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6 | Dalek (S1E6)
22 Plays15 days ago
In episode six, we talk about the episode "Dalek!" a truly impactful experience for all involved. We talk topics such as Phantom of the Paradise, British museums, and the morals of memory wiping!
--- Find the show here ---
- Website: MeYouAndDoctorWho.carrd.co
- Patreon: Patreon.com/meyouanddoctorwho
- Instagram: Instagram.com/meyouanddoctorwho
- Twitter: X.com/MeYouAndDW
- TikTok: Tiktok.com/@meyouanddoctorwho
- Discord: https://discord.gg/jkZ63FrcP8
--- Credits ---
- Creators, hosts, & illustrators: Julia C. and Hailey Dorritie
- Editing: Julia C.
- Social Media: Hailey Dorritie
- Music: Half.Cool
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Transcript
First Recording & Popularity
00:00:18
Speaker
Hi everyone! Welcome to me, and Doctor I hope we harmonized with that. I can't exactly tell over Discord. But hello! It'll be funnier if not. it would be.
00:00:31
Speaker
ah Hi, welcome. ah This is our first official recording after i think the podcast has been released. uh correct i think this is what yeah this is the first time we're recording uh hello scary i hope you like us like us we have like 12 downloads or something last time i checked we're so popular um we're basically famous yeah yeah hayley's been making waiting in my trailer jokes uh and i've been making first on the call sheet jokes uh but
00:01:05
Speaker
I'm excited for the episode we're going to
Episode 'The Bumper' Analysis
00:01:07
Speaker
watch today. We just finished watching The Bumper. ah It's probably one of the first ah emotionally tense episodes, if I can recall.
00:01:18
Speaker
like ah kind of We've kind of been goofing and farting around in quite literal senses of the word the past few episodes. And ah I think this is the first time, you know, stuff gets real for a little bit.
00:01:33
Speaker
Hayley, what did you think of the bumper that we just watched? Well, clearly it's time to leave that baby crap at home. I've allowed to say that right. I can't remember what I've allowed to say.
00:01:46
Speaker
Oh, but yeah, we're exploring a museum of sorts, I guess. ah People are getting blasted like crazy. All dead, they say. of Salt Lake City is dead. All of them, every single one. And also, we see a bit of skin from the ninth doctor. Ooh, things are getting saucy. Some tasteful nudity. No, it's not.
00:02:10
Speaker
ah He's clearly in trouble, but I don't know why his shirt is off. That's crazy. He chose that way. Yeah, I don't know. ah This is probably an episode I remember i remember um not like quite a bit from, but a lot of scenes stand out to me, and I do believe I do know how this ends in give or take.
00:02:32
Speaker
ah But I'm excited to be reminded of it and ah experience the scenes for the first time. Well, not the first time, but Basically like the second or third time because I don't remember how many times I've seen this episode.
00:02:43
Speaker
ah But I'm excited for Hayley to watch it for the first time. I have seen this episode of No Dream before. Oh, yeah? so I'm pretty... Yes. I'm pretty familiar it. So you know how it ends and how they all become besties in the end, right?
00:02:57
Speaker
Exactly. Yeah, we might as well not even watch it. Yeah. You know what? Let's turn off the podcast. I actually hate this show. This is our final episode. This is... We're never coming back.
00:03:09
Speaker
Well, that's crazy for us to say because I think... oh No, I can't. that's i That's not crazy for me to say.
Credits & Pronunciation Debate
00:03:16
Speaker
I'm imagining in the future because ah the next episode, as of recording, that's coming out is the end of the world. And then and then I believe we're taking a break for a week, especially because I'm going to be out of town for a little bit. ah So we're getting those done ahead of time.
00:03:30
Speaker
And I don't know when this episode that we're recording is coming out. Probably like next, the month after that. I think so. That's like episode two. This is episode six.
00:03:40
Speaker
I don't, I don't know. We'll figure it out. Uh, but to, to get the credits, uh, in, uh, this, this episode was written by, ah we've got a bit of a new group of people except for like Phil Collinson. I think we've heard of, I think we've seen Phil, Phil Collinson before. Uh, but, uh,
00:04:00
Speaker
The writer for this episode is Robert Shearman, and the director is Joe Ahern. Joe Ahern, Joe Ahern. I probably should look up these names and how they're pronounced before i start recording. Before you start making Minecraft villager noises. Yeah. spongebob spongebob and uh produced uh by phil collinson so that is our crew or our head crew for today i'm sure there's a bunch of lovely people who worked on this episode you know it takes a village to raise this baby and i'm so glad we get to witness it so uh anything else you want to say hayley before we start
00:04:43
Speaker
I'm very excited. ah Please remind me it's pronounced Dalek, right? I'm saying it correct this time. I mean, like, only British people say it, so we only have the British pronunciation to go off on.
00:04:55
Speaker
but Which is basically wrong. Yeah, which is always wrong. ah We should be pronouncing it Dalek. um Of course. I think there might be some future episodes with, like, American characters who go Dalek.
00:05:07
Speaker
ah But I'm actually not 100% sure. But it would be really funny if they did. um i hope so. I hope so. I want to see them. i I think I know who the first American character is, and I'm excited to see when he shows up. But ah we still have a time to go before that.
00:05:22
Speaker
i Well. I guess it's time to watch Dalek. I'm strapped in. I'm ready. I'm bracing myself. hope nothing bad happens. o Scary.
00:05:34
Speaker
Scary. I'm done with these side quests. I'm ready to get into the the real meat and potatoes of this adventure. Getting my big
Intense Performances & Plot Discussion
00:05:40
Speaker
boy boots right now. All right, we'll see you on the other side. Bye-bye.
00:05:46
Speaker
Trigger warnings for this episode include character death, screaming, medical gore, and drug mention.
00:05:53
Speaker
Oh boy! Oof. Welcome back! That episode was... So, actually, I thought I had a great time watching it, actually.
00:06:04
Speaker
i was about to be, like, sarcastic with it, but genuinely, i think so far that was probably the best one we watched. Oh, that was easily the best episode. Yeah, the freaking monologues and, like, the speeches people... all ah they Like...
00:06:21
Speaker
Christopher Eccleston and ah Billy Piper just on their A-game. Not that they aren't, you know, in ah in other episodes, but like, they, they, ooh, it was just really good this episode.
00:06:31
Speaker
ah
00:06:34
Speaker
If I could, please, I push my mic towards you. what what are your What are your thoughts? What are your fresh thoughts on the episode? ah Bats the mic off of the table like a cat.
00:06:46
Speaker
But yes, so easily best episode so far. lot of intense, great scenes. I'm sure old fans must have been going cuckoo crazy. Cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs, you might say.
00:06:56
Speaker
Don't get me wrong. i've like I've been enjoying it all up until this point. This has been a very fun show. And I've been and really enjoying recording and watching it with you. But I think specifically when he said you would have been a great Dalek,
00:07:10
Speaker
I think I physically felt something switch in my brain where I was like, oh, I think I'm obsessed with this now, actually. Literally, oh my gosh. Like, that is... I keep saying stuff like, uh, like, this is so iconic, this is iconic.
00:07:25
Speaker
This is iconic. It was, it really was. Okay? This is like, like, I'm gonna go through the episode and we're gonna talk about, you know, you know, and ah as scene by scene as we can get, I guess, but, like, just to get the elephant out of the room, like,
00:07:39
Speaker
That like a affected people in such a way. It affected Yeah, I'm so glad you're experiencing it for the first time. Cause that, yeah, that line really hits hard.
00:07:53
Speaker
Especially cause- just all the stuff he's going through. Okay, I can't- I feel like I'm getting ahead of myself- We gotta start! We gotta start! ah Hashtag America! We're in America now!
00:08:06
Speaker
ah ah The Americaness started sooner than I thought it would, actually. I thought the first American character was going to be in, um I think it's called the Doctor Dances or something.
00:08:18
Speaker
dances? Or the Empty Child. Yeah, he boogies down. no Oh, yes. ah ah The Empty Child, I think it's what it's called. There's a there's an American side character.
00:08:30
Speaker
um I that I remember ah very clearly and I and I was I was pretty sure that was our like first American character, but turns out ah We're actually gonna be taking ah place in Utah We're not gonna see much of Utah though because we're gonna be in a bunker this whole time.
00:08:47
Speaker
We are under Utah. We are under Utah Many many floors, at least 50 floors under Utah. um It is technically the future, but it's only 2012. This episode came out in 2005, so it's very funny that that was considered the future.
00:09:06
Speaker
um Especially when you get to the part where the Dalek absorbs the like internet. like The 2012 internet was a place to be, truly. Sure was, baby.
00:09:18
Speaker
Uh, but the the doctor and Rose, they basically, uh, what was it? The TARDIS like caught a signal and, uh, the TARDIS caught a vibe and landed in a, in a Utah basement.
00:09:30
Speaker
Uh, I don't, I mean, i don't know for sure. Is area 51 in Utah? I'm pretty, it's either Utah or Nevada. Hold on. It is in Nevada. Okay. Okay. Okay. So this is not, so this is not area 51. So I thought there was going to be like a little reveal of like,
00:09:45
Speaker
Where do you think you are? This is Area 51 or something. Where do you think you are? e Yeah, i well, I guess Area 51 would be more of like a less of a museum and more of like a scientific lab studying aliens or something. I think because that's what we're we all assume Area 51 is if it's anything at all.
00:10:04
Speaker
ah But I think this is just some random rich guy's personal museum of like alien artifacts, basically. Uh, and this guy's name is Henry Voss Staten.
00:10:15
Speaker
It was a Voss, uh, Voss Stat or Voss Statten. I think it's, I think it's. have Henry Van Staten down in my notes, but I could be wrong. I'm pretty sure it's Staten, but every once in a while, I think, I think at least once the doctor calls him Stat and, uh, they, they landed his like museum and, uh, the little, little, uh, Easter egg, I guess, uh, they see one of the, ah old classic who Cyberman heads, uh, which was,
00:10:42
Speaker
uh really cool because it's not really a spoiler the cybermen do start do show up later in the series i'm pretty sure you know based off like that one tiktok audio of like the dalek and the cybermen like ripping on each other whatever yeah uh so they do come back later but with like different designs but i'm glad that they're not doing a thing where like they used the ah new design for like the artifact head they were like, yeah, Cybermen have always looked like this, but they used an actual like classic Who designed head and he like, this is an old enemy of mine.
00:11:18
Speaker
for my i'm getting old. I think it's- It's my ex lover. Yeah, literally talking about him like they're exes. oh And I'm not sure how old the doctor is at this point,
00:11:32
Speaker
I recall that the 11th Doctor starts saying his age, uh, like every- like, not even every few episodes, but like, at least once a season he'll be like, I am this age.
00:11:43
Speaker
I think the 10th Doctor might throw it around a bit, but I don't think they- Maybe the writers just haven't decided yet on like how old the Ninth Doctor is. He's embarrassed about it. Yeah, he's a little shy.
00:11:54
Speaker
think he might be in the 800s, maybe 900s regarding years, which is very funny because he's like, and then I'm like 907 I'm going travel with this 19-year-old.
00:12:07
Speaker
And so they get like taken in by the soldiers or whatever who work here and we get like a cut to, after the theme song, we get a little cut to of this Henry guy who's in charge of the facility and he's like, all right, secretary lady, tell me, who do you think should become the next president, Republican or Democrat? And she's like, Democrat?
00:12:29
Speaker
And he's like, why? It's like, because they're funny. it's like,
Doctor's Reaction to Dalek
00:12:34
Speaker
yeah. To be fair, Obama's hilarious. Yeah. It is 2012! I actually got it confused because I thought that was the year Trump won was just like, oh, this didn't age well, the the Republican got in.
00:12:46
Speaker
ah But I guess, yeah, that was the year... Was that Obama's second term or first term? That was Obama's second term. Okay, so... So this actually aged fantastically. Yeah, beautifully, actually.
00:12:57
Speaker
Literally calling Obama a funny man. ah I mean, yet he he was capable of being funny, I guess, more than a lot of other presidents. Yeah. Like some people we know. Like some people.
00:13:09
Speaker
um i feel like I have to mention this secretary lady who we sort of like stick with for a while. ah and I'm like almost like certain this is like a British actor doing an American accent because she slipped a lot.
00:13:26
Speaker
I don't know if it's that obvious to like other people, especially maybe British people. ah But like almost like every other sentence, she would like have like a British accent. I'd be like, okay, Miss Girl, you are not from here.
00:13:39
Speaker
get your blue a**. You bleeding heart liberal. You Yankee. It's not even a Yankee. you You lobster. You red coat.
00:13:51
Speaker
yeah up You lobster. You get out of here. Um, and, uh, so I don't believe she was American in the true sense of the word.
00:14:02
Speaker
um but he, introduces he gets introduced to the doctor, uh, just cause they're like, how the hell did you get here? And the doctor's like, wouldn't you like to know whether boy? um and then like, I don't remember why. I think, uh,
00:14:16
Speaker
Oh, it's because the doctor is like, oh yeah, I know a bit about alien technology and like shows off, not even shows off, he just shows him how this like little alien instrument works and that gives him a bit of rapport with this guy to know what alien stuff is. And so he's like, well, if you know so much about alien stuff, can you check out this like machine that's been screaming at us?
00:14:35
Speaker
ah It's not saying anything, but I want it to say stuff so we can like talk to it and figure out what it is. And the doctor's like, all right, whatever. And so he goes and Rose stays behind with another, like, with the with the one other British person there.
00:14:49
Speaker
ah Quote, unquote, the only British person there. ah ah And they lead him into the like containment room that they're keeping the the creature in And you slowly come to realize, oh, this is that this is the Dalek. And the Dalek only stops screaming and starts talking once he realizes the doctor is there.
00:15:14
Speaker
And i think this is the beginning of like the episode like getting really good because you get such... like I would't even know how describe it. Like, such a... I don't want to call it great because it's you know it's awful what he's going through, but such like a realistic, like traumatic response to something.
00:15:34
Speaker
ah Especially something that you're like terrified for your life for. like The doctor immediately... like I don't want to say cowards, but has like a real emotional reaction to this and is desperate to be let out, ah thinking he's about to die.
00:15:49
Speaker
ah But of course, like the Dalek is... you know, his his gun gun is turned off. He doesn't have the power to shoot him, which sends, uh, the doctor on, uh,
00:16:00
Speaker
really good monologue describing like uh what what i would what i would describe as like a master class on like exposition how you deliver exposition in like a very interesting way as opposed to like you know just like dropping dialogue of information just like a whole line of script which i'm sure it was like it was probably a big dialogue heavy script this episode And you really learn a lot, not just of the doctor like explaining it to people, because he doesn't even do that until later, like after he gets out of the room, he like explains it to the Americans.
00:16:37
Speaker
ah when because the dalek doesn't know what's happened he doesn't know about the time war so you get more exposition and information about the doctor's backstory and the dalek's history just from him just from him trauma dumping uh but i feel like it was in a very moving way that like you know i was never my attention was never drawn away i feel like i was like learning information in a way that felt very natural, if that makes sense.
00:17:10
Speaker
Nah, I completely agree. Gosh, but that scene, yeah, that scene was really great. And the secretary was named Goddard, like the dog from Jimmy Neutron. That was her name? I didn't even catch name. I'm pretty sure it was Goddard.
00:17:21
Speaker
I wrote it down in my notes. Unless I'm crazy and I'm having digital hallucinations. I think you're insane, actually, Hayley. Who care? I'll be in my trailer. yeah so No, no, wait, come back!
00:17:33
Speaker
You better up my pay for this. We can't afford another host, okay?
00:17:40
Speaker
Well, you're not going to be able to afford me after long. After this episode. If this continues, this treatment. um You know, he's finished talking to him and he leaves. um He's basically warning the Americans, like, yeah, you have to straight up kill that thing. Because he does start trying to kill it.
00:17:59
Speaker
Like, once the Dalek is like, what do ah what am I supposed to do? And the Dalek, the Dalek. And the doctor is like, here, let me help. I'll just ah kill you. And starts electrocuting it.
00:18:11
Speaker
um And has to be like dragged away by the soldiers. ah I think while this is happening, ah we see that Rose is hanging out with ah the British guy. I forget his name.
00:18:22
Speaker
I don't know. Did you guys- Yeah, his name I didn't catch. Yeah. um He's, like, one of the scientists there. he like collects He, like, collects and studies the artifacts that they get from there. And what what were they talking about? Like, they were, like, low-key flirting a little bit. And I'm like- Yeah, they were just like about to kiss. Yeah, which is crazy because I know we we joke we joke about like Rose leaving her boyfriend, Mickey, but like they don't they never officially broke up, I don't think.
00:18:48
Speaker
I think she was just like, I'm just... No, don't think so. She was just like, I'm going to be gone for a while. um And Mickey was like, so do you want me... What, do you used expect me to wait here for you? And she was kind of like... Yeah, a little. and Yeah, I guess. And I think he just cares- Mickey probably just cares about her so much that even though he says that, like, what do you expect me to wait here for you? He's still going to do that.
00:19:07
Speaker
ah Like, despite himself saying that. And- It's kind of a sad thing to think about that is like- He's such an angel. I love him so much. Especially because this is- they're still on Earth and it's 2012. Like, as far as we know, Mickey is like still- is out there doing his thing. and like, uh, what- so like, what is that like?
00:19:28
Speaker
In Rose's timeline, it's 2006 because she skipped ahead a year, right? So 2012. twenty twelve So that's six years later. So it's probably feasible that Mickey's just around.
00:19:39
Speaker
but i But obviously we can't check in on him at this point because that would like probably ruin ah the timeline or whatever. ah I don't think we... Can't look at his face both. yeah can't can' get a Can't do a quick pop in.
00:19:51
Speaker
But yeah, I thought it was like kind of weird that she was like flirting with him. and ah It's because because they did have chemistry. They talked to each other pretty well. And he started. Oh, totally. Yeah. And he starts showing her like the live feed from the ah containment room of the with the Dalek in it.
00:20:09
Speaker
And Rose, who has never seen Dalek. I don't think she's even heard the doctor talk about. Has the doctor even brought up Daleks at this point? Because he's talked about the time war a little bit and that his planet was wiped out and it was like his fault or whatever.
00:20:24
Speaker
I don't think he's mentioned them specifically. I could be wrong, though. I like i don't think I have it in my notes at all. um I mean, I'm still editing the episodes that are coming out.
00:20:36
Speaker
So, like, I don't remember everything we said from the past episodes. But whenever I'm editing, I'm like, oh, yeah, I did talk about this. And I remember. um He might have mentioned it in ah the last episode where like, I don't know. i I don't remember if he talked about himself that much. I don't remember. I have the crappiest memory. I should not be the one who has to remember everything. Don't make me do it. I will go through with it.
00:20:59
Speaker
ah What was I saying? Oh, yeah. So so Rose probably wouldn't know what a Dalek is. So she's like naturally like empathetic towards it. Which i I feel like I understand. from the From the context she has, it looks like this creature is like screaming and being tortured and he like doesn't yeah like doesn't deserve it.
00:21:16
Speaker
At this point, it probably does deserve it. oh I mean, we get to the point where like it starts changing, but that was because of Rose like showing up and like interacting with it. But at this point in the episode,
00:21:30
Speaker
It kind of probably deserves being tortured and killed because it's kind of a genocidal maniac that, like, doesn't care about any type of life form. I mean, sue me for saying that. ah You bleeding heart. Yeah, literally.
00:21:45
Speaker
Um, I think we come back to, like, the doctor talking to the Americans, and, uh, he sort of does- this is when he gets to, like, a traditional, like, exposition dump. It's like, that's a doll, like, they're doing this, and this is what they're for. And the Americans are like, oh, interesting.
00:22:02
Speaker
Um, I think the doctor also, like, quickly mentions, like, oh, yeah, they have a creator. You'd like him. You'd get along with him, which I think is interesting for the future. yeah. And the American guy, i I don't want to call him Henry. I guess his name is, like, Staten. just call him Staten.
00:22:19
Speaker
ah He sort of, like, realizes, like, so you're the last of your kind, too. And the doctor's like, yeah? question mark ah He's like, cool. What if we did experiments on you?
00:22:33
Speaker
ah And they, like, capture him and, like, chain him up. Shirtless, I must say. ah we get some... We get some doctor chest action ah in in in our show.
00:22:45
Speaker
Some top surgery. Literally, it looked like they were giving him top surgery. They were only aiming at his chest. ah And I was like, no, they're taking they're taking is his... I can't say this word.
00:22:58
Speaker
They're giving him top surgery. That's all we need to know. um You know when trying this way. You know, a wink, a wink, a nudge, a nudge. ah But this also, i remember saying that I was wondering when, like, the drop of, like, ah him having two hearts was going to be. I did not think it was going to be this.
00:23:15
Speaker
I did not remember this part of the episode ah where they, like, x-ray him and they're like, oh, wow, two hearts. I'm going to, like, make this super popular in America. Like, what you talking about? That's it.
00:23:27
Speaker
and That's not feasible. We can't hold two hearts in our ribs. Stop that. ah But it's like a really... Should I like trigger warning this episode for like slight gore? Because those hearts were kind of semi-realistic hearts. I don't see why not, I suppose. like mild gore, I guess.
00:23:44
Speaker
Because they were like beating and it was kind of gross looking. I was like, ugh. Yucky. Yeah, yucky, yucky. Oh yeah, I was gonna point this out. I put a question mark by it in case like it was wrong, but...
00:23:55
Speaker
I thought it might it was like cut either interesting or a plot hole that the doctor says to Staten, you're worse than the Dalek because at least a donnic ah at least a Dalek is honest. you just You're like lying to like the American populace because you know he mentions, like oh yeah, we discovered a cure for the flu or a common cold and we're just common cold yeah and we're just like keeping it under wraps and we're go we're thinking about selling the cure in tiny increments or whatever.
00:24:25
Speaker
and so the doctor is like, yeah, you're just a big freaking liar. At least a Dalek is honest. And then in the next scene, we have the Dalek lying to Rose. So I'm not sure what that was supposed to be.
00:24:40
Speaker
Because like, yeah, that's a good point. Because, you know, Rose hasn't touched the Dalek yet. So hasn't given her, given him. good What are the Dalek's pronouns? I don't know. He becomes she, her by the end of the episode.
Dalek's Threat & Transformation
00:24:52
Speaker
Yeah.
00:24:53
Speaker
because of Rose uh but it like it basically does i don't know if it lies to Rose but it definitely like plays up to her sympathies uh I think it realizes that she's a very empathetic person and uh uses that to its advantage to uh get himself out because I think it knows that uh it needs like a what what did he call it A freaking genetic material. That's what it is.
00:25:21
Speaker
ah Because at this point, Rose is like talking to it and like ah wanting to like free it or like help it. And in a classic human move, ah goes to comfort it with ah with a little touch of her hand and...
00:25:37
Speaker
and I don't know. gets like... She like... It's a burning sound happens, but it doesn't look like she got like physically burned. It just looked like... She was fine. yeah She walked it off.
00:25:49
Speaker
Yeah. Run it under cold water for a little bit. you're You'll be fine, kiddo. And... and ah The dog basically is able to break out because he gets like, he explains later why, but it's because ah Rose is a time traveler, so genetic material from her ah regenerated him, I guess, which is a funny way of putting it, especially when the doctor is the one who regenerates.
00:26:14
Speaker
I guess you get a little, I don't know if this is spoilers if I say this.
00:26:21
Speaker
Okay, I will be as vague as possible. The reason why Time Lords are different than humans is because of their interactions with the Time Vortex, which is that like blue Coraline tunnel that the TARDIS like spins around in That's the Time Vortex. The Brain Blast.
00:26:40
Speaker
So because of their constant interaction with it, they sort of like have become a different species. They're not based on humans or from Earth or anything. ah But they are different from like other other humanoid races because of their interaction their constant interactions with the time vortex and traveling and TARDISes.
00:26:58
Speaker
I guess Rose gets a little bit of that ah just because she's been time traveling for a hot minute. ah But I don't think that's how... ah I don't think she would become a time lord as a result of that, if that makes sense.
00:27:13
Speaker
Yeah, it's just a side effect of the radioactivity. Yeah, literally, literally getting radio. This is like, this episode low-key reminded me of Fallout, the Fallout series. We've got radioactivity. We've got sketchy bunkers. We've got it all.
00:27:29
Speaker
we've got utah we've got america lying to the citizens this is just like fallout um i'm proud to be an american and then like once the dalek actually gets out it like very slowly it doesn't start killing people right away i think because it has to like power up its gun first it like it's it's able to get a strength back just from the genetic material but i guess it needs to absorb the internet to get power for its gun it goes to consume the whole and Yeah, it it like, oh, oh, before he does that, ah we can't forget he like plunges someone to death. ah like
00:28:02
Speaker
Oh, yeah, I wanted to say if ah anyone has ever seen the 1970s horror musical Phantom of the Paradise, there's a seeded net that was brought to mind by the plunger suffocation. I can't imagine like they didn't know what they were doing in Phantom of the Paradise. That was probably a little bit of a Dalek reference. I mean, well, wait, no, wait, that movie came out in 1970.
00:28:26
Speaker
the Yeah, it was like 74. don't know if the classic Who Daleks did that, actually, if they, like, plungered people to death. ah But maybe it was the other way around. Maybe, like, this episode was just more of a reference to Phantom of the Paradise.
00:28:43
Speaker
Oh, my God, that'd be crazy. You know I'm i'm calling up the expert. Yeah. Our friend Ella. Yeah. Oh my gosh, we should've had her for this episode! Aw, if only we do! If only, oh no!
00:28:57
Speaker
But yeah, you he plunged someone to death, and then he goes to download all of the internet. They just say he he downloaded the internet, which is a crazy thing to say. ah he eats it. He downloaded CoolMathGames.com, he downloaded PlayhouseDisney.com.
00:29:12
Speaker
So many racist, outdated YouTube videos. So many Flash games. ah So many ah cat memes. and that was so many i can has cheeseburger images literally and uh go uh that's enough to power up his gun so that's when he starts killing i have next in my notes that like the so at this point the doctor and staten are trying to figure out like how to stop it um and staten wants to keep it alive but uh also doesn't want to die so he's like starting to get desperate and the doctor is like
00:29:46
Speaker
It's like the the the doctor is like, you have to kill it. It's not going to stop killing. And then Sten goes, well, why would it do that? don't know. I just thought that was so funny. Like, don't, dude, this is like an alien creature, like, with who you couldn't even begin to understand that you're just researching so you can make a quick buck off it somehow.
00:30:07
Speaker
Like... Are you stupid? I think I am some kind of doll ecologist. Yeah, are you stupid? Are you dense? Are you duped? Are duped? Yes.
00:30:18
Speaker
of Can we bring up ah all of Salt Lake City is dead yet? Oh yeah, I think it is. Yeah, because the I thought the delivery of that in the bumper was like was like really fast and I was like, I bet they edited that together to make it like really fast and and uh punchy but he literally at that same speed like what's the nearest city salt lake city utah population a million all dead if brought someone i don't know if anyone else has seen this but there is a video out there somewhere of a weatherman i want to say in like texas or something doing a report
00:30:51
Speaker
and the numbers are super wrong and there's one town, I think it was McKinney, where it's like seven bajillion degrees and he goes, everyone in McKinney is there. I've seen that video. that video because it's like clearly they accidentally added like one more digit to like the temperature and he just has to roll with it and just be like, well,
00:31:11
Speaker
It's a thousand degrees over there. I'm pretty sure you guys are all dead. um Everyone in McKinney is dead. You guys are all dead. ah But over here, it's a nice, healthy 78 degrees. Go enjoy that stroll in the park. Yeah, just don't just don't cross that state line over to McKinney.
00:31:28
Speaker
Or you'll burst into flames. Yeah, he, uh, the, the Dalek explains, this is the point where he explains, like, why, uh, Rose's biomass, like, helped him.
00:31:38
Speaker
Uh, at this point, it's a lot of, like, chase sequences, uh, at this point, uh, Rose, uh, and... her little British friend, who's whose name I cannot remember, ah are basically running with soldiers behind them. And the soldiers are dropping like flies, let me tell you.
00:31:55
Speaker
And they enter, like, this courtyard where the'll where the doctor is desperately trying to give these American soldiers advice on, like, how to shoot and kill it. And for some reason, the like...
00:32:07
Speaker
what I can only assume is, like, the captain or sergeant or whatever soldier rank he is, like, the guy in charge, uh, is like, I think a little bit, I think I know a little bit more about American Girl Dolls than you do, genius.
00:32:20
Speaker
just go And it's like, alright guys, we're just gonna blast this guy. and uh, they all die, as a result. And... No one is surprised, but ah Rose and the British guy keep running, and ah and as they're running, ah they the I do believe they're able to pull like the Dalek up on like their their feed, and the Dalek is like, I'm only going to talk to the doctor, and the doctor's like, alright, I'm here.
00:32:45
Speaker
And this is where we get... iconic scene number two ah where the dalek is like begging for orders and i'm so sad that this audio got viral on tiktok out of context because it really is such like a serious audio of the ninth doctor basically telling telling the dalek to like kill itself like because like what else are you good for you genocidal maniac i hate you i hate you okay yeah you literally are killing people on your way here ah Yeah, it makes me so bitter that that audio got a little bit popular on TikTok, just going like, kill yourself.
00:33:21
Speaker
Why don't you just die? And it's like, shut up! He's so sad in that scene. He's so angry. and that And it's at that point where the Dalek does say, like, ah you would make a good Dalek.
00:33:31
Speaker
And the horror that, like, dawns on his face... I really love actors who like, who like take great care in expressing ah their emotions, like even in small ways. Like it's not even just shock. It's literal horror realizing that in himself, that he could potentially be ah the same or ah not even because they he was like, he was willing to accept like, yeah, maybe we are the same.
00:34:01
Speaker
ah But I think the line really is like him being, told that he would be an like an excellent version. If he was a Dalek, he'd be an excellent at it.
00:34:11
Speaker
Which is horrifying to hear. Especially as like, I don't know if they've established this yet, but I think it's kind of implied that like the doctor isn't really the kind of person to like carry a weapon and like attack people.
00:34:27
Speaker
This is kind of the first instance we get, really, of ah him going on the offensive, I think. ah Or at least really desperately trying to. Like, I was, like, really surprised how eager he was to, like, pick up that big gun. and He was ready to kill. Yeah, I have to kill kill. That's what happens when you spend five seconds in America. It just gets us.
00:34:48
Speaker
it Really? Literally? He spends five seconds in America and suddenly it's like, oh, gun, gun, gun. I'm ready to shoot. to Take me to Walmart. I want to get a gun. It's legal over here. Let's do it. Um...
00:35:01
Speaker
But yeah, it's he doesn't want to like believe that himself, but he also like proves it over the course of the episode a little bit with how ready he is to use these guns, truly.
00:35:12
Speaker
And I think ah it really is
00:35:18
Speaker
Because they don't say it explicitly. They do late in later episodes about like how the doctor like doesn't carry a gun kind of thing. ah This is low-key anti-gun statement, ah which I appreciate a bit.
00:35:33
Speaker
ah Because it's not a gun that solves the problem in this episode. It's like empathy. and And knowing that there's not just one option out. like There's always a choice when it comes to...
00:35:44
Speaker
like how to solve something. I think this is the point where um Rose and the British guy are still running and ah the doctor is like, we have to seal off the whole place. And oh yeah, and there was like a crazy there was a crazy line that I thought was really good. I don't think it was the point of the episode to like make a statement on how like how bad it is when museums take like foreign artifacts and just keep it for themselves.
00:36:08
Speaker
ah But they kind of, like, imply that when the Doctor's, like, yelling at Staten. And Staten is like, oh, I just wanted to see the stars. And the Doctor's like, no, you just wanted to bring the stars down to your level and keep them in the dirt in a box ah for yourself underground. Yeah. And Alice is like, hell yeah, that's...
00:36:28
Speaker
That's it, baby. Like, when but when it comes to, like, stealing stuff that isn't yours, it's never about, like, I, you know, I want to share this with people and I want everyone to see it. It's all about who owns it. Like, you want to be the one to own it and have it so you can say you have it and have, like, a one-up on someone.
00:36:48
Speaker
Because think down to nitty-gritty, sometimes a lot of museums are like that. Not all museums, but... The British Museum, very much so. Yeah, the British Museum, though. ah Their unwillingness to give back artifacts that clearly belong to certain countries and cultures is sometimes sickening to see.
00:37:08
Speaker
and i yeah And like I said, I don't think that was like the the message of this episode, but I think it's like a little... A little bit of a side message. A little, like... It's theme. Yeah, just a little bit.
00:37:20
Speaker
a Yeah, a little theme of the episode. As a treat. Yeah, just a little treat. Just a bit of a anti-Indiana Jones treat for you. yeah it does not belong in museum. It belongs in a museum. Indiana Jones, I'll kill you.
00:37:35
Speaker
I'll kill you. You sound like a Muppet. It's me, Indiana Jones, and I think um this belong belongs in museum. Okay. cur No, this isn't Kermit the Frog. This Kermit the Frog's evil brother.
00:37:47
Speaker
There is a very funny clip, I believe, from the original Muppet show of him dressed up as Indiana Jones. He's like, I want to make it very clear that I do not support violence. And then he shoots it. Oh, yeah, yeah. He goes, however. And then he turns to shoot the... I didn't know that was from, like, an Indiana Jones parody. i Yeah, I think he's supposed to be Indiana Jones in that.
00:38:07
Speaker
Well, Kermit, I think the whole of humanity has forgiven you. i definitely excuse that kind of that kind of action. It's acceptable violence.
00:38:18
Speaker
Acceptable violence. I accept it. um And I think after, while like the Doctor's like you know trying to seal off the whole facility so the Dalek doesn't like reach the surface of Earth,
00:38:31
Speaker
ah he, like, makes a call to, like, close the doors, ah you know, and Rose and her friend are still running towards them. ah And they're still running, and the... and It's a classic situation of, like, the doors are getting sealed, and they have to, like, a slide under them. But unfortunately, Rose actually doesn't make it through. I didn't think she was going to make it with how slow she was running. i was like, girl, you've got to run faster than that. I think she was good.
00:38:57
Speaker
I think, I don't know if it was the director, but I feel like someone must have told her, you have to run pretty, you know, you can't just like... Yeah, you have to look good. Yeah, you can't just run like your life depends on it. You have to run while also keeping your face in frame.
00:39:12
Speaker
Which, uh, yeah, I didn't feel like she looked very desperate in that moment, but I digress. It's not that important because for plot reasons, she had to be behind the door. Um... And you hear you get such a sad scene of, like, her basically accepting her death.
00:39:30
Speaker
And I think she realizes that, or at least ah she makes it clear to the audience that, you know, she's not, like, stupid. She knows that the doctor is, ah he carries a lot of guilt and a lot of weight on whether he can save people's lives or not.
00:39:50
Speaker
So that I think that's why, like, her first instinct is to, like, tell him that it isn't his fault and she doesn't regret like like traveling or doing all these things with him uh which is really really sad actually heartbreaking it really is and and the doctor does make a point of saying like yeah she was literally only 19 like this shouldn't have happened to her and that's crazy that she's She's just 19!
00:40:19
Speaker
She's just a kid! she is She's just... She's not even in her 20s yet. I can't believe I'm older than Rose. Jesus. Yeah, no, she's just a baby. She's just a babby.
00:40:30
Speaker
like she's she's Like, she's not much older than, like, my youngest sibling, which is crazy. I would i would go insane if my my youngest sibling, like, went missing for a year, and then was like, and now I'm gonna go travel again. I'd be like, no!
00:40:45
Speaker
What are you doing? I might die. Peace. Oh my gosh. Yeah, I'd be in a rage. I think I did get the scenes mixed up. I think the whole like ah talking about ah the museum artifacts stuff comes after this scene because the doctor's like enraged with Staten.
00:41:03
Speaker
ah But then you come to realize that ah Rose actually is not dead. The Dalek can't bring itself to kill her for whatever reason. he does And it doesn't understand why. ah and think it's basically implied that through the genetic collection of Rose, it also gained a little bit of her emotions, or at least capability to feel emotions, because obviously it doesn't start right away, where because clearly it went on a killing spree on its way up here.
00:41:34
Speaker
um Just for funsies. Just funsies. But I think once it, like, realized for Ro specifically couldn't kill her, like, something just starts to, like, click in it. Because I think he describes it as, ah like, I feel your fear.
00:41:49
Speaker
So he's like it's, like, literally empathizing with her. um And I guess doesn't want to feel that from from her and the only way to do that is to not kill her basically not he's an empath it's an empath oh my gosh rose you created an empath you've created shane dawson robot and uh i mean it's not empathetic enough to not take her hostage though like it's it basically calls the doctor back up and just and it's just like doctor you're going to meet you're going to let me go and we're going to talk
00:42:20
Speaker
uh or i kill the girl you love and it's like all right very damsel in distress core right now my favorite part of the episode is like the girl you love like okay i think rose can kick a little bit of butt but whatever what happens after that oh yeah they go up the elevator they go up the elevator and uh rose is trying to talk it down and when they reach the floor that uh they see Staten on, the Dalek is literally about to kill him and also, I don't know, if it if it got close to killing him, but Rose is able to talk him down, weirdly enough, I feel like the Dalek is very,
00:43:00
Speaker
human lines when it comes to
Dalek's Empathy & Self-Destruction
00:43:03
Speaker
how it talked to Staten because it's not just like, oh, I'm going to exterminate you because that's what I'm programmed to do. It was like, you know, you tortured me. Why would you do that? Like, it wants to know why, which is- That's a very good observation.
00:43:19
Speaker
Yeah, as opposed to like you know a a robotic being like, I'm just going to kill you. And even ah even in the sense of like, oh, you tortured me? I'm going to kill you for that. It's the fact that he wanted to know it wanted to know why that really sort of like I found interesting. ah And of course, the statin can only offer excuses of just like, oh, I just wanted to hear you talk.
00:43:38
Speaker
And the Dalek is like, oh, well, I'm talking now. B-word. it's a very different use gangster. Yeah. What's it going to say? Oh, it's 2012, and I just wanted to hear you talk, see? See?
00:43:49
Speaker
That's how everyone in America talks. That's how every single one of them talks. But like ah Rose convinces it otherwise and Rose is like, what do you actually want? Because you can't obviously you can't killing isn't solving anything or bringing you anything, so what do you actually want?
00:44:05
Speaker
and the dog and And the Dalek is like, oh, I want freedom. So they head out to like this corridor and the Dalek blasts a hole in the roof so it could feel like the sun...
00:44:16
Speaker
light on its skin and like opens up and reveals what it looks like. I also didn't think we were also going to get this reveal like early on. I thought it was going be saved for a little bit later, but it does. But I think that's okay. I shouldn't say saved like, you know, this was like ruined for being so early on.
00:44:32
Speaker
But the fact that we got to see like it's inside of like, it's a little flesh monster with a single, single eye. didn't i don't know. Hayley, were you expecting that?
00:44:43
Speaker
actually, actually want to know. I mean, to tell you the truth, I never really processed the idea that they were, like, something inside. oh my god, wait, I'm sorry, I just had a revelation, but I'm gonna finish what I'm talking about first. Yes. um Yeah, I never processed that they could be like something within a suit of armor. I kind of just always assumed that they were robots.
00:45:07
Speaker
Which is fair. I clearly haven't met my obscure media reference quota for this episode, so just to get one last one in there. Some of you may be familiar with a cartoon, a British cartoon actually, which makes my revelation all the more clear now that I'm talking about it, from the late 2000s, I want to say, called The Secret Show.
00:45:27
Speaker
Which was about secret agents. And it aired on Nicktoons in America for a little bit. And I loved it when I was a kid. And I'm now remembering that there was a creature you would see regularly called the Impostors, I think they were called. And they were like changelings, basically. They would ah to take on the form and voice of anyone.
00:45:47
Speaker
And distinctly remember now that there was an episode where they revealed that they were actually like worm creatures inside. And I'm realizing now that that was 100% supposed to be a reference to Daleks, especially because it was a British show.
00:46:00
Speaker
I have to watch it again now because the show was probably full of Doctor Who references that I've never even got. It probably was. Because I admit, like i I really don't think Doctor Who is a household name here in America. It's definitely popular here. like You could go to like a nerd store, a Hot Topic or something, and find Doctor Who stuff.
00:46:19
Speaker
But, like, culture-wise, it's really not as big here as I imagine is in Britain. Anything that's, like, slightly British media here that we get, ah feel like there you get, like, vague Doctor Who references sometimes. Like, there's a Doctor Who reference in Phineas and Ferb that I, like, remember off the top of my head, which...
00:46:39
Speaker
uh is basically they it's it's a tardis joke they have a shed that they build and there's like a lab in the shed and they're like how did you guys do this and then firm goes oh with the little british technology and he's british it's funny and uh yeah as i don't know the point i'm going with this is yeah i'm pretty yeah if it's a british show it it you know not and there's a non-zero chance it's gonna reference doctor who at some point thoughts it's never zero and it's never zero it's actually i bet it's like very close to like by like five percent chance that's the exact number that's the exact number i've done the calculations and in this uh in last two seconds did you do it with your plunger hand of course what else would i have done it with andng yaring r i i r arrow and then i uh get all the pound numbers in i break your door down
00:47:31
Speaker
so My trailer. yeah
00:47:35
Speaker
And um ah at this point, the doctor shows up and aims his big old gun at, ah or tries to aim it at the doll. Rose is in the way, and he yells at Rose to out of the way, up but she won't let him.
00:47:49
Speaker
They have this very nice heart-to-heart where... she's basically trying to tell him like, hey, he's, that that this Dalek is changing. And the doctor's like, I don't think that matters. It killed so many people, which I think is a little fair.
00:48:06
Speaker
It did just kill hundreds of people. Um... just because it feels a little bad about it right now or maybe not feel bad about it right now but is deciding to no longer kill people right now doesn't ex doesn't exhume that it killed a hundreds of people like five minutes ago but uh i i think it's more about the implication of what the doctor is going to do about it uh because rose basically is like so like yeah literally like what so what are you planning on doing like killing him
00:48:40
Speaker
ah Like, what does that make you ah kind of situation? but But she does convince the doctor. he He's like, yeah, I see that he's not killing you. He's not killing me.
00:48:52
Speaker
And in all actuality, like it gaining emotions and sympathy. for like others is actually probably its worst nightmare and it does what it does make the dalek want to kill itself basically and it asks for rose for orders to allow him to kill himself uh which she like very reluctantly gives she uh doesn't want to at first and the dalek is' like well what kind of life is this like Because, I don't know, all my purpose all its purpose only is to kill things.
00:49:27
Speaker
And the only the only minimal joy it had was like feeling the sunlight on its skin. And like there's kind of not much else for it, at least on Earth. ah And there's not even a planet for it to go back to because Dalek and Time Lord Planet had both got exploded.
00:49:44
Speaker
ah And so it does decide to go through with, like, exploding itself with its little orbs around on its, like, not torso, but, like, you know, the little orbs on them.
00:49:57
Speaker
ah I didn't know they did that. i My orbs. Yeah, go, my orbs. um That kind of just wraps it up, basically.
Mind-Wiping & Ethics Discussion
00:50:07
Speaker
The staten guy gets, like, apprehended and the...
00:50:13
Speaker
totally American secretary lady, uh, basically says he's gonna get his mind wiped and then become a junkie. Like, that's the word you use, like, a junkie on the street. They was, yeah. And was just like, oh my gosh, that's... it is I'm not, okay, I mean, I mean, what are the morals of this? If someone did something bad, like, like, really bad, like, basically caused the deaths of hundreds of people because of selfish purposes, and then you wiped his memory so he had no recollection of that and he would never remember it again,
00:50:43
Speaker
Does this person deserve to be put on the street and forced to be homeless and a drug addict? I think, well, I feel like wouldn't it be better to put him in jail because the you wiped his memory, but not his personality. So he could still find ways to hurt other people.
00:51:01
Speaker
That also brings up the um ah the argument of like nature versus nurture. like he could He could have like a you know ah bit of a cocky personality naturally, but his motivations might have come from something he learned growing up, especially in America.
00:51:16
Speaker
a He probably a rich kid or something, and... he was a he was a probably he was probably a rich kid or something and I feel like if you actually wanted to punish him, you probably should just keep his memory and then put him in jail.
00:51:31
Speaker
um If you're gonna wipe his memory, that's basically a new person. Not to and to bring up Severance, but I do think Severance um brings up the idea of like, well, if you don't have...
00:51:46
Speaker
the memories that make you who you are are you a completely different person and the answer that show gives is a yes and i've yet to see an argument that convinced me convinces me otherwise can i hit you with a hypothetical real quick yes please okay so let's say that you're a bad person yes And the reason you're a bad person is because of all of these really terrible things that happened to you when you were a child that were completely out of your control.
00:52:15
Speaker
Yeah. Uh-huh.
00:52:20
Speaker
And let's say because you're such a bad person, you want to do more bad things. Uh-huh. So you get a cloning machine. Does my name start with a P by the way? does. it's You make a clone of yourself, but here's the kicker. oh The clone is you as a child before all these terrible things happen. Oh my god.
00:52:40
Speaker
So the child is is a good child. So like, what do you- and now you're father, what do you do? Well, obviously, um I go through a divorce, uh, with my dog husband. And we get, uh, split custody and we're actually very healthy about it.
00:52:55
Speaker
um so healthy in fact that I think I might be falling in love with him again. Yes! yes You're not gonna put him in a box first that says free kitty and leave it out on the street. Oh, yeah. Sorry, I do that real quick and then I do all that other stuff real quick.
00:53:13
Speaker
Anyway, Dogman is a really fun comic. Anyway, Dogman has lots of child-friendly drama for you to enjoy. i mean, it's genuinely a good story. I can't i can't rag on it too much.
00:53:26
Speaker
Yeah, but yeah, the idea of just, like, ah ah erasing someone's memory. Because, like,
00:53:34
Speaker
I don't know if that's fair. i mean, I'm probably thinking about this way too much, but I feel like that's not fair if you're going to take someone and basically create a whole new person and then punish them for something they didn't do.
00:53:49
Speaker
because they didn't Because as far as they know, they didn't do it. can can you Yeah, he's basically the innie. Yeah. And also, they're not even putting him under arrest. they're They're forcing him to be homeless. Can you imagine just like waking up one day?
00:54:03
Speaker
You're full-grown person, but you have no past and no recollection of who you are, or how the world works. ah But you do have access to drugs. And then, like...
00:54:15
Speaker
they I don't even know. Like, do they just force him to become a drug addict? I don't know. I'm thinking about this like way much. Like, was he just talking out of her butt? Or is that, like, for word for word what they're gonna do? i think we've got a great pitch for Severance Season 2. Yeah.
00:54:28
Speaker
I think we gotta hit up Apple TV about this. This is, oh my gosh, the horrors. It writes itself. Truly. It does. Like AI. No, no, we're thinking about this. We're using our brains.
00:54:39
Speaker
But I don't want to use
New Companion & Future Adventures
00:54:41
Speaker
my brain. I want to effort into this. I want my brain to go soft and for the computer to think for me, please. My brain already is so nice and unwrinkled. Yeah. um What happens after that? I think um the Doctor and Rose are about basically going back to their TARDIS and the the British friend they met along the way ah is like, yeah...
00:55:01
Speaker
He doesn't even say this. Rose is like, he doesn't have a ride home. Can we take him home? Also, he wants to see the stars. Can we travel for a little bit with him? And the doctor's like, all right, I guess, but it's your responsibility. Like he's a pet.
00:55:13
Speaker
Like he's a pet. Like he's an animal. ah Excuse my F word. Julia. I thought I recognized him because I was like, this guy looks familiar. And I was like,
00:55:26
Speaker
He can't be the guy from that one episode, right? And then we got the bumper for the next episode. I'm like, oh, he is. He is that guy. Don't remember much from that episode. We'll talk about it in then and our next episode of the podcast. But i don't know. and do you have like That might be all my thoughts for the episode. Do you have any closing thoughts, Hayley?
00:55:46
Speaker
I do have a bit of a weird question that I promise will make sense in a second. But do Daleks, to your knowledge... have any like weird allergies or sensitivities to anything bizarre?
00:55:58
Speaker
My brain says no, my gut says yes. I feel like they have something exactly as you described, something weird and unique that they're like slightly weak to.
00:56:10
Speaker
Okay, I bring it up because in that old cartoon I was meant old, like it's, you know, like it's from the 30s. The spy cartoon I was talking about, the creatures that I realize now are Dalek references, they were allergic to penguins. Oh. ah Which is very bizarre, so I was just always curious if that was also part of the reference or if it was just a ah weird addition. Yeah, I don't think there's any birds they're allergic to.
00:56:34
Speaker
i think if I had to wager a guess, uh, because it's been a while since I've watched Dalek-centered episodes. um I would probably guess it's something more like concept-wise. like They're allergic to emotions, basically. Okay. So literally what happened in the episode, if they are inflicted and given the power to process like empathy, then...
00:56:57
Speaker
it kind of makes them short circuit and want to die, basically. Oh, just like me. just's Just like humans real life. Yeah, just just this is just like ah content creators on YouTube when they're forced to empathize with people, they short circuit.
00:57:12
Speaker
My god, I want to see a Dalek apology video. Hello, i that's up I know I exterminated 200 citizens, but I've come to say am sorry you feel that way.
00:57:24
Speaker
You must understand that I am neurodivergent and a minor. And a minor. I was just born two days ago. was literally born yesterday. Literally. So you are literally bullying a minor right now. I hope i hope you are happy.
00:57:38
Speaker
Goodbye. But you are B2B. This is who you are being B2B. Don't forget to like and subscribe.
00:57:45
Speaker
Don't forget to ring that bell. Ring that bell. Not everyone who is who watches my videos has subscribed. And it's free. So... Be sure to use that toilet puncher.
00:57:56
Speaker
I mean, like, oh, yeah, i don't have much thoughts afterwards. I pretty much, I think I've said what I want to say.
Episode Reflection & Ratings
00:58:02
Speaker
It's, this is, like, a very, I felt very compelled this episode. Truly. did I. Truly compelled. More so than I have in the last few episodes. I think, uh,
00:58:13
Speaker
So far this episode ranks the highest for me. I think maybe second highest is like the end of the world. Then probably probably the Charles Dickens and the pilot probably tied for third place.
00:58:25
Speaker
And then unfortunately bottom up bottom of the rank is the fart. The fart scapade. fart scapade. The fart fiasco. Literally the fart incident.
00:58:35
Speaker
The fart incident. Just like an ARG out of- Analog horror the fart incident. They took her face. They left behind a fart.
00:58:49
Speaker
Oh my gosh. ah But I completely forgot to do trivia. Okay, trivia notes! Oh, yay! I'm so glad I didn't forget to do this and I'm definitely not editing this in post. ah Wow!
00:59:01
Speaker
We're definitely not traveling back in time. All right. o All right, I forgot to keep my eye out for this, but one of the trivia points actually was... ah It says, quote, behind and to the left of the TARDIS is a display holding a xenomorph egg.
00:59:16
Speaker
I was not paying attention to the display sections, actually, but I did just watch Alien for the first time the other night with my partner. I saw. And it was crazy because I was like, I really, I like, it was ah one of those movies where I just never got around to watching and I was like,
00:59:33
Speaker
And I also had mentioned I'd never seen Predator, so ah they were like, well, we should just, well, why don't we just just watch both of them? Like, 80s horror alien movie night. And I was like, all right.
00:59:44
Speaker
And then we watched it, and Predator was okay, and Alien was pretty good. So oh I'd have to go back to, like, see if there was actually a xenomorph egg, but i don't know. If you guys want to watch the episode and look out for that, feel free.
00:59:59
Speaker
Because don't know. I'll watch it in my free time. um So, says here on the Doctor Who wiki, that's where I'm sourcing my trivia points of IMDB right now, because I think that probably wasn't the best source to get that. And there the IMDB was getting their source from the wiki anyway, so whatever.
01:00:17
Speaker
But the next thing is that... ah Apparently, the the ah the doctor's interaction with the Dalek was originally written to just be mocking and flippant. Christopher Eccleston decided to pour in incredible amounts of rage and pain in as well. Robert Shearman, who is the writer, was briefly miffed.
01:00:33
Speaker
Of course. Yeah, literally. That's what I was like ah laughing at earlier ah when I was reading all this. ah Yeah, no, he made it so much better. I applaud him for that.
01:00:44
Speaker
Yeah, I like... Because there's this thing where it really is up to the actors in this context to imply how much something affects their character. Mm-hmm.
01:00:59
Speaker
um I think if he went that route of being like mocking mocking and flippant towards it, we wouldn't take the Dalek as seriously as I think we were meant to take it.
01:01:10
Speaker
Because this thing kills people. yeah It's a genocidal maniac. And I think that point comes across very well. We joke about it a little bit in the episode, but I think as like...
01:01:23
Speaker
a story and as like a villain, it's written very well in this episode. Like you get the sense of how dangerous and deadly it is just based off how terrified the doctor is. Because I don't think i don't think the doctor has been like this scared at this point.
01:01:40
Speaker
like I did put that in my notes. Yeah, that that like we're seeing legitimate fear. It definitely struck me. Yeah, like it starts as fear, then it turns into rage. ah you really get the sense of how much this is this like creature and all the other Daleks have affected the Ninth Doctor.
01:02:00
Speaker
And I'm so happy he played it like that because I don't think the impact- we wouldn't have gotten that impact if he decided to be like, oh look at this loser all tied up, ooh ooh, pointing and laughing, pointing and laughing, haaaah!
01:02:15
Speaker
Does L sign on my forehead. Yeah. I don't know if there's much to comment on on this trivia point, but apparently it says that Christopher Eccleston got so into the Doctor's rage that he literally foams at the mouth in one scene. And I think could see that.
01:02:29
Speaker
I think you could see that in the, ah when he's like telling the Dalek to kill itself. Uh, what, like, why don't you just die? And he's got, like, a bit of dribble on his mouth. Uh, and apparently this wasn't planned and he insisted on keeping it in.
01:02:41
Speaker
Which, you know, I think good, good actor choice. Like, sometimes you get, uh, when a character gets in such a rage, they get to a point where, like, they become almost feral-like.
01:02:52
Speaker
and And I really think that emphasizes like the rage someone is in I think spittle should be used sparingly, though. I get a little bit grossed out by it sometimes if there's too much of it.
01:03:05
Speaker
I'm looking at you. This was a called for use, I would say. yeah i was go was gonna say, I'm looking at you, your Hamilton Pro Shot. I did not need to see all that spit on Jonathan Groff's mouth.
01:03:17
Speaker
I don't think that was a character choice, though. I think he just accidentally did that. Just spits a lot. Yeah. um He's just a wet-mouthed man. another Another point is that apparently Russell T. Davies, I don't think he directly worked on this episode, but of course he's the show creator. He probably had a hand in it at some point.
01:03:38
Speaker
Um, and he apparently wished for the episode to be emotional rather than quote, relying on people running down corridors. Quote, uh, Robert Sherman, the writer expressed a desire to take all the things people find funny about the Daleks and turn them into something people would find memorable.
01:03:54
Speaker
That sounds like they're probably talking about like the, uh, plunger thing. Um, but I do think often there's this aspect in like, uh,
01:04:05
Speaker
Daleks at least from like classic who that like they're a bit silly to look at and They're kind of goofy. They're very slow moving and they've got a plunger for a hand ah And I think, though the plunger was pretty silly, and I think they did play it up for a little bit of a laugh, I like the angle of them trying to basically make them scary again, ah which I always love when maybe when, like, if you're going to, like, re-release a media or, like, redo something that's been done in the past and, like, successfully making it
01:04:43
Speaker
fit ah the tone you're aiming for successfully and making the audience feel that way. Like, the closest thing I could compare this to is when I saw, this is gonna be stupid, and I'm outing myself ah right now, but, uh,
01:04:59
Speaker
when the Avengers movie first came out. And all I knew about the Hulk was he was a silly green guy who was, had big muscles and he only had pants on, made him kind of goofy looking.
01:05:14
Speaker
When I went to that theater in 2012, while the doctor was handling the Dalek in Utah, when I went to that theater, and the Hulk showed up in the scariest way they could have made him show up.
01:05:30
Speaker
I was sweating in my seat because it felt like there was a monster on screen and that people were gonna die. ah and I like when media does that, when they take something that was once silly, but meant to be scary that ah we consider silly now and then making it scary again.
01:05:50
Speaker
ah baller i love that i love that baller i like the idea that this was the same day that he was doing all the stuff and you don't you were in uh wherever you were i was in my hometown movieofy i was in a movie theater with my dad uh he could not stop cracking up at the joke of hulk punching thor at the end of the movie or whatever uh all we talked about on our on our ride home I think I kind of just impulsively added this trivia point in, but it says that the writer, Robert Shearman, he viciously resisted the notes from the BBC, insisting that the Dalek be humanized in the final scene and proclaiming Rose as its friend.
01:06:32
Speaker
Shearman was adamant that the Dalek remain a fascist and wanted to focus... what Wanted the focus to be on how it would rather die than be like the humans.
01:06:45
Speaker
I think that's like... Hmm. Can he say that? That's a strong word. That's a very strong word. Because I think calling it a fascist implies that it has, like, political control over something. That's what I was gonna say. It implies, like, what's the line in Barbie where she's like, she called me a fascist.
01:07:04
Speaker
I don't control the flow of commerce or the railroads. Yeah, but I don't even know how commerce works. Uh, yeah, literally. Um... It's a bit of a bold word for him to use, but also it wasn't, it wasn't a direct quote. So maybe he used a different word, but also that's a very bold word to have in a trivia statement. So he must've used something close to it and, or it the word itself.
01:07:29
Speaker
And I don't know if you should, I, cause it's like, you don't want to take away meaning from the word by just calling something exactly fascist here and there, like willy nilly.
01:07:41
Speaker
um You could... I think you can call the Dalek a genocidal maniac. Its whole purpose is that it wipes out races and planets. ah You could call it a murderer, an exterminator.
01:07:53
Speaker
ah you could might be more fitting to say that the person who made the Daleks is the fascist. Because I kind of feel like these guys are a little bit more just pawns that in this person's grand scheme. You know what I mean?
01:08:06
Speaker
ah that that's a Yeah, that is a better point. i Maybe that's what he meant, is like... he wanted like the initial goal of the Dalek, like whatever the Dalek takes orders from is a like fascist power.
01:08:21
Speaker
um I think maybe at most you could call this guy like ah ah the a pawn of a fascist, but not a fascist because this guy isn't making any moves in the in the political sphere. I'll tell you that much. He's just killing people.
01:08:38
Speaker
I do not control the flow of commerce or the railroads. Yeah. it's It's like, a how would you say this? Like, not all genocidal not all genocidal maniacs are fascists, but a lot of fascists can be genocidal maniacs.
01:08:54
Speaker
If that makes sense. I mean, yeah, I think it might be rating time, Hayley. Alright, I'm going to rate this 9 plungers suffocating me on my face out of 10. Ooh,
01:09:10
Speaker
ah I thought... God, I feel like I thought of a funny one while we were watching and I completely forgot it. Does it have to do with the doctor's top surgery? it should! But wait, but well I actually, I think i what I was going to do was I was going to do, um so I think I'm going to give this a, hmm, 9.5 squirming flesh mounds with one eye out of 10 who feel the sunlight on their skin for the first time. Feel the rain on your skin, release your inhibitions. Yeah, go get it, girl.
01:09:44
Speaker
um And yeah, that was a pretty good episode for me. Uh, very little time did it falter a little bit. I think at some times it was, like, a little bit slow, but it really made up for it in, like, uh, the dialogue and the writing.
01:10:00
Speaker
Who wrote this episode again? i need to, like, send congratulations. This really felt like an apology for the two-farter, and I'm very grateful for that. Robert Shearman. Thank you. You did great, Robert Shearman.
01:10:11
Speaker
i guess i I guess, yeah. i Haley, I'm glad you enjoyed the episode. I'm glad I enjoyed the episode. Oh god, I enjoyed this one a lot. um The next one...
01:10:25
Speaker
i'm not i can't say if it's bad or good or not because I don't remember it, but maybe that's a clue on how good it is if I don't remember it sense.
01:10:35
Speaker
All I remember is the ending of the episode because it's a very funny ending, but I guess we'll talk about that when we talk about it. ah We will see all you guys next week or the week after, depending on when this episode comes out. If it's If it's the third to last week of the month, then we'll see you in two weeks. If it's not, we'll see you next month week. You wait. You will wait.
01:10:58
Speaker
And you will wait for us until we come back in our TARDIS to rescue you. The girl we love. Then you shall suffer. Bye. Goodbye.
Podcast Credits & Social Media
01:11:18
Speaker
Hey guys, thank you for listening to our show. This was created by me, Julia, and Hailey Doherty. The cover art and the thumbnails were illustrated by the two of us and edited by me. Episodes edited by me and social media is run by Hailey. The theme song and other sound effects are by half.cool. You can find us on Instagram at meuanddw, on Twitter at meuanddw, and on TikTok at meuanddw.
01:11:40
Speaker
You can find this podcast on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube. Thank you for listening. Bye!