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The Casual Nerdity Holiday Special
19 Plays1 month ago
The holidays are upon us, so Nick & Daryl spend some time talking about some of their favorite holiday specials, from the Star Wars Holiday Special to A Charlie Brown Christmas. Along the way, they try to figure out the cosmology of the Rankin-Bass Christmas Specials Universe.
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Transcript
Introduction to Casual Nerdity Holiday Special
00:00:01
Speaker
Because of the following special program, Wonder Woman and the Incredible Hulk will not be presented this evening.
Holiday Special Plot Points and Themes
00:00:18
Speaker
Welcome to the Casual Nerdity Holiday Special, everyone. We're doing something a little different this time. Thank you for joining us. This is Daryl.
00:00:30
Speaker
This is Nick. And it's just the two of us this time around as we are just, ah we're going to have some fun just chatting about holiday specials and some of the cool, some of the silly, some of the just outrageous and decide what meaning of outrageous you want to apply to that. and Perhaps we may even learn the meaning of the holidays. Is that the point of all this? ah No. No.
00:01:02
Speaker
Isn't the meaning of the holidays we have to leave our large metro area, which we do live in a large metro area, and go to our home? it out in the We have to be very successfully, we have to be in a very successful business field and be either engaged or married, or about to be married.
00:01:24
Speaker
We're already out. oh We're already out because we're we're we're we're not super successful. We we get by. Yeah. Okay, so we... Or am about to get married married to someone in the similar field, but they're just not... I don't like them anymore. I like Christmas and fun.
00:01:43
Speaker
No, you don't like Christmas and fun, at least not yet. You have to go back to your home out in the middle of nowhere where a hunky basket weaver who makes $14 year teaches you the true meaning of love and Christmas and makes you abandon your successful seven-figure job in the large metro area and... And the boring love interest.
00:02:11
Speaker
Yes. is also really okay with this. Oh, and the hunky basket weaver has a precocious child, too, that you become attached to.
00:02:23
Speaker
So, yeah, none of that's going to happen for us this year.
Focus on TV Christmas Specials
00:02:27
Speaker
Now, just at the outset, let's set a few ground rules. We're going to be talking Christmas specials, which are typically TV special presentations or even sometimes special Christmas episodes of an established TV series as opposed to Christmas movies. No, we will not be fighting about whether Die Hard is a Christmas movie or not, at least not this year.
00:02:56
Speaker
that requires ah That probably serves a larger forum to discuss that. there's some nuance to that Yes, Christmas movies and the whole Die Hard conundrum, ah they deserve their own platform, so let's put a pin in that for next year.
00:03:11
Speaker
And instead, let's talk Christmas specials. Now, I don't know about you, Nick. I grew up loving Christmas specials like a Charlie Brown Christmas and Rudolph.
00:03:24
Speaker
they ah and They still are part of my tradition every year to watch a good handful of Christmas specials in the lead up are on ah the eve and even on the day, just depending on where I put my Christmas movie watch order. Same, same. And while we're talking a little bit later ah Help me remember that I do want to talk about the whole, know, is there a unified Rankin-Bass Christmas special universe or is it a multiverse?
00:03:58
Speaker
Now that's an interesting question. and Yes. and But we will come back to it like that Those Rankin-Bass heads out there, we we're we know that you're out there.
Inspiration from the Star Wars Holiday Special
00:04:09
Speaker
you over there One of the things, though, that really inspired this episode is our friends at the Movie Defenders podcast a few episodes ago, they did an episode about the infamous Star Wars holiday special.
00:04:25
Speaker
I even watched it with one of them in the lead up to it. Yes, you you watched it with Donald and on his movie night on Discord. I was unfortunately working a conference, so I didn't even see that he was doing it that night until like three nights later. It was the only... Unfortunately, we were the only ones there, so... I mean, that that's usually how the movie nights go. There's usually one or two other people.
00:04:49
Speaker
It was sad, though, because I... Would have been nice to have a few more. It's always good to to riff with more than two. Exactly. But that got us to thinking about Christmas specials. And oddly enough, just starting with the Star Wars holiday special, it wasn't the first holiday special.
00:05:08
Speaker
By far. It crafted by... designed to be a holiday special by experts in the holiday special field. In the variety show field. It was the standard 70s variety show with a code of Star Wars paint slapped on it.
00:05:25
Speaker
But it's like it but they knew the background of how to make holiday specials and variety shows. So it just adds to the mystique of how it came out. It was how it has...
00:05:38
Speaker
Such huge names behind it, like in that both of the time terms of like actors and stuff like that, but also like in the background, like people who like worked on stuff like the Dick Van Dyke, like Holland variety shows like and classic, like legendaries. And it only aired once.
00:05:58
Speaker
And then started circulating on bootleg tapes through the convention circuit. But despite that, through that reputation that it has, it actually has influenced other holiday specials in the years that have come.
Glee's Homage to Holiday Specials
00:06:15
Speaker
ah For instance, in season three of Glee, they they did a Christmas episode that the podcast plot within the episode was that the Glee Club was hired by the local cable access station to create a holiday special to air because they didn't want to pay the licensing rights for the burning Yule log footage. And so Artie
00:06:47
Speaker
one of the members of the Glee Club has this insane idea that their Christmas special is going to be a mashup of the old school Liza Minnelli Christmas special and the Star Wars holiday special.
00:07:06
Speaker
And so it it's a variety show. It has a set that looks like the Liza Minnelli Christmas special, but but the opening credits look like the Star Wars holiday special. And, well, at one point, there is this entrance.
00:07:23
Speaker
Oh, how rude of me. Ladies and gentlemen, Finn Hudson and Noah Puckerman. Say, are you dressed like Luke Skywalker and Han Solo? No, that's copyright infringement.
00:07:35
Speaker
Any resemblance to Star Wars characters is purely coincidental. And Finn's not only dressed as Luke, he's like waving a lightsaber around. And part of the part of the aesthetic is, since it's partly the Liza Minnelli Christmas special, it's in black and white, but Finn's lightsaber that he's waving around is blue.
00:07:57
Speaker
In the black and white footage. So, I mean, how how the Glee Club working for a cable access company that didn't want to pay for stock footage could do those kind of effects?
00:08:10
Speaker
Don't ask. that that's That's rule number one with Glee. Don't ask. but Also, one of the few times that Fox was like letting the play, sort of Disney would do that the same later and have, like when they bought Star Wars, they'd have Star Wars characters in some of their DCOM original Disney sitcoms appear just because they had them. So this was kind of a fun way that Fox was doing the same. Well, and I mean, if yes, that was near the end of Of Lucasfilm being like super, super tightened down.
Guardians of the Galaxy Holiday Special
00:08:44
Speaker
Because round of you have the Star Wars Holiday Special that just is this drug-fueled orgy of 70s variety.
00:08:56
Speaker
We're not entirely sure which drugs they were. Possibly all of them. But you also had things like... circa 1980 because it was the cloud city carbon freezing chamber set.
00:09:10
Speaker
There was an energizer battery commercial with Darth Vader who goes to ignite his lightsaber, but it won't come on because he's got Duracell batteries in and the energizer bunny comes, you know, thumping through running because he's on energizer batteries and fader was on Duracell. So, i mean, it it wasn't anything new, but it was something that hadn't happened for a while that you let something totally off-brand have that kind of fun with the property. Because they even, Lucasfilm sent a Chewbacca to the set because at one point when Artie comes up with this idea, you know, he he daydreams about Chewbacca. So...
00:09:59
Speaker
you know You see the Chewbacca there. And they had a photo shoot with the cast doing promo pictures with Chewbacca. So this had Lucasfilm's stamp of approval, despite the little meta joke about, no, that's copyright infringement. We are just distinctly different from from Luke Skywalker and Han Solo.
00:10:22
Speaker
it's like it's It's a fun way of like referencing character. pseudo classic yeah and and also having fun with the concept of a holiday special and then more recently just a couple of years ago you know that james gunn is like you know a gen x pop culture you sponge yeah and really i i wouldn't have known and a couple of years ago On Disney+, plus we had the Guardians of the Galaxy holiday special. And at this point, I think anything, especially anything genre like that, but anything that specifically uses the term holiday special... Knows what talking about.
00:11:07
Speaker
Yeah, they're pointing back to the Star Wars holiday special at this point. So, again, it had a musical number. Yeah. It had a musical number that opened and closed it. Again, not something unique from for James Gunn, but you know it it had even though it was about 30 minutes or so, 30, 45 minutes, it had the same kind of pseudo-variety vibe. Yeah, it had the manic energy of both the Guardians movies and the Star Wars Holiday special.
00:11:43
Speaker
I'd say that and they definitely... If we had to compare it, it played it a lot more straight as like a straightforward narrative than a variety show. But it had that. answer Yes. Yes. Although in it, the Guardians did learn the true meaning of Christmas. Mm hmm.
00:12:00
Speaker
But you know since all of them but Star-Lord are aliens, it stands to reason why they don't know what Christmas is. In fact, that is the opening musical number.
00:12:13
Speaker
I don't know what Christmas is, but Christmastime is here. And it's beautiful. And I added it to i added it to our Christmas playlist. and I love it. It's un beautiful.
00:12:25
Speaker
It's like, it's earnest. It's like, again, like it could easily been satirical, but it does come up very earnest. is like, it's funny. Yeah. But it's like, yeah, of course they don't know, but they want to know because they want to support their friend.
00:12:38
Speaker
And yeah how how better to do it than by kidnapping Kevin Bacon to make him a human Christmas present for Star-Lord. Again, it's gem. It's a real, if you haven't saw seen it, uh,
00:12:52
Speaker
Trust me. Worth it. Very much so. Very much so. Now, you said that you had a few Christmas slash holiday specials that you wanted to to touch on specifically.
Unique Christmas Specials Discussed
00:13:04
Speaker
ah Yeah. ah One of my favorite is ah came out in 1999. It's a Olive the Other Reindeer. I have heard of it, but I have never seen it.
00:13:15
Speaker
Oh, it it it stars ah Drew Barrymore, Dan Castaneda, a.k.a. Okay, Homer Simpson it was animated by Mac Ronin. Interesting. Or least produced by him. It's a fun idea. It's about a and i young Jack Russell Terrier voiced by Drew Baylor named Olive. who just doesn't seem to, like, fit in where she lives. And thinks, like... And here's, like, a... as s ah On the radio, that Santa Claus is canceling Christmas because the reindeer are unwell, and he's calling for all of the other reindeer, but...
00:13:55
Speaker
Seamus hears it as Olive, the other reindeer. And goes on a journey to the North Pole full of like incredibly funny meta commentary. It's hilarious.
00:14:08
Speaker
That sounds fun. That sounds fun. It's fun. It's cute. It's got great musical numbers. It's got great voice acting. And it's just it's just a fun idea.
00:14:21
Speaker
And I want to circle back to Matt Groening later too. what what else do What else is there? This was a bit unconvinced, but have you ever heard like ah like old Christmas songs about the tales of the glories and scary ghost stories? like I'd be remiss of talking about the ah Black Mirror Christmas special, White Christmas.
00:14:45
Speaker
No, i have I have not seen that. I have not seen a single episode of Black Mirror. I recommend it. It's something that... It's something that I want to correct at some point, but I just never... This is especially, this is this is right after the second series, I believe. Yeah, it's a it's in the second so and series, so the third, so right before the third season. And it's it's a sort of 74-minute special that tells three different stories that are all connected in the end.
00:15:18
Speaker
And if you don't know what Black Mirror is about, it's usually about, it's sort of a twilight zone, but more about the technological than the supernatural. I see. It's all built around like a...
00:15:30
Speaker
group of individuals in a remote ca row cabin a sort of discuss and who are sort of on a job of undisclosed reasonings and they haven't had much contact with each other so they decide to on Christmas Day to sort of open up to each other going into several vignettes that reveal more and there's as always with Black Mirror there's a rather ah sickening twist.
00:15:56
Speaker
Yeah that much I gathered about Black Mirror. This one's unique in that it has three stories that are all seemingly, that are all very unique, but they all sort of come together to form the final twist.
00:16:09
Speaker
Very well acted, very well done. Some very unique and heady ideas. like it's not It's not your feel-good holiday special, but it's definitely, it has elements that make you feel sort of Warm fuzzy, and then it rips the the carpeting off from under you. Gotcha.
00:16:25
Speaker
Gotcha. So again, it definitely fits more into those ski to that dead line of scary ghost stories and tales of glory. And just just for the record, um yeah, that's Stephanie's least favorite Christmas song.
00:16:40
Speaker
It's like, why are they telling ghost stories? She hates that song. Almost as much almost as Almost as much as the Mariahpocalypse and Whamageddon. Well, there's only one that I despise more, and that's the Christmas suit. Well, yeah, that one, that's just that horrible.
00:16:59
Speaker
All around. But we're not going to get in I could do a whole rant about that. That song. And the movie that came out of it. Yeah, we we can hold off on that. Maybe that's year after next Christmas song.
TV Specials vs Episodes
00:17:11
Speaker
I was going to ask, like would you put like the various episodes of television ist that depict a Christmas carol as a holiday special? Or would that be its own concept? A little from column A and a little from column B. Because... i As we're having this conversation, I'm trying to not even just make, but see if there is a distinction between a, yeah when it comes to a TV series, a Christmas special and a Christmas episode.
00:17:44
Speaker
You know what I mean? know what you mean. Because there are, when i was when we were thinking this up, is like I think specials are their own separate things, but they can be connected to larger series. yeah Specials are are generally their their own kind of thing. The reason I kind of include that Glee episode, even though it is their second annual Christmas episode, but from their third season, the setup itself of the episode is them making a Christmas special.
00:18:17
Speaker
So at least half of the episode is structured like... a Christmas special. So I think it kind of counts there.
00:18:27
Speaker
Like I was going to bring up like ah that about a year ago, me and Lawrence did a rewatch of the Milo pony generation four. So it has three to four Christmas episodes, but an actual holiday special.
00:18:40
Speaker
So it's like, it I wouldn't count those as holiday specials because there isn't one that's designated like, no, this is the holiday special. Right. Yeah. there There's a separate holiday special alongside their Christmas episodes. Yeah. so Sometimes there is ah that little bit of a distinction where, you know,
00:18:59
Speaker
Yes, a series might have one or more Christmas episodes, but then they will also do a Christmas special that kind of, know, breaks the mold and is its own event.
00:19:13
Speaker
Yeah, and it's good to have that discussion because we could we'd gladly like to hear about your favorite holiday specials and maybe even do holiday episodes from longer series as well in future holiday specials of ours here at Casual Nerdy.
00:19:30
Speaker
Yep, absolutely. And, you know, maybe maybe I'm cheating a little bit by including that Glee episode, but I'm going to steal something else from our friends at the Movie Defenders when they say, it's our show.
00:19:43
Speaker
It's my show. Screw it. I'll do what I want. And you get to say the same thing, too. But... ah better I think if we're going to talk holiday, especially around the Christmas time a year.
00:19:56
Speaker
Well, that's usually when holiday specials are released. There's only like one, it's ah it's there's a name that comes to It's minor type that this should be in everyone's mind. And that is? The Rankin-Bass Special. Yes, the Rankin-Bass Special. Okay, so I'm going to dive right in with what I mentioned earlier.
00:20:15
Speaker
Is it a cohesive universe or a multiverse? Hear me out. I'm going to hear you out, because I've had my thoughts about that as well. Now, granted, Rudolph came first.
00:20:27
Speaker
Of course. But then then came Santa Claus is coming to town. actually and believe the after that was actually the little drummer bowl. Well, umm I'm talking about the ones that involve Santa.
00:20:40
Speaker
Okay. All of the ones that involve Santa. So you have the year without it our Santa Claus is coming to town. And then the year without a Santa Claus. Now, even though off on the side there, even though it is traditional cell animation rather than then the puppet animation, Frosty the Snowman is part of this universe because of Rudolph and Frosty's Christmas in July.
00:21:08
Speaker
Yes. And Rudolph's shiny new year is part of the same universe with Rudolph. Now, here's here's the thing, though. If we're looking at those three with Rudolph in them, right?
00:21:22
Speaker
Yeah. Rudolph grows to adulthood by the end of Rudolph. yeah Exactly. we spen he he he spen He spends most of it as the cute little reindeer that's in all the merchandising. and with his With his disturbing disturbing horn that that haunts my eardrums every time that happens. And then by the end of it, he's grown to adulthood. He's a full adult reindeer.
00:21:48
Speaker
Yeah. And then the events of the song happen. At the end. But like most of his adventure takes place when he's like, it starts with mostly when the kid, then his sort of like teenage years, but he's a full, he's a full on adult but by the time the song happens.
00:22:04
Speaker
Right. But then we go into Rudolph's shiny new year and he's the cute kid again, but the events of the song have happened because when he catches up with happy, the baby new year and tries to tell him that it's okay to be different,
00:22:20
Speaker
he relates the story of the song. Which he doesn't learn. he's He's still an outcast, weirdly, even an Rudolph isn't an outcast anymore. but that's know what i'm saying the wholeli that's That's the whole point of like him of you bringing
Rankin-Bass Universe Debate
00:22:34
Speaker
it up.
00:22:34
Speaker
Yeah, but the model that they use is he's a kid again. Because that's the cute, adorable one on all the merchandise. Yes. And same goes for Rudolph and Frosty's Christmas in July. So you yeah you immediately get that retcon there.
00:22:50
Speaker
But we have the Santa Claus ones. We have the year without a Santa Claus and Santa Claus is coming to town. Santa Claus is coming to town probably up there is one of my favorites. Oh, yeah.
00:23:03
Speaker
Santa Claus is coming to town is awesome. And in both. Santa Claus is coming to town and the year without a Santa Claus, Mickey Rooney voices Santa. Yes.
00:23:14
Speaker
and He does. and he He does. a Great. that He does. If you haven't seen those, if if you've somehow not seen the these, just his voice alone as Santa Claus is, that that will be in your head for as Santa Claus. Now, keep with me here.
00:23:29
Speaker
Stay with me. In Santa Claus is coming to town, which is his origin story. Yes. We are also introduced to Jessica, the schoolteacher, who becomes Mrs. Claus. Jessica has red hair.
00:23:42
Speaker
And in Santa Claus is Coming to Town, even though Mrs. Claus is older, plumper, and has gray hair, it has streaks of red. Yes. So, by virtue of Mickey Rooney voicing Santa Claus...
00:23:59
Speaker
and Mrs. Claus having streaks of red hair, i we are... Those two are definitely connected. We have to believe that those are a connected story.
00:24:11
Speaker
And because there is a... in In not to spoil anything for Year of Out with the Santa Claus card, there is an affluence of like unique sort of spirits and creatures around in the sort of right or as story of Santa Claus beyond the usual elves, which gets us into sort of the unique antagonists of the Year of Out of Santa Claus, Snow Miser and Heat Miser, who are awesome. They they are amazing.
00:24:40
Speaker
Now, Rudolph, on the other hand, it came first. Mickey Rooney does not voice Santa, but again, it came first. The design has some reminiscence. but The design is similar, but Mrs. Claus has black hair.
00:24:56
Speaker
Yes. But, of course, Rudolph is the Rankin-Bass flagship holiday special. It's... It's the big one. It's the one that everyone knows. If you look on on the on the Wikipedia, this era of them is called the Rudolph era.
00:25:16
Speaker
So, my question, that's where my question comes in. Are we looking at a Rankin-Bass universe or a multiverse? Because Rudolph is referenced in A Year Without a Santa Claus.
00:25:31
Speaker
Yes. At one point, you know, um the the narrator asks the kid, or no, in um Santa Claus is Coming to Town, the narrator ah asks the kids, you know after you learn the origin of the flying reindeer, he's like, and I bet you know all of the reindeer's names and kids off screen name off for the reindeer. And then one of them says, what about, and it cuts, what about Rudolph? And it cuts to Rudolph, an adult Rudolph in silhouette whose nose lights up just like on Rudolph.
00:26:08
Speaker
And then everyone's like, oh, that's a story for another time. It's a different sound. Different sound, but a sound. Yes. But that's important to know. That's like, in case you haven't seen your puzzles, the sound is a very big part of that as well. So there is a Rudolph in the Santa Claus come to town, Year Without a Santa Claus universe.
00:26:32
Speaker
Is it the same one? And we're basically just looking at recasting of Santa and Mrs. Claus. I'd argue with that being sort of that this we are looking at a variant of Rudolf. We're looking at a variant, so there's a multiverse.
00:26:51
Speaker
That's what I'm going to go with. Because if I remember correctly, both both universes have a sentient snowman as the narrator. Rudolf does, because it's Burl Ives.
00:27:04
Speaker
Yeah. Santa Claus is Coming to Town has Fred Astaire as the postman. Oh, the postman. And mrs I believe Mrs. Claus narrates the year without a Santa Claus. Yes, because NC's also one of the characters in it. so Right.
00:27:22
Speaker
Could that be the the sort of inflection point that there isn't a Frosty? Well, I mean, it's not Frosty who's narrating Rudolph. know that, but both of them have hats.
00:27:35
Speaker
Could the year of Out of Santa Claus and Santa Claus coming to town be a universe where snowmen with hats can't come along? And that's like... I don't know. This takes some point.
00:27:46
Speaker
Or are we way overthinking all of this? For all in the name of of fun. For all in the name fun. but it's like, it's it's if you've watched them, you can't help but think like, ah.
00:27:57
Speaker
Because didn't remember watching it. is like, wait, that is the design of Rudolph in silhouette with the nose. But the noise, you're right, the noise is different. I remember that as kid's like, wait, that's not the same noise.
00:28:10
Speaker
Well, and the noise changes from Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer to Rudolph's Shiny New Year, too. Yeah. When when Rudolph de-ages. And can can I just go on record?
00:28:22
Speaker
I know that we have mentioned this before in years past talking about it. But yeah, in Rudolph the resno Red-Nosed Reindeer, Santa Claus is a dick.
00:28:32
Speaker
Oh, he is. That's also kind of why I'm fine them being multiverse. Because, like, in Santa Claus is a saint.
00:28:45
Speaker
Well, here's the thing, though. Here's how you can reconcile them. Remember, the whole plot of the year without a Santa Claus is Santa Claus is like, I'm done. Nobody cares about Christmas.
00:28:57
Speaker
So... If we look at the timeline here, you have Santa Claus is coming to town, which is his origin and his beginnings and he's hopeful. He's already getting a little worn down by the end of it because that's when he cuts back his deliveries to once a year.
00:29:15
Speaker
Yeah. Because yeah everything has gotten so big that it's that it can't be handled as frequently as he had been doing everything. So he delivers presents only once a year. It actually really cool and inspiring. Again, like, watch the Santa Claus is coming down. You will love it. It's just such a wholesome story.
00:29:35
Speaker
And then, um you know, then, and again, you have variable ages and genders of the reindeer among the three specials, but you can hand wave that away by saying that, no, it's not the same reindeer. He goes through a series of them and just keeps giving them the same name. Yeah, they're code names. It's like 007. so, but, so has his origin,
00:30:02
Speaker
and so so he he he has his origin Then we do Rudolph. Santa Claus is getting cranky. This is all a grind at this point. This is a business now. And... And it's a particularly rough night. It's a particularly rough night.
00:30:21
Speaker
And I mean, you we... that That's no excuse for how he acts at the beginning of the movie. Oh, yeah. they At the beginning of the special. But, you know... Honestly, also we do have to accept that that, especially in the opening, it is the snowman narrator. And I'm not sure how much we can trust snowman narrator.
00:30:40
Speaker
But it's Burl Ives. We can trust him. That's true. And he has really spiffy hat. And so, you know Santa Claus is getting into the whole, this is a business...
00:30:52
Speaker
Here's how things run. we have he's a lot He's allowing the reindeer games going on. He's just bullying with extra steps. yeah Oh, and everything he does to Hermes. He just wants to be a dentist. Yeah.
00:31:05
Speaker
I mean, i mean we we started to discuss at our gaming session this weekend. ah Betsy and I were having the conversation about how you don't don't tell us that Hermes is not a coming out allegory.
00:31:20
Speaker
Oh, obvious. It's obvious. But you have... um So... i they you're even that going ex there's all of that There's all of that going on in Rudolph, right?
00:31:33
Speaker
There's like a bunch of bullying, a bunch of like regressions. It's like Rudolph has to hide his nose and then he gets bullied for it. So then you go into the year without a Santa Claus and at that point he's like, you know what? I'm done. We found a workaround to the bad year, but...
00:31:49
Speaker
I'm done. you know no but Look at everything that i have that I have built here and nobody cares. and so I'm done. I'm taking the cancel crisp. so very Spider-Man No More.
00:32:02
Speaker
Yeah, you know if you if you look at everything you not in release order because the origin story came second. The prequel came second just like Star Wars.
00:32:15
Speaker
Then... you know, you you have a character through line, but, you know, maybe Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer is just that case of, you know, you know how every time there was hey revival of the Brady Bunch, one of the kids didn't participate and was
Debating Christmas Special Formats
00:32:40
Speaker
recast. yeah So, you know, you got like,
00:32:43
Speaker
you You go from the Brady Bunch to the Brady Brides, which just focused on two of the kids. So that's an outlier. Then you have the Brady Bunch variety hour where Eve Plum didn't participate.
00:32:56
Speaker
And they they brought in a fake Jan. and And then you have the Bradys where they went one hour dramedy. Yeah. And Maureen McCormick.
00:33:08
Speaker
Didn't want to participate, so they brought in a fake Marsha, but Eve Plum was back. So, oh! And given what we're talking about, does this... So, Nick, is this a Christmas movie or a Christmas special Fairy Brady Christmas?
00:33:28
Speaker
Ooh! Oh, that's... Let me quickly bring it up. Fairy Brady Christmas. It was a TV movie. t Okay, now that's that's blurring the line.
00:33:40
Speaker
you know Ostensibly, it is a TV movie. There was no active Brady Bunch series at the time. Its success is actually what led to the Bradys.
00:33:52
Speaker
Ooh, that one actually is a head turner in terms of like 100 minutes. So that's roughly if in like a feature film. Right. it It was a two two hour TV movie. When you take the commercials out, it's 100 But the same can be said for the Star Wars holidays. Arguably as well. I am counting this as a Christmas special.
00:34:16
Speaker
The fact that it's off on television, like, if i said this if I had to argue what have but a Christmas movie is, it has to have either been on a streaming platform or in theaters. Well, and it is...
00:34:30
Speaker
A basically a special revival episode episode holiday themed of a beloved nostalgic TV series.
00:34:41
Speaker
Which would not exist without being a television series. It has to have come from a previous property to start off to be even a special, but especially a TV. So I am counting A Very Brady Christmas as a Christmas special.
00:34:55
Speaker
Again, like i just as I counted the Black Mirror White Christmas special, which is itself longer, it' just about near feature length and doesn't have commercials. so two would be the It would not be a Christmas movie from Black Mirror. It is a Christmas special. So yes, by both definition definitions, I can agree.
00:35:13
Speaker
And it also carried that pattern through in that Susan Olsen was not involved in A Very Pretty Christmas and they had a fake Cindy. Mm-hmm.
00:35:24
Speaker
And it had my favorite bit about it It actually hung a lantern on the fact that it was a different actress playing playing Cindy.
00:35:38
Speaker
Because when Alice goes to the airport to pick Cindy up as all of the kids are coming home for Christmas... she goes to the wrong young blonde getting off of the plane and starts to take her with her. And Cindy comes up to her like, what, don't you recognize me? That's good.
00:35:58
Speaker
That is a good one. I am an unapologetic Brady Bunch fan. I enjoy it both ironically and unironically and the same for a very Brady Christmas.
00:36:12
Speaker
At any point. I'd say so ah as well. um I don't know. I didn't even grow up with it. It just sort of happened. i sort stumbled upon it on the people.
00:36:23
Speaker
I grew up watching Brady Bunch reruns. And when they did a Very Brady Christmas, I was in high school, but I was still thrilled. My inner child was beside himself with joy.
00:36:40
Speaker
And that's sort of the main thing about what great Christmas specials, they bring back that inner child. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. I mean, here I am in my fifties and every year i watch Rudolph.
00:36:55
Speaker
I watch Santa Claus is coming to town. I watched the year without a Santa Claus. I've already watched Santa Claus is coming to town and the year without a Santa Claus. And we are recording this on December 2nd.
00:37:07
Speaker
It's like... Like, when it starts getting cold, I can't help but i started to think start imagining that I'm Mr. White Christmas. I'm Mr. Snow.
00:37:21
Speaker
After many years of saying I was going to do it, this year I finally added both of those songs onto our Christmas song playlist. How are are they not on there already? Because I didn't have copies of them.
00:37:35
Speaker
It's just that simple. Still, like, those like that i it went once it it got chilly this week, and I even put it on. It's like, his bisto why Christmas, Christmas, Christmas, there's snow.
00:37:48
Speaker
but um but um I mean, literally, Nick, we had to leave for both of them. It's barely even touching, like, below 30 for, like, part of the morning. it was like But even I was like, no, I got a chance of that.
00:38:03
Speaker
We literally had to wait for both of those songs to be over before we could head over to your house on Friday. Because we stumbled across the year without a Santa Claus on TV. right we've We love it, but we got to wait for the Miser Brothers to be done.
00:38:18
Speaker
of if I had known, I'd put it on in my place. Well, it would have been over by the time we got there. But it's on the Plex server. you could We could have put it on there. That's true. Yeah.
00:38:31
Speaker
Let's say thank you very much for sharing your Christmas list. with me with that Christmas list with me. But yeah, A Very Brady Christmas, it it is cheesetacular. It is everything that you would expect from a Brady Bunch Christmas special. um Stephanie hates it. She does not have the affection for the bunch that I do, but you know that that was my childhood being resurrected. i i'd I'd say divorce her, Daryl, for that, but then you'd have to stay at my place, and I'm not going to allow that.
00:39:04
Speaker
and you know Like I mentioned, the success of A Very Brady Christmas led to the short-lived revival dramedy series, The Bradys, which then in turn, when it didn't work, that led to the semi-parody Brady Bunch movies.
00:39:27
Speaker
Yes. Which the first two are a lot of fun. i'll agree. Yeah. The first two are a lot of fun, but, uh, you the, I've honestly never seen the third one.
00:39:38
Speaker
I think I might have, but I've only think, I think only once. Now here's another Christmas special that I don't know that it has aired more than, than twice.
00:39:50
Speaker
The soundtrack is out there and is incredibly popular. And you, you may know it from the soundtrack, But did you ever see John Denver and the Muppets A Christmas Together?
00:40:03
Speaker
Yes. I'm not sure how. I think it might have been a VHS. I am amazed that that is not in rotation anyway. I am astounded that that is not on Disney+. Yes.
00:40:15
Speaker
It was a VHS. I don't know if it was, like, my parents either... recorded it or of like in the official release but I do remember it's a VHS yeah I am astounded that it is not as on Disney Plus like that was also again in the classic variety it had some variety style it was the Muppets obviously Well, yeah, and it was the the height of the Muppet show.
00:40:39
Speaker
Yeah. so Which I think with different was It's different from, say, like, a Muppet's Christmas Carol, because that's a Christmas movie. Right. yeah You know, we've we've forgotten one of, like, the the biggies here, Nick. Oh, you're right.
00:40:55
Speaker
And does that make you a mean one, Mr. Grinch? I guess I am. Your heart better grow three sizes by the end of the episode. I'm pretty sure that it'd give me a heart attack.
00:41:07
Speaker
But that one is just pure artistry. Oh, it's... As an animation fan, it is beautiful. you I mean, it's Chuck Jones.
00:41:18
Speaker
It's Chuck Jones, obviously. But it's like, it's some of his best work. like Nick, how how many times... you know How frequently do you hear...
00:41:30
Speaker
Someone in our gaming group say, i have an idea, an awful idea, a wonderful, awful idea. oh I don't know. Every session.
Praising Iconic Animated Specials
00:41:40
Speaker
I've seen you, I've even seen you do the smile. or is close to the smile. you though No one can do the smile. for his like That smile's iconic.
00:41:51
Speaker
Yeah. yeah that That one bit of animation of that of the Grinch smile is gorgeous animation. And I understand that we are we are talking about the animated 1966 How the Grinch Stole Christmas. But if you will allow me just a small aside into the Ron Howard, Jim Carrey movie version for a moment. Which is a movie.
00:42:22
Speaker
Yes, I understand it's a movie. Allow me this sidebar for a moment. Just to ask you that I know that you are probably aware that eight the young girl who played Cindy Lou, who grew up to be lead singer and front woman of the rock band The Pretty Reckless...
00:42:44
Speaker
Yes. Have you heard their new cover this year of her song from that movie, Where Are You Christmas? I have not.
00:42:56
Speaker
That ah is a banger. It is a banger. It starts off. it starts off bear Bear with me here. It starts off with the audio of her as a child in the movie singing it. And then when the band cuts in, it switches to Tyler Momsen now rocking the ever loving crap out of that song. and I used to not like that song when I was younger. I grew up as like, I like it.
00:43:27
Speaker
And now I'm like very interested to see this like redux. Cause, oh, that sounds hardcore. Oh, it is. I love it. I absolutely love it.
00:43:40
Speaker
Um, and. But also if we're talking songs, you're a mean one, Mr. Grintz. Yes, no. yeah can sure That's, oh, it's pure gold. And i don't know why it took me until my late teens to learn that I knew that Boris Karloff narrated the the special and was the voice of the speaking voice of the Grinch. I don't know why it took me until my late teens, possibly early 20s, to learn that the song is sung by Thoral Ravenscroft, the classic voice of Tony the Tiger.
00:44:23
Speaker
Which, that was, it even ah that was a song, I think I was in my teens when I figured that too. is like But you you can, once you hear it, you can't un-hear it. No, you cannot. No, you cannot. That is a voice that is incredibly smooth.
00:44:39
Speaker
Yep. um You know, we we totally glossed over something too earlier when we were talking about the influence of the Star Wars Holiday Special.
00:44:51
Speaker
And that is the Lego Star Wars Holiday Special. Which is a thing, and actually introduced is technically the first post-Rise of Skywalker story that has canonist elements. Quasi-canon? It elements. Yeah,
00:45:11
Speaker
and And it's just a lot of fun. It's a lot of fun. it it does a it does some wonderful life type shenanigans, time travel list stuff, Lego. But like it's it confirms that Finn is Force sensitive.
00:45:30
Speaker
a A thing that not even of Skywalker could confirm. I'm trying to think if there was any other one before before we get to the 800-pound gorilla in the space of Christmas specials.
00:45:45
Speaker
I'm just trying to remember if there was anything else that I wanted to touch on. Oh, I don't know if you saw it, but there's a really fun animated special cup for the song ah Grandma Got Ran Over by a Reindeer.
00:46:01
Speaker
i always find that very funny. I know that it exists. I have never watched it because I can't stand that song.
00:46:12
Speaker
and I will say that it delves into the absurdity of the entire song, and it's just kind of fun that it like plays it straight. Now, a couple of other specials, and there was actually a new installment in this series this year, which, looking, was 14 years after the last installment. But have you ever seen any of the Prep and Landing Christmas specials?
Discussing Prep and Landing Specials
00:46:42
Speaker
um which Yeah, those those are fun they they were They were on ABC. Yeah, they they just did a new one Sunday night that I had on, but only like half paid attention to it. so Like 14 years is like... Yeah, the the second one, Prep and Landing, Naughty vs. Nice, was 2011. Oh, Daryl, I just felt my entire... I just got hit with a time bomb now. was like, wow.
00:47:12
Speaker
I know. I didn't realize it had been that long. i remember watching that on on the TV when it came out. like I was like sat in front of it, like not with a DVR or anything. like No, I sat down in front of a TV, put on the ABC network, and was like, yeah.
00:47:31
Speaker
Yep, that was 2011. was It was 2011. Yeah. twenty eleven When I was about to turn 18, I 17. But if if there's no others that we can think of, that takes us to the 800-pound gorilla.
Enduring Appeal of A Charlie Brown Christmas
00:47:47
Speaker
Mm-hmm. That takes us to a Charlie Brown Christmas. The... but Like, is there such thing as Some people could argue there's the this and the this.
00:47:58
Speaker
The Christmas special. Yes. It's the hall is it Charlie Brown Christmas. So, this tells you... This probably is a good indication of just how good and how solid this special is. It's like, you don't...
00:48:16
Speaker
Usually for all of these, there's sort of a mix of – these are all sort of what I would call like secular Christmas vessels. And this one is secular as well, but this one also does have the heart of Christmas in it without – Yeah, well, then that's what was what I was about to say is, this tells you how strong and tight this special is.
00:48:41
Speaker
it's the sword It's arguably the shortest of the ones that we've talked about. I make no secret of the fact that I am an atheist. On our Christmas playlist, which has...
00:48:55
Speaker
interspersed with music, clips from different Christmas movies and Christmas specials. I have Linus's, you know, what Christmas is all about speech on the playlist.
00:49:07
Speaker
I am at my heart a Christian, but I am more open and lenient than most in my faith. But this but i will say that as part of my Christmas tradition, on Christmas Eve, I will watch the Charlie Brown Christmas Festival specifically for...
00:49:23
Speaker
lius' beats Now, part of that is also flow because i I have spent far too much time and effort curating and putting everything just so on this playlist over the decades because this playlist started out as a Christmas tape.
00:49:45
Speaker
In college. And then it became two Christmas tapes. And it became Christmas CDs. And now it is a Christmas playlist. But there is flow to it.
00:49:57
Speaker
And so, you know, this this clip, it's the second track on the playlist. the first track is u2's christmas baby please come home and then there then there is the clip of um you know it begins with everyone berating charlie brown because he came back with the bad tree and then charlie brown yeah isn't there anyone who knows what christmas is all about sure charlie brown i can tell you what christmas is all about and then goes into line this is speech
00:50:29
Speaker
And then after Linus's speech, you and that's what Christmas is all about, Charlie Brown. I go into Sting's Gabriel's message. Oh, that's that's a good transition. And part of this is back in the...
00:50:45
Speaker
Late 80s, early 90s, when I first put this Christmas tape together, i had a limited pool of Christmas songs that I was pulling from, and I had limited space. A lot of this tape was coming off of the first two volumes of A Very Special Christmas and a Billboard Greatest Christmas Hits Ever thing.
00:51:09
Speaker
There is also another bit from A Charlie Brown Christmas that is... on there that transitions into a song. You know, Sally's letter to Santa Claus? Yeah.
00:51:20
Speaker
All I want is what I have coming to me. All I want is my fair share goes into Eartha Kitts' Santa Baby. Oh, that's good.
00:51:31
Speaker
And Eartha Kitts, that's, yeah, that's the definitive. Yep. Yep. So, you know, I, there's so in that, let's see, how, how long is this thing anyway?
00:51:43
Speaker
A Charlie Brown Christmas is 25 minutes. it's somes the It truly encapsulates like so much about being a child at Christmas. there But you can get so much as an adult and just as much as a child from it. Mm-hmm.
00:52:00
Speaker
There's like... It's hard to explain how something so as simple as it is, it has so much to say. It does. It does. it It's not overt. It's also, in a way, timeless.
00:52:16
Speaker
Oh, it's very timeless. To the point, it could have released it today or 10 years ago, but without changing a thing, and it would still feel the same.
00:52:28
Speaker
And there's not an ounce of fat in that script. Oh, yeah. and that's stuff like it it would it when When it was on television, it would be a clean 30 minutes of like maybe two, three-minute commercials. Yeah, well, I mean, back in 65 when it aired...
00:52:47
Speaker
five minutes of commercials was all there was. over the For some years, they did cut into it more. But then, once people started pushing back on it because they wanted the whole thing with it and it's the Great Pumpkin, Charlie Brown, yeah because they they cut out the whole run on the great pumpkin they cut out the whole running gag rock. a rule of they left it in once when it's a run it when it happens through it it's a's's a Yeah, when it happens three times, it's funny.
00:53:20
Speaker
When it happens just once, it's sad. And so what abc so what ABC started doing when they still had the rights is they wouldn't cut anything out, which would have it running longer than 30 minutes. So they would include other more...
00:53:40
Speaker
recent Christmas-related Charlie Brown shorts after a Charlie Brown Christmas to fill out an hour. But yeah, it's like like, I don't think it's at all a nostalgia goggle thing. It's a part of my watching every year. well and ah a lot has been said over the years. We're not making any... We're not breaking new ground, but it's like... We're we're not breaking new ground to say that In all of the Charlie Brown specials, casting actual children as the characters does does a wonders. Yes, it adds something to it. But it's like also, but it's like as you said, the scripting is tight, the story is concise. Yeah, and there there are no choices that are horrible. Every pause is deliberate.
00:54:36
Speaker
Every, every, there's, there's long pauses of silence. Well, and, and there's, there's things like in, um, happy Thanksgiving, Charlie Brown.
00:54:48
Speaker
There, there are things that, you know, if you stop for even half a second to think about it, you're like, Wow. you know just like santa claus was a dick in rudolph snoopy's kind of a dick and happy thanksgiving charlie brown because he knows that charlie brown is in this bad spot and is helping him cook thanksgiving dinner for his friends who have invited themselves over And so he makes toast and popcorn and pretzel sticks and jelly beans. And as soon as the kids all leave to go to Charlie Brown's grandmother's house, he pulls out this feast, this Thanksgiving feast for just him and Woodstock. There's nothing like that in a Charlie Brown Christmas.
00:55:30
Speaker
It's all about this, like, what makes, ah yeah, it just it's really good. It's all what Christmas is all about. And again, regardless of what do you feel about what hollers, you can't help but like get a good feeling after it.
00:55:46
Speaker
It sees for all the gloss and the glamour and all the presents and all the stuff, like, gets to the heart of it. It's really strong. Yep. And just icing on the cake. Vince Guaraldi's soundtrack to it.
00:55:59
Speaker
Oh, yeah it'll be it'll be in your ears for for weeks in the best way. Just a jazz trio. ah who Who had the idea to put a a jazz trio doing the music for this kid's cartoon? For like for a Christmas special thing. Yeah.
00:56:18
Speaker
But it works. It just works. on On that Christmas playlist is the instrumental O. Tannenbaum from a Charlie Brown Christmas.
00:56:30
Speaker
Again, an unusual version of O. Tannenbaum, but still solid. ten And also vocal... the vocal because I don't know if you have the soundtrack or not.
00:56:42
Speaker
the soundtrack has for you The soundtrack has both an instrumental version and the vocal version that we hear in the special of Christmastime is Here. and And I have the vocal version on the playlist. no one with the kid The one with the kids singing Christmastime Here. The soundtrack is amazing.
00:57:10
Speaker
And you know there there are non-holiday pieces that have become intertwined. Synonymous with the peanut specials like Linus and Lucy.
00:57:21
Speaker
Oh, yeah, that's great. Linus and Lucy was introduced in A Charlie Brown Christmas. Mm-hmm.
00:57:30
Speaker
But the the music is just, it's wonderful. It's absolutely wonderful. And so, wonderful time of year to watch it. Yep. Yep, it it absolutely
Audience Engagement and Reflections
00:57:41
Speaker
is. oh yeah when When we were talking about Rudolph, we got so into the Rankin-Bass universe slash multiverse ideas.
00:57:50
Speaker
i just I love the story that um original when it first aired, the the Island of Misfit Toys story was just you dropped. Once they get off the Island of Misfit Toys, you're speed run through the end of the song and that's the end of the special and children wrote to the network they were like narrow distraught they left the the misfit toys behind yeah and so for subsequent airings they filmed the ending that we see now where they go back and they get the misfit toys and you see them being delivered
00:58:31
Speaker
And it's like, because I saw an original VHS tape of it, and I remember being upset about that. And then I watched a revamped version of it on TV. was like, that's do oh, this is good. They got the toys off the island. Because that was sad. That was really sad. Now, a couple of questions about the Misfit toys here, Nick.
00:58:53
Speaker
Question number one, how is King Roo... How is King Moonracer a misfit toy? I would have died for that toy. Oh, yeah. A big winged lion?
00:59:05
Speaker
Yes, please, give me. i thought it was manticore, but either way, it's cool. It is a mythological monster thing. That was cool. And what makes a spotted plush elephant a misfit?
00:59:18
Speaker
that I would have had that too. That's pretty standard for plush children. yeah my Me and my sister probably would have fought over who had custody of the spotted elephant. And she would have won.
00:59:30
Speaker
She would have won. Because she would have pounded you into dust. This is true, but but we would... but Yeah, that's not a misfit tool. do The fact that its only flaw is at least the pop gun that doesn't go pop.
00:59:43
Speaker
Well, and then there's there's also the the water pistol that squirts jelly. yeah Well, that's just user error. It's like, well, someone used you wrong.
00:59:54
Speaker
Someone just filled you with jelly instead of water. Which is more on the child's problems. Like, what's their problem? But, you know, I do enjoy going going back to going back to glee on their first Christmas episode, they did a cover of, um, the most wonderful day of the year, the song from Rudolph.
01:00:24
Speaker
Yeah. That, that has the misfit toys in it. And there's two versions of that song. There's the version that's in the episode and the version that is on the first Glee Christmas album and different actors,
01:00:41
Speaker
you know Different performers from the show have different lines at parts in the two different versions. ah And let me tell you, somebody was being a little on the nose with the album version of that when they gave Chris Colfer's Kurt the line, wake up, it's time to come out.
01:01:04
Speaker
Oh. ah I see what they did there. Oh, yeah. Yeah, they were being pretty, pretty unsubtle there.
01:01:16
Speaker
Or, wake up, don't you know that it's time to come out? Yeah, that's the line. Yeah, it's Chris Colfer on the album. Mm-hmm. and ah And at the time, you when when he sings, especially in the first two, three seasons of Glee, it's at a pretty high register, too. and Kurt cururt was both groundbreaking and a stereotype at the same time, somehow.
01:01:39
Speaker
It's... i think I think Betsy's mentioned that before in a conversation we've had. But, yeah, I just... but the We want to thank everyone so far for, you know, just hanging with us as we basically have just rambled and and been nostalgia demons about Christmas specials because, well, it's just that time a year.
01:02:02
Speaker
couldn't even, like... He couldn't even ask us to, like, really critique them as, like... we were just sort of just saying like, we like them. And I think you we you'll like them. It's like, we kind of felt like kids just to be like, you should watch it.
01:02:15
Speaker
It's really fun. Yeah. Yeah. They're, they're a whole lot of fun. And there's a ton of them. Like, and yeah, you can see them as kind of cynical in a way, but it's like, Don't. It's like, that's not the point. It's like, give me the whimsy.
01:02:30
Speaker
You know, i when when my Christmas tapes transitioned to Christmas CDs, and I had them structured originally, it it started off with two discs.
01:02:42
Speaker
But because disc two was structured, and it still kind of is, if you look at them in their separate breakdowns like that, structured to be a finale for the whole thing.
01:02:56
Speaker
So rather than labeling it disc two, I labeled it the final disc. And so as i expanded and added more music, I added a disc two and a disc three and was in progress on stocking a disc for when it became a playlist instead of, of discs.
01:03:24
Speaker
But I gave each of them a subtitle and the final disc, even though the subtitle was more general pop music than Christmas music or holiday reference or anything like that.
01:03:41
Speaker
Disc, the final disc along with its title had, you know, like a little, like cartoony caricature of Santa Claus with the subtitle. Don't stop believing.
01:03:52
Speaker
oh that's. and I have made you speechless. You have. ah I have rendered you speechless. So that probably means we've we've hit our end point. A good point to end it where you know instead of ending with just warm fuzzies, I got to you know do some housekeeping here.
01:04:16
Speaker
i i've got I've got to do some housekeeping here too. And have to say, you be sure to follow us on socials, Facebook, Instagram, Threads, Blue Sky, and Twitter, X, whatever it's being called this week. We K-N-T. casual nerdity, all one word on all of those platforms. ah You can help the podcast get a larger reach by giving us a hopefully good review on your podcast platform of choice. Or if you're listening through YouTube, do all those YouTube cliches, like subscribe notifications, all of that stuff. We want to comment about your favorite, favorite holiday specials. ah And how does it make you feel?
01:05:00
Speaker
we we want to um We'd love to hear that. I'm sure others would too. We would. And we also just want all of those algorithms, algorithms chugging along, helping us get the podcast in front of more people.
Closing and Audience Encouragement
01:05:14
Speaker
But but i also want to I think we also want to say a thank you to all of you for being with us either just today, just a few weeks ago, or with us for the long haul.
01:05:26
Speaker
Yep, we appreciate every single one of you. And we hope that that we have you back with us again next time. And although we have not finalized what that is, i have an idea, Nick, and I will talk to you off air about it. Okay.
01:05:50
Speaker
But thank you once again for listening to us. And and whether you hear us again later on this is this year or in the next year, we still wish you a happy holidays.
01:06:02
Speaker
Yes, indeed. Happy holidays and thanks for listening. We'll catch you next time. Bye.
01:06:11
Speaker
This has been Casual Nerdity. We hope you've enjoyed your time with us and look forward to having you back.