. they like That train as it is now does not run during game time for the Sounders. Making making the case for Longacres being on the rail line is this clearest sign to me that somebody has never even thought about taking mass transit regionally.
00:36:33
Speaker
Because it's just not it's it's not a viable option. It's it's. six trips a day during the week and not on the weekends. Yeah. Best case scenario, but best case scenario. They get that. trend They are able to somehow convince the, the like very powerful BNSF controls that they're the, the freight, they control the right of way there.
00:36:55
Speaker
And so somehow they would have to convince them to allow sounder to run more frequently on game days. And then, The sounder would have to actually want to do that, which is not a given either.
00:37:08
Speaker
And so best case scenario, though, let's just say best case you get it. So you've got two daily trips in from Seattle and two daily trips up from Tacoma on that on that rail line.
00:37:21
Speaker
That's maybe like 2000 people max, max. yeah there's There's one rapid bus line that goes by there, and it's really not a rapid bus line. It it basically is a rapid bus line that comes from Tukwila light rail station. And it takes 20 minutes to get there from the Tukwila light rail station.
00:37:39
Speaker
And the light rail station takes you 40 minutes to get to from downtown Seattle. Now, I will say the train ride is only 10 minutes from Seattle. it's a It's a really easy train ride. But it's just, again, it's just one train line. It's not, and and you would have to get to the train anyway.
00:37:54
Speaker
It's not the easiest thing. That's however long it takes you to get to the station now to to the stadium now. Yeah, it's 10 minutes on top of that because you've got to go catch the train and you've got park and you've got to write or whatever, you know?
00:38:08
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, it's it's it's not. I just don't I'm not seeing the case for Long Acres being a good location. And I think right now it's also really hard to imagine Long Acres being a good location because where it is, is sort of out in the middle of an office of a ah wasteland of office parks.
00:38:26
Speaker
of industrial spaces and of wetlands, there's not, there's nothing like a, there is like the closest restaurant, the closest restaurant, not like there's a cafe at, but there is a cafe at at Long Acres, but outside of that, you have to, you know, you're 15 minutes from down or 10 minutes from downtown Renton, which, you know, not so bad mouth Renton, but 10 minutes from downtown Renton is,
00:38:55
Speaker
You know, you're you're you're out. You're ah a ways away from where people are, I guess is what I'm saying. like No one lives there right now. Like literally no one lives near there. No one would walk. No one could walk there.
00:39:07
Speaker
Everything, all of the pluses that I've heard the Sounders put forward about potentially a stadium being there. is well imagine if or right exactly when the apartments are there or when the transit service is better like it's all predicated on stuff happening that i'm just super skeptical is ever going to happen um it's yeah it would be it would be great if king county said oh you want to put a stadium there well we're going to expand our rapid ride service you know which can give you dedicated service
00:39:40
Speaker
No, it's not going to happen. It's not going happen. I'm just saying we don't even have dedicated day service for Sounders games now. Right. No, that's right. No, that's a a very fair point. And I think it's in the thing is, is that I'm not saying that Long Acres is DOA.
00:39:56
Speaker
What I'm saying is that the Sounders have not even started to make the case for it. And yeah, I think right now where we sit, it's impossible for me to see this as a as a real viable solution.
00:40:10
Speaker
in part, like, I don't I just look at like today, NWSL Colorado came out and said, Hey, we want to build 14 and a half thousand seat stadium in Denver proper. And basically every team in the country, every soccer team in the country is trying to build close to urban centers.
00:40:31
Speaker
And the sounders are talking about possibly bailing on the most excessive, most like accessible stadium location in the whole continent. And going to move someplace that is like essentially Frisco.
00:40:44
Speaker
ah Right. It just feels like a very backwards move. A team that talks all the time about their sustainability goals and pledges and has nice little slogans about, you know, how much, well, right. um Yeah. It would be, I think, a betrayal of a lot of things about the culture of the club and and yeah a pretty frustrating decision. Even if I understand it from, from a dollars and cents perspective, um I'm never going to be supportive of it.
00:41:10
Speaker
Yeah. And all that said, I get why Lumen is becoming unviable. And i I do think there's something to be said about how in its current situation, like maybe it would be, maybe we should, maybe I should have flipped those two because I do think Lumen is, there is an element of Lumen that feels unviable right now. But I think also part of that is that I don't see the Sounders pushing first and goal to improve the situation either.
00:41:36
Speaker
Like they, I don't, I just don't see them fighting the good fight to let's make sure there's more concessions open. Let's make sure there's more activity in the concourse. Let's make sure that we aren't always getting the short straw when it comes to renovations on this stadium.
00:41:53
Speaker
Let's push first and goal to build us a locker room. Let's push, like, let's do all these, let's, let's, let's put up money to, you know, try it. Let's, let's try to be partners and getting grass on the, in the stadium.
00:42:06
Speaker
Like I don't see them doing any of that stuff. So I'm skeptical that they are putting in the sort of effort that they could, if they wanted to make Lumen a better venue absent controlling it. Now,
00:42:22
Speaker
controlling lumen could be a total paradigm shifter. Like that's, I think they would probably have to figure out how to downsize it somewhat. I don't, I do think the sounders are moving beyond the, ah the even aspirational goal of seven, 70,000 tickets on a regular basis.
00:42:40
Speaker
Yeah. They, they should be, i mean, if they still have that aspiration, I'm not, I'm not sure um what they're smoking over there, but yeah, I think it's pretty easy to see how you could make some,
00:42:52
Speaker
changes to Lumen and have it be a perfect stadium, you know, for, for soccer. um It's, it's really easy to see. And I mean, I guess it's not perfect. It's never going to be as perfect as one that's purpose built specifically for soccer. And that's the only thing that happens in it, but one that I think everybody would be thrilled with.
00:43:11
Speaker
And the location is impossible to beat. As you know, as we've talked about um just in terms of, both getting there, all the stuff around it, and also just the setting in the stadium itself. i mean, it's, it's just a beautiful place to watch a game.
00:43:29
Speaker
Um, yeah, I mean, it's, it's the perfect location. and and I think it's why it's been a tenable situation for so long. Right. And why it really hasn't been until the last few years that I think the sounders were making noise about wanting their own stadium.
00:43:46
Speaker
Um, And I think, you know, in terms of of the Sounders not doing what they could to make Lumen a better game day experience, i'm I'm sympathetic to the idea that first and goal views them as as second, you know, second last citizens. They do.
00:44:01
Speaker
they They obviously do. But I do also remember a time not that long ago when going to games was more fun. And so it's obviously and unless first and goal has completely said, no we're not doing anything for you anymore. And that's just really hard for me to believe that they would have changed that ah drastically.
00:44:22
Speaker
um It really seems like you're you're right that the Sounders aren't doing all they could depress to make it a more enjoyable experience. I i will say that. I think the experience of going to live events has gotten worse cross the across the board. I think automation, um cashless payments, all that kind of stuff, ah you know, emphasizing speed over service and quality.
00:44:47
Speaker
i think pretty much, i mean, even at Climate Pledge, right? Climate Pledge is like a really nice state-of-the-art arena. For the most part, the experience of going and getting food or going and getting a beer or whatever is more or less the same as it is at at Moomin.
00:45:01
Speaker
um You walk in, you grab it, you walk out. And that's, you know... It's not a lot of fun for me, but they have better options, better food options. um And then obviously T-Mobile just laps everybody with their food options. and um But there was a time where you could get cool food at the stadium at Lumen. You could get interesting stuff or you could get cheap stuff.
00:45:24
Speaker
um And it just hasn't been that way since the pandemic, if not before. um But I feel like andl the MLS Cup final was the last game I went to before the pandemic.
00:45:36
Speaker
in 2019. And that felt very much like, you know, when I was going to every game, right. It felt like pretty much more or less the same experience. And so it really does feel like since the pandemic has, has ended or, you know, things have gotten back to normal that there's just been, never been this effort to ramp things back up to the way they used to be. And yeah, i I'm willing to believe that's not entirely the sounder's fault, but,
00:46:05
Speaker
They're not they' not exactly just mere passengers either. ah Right. And I think other thing is i think back to the Champions League final, and they did but you know they had people there.
00:46:20
Speaker
and that fell but that's felt as special as any game and i think it was it's sort of a reminder to me that I don't know. Maybe Atlanta has a bigger fan base. That might be that might be true. i don't I don't know if that's true or not. Atlanta is certainly a bigger metropolitan area, so that's possible.
00:46:40
Speaker
But the Sounders have this sort of superpower right now. They have this massive fan base that just wants to be...
00:46:53
Speaker
wants to be a track. They want, they want something to get excited about. And centers have played good soccer over the last two years, but they haven't necessarily played exciting soccer, but they also just haven't done enough to pull fans in And I just feels like going to long acres. And I saw a few people sort of making this comment that as if,
00:47:14
Speaker
downtown Seattle is a lost cause. And I, it's, it's like, we're, well read we're talking about two years ago, three years ago, they packed this stadium admittedly for a big event, but it's, what are we talking about?
00:47:28
Speaker
Like, it's really only the last two years, at least to me where the attendance numbers have gotten real red flaggy where you're like, gosh, this is, this is thinner than i remember it being.
00:47:40
Speaker
And the LAFC was a good example of that where, there were, you know, there was probably 20,000 people in the building and it still got loud and it still felt fun, but it just is feels different.
00:47:52
Speaker
And I just hope that centers have not given up on reclaiming that because there's no, like, I don't know. I look at, I look at the sounder at heart subscribers as a good example of this.
00:48:03
Speaker
We have, there's no other market in, in the U S that would support a full-time operation like where we're currently running. And, We are still growing. And so like that just tells me there is a big fan base out there that is thirsting to be like excited and turned on. And i guess to get back to the point of this little discussion.
00:48:28
Speaker
i still believe there's got to be someplace in Seattle. I don't know where it is. Yeah, there's got to be someplace in Seattle that where you can where you can make this work. Maybe it's the Hanson lots that are south of the stadium.
00:48:41
Speaker
i don't know. I was looking at, I was talking to someone today about how, i don't know, maybe there's space over at Northgate. Yeah. I was just, I was going to say Northgate. Yeah. Like, yeah, there's There is definitely some areas, if you parse up that land, that it feels like you could put a ah stadium on.
00:48:57
Speaker
And man, that would be that would be pretty slick. I mean, you're right next to the freeway. You are connected to light rail. You are in an urban area, but it's not totally built out yet. So there's still potential to sort of like shape it differently.
00:49:13
Speaker
I'm sure there would be some, you know... fight over you know how like there but there like there's housing there but it's not single family housing I don't know it or at least right there I don't know I I just think I really hope they're open-minded about where they're gonna go if they're gonna go because I just would be it would just be so sad for the me to like i I mean i'll I'll go to games I this is my job I'm not I'm not saying that and then they might build a great stadium out there but
00:49:46
Speaker
I don't know right now where we sit. I am. I am. I am not convinced at all. I'm not. I'll even go so far as to say. Even if it's out of the city limits, right?
00:49:58
Speaker
If they build a stadium in Shoreline or. Or Bellevue or something, just somewhere that is going the other way, federal way. Let's let's not go nuts.
00:50:10
Speaker
I would I would rather go to Tuck Willow than federal way. I'll tell you that much. But. but Somewhere on light rail with dedicated transit going to and from, um, that's just gotta be better than long acres. The, the, the selling point of long acres is we own the land.
00:50:30
Speaker
That is the, that's the extent of it, I believe. And that is ah decent selling point, right? i mean, it's important. um It's an important point. i don't know if it's a selling point to me, but it's an important point for sure for turning it into a reality.
00:50:45
Speaker
But I think if you are trying to shake off the sense that the fan base has that you are not willing to spend money to be excellent, maybe saying, well, this is the cheapest place to build the stadium, so we're going to build it here, even though literally everyone in the world hates the idea. It's not the way to convince them otherwise. It's not the way to go about it.
00:51:05
Speaker
It's not the way to go about it. And you know what? You can sell that land, right? And use that to fund it. Like, I mean, you can sell property that you own.
00:51:18
Speaker
Well, I mean, they're they are investors in this project, the Long Acres project. And presumably there's designs to build all sorts of housing out there and to build sort of a live, work, play environment.
00:51:30
Speaker
And there's no reason that they can't still make money on that deal. And then that that money can't help fund a place where they're actually going build a stadium. I am just...
00:51:42
Speaker
so Like I said, I am just super skeptical that a stadium there really makes sense. And I suppose on some level you can brute force it. And I wouldn't even be surprised if for the first five or even 10 years it's working out.
00:51:55
Speaker
But if you're trying to cast like a long-term vision of what the Sounders are, and you're telling me that their long-term vision is a 20 or 25,000 seat stadium out in the suburbs, I just...
00:52:10
Speaker
I just am not convinced that's, that's the best thing to do for the long-term future of this team. And if, even if, even if they're positioning themselves to sell, which I don't know, and like I, that is just a random thing I'm pulling out there. I have not heard anything along the lines that they're looking to sell, but if they were trying to position themselves for a sale,
00:52:32
Speaker
I don't know what kind of investor would be like, oh, you're going to build up in the service. That's a great idea. Every other MLS team is building in the and there, ah like directly in there, trying to get down as close to downtown as possible.
00:52:43
Speaker
And you're leaving downtown. Please explain this to me. Like, why why do I want to invest in that? Why would you do that? Yeah. they they I mean, yeah I can't imagine a world in which you were getting ready to sell or preparing to sell.
00:52:56
Speaker
And decide to build a stadium. Like, what do what's the benefit of doing that? It doesn't make any sense to me here. here Speaking of concept of sales, though, my understanding, maybe it's incorrect, but my understanding is that Jody Allen is obligated to sell.
00:53:12
Speaker
Yeah. The Allen shares of all of the the teams that that is the big. that It would be very interesting to me if whoever wants to buy the Seahawks also wants that share of the Sounders and is interested in being a much more active partner. Oh, interesting. Because I think but that could really change the dynamic a lot.
00:53:35
Speaker
That's interesting. Whoever. yeah I mean, because first and goal is basically operating on behalf of the Seahawks. Yes. And when Paul Allen was an owner and he's never but he was never engaged in the team.
00:53:47
Speaker
But in the early days of the Sounders, I mean, their business operations ran the Sounders for the first five seasons. Yeah. Right. Right. and And even after the first few years that they separated, it seemed like Lumen was a lot, first and goal, was a lot more interested in treating the Sounders as a...
00:54:05
Speaker
1b if if not a you know if not a first class partner um taking them seriously not treating them like more or less a nuisance and if they could get back to a situation like that at loom and i think that that even that could really um shift the scales back loomans favor yeah uh that is an interesting i hadn't really thought of that aspect of it i think the other But there is that is sort of speaks to the the big, big unknown in this equation, which is the status of Jody Allen's ownership of the Seahawks. Because if she sells the Seahawks, independent of whatever happens to the shares that they own in the Sounders,
00:54:45
Speaker
who knows what a, the next owner is going to want to do with the Seahawks. And there is not, I don't think it's a completely fantastical idea to think that a new owner will come in and say, Oh, I want to build a 75,000 seat stadium out at, um, out in Kent or in Bellevue or we're at Emerald downs or wherever. Right.
00:55:09
Speaker
And they want to just Yeah. Right. or to look Or Longhackers, I suppose. I don't think there's room there. But ah like there is there's a world where the Seahawks leave Lumen and all of a sudden – and that's sort of like the scenario where the Sounders could run that. But it's an it would be interesting if the if the new owner of the Seahawks were to also buy into the Sounders. And and i mean at this point, it is interesting because the Sounders – that I believe the Allens have a 25% stake in the Sounders.
00:55:43
Speaker
By the time the sale goes through, the Sounders will probably be valued at something like a billion dollars. i mean, that's a $250 million chunk. ah You would think a new owner would have, like for for the Allens, they didn't pay almost anything, I don't think, to get that to get that sort of share.
00:56:03
Speaker
So they don't treat it as a really valuable thing, whereas a new owner would have potentially have some some juice in that relationship and they might want to throw their weight around a little bit more.
00:56:16
Speaker
So that could that could change things for sure. yeah Well, yeah it'll be it'll be interesting to watch. Yeah. I don't, I don't, I don't know if this, this, uh, power rankings conceit totally worked out how I imagined it. I don't know what I imagined, but I do think we had a good conversation about the stadium situation.
00:56:35
Speaker
Uh, Yeah, I like it. and liked it. So matter we'll see how this we'll see how this evolves over time. But I think we're going to do a mailbag episode next week just to give you a little heads up.
00:56:46
Speaker
ah And other than that, I hope i urge you to go go watch Ballard FC probably tonight. If you're listening to this, probably tonight. Heck, go out to Starfire. Watch Tacoma in the Open Cup.
00:56:58
Speaker
Could be a lot of fun. ah do like the Open Cup. I do. All that said, I'm Jeremiah Shan signing off for Aaron Campo and Lick It. This is Nos Adietes.
00:57:09
Speaker
Remember, you'll never get a alone.
00:57:48
Speaker
I expect an LAFC who's motivated ah to prove themselves at home, to prove to their fans that that they're capable of winning in this league. And it's up to us to really brew in the party.
00:58:01
Speaker
You guys like that? and a what Awkward joke, dad joke right there, huh?