Transcript
Speaker: Thanks for tuning in to Loser Kid Pinball Podcast.
Speaker: We are on episode 113.
Speaker: I am Josh Roop.
Speaker: With me, my co-captain.
Speaker: Scott Larson.
Speaker: And Scott, it's been an amazing week, hasn't it?
Speaker: It's okay.
Speaker: It's been ups and downs.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I'll take that.
Speaker: I'll say that.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: There's been a new release.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: If you haven't heard, maybe you're under a rock, but Venom has now released and we're going to talk all about tonight.
Speaker: But if you want to order that Venom, where are you going to buy it from, Scott?
Speaker: Contact Zach and Nicole Minnie.
Speaker: And they sold out of their LEs, but they were able to get some more.
Speaker: So if you're interested in an LE, last I checked, they seem to be able to finagle a few.
Speaker: So if you are looking to pick up that new Venom and we're going to talk about Venom today.
Speaker: I'm, I'm a lot more interested than I was at the beginning.
Speaker: I guess I'll put it that way.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: So definitely contact Zach and Nicole at flipping out pinball.
Speaker: Definitely.
Speaker: If you want to get that venom, get ahold of them.
Speaker: They've got other games as well.
Speaker: They got plenty in stock.
Speaker: If you're ever curious to what they have, we highly recommend going on their Facebook page, flipping out pinball.
Speaker: And they have a whole list there of games that they have in inventory, willing and ready to ship to you.
Speaker: So, yeah,
Speaker: Hit them up.
Speaker: You know you want to.
Speaker: Absolutely.
Speaker: Well, Scott, you kind of alluded to it during our little, us talking about flipping out.
Speaker: What have you thought of Venom so far?
Speaker: Okay, well...
Speaker: Do we start at the beginning with the teaser?
Speaker: I'm going to start.
Speaker: Yeah, let's start with the teaser.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So go ahead and give me your thoughts on the teaser.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So first off, I wasn't really super excited for Venom.
Speaker: I think we've kind of already... Like, I was in the same boat as Godzilla, right?
Speaker: Like, it's just... I know what it is.
Speaker: It's a sea theme.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It is.
Speaker: Like, I would say that when the movie came out, it probably bumped it up to a B theme.
Speaker: The Tom Hardy movie?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I thought, I thought it was fine.
Speaker: It was a, it was a fun one.
Speaker: I, I enjoyed the movie, the, but it was still, it, it was not mandatory viewing.
Speaker: If you're into superhero movies.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: But this is not the Tom Hardy movie, but I don't think this would have been made without the Tom Hardy movie.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: I still think the theme's a little like not,
Speaker: I don't think it draws as many people at this point.
Speaker: And, you know, going back to the teaser, the art looks fantastic.
Speaker: Like zombie Yeti,
Speaker: I don't think he's had a bad art package yet.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: No.
Speaker: And he's really brought it with this one.
Speaker: I know a lot of complaints is he uses a lot of reds.
Speaker: Red.
Speaker: But a carnage is red.
Speaker: So.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But it was nice because it seemed like he leaned heavily on the blacks and blues with red to, you know, obviously highlight carnage.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And who cares?
Speaker: I like red.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: My hat's red.
Speaker: So we're good.
Speaker: It doesn't bother me one bit.
Speaker: I think overall, I still was kind of like, well, now I'm getting a little intrigued, right?
Speaker: Vocals sound good.
Speaker: It all sounded really well in the teaser trailer.
Speaker: And so what shocked me is how long this game has been teased.
Speaker: Not even teased.
Speaker: Well, rumored.
Speaker: Rumored.
Speaker: It's only been rumored for years.
Speaker: Years.
Speaker: And so it kind of shocked me that nothing had really leaked.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: pushing it back another year and whatnot.
Speaker: And even what took its place.
Speaker: Let's talk about that.
Speaker: What took its place was bond.
Speaker: I think.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, and Bond, you know, I'm hearing, I do know someone that got a Bond and they're actually really enjoying it.
Speaker: It's one of their favorite games in their collection right now because of the new code update that's really fleshed out the game.
Speaker: And I predicted that.
Speaker: I predicted if you're a Bond fan, if you're willing to wait it out, then they would be able to
Speaker: to fill it out because it, the layout I think is good.
Speaker: I is still on my favorite layout.
Speaker: I, I'm still not a huge fan of the left side with the, with the scoop.
Speaker: Cause it, when I'm playing it, it gets into that left scoop all the time and then it shoots out and it's out of control.
Speaker: So I, I, you know, the layout's okay, but with the new rules on board, it actually is a fun game.
Speaker: Like my friend picked up an L E.
Speaker: And we had a great time playing it the other day.
Speaker: Well, good.
Speaker: I think, I want to tie this back to Venom.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: No, but I'm curious.
Speaker: Why do you think that it was pushed for a year?
Speaker: I really don't know speculating by the way.
Speaker: No one has any idea, but I, it was obvious that they were planning on releasing it last year because they had a booth with Todd McFarlane.
Speaker: And by the way, I, I will correct myself because I, I thought that Todd McFarlane was a Spider-Man artist who ended up becoming very famous.
Speaker: Apparently he did co like co-create Venom.
Speaker: So that's that's why Todd was was there last year.
Speaker: I'm assuming to anticipate the release.
Speaker: And the only thing I can possibly think of like Ozzy Osbourne being there is because there's an Osbourne in the character, I guess.
Speaker: Well, until VH1 does a behind the pinball machine, right?
Speaker: Yeah, I guess we'll never know until.
Speaker: We don't get the stories out of the guys except for like the old Bally Williams stuff we get information on because.
Speaker: Because it's 30 years old.
Speaker: Yeah, and the company doesn't exist anymore.
Speaker: So what's it going to hurt it to release that information?
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Maybe this is all speculation.
Speaker: Maybe originally it did have Todd McFarland and Ozzy Osbourne in the game, but they had to revamp because of.
Speaker: licensing issues or something like that.
Speaker: It is kind of bizarre.
Speaker: And the other funny part to it.
Speaker: So let's, let's move past the teaser.
Speaker: And finally, Monday stern puts out like a full week long schedule, right?
Speaker: And, uh, you know, releases on Tuesday.
Speaker: It finally releases, uh,
Speaker: And there's no Ozzy Osbourne.
Speaker: As far as I can tell, I don't know if Todd's had any involvement in the game.
Speaker: But the interesting part about this is when they released it, at least if you listen to the Stern Insider podcast, they talked about it was at like.72.
Speaker: And that's releasing now, which I thought was very strange.
Speaker: Because if we pushed it another year out,
Speaker: And it was, we don't know how ready it was for Comic-Con.
Speaker: Shouldn't it be 1.72?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that's what we've kind of like been talking about.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But after looking at Dwight's on the game and he's,
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: How many pages is the PDF for the rule sheet?
Speaker: You remember?
Speaker: Over 30?
Speaker: Yeah, it's like 31 pages of rules.
Speaker: So I'm like, okay, well, I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt because maybe they spent that time just solely putting in rules to this game.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know?
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: What was your first thoughts when you saw that the trailer leaked like an hour early?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I guess it wasn't the trailer.
Speaker: Sorry.
Speaker: On Monday,
Speaker: They had accidentally put it into a playlist under YouTube as it wasn't listed.
Speaker: But if you knew the link, like, yeah, I didn't see it.
Speaker: You saw it because you sent it to me.
Speaker: And then when I clicked on it, they had already made it a private link.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I didn't see it until it finally became public.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: And that the artwork still look great to me.
Speaker: Like it just, it was reaffirming that like, it's still going to look great.
Speaker: What were your initial thoughts when finally Tuesday hit and 10 o'clock hit and they released the game trailer?
Speaker: You know what?
Speaker: Not good.
Speaker: To be blunt.
Speaker: I looked at the game and I eyeballed it and I said this is
Speaker: it looks like almost everything is in the back third of the game.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: It felt very, very open.
Speaker: Um, and my initial thoughts were it could be a P three game.
Speaker: I do remember you saying that.
Speaker: Yeah, because it like, it looks like something that you could drop into a, uh, a generic play field that has flippers on it.
Speaker: And, uh,
Speaker: then they're starting to do that on P3 where they're able to bring things down the side.
Speaker: So that was my initial thought and I was confused, I guess.
Speaker: What about you?
Speaker: I was confused.
Speaker: It was what a minute long trailer.
Speaker: I don't know if it was that long, a little bit over.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And by the end of it, I was just, I was so confused.
Speaker: Like, it's funny.
Speaker: Cause I went and posted on our Facebook.
Speaker: I shared the stern stuff and I put like, they reuse the Ferris wheel mech from comment.
Speaker: Cause that's what that, that's what that ran like scoop.
Speaker: And then the way it moves and everything and the way that they presented it in that first trailer,
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: At first glance, I was like, yeah, that's what that is.
Speaker: After watching the trailer numerous times, it's like, oh, that's not exactly what that is.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I still... It wasn't until Jack Danger and Brian Eddy were playing it.
Speaker: Did the stream last night.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: And explaining it and watching it actually... Like, the game literally evolve as you're watching it.
Speaker: I was like, oh, this is like a change... Like, the full game is a change state game.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And so...
Speaker: I guess I think the problem I've had with all of this so far is I just don't feel like this has been communicated properly.
Speaker: Like they, they have not controlled their own message.
Speaker: Correct.
Speaker: And it's sad, which is weird.
Speaker: Cause I feel like it's the same, like they did with bond as well.
Speaker: Like the, the message was not clear on that one as well.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so with venom, I just, I wasn't super excited until I,
Speaker: I listened to the Stern Insider podcast and it was explained.
Speaker: This whole game is based off of experience points.
Speaker: This is almost like a video game.
Speaker: This is a video game.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it's set up like an RPG, an online RPG.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You're leveling up.
Speaker: There's four characters that you can play as.
Speaker: You can level up each character.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Or maybe it's just yourself.
Speaker: This is all tied to your Insider Connected.
Speaker: So say you're playing this on a location.
Speaker: it goes with you when you leave.
Speaker: And then once you actually get to a certain part in the game, you can unlock Hulk, Captain America and Wolverine and have those unlocked for the rest of the game.
Speaker: Once you, I'm sorry, keep going.
Speaker: No, you're good.
Speaker: Like it just, it boggles my mind.
Speaker: Like I'm really impressed with what Dwight has come up with this.
Speaker: Like right system.
Speaker: It's, it's very unique.
Speaker: Well, I guess Ray day and Dwight, they're both mean, um,
Speaker: I just, they should be pushing that.
Speaker: I don't understand why they're not pushing that.
Speaker: Can I get into some concerns?
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Go for it.
Speaker: The concern I have is along the lines of, we have always said, we want something different.
Speaker: And Marty puts it as we want something different, but not that.
Speaker: And so that's typically our go-to response when something different comes out.
Speaker: So does that mean, is this going to, is this going to be something that carries to the pinball audience?
Speaker: Because it is, it is different.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's a, this is not a system that we're used to in pinball.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Is that, and also what happens if you have a location that does not,
Speaker: activate the insider connected.
Speaker: True.
Speaker: So you're going to have, you're going to have some issues with that.
Speaker: And I would say the majority, you're definitely catering to a crowd that's thirties and twenties.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Because they're used to, there's going to be a lot more crossover in that demographic with video games than in the forties, fifties and sixties.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: And I, I,
Speaker: I haven't played those type of games in 15 years.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So that's, that's a different demographic.
Speaker: If that's what they're going for, then this could be a reach.
Speaker: Another question is, was that plant?
Speaker: What, what was what plan?
Speaker: What was it planned to say, Hey, we are going to design a game that has a lot more in common with video games and online video games.
Speaker: And if that was a planned strategic choice, which I hope it, I hope it was, I think it should be.
Speaker: I think it is.
Speaker: Why, why did they not push it at all?
Speaker: We basically had to figure that out on our own.
Speaker: Why, while watching the, the reveal stream.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, it helped.
Speaker: It helped to, you know, it helps that we sat there and we talked to Travis Murie and Joel and birth and Tom and Travis gets paid to watch this stuff over and over.
Speaker: Well, he's also a top player and so is Tom.
Speaker: And so they're going to dissect things very quickly.
Speaker: But Travis is getting paid to dissect, right?
Speaker: Yes, that's true.
Speaker: Up front.
Speaker: And so like he's telling us this as we're, because I'm not going to lie.
Speaker: If I wasn't friends with Travis at this point, I don't know if I'd still understand half of this stuff.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so they really should be pushing like save your progress and like level up your game.
Speaker: And cause they came out, they came straight out and was like, this isn't a mode based game, but it's got modes in it.
Speaker: So it's like, so it doesn't revolve around the modes.
Speaker: It's an activation game.
Speaker: You can,
Speaker: You can activate a mode based on experience levels.
Speaker: So is that frustrating though to you?
Speaker: Like, is that frustrating that like you don't get everything up front when you, cause pinball has always been like, everything's available.
Speaker: So long as your skill level is able to activate it where this is like, you doesn't, it, the better, the longer you play, the easier the game can get.
Speaker: However, he did say that if you're a, they do have a speed run option in this.
Speaker: And so there is a way of logging in.
Speaker: And, you know, if you have the skill set of Raymond Davidson, I'm pretty sure you could get to level 50 in one game.
Speaker: Yeah, I agree.
Speaker: So that, so that's not prohibitive, but the question I have also is, is that advantageous?
Speaker: that you are always crawling toward a higher level that does it top out at like 50?
Speaker: Does it top out at 99?
Speaker: I think they said 50.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So you top out at 50.
Speaker: Are there people who are going to like video games?
Speaker: A lot of, a lot of players of video games will say I'd beat the game.
Speaker: And so they sell it and they, they never play it again.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, and it's not going to happen with something like this.
Speaker: Well, that's, what's crazy too.
Speaker: Like,
Speaker: This is definitely like new territory.
Speaker: I don't know why they're not pushing this.
Speaker: This is brand new territory in pinball.
Speaker: This has never been done before.
Speaker: And like you said, let's say you do beat the game.
Speaker: Let's say you own Venom, you beat the game, you have it all saved to your account, and granted, I think you can reset it.
Speaker: They did talk about you can reset your levels and stuff like that.
Speaker: But let's say you sell the game and you keep it saved through your phone and whatnot.
Speaker: I mean, do you have the urge to buy it back?
Speaker: And if not, you could just go out on location and find it and just...
Speaker: Boom, there's your progress.
Speaker: There's so much unknowns to this.
Speaker: Maybe we're just super, we're so overthinking what's going on right now.
Speaker: Okay, but we've all bought games.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Right?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so we're not naive to pinball.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: We're used to what a game is.
Speaker: So this is a huge risk in that they have completely deviated from what their, their historic titles are.
Speaker: Now they have more technology.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: So they, so insider connected has definitely made this possible.
Speaker: And I, I,
Speaker: I applaud them for trying something.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: No, I agree.
Speaker: Will it be successful?
Speaker: That's yet to be determined.
Speaker: However, I would, I would argue that the response has been so far either.
Speaker: No, it's been lukewarm at best or, or, um,
Speaker: still fact finding, just questioning, like trying to get more information about it.
Speaker: But I don't know too many people that are jumping on by now.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: Well, that's what concerns me as well.
Speaker: Like why this game?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Let's talk about layout.
Speaker: It's a fan layout.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, it's basically the ultimate fan layout.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Because the first two thirds really are an open canvas.
Speaker: It is way open.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But the interesting part is because of those locks, pretty much holding the balls at half filled, it becomes ridiculously fast to play this game.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So that's actually what I was going to bring up.
Speaker: I was going to bring up, you know how Black Knight, one of the complaints was that
Speaker: is that the shots were about halfway up the field.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It was basically like a mini game.
Speaker: And so it was brutal from the start.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: And that you, you were firing it and it was coming back at you so fast.
Speaker: Well, this game,
Speaker: this is kind of a hybrid where the balls are coming back because you hit a ramp and it kicks a ball out a lot faster than you think it's going to.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so you're getting the balls back, but you're not getting as much ricochet.
Speaker: I wonder if they considered that because, because why else would you design these, these,
Speaker: these dispensers on the right and left and the right is even lower on the play field.
Speaker: The right looks like it's about 66% down on the play field.
Speaker: The left looks about 50% down.
Speaker: And I don't know if that's because like they took into consideration it is a family out.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so family outs are typically pandas like super easy, which they're not wrong.
Speaker: Like, right.
Speaker: Like,
Speaker: But well, there's only seven shots really.
Speaker: There's one, two.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So I'm counting.
Speaker: There's one, two, three on the left.
Speaker: There's the ramp up the middle and then you have, um, so that's four, then five, six, seven, eight.
Speaker: I guess there's eight targeted shots.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So you see, well, I guess there's nine if you want to count the bell tower, the bell tower.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But still, overall, the game, watching it last night, it moved really fast.
Speaker: It did.
Speaker: Maybe that's great that the safe progression, maybe that was a very knowledgeable thing because they're like, well, if this plays too long, then the safe progression system is not really going to be worth much then.
Speaker: If you can do it all on the first run and you're a novice, there's a problem.
Speaker: Okay, so let's talk about the other issue.
Speaker: Is that, not issue.
Speaker: The complete unknown on how people will receive this is that depending on which host you choose, it reconfigures the game, at least on the premium and LE one.
Speaker: Which is insanely cool to me.
Speaker: It's really cool because you have different shots.
Speaker: There's no other game they've done this on.
Speaker: Well, okay.
Speaker: Now there are games that we're used to having diverters on.
Speaker: Diverters?
Speaker: Well, and okay, to be fair, that's kind of what this is.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's basically a diverter that changes from ball to ball.
Speaker: true but but like i guess godzilla is the only other one i can think of like in godzilla obviously if you hit the building enough it drops down and it changes the path of the balls right going through the ramps which was diverters yeah correct but like this is from the get-go is technically like four i want to say four different different games yeah but it's four different layouts it is because the the shots are the same but the balls come back differently
Speaker: Yeah, and really the only thing that stays the same is the orbits, I want to say.
Speaker: Because most of the ramps and even the middle shots and everything all change to some extent.
Speaker: And it's, I don't know, it's insanely cool.
Speaker: Like, I don't get why there's a lukewarm reception to this game.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, based off of your true hardcore pinball fan, like throwaway theme, because obviously Godzilla, like I said, Godzilla was a C theme.
Speaker: C theme.
Speaker: I would I would put Venom above Godzilla.
Speaker: Oh, yes, I would.
Speaker: I don't.
Speaker: Are we just I mean, look at movie theaters.
Speaker: I guess superhero movies are not doing great right now.
Speaker: Is it because of that?
Speaker: Is there just a whirlwind of stuff?
Speaker: Because I know that people do complain about Dwight code.
Speaker: I know people either love it or hate it, but the problem is too is sometimes you have to wait.
Speaker: It takes a long time.
Speaker: That's my biggest concern with Dwight is that he is so passionate about it.
Speaker: that it can take him a long time to really flesh out a code set.
Speaker: And even then he has radically changed many code sets.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: I mean, Game of Thrones went through that.
Speaker: Ghostbusters.
Speaker: Ghostbusters went through that.
Speaker: And, you know, it's...
Speaker: I don't feel like Ninja Turtles did, but the Ninja Turtles did take a balancing of the score as well.
Speaker: It did, yeah.
Speaker: And you can already tell that with Venom.
Speaker: Like, when we watched last night, what was it?
Speaker: It was like Mayhem multiball.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: If you start off as Eddie Brock, and I think maybe he even was more leveled up.
Speaker: Once you got a Mayhem multiball, it just destroyed the game.
Speaker: Like, $2 billion on one ball, and the next closest score was $33 million.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And he was telling us like, oh, there's like a backdoor to get into that.
Speaker: And it gives you like two X. And he was talking about the multipliers and everything.
Speaker: It's like,
Speaker: Oh, great.
Speaker: Like, so I can get my bot handed to me.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's yeah.
Speaker: That, that, that was unfortunate.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: To see, because you don't want to, if you're going into a, if you're playing for points, you don't want to be beat because someone knows, knows an exploit that makes a 10 times multiplier happen.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: I really hope,
Speaker: I love Dwight, and I really think that his code, his rules are very unique from what everyone else is doing.
Speaker: I hope he's doing the rule set and Raymond's doing the coding.
Speaker: Because the issue I had with Ninja Turtles is there was a lot of glitches, and I don't know if that was specifically for Dwight or whatnot, but I remember I'd get into a multiball and the whole game would shut down if you did something and reset itself.
Speaker: And I don't have that issue with any of my other games behind me.
Speaker: I could be, I could be miss mistaken, but I would bet that the, the lead coders are more of the rule set designers and they have other people who are doing the code, like writing the physical code.
Speaker: Cause, cause there, there's no need for, there's, you know, there's no need for the master architect.
Speaker: And even,
Speaker: Even Lyman wasn't... When they were talking with Josh Sharp and they were talking about the Cactus Canyon continued code, it was Lyman fleshing out all the rules.
Speaker: Yeah, he was coming up with the concepts.
Speaker: He was coming up with the concepts.
Speaker: And that's pretty much what...
Speaker: what I'm assuming Dwight's doing.
Speaker: I could be completely wrong.
Speaker: So we've touched on this a little bit.
Speaker: We've been so scattered brain, but it's hard because there's so much information on this one.
Speaker: We both agreed there has been a lukewarm reception.
Speaker: If you haven't heard a lot of distributors, you've either turned down allotment or the allotment that they do have isn't moving as quickly as they thought.
Speaker: Why do you think there's such a lukewarm reception to this game?
Speaker: I would attribute it to two things.
Speaker: One, the game is different.
Speaker: It is not your typical game.
Speaker: No, it's not.
Speaker: So there's this, I don't know what this is.
Speaker: And that's what people are saying.
Speaker: I'm not sure what this is.
Speaker: And so they're evaluating it based on historical games.
Speaker: So they're looking at this game and saying, huh, well, basically like you and I did.
Speaker: Well, it looks like there's eight shots in a fan layout.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Pretty art.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But when you look at it and they actually have all these state changes that make it reconfigure it, depending on which host you are, it does make it a lot more interesting.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: The question is, is that good?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So people know what they get with other games.
Speaker: People just don't understand what they're getting with this game.
Speaker: And it could be a huge hit.
Speaker: What I'm concerned with is
Speaker: is this could be another Stranger Things thing where we all know Stranger Things wasn't, it was a very lukewarm reception because it was basically a re-theme of Attack from Mars.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But guess what?
Speaker: Attack from Mars is a great game.
Speaker: And so they cut production short.
Speaker: Then people said, hey, wait, this is a great layout and it's a theme I like.
Speaker: And then they didn't have any more.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that's one of the only games that's still commanding high dollar right now.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I'm wondering, I'm concerned that this won't have enough velocity for people to experience it because you at least need people who are willing to take a chance at buying this and letting people play it.
Speaker: I think,
Speaker: I think also what's going to, it's hurting it and it's helping it.
Speaker: And the reason I say this is the production schedule doesn't actually start till September.
Speaker: That's fair.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, so we're at the end of July now.
Speaker: And then August is pretty much going to take most of the time moving into the new factory, like two weeks or whatever.
Speaker: And then they're going to get the pros on the line at the end of August and then premiums and LEs in September.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But at the end of October, we also have, yeah,
Speaker: another pinball expo.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So, and people can play it there.
Speaker: And that, that is the telltale sign of a game.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Is if people want to play it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Add, add an expo and people who know what they're doing.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: I think people are going to get their hands on this expo and realize like, this is really good.
Speaker: Like the concepts are here.
Speaker: It feels great.
Speaker: Um, because family outs, I don't know many family outs where it's like, I shoot it and it's,
Speaker: It doesn't feel great.
Speaker: The shots could feel good, but I guess the first one that comes to mind is Stearns, Indiana Jones.
Speaker: It's a fan layout, and it shoots great, but the problem is it shoots too great.
Speaker: It's boring.
Speaker: It's a boring game.
Speaker: It becomes boring.
Speaker: Where this is so fast, I think that's going to eliminate that.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: It's so mind-boggling to me because there are some really cool concepts in this game.
Speaker: I just...
Speaker: I don't want to like pin the fault on anyone.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Like, but I'm just trying to like, well, I'm trying to understand because they don't make these decisions in a bubble.
Speaker: Correct.
Speaker: I'm also slightly concerned that the pro version, I it's a static layout.
Speaker: Yes, it is.
Speaker: So it's kind of premium or nothing.
Speaker: Well, premium Ellie or nothing at this point.
Speaker: Huh?
Speaker: Well, if you want all the features, if you're like, Hey, I just want a game, but the,
Speaker: I would say that the pro version of this looks a lot, you know, similar to like a, I don't want to insult it, but like a home pin version.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: There's there, there, there is no Mac.
Speaker: There's no, um, wow.
Speaker: The doppelganger is gone.
Speaker: And, um,
Speaker: You mean like a home edition of a Stern, right?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
Speaker: So you said home pin, I thought.
Speaker: Oh, I'm sorry.
Speaker: Sorry.
Speaker: I'm talking a home version of a pin.
Speaker: So a home use only or whatever.
Speaker: Yeah, I get you.
Speaker: I just did.
Speaker: Yeah, the pin series is what I mean.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, but this one, obviously the mech that changes, it's the fourth shot over from the left.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: That's the big mech in the game.
Speaker: So the two main things I see different is that mech and the doppelganger.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And you're not getting that on the pro.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: However, sometimes people like the pro version better.
Speaker: I remember Game of Thrones.
Speaker: That wasn't that deep of a layout, but a lot of people preferred the fan layout without the upper play field.
Speaker: That's true as well.
Speaker: you brought up the doppelganger i gotta we watched the video last night as they say in ray and the last dragon that bug's got a booty oh my goodness what is up with the sculptor and that doppelganger it's it's certainly something something someone someone gave that doppelganger some cake
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker: Yeah, it looks interesting, yeah.
Speaker: I was like, what the heck?
Speaker: And they would pause the screen on the booty.
Speaker: On the doppelganger, yeah.
Speaker: We won't tell you about the XP system, but you should check out this booty on the doppelganger.
Speaker: Check out the sculpt.
Speaker: I'm sorry.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Uh...
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: I agree with you.
Speaker: I think the chain state is one of the... I don't know.
Speaker: I can't fathom buying the Pro at this point because of that.
Speaker: If you're going to choose one, pay the extra $2,000 to $3,000, get the premium.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's my take.
Speaker: Unless you want a more economical...
Speaker: game that you put in your house.
Speaker: And by saying more economical, you know, still the, still the price of a used car.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So overall,
Speaker: What are your thoughts on, on Venom?
Speaker: My thoughts are, I hope there is enough time that people are able to get to play it.
Speaker: And I hope there's enough people who are willing to take a risk on a game that is unknown so they can try it out.
Speaker: And because that's the only way this game is going to succeed is by word of mouth.
Speaker: It's, it's the same thing as a movie.
Speaker: Sometimes movies, they come a lot of times movies come out the big weekend.
Speaker: And then the second weekend, there's a huge drop off.
Speaker: There's like a 60% drop off and then it goes even lower and then goes even lower.
Speaker: So they make their money in the first two weeks on movies that people go see it.
Speaker: And it may be a lower budget movie.
Speaker: and people tell their friends, Hey, this was really good.
Speaker: You should check it out.
Speaker: And so it has a lot more of a slow burn.
Speaker: That is the only way this is going to work because the first weekend out of the gate, it's not doing well.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: And I think this definitely, I agree with you.
Speaker: This is going to have to be a slow burn on this one.
Speaker: It's,
Speaker: I guess just time will tell.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And I have to, for me, if I'm selling a game, if I'm buying a game, I have to sell a game because I am out of space.
Speaker: So many people are in that position.
Speaker: So when you're taking a risk, you're selling a game that you don't, that you know what you're getting.
Speaker: And then you're committing to buying a very expensive game that you don't know.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: There's also,
Speaker: there's a very real chance that when these are available, there is going to be announced another game.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And L one's up.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's, that's the hard part too.
Speaker: Like that's the hard part.
Speaker: That space behind me, Foo Fighters, is going there on Monday.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: It's coming in.
Speaker: That's the thing.
Speaker: That's where we're at production-wise is I usually get in on the second run, and by the time the second run rolls around, you're running into the next game that they're releasing.
Speaker: I mean, I'm literally the same week.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I'm within seven days of the release.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: I think it's just really weird.
Speaker: That's the challenge.
Speaker: I think I agree with you on it's harder to move games right now as well.
Speaker: It is.
Speaker: I don't know what's going on in your neck of the woods, but watching the Utah market, games, Sterns that are six months old are selling for six grand.
Speaker: Like, yeah, it's not.
Speaker: And granted, I guess some of those are more used games that are for like, okay, but they're rentals, but we need to remember though, that that's how it's always been.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So the COVID years, when people were buying games and then selling them later for $500 to $1,000 more than they paid for them, that's not normal.
Speaker: No, it's not.
Speaker: And usually if you buy a game and you play it for a while and then you take a $500 to $1,000 hit, you're saying, well, okay, at least I rented a game for $500.
Speaker: five months, five to 10 months.
Speaker: And okay.
Speaker: I play, I paid a hundred dollars a month for the game.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So that's not a, that's not unreasonable.
Speaker: And that's more likely than, than what it was.
Speaker: So I, I'm not too concerned about that, but it is, it doesn't make people question whether or not they should immediately buy a new game though.
Speaker: Correct.
Speaker: And I agree.
Speaker: And I think it also comes down to that.
Speaker: Like,
Speaker: like you, you don't have much room left in your connect or your collection.
Speaker: So it's like, well, if I do see, you'd say you wanted venom, you would have to essentially start selling now.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And it's not because it's because you've got to have those couple of months to actually move the game.
Speaker: And just, I feel like we were so used to, you could post a game 48 hours later.
Speaker: That's like a long period at that time.
Speaker: It would be sold and you would have it out before the end of the week.
Speaker: Now it's like, I, I would even give it, it used to be, I'd give it two weeks just to be safe.
Speaker: Cause if I knew a game was coming in in two weeks, you know,
Speaker: And now it's like you almost need two months to, to move a game at a decent price.
Speaker: So I just pulled up, I just pulled up Pinside and looked at the, the for sale stuff.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And, and this is the first page.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So you're, you're getting, you know, promoted content, even promoted content, new in box, Godzilla, a premium.
Speaker: 9,699.
Speaker: Gotcha.
Speaker: You have Venom LE on there for, you know, the sticker price.
Speaker: You have dialed in at $8,000.
Speaker: And this is a Jurassic Park Pro Firm 6,500.
Speaker: So I actually, I'm going to plug this right now because Ted Finley reached out to us via email.
Speaker: He just says he loves the podcast and he wanted to make us aware of his website, pinballprices.com.
Speaker: And we're speaking trends right now.
Speaker: And he actually has a pinball price trend tab that consolidates this information.
Speaker: And he does actually...
Speaker: kind of in eras so electromechanical early solid state so let's take lcd based off of 2022 to 2023 we've seen a negative six percent decrease so the average pinball machine was selling around 10 grand as of 2022 so i'm assuming this is taking into account pros premiums and le's that's over 500 cells um
Speaker: And as of 2023, about half the cells, so 265, but we're at 9,500.
Speaker: So you can tell that there's a decrease there.
Speaker: Same with Stern DMD.
Speaker: So this is 99 to 15.
Speaker: 2022 was about 7,800 per game.
Speaker: down to 7,000, about a 9% decrease.
Speaker: It's very interesting.
Speaker: Like, if you haven't checked out pinballprices.com, you should go check it out because there's a lot of this cool stuff.
Speaker: Like, even DMDs, like, they're not dropping as bad.
Speaker: It's 2%, but it's still a drop from what we've been seeing.
Speaker: And so, the interesting part is, like, alphanumeric, solid state, and electromechanical, or the onions are really retaining percentage or slightly going up.
Speaker: But then again, like,
Speaker: They're not making any more of them.
Speaker: They're not making any more.
Speaker: And really, it's, what, $500 to $1,000 for an EM.
Speaker: So it's not hard to really keep that maintained or push that a little higher.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But, yeah, there is that.
Speaker: So thanks, Ted, for reaching out and letting us know that.
Speaker: That price trends tab is pretty cool.
Speaker: It'll be interesting to see where everything lands at the end of the year.
Speaker: Maybe we should –
Speaker: come back around.
Speaker: Cause like I said, only about half the cells have been done, which makes sense.
Speaker: Cause we're a little over half the year now.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Um, but yeah, it's pretty cool.
Speaker: So, okay.
Speaker: So what, what's your take though?
Speaker: Like I, denim.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I,
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I, I'm so conflicted on this game because I want it to do well and I want them to be able to do more interesting things.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I'll tell you concerns about over-reliance on insider connected though.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's you're getting into a possibility of a, of a DLC that,
Speaker: type thing where you have to go up and log into a machine and they're like, hey, if you want the extra packet to play this game fully, you have to pay another $30 on your personal account to activate it on a game on location.
Speaker: I don't know if that's really going to happen.
Speaker: So it's getting to the possibility that they could do that.
Speaker: That brings up a different concept in my mind.
Speaker: Would you be opposed to, because like obviously things are starting to trend down.
Speaker: We don't know exactly where the market's going, but it looks like it's going to be taking a dip for a little bit, right?
Speaker: Like economy's hard, yada, yada, yada.
Speaker: Would you be opposed to if yes, they went to DLC content, but they lowered the prices of the pinball machine.
Speaker: So essentially you're getting a cheaper pinball machine, but if you want the full game, you buy the DLC.
Speaker: That's well, that's the Rothrill's big buck hunter model.
Speaker: Correct.
Speaker: Would you be opposed to that then?
Speaker: I don't play enough to justify if it's like a monthly fee.
Speaker: So there's two questions.
Speaker: A.
Speaker: I buy it and I buy all a cart and then I have no time limitations on it.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So like most video games, like most video games, right?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: If I buy Mario cart, I own Mario cart and I bought the, you know, when the super Mario movie came out and I bought the, uh, extra levels on Mario cart.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It was 20 bucks or something.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: What I do will season pass.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Something.
Speaker: So they slowly trickle out the DLC, but you, you automatically get it cause you paid for it up front.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so, so that's fine.
Speaker: Would I have done that if they said, Hey, you need to pay five bucks a month in perpetuity to play this.
Speaker: I would say, no, I would not be interested in that because you are a hundred percent eliminating casual gamers on that.
Speaker: Um, I, and to be fair, I don't think pinball is as big on location with that model.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I would, you would have to have a lot of things change for that to be a, a reasonable concern.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Um, I'm, I'm going to, I think that those are all valid points.
Speaker: Um, I'm going to revolve back to the question that you asked me about five minutes ago.
Speaker: of what do I think of Venom.
Speaker: I think the problem is there was a cluster of information.
Speaker: It wasn't the right information.
Speaker: They're not selling this properly, I feel like.
Speaker: I agree with you.
Speaker: It's going to be a slow burn.
Speaker: I think this game looks cool as heck, man.
Speaker: I really wish... Here's my problem.
Speaker: And I don't know if everyone feels like this, if you're in the same boat.
Speaker: I don't have space.
Speaker: Well, I guess I do have space, but I don't have extra money.
Speaker: And with the last couple pinball sells that have happened with me, with it being really weird and hard to get rid of and whatnot, and I know Ellen's next, I would rather hold off on Venom and see whatever Ellen's coming out with next to say, hey, is that what I want versus Venom?
Speaker: Because I would hate to buy Venom
Speaker: week of of elwyn's next game being shown they're like venom's getting into your house and then we have to figure out well crap what am i going to sell now like i've only got a couple months before i get elwyn's game in my house right so i just the problem is is the window is just too small i feel like uh on owning i guess a game and okay i'm getting to the point where i don't want to move stuff either so
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I will push back a little bit though, because we typically buy things after the, the main people.
Speaker: I, the bottom line is we, you know, Zach does sponsor us and we certainly are able to buy games from him, but we want him to sell to you guys first.
Speaker: So if he has, you know, another customer, then it's, we're not jumping to the front of the line.
Speaker: We actually, we defer and say, no, send it to those guys first.
Speaker: We'll wait.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So that may not be the situation for everybody.
Speaker: It may be the situation for us, but not for everybody.
Speaker: Correct.
Speaker: But still like, I just, I would hate to get venom in my house and like for like a month or two later, I'd have to get rid of it to get out one's next game.
Speaker: Well, and yeah,
Speaker: Now you're saying that because we're assuming that Elwin will come out with another great game.
Speaker: True.
Speaker: Well, and that's the other part too, is like, I'm tired of moving pinball machines.
Speaker: I'm kind of to that point where it's like, well, I'm still in a situation where I need to move five down and five up.
Speaker: And I've been saying that for six weeks.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: No, I get you.
Speaker: I think overall, like I said,
Speaker: I'm excited to see where this goes with Venom.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: I think it's a positive direction in the homeowner's camp, right?
Speaker: Like, we still have this mentality of location, which is great.
Speaker: Like, there needs to be games on location because that is – that's where you test drive.
Speaker: And so – but I think this is more geared towards the homeowner, and I'm excited for that.
Speaker: I think –
Speaker: Outside of this game, I don't know.
Speaker: They're all starting to trend towards more depth, but games that aren't woodchoppy.
Speaker: And I'm really starting to... I really appreciate that.
Speaker: Overall, I just feel bad because, man, this game is really cool.
Speaker: But I don't have any desire to buy it right now because I feel like I'm stuck in limbo.
Speaker: I don't know if everyone else out there feels like that.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: It's kind of a wait and see.
Speaker: Well, I'm going to, I'm going to be at Expo in October.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And actually I, I feel bad.
Speaker: I actually just figured out it lands on our fall break.
Speaker: And that's one of the premium time offs that we can only let as a, you know, in my job, there's only so many people that can take the same time off and it's the same time all the kids are out of school.
Speaker: So everybody wants it.
Speaker: So I am not,
Speaker: available to go to expo this year which i'm totally bummed at so i will have to you know kind of wait and likely play this at texas yeah and by that time elwyn's should be out too yeah and i should be able to play a lot of games i actually i still haven't played foo fighters yet i need to go down down you need to come to my house i'll have it on monday absolutely road road trip to dinosaur land yeah because my birthday's on tuesday so oh there you go to me
Speaker: Happy birthday.
Speaker: Thanks.
Speaker: Well, I think that pretty much covers it for Venom.
Speaker: I want to hear what other people are thinking though.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So reach out, let us know.
Speaker: Are you thinking of buying it?
Speaker: Are, what are your thoughts?
Speaker: Are you, yes, I'm buying it.
Speaker: No, I'm not.
Speaker: I'm waiting to see.
Speaker: Or, you know, is there a possibility given more information that you would be interested in buying this?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's my question is what's your current state?
Speaker: And like the game, having a phase change, are you open to purchasing it in the future given certain things?
Speaker: Okay, I'm actually going to throw one more thing out that I... Okay, this is the third fighting game.
Speaker: yeah and we have fighting game in a row isn't yeah because well we had pool and then we had infinity quest and so like the marvel things is are we getting over it well i'm i'm wondering if it still has that same vibe i mean godzilla's a fighting game you take on
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I guess they're kind of all on that level, but this feels very similar.
Speaker: The, the goals are you are fighting this other superhero.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: True.
Speaker: Or super villain or whatever.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Anyway, before we wrap this up, we did have a couple of emails.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Jeff S. He just want to say he enjoyed our most recent episode.
Speaker: He appreciates that sometimes the jokes go over my head.
Speaker: And even though everyone has commented on the same topics, he enjoys our takes on them the most.
Speaker: But he just wanted for my benefit.
Speaker: He's like, he just wanted me to really know that sometimes you tell a good joke.
Speaker: Like the last one on our last episode was,
Speaker: mike's first name was magic and the problem was i think the thing is i'm trying to think ahead in the episode and trying to line stuff up so you're not listening next that's what you're saying i'm sorry i know i this is comedy gold here it is apparently it is we're getting emails about how the comedy like it even says let's see that is great humorous i do not need to tell scott so this is really for josh's benefit
Speaker: Okay, but that's not my favorite review, by the way.
Speaker: Oh, well, we got another one from Three Week.
Speaker: This Week in Pinball, just a new three-star review.
Speaker: Because we will read them, by the way.
Speaker: If we get reviews, we'll read them.
Speaker: Hosts don't seem like fun.
Speaker: We're a bit preachy and we'd love to mention we don't drink alcohol and when give a chance.
Speaker: I'm reading this straight.
Speaker: Like if you can't type your thoughts correctly.
Speaker: Sorry.
Speaker: Can't have some games in their house because of children?
Speaker: You, you're the parent and can make something off limits or play when the kids aren't around.
Speaker: Adam.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: By the way, Adam, I, I appreciate you taking time to write this.
Speaker: Yeah, I appreciate it.
Speaker: Because actually it does show something that you're actually listening and I'm totally fine with getting, with getting an average review.
Speaker: If, if people are, if we're not for everybody and that's, that's fine.
Speaker: I will clarify that I,
Speaker: I don't care if people drink alcohol.
Speaker: I don't.
Speaker: It's, it's, I guess it's along those lines of, Hey, not my thing, but do your thing.
Speaker: If that's, if that's what you're, you're doing when we're at pinball conventions, a lot of times we are the,
Speaker: the few sober ones.
Speaker: And this is not me on a higher moral ground.
Speaker: I'm just saying other people are imbibing and I hang out with them and it's totally fine.
Speaker: I totally let them do that.
Speaker: And without any reservation, that's, that's their, that's their choice.
Speaker: With regard to some games, there are some movies I don't want to watch too.
Speaker: And there are some games that I don't want to buy because the theme is not for me.
Speaker: And maybe I just don't want those things too.
Speaker: And so I'm, I'm not just putting it on my kids, my kids, what I'm willing to have my kids experience are also the same things that I want to experience too.
Speaker: And so like, Hey, my friend has an amazing scared stiff that he, that he restored.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it is a beautiful game and I love playing it at his house, but it's still not something, even if I had my own apartment without any family, you know, no, no young kids, no wife, I still probably wouldn't own it.
Speaker: And so, and that's fine.
Speaker: I, I want everybody to find the themes that, that they like.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, you know what makes me laugh too, Scott?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You want the title.
Speaker: So I can't really reveal the information that's in the next email, but I can give you the title of the email.
Speaker: It just made me laugh.
Speaker: You ready for this?
Speaker: beers at expo question mark yes hey absolutely you know what i will i i go to bars with people i'm happy to uh yeah and someone is i'm happy to safely drive you home someone someone has invited us for for drinks yeah at a bar which i'm not opposed to that like it's anywho oh absolutely there's there's more information too we'll talk about later off screen but it's just funny because i was like we have a gentleman going off about like
Speaker: we're preachy about no alcohol.
Speaker: And then our next email is, and again, it's yours at expo.
Speaker: You're just getting basically a snapshot of Josh and my home life.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I'm sure your home life is different than mine.
Speaker: So that's fine.
Speaker: Do you.
Speaker: And I love drew and Ian and I love the whole poor man's crew.
Speaker: I don't fault them for it's a different life.
Speaker: It's literally like the second they start, like what you drinking?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I love that.
Speaker: I love the, like check out poor man's that may be your jam.
Speaker: Yeah, it really might be.
Speaker: Check it out, Adam.
Speaker: You might love it.
Speaker: So yeah,
Speaker: We still do retain our 5.0 rating, 5 out of 5, on This Week in Pinball, even though we've got a three-star.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: It's okay.
Speaker: We're still good.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: 42 reviews.
Speaker: You know the number 42.
Speaker: Anyhow.
Speaker: That's the answer to everything, obviously.
Speaker: When are we going to get a Hitchhiker Guide to the Galaxy pin?
Speaker: Oh, man.
Speaker: Don't even tease me.
Speaker: George, make it happen.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Why isn't George re-theming this?
Speaker: You know, you, what's the number one thing I've heard about the George Fisher.
Speaker: Don't panic flip.
Speaker: Just check it out.
Speaker: Check it out.
Speaker: Uh,
Speaker: you what's the one number one thing I've heard in all this venom talk doesn't matter.
Speaker: I, you know, I've heard people say they love to why I've heard people say they don't, you know, they don't like his rule sets.
Speaker: I've heard, I've heard yada, yada, yada.
Speaker: The general consensus that everyone pretty much agrees upon at this point is this shouldn't have been venom.
Speaker: That should have been a Spider-Man across the spider verse.
Speaker: A hundred percent.
Speaker: Now that's assuming that that license is available.
Speaker: And, um, and also, uh,
Speaker: economical.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Cause that's a, that's a, that's an a-list, a list license.
Speaker: I saw people who watched the, the latest, uh, the across the spider verse or whatever it's, I, I didn't see it.
Speaker: Um, but I heard people posting, I just saw this generation's empire strikes back.
Speaker: That's a big deal.
Speaker: That is a big deal.
Speaker: So I, I do need to watch it.
Speaker: It's on my list, but yeah, I agree.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: We got some cool stuff lined up.
Speaker: Sadly, we can have some guests join us tonight, but you know what?
Speaker: Life is chaotic, especially during the summertime.
Speaker: So we will be having them on soon.
Speaker: I think things are going to slow down for a little bit, at least news-wise.
Speaker: I mean, things... It is what it is, but...
Speaker: Got anything else for Scott before we head off?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I want, I want someone to go play venom and give me feedback.
Speaker: I want to know someone who experienced it.
Speaker: And that is definitely going to be a lot more than me watching the, you know, the reveal at comic-con.
Speaker: So if anyone's going down to San Diego comic-con, like let us know how it is playing down there.
Speaker: Cause you only need to, you live in the San Diego area.
Speaker: You don't need a ticket to get in.
Speaker: The arcade is free.
Speaker: Like if you did not hear that,
Speaker: You can get in.
Speaker: It's just in the lobby.
Speaker: So go play.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And give us your thoughts.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: If you want to get ahold of us, we are loser kid pinball podcast at gmail.com.
Speaker: We are at loser kid pinball on all of our socials.
Speaker: That's Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Twitch, YouTube, and Tik TOK, even though I haven't done any videos cause I'm not very good at that.
Speaker: I've got, I've got a face for podcast.
Speaker: take a lot of code.
Speaker: Hey, we are video though.
Speaker: If you want to watch us talk, you can look at my books and you can look at Josh's games.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: And there was even some fun little pictures I inserted into the episode last episode.
Speaker: The save the cat episode.
Speaker: Oh yeah.
Speaker: The title of this one's going to be Bugs Got a Booty.
Speaker: Bugs Got a Booty.
Speaker: Bugs Got a Booty.
Speaker: All right, Scott.
Speaker: You send us off.
Speaker: Love you guys.
Speaker: Thanks for listening and go and play pinball.
Speaker: Boost.
Speaker: Change the game.
