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You Can Do It - With Jessica Zander
74 Plays15 hours ago
Jessica Zander of You Can Do It Gardening is known for common sense no-frills garden advice inspiring hundreds of thousands of people across the globe that they can do it themselves, and that gardening doesn’t have to be so complicated. Jessica Zander has built a booming garden coaching business from scratch after a career in finance. We chat about starting her business to Spring Garden Tips.
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Transcript
Introduction to Gardening and Ecology
00:00:08
Speaker
Step into the Gardener's Lodge with me, Michael Haw. Let's explore the fascinating worlds of gardening, nature and ecology through conversations with experts, thought leaders, passionate enthusiasts, and of course, some real good friends.
00:00:24
Speaker
All from the cozy heart of the lodge.
Jessica Zander's Journey into Gardening
00:00:27
Speaker
Come on in. Today, my guest is someone who's known for common sense, no frills gardening advice, inspiring hundreds of thousands of people across the globe that they can do it themselves.
00:00:38
Speaker
And that gardening doesn't have to be so complicated. Jessica Zander is the founder of you Can Do It Gardening, a booming garden coaching business that she has started from scratch after a long successful career in non-for-profit finance.
00:00:53
Speaker
I thoroughly enjoyed my chat with Jessica, which ranged from how she started her business right through to some no nonsense spring garden tips. But first let's hear her answers to our six rapid fire questions.
00:01:07
Speaker
Are you ready? Yeah. Favorite plant? Oh gosh. I mean, I think it just varies by what's in, what's in bloom, honestly. True. What is your favorite way to connect with nature?
00:01:20
Speaker
To be out in it, you know, either in a canoe or walking through the woods or just like hanging out in my garden. Beautiful. And what is the most beautiful garden or natural landscape that you have ever visited?
00:01:34
Speaker
Peru. I went Colca Canyon, which is this huge canyon. It was just so spectacular. Favorite garden tool? Shovel.
00:01:45
Speaker
If you could be one, plant or an animal? Definitely an animal.
Jessica's Gardening Inspirations and Resources
00:01:50
Speaker
Okay. But not an animal that needs to work that hard. I'd sort of like a cat that can go outside, but without claws, you know. when you're looking for reliable research on something garden related, where do you turn?
00:02:07
Speaker
Well, if I really want like research-backed information, I go to extension university extension articles, or I'll i'll look on. like There are a number of different university extensions. So the one in my state, UMass, Amherst has one that's reliable and research backed. And then there's this, um there's a couple of resources like blogs also that I'm really fond of. One is called Garden Fundamentals. And then another blog and Facebook group is um The Garden Professors, which is, you know, researchers talking about things that are
00:02:45
Speaker
ah you know, that the average homeowner might not know or certainly maybe not seek out. But this is where I got my love of wood chips is from the garden professor. So it's little things like that. Where did you first find your love of
From Finance to Garden Coaching
00:02:58
Speaker
gardening or the natural world?
00:03:00
Speaker
So the love of gardening didn't emerge right away, but I would say that it started when I had my first home, which I got in 1995 and quickly realized i had no idea what I was doing.
00:03:15
Speaker
and ah needed to learn and get up to speed ah at least sufficiently to be able to manage the property, which was small at that time, but there was still some garden. And my mother, who was a brilliant gardener, ah was available on call, so to speak. She lived nearby, so she came over and helped me figure out how to prune forsythias, for example. So that was really helpful and to you know get me accustomed and and you know in the swing of things a little bit. And then through the process of
00:03:46
Speaker
you know, learning how to do that and and taking on a number of different gardens, um I developed my love for it. And that's been now over 30 years since I've been gardening.
00:04:00
Speaker
So less of a kind of innate thing that was in you and more of something that's come out of, you know, the pressure of having to maintain a garden yourself. Yeah, I think initially it was the pragmatic side, but then i do have a connection through my mother's side of the family to gardening. Her father was a a gardener in England, the kind of person who you know they lived in the gardener's cottage on a couple of estates. and Oh, lovely. Nothing glamorous in those days, but- um That's what he did professionally. And so as a kid, would when we went to visit them, i would he would talk my ear off about this and that the other thing in the greenhouse. And I... had no idea what he was talking about and really had no interest at the time. This was a very long time ago.
00:04:45
Speaker
um But then as I watched my mom get into her garden and be kind of obsessed with it and travel around and go to gardens you know all over in England and ah and then seek out unusual plants nearby where she lived, i began to get a sense of the complexity and the richness of this as something to um potentially explore. But I had young kids and it really was limited to, okay, what can I do in my own yard and not get, you know, I didn't get too um extravagant in my interests, certainly not in terms of budget or whatever, but just like beginning to be aware, oh there's more to this actually.
00:05:23
Speaker
And there are layers upon layers upon layers. Yeah. And of course you had like a very long career for a non-for-profit working in the financing department. Yeah. What actually led you to step away from that completely and start your own garden coaching business?
00:05:39
Speaker
Yeah. So I was gardening the same amount of time basically as I was working um in the nonprofit field. And my roles were, like you say, in finance, finance and operations. And so I was the CFO of a number of small nonprofits. And so while I was doing this, i ah was gardening on the side and then informally helping people, friends and relatives with you know design ideas or why don't you try this, why don' you try that, or dividing some of my plants and giving them over to them. And then in the fall of 2021, I was sitting at a friend's house in her backyard facing the backyard and looking at it and it looked, you know it was kind of lacking. It was just, it wasn't anything really. And so i you know you don't ask this question without a without the concept that it could be better. um or the idea that there that room you know there's room for improvement. And so I said, what are you doing back here? you know Just kind of casually. um And she, to her credit, you know she said, I have no idea. What should I do? Which is not how most people I think would respond in that situation. But she was really receptive to some input and feedback. I gave her a bunch of suggestions. And then
00:06:58
Speaker
Again, unlike the the majority of people, she immediately implemented those things. And I had a sense that this could be a service that other people might appreciate. So then I just started figuring out, okay, let me start this you know side hustle, basically. It was never intended to be a full-time career, basically.
00:07:18
Speaker
And so that was the fall of 2021. And then i launched in March And then the business...
Expansion of Jessica's Business in 2023
00:07:25
Speaker
went fine as a sort of a startup side hustle in 2022. But where things really took off was in 2023 when social media came into play. And I had a few very kind of viral for me reels. And it just started to get out of control. Like I didn't have enough time in my schedule.
00:07:49
Speaker
And I would stuff meetings in, you know, early morning, late in the day, lunch, you know, it was just becoming apparent that there was more demand than I had initially thought. And that maybe, you know, when I did start to get an inkling that, oh, maybe I could do this full time, I didn't realize how quickly it could happen. And that was all because of social media. But, what you know, as a finance person in my role, I had to, I quickly I think had to assess, all right, what is the viability of this business? What's the cashflow? Where's the pipeline for new clients? You know, how reliable is that? Can I count on that?
00:08:28
Speaker
We know what are the inputs that I can control and then where's this business likely to go? And that was all, again, that was all based on kind of social media, but it became, there was a point at which I felt very um comfortable with the idea of stepping away. So I gave my notice and I left and I haven't looked back since.
00:08:46
Speaker
Yeah. mean, it's a great story. And I think obviously your experience in the not-for-profit sector, particularly in finance, kind of readied you to take that big leap. I think a lot of people do what you've done, but maybe don't have that kind of finance background and understanding of your business acumen that can get them quite to that next stage. So they fumble probably a lot more than you have. And I mean, you've kind of your business has exploded in what would it be three years now, really four years. Yeah.
00:09:18
Speaker
Which is fantastic. Yeah. I feel incredibly fortunate. And I think you're absolutely right about the positioning for this, that, you know, I'm also you know, late into my career here, I'm in my mid fifties and I started this in my early fifties. So I had, um a bunch of experience to draw on that I didn't realize would be relevant necessarily. um But it's all it all kind of comes into play. And what's interesting is someone along the way made a suggestion that even if I'm a you know a party of one, ah that I do an org chart for the number of roles that I play, which is really interesting. So I started to brainstorm because in all the different organizations where I worked over the many years, you know there were marketing departments or you know People who had all these different functions, business development, marketing, you know the social media stuff, I had no experience with whatsoever, even personally. So i was you
Empowering Clients in Gardening
00:10:18
Speaker
know that was all new.
00:10:19
Speaker
um i had the business side, like you know the the sort of more financial operations, but even the admin stuff, I hadn't been in the weeds on a lot of this stuff for years. I had a team of people or what have you. So you know just the basic... stuff, I had to like really take a step back and get, you know, and just immerse myself in all of the things. And there are probably about 20 different roles that I play. I mean, as many people do, we we wear a lot of hats in a small operation, but that's been really interesting to think about. And um I've learned, I mean, I've learned so much about so many different things.
00:10:58
Speaker
It's been really quite a journey. Yeah. It is a journey, isn't it? I mean, i'm I too am self-employed and yeah, you're right. I've not counted the amount of hats, but there is a lot. Yeah. And and it all is just churning away in your brain constantly. Right, That's right.
00:11:14
Speaker
Do you have a sunny space in your garden that you just don't know what to do with? Well, I have a treat for you. A free perennial garden design that you can download right now.
00:11:26
Speaker
It's full of colour and year-round interest, and the best part is that it's pollinator and wildlife attracting. It's been designed with the yeah UK climate in mind, but I know I've got listeners across the globe. So if you're in the southern states of Australia or the northern part of the US, this is the design for you.
00:11:46
Speaker
You can download your free perennial garden design, as well as my free Australian native garden design at the link in the description.
00:11:56
Speaker
Why garden coaching as opposed to maybe design work or straight out gardening or? Going into the business, I was pretty open-minded about some things and very close-minded about some others. So for example, I had no interest in doing other people's yards. I didn't want a truck. I didn't want a crew. I don't want to haul the yard waste around. i don't want to go to the garden center and pick out all the plants and do the installations. So I was really clear about that. Having said that, I do work with clients. Like I've gone to garden centers with clients a few times. I have worked alongside them with landscaping crews, but I don't want to be the person doing that for clients. I think that's the line there is like, Look, I'll work with you alongside you. I'll help you with this, but I'm not doing it for you because that defeats the whole purpose. My thing is like, let me help you feel empowered.
00:12:57
Speaker
And that means you need to get in there and get your hands dirty. That's how I started was with that clarity. um And then I do design as part of my services. It's sort of integrated into everything. To answer the question about coach, it just felt like the right title because – I mean, i'm kind of sometimes I'm much more of a consultant, but consultant is too narrow because with coach, you're really trying to help people with skills and mindset. um You're giving them ideas, but you're trying to get them to get them to a point, whatever it is, coach them through something or coach them to something.
00:13:39
Speaker
and a consultant is just comes in and gives you some advice, which I often am doing. Yeah. um And there's nothing wrong with that. And then design is also too narrow. You know i mean? It's like, yeah it's everything. It's all of those things. So I think coach just felt like the broadest service basically. And so when people come to you for help, what are their motivations? What are their most common worries or frustrations or concerns that they're calling you for?
Addressing Common Gardening Challenges
00:14:08
Speaker
Yeah. A lot of times it's new homeowners. um They're new to the property and they want to get their bearings. So what are the plants they have?
00:14:19
Speaker
ah how should they take care of them? This area is blank or this area needs to be redone. What could I put here? I'm new to gardening. What should I think about? What are the skills? What are the tools?
00:14:33
Speaker
you know Some basic stuff. you know Sometimes people get in touch because they know they have a lot of invasive plants or they worry that they have a lot of invasive plants. So they want to kind of get an audit on their property, whether they're new to the property, new to gardening, or just like now have the awareness that there's a liability potential for them and they want to get a handle on that. So it kind of runs the gamut. And then there's the really, there's the experienced gardeners who've been in a property for, you know,
00:15:02
Speaker
30 years or whatever, and they just want a fresh pair of eyes on their situation, which I love. like I love that because it's a slightly different conversation. With a more experienced gardener, we can kind of go deep on some things. But I love all the stages of the gardener's journey and kind of plug into wherever they are. I think that's the most important thing is to kind of meet them where they are. And I try not to get too ambitious for them because that is a that's a setup for failure and disappointment. So it's like a quick assessment of where people are and then what they might be capable of kind of doing.
00:15:42
Speaker
yeah And then trying to set them up for realistic expectations so that you know they don't have so they don't basically shut down and not do anything. It's a hard balance sometimes.
00:15:53
Speaker
It is a hard balance. i do I do a little bit of coaching here and there. I used to do a fair bit more when I lived in Australia. And I loved it because you could meet where people where they are. Right. They call you in a bit of a panic, you know, things are growing. Right. What do I do? Yeah. Yeah.
00:16:10
Speaker
ah Why do you think people lack the confidence just to get stuck in?
Gardening Confidence and Simplicity
00:16:15
Speaker
You know, I have little theories about kind of the commercialization of gardening and, and you know, the garden media that likes to, you know, overcomplicate things. And, you know, there's a product for this and ah you need to this for this and that for that. And I think it doesn't have to be that complicated, really.
00:16:32
Speaker
Yeah, I totally agree. Yeah, yeah, I totally agree with that. I think it is a bit of the wild west out on the internet, which is where people naturally turn. There is some conflicting information out there. yeah um i think people are worried about killing plants um and they should be worried about killing plants, but not for the reasons that they think. I think people are worried about killing plants from pruning, for example, but that's rarely the case. You're more likely to kill a plant from neglect because you planted and then neglect to water. And I just had a client this morning that was, she admitted that she planted some things and then didn't pay attention to them. And, you know, it was funny. It's like, that is the thing that I see the most is that kind of neglect. um
00:17:17
Speaker
So I think it's, fear of um It should be fear of wasting money because there is a lot of waste. And there is, to your point, yeah, you don't need to buy all the fancy tools. You don't need the gadgets. You don't need you know all the paraphernalia, really. like you know i think the shovel, it just broke. I think I'd used it for 25 years. i don't If there was a label on it at any point, I'm not sure what it was. People try to say things like, oh, you need an edger. You need this. You need that. No, you don't. You just need, you know, the basics. And yeah um so I think I'm big on that and I'm big on um trial and error.
00:17:59
Speaker
um And I think people just generally – I think probably we all suffer to a certain extent from this sort of, not perfectionism necessarily, but like we don't want to fail. Nobody wants to fail, but that is gardening. That's part of gardening. And it's not, people are not necessarily accustomed to that. No.
00:18:19
Speaker
i agree. That's like trial and error, failing, killing plants is the only real way that you can get better at what you're doing because then you can analyze what you've done wrong.
00:18:30
Speaker
That's right. and And it's like, I'll do things that, you know, research papers would say, don't do that. But that doesn't mean you can't do it. And I think, for example, ah watering at different times a day besides the morning or pruning it less than ideal times, you know, like in the middle of the summer when it's hot. It's like you can do these things, dividing when it's 90 degrees. You can do these things. Are you going to find in a research paper that it says to do these things? No, you're not. You're going to find, you know, the best results are done when whatever. But I think people obsess about, to a certain extent, people obsess about like the right way because that's the way we've been conditioned. You know, everyone wants to optimize everything. I get it. I totally get that. But this is not, one of those situations, um really, you know, you start to get it. It's like the layers that i was talking about.
00:19:20
Speaker
You start to get the hang of it and you realize, oh yeah, right. I'm, I make mistakes. That's okay. I learned from them. Let me not do that again. Or if I do that again, I'll handle it differently. And what about this? What about that? You know, let me try this thing. Let me push the boundaries on this. Let me, you know, what, what would happen if I did this? You know, it becomes a, almost an intellectual,
00:19:42
Speaker
um endeavor, but at the same time, it's a pragmatic thing. Like not everybody's going to be as into it as you and I are, you know, they're just there to like get the, you know, get the shrubs watered and maintained for their property. And they want to, they have other things that they're interested in. So I think there's, there's also categories or groups of dedication or devotion.
00:20:05
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Not everyone is going to think of themselves as a gardener. Sometimes they just need to like, do bare minimum landscaping and maintenance and get on with it. And that's fine. I mean, there's nothing wrong with that. I think it's just for the passionate gardeners. We all share these things in common, I think, where we're seeking and learning and it's okay to fail. You know, I think these are just foreign to some people, just in general, you know? It definitely is foreign to a lot of people because I think, and I would say the internet a little bit has a bit to do with this, but like perfectionism is sought after so much. yeah But gardening's not like that at all. There's not ah a 100% right way to do something. There's the optimum way, but even then you're going to have ah a slither of failure.
00:20:55
Speaker
Yeah. What are some simple ways that gardeners can build confidence? Yeah. I mean, i it sounds so overly simplistic, but it's just basically to get out there and try something.
00:21:07
Speaker
mean, that's kind of the cumulative effect of trying and getting out there and just messing around does lead to more confidence, which then begets more confidence. and then you know And then you get more curious and then you try more things. And then the thing about that feedback loop is then I think it gets more rewarding and more interesting.
00:21:29
Speaker
And then you want more. you know It's like this sort of self-propelling thing, not for everybody, but for people who you know for whom that it really resonates. um so But I think you know just for the the basic, like how do I get
Building Gardening Initiative and Confidence
00:21:44
Speaker
started? I think it's just like, get started.
00:21:46
Speaker
Just do something. it. Get out there. Yeah. You can do it. yeah Literally, like, at first, I was concerned that that name was going to be a little cheesy. And then it was like, I couldn't think of a better name. And and and then I couldn't believe no one else had taken it. And then as time goes on, it's like, you know, it's the perfect name, you know, just because that is my whole ethos, you know, it's just like, no, you can do this. Come on, let's go. Yeah. Well, that's right I mean, before when you were saying you didn't want to do it yourself, you wanted to help other people do it. It is the perfect name for that. Exactly. Right. 2026 is upon us and I have limited spaces open for my garden coaching and consultation sessions.
00:22:27
Speaker
Whether you're looking for help with plant identification, advice on care and maintenance or tips for improving your soil and plant nutrition. I'm here to help. As a garden designer, I'll help you think creatively about your outdoor space, offering tools and ideas to give you a fresh perspective on your garden projects.
00:22:48
Speaker
My coaching and consultation sessions can happen right in your garden if you live in the yeah UK or online if you're anywhere else in the world. My goal is to meet you where you are and support your unique garden journey.
00:23:03
Speaker
Whether you're just starting out, looking to refine your skills, or simply need a second opinion, or someone just to bounce ideas off, you have found your space.
00:23:14
Speaker
Head to the link in this episode description or shoot me an email at hello at thegardenerslodge.co.uk.
Using Social Media for Business Growth
00:23:24
Speaker
Social media, as we were talking about before, has played a massive role in building your business. yeah Talk to me about how you decided to start posting online and and building your business that way, as opposed to kind of maybe more generic ways, simplistic ways. Yeah, i think i I think I understood that I needed to be on social media. I mean, everybody, i think generally everyone's on social media if they have a business, some kind of social media. And I wasn't on anything online.
00:23:53
Speaker
um And I thought, all right, Instagram, I'll start with that. And it took me a while to even show my face on Instagram. um And mind you, I mean, it's not like I had any followers. It's just like, I'm actually a very private person, which I think is probably hard to believe, but- yeah I really don't like to put myself out there too much. And I really had to overcome. i mean, every time i press share, I'm overcoming something, you know. yeah but you know But showing my face is was a barrier. And I got over that, you know, ripped the bandaid and I was like, all right, that's done, you know. But i as I said, I didn't have any followers really at that time. And then I was teaching a class at the community, ah you know like adult ed kind of place. And I remember it so clearly. It was it was May of 2022. And I had like 50 followers at the time. Somebody in the class was like, oh, are you on social media? And i told her the account. She's like, girl, we need to get you some more people. Right.
00:24:55
Speaker
She might have been 51st or something. um But anyway, and so, and I didn't, I thought, yeah, let me, i need to be on here because ah that might be how people find me. But also it's one of those things where it's like, ah makes you not more legitimate, but you know like you gotta have, you gotta have a website or something that people can go to. Yeah. um So that's how it kind of started. And it it was with Instagram. And then after Instagram, I think it was, I think it was TikTok and then Facebook.
00:25:25
Speaker
What I love about your social media presence is that it is actually very different to a lot of other gardeners out there. You're not showing beautiful, perfect pictures. You're showing people's real gardens that are often quite gnarly. um And you're standing in front of a camera ah giving them advice. Right. Telling them, don't be afraid, chop the rhododendron. Exactly. Exactly. Why do you think people resonate so strongly with that honesty rather than that kind of like frivolous to me, at least inspirational pictures?
00:26:00
Speaker
Well, I think people go to these platforms for a few different reasons. One is for information, for learning. Like, how do I do this thing?
00:26:11
Speaker
You know, people go to YouTube and and type in like, how do i you know, fill in the blank. So I think there's a real how-to component here that people just need information and guidance.
00:26:23
Speaker
I also think people obviously go to be entertained and they go to be inspired. And I think there's just a lot of people who don't have anyone in their life to help them figure out what to do with their rhododendron. And they might've started to do research on this and then it quickly gets overwhelming. And Like I said, then sometimes there's contradictory advice.
00:26:46
Speaker
And so when I'm in somebody's yard and it might look like your yard, you can relate to it. you know You can see, oh, this person has an overgrown rhododendron. So do I. oh what is she going to tell them to do?
00:26:59
Speaker
maybe Maybe I can do that thing. You know what I mean? So at the end of the day, i think we're all just trying to make things efficient for ourselves to learn And if something is applying to us that someone else is talking about, then it it might be useful. So I think that's at the end of the day, I think that's what it is. I mean, you are so no nonsense on social media. And that's what I actually am quite drawn to with you. Talk to me about your garden ethos.
00:27:30
Speaker
Well, my garden ethos and my being direct ethos. Well, I mean, i imagine they link together quite hand in hand. Yeah. I mean, i think I'm a very direct person. So I just bring that to the garden, you know? And I think when I'm working with clients, which is most of my videos,
00:27:49
Speaker
I want them to have a good value for their money. And so I'm not going to dance, you know, I'm not going to beat around the bush. I'm going to tell them honestly what I think. And I i try to be nice and and respectful and all that. And sometimes they're difficult conversations because, you know, someone may have neglected something for a long time and now they need to really backtrack and deal with it. Sometimes there's conflicts or whatever with people. or someone's taken over a property that was badly managed. you know not These are not pleasant conversations that I need to have, all the invasives, whatever. These are not fun conversations. so
00:28:24
Speaker
I think the other part of this is just not just direct, but to weave in a little bit of humor and humanity in there with people because, you know, life is hard.
00:28:36
Speaker
Yeah. These conversations are hard, but it it doesn't mean that we can't find little bits of humor and um i don't know. i try joy I try to, yeah, joy. Exactly. I try to find that wherever I can.
00:28:51
Speaker
Yeah, i suppose it's not particularly nice when someone that you're paying comes to your house and goes, your entire garden is full of weeds. Yeah. And at the same time, I know that's why why I'm there is to tell them my opinion. And they know what they're getting themselves into. It's very rare that I go somewhere and they haven't seen a video of mine. I mean, occasionally it happens and it's very funny because I'll say, all right, well, you can record me telling you this and then, you know, this and that, and they're confused. And I'm like, wait, how did you find me? You know, oh, I Google, I found you on Google. Ah, right. Okay.
00:29:24
Speaker
Okay. Let me, let me explain. You know what I mean? That's very rare. That's very rare. Most people like they find me, most of them find me on Instagram. So they know the drill, you know, they know what they're getting them getting into when, when you're coming around. Yeah, I think they do. Yeah.
00:29:39
Speaker
a common sense gardening then. What does that actually mean
Practical and Minimalist Gardening Advice
00:29:42
Speaker
in practice? I think it's, you know, a lot of it is, look, don't take on too much. You know, don't take on more than you can reasonably do because then you're going to set yourself up for failure. So that's one thing. The other thing is to be um but pragmatic about the the resources. So like I was saying before, you don't need all these fancy tools. you know you need the bare minimum.
00:30:02
Speaker
Let's do that. um Let's try to save money wherever ever possible. So a lot of my ethos is about saving money. So don't buy stuff you don't need. Don't buy plants you don't need. Divide what you have. Share them. You know, don't overplant. You're wasting your money. Like, space them properly. And then, you know, don't set yourself up. This is just all about pragmatism, really. Like, don't set yourself up for ah needless maintenance requirements, hassles, wasting money, you know problems later. And a lot of this comes from my own mistakes that I have made, um which I'm happy to try to help people avoid. And then other you know mistakes that other people have made. So it's like, let me synthesize all the mistakes you know and then try to you know prevent you from making them. and help you feel empowered and try to have some fun and find joy in gardening and maintain your property and try to avoid the invasive plants and try to introduce some ecological gardening practices. Like it's all kind of related. Let me shove all that at people, you know?
00:31:09
Speaker
You know, one of the things that i often, and I'm sure you're the same when you get called to do a consultation or a coaching session is they go, this plant is sick. Yeah. Yeah. And they freak out and they're like, what what do I spray? What am I going to do to it? And I think the hardest thing for me is trying to get across to them.
00:31:27
Speaker
You do not need to do anything to it, depending, of course. Sometimes things have gone a little far and you do. But... Generally, it you need to kind of say, so stop, stand back, observe. how How important do you think observation is when you're communicating gardening skill to your clients? Yeah, I think observation is especially critical with pruning, actually. So not just when you're pruning, you know, even before, like, why are you thinking you need to prune this thing? Then when you're pruning, it's hold on,
00:32:03
Speaker
Don't just, you know, like take a step back, look at it, you know, make sure you can't remove less, but you can remove more. But then actually after you prune something is when you should really pay attention to just see what happens with the plant because every plant's a little different in terms of how it's going to respond to pruning. And if you pay attention, then that gives you insight into how to prune it in the future, which then builds your confidence and, you know, then you can go off and do other plants. So I think the power of observation to see what and what pruning has in terms of an impact on a particular plant is really instructive.
00:32:40
Speaker
How can people save money and where do they waste it? I think people waste a lot of money on plants. um Too many plants and then the wrong plants for their yard.
00:32:53
Speaker
um I think they they, and then they also neglect them sometimes. So- you know spending a Plants are very expensive, at least where I live. Very expensive. Like a perennial is $30 or something, $15 to $30, depending on how so how big it is and where you're getting it. So that adds up really quickly if you're trying to fill a space. So first of all, you need to take care of your plants once you once you put them in the ground. So this is this is an unforced error. Like water your plants, keep them watered, keep your eye on them until they get established. Otherwise, you're throwing money down the toilet. So that's important, but also plants get bigger. So don't buy too many.
00:33:33
Speaker
This is, you know, like classic of sort of over planting. um So that's, those are the basics. And then, you know, don't buy something you already have. Like if you have catmint and sedum and, you know,
00:33:45
Speaker
ah some grasses or whatever. Don't go buy more of those things. Divide what you have and move them around. That is very economical. And i talk a lot about that. you know you You can also buy small and wait. you know Instead of buying something you know in a two-gallon pot, you just buy a small little thing. And it grows so they grow so quickly. And the same thing with shrubs and trees. They establish so much quicker and better in a long run. And you get a plant that actually...
00:34:13
Speaker
Yeah. Looks right for the space as instead of one that's grown perfectly in a you know yeah glass house somewhere. Exactly. i also think people waste money on fertilizer. i mean, that's sort short lived anyway.
00:34:24
Speaker
yeah um Whereas where I think people would be wise to invest time and not that much money, but certainly time is in spreading compost around. the garden and enriching the soil there, providing sufficient nutrients for the plants. once you And I talk a lot about this actually because this fits perfectly with my style, which is I'm lazy. you know I mean, I have a lot of energy and I'm very ambitious and work endlessly in the garden, but at the end of the day, I'm always looking about looking to cut corners. And it just so happens that cutting that some of the corners that you can cut are better ecologically for
00:35:03
Speaker
your garden and, you know, sort of for the ecosystem in general. So an example of that would be leaving all the leaves, leaving your perennials as long as possible into the spring and temperatures would get reliably in the fifties. This is great. You know, ultimately it's less time for us. um And it's, we keep the, the organic matter on the property, let it all break down. Then you need less fertilizer. I, I refer to my property as a closed system where very little comes in.
00:35:33
Speaker
And only some things leave. Like if I cut down a small tree or a bunch of shrubs or whatever, then it's too much for my little stick pile or what have you. And then that might go to the, we have a transfer station in town, but some people have municipal, like a yard waste pickup or whatever. yeah um So, but I don't,
00:35:52
Speaker
when you use what you have available, then and and everything's breaking down, that's good for the soil. So now we're not buying fertilizers. We're not buying compost. We're not even buying mulch now. We just use wood chips I get from a tree service. So now it's like, what am I spending money on? You know what I mean? Only new plants. And when I get new plants, I'm buying them small or I'm getting bare root or, you know, it's like, or I'm getting them on clearance, like at the end of the season.
00:36:22
Speaker
I think, At the end of the day, like I am very frugal. And so I bring that mentality to the whole endeavor, not just for myself, but for everybody.
Patience in Gardening
00:36:31
Speaker
I want everybody to save money and spend it on the right thing and not be hemorrhaging you know on you know money on things that are not necessary.
00:36:41
Speaker
I think you're completely right. And I think this kind of ties back into what we were speaking about before people want things to be perfect. So they think they need to go out and buy every plant that they need and they want it done tomorrow um or yesterday, most likely. But if they stop and they learn, and this is one of the, I think the greatest teachings of gardening really is patience.
00:37:04
Speaker
Yeah. If you can wait a couple of seasons for that miscanthus to grow big so you can divide it, you're going to save money. You're going to end up with a better planting scheme because you've actually thought it through yeah been able to visualize it greatly um as opposed to going to the garden center without a clue in the world and you know buying 20 different plants that are all going to out-compete each other and grow.
00:37:30
Speaker
end up being a mess. So yeah, I think, I think that all feeds back into that. Yeah. patient I love what you were saying about leaving the plants over the, to overwinter, and then chopping them down in the, in the early but little very late winter, early spring. I suppose in England, it is early spring, isn't it? When it gets into the 50s. I don't know what that is. said to You know, we have Fahrenheit over here, but- Mid 50s is around 12 degrees Celsius. Yeah. For me in my area, it's like mid-April that results in mid-April. So that means like I used to be a tidy gardener that that was doing a fall cleanup or an early spring cleanup. And now it's like,
00:38:06
Speaker
my just My garden is just a mess until mid to late April, you know? Yeah, it's it's interesting. With climate change or the climate crisis, I'm noticing that things are popping out earlier than they usually do. So yeah at this point, instead of kind of going like, oh, it's, you know, the meteorological spring or whatever, it's I'm just
Adapting to Climate Change in Gardening
00:38:28
Speaker
taking cues really. And I think this is a good idea is take cues from your garden, particularly moving forward. Yeah. Because, yeah, things here are popping out and I'm thinking, oh, God, it's a bit early, mate. you know Is it already popping out? Oh, yeah. We've got um a lot of ah roses are starting to shoot a little bit. um
00:38:47
Speaker
What else? We've a lot of blossom out at the moment. i That does feel very early. That is early. Can I just tell you where it is? getting two feet of snow right now we're in the kidding in the middle of a massive snowstorm so it's just so hilarious like I can't even begin to see the ground oh my god that is funny that's interesting because yeah yeah being early spring here what should we be doing in the garden Yeah. Okay. So I would say, you know, the longer you can wait on the cleanup is the best thing to do ecologically. So what does that mean? That means what we want to do according to ecologists, is um let as many insects as possible complete their life cycle. So that's usually when temperatures are around the mid-50s Fahrenheit consistently.
00:39:42
Speaker
And so for me where I live, that's around mid-April or so. um And then what does a cleanup look like? it Very little. So it's um you know thinking about things like sedum or catmint or you know um other upright things that either flop over or they're just a little bushy to just leave them completely alone. Like I leave hostas completely alone. They just come up, come down, come up, come down. I don't do anything with them.
00:40:11
Speaker
But things like cat mint, for example, or sedum, I'll cut them back and tuck the um the stems around the base of the plant. And then they get hidden when the plants grow in. and so that's the kind of thing where it's less to cart around And also all that breaks down and goes into the soil then for nutrients. So that kind of cleanup is efficient and it does tidy things up, but it looks still a little messy at first for a little while until things grow in. um But it also acts as mulch. So then it's less labor to be spreading mulch around. And certainly, again, you don't need fertilizer and you don't need compost this way. So
00:40:57
Speaker
I think what's evolving or what should be evolving or certainly has for me is this idea of what is attractive. um And once you have an appreciation for the life that you're fostering on your property, it helps to ease the pain of having it not look all tidy. Like it actually looks nice to me now to have it be a little messy because I know there's ecological value. So, right. So I would say delayed cleanup, um except in some areas where like if you have,
00:41:28
Speaker
crocuses or small bulbs that are not going to be able to come up in the middle of a big mess of stuff or a lot of leaves, then that's where it's like this selective ah tidying does come into play. Like I do have some of those things. And I have an area where I have a lot of tulips and some other bulbs where it is tidy because I look at it all the time out the kitchen window. So I think these are just like you know nuances and and arrangements we make with ourselves about like, okay, I'm going to do this in this area. i'm going to do that in that other area. i'm going to leave this totally alone. I'm going to tidy this up. So it's like figuring out, everybody needs to figure out their own approach.
Spring Gardening Tips
00:42:05
Speaker
But in the spring, for me personally, and what I suggest to other people is in addition to the delayed cleanup, it's you know know your own plants so you can adjust accordingly. But when things start to thaw, you can divide plants. um And so, you know, as soon as people feel like getting out there, wanting to divide their plants and start moving around, great, do it. You know, as soon as the ground, at least here, it freezes. don't know. In a lot of places, it doesn't.
00:42:34
Speaker
and yeah But I'm out there, in you know, in December and then again in March, you know. um dividing things. So I think, you know, that's something that people can get excited about doing in the, in the spring and go all the way until winter or through winter, depending on where you live.
00:42:52
Speaker
So the other thing about spring is that it is a really, really good time to do your pruning. um And so if you have an overgrown shrub, for example, or something that's leggy, meaning that you know it doesn't have um healthy growth on it, and you want to kind of give it a reboot,
00:43:11
Speaker
Late winter, early spring is the best time for that because you'll get the most vigorous growth. And sometimes people overthink and they're worried about where do I cut. It usually doesn't matter that much. So I would just say, go in and do it and get it done. And then you'll see vigorous new growth and that will be beneficial um for the landscape. You know, they can't tell you the number of times that I've worked with clients where there's been a big pruning in the spring and even in the summer, you know, and then just the plants want to live. So they just kick out a bunch of new growth.
00:43:39
Speaker
No, I think that's really good advice. And i think you're right too. Leaving things on the ground does look a little bit messy and it is a mindset shift. But I think when you know that you're doing it for the right reasons, it becomes a lot easier. Also, i like the idea of knowing your garden and knowing your high presentation areas. So maybe at your front door, things are kept a little bit neater. Yeah. um And tidier and where you just want to see like, yeah, beauty um as opposed to it. But I mean, yeah, mindset shift is is is a great one with that. Yeah, I think so.
00:44:12
Speaker
What do you think people rush in too early to do in spring? you know As soon as the the garden centers are open, people go and they get excited to buy plants, but they don't necessarily... um they don't it's not like they don't know how It's not like they know how to think it through and they don't. I think people don't necessarily...
00:44:31
Speaker
have the ability to think through, okay wait, where are these plants going? How am I going to arrange them? I think a lot of people find that very overwhelming actually. So instead of trying to figure that out, <unk> they just go to the garden center and buy a bunch of plants and just shove them in, which I completely understand because I've done that myself many times. um So I think it's the rushing into it, but i I don't even really want to say that because It's not like everybody is equipped to figure out a different way.
00:45:00
Speaker
um And that's why people hire us You know, it's why people need help, you know, figuring out how to design things, um you know, because otherwise they might waste money. So again, i would say... you know If people have the desire to go and buy stuff, great. Buy a couple of things. Try not to break the bank and get too many things.
00:45:21
Speaker
And then satisfy that itch, get a couple things, put them in, and then try to be patient about you know how you're going to approach the rest of the season.
00:45:33
Speaker
Great advice. I think too, with that, people ah often will make the mistake of buying a lot of little things all the time, you know, running to the garden center every weekend on a nice day and buying one of this, one of that without any kind of real yeah thought process around the cohesion of the garden. Yeah. A plan is nice, but then again, i think it's, you know, i think that's part of the trial and error, isn't it? It's like,
00:46:02
Speaker
I know for myself, I've put a bunch of things in, then it's like I've moved so many things over the years because I figure out, oh, this doesn't really go here or it could it could be fine, but it's like, it bothers me. And you know why does it bother me? And then it takes some tweaking and I might move something a couple of times. And that's when things gel. So I think i think right it's it's not um failure if something goes in and it is moved. I think that's where we kind of come back to people needing to feel more confidence about look, just plant it and then make sure to take care of it so you don't kill it. And then if you need to move it later, you move it. Like I've planted things and dug them up the next day and he would put them in somewhere else. Yeah. you know him
00:46:52
Speaker
I have also done that. i've I think I played out an entire garden once and then went, you know what? Yeah. Right. Let's re-go. let's Yeah. I mean, I've even planned something and move it 10 minutes later. I mean, it's ridiculous, but, but that's part of gardening. I think that, ah that inexperienced gardeners don't necessarily know is like, Oh, the number of times you might end up moving something is quite staggering.
00:47:16
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. And even like with my design clients, like I kind of say to them, you know, ah I'm going to design this on paper. And in theory,
00:47:28
Speaker
It'll work great. Yeah. On the day I'm going to come and I'm going to lay out all the plants because I know for a fact that when I'm in the physical space, changes will be made. There's, there's like no question about it. Things will be shifted and admittedly, yeah, in the future, they're, you know, maintenance gardener should be reevaluating things as the garden grows and flourishes because it's only natural.
00:47:54
Speaker
Yeah. Agreed. What is next for you? Well, I'm just gearing up for this season here and funny with this new snow, it's like, it's delayed. I mean, is it untimely snow?
00:48:07
Speaker
Yeah, it's, ah we've had so much snow this winter already. And yeah it's also been unseasonably cold. So more snow than normal and colder than normal. And um so it's just, yeah, it's delayed. that My season will be delayed start, but that's totally fine. You know, there's plenty of time.
00:48:28
Speaker
Thank you so much for your time today, Jessica. You're welcome. It was great chatting with you. Lovely chatting with you too. Thank you so much for joining me today. If you like the show, don't forget to hit the follow or subscribe button, tell a friend or two, or maybe even give the show five-star rating and a review.
Conclusion and Listener Engagement
00:48:47
Speaker
If you want more gardeners lodge content, you can find our website, our Instagram and our TikTok in the show notes below this episode. The gardeners lodge podcast is a growing media production.