Transcript
Speaker: The sort of mainstreaming up of the so -called LGBT is still very centered in this very normative idea of assimilation. into straight privilege at any cost.
Speaker: And the cost always is. that the people who are most marginalized in everyday experience will always get Push to the side. of Dreaming. has really marginalized the people who are most marginal rather than bringing them in. or creating access.
Speaker: Hello and welcome to Power Beyond Pride, a weekly queer change -making podcast bringing you voices and ideas from across our fierce and fabulous spectrum to transform our world. I'm Shane Lucas. I'm a lifelong home productionist, owner of A Great Idea, and a very proud Leo. Yes, I am. I'm a bringing all the grrrr with me today. along with my amazing co -host.
Speaker: Well, if that's the case, then I'm also a Leo as well. So in all my queendom that I sit on my throne, I am Maddie Bynum, the other co -host, the loudest one in the room at all times. Whether I am laughing, singing, or just standing still, I am always a conversational piece. I love it.
Speaker: And we want to thank you for joining us on our um Queer Cast journey today. On today's episode, our guest is a New York Times Editor's Choice author, one of Oprah Magazine's best LGBTQ plus offers of 2020.
Speaker: Matilda Bernstein Sycamore has penned numerous publications. They are the creator of Lost Missing. and has been actively on the forefront as a powerful activist it for the LGBTQ plus community for many, many years.
Speaker: And they are celebrating the launch of their latest work. Terry Baxall. Welcome, and we thank you for being here with us today. Ms. Matilda, how are you doing? Thank you so much. It's great to be here.
Speaker: Wonderful, wonderful, wonderful to have you here, Matilda. And again, it means a lot for you to join us here on Power Beyond Pride because confession. I was lucky enough to design one of your earliest book covers for Pulling Taffy. So I've known for years how your intense imagery, your honest storytelling about club culture and nightlife, and you're done with such heartbreaking authenticity, right? But like, this is your hundredth book, right?
Speaker: Am I right? What number book is this? Well, i have this will be I have seven books, and then I also have six anthologies. So if you count them it' together, it'd be like 13.
Speaker: But it's also my fourth novel because then I have three nonfiction titles. And then all the anthologies are nonfiction. That was so much writing. like How are you constantly uncovering unique and new ways to talk about queer culture? like how how do you how do you How do you do that?
Speaker: Well, I think for me Writing is the way. That I stay alive. It's how I process the world around me. It's how I articulate.
Speaker: things in as nuanced and vulnerable. and intimate. a away as possible. And it's also how if there's something I feel like I need to say. but I can't say it. Because I might die that you and when you have that panic.
Speaker: That's when I have to write it down. And then I can say it. And I don't die. So for me... Writing is always the way. that I've been able to survive.
Speaker: And so because of that... I am always. Thinking about. or attempting different... methods and different strategies. For bringing things out in... and it's intimate and explosive and hopefully transcendent way as possible.
Speaker: Well, that's beautiful. I think that writing, well, art itself is a lifeline. So definitely. And I agree with you on that one. Now, your particular art is interesting because the life that you have lived has clearly informed your art with joy, the grit, the lessons that you have been through in life.
Speaker: So could you give us a few moments and just tell us how has your journey throughout life itself helped to shake the stories that you tell? And how have you become the person that you are today? Absolutely. Yeah. When I was a teenager, I was... A poet.
Speaker: And then I discovered language poetry. and language poetry. is when you basically condense Everything that's ever happened. until 12 words on the page. So. That's how I became a really good editor.
Speaker: by cutting cutting cutting cutting And then when I was 19... I started turning tricks for a living. And my friend Thomas. friends these stories. And they're like, Matilda, you have to write those stories down.
Speaker: And I was like, well, I don't know if I want to write those stories because. I'm trying to change language. I felt like this, that because language poetry is very pure. It has a purism to it. And. But I was like, wait a second. I believe in.
Speaker: experimentation. I'm an experimental writer. Let me just try it out. So I started, I wrote. one of those stories. I think it was about my fifth track. And. And then I was like, wait a second.
Speaker: This is really interesting. And so then and that was when I brought voice back in and voice became the central thing. So it really did start there with sex work. Which, because also sex work was how I was supporting myself.
Speaker: So that I could be. so that I can have my creative life. Right? and i live as close to my own terms as possible. Now, of course it wasn't on my own terms when I was training tricks, unfortunately, but. In general. I didn't have to have. a job that was wearing me out so much that I couldn't do activism. or couldn't.
Speaker: Right? or couldn't create Kind of. wild alternatives to the status quo in my own relationship. And so. So I think it really started there. And I think also...
Speaker: With my anthologies. Each one is kind of an intervention. in the sort of political moment. to kind of bring the conversation. that I've been engaging with with other people, whether it's about sex work.
Speaker: or about surviving sexual abuse. or about... yeah know assimilationist trends in queer politics or about conformist gender norms.
Speaker: Or about the AIDS crisis. So then... My anthology sort of became a way to bring my sort of... skills as an activist and an organizer into a writing realm.
Speaker: And then. In my writing itself, I think before I was talking about vulnerability. And I think that's something I'm really drawn to because as a child and a teenager and a young adult,
Speaker: Invulnerability is what saved me, right? Because I'm walking down the street and people are telling me they want to kill me. I might get thrown against a wall. i might These things are just everyday experiences and it had to be. project in vulnerability. But for me now. Several decades later, it's not that those things don't happen still on the street. but But I do feel like vulnerability. is what will save me and what will connect me. with other queers, with other people who share similar experiences.
Speaker: And also... what people can connect with on the page. So that it feels like. Oh. full experience of the world. and not something. that's being explicated. or toned down. in order to find some narrow different definition. of accessibility.
Speaker: It's beautiful that you talk about, especially vulnerability, I think is is so powerful because, again, it's in it's in that authenticity. And now you've written for years around your your experience of sex work. And obviously, it's one of the places you and I have known each other over the years. You were one of the first interviews at a Hook, which is a program run for men in the industry many, many years ago. You've also written an incredible anthology around sex work. And one thing that I think about with your writing is it's so provocative. right It's provocative around sex work. It's provocative around substance use. It's provocative around experience.
Speaker: Do you feel like in your activism and the way that you think about your writing as activism, that that provocation is one of the things missing from the current queer movement? Oh yeah, that's a great question. ah Yes. I mean, definitely. The sort of mainstreaming of of the so -called LGBT, and sometimes they put the Q on, they might put on some other letters. But it's still very centered in this.
Speaker: very normative idea. of assimilation. into straight privilege at any cost. And the cost always is. that the people who are most marginalized in everyday experience, whether that be trans people, whether that be youth, whether that be seniors. People living on the streets, migrants.
Speaker: People are in prison. Those experiences. Always got. Push to the side unless it's for a fundraising. And. So I think that means streaming.
Speaker: has really marginalized. the people who are most marginalized. rather than bringing them in or creating access. And so. So I think for me.
Speaker: I think activism is both separate from and connected to to my writing and my editing, right? So there is the activism. Yeah, because direct action activism is really where, say at the same time as... as I started writing these stories when I was like 19. I was part of ACT UP in San Francisco. And then a bunch of other.
Speaker: different direct action experiments like better queers in New York or gay shame later. But all of my activism has been outside. of the centers of power and also outside.
Speaker: of a nonprofit industrial complex. So. So it really comes from, and I feel like that's where. That's where, like you mentioned, That's working drug use.
Speaker: These are things that come back into my work over and over and over again, even though right now I'm not turning tricks and not doing drugs. Bye bye. Pterodactyl, for example. It opens on the dance floor at the Limelight in 1991. And you're just in this world, right? You're just a mess.
Speaker: in this like transgressive. and over the top. And. desperate and also flamboyant and full of pageantry. And.
Speaker: And so for me, That enmeshment. or that layering, that experience of everything happening at once. That's what I'm always trying to get in my writing.
Speaker: I love that. And and you I love that you're able to mesh and layer those things because a good book brings fiction to reality and makes reality seem to be fiction from time to time. so I love i love that that about your writing style. And I definitely want to continue on that same topic and asking you, how do you so seamlessly mesh together? fictional
Speaker: creativity of worlds that we can envision, but you can always intersect and bring in the real stories of history of HIV crisis and and AIDS activism work and sex work. So how is that a hard thing? One.
Speaker: or And also, how do you create that? Oh, that's a great question. Thank you so much. Well, I think i I, in a way, I'm doing... Mo? at the same time, but I also do them separately. So for example, to take pterodactyl,
Speaker: Paradoxical. as a trans girl. who grows up in Seattle. She's raised by lesbian mothers. They're party girls. Their house is always filled with all these queens.
Speaker: this When she's a little child. These are kind of like parole models. And then when she's 10, 11, 12. All of those queens start dying of age. And so. That's work for her formation.
Speaker: And in a way... That came in some ways from my experience, although I grew up in a world with no queers around. Zero. There was no possibility to be queer. But I have the same generational experience.
Speaker: So I wanted to imagine, well what happens if you did grow up in that world? They're not that many 10, 11, 12 year olds. Who did grow up in that world. In the 80s. But here's here's someone who did. And then you lose it all.
Speaker: And so how does that trauma... impacts you. Now in one of my anthologies. Between certain death. and a possible future. which is 32 different contributors.
Speaker: addressing that same question. So it's not the generation that we're usually. We usually see that's the generation that grew up with sexual liberation. And experienced it. and then watched as all their friends died of a mysterious...
Speaker: disease as the government did nothing to intervene. Now this is the next generation. We grow up. With that. death. as Part of our design. Right. We were like 10, 11, 12.
Speaker: when we first knew about. eights Right. It was. part of becoming queer. And so that generational experience. I think has is always informing.
Speaker: My work? And. in the writing itself. So it's interesting. so In non -fiction, for me, It's not necessarily about So I guess all my work is a hybrid, right? So it has aspects of fiction, not fiction, everything, right? So when Terry Daschle's on the dance floor at the limelight in 1991. That's not me, but I was on the dance floor of the limelight in 1901 a few times.
Speaker: ah But so so each thing kind of... Enter Weeds. And I think when I'm writing a book, I don't know necessarily when I start, whether it's fiction or nonfiction. I just know I have to write something down. And I just start with it.
Speaker: And then I go where the vulnerability is. So it's that key again. And where... And also I want it to be on the terms of the character. So it term in case of... pterodactyl which is a novel. It is on her terms.
Speaker: And in her world. And then the reader. Just have to. Decide what to do. The reader, to and hopefully continues reading, right? Hopefully is enthralled. by this kind of...
Speaker: Spectacular intimacy. And. engaged. in a way that kind of opens up. the possibility for a more embodied experience. Hey, you saved her.
Speaker: I was going to say, you said the key thing and and just now. And I love, this is what makes sure your stories so touching and so poignant with everybody is you don't start out writing a nonfiction or a fiction. You start the story and then let the story itself develop. And I think that's beautiful because when we start reading, I don't start reading a nonfiction because it's nonfiction. I find the similarities in the nonfiction in my life so I can relate to the character.
Speaker: So I appreciate that. Thank you. Thank you. I love that. No, I love this. And we're going to take a quick break. But when we come back, Matilda, I have a couple of questions. i want to I want to dig a little bit more into into what you shared, especially around urgency.
Speaker: And so everyone stick stick stick with us for this episode of Power Beyond Pride. We are in a conversation with the phenomenal author, activist, just someone I'm grateful to have across our communities doing incredible work, Matilda Bernstein -Sickler.
Speaker: Welcome back. This is Power Beyond Pride, a queer change -making podcast. And I'm Shane Lucas here with my phenomenal, gorgeous, belle of the ball, if you will, Maddie Bynum is my co -host. And we are we have as a guest, Matilda Bernstein -Sycamore, author of Terry Dactyl, which just hit the shelves, and really just ah ah an incredible career of ah books that are just...
Speaker: And. I come back to the word urgent. And I think something that you said earlier, Matilda, that was really powerful to me in the first segment is you really talked about what it meant to have this intensity to have to write this down. I have to write this down. this is this is This is the thing that is fueling my existence. And if I don't put it on the page. I'm curious as somebody else who similarly grew up and also came to activism at a pretty young age.
Speaker: Whether or not that's something that's also influenced by your own story of both coming out in an era that was in the midst of the crisis, as and of the HIV crisis, as well as just something of that time that was pre -will and grace, right? There's just a sense of urgency, a sense that we may not have as long of lives as we thought we were going to have.
Speaker: And I'm curious if you could speak to that a little bit, if some of that urgency comes from this sense of. Hey, I Because I just turned 50 last year and it was something that really... in conversations with people, they'd be like, happy birthday. And I'm like.
Speaker: I really didn't think I'd be here. I didn't really think. this was this was going to happen for me. Not for any particular specific reason, like there were there were different people I'd lost over the years. But this idea of urgency just really, really felt very poignant in what you shared because it was something I thought of in my early years of activism.
Speaker: yeah absolutely yeah I mean I think As a kid. Like I was the first time. I ever. part of a gay person in the world. It was Rock Hudson dying on the front cover of The Inquirer.
Speaker: So gay and ads were interplot. When I first started... Thinking about that. I was like afraid that I might get AIDS from my own cum. And while I had...
Speaker: sexual education and I knew that wasn't technically possible. I still was afraid, right? Beer. And that you're... I've And almost like a certainty of early death.
Speaker: Because when I moved to San Francisco... when I was 19. That was in 1991, 1992. Everywhere, people were dying of AIDS, of drug addiction, of suicide.
Speaker: And. That death was... part of what it meant. to become queer. in that moment And. And so I think you're right that.
Speaker: That. And also there were a lot of artists. artists, performers. who were dying of AIDS, or had just died of AIDS, And those were the people. who in some ways...
Speaker: became Where I found... role models of a certain kind, but they were role models who were all dying or had just died. And so but when I found David Wojnarowicz's work. At that same time period.
Speaker: And. I literally read about him. in a piece that was right after he died. And so. That sense of loss and that. sense of communal possibility were intertwined.
Speaker: And. And being a part of ACT UP when I was... 19 and finding a kind of culture. of politicizing. Sexuality. and refusing.
Speaker: The violence. of the status quo of government inaction. uh structural, familial, societal. Homophobia. And.
Speaker: and deciding. See you exist in our own as much as possible. It's creating our ah alternative. to that violence that we grew up with. Right. So I grew up in. and an Upper middle class.
Speaker: Jewish assimilated family. But it was like deeply believe homophobic. And there was like. No, and also I was sexually abused by my father. And. And so for me, becoming queer, part of becoming queer.
Speaker: have always met. refusing everything about how I was raised. and And I think that is a generational. a but a particular generational perspective that does come from the AIDS crisis and also from That intense.
Speaker: Moment. Uh... societal... Homophobia and... Brutality. right Where? where dominant culture was more than happy. To see like.
Speaker: I'll be. faggots and drug addicts and... Trans people, like, die of AIDS. They're like, get rid of them right now. And people literally say that. And this was like... me Well, politics. Now it's time! Piss off.
Speaker: aspects of that. But that particular moment. I think. In terms of the AIDS crisis... is a generational experience. That I think. I think it it has been.
Speaker: I think in a way. Once we. developed drugs that actually extended people's lives. Starting around 1996. ah AIDS, IB and AIDS were kind of pushed under the rock.
Speaker: There are still people dying to today. in this country. Even in... The wealthiest. gay neighborhood. So you go to the West Village. And you still see. People on the street.
Speaker: Literally. Dying of AIDS. And those are the people who have been pushed to the margins, right? So that again is like queer youth, it's trans people. If people... You might have. Nightly. Have access.
Speaker: See you. Medication. But if they don't have housing. If they don't have a way to make a living. If they don't have food on the table. Like. does that really enable them to have a way to survive?
Speaker: And so. So I think it's a continuing legacy. That. is ongoing in our current moment as well. I like that. I like how you drew that conclusion. I mean, that that that narration together. Now, also, too, currently in our political system, I will say that...
Speaker: free speech is is under attack. I'm trying to think of the best way to try to say this, the best way, because I think... the The voice that you have and the the the narrative that you bring bring to the table is very, very important because a lot of young people, and and I'm going to say this to make my point.
Speaker: A lot of younger LGBTQ may not understand the understanding and the meaning of life that older gay members of the the community have because they grew up during the 90s. They grew up during the HIV and the AIDS crisis. Not saying there's not a tax on the community now, but that narrative is so beautiful and so important for generations to come to have.
Speaker: How do you feel about right now with books being banned and being burned, rights being rolled back, voices are being silenced because they may make a comment that somebody else may not like?
Speaker: But at the same time, there's this powerful wave of resistance and creation coming from our queer community. So when you look at all of that, what would you like to see the and this administration to do differently or do better for the LGBTQ people and to keep that voice alive?
Speaker: Yeah, thank you. well Unfortunately... This administration, the only thing they could do to do better. is to resign. All of them. All of them must go. you There's nothing... What are we gonna do? To support.
Speaker: Queer, trans. lives on the margin ever. Now, unfortunately, There are some very scary gays. nor in that administration, right? And that is the nightmare of assimilation right there. you have Someone like Peter Thiel, I just realized, is gay, right? you have A gay secretary of the treasury. You have these. These scary gays.
Speaker: that are like Yeah, Barry Weiss just got announced to take over, I think it was ABC or one at least one of the networks. and barry Oh yeah, we have, what's their name? Yeah, the the person who started the free press. And now the CBS, the the director her or the...
Speaker: Out of CBF. So. We have this. That's the absolute nightmare. Those are people who have developed access. Bye. pushing everyone else to the side. And that's that's saying it lightly.
Speaker: Right. And so. So I think we are in a very. Gary political moment. And I think the only way. To resist is to refuse their time.
Speaker: Right. So. So I actually find, for example, when we see protests in Portland outside of ICE facilities. As people are. in these inflatable unicorn outfits and frogs.
Speaker: And polar bears. That's one way to refuse their terms, right? Like yeah they are still firing. tear -gassing people every night. They're still arresting and deporting people.
Speaker: But I think there's a way to take... A kind of... pageantry. and and refuse those terms. And also, I think... the way that people are creating mutual aid networks.
Speaker: And. ways to support one another. But I think the... Unfortunately, the dominant institutions of power. then it's never been clearer.
Speaker: that they have no interest in supporting. Really anyone. I mean, it's it's that's how bad it is right now. so So I think. that There's no real hope in...
Speaker: in getting Trump. to change his tune unless we can somehow just get rid of him entirely. Well, that kind of pushes me to another question then, Matilda, because again... with your experience, both as an, as a grassroots art organizer, as well as a creator right in this current moment as, and as well as somebody who obviously with a career that has gotten enormous notoriety, a lot of respect.
Speaker: Like when you think about other people who are leading in the movement, and I'm thinking about people who are taking positions of power. So you have your Peter Thiel's and Barry Weiss's who are obviously, they're people in in those. industries doing that work. and and sometimes oftentimes counter. productive to the advancements of rights. But you also have organizations right within the nonprofit sector and queer sector. that are being led by people of lived experience, but...
Speaker: In some ways, even hearing you talk about coming out in San Francisco at a time where we lost enormous numbers of leaders and creative people and innovators and ideators and people who who had the courage to step into the movements early on, right? Who had the courage to be in these spaces were also a lot of the people that we lost in those eras.
Speaker: Do you feel like we're we have a we have an absence of leadership in some cases at these higher levels? Because all those all those individuals who were there early on. With some exceptions, obviously people like Peter Staley and other people who are, again, who have who have would continued to try to carry on a lot of that work in different ways.
Speaker: But they're a rarity. in many of these conversations. And so we don't have many of those individuals left from that early courageous days. Do you feel like the absence of that is also one of the things we're contending with within our own movements?
Speaker: I think for me, the problem is more that. People have... believe too much in these systems of power. Dang. So they have internalized.
Speaker: to mind that. Right? that the only way to change something And. Let's say within. a very normative let's say, married, gay, serving in the military. I mean, what could be worse than serving in the military, right? That's where the movement has failed. up I think. if they were saying nothing can be worth going abroad and killing people. and getting away with it.
Speaker: Like nothing could be worse. So a queer movement. And it's... Initiation. At the very least. has to be anti -military, right? If we got rid of the military in the country this country, We would have.
Speaker: Access. to the resources to fund everything we've ever dreamed of. Everything. Just immediately, like universal health care would be like. Okay, boom, done. You know what I mean? Save houses for queer kids to escape abusive homes. One second.
Speaker: Universal access? to like every kind of healthcare or food or. Or... a Sex life that matters. All of it. It all just becomes. And I think.
Speaker: So I think that for me is the real problem that. This mainstream. LGBT movement. is so centered or around, and it again in some ways it gets worse. We had gays in the military in the early 90s.
Speaker: Now that was very formative because for me because In 1993, Here with the March on Washington. For then it was just. I think lesbian, gay and bisexual. Right. Because they hadn't. put On the acronym, yeah.
Speaker: And. I went with ACT UP. And we were doing a yeah civil disobedience. for universal health care. We thought we were going to get like hundreds. if not thousands of people to join us. Because there were a million people at this march, right? Now, I think we had something like.
Speaker: 43 people or something, right? That was a small civil disobedience. It didn't get very much attention. Meanwhile... The Hallmark. was around. repealing the ban on openly gay members of the military, right? And so...
Speaker: data. And this is in a moment where. So many people. have lost so entire circles of friends to the AIDS crisis. And. universal healthcare was almost a mainstream issue.
Speaker: It was. there were People like Hillary Clinton were talking. That's how mainstream it was. She was like, I'm going to create a granted plan. Now, obviously she never did that. Bye. I think. If in that moment.
Speaker: universal healthcare. had become the central issue. of the LGBT movement or in that in that moment, the LGB movement. then we would be so much further along.
Speaker: But as long as... The movement is in thrall. Uh... dominant institutions of power, the military being the most obvious. But also... Things like.
Speaker: hate crimes legislation. It's like, let's give the cops more money. to fight hate crimes okay but that's not what the cops do hello and So I think. Access.
Speaker: to benefits through marriage. but not access to benefits if you're not married. So this, that to me, that hypocrisy. And not. Abandonment.
Speaker: It just goes on and on. when when they were like, oh, we got that gays in the military thing. And then suddenly they're like. Oh wait, now? What about trans people in the military? It's like a satire. You know what I mean? There are so many... trips Well... You know...
Speaker: Cannot they can't live in the their families of origin in the cities where they grew up. They are. still brutalized on the street, murdered in broad daylight.
Speaker: and And people are like, well, what do trans people need? It's not. joining the military, you know what I mean? It's like ending the military so we can actually access. the things that will change people's lives.
Speaker: Well, I love you sharing that too, because you're not not just, obviously, that I think it's an incredible. perspective to say, hey, look. were these the fights that we needed to have? And as activists, as queer people,
Speaker: Obviously, we we we live intersectionally. So there are queer people who work in climate movements, housing movements, employment movements, all kinds of movements. but really thinking about what is the most efficient use of our of our efforts and are we reinforcing existing systems? And I want to call out too that you're working on an ACT UP anthology now, right? You're working on...
Speaker: you're you're you're You're starting to work on on ah on a piece really chronicling the power of backed up. Is that correct? Yes. Yeah. So I'm working on a new anthology. It's called Act Up. Beyond New York. Stories and strategies.
Speaker: from a movement to end the AIDS crisis. So basically what I want to do with the anthology is. Because... The more... i think I think Act Up New York, which was the first chapter, it started in 1987.
Speaker: in New York. Act of New York in many ways has become Canada. And there are books and movies about it. But ACT UP! Actually, there were almost 150 chapters.
Speaker: So there was... Act up Shreveport. Act up Milwaukee. Then with Octop, knock it ass Louisiana. There was Act Up Miami, Act Up Memphis, and... Out to Paris. And and so...
Speaker: All of these, paradoxically. the more attention there is on Active New York. It doesn't filter down. And people don't realize. Oh wait a second. So let's say someone is.
Speaker: growing up in in Natchitoches, Louisiana. they And they hear about Act of New York. Does that inspire them to be able to do something in Natchitoches? I don't know. or Shreveport. And also... This sort of.
Speaker: The struggles that people face in these different environments. were very different. So in Shreveport, people were fighting David Duke. And the KKK. In Milwaukee, they're organizing. in the shadow of Jeffrey Dahmer's murders.
Speaker: of gay Black men. And... And also... of radical anti -abortion organizing. And so... So for me, what I want to do with this anthology.
Speaker: is to bring this really wide range. of experience of whether it's Act Up Los Angeles. or ACT UP. Atlanta or...
Speaker: out to Evansville, Indiana. And... Because there were... There were. it was It was actually a national and international movement. And it was decentralized.
Speaker: And. the Each chapter was entirely autonomous. And. One of the things... Once I started circulating the call for submissions, and by the way, If anyone's listening. The call for submissions is open right now for anyone who was involved.
Speaker: in any chapter. You can just look on my website there. And but one of the things that happened soon after. I came up with the proposal and started circulating the call for submission.
Speaker: In this. Second. Trump charm. There are new ACT UP chapters. That have just. a marked So there's a new chapter in Pittsburgh. There's a new chapter in Cleveland.
Speaker: There's a new chapter in Boston. And so... So that's really interesting, right? and so That's those are people. New R. being. The first wave of ACT UP.
Speaker: and how people were responding. to another right -wing administration. In fact, the one that coined... Make America Great Again. That was a slogan from Reagan. And. And are thinking, oh, maybe these tactics.
Speaker: can. Help us now. And. How we. fight for resources for the AIDS crisis and beyond. Because some of these... Chapters are also... engaged in.
Speaker: These new chapters. in fights over trans healthcare. And so it's a. And in. Earlier, Waver backed up. that wasn't ne That wasn't something that... What public and such is that? And so...
Speaker: No, that's a really exciting. Thing that I did not expect. When I started circulating. this call for submission. So I'm really excited. to to bring about Because for me, an anthology is a conversation.
Speaker: It's like Creating a conversation. that might be happening, but isn't necessarily public. and bringing it into the public sphere. So hopefully in this case. One thing is it's a historical corrective.
Speaker: But also it's a way to look at. past and present activist strategies. End. different locales. and the very specificity. whether it's in a small town or a larger city, whether it's in... The Deep South.
Speaker: Or... the East Coast or the Midwest or the West Coast. Or whether it's in Paris, in another country, or in the UK. So. Putting that all together.
Speaker: to see what conversation emerged. Most definitely, most definitely. I think that is a a very good way of bringing it all together so that we can have one two -foot conversation.
Speaker: At this moment, I do caution people, please stay, do not leave. We do have to take a quick break real quick so we can sit down and have a private conversation with Matilda. No, I'm just joking. Now, anything we talk about will be discussed on the show. But yeah, we will be back with Power be Beyond Pride in just a few moments.
Speaker: Welcome back to Power Beyond Pride, and I am Shane Lucas. I'm here with my amazing co -host, Maddie Bynum. And we are interviewing and spending time with author, creator, activists. I run out of words when I think about all the different impacts that Matilda Bernstein Sycamore has. What if I have a great and powerful Oz in a way? Because, I mean, what is there left to you to describe this beautiful being of a... creativity and love and knowledge and and figurativeness. like
Speaker: Yeah. Language guide, storyteller. I guess we could go with all of those as all being true. Again, story sharer, I think in many ways, both in their fiction and nonfiction work. But now we want to get to know...
Speaker: I'm going to tell it a little bit more. So we're going to engage in our speed round. And Matilda, are you ready for a speed round where we ask you questions and you don't can't think about the answers? You ready? Ready to go? At all. Not at all. you Everybody says they won't think about it and then they do the same thing. They stop and look up. so so All right. So the first question is going to be, what's a guilty pleasure you're not so guilty about?
Speaker: Oh, taking k naps in the sun in the park. yeah that Oh, or maybe it's a guilty pleasure. Having sex in the park? There we go. No one tells me about that. We'll go with both. And I think it absolutely works. Speaking of, do you prefer giving gifts or receiving them?
Speaker: Oh, let's say I'll take both. I'll take both. Okay. We appreciate Versatility here. It is. It takes a good art form to be able to give and receive equally just as great. So that is a good art form to have. plus that What's one thing you need to start your day? Coffee, chaos, or quietness?
Speaker: Oh, I think quietness because i I get up and I have to take a bath and. Pass out in the bow. Just to recover from that. Supposed that sleep. i have Ooh. Ha! That sounds like a very, and but okay, so now I have to ask, do you remember any of your dreams?
Speaker: I do sometimes remember my dream. but often I think I'm going to remember them and then they're gone as soon as I try to access them again. now are yeah drink I feel like... mirror
Speaker: I feel like our dreams would be really vivid. Eh? Oh, give it. I have favorite dreams, but it doesn't mean they don't they don't disappear fast. Because I'm like, oh, that one was so vivid. There's no way I'll forget that. 20 minutes later, what was that dream? No clue.
Speaker: It is. Wow. All I know is is is if your life had a soundtrack, and I feel like your life should have a soundtrack. What do you think your entrance song would be?
Speaker: Oh, Brighter Days by Kashmir. Ooh, nice. Good one. Good one. What's the specific challenge you've overcome in your advocacy work?
Speaker: I don't know if I've overcome my challenges. ah Let me think. Overcoming my advocacy work. Oh, that's such a good question. I have to think about.
Speaker: Well, I guess. overcome the the world that I grew up in, right? that told me that I should either die or disappear. And I think. I'll figure it out away.
Speaker: to to refuse those terms. Because I think that's what I'm always trying to do. when I talk to other people too, is... We don't have to. think on the terms of the dominant culture that doesn't believe that we even deserve to live. Right. so So I think rejecting those times.
Speaker: Love that. Love that. Who's one person, living or gone? you'd like to sit down with. Well the first - Two people I thought of. Far gone. that David, want to rub it?
Speaker: Myth major. That would be a fun conversation, the two of them together. Now... Yeah. let love Yeah, we do want to take a moment to honor Ms. Major. we just we just She just recently passed, so we we certainly appreciate her.
Speaker: or Her guidance. Was there any moment in Ms. Major's her her story that really speaks to you? Oh, I just love how she was constantly... I mean, she's an example of someone.
Speaker: No. With constantly. reinventing herself. And. thinking about trans existence. in a way that was totally refusing.
Speaker: dominant culture in the world. Totally refusing them. and inspiring. Generation. of trans girls. to live their lives. on their own terms.
Speaker: and And also, she's always focused on the most marginalized, like trans women in prison. And. How to... help other girls to To live.
Speaker: A full life. On their own. Before I move on to the next one, I saw a video quote of her this past week that she had did an interview and it was like, she said, I never considered myself an activist. I just knew I always dared to be different and I wanted other people to feel different, be different.
Speaker: And I think that's a beautiful quote to live as an activist, period, in this movement, because sometimes activism can get us down. But I love how she was just like, I was just being different.
Speaker: Just... Being in myself. up Love that. love that So I would say finish this sentence for me. Writing pterodactyl taught me. blank.
Speaker: How to live. Ooh. And turn. If you could teleport anywhere in the world for dinner tonight, where would you go and with whom?
Speaker: ah What? I'll set a table for you if this happens to be here. ah ah ah We're going to go for dinner. I'm not sure. Well, I absolutely. I mean, this is gonna sound really boring, but...
Speaker: I love. There's some really good vegan restaurants in LA. No. I think I would teleport myself to one of those. Outdoor seating, please, during this ongoing pandemic.
Speaker: Good place for outdoor seating. And... I think I would have a table with. like 20 or 30 of my friends. Okay. Sounds like a great time.
Speaker: What's a quote or mantra you live by? Oh. Do feelings lose their feeling if they speak to a lack of feeling? Body ranking.
Speaker: All right. Can you repeat that one more time and we will, I want to soak that.
Speaker: Do feelings lose their feeling? if they speak to a lack of feeling. I'm going to have to settle that. I'm going to have to sit with that one. I love it. i took with that i give it now and Yeah, that's a good one.
Speaker: That's a really, its really great one. Well, now I want to know, here's my last question for you is, what does power beyond pride mean to you? Mmm. I think power beyond. Pride.
Speaker: Me and... refusing the terms of the dominant culture. and invoking. The original. Power, which one? fighting against Police. and state control.
Speaker: over queer bodies and lives. And building. Ways of living with. taken care of. lusting for. And.
Speaker: Nourishing. one another. that are not Predicated. on any dominant. institutions of oppression. So that we can create. Gender. Sexual.
Speaker: social and political. Self -determination. for everyone. Beautiful. I'm going to put that, I'm going to cross stitch that. and That, that, that, that I'm going to cross stitch somewhere. I think that's, that's brilliant. And ma' so the work and people find out more about your work.
Speaker: So I have a web website. It's just myfullname .com. Mattel. Burn soon. sycamore .com. That has, I'm going to be on a book tour for Terry Doctal. So if you're in Seattle, Portland. New York, DC, or Baltimore, I'll be there.
Speaker: And there's more information about my books and different things. There it's here. Well, because you have more books to come. So and if you don't, there's a pterodactyl Torah, but I have no doubt.
Speaker: We have so much more to hear from you, which again, we could not be luckier as a movement. as ah as a community, just as as simply a human being alive at this time. to be able to. again, have access to your novels, your anthologies, and your work. So again, thank you so much for being here today. spending time on this podcast. And and we hope you'll join us again.
Speaker: as well. Thank you so much. It's been such a pleasure to be here. And thank you for your amazing questions and also just. You're warm. sense. care, and camaraderie. I really appreciate it.
Speaker: Always, always. And so I just, I will guess I would, my last words to you today would be to just continue being the beautiful essence of a person that you are. I love it. I love it. I thank you for imprinting on my life today.
Speaker: And that's how the... So I am Maddie Bynum, comedian, actress, and always the loudest person in the room, regardless if I'm speaking or not, because I just am that girl. And you can follow me on at Simone737 at Instagram.
Speaker: Maddie Bynum at Facebook. And like I always say at the end of these shows now, I do have a TikTok, but I only have five videos. So if you want to go watch the five videos. It's MaddieSimone737, I think, as well.
Speaker: And I am your other co -host, Shane Lucas. He, him, his. And I'm a lifelong harm reductionist, owner of a great idea, and and also the person who's been watching Maddie's videos at least 50 or so many times, so I can try to get those numbers up on TikTok.
Speaker: Remember it to subscribe and actually, oh, yeah and also you can find me at shanelucas .com, agreatidea .com, any place any of those are around, as well as through the Power Beyond Pride channels. Remember to subscribe and get your friends to subscribe to Power Beyond Pride on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts and check out our site at powerbeyondpride .com.
Speaker: Empower Beyond Pride is a project from A Great Idea, a queer -owned design and content agency. Learn more about them at agreatidea .com. This episode is produced by Shane Lucas. And that'd be me. And Maddy Bynum is the project developer. That'd be her. And our editor is Jarrett Redding. Hi, Jarrett. And support from Ian Wilson. Hi, Ian.
Speaker: Bye bye. Yeah. And we are both part of the podcast. Awesome host team here. We will invite you to always please send in your questions and comments to Power be Beyond Fraud. It is, we have not renamed it, so if you happen to have called our reply all, we are still taking submissions for how we will call it, either the mailbag, the mail slot, or if it's just going to be the place where your comments come. But yes. I'm voting on Milk Slot.
Speaker: Check out new episodes each week where we have guests visit us like today with the wonderful Matilda Bernstein Sycamore. And every month we also do a reply all episode where we tackle some of the top headlines as well as other issues impacting activists. We look forward to queer change making with you. this time, next time and in the future. Thank you from all of us at Power Beyond Pride.
