Transcript
Speaker: There is more than enough room. Hold on, can you Lauren? Would you believe that?
Speaker: Hello, hello, and welcome back to another episode of Where's Your Humanity. I'm your host, Gail Fraser, and I am joined today by Edela Stace-Smith. Edela is a ah URL and IRL experience curator and community builder devoted to the art of gathering. Her work centers around bringing people together in real time, around dinner tables, inside URL group spaces, and at international IRL gatherings designed for friendship making and having big fun. Because she will forever believe that communities are not stumbled upon, they are intentionally cultivated and actively participated in. Thank you for being here. and Welcome. Yeah, thanks for having me. Can't wait. I'm so excited to chat with you today. Before we get started, tell the audience, obviously a read off your little bio, but tell the audience a little bit about you.
Speaker: oh my gosh, a little bit about me. I always like, it's so funny too with this question. I'm like, do I start when I was a child? Do I start now? I'm like, how much how much people want to know? But yeah, I mean, I feel like the bio says so much about it. um I kind of, not even like stumbled into, but you know, maybe this is like a pretty traditional pipeline, but like started as a web designer and a brand designer and then, you know, went into like coaching and then went into educational programs. And if, you know, for anyone that knew me when I was younger, where I've landed now makes complete sense. And it feels like a very pretty big full circle moment because i was very much always the person for better or for worse, who was just, you know, how can we have the most fun?
Speaker: Like you guys. We only have one life. Like, I don't think you understand this, you know, like, let's just fucking go. And and really have always kind of had that as my North star of like, okay, where's my friends? Let's hang out. Let's just like fun shit together. And I think it's, yeah, it's it's all very fitting now that, you know,
Speaker: kind of the work that I do really centers like, okay, how can I with my friends and have fun? um and And also like, how can we all do that? Because, you know, I think when i was younger, maybe it just was like, I think maybe when I was younger, it just was simply that me wanting to do that. But now I think getting older, I'm really kind of like putting language to it and understanding it more. And also now it's like my work.
Speaker: Yeah, now I've really, really, really deeply come to understand. I think something that I maybe subconsciously understood when I was younger was like, oh, wow, no, these things are are so fundamental to the human experience. And they are so fundamental to like our existence and making it through this life. And and I think that like having fun and being stupid and doing shit with your friends and building community and and and really kind of like upholding those things and prioritizing them is is, you know, not to be dramatic, but like to be dramatic. Yeah. You don't make it through this through this life without those things, you know? And I think they're such pillars to your success and to your transformations and to your um evolutions. And I think we've really, like, kind of lost the plot on that and forgotten that. No, I totally agree. And i think it's so interesting hearing your back a little bit of your backstory as, like, growing up. I think i was very much someone who, like, didn't have a central group or didn't have, like –
Speaker: It was always a little bit harder for me to like make and keep friends. And then when I started my business, I started doing a lot of like networking to meet people. And I live in the city and I'm able to like go out and go to all these amazing groups that we have here. And then I was like,
Speaker: Oh, like just meeting people and like connecting with people what became so much more important to me than any like business leads or any like sales that I'm getting out of it. I was like, no, it's just so energizing to like go and be curious about people and meet them and say, like, we should meet for coffee. We had such a great conversation. And now I am so invested in community building and friendship making And I think it's such a lost art because now people are just like, well, that's so easy for you because you're so good at it. And I'm like, no, I just did it a lot. Like I just practiced and I was intentional about it and I showed up and I went to the things even if I was tired or even if I like didn't really feel up for it And it was always worth it.
Speaker: And I just I think for me, like I see so many people just kind of give up on the idea of like making friends as an adult or like building community intentionally because it's taught to us, especially here in the U.S., that it just kind of like happens.
Speaker: Yeah. Okay. That's actually a great point that you said at the end of like, it just happens. And I think there is this like really interesting misconception and which I've also like make no fucking mistake, right? There's, there's been, there's been a lot of um different points in my life where, yeah, I didn't have a big group of friends at all. Oh my gosh. um So many times, but I think that's a really big misconception is that We see it all the time too, especially now online. it was something that was like spoken about more, but now it's kind of being magnifying because we're being fed it all the time. it like you know You always see these people who are like, I have 20 best friends or like you know me and 40 of my friends went on this trip. And I think that is really discouraging for people because people, people I think the word community can sometimes be wrapped up in ah quantity and numbers. And I think similar to you, I'm sure. Yeah.
Speaker: any any any kind of like language or anytime I speak on this, like it it relates to like, fuck, you might have two friends that are like your best friends and the you know the the kind of like cornerstones of your life and the people that you go to That's great. i think I think it really, yeah, I think this whole kind of conversation is just like a call to- Whatever this looks like for you, like invest in it and invest in it intentionally and, you know, hold it close to you and honor it and and realize the importance of it, whether it's two amazing people or you 30 people or whatever it is.
Speaker: Yeah. Those close relationships too those people that are like the cornerstones of your life that you're calling when you need. support or sending a message or they're the first people you tell when you're really excited about something like those are such essential pieces of our lives and such essential pieces for our mental and social capacity like we all need to be hyped up and like grounded and have someone to talk to because we're social beings and
Speaker: But we also benefit so much from the like more casual friendships, relationships, just like people that you know and see. And they don't have to be like your closest friend in the world that you tell everything to. But like they're still a meaningful part of your life. That is like yes. Okay.
Speaker: Yes. Oh my God, this is such a good point. I was going to say it before you said it because yeah, I think this is, um yeah, I think so much of it relates to and goes back to what we see on social media, what we see online. And I think everything is always very black and white, right? It's either it's a yes or it's no, or it's wrong or it's right, or you should do it this way or you should do it that way. And I think, again, there is so much talk around Especially now, it feels like it's like really in like the cultural zeitgeist of of community and friendship and things like that. But yeah, i think I think there's this kind of weird space that we've landed in where people kind of feel like, oh, you know, I don't...
Speaker: have that community or I don't have the friends that I want. But I i think sometimes we really discount, like you were saying, we really, really discount the like more casual friends or, or even, um, I was speaking to this recently about kind of like being really honest with yourself about what you can expect from certain people. Because a lot of the time I see, ah I kind of, you know, I'm always, I'm always like looking on threads and looking in places and seeing how people are are speaking about, you know, friendships and groups and communities and and how they feel about it. And I noticed a lot of people will, will kind of be like, yeah,
Speaker: you know, I feel disappointed by this person or I feel let down by this or like I don't really have any friends because of X, and Z or I, you know, I don't feel like I have a community I can turn to because I always feel like I'm being disappointed or let down. And I think this is a really interesting part of it. Yes, obviously there are people who just like screw you over it and and and that's another conversation. But I think this is ah something else we've kind of mismanaged is our expectations of people um and placing the same expectations on every single person. And I think realistically it's like some friends are like fun friends. Some friends are the ones you'll tell everything to. Some friends are the ones who you call on like your life is fucking imploding. You know, like there's different peoples for there's different people for like different reasons. um
Speaker: And I think when we become a little bit more honest about what we can what we can expect from each person, I think that conversation of like, oh, it's it's impossible to make friends. in your 30s or 40s or whatever, i think that conversation starts to change.
Speaker: A hundred percent. That's the whole village aspect of it, right? It's like everyone plays their role and it's not everyone doesn't do everything. That's why we all need each other. And it's the same reason that a business has all these different departments with all these different specialists in it. um And we can criticize that system however we want to. But at the same time, like we all have things that we're good at. We all have things that we're not so great at.
Speaker: I have ADHD. I am like very likely to forget that you texted me after seeing it and like maybe not respond for two weeks. And like all my friends know that about me.
Speaker: And that's just not a need that they have from me. But I'm really good at showing up in other ways. I'm really good at gathering people in person. I'm going to be the one. Hey, let's go to this thing. ah We should get coffee next week. Like I'm going to be the person setting something up. to be in person um or call or whatever. and I think that we all play our role and that's like, that's part of your village. You can't expect everyone to be everything for you.
Speaker: Yeah, exactly. And it's, it's, It's kind of similar to like the romantic partnership conversation, right? Because you know how there's always a lot of talk around, we've essentially made our partner like our our everything, right? Like they have to be your like caretaker and they have to be your like confidant and they have to be your best friend and they have to be whatever the fuck they have to be all of these things. But kind of back to what you were saying of, yeah, everyone kind of plays their role. And and you were saying like your friends, are they just know this about you. They know that they're probably might they're probably not going to hear back. And because they know that, they're not disappointed. They're not frustrated. They're not annoyed because you bring other things to the table. And I think you can, you know, you can even apply that to any relationship. And and this kind of where the romantic relationship comes into play where it's like, you know, when you start dating, you're dating somebody or you're or you're with somebody, you can't change them.
Speaker: Right. You might, you might know there's like, you know, there's little things that my partner does like, you know, trying to be insane. But it's like I know that I go into this understanding that and knowing that. And because I know that and because i I don't know, essentially like made peace with that, the other areas or the other aspects kind of make up for it. So I think it's like, you know, we're talking about villages and communities, but I'm like, it goes, it goes across the board for any relationship. Right. And again, if something's like egregious and it's, you know, it's, it's something you really need to talk about, obviously, you know, you can sit down and talk about it, but Yeah, we can't make people who we want them to be. We have to just like take them for who they are. And if that doesn't work for us or doesn't suit us, then, you know, you can move on.
Speaker: Yeah. And i think you brought hit on a really good point in there that I want to pull the thread a little bit of having hard conversations with people that we care about. If they're, you know, they say something or their behavior is unacceptable or something that they said hurt you. um i also think that our we're becoming worse as a society at having those hard conversations and just kind of being like either from my Midwestern upbringing, just ignore it and pretend it didn't happen. Or, well, that's a deal. but They said this thing and then like all bets are off. The deal breakers. Oh my God. The fucking deal breakers. i feel like that's actually seeped into everything. You know, the, um what is it? It's the red flag, the red flag, the deal breaker, the red flag, the,
Speaker: the boundary, they're they're all the same kind of context. And I think that is also, because again, like I i see people kind of sharing this and talking about this a lot of like, oh, it's so, so impossible to make friends.
Speaker: And then, you know, kind of below, let's say the thread, below the thread, they'll kind of write in the comments and kind of say like, well, I don't really like going out or, well, I, you know, this is a deal breaker for me, right? Like I don't, want to hang out with people who are X, Y, and Z. And it's, we've essentially, essentially like backed ourselves into a corner and isolated the fuck out of ourselves. And then,
Speaker: kind of wonder why we're lonely. And it's just because there's there's so many deal breakers and there's so many rules and there's so many boundaries and there's, you know, well, I have to be i have to be up at seven because I have to go through my seven step routine. And well, I have to go to Pilates and well, it's a Tuesday, so I can't go out on a Tuesday. And well, they said something that was a kind of weird one time. And, you know, I just don't need that energy in my life or whatever. whatever you know And again, these there's always outlier cases. Of course, yes, have have a boundary. have You know you need yeah need something in your life. you know Totally. And like have self-respect, right? If someone treats you really poorly, yeah, totally. I get it. But I think it's – yeah, we've we've all taken it like way too far and we've all become very –
Speaker: I'm trying to find a better word than than sensitive, but it just, yeah, kind of feels like we have. And I think this this is maybe like going on a bit of a tangent, but I think it's also because we have things to like hide behind more now. Like you can hide behind your like health routine or you can hide behind your tense,
Speaker: step bedtime routine or I have to be at this appointment or I have to be at this class or I'm really trying to get like 10 hours of sleep. h I don't know. I just feel before there wasn't, there wasn't as much that we could hide behind. But I think now because we take, because by the way, this bleeds into everything. We take everything so seriously now. So like we take our yeah can hair so seriously and our nails so seriously and our sleep so so seriously and ironically, we take everything so deeply seriously. But the one thing that's kind of being forgotten about is our people and our communities. We've become so obsessed with them.
Speaker: ourselves honestly we've become so fucking obsessed ourselves and optimizing the shit out of ourselves and we've like yeah forgotten about our people we've forgotten to be with our friends make new friends and again the biggest you know ironic thing of this all the biggest underscore is that so many so many of us are like I'm deeply, like painfully lonely and isolated. Yeah.
Speaker: The thing that I always say to people when they're just like, oh I feel uncomfortable, like going up to someone that I don't know, or like I go to a lot of events here in the cities and so many people are uncomfortable just like going up to someone that they don't know. That's so normal. Like a lot of people feel that way. And if you, if I were to stand in front of a room full of a hundred people and ask,
Speaker: Who wishes they had more friends in their life? like everyone would be raising their hands because we all crave human connection. And like you said, we're like lonelier than ever. And I like that you talked about the like protect my energy boundaries because I think that that conversation is also like, yes, there are situations where this is really relevant, necessary requirement, but it's also become something that's like a buzzword that people hide behind of like,
Speaker: Oh, like, sorry to cancel, but I just like, I'm not feeling it tonight. Or like, I have to, I have to protect my energy. And I'm just like, no, like, that's not a good reason not to go to your friend's birthday.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, exactly. Like I think, and this completely makes sense what we were talking to, you know, before before we hit record, but the society in which we live in, it's very massively individualistic, right? So we have gotten, yeah, just so good at kind of tending to ourselves, like, I guess, respecting ourselves um and placing importance for the self, which, you know, in isolation, those aren't bad things. Yeah.
Speaker: But in the process of we have like we've like lost all like allegiance or responsibility to community um and to our people. And it doesn't when I say our people, it doesn't even have to be like your your closest people. like I think there is a greater responsibility for like the greater community, you know, um to like show up and be there and be.
Speaker: active and participate and um it's also a trickle-down effect too right because I think a lot of the time like you were like you were saying right like the oh I don't know like I'm not you the last minute like I don't know I'm not really feeling it right I think it becomes a bit of a trickle-down effect because then you know then other people start to be like okay well then maybe I don't want to put in as much effort right because because when I do then you know the outcome isn't really what I want I feel a bit discouraged and Yeah, it's all very interesting too, because the conversation right now, i feel like everywhere you turn is like community, friends, village building, are you a villager? Like everyone, you know, everyone fucking talking about this right now.
Speaker: um i always am really curious of like how much action is actually being taken because you know what, you live in the online space. There's always like so much talk about everything, but you're like, is anything like actually changing? like are people, you know, is this being actioned? Yeah.
Speaker: And I think it is. I really do think it is. like there's there's There's more in-person events being created than ever. um People are like actively showing up for those spaces and really, you know, stating that they're craving that and that they're wanting that.
Speaker: But I think To your point, too, of, you know, going to an event or doing something and feeling uncomfortable, I think that's also something that can get a little bit lost. Yes, I totally understand that there are just severely different personalities. And I can also understand anxieties and things like that. But I think there is a bit of misconception sometimes where it can feel like, oh, well, yeah, it's easy for you. Or, you know, oh, I'm just not like that. And you're that kind of person. Like, fuck, I get nervous and awkward all the time. Yeah. Same, yeah.
Speaker: it's like sometimes i like for the majority of the time actually i do feel pretty good but and this is actually a good example i was at a friend's wedding this past weekend And it was in France. So everyone was obviously speaking French. And there was probably like five of us maybe that spoke English. Everyone spoke English, but obviously that was the primary language, right? So that sort was like a a huge situation where I was like, you know, pretty uncomfortable a lot of the time. But I'm still so happy that I did it. You know what I mean? Like I i met some really great people.
Speaker: It was really like beautiful to be there, like to like celebrate and support my friends. And i think I think also that kind of can tie back into the more conversation of like individualism, right? And And kind of showing up for the greater community. Because it's, yeah. Would would it be like my first choice to feel that uncomfortable in a group of 200 people? No. But I think it's also like goes back to like social responsibility. Like I want to celebrate my friends and I want to show up. And I told them that I would be there. Right. I think also like one doesn't always have to equal the other. You know, like there there is a there is a discomfort in community building. There is a there is a massive discomfort in in making friends and also keeping friends. um Yeah.
Speaker: And I know what we see online, right, is always people being like, yeah, like I'm so, what is it, like ah my life's so chaotic and I'm partying and it's so fun. And like, you know, I just, there's a lot of kind of conversation around that, but it's like yeah, you know, behind behind the screen, it's like half the time it's like pretty awkward and kind of weird and and you're like stumbling over your words and, you know you go home thinking like, was that weird? are you being weird? You know, its that's a very real part of it. And I think obviously that part isn't shown.
Speaker: online. yeah So I think a lot of times people think it's easy for people. Totally. And I think that as a society, we've gotten so averse to being uncomfortable or having to experience discomfort. And we see that in all parts of our society. And that's like the convenience culture of capitalism too.
Speaker: I think in like the online space too, because we're so worried about showing up like presentable and the way that we want to be perceived. And I've been seeing a lot of commentary on this. I don't know if you have been to about Gen Z being afraid to be cringe and how that like, it's just like, oh, but now you've kind of expected perfection from yourself and others in a way that's never going to be attainable.
Speaker: And if you are expecting perfection from yourself in a social setting, from other people in a social setting, you're not going to make friends that way because you're going to feel so uncomfortable in your own self because why do I feel nervous? Why do I feel weird going up to this group of women and introducing myself? Why do I like you're going to just be so in your head and then you're going to be so disappointed by everyone else because they're also imperfect.
Speaker: Oh my God. You know what? This, this generation, I actually genuinely just feel bad for them because I just, I just, you know, I feel like the outcome that is Gen Z, I'm kind of like, wow, I just feel like they never really stood a chance. Um, I'm not sure what year you were born, but I just, oh, I'm always like, I think, yeah, actually I shared something about this one time of, um, I don't know, it was like post or something that I shared and it kind of was like, you know, I never,
Speaker: I didn't have a Facebook account until I was out of high school. I never had a TikTok account. i never had a MySpace. I never had Vine. I've never had any of them. Yeah. I think got Instagram account when I was 25. And I really, really honestly attribute that to like before I, yeah, had to curate myself or knew how to like can put together a reel or a carousel or write a caption that perfectly summarized my experience. It's like, you know,
Speaker: my think my generation and and down, like we were able to truly experience life before we had to like be recorded and be on and be click caught you know being crammed or be caught saying something stupid or be caught doing something dumb. I think that this is why our generation and you know before kind of have those social capabilities. Yeah, no, I think that 100% too. So I am like an elder Gen Z. was born in 98. So I am like right at the cusp of like Gen Z millennial. I got social media in high school. The late 90s babies that are in that Gen z generation kind of missed like the bulk of what the younger Gen Z's had where like we were at least like in high school like teenagers whatever when we're first getting exposed to social media and it was like early Instagram where people are like posting a photo of this leaf like it's just like yeah It was nothing. And so it was like we were exposed to very like early social media where it was a lot more just casual and no one really cared. But then the younger Gen Z's are like they've had it their whole lives and they've had the algorithmic social media that's like constantly advertising to them and constantly showing them certain content. And it just, yeah, it fucks with your head so much.
Speaker: And I feel for them so much because they didn't choose that. None of us, well, We didn't actively choose to be in like late stage capitalism, but that's kind of like just what they had on offer. And yeah, our society was just like, well, we're not going to do anything about that. So here you go. And it's, you know, it's really interesting. Something that you said actually earlier, because I think, you know, this conversation we're having, we're talking about like the importance of like human human connection um and community building. And I think something that you said earlier was we live in this, like we live in a convenience culture, right? And I think sometimes it can seem like, oh, you know, we're having, those are two different conversations, but like they are so all interconnected and they all bleed into each other. And the reason like, whatever, yes, let's say capitalism birthed convenience culture. And then it's all this like trickle down effect, right? the The conversation that me and you are having today is is basically the end result of fucking convenience culture and capitalism.
Speaker: both, yeah, really foster isolation, individualism, me-minded, self-centered. I don't mean like self-centered in that way, but like literally self at the center. So anyway, I think that is like a really interesting distinction to make because sometimes I think it can feel like, oh, you know, these all of these things are like very different conversations, but they're not, right? They're all so connected to each other and are all kind of like products of the same thing.
Speaker: Yeah, 100%. I want to pivot a little bit. And I know that you ah put together a lot of amazing online community spaces, in-person events, and you hit on this a little bit already of that, like, as a society, and I think a big part post-COVID, too, where we're, like, finally getting out and doing stuff again and feeling comfortable to be in a big group and, like,
Speaker: in person. But how have you seen that pivot it as you've been building these spaces in the last few years with in-person events and the experience that you and like your participants are having and wanting those spaces?
Speaker: Okay, this is actually really interesting because, my God, I always think COVID it was like two years ago, but it was six years ago somehow. Yeah. um So, I mean, back then, oh my gosh, back then, oh my gosh, I had just started my company actually in 2020, like when COVID happened. So I actually wasn't doing any of this work then. i was running like a yeah design studio, branding and web design. So I haven't seen the evolution of what people are like coming out of COVID in relation to events and um community building. But I can say now that I think it's massive it's definitely a factor, right? Like me and you were talking about right now of like capitalism and we're talking about um a generation growing up with
Speaker: just like mass technology and surveillance. But yes, like the the pandemic was also such a big factor, I think, in where we are now, right, where people are not even like talking about it. It's actually really interesting. I'm always kind of i'm always kind of taking into account like language that people use online.
Speaker: And some of it's actually a little bit heartbreaking. Like people, you know, people are, um, oh my gosh, this one woman, she wrote a thread recently and it was really quite, quite like gut wrenching, like the language she used around like how desperate she was to have, you know, people in her life and how utterly lonely she felt.
Speaker: And yeah, I think it's, I think it's, I think it's all a result of everything that we just spoke about. And i think COVID is was a really massive, um, really, really big one. Um, i also feel like that's actually interesting. I also think the pandemic, you know, what whatever skills like we had, I feel like it made everyone have to like.
Speaker: Oh my gosh, we've lost that. by How do I be, you know? How how do I like person in public? You know? um ah How do i like relearn these skills? um So I think like as, not even a society, honestly, as a world world,
Speaker: We just got like hit with a lot of things, you know, we got hit with the pandemic and then we got hit with just, um just technology upgrade after technology upgrade after technology upgrade stacked on top of that is just like mass surveillance and stacked on top of that is just like advertisements and algorithms being thrown at us all the time. So it's like, you know, I think it's really interesting because we can obviously talk about this and be like, Oh my God, you know, ah you know, we know how this happened, but you know,
Speaker: you know, why do people feel nervous talking to somebody or why do people feel awkward? Or, you know, we all need to prioritize this more. And yes, I still believe all of those things and I'll still like always advocate for that. But It totally makes sense how we got here. Yeah. And I think I even remember like post early pandemic, I'm pretty extroverted person. I've worked in a lot of really social, like extroverted jobs. Like I've been a recruiter. I used to be a campus recruiter. Like I'd go to events and talk to people for hours every day um or like worked in a clinic, like checking people in. Like I've had a lot of really social jobs, um including right up to the pandemic. I think two things happened during COVID.
Speaker: The first one, I think it kind of instilled like a subconscious fear of being in close proximity to other people and talking to people because it was like so associated with like, am I going to get sick?
Speaker: Or like, is this safe? Like it kind of instilled a like being in close proximity to other people isn't safe in like a subconscious way that I think has like really impacted us as a society more than we let on.
Speaker: And then I also think that it's just like, yeah, we just lost the skill of communicating. and I sometimes think when when i do get the comment like, oh, but you're so good at this or whatever.
Speaker: and it's like, yeah, because I just go like I have a lot of practice. Like I go out and I go to things even if I'm tired and don't want to go. and my husband's like, get up off the couch. You're going to have a good time. Then I come home and I'm like, it was so fun. Like, yeah. And like, but like those first few events after COVID were like so exhausting because I just hadn't done it in a long time. And I think that if you're someone listening and you're like, I'm like trying to make more friends.
Speaker: I want to do that. But like being in person in a group setting is so intimidating or I always feel so exhausted when I get home. Like it might just be because you're not doing it enough for it to feel like normal And even like my husband's really introverted, but even he has like his groups of people where, yes, he has to have some like alone recharge time after, but it's still like fulfilling and energizing in the way that being in community is for us as social beings.
Speaker: Mm hmm. Yeah, that's actually I mean, there's a there's like actually like a few points here, but I think there there really is something to be said for that. Like, I think there is a pretty big distinction, right? Because I think sometimes there can be a lot of kind of dialogue around. Well, yeah, like I'm really I'm just like really introverted and.
Speaker: It's such a struggle for me. And I think it's kind of great here that you, you know, you were able to use the example of of your partner and and, you know, you're like, he's actually really introverted. But I think it's like, even at the end of the day, whatever it looks like for for you, if you are somebody who maybe struggles a little bit more with it, whatever kind of like path that you want to go on in order to like make some sort of connections, maybe unfortunately, if someone's listening to this, they might be like, oh, damn it. it's it's like a non-negotiable, right? Like, unfortunately, like, we're pack people, we're community people, we're we're fucking animals.
Speaker: it's It's like, I talk about this sometimes, like, it's it's survival, you know? We we literally can't survive this life without people. And again, it could be one, it could be two, it could be three, you could have 50, you could have a hundred, but like you need somebody. yeah i think, you know, even, even sometimes if some, you know, somebody says, well, I just, I, you know, I just like to be alone. Like I don't, I don't like having people around, like it just, um, or makes you really anxious or whatever it is. And it's, and sometimes I think like, you know, it is true. And then that, and that is valid, but part of like, yeah, the human experience, the human fucking condition, like we, mean we need each other.
Speaker: um deeply. So yeah, I think that's like a really interesting conversation because think it can also be a little bit touchy, right? Because I think it can feel very like, well, like it doesn't work for me or like it makes me really anxious or like I just don't enjoy it or like I don't enjoy the process of like going out and being uncomfortable, right? And then you have the side who's like, oh my God, just do it. Like it's not that hard. And I think like it's not as easy as like, oh, just do it.
Speaker: But I also think, yeah, the other solution can't be like, oh, well, I just don't like people. I don't want anybody because it's, for our like mental and physical health we we truly cannot survive without community of some sort and I think it comes back to like the discomfort conversation of yeah but all like all great things in life require little bit of discomfort and like yes you might feel awkward I always tell people like if we're if they're going to an event they're nervous I'm like
Speaker: just go up to somebody ask them what they do I mean in a networking setting it's like what do you do where do you live in the city where do you like what do you like to do for fun like ask them kind of the non-threatening like icebreaker questions that are easy for everyone to answer or my favorite like I'm like oh I like your earrings or this color pink really works on you or whatever like so non-threatening it's an easy way to like get in past the discomfort and then you're like doing it and then if you have like a good conversation sometimes that's going to be an awkward conversation and you're not going to vibe and like okay whatever but like a lot of the time it's like you probably will meet like one person that you vibed with at an event i always say like invite them to like a coffee or drinks or whatever
Speaker: And you can acknowledge that it's that you're feel uncomfortable about it You can say, hey I feel a little bit awkward asking this, but like I'm trying to challenge myself to get out there and like meet new people. And we had a great conversation. Like, do you want to get coffee? I always tell people I'm like, the worst thing that can happen is that you have like an awkward coffee.
Speaker: And then you decide that this isn't like the person for you. A hundred percent. Yeah, that's exactly it. You know, obviously when you're in it, you're just like, oh God, you know, my minute feels like a lifetime, but you know, it passes.
Speaker: Recently they were asking me, like how do you talk to people? Right? Like, do you ever feel uncomfortable? How do you make conversation? and kind of what I was saying was, you know, not Like, yeah, you know, I really do feel like I can kind of make conversation with anybody, by the way, not to be mistaken for i feel totally comfortable a lot of the time. No, I, you know, like I said, I definitely feel awkward. I definitely say shit sometimes that I'm like, what?
Speaker: That's so weird. um But to kind of um her point and her question was like, you know, do is it difficult to make conversation? Like, how do you do that? and I, and my response was, and this kind of goes back to the fun component and kind of just how I've being from a really young age of the bigger you allow your life to be, the more interesting that you allow your life to be, the more intentional you are about seeking out and creating the life that you, you know, having your dreams, the more shit you have to talk about and more people you can relate to. Right? So I feel like there's always, there's always like something that I can like relate to or be like, I've been there. I've seen that. I've done that. Oh my God, that's so cool. I saw you did this thing. So all to say,
Speaker: It's not, you know, foolproof and it's probably not the only way, but I think like the, one of the best icebreakers or one of the best way to be able to kind of come up with icebreakers is like, yeah, set out to like live a really, really fucking epic life first and the rest kind of unfolds a lot easier.
Speaker: I think, too, that's like a great way to meet people if you're worried about feeling uncomfortable. If you have like if you're a sports person, if you grew up playing softball or volleyball or whatever, like if you're in a place that has like a community league or like a co-ed league or whatever, like joining that and you already have something in common because you already have this shared interest. And it can be a really like, well, we already have something to talk about.
Speaker: And if it goes beyond that, great. And I think to your point about like living a big life, it's yeah, going out and being like, yeah, I'm going to join this thing because I miss playing volleyball in high school and there's a community league like the next town over whatever. I'm going to join that and try it out for a season or just like getting out there and trying new group activities and finding the one that sticks for you because you're probably not going to love every group thing that you attend. i know there are groups that I'm like, yeah, one was enough. And like, that's not my place. And that's okay. And you deal with a little bit of that discomfort in the moment. And then you're just like, okay, and on to the next.
Speaker: Yeah. Yeah, exactly. I mean, that actually is a really good one, like joining kind of group spaces. But I think too, it's like, let's just say somebody was like, oh i you know, I don't really like sports. I don't really like joining like, i don't know, like a pottery class or whatever it is. I think there, something that maybe doesn't seem super obvious is there actually is a lot of power and a lot of, um I think, importance in, you can still like do a bunch of shit on your own, but it's kind of like the doing that's the important thing. Like do a bunch of things, try a bunch of things on, like say yes to a lot of things, because in doing that, when you do come across people, you'll have more to talk about and you'll have probably more areas of your life that cross over with somebody else. Right.
Speaker: feel like I'm a really big believer in that. Like do the things that you want to do. Right. Like if there's anything you're like, I wish I traveled there. Like, oh, you know, really wish that took like piano lessons, you know, or I really wish I could like literally all of those things that you say that you wish you wanted to do.
Speaker: Obviously, I know there are some like um there are financial restrictions. Exactly. There's some restrictions. Yeah. But if you can do it physically or financially, whatever it is, do it.
Speaker: Do it. You know, um I really do feel like the world opens up to you when you really kind of like live your life the way that you want to. It's kind of like the rest follows. You know, it's like the fucking universe just knows what's up and is like, OK,
Speaker: okay, I see you. You did the work. Now let me kind of um gift this to you in return or or or kind of like land this in your lap. That's my, that's my, that's my like icebreaker like advice. Just like, do you have a lot of fun, live a cool ass life and everything else becomes exponentially easier in terms of friendship making and building community and like meeting your people, you know, and feeling comfortable.
Speaker: Have you had any like turning point moments in your life where you're like, I'm just going to go out and try this and that like specifically stick out to you as like a, this is a moment that changed so many things for me.
Speaker: Honestly, probably when i left Canada in 2022 and went traveling, that was like a really, really, and again, by the way, if anyone's listening, like it doesn't, it doesn't need to be as extreme as this. and There's like lots of things you could do that like, you know, are still really supportive in your pursuit of meeting people and things like that. But um yeah, I think probably 2022 selling, you know, all the things, selling the apartment, getting one way ticket to Mexico. And, you know, that was 2022. We're in 2026. Now it's almost been five years. Like I'm still on the fucking road, which is crazy to say, but I think that was this thing that I really wanted to do for so long, but it always felt very unattainable because I worked in hospitality for over a decade.
Speaker: Obviously it's fitting. It makes sense. And I always was like, oh, you know, i'm I'm bound. I can't do this thing. So I kind of always like slotted in travel where I could. And then when met my partner, because he had been working remotely for years before that, and I was like, fuck, okay, how do I figure this out Like, how do I do that? Because i want I want to be able to travel. I want to be able to work. And I want autonomy over my space and location and time.
Speaker: I can't attribute, you know, everything that I have now is because of that, but I really do believe that a lot of of what my life looks like now comes from from that. whether Whether it actually the reason things transpired the way they did or...
Speaker: It might've just been the thing that helped me like exercise that muscle of being like, oh, I want to do the thing, just do the thing. And when you do the thing, you see the kind of unrabbles. I think that was the first time of like really exercising that muscle of of like, okay, you said you want to do something, so follow through on it and do it. And so now I feel like after that particular situation, yeah, now it feels like so much easier to be like, okay, we'll just do the thing. Like, You always kind of get kind of like gifted and in blessed in return. And you've still you said you're still on the road since then. oh my God. Where have you been since that moment?
Speaker: Oh, God, everywhere. So um the list is too long. The list is too long. I mean, now I'm kind of at the end of it where i'm like, I want a home and I need to, you know, have some sort of grounding. But oh my gosh, like most of, almost all of South America. Yeah, part of Central America. Also like a lot of North America, almost all of...
Speaker: The Balkans, majority of Eastern Europe, Africa, like a big part of Africa, kind of like the northern part. au We did like a big trip, actually, my partner and I, which was like this eight month trip through Africa from the north. And we kind of traveled all the way down to the south. I'm trying to think of where else because we actually I always stay in places for a long time. like I'll always stay in a country for a month to two months just because obviously I'm working at the same time.
Speaker: haven't really done Asia or like Oceania, like, um, Australia and New Zealand like that just the time zone difference, but yeah planning a trip to Japan in February. So if you've been, or you know, anyone who's been would love the wrecks.
Speaker: Um, but yeah, I mean, now I'm kind of, you know, going into like a new chapter where I'm like, Oh, i want a home and I want plants and want a routine and I want all of those things i didn't want five years ago.
Speaker: Um, But yeah, it's been really interesting. Actually, to kind of tie this all back, one thing that I both, well, me and my partner kind of said to each other was like, you know, we really, really, really want to create a global community, like where we have people all over the world we feel connected to and like we have friends everywhere. And I think this year was really the first year that I was like, oh, fuck.
Speaker: Damn, we did it. um And now it's kind of like anywhere we go in the world, we... have people to link up with, you know, we have friends to connect with. if I have this running list. It's called community actually. It's in my notes app and it's called community and it's kind of broken down by like, um ah I don't know, it's like by country. Like some places would be like New York or I'll have like a list of New York people. It'll be like Germany or it'll be South Africa or it'll be, you know. So it was very, very cool to a kind of like, yeah, act on, act on like a dream or a thing that I wanted to do. um
Speaker: And then B, kind of the outcome ah outcome of it would be like, okay, sweet, we'll have friends all over the world. And then C, to kind be like, oh, oh, we did it Cool.
Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. It's so cool when you have those moments to be able to look back and be like, oh I like accomplished the thing that I set out to do that felt like a lofty goal at the time. And you're just like, but I did that.
Speaker: Yeah. I think kind of back to our conversation too of like, yeah, awkward, discomfort, all of those things. i think I think that has been like a very, not like a very big part, but definitely a big part. Because like a lot of these people and connections that we made on the road, you know, it's like people you're meeting from like different cultures and different backgrounds and all of these things. So, and people that you might not have as many things in common with, right? You're kind of like meeting them in passing, you're meeting them on the road. So yeah, I think a lot of things that we spoke about today were kind of like put into action in order to create all these kind of like people all around the world, all those those relationships.
Speaker: I love that for you. That's so special. And I think I'm curious to hear what tips you have, because I know you talk a lot about part of friendship is intentionally maintaining friendship and reaching out to people. And as your community gets bigger and more broad locationally, how do you approach intentionality in maintaining friendships all over the place? wasn't These tips are not like amazing. They're pretty fucking basic. But I think something that for me, that's actually really, really, really helped.
Speaker: and I think this is something that we have, yeah, we've we've kind of lost or we don't place as much as much importance on it anymore. But two things actually. So if when I meet somebody new, if I vibe with them and I'm like, you're cool, gonna hang out with you again. I'll always write down their name and then I'll write like a little note beside their name of like where I met them and how I know them and kind of like what I liked about them. And then within meeting them, I'll i'll message them like within a couple days or maybe even the next day and be like, you know, hey, it was like so lovely meeting you. Like, how is your next week? like Like, let's make a plan. Let's hang out. That was the two parts. you Like keep keeping like a like a running list of people and then following up.
Speaker: Like the follow up. The follow up. You know, I think like that's a really, really big part that we have kind of forgotten about. And I have this half written thread actually about this. It's been sitting in my drafts for a long time. But it's it's kind of of the conversation of, oh, I forgot. Or, oh, I don't know. I didn't have time.
Speaker: And i I so understand that, but I think now the reason why I don't feel like I kind of fall into that anymore is because, and you might relate to this, I feel like getting older, if I don't write it down, didn't happen, never thought of it, it's gone up my head, like it's nothing, it's absolutely nothing. So just really getting to that habit of like, just write this shit down, write this shit down, make a reminder in your whatever calendar or notes app or whatever you use. Because it's funny, when i whenever I look at my schedule each day, like half the things are follow up with this person, text this person, text this person. You know, and and it's, I sometimes catch myself being like, I need to do this thing. And then I'll be like, Hey, I'll remember. I'll remember like, whatever. Don't remember. It's gone. And then I feel bad. Right. When you come to the message, you're like, fuck, I like you know, left you, left you on read for three weeks. Now the conversation is like weird if I bring it up now. So yeah, i think that's a really, really big piece. And I know we use the word intentional a lot and it's buzzword and it's become kind of obnoxious, but there's like the want and the desire here. And then there's the kind of disgruntled frustrated part over here. And it's because the effort, I think the effort and the intentionality piece of the puzzle is missing.
Speaker: And I know that might be kind of annoying to hear, but um i was even sharing this recently with someone where I was like, this shit's exhausting, like keeping track of all this following up with people and making plans and,
Speaker: writing writing the notes, you't the reminders so you don't forget. Like, holy fucking hell. Yeah, it's it's exhausting and it takes time and you have to like really want it. And I think you had said it before in the beginning of our call of kind of like everybody wants it, but but no one's like really willing to kind of like put in the work. Like we kind of live in a society that makes you think that it just like creates itself. um the behind so and bes yeah But behind the scenes, there's like people who are really putting in genuine effort yeah Yeah. And like we're all busy. And i think, too, that like this was such a big game changer for me in building my own community. so i moved to the Southwest for college and then came back. I dropped out of college at 19. And so I like moved back. I hadn't kept in touch with a lot of people.
Speaker: I like didn't really know anyone like I was living with my sister. So it's like I had my sister and my roommates. and But beyond that, it was like I didn't feel like I had any like close friends or close community.
Speaker: And she said something to me because I was just getting super down and being like no one's reaching out to me like no one wants to hang out. And she goes, well, are you reaching out to them?
Speaker: And I was like, you make a good point there. And like that comment was honestly like it was such an impassing comment. But like it literally was such a game changer for me where I was just like, oh, yeah.
Speaker: And then even if I had to like lie to myself about it for a while, where I was just like, if I reach out to them, they're going to want to hang out with me. Because everyone wants someone to reach out to them to hang out. And so I just have to go in with that assumption. and maybe it's not always true, but most of the time it's true. And you have to give yourself the opportunity to have that outcome too.
Speaker: Yeah, like 100%. I love that you brought this up, actually, because I ran this like free, this kind of like community building, village builder or social experiment. um And one of the kind of like prompts for the day, there was like other things around it. But the main part of the prompt was like, be the inviter. It's very easy to kind of be like, a fuck, like, I want to go to this thing. or like why'm you know why why and Why is no one reaching out to me? Again, right? There's obviously circumstances where it's were literally only ever the one to reach out to someone and they never once sent a message to you. That's weird. There's something like a miss there. But yeah, it's it's it's so funny too, because when you pull out how this bird's eye view, right? We have all these people who are just like sitting around being like, are am I going to be invited? Are they going invite me? but and everyone wants to be invited, but but no one wants to kind of... um
Speaker: be the inviter and I don't know what it is and I don't know if there's a bit of like a cringe factor that's attached to it like oh you know it feels kind of lame or if there are people feel like it's desperate or if people feel or or people kind of feel like well why should i right why aren't you and I think once once you kind of move past those feelings you also become a lot less attached to the outcome right so if they say like oh I'm busy you're kind of like whatever sweet okay that's fine like I'll invite somebody else or um this actually This actually lends itself really well to the kind of like, you know, be the inviter conversation. It's also creating the things, right? And again, this is not everyone's disposition, right? This is not something that everybody cares to do, likes to do, has the skills to do. But if you are, and a good example of this is the last two summers. So this summer and the summer before I was spending in Lisbon and, you know, my partner and I were new. We didn't really know, like we knew a few people.
Speaker: And I was like, fuck, okay, our apartment's so tiny. Like I don't have anywhere to gather anybody. So we ended up hosting this dinner party in a park. We just like rented a bunch of tables, rented tablecloths, rented like wine glasses. We have flowers. We did this a whole kind of long table dinner in the park.
Speaker: And that's kind of all to say of of, yes, you know, sure be the inviter. But another, i think another tool that we have that we don't utilize and don't realize sometimes is like, you know, if you want to be in a certain environment and you want to be around certain people, and you want to be in a certain event, like you also have, you also have like the agency and the control to like create it, you know? Yeah. Well, you know, whatever other event you're going to, that's just another person who created it. So why can't you, you know, why can't we, why can't I do the same thing?
Speaker: And then you get to hang out with all the people you want hang out with. so yes, it's. Yeah. And I think you can start small too, right? Like exactly if a dinner party or whatever feels like out of your wheelhouse one of the things that I want to bring back is like I'm just gonna go to the grocery store with you i'm just gonna like mundane shit yeah we're like I have a friend and bless her one of my best friends and she'll she'll be like hey I'm going to the Trader Joe's by your house do you want to come
Speaker: I love that. Or I have to run errands today and I really don't want to. Do you want to come with me? Like, and yeah yes, I do. Like, i I want to hang out with her. i want to chat. I don't really care what we're doing. Like just going over to someone's house and watching TV. i have a friend that she's like in the film industry, loves to just veg and watch TV. I go over to her house with my knitting and I watch should watch TV with her. Like,
Speaker: And yeah those moments are really intentional too, in a way, where it's like, we don't think to do that. Or we're like in Midwest culture here, like people are really afraid of being a burden or like imposing on other people. And I'm just like, impose. Like, I'm always going to be the friend that's like, oh, you're busy every night, but five of those nights you're home, I'm going to be at your house. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like I love to throw gathering. I love to throw a party. I'm right there with you of like, let's do a dinner party. Like, let's pull something together. um but if you're not that person, yeah like, let's go for a walk.
Speaker: at this park let's go do you want to come over for dinner and you get takeout like it doesn't have to be this like super planned out thing and i think people have in their heads that like in order to have those moments they have to be really intentional you have to be going out to like a restaurant if you're getting dinner or you have to you know like prep a whole course meal if you're hosting someone for dinner at your home or whatever like I used to have friends that would come over to watch The Bachelor every week which was really just a way for us to hang out yes and they'd bring their like
Speaker: microwave meal or order takeout to my house or like whatever. And like someone would bring a bottle of wine and everyone would just kind of bring like the half open bags that they have of snacks from their house. And we just have our little like hangout, low effort, low budget, easy, really chill, but really connected. Like those are my favorite memories of hanging out with them, even though I've done all kinds of like events that they've come to, like all kinds of more quote unquote like intentional or special. But those little moments matter a lot too. And it doesn't have to be this like big overblown event for it to matter and for it to be community building.
Speaker: oh yeah I feel like you really said it too, where you said, yeah, but but we're still connected. Because we're talking about, right, we were saying like, oh you know, everywhere you look now, especially online, is like community, community, community, community. That's like the thing. It's so funny. was going to say trend, even though it's like this is not trend. It's like, you know, literally how we like live and breathe. But it feels very kind of trendy right now.
Speaker: And because of that, it feels like what's happened is like the point that you just said, like, yeah, it's not like that cute or aesthetic, but like, whatever, we're connected, we're hanging out we're having fun. that's That's the whole point, right? Like that's that's the um kind of like North Star of the whole whole situation. But because it's become so kind of, it's buzzy and trendy, what what feels like what's happened is the aesthetic of it has become like the like the Instagram ability of it, the shareability of it has kind of become, it kind of plays like center stage.
Speaker: And the connection part, which is the whole fucking point, has kind of been lost. So anyway, maybe that's a product of like the 90s or like the early 2000s, right? Where like people are just like showing up to people's houses and you didn't even the call before because you couldn't really like call and don't answer and you'd be like, hey, I'm on your front door. but You know? yeah And it's so funny because as someone who grew up in that time, i i lived kind of in the country, so I didn't really have like close enough neighbors to just like be like walking up to someone's door. Mm-hmm. But yeah, even if it was like, oh, I call my friend, you want to hang out tonight? And like my dad's driving me over to her house and whatever. And it was like all these last minute plans. But I think about like um my husband grew up in a small town, like 15, less than 1500 people. yeah, like...
Speaker: he's like yeah i like was always over at this friend's house and we were like biking and playing in the park and doing whatever. And like, I think that's what small towns do really, really well is they need each other to be resources so much more because there aren't those like convenience things that we have like here in the city, for example, is like, it's really easy. i don't have kids, but like,
Speaker: If I needed a babysitter, there are a million and one options in the city for getting a babysitter. If you need a babysitter in a small town, you're asking the kid next door. like And so you kind of like by default have that more like pop in and whatever. And I think we've gotten really annoyed with the like, oh, I'm just going to pop in and get a coffee. And especially, like I said, here in the Midwest, imposition is like really impolite. right And there's this like, oh, well, if I just show up, I'm imposing. And that's impolite and whatever. And I'm just like, as annoying as it can be sometimes to like, now I have to get up from off the couch and entertain a person. Like, no, we need that. I need someone to just like show up and be like, let's have coffee and chat for an hour. And then i have to go and run my errands. Yeah, like was in neighborhood. gotten away from it.
Speaker: but it used to be so common like you said like in the it's like were just like pop showing up at someone's door like hey i'm here well i think also too i feel like it's kind of a product of like how much technology we have at our fingertips because before we weren't able to text back and forth about it right why well monday doesn't work what what is next week oh next week doesn't really work what about next week right we weren't even able to have that fucking conversation first of all um you phone the house someone doesn't answer you're just like okay well I guess I'm just gonna show up see if she's home I'll see if she's home you never know us maybe someone's on the other line you never know like there was just less technology that allowed us to kind of go back and forth and back and forth and back and forth and you talked about it for so long now and and and now it's a month later and you still haven't set a date you know like there was just so many less opportunities I think to um avoid it um or reschedule or or like opt out um and like you know we
Speaker: yeah obviously you probably know this too um our schedules were also just like a lot less full we just like had less shit going on so it like genuinely probably was easier to just be like i was in the neighborhood hey how's it going yeah it's very interesting like it's like it's one of these conversations feel like you could go on and on and on about and it's really is like at the intersection of of technology and it's at the intersection capitalism and it Yeah, it all kind of like bleeds into one another and and each one has like a, a yeah. yeah And I think from like an actionability standpoint, if you're like, oh, I miss that too. Like, I wish I could do that, but I don't know how. Like, it is just being the person who's willing to
Speaker: impose and just like do that. Like yeah i I think about it. So I live in the city, but in like a neighborhood and our next door neighbor right when we moved in, she's pretty chatty, no filter, just like came up and was like chatting with us. And so we like kind of became friends with her. But then we got new neighbors on the other side and they seemed cool. And like, I think it was the day they were literally moving their cats inside their home. And I was like, hi, I'm Gail and this is my partner and this is our dog and this is like whatever. yeah And my husband was like, she's so embarrassing. I'm so sorry.
Speaker: And I think they were off put by it at first, but it's like now we have like our neighborhood cookouts like every once in a while, probably like once a quarter. I had them over to our house. Like our dog knows that. Like, and yeah, you have to be the one to be what, even if it's not like that, I wasn't actively inviting them to anything in that moment or like being the inviter, but it's just like, I was just the one to open that door yeah of like, yeah, you're moving into a great neighborhood. Like everyone's really friendly here and call me if you need anything. And I think that imposing too,
Speaker: Like the calling your neighbor if you need a cup of sugar kind of thing. Like you also invite people to do that to you. Yeah. And you also open that door to be the person asked. You're going to say yes to those things too.
Speaker: Very, very good point. And that actually that actually works across a lot of different things, right? Like the way that you show up and the way that you act gives other people permission to show up that way, right? So it like it could be like asking for the the cheese braider or or it could also be reaching out. that's ah That's a really big thing people have a hard time with. Like, hey, I'm actually like kept going through a really hard time right now. Like, yeah, I do fucking need support. And I think it's like, again, right? And the way in which you act informs and also signals to other people like, oh okay, like I can do that too. you know i can ask for help. And you know those talk people might even think you know the first time they hear they might be like, oh, it's so annoying. But plants a seed.
Speaker: And then one when maybe when it comes around to them, then they feel more open to be like, oh, I'm going to ask too So I think Yeah, if there is, you know, not one takeaway, but I think this is a really good takeaway from this from this conversation is, you know, it's the way that you show up gives permission to other people to show up that way as well. I think a lot of people do need that permission, you know, because like you said, a lot of people don't want to be burdened. A lot of people don't want to bother people. A lot of people are like, oh my God, you know, and we need to be, we all need to be bothered more.
Speaker: Truly. Yeah. You know? Be the imposition you wish to see in the world. Exactly. a Yes, I was actually thinking that. Yes, exactly. say Yes.
Speaker: Yes. Okay, well, this has been such a lovely conversation and I hate to cut it off, but I am going to ah wrap up so up. It has been truly so lovely getting to chat and I'm so glad that you came on. Adela, where can people find you if they want to hear all of your great community tips or get involved in your community?
Speaker: So luckily, great. My Instagram, my threads are exactly the same. So it's at edela, E-D-I-L-A dot Smith, S-M-I-T-H. And it's the same on Instagram, same on threads. I'm always on stories, posting to the feed, sharing ridiculous shit on threads as everybody else is. Yeah, you can find me there. Awesome. Well, thanks so much for being on. yeah Thank you so much for listening. You can find this episode and more wherever you listen to podcasts. And you can follow us on Instagram at Where Is Your Humanity Pod.
Speaker: Our lovely theme music is created by Emily Bjorki. And you can listen to her new single, No Angel, out now. And her upcoming album, Are You Going to Heaven or Hell, out on October fifteen For more information about me, Gail, and the work that I do, you can go to worksimple.io, my website, or you can follow me on all the platforms, Instagram, TikTok, threads, also at worksimple.io. See you next time.
