Transcript
Speaker: I was interviewing and while I was interviewing, I i casually mentioned my my boyfriend. I did that. very purposefully just to see the reaction that my interviewer might have. I just stood there waiting for some sort of reaction and there was none. And that really spoke volumes to me because it meant that
Speaker: me being myself and bringing my truest self to to work every day would not be a problem. And so I say that to every student you're interviewing. a company just as much as they're interviewing you. And if you want to bring your best self to work and your best... work to work. you have to bring yourself and your true identity.
Speaker: Hello and welcome to Power Beyond Pride, a weekly queer change -making podcast and bringing you voices and ideas from across our fierce... and Fabulous Spectrum to transform our world. I am Daniel WK Lee. Poet. author and certified umami bomb.
Speaker: And I am Europe. co -host. I'm Sean Aaron. He, him, his. I am a nonprofit leader, a podcast host, and fun fact about me that most folks don't know, I'm a grandfather. Which I think is...
Speaker: Way funner than being a parent.
Speaker: We are your co -host on today's Queer Cast Journey. Today, we have someone in the house who is truly shaping the future, not just of tech, but of how we show up in it.
Speaker: Our guest is a visionary who believes that innovation and identity aren't separate lanes. They are a full -on intersection where the magic happens. So let's welcome Jake Tenenbaum to the...
Speaker: Power Beyond Pride. Hey guys. nice to see you nice to meet you and Likewise. Likewise. Yes. Thank you so much for joining us on today's podcast.
Speaker: Jake. You've built spaces at the intersection of tech. identity and community. What law made you realize that LGBTQ representation in tech wasn't just important. but was necessary.
Speaker: It's a great question. Yeah. i I think the the really significant for moment for me, I started attending out -in -tech events. Back in 2015, And... It was a really great moment because I was just starting my tech career.
Speaker: I was leaving the the client side, moving to to the tech space. And it was just. Great to go to tech events. In 2016, my partner and I... We moved to London and I was really excited to start. ah alan check an Alentech chapter of my own.
Speaker: We fast forward to 2017. We started the chapter. I was one of the first committee members. But I felt so disconnected from the rest of... The Alentech chapters from people I knew back in New York from friends I'd made in LA and SF.
Speaker: And so i I quickly recognized the need to not only... build a bridge between countries and and the world of where we were talking about. tech and and and the LGBTQ plus community.
Speaker: But also... we would have events that... It felt like it ended too soon. This is back in the days when we would have panels or I would try to create these TN tech events. where we would have an icebreaker or almost a salon -based event. and I want to continue the conversation.
Speaker: And that just didn't exist. And so in 2018, I was one of the co -founders of the... Allen Tech virtual community, our Slack space at the time. Am I stood it up? And we we saw some traction by the end of 2020.
Speaker: Say 2019 or so, we were about. 3 ,000, 5 ,000, somewhere in that number. And I was always tracking. ways but then the pandemic really fast -tracked. the need for community and a virtual community at that.
Speaker: And so since the since the pandemic, And as. We all know the pandemic is still. ongoing COVID is still around with us, but we're obviously returning to office. the need for community and and the ways that tech can stand up for itself.
Speaker: and defend that community. is still prevalent today so i continue to innovate on the on the community. We've just actually migrated from Slack to Discord. We're constantly finding new ways to improve our our members. time in the discord and in the virtual spaces.
Speaker: and du continue to try to build and grow and evolve. Jake, you said that identity fuels innovation. Can you share a moment where your identity directly influenced the decisions that you made?
Speaker: Oh, sure. i I... I think as queer people, we have this I want to say this very... positive stereotype about us that we have this need to be a pleasure to have it in class. or be that that really driven kid in school because you you know There's no sexual distractions, I suppose.
Speaker: And so... and ah So I graduated high school. I went to a very public high school here in... in the suburbs of New York. i I went to ah a liberal arts school, a small liberal arts school in upstate New York. in Ithaca, New York, central New York.
Speaker: And. I graduated college very early. A year early, I graduated at 20. And then I quickly went into the job. into the professional world. Every step of of that journey alone was driven by my identity. I moved quickly because of...
Speaker: my need to kind of escape the smaller world and get into a bigger world. Ithaca College. A fantastic story. school, a fantastic liberal arts school and a very, very queer friendly school. But where I was in this intersection of... being queer and also business just didn't seem to blend as much as I expected it to.
Speaker: and so My, my. quest to get out of. I'll call it rural. It was like a real, I mean, it's 40 square miles surrounded by reality is one of the taglines at Ithaca. But the idea of getting out of Ithaca and into New York and being in this big urban space.
Speaker: was really important to me and finding that community. And then as i I constantly go back and and give presentations to Ithaca. mostly virtual. but Whenever I'm getting giving presentations to young people or as an alum,
Speaker: I... Always. I explained one significant story in my career. In 20... 2013, 2014, I was leading a retailer and trying to move into ah a tech vendor.
Speaker: Adobe. It was my first i'm ah I'm a boomerang to Adobe. So it was my first go around. And I was interviewing. And while I was interviewing, I... I casually mentioned my my boyfriend.
Speaker: Same person i'm I'm now engaged to. And I did that. very purposefully just to see the reaction that my interviewer might have. It was a straight. That's great guy. And I was saying, oh yeah, on the weekend, my boyfriend and I do X. And I just go there.
Speaker: waiting for some sort of reaction. And there was none. And that really spoke volumes to me because it meant that. meeting myself and bringing my truest self to so to work every day would not be a problem.
Speaker: In other places where I had interviewed, where I've said boyfriend or I've... I've never been like. very closeted, but i've i've there have been times where I've had to keep my, especially in consulting, I've had to bring my identity or tone down my identity.
Speaker: you find that bringing your truest self is how you're going to get your best out of your employees. And so I say that to every student you're interviewing. a company just as much as they're interviewing you. And if you want to bring your best self to work and your best...
Speaker: work to work. You have to bring yourself and your true identity. I want to just talk really briefly about the Syncing Up podcast. Oh. and Which... highlights identity -driven innovation with with your guests that you're interviewing. Start off by telling our listeners.
Speaker: What was or is... the gap in our tech ecosystem. that. this project is trying to fill. Thank you. yeah You mentioned at the very beginning, we talked a little bit about bringing identity and And. tech together. And I don't even talk about my podcast, which really is embarrassing for me. But yeah this is a a really ambitious project that I took on last December.
Speaker: I... i'm a i'm ah I'm a podcast fan. i In my some of my darker days of. The last. call it 10 -ish years of of politics and the world.
Speaker: and life -changing i've turned to podcasts as a way to distract myself from news or i to distract myself from life at times. And some of the... My favorite podcasts.
Speaker: touch on on real life stories. They touch on real people. I'll take you all. And where I wanted to... bring, and I found this way with Allen Tech to to bring this story to life.
Speaker: was how could we... tell help tell the stories of our members. Alan Tech boasts. About 40 ,000, 45 ,000 members worldwide that have been to events, that have joined our listserv.
Speaker: and that is truly a globally if folks in the middle east were being queer or being trans is illegal. We have over 11 ,000 members here in New York on our listserv alone. yeah We typically sell out.
Speaker: of our free events but Out. 200 300 400 people we get to events. So it is a ah very large community. And that means everyone has a story to tell. And especially in the in the tech world.
Speaker: There are really interesting stories and maybe tech related and maybe what you're doing with tech. So we're syncing up. I wanted to highlight Real people?
Speaker: Not celebrities, not... i always tell I always tell people, when I started this podcast, it was because... I was in in university around 2011, 2012. where some athletes started coming out.
Speaker: We saw some NFL stars starting to come out a couple years later. We had some. actors and actresses starting to come out. And that's that's big news. But it shouldn't.
Speaker: It's not the norm, right? or we don't we don't We're not all celebrities. We're not all athletes. We're not all famous people. We we are real. ball. And so the idea was to bring... real people with their real stories and how their identity.
Speaker: help shape their innovations, whether it's their day to day at work, whether it's building a new startup or launching a new project. How does their identity? Ring the bell. represent itself or showcase itself. in in that project and so that's what syncing up has been and since then i've had I've had startup founders. who've also sold their businesses, which is awesome because I had them on before they sold their businesses. I've had both of you.
Speaker: I've had folks who came out just years ago, but have been in ah in their professional career for over 20 years and host. and and Have. see CMO level titles. And so watching the progression of of those kinds of folks who say, oh, when I started my career, I was a straight cis woman. And now I'm i'm a lesbian, a cis lesbian. but that changed the trajectory of of the work that I do.
Speaker: Or I started working on this bank. even though I studied poetry in school. Or I was a... I... i i i i did I had one member. ah non -binary black person.
Speaker: male presenting. And. they They spoke openly about... They're... their artwork and how their photography, their art, their desire to be in that world has led itself, has has led... has led the the work has led itself to.
Speaker: helping them build their cybersecurity work. And it's all really fascinating because you don't think about how each of these little moments in life. Help build the collage of what you're becoming.
Speaker: And that's really what I want to tell because I didn't have that in school. I didn't have... real nonmiionaire non non -billionaire Peter Thiel -esque or... Word. Tim Cook -esque.
Speaker: folks who who i could say oh i want to be like them when i'm alive or when i'm when i'm older ah ten Peace. So just... I... Yeah. I said what I said. Yeah.
Speaker: but So that's what I thought about. So that's why I want to launch once launched this was that. everyday folks could tell their everyday stories, inspiring everyday people. and And I'm really proud of it. I just recorded my 16th episode.
Speaker: So. 10 episodes in the first season. I'll have another 8 or 10 episodes in the second season. And yeah, I am doing it by myself. I have two. crappy microphones from the TikTok shop.
Speaker: I have Adobe Podcast. Thankfully, i so I work at Adobe, so I have access to Adobe Podcast. And yeah, and I have a hope and a dream to make things better. I love that. So you're talking about The intersections of tech and and identity.
Speaker: And for me. i'm not a tech person and i get pissed off when i i can't even use my phone correctly and that's a true story yeah and so that that also means that it's not too many people of us that people that look like me are are folks that are impacted by tech the most that are sitting at the table right and so how do you make sure that the queer community are not just users of tech, but that they also are architects in the field of tech.
Speaker: It's a great question. i Back when I was starting with Slack, that the virtual community and lack of the time. I would often try to get my friends to just join the stack.
Speaker: They'd say, well, I don't work in tech. I work in medical. Or I work in, I'm in accounting. I go, but yeah, you use a computer, right? Like you're using you're doing x rays. That's tech. And you're doing, you're in Excel and you're doing blah, blah, blah. And that's tech, right?
Speaker: And so. I think we need to as a as a community and i mean this as a broad sense like we as people need to recognize that almost everything we do in this world is touching technology in one way or another.
Speaker: Should I mention using your phone? I. I am. I'm also i I have two phones and I hate using both them. because I just, I need analog life. but they are part of my everyday.
Speaker: I constantly have technical questions or I want to do something and it doesn't seem logical. So that's a ah technical problem. Our world is being upended by AI, and inserting itself into every asset into every facet of our lives.
Speaker: End. in some ways good. In some ways, AI is helping us be more productive or find new cures. I suffer from m MRSA. a What's it called? a so It's a virus.
Speaker: It is a... The disease, that it's a skin disease, skin board disease, but I'm blanking on the name. But... AI. like AI help. start to crack how we can. Sure. I'm immersive.
Speaker: So in some ways it's really good. In some ways it's changing or harming. some of our careers And so we have to be on the lookout. of of how that's ah impacting us. I'm not here to, I'm not trying to defend AI in one way or another. That's not my goal. My intention here is to simply say we are being impacted by technology every single day, whether that's hardware, software.
Speaker: like large inwards models. And it's... R. responsibility to ourselves and our and others. just to understand that and say, How can this help me? Or how can this help? How could this help others?
Speaker: I'll give you one more example. i Am I? In my podcast, I had a... I'm gassed. Join. Who is? Singaporean. And he came here, he came to to New York.
Speaker: That's a study. he went to law school here in New York. and in doing so he actually started an out in tech chapter at his school and that's great that was awesome But ultimately, And most recently, he's built a...
Speaker: startup where he hosts dinners. for people and he invites queer people or all people. Different communities do dinners and they buy tickets and they get to meet people and it's like a whole activity. And you might say, okay, where's the tech part? Well, the tech part is how do you enable that?
Speaker: How do you scale that? how do you look How do you market that? And so that's what we say. Tech is not just simply. codes on a page or or codes or scripts. is It's how we interact with and get words out. It's how do we communicate with the outside world.
Speaker: And so I think if we look at it from that kind of lens. We're all impacted by tech every single day. Before we go to... break. I just want to ask then. You're speaking of, well, beginning as a Slack, but now as a Discord, as part of out in tech. Are the kind of conversations that are happening on that platform really kind of. giving you a sense of.
Speaker: The Discourse Or what is that what is that kind of, what is that discourse on around tech in that space with respect to LGBTQ people on on Discord? What are you...
Speaker: What are the insights that you're kind of like? Yeah, that are floating to the top as you kind of. to see what kind of conversations are happening. Hoo boy.
Speaker: the The reality is, is that Discord, I'll... Umbrella at as the virtual community. It is a vast community around the world. we have So.
Speaker: I basically, when I brought up everything over to Discord from Slack, we migrated about. 200 plus channels. of different sort of topics. And those topics include. job based roles, I started the slack very much as a professional space. And we so we started on slack because we wanted people to be able to see the community while they were at work. This is pre -pandemic. We were in the office.
Speaker: And so most of the channels that we created were very. business focused, they were ah channels for engineers and developers. They were channels for marketers. They were channels for UI UX. It was very career business focused.
Speaker: But then we started getting to a challenge of The sub communities or these subtopics. Well, there's health tech and that's different than. than generic tech because we have more regulations. we have cannabis and cannabis is a growing field where People use blockchain to track. cannabis around and we have laws governing cannabis and then we have legal. And while legal is itself is not a technical career per se.
Speaker: I just had a guest on the podcast who... has a legal tech career because that's what he really wanted to pursue. And that's a growing field. And so we went from this very...
Speaker: Again, um umbrella -based approach. 2. more hyper -specific professionally. But then we'll be found. was more and more people wanted a essential space to communicate. They wanted community. wherever that might be.
Speaker: And to evolve from... business -like questions or professional -based questions. 2. Just general community. it became we have a lot we have a multiple neurodivergent but We have multiple private communities. Use for the neurodivergent. Communities for for a tree for trans and non -binary community.
Speaker: We have and i I. They are private. Because. They deserve their own space. as communities, and then they are also public spaces that there are more. public discourses. We have communities for people over 40.
Speaker: We have communities for parents or want to be parents. We have arts and crafts -based communities. And... And so this really has... blossomed into a holistic space where people can come and and and hang out.
Speaker: And. communicate about whatever is on their mind, questions, topics, just the need to vent. and it's become a really beautiful space for people to congregate around the world. Daniel, we can't hear you.
Speaker: Can you hear me? Yes. Very strange. Okay.
Speaker: It's time to take a very short break, but please stay tuned for this episode of Power Beyond Pride, where we are in conversation with Jake. 10 and bomb.
Speaker: Welcome back. This is Power Beyond Pride, a queer change making podcast. And I am Daniel W .K. Lee with my co -host. Sean, Aaron, and we're getting technical with Jake Tenenbaum.
Speaker: The intersection of tech. and identity. And the meaning of inclusion is challenged. by both the ways tech can be deployed And. Ooh, tech. companies invest in.
Speaker: Clearly, in cases... It's... Outright. counter -liberatory Example. would be human rights campaigns, financial relationships are long. financial relationships with arms manufacturers.
Speaker: Bye. north of Grumman and X. Sorry, RTX, formerly Raytheon. In what ways does inclusion and intersectionality need to be critically expanded?
Speaker: so that LGBT people don't just become part of companies, systems, and structures. that aren't working towards the liberation of all people. Hang, you're hitting me with some hard questions now.
Speaker: but and It's a great question. The... I think. There's, there's a. multitude of ways that I look at this. The beginning I'll say is...
Speaker: We live in a capitalist society. And so. A lot of us are... going to take on Texas. jobs or or tech roles to make money to have. a certain lifestyle. That's just the reality. of kind of why we do things.
Speaker: But I've always said that. you can separate your day job from your gay job. That's what I've tried to do with Owntech. i I work a day job that i that affords me my lifestyle and allows me to then volunteer my time.
Speaker: and or my money. with activities or projects or... or organizations that i I believe are better and more supportive. of the ones I'm going for.
Speaker: So. When I look at companies, I... I think that we have clear distinctions to make. We have to decide if we want to work for those types of companies who don't support us. If it means... having livability.
Speaker: I think everyone. has a right to. to survive at this point. without intonation. But at the same time, if you can... find those jobs and you can give back in some way, whether it's giving money, whether it's giving time, whether it's giving...
Speaker: an hour a month. to mentorship or volunteerism. i think it's really important to do so and And last and not least, I... The last two things I'll say on this is... Number one.
Speaker: We're in a really weird time right now. companies that used to be very supportive of the LGBTQ plus community. and other I'll say like other interest -based organ. other interest -based.
Speaker: or diversity -based. Oops. ah Call it. DEI if you want to. are under attack. Right. where're we're if we're trying to so If you're a tech company.
Speaker: you're likely trying to do business with the government in one way or another. And. Obviously, that's that's not really beneficial to a lot of companies right now. And we forget that DEI does not just mean LGBTQ+. plus It means... Accessibility.
Speaker: Right. It means. ethnicity based. It means a lot of its accessibility. It's equity. And. Yeah. It's a really nuanced term that I think people are just putting umbrellas on.
Speaker: And so. Because of that, We can't judge every company for their actions, I think, over this course of time. Alex. I don't think it's fair to the to the companies. It's definitely not fair to the employees, but it's certainly not fair to companies who are just trying to...
Speaker: I'm gonna hate myself for saying this, but keep the shareholders happy. So that's that's one thought on it. the other part is is that even if companies are not sponsoring DEI -based events. there are still organizations internally.
Speaker: I can think of and quite a few different companies that I'm close with that. Bye. are trying to distance themselves from the DEI terminology. but still have yeah ERGs that are.
Speaker: pride -based or women -based or gender -based or faith -based. And those are still really important. And so when i when I go back to that question, I i asked the recruiter or... the When i I mentioned before in the earlier section.
Speaker: about how I told my future manager about how I was spending time um with my boyfriend over a weekend. Back in 2014, I think that's our job as as LGBTQ plus people.
Speaker: just by simply saying, here's who I am. You can take it or leave it. the more that we ourselves... bring ourselves to our to work. and to interviews and to real life, the the more present we can be.
Speaker: I love what you said, separating your day job from your day job. i love that and it's almost like the the the robin hood effect of like yeah i'm gonna work here i'm gonna take your money But I'm also going to take that money and put it towards causes that mean something and within the community.
Speaker: And DEI is a kind of an umbrella effect. And I think that that's intentional, right? Because they want to. to use that. DEI is just about LGBTQ folks, right? So folks could be against it.
Speaker: And so we're living in this this age of AI, right? whether we like it or not. And so what role do you think AI can play in shaping a safer, more inclusive workplace for queer people? But also on the flip side, what what gives you pause about AI?
Speaker: And where do we need to be more careful and intentional about it? Yeah. Oh good question. So. AI. yeah I always think back to this story. i'm I'm going to try my best to not be a. to not call out the company that did this, but a very large tech company was releasing a Tech. product.
Speaker: for gaming purposes. And when they were doing testing, they did not test with black people. End. when they started using when when black people started using this device which was a a camera,
Speaker: I did not recognize the bot people who were using it. And. That was a. Disaster. for this tech company. I use that as a representation for all sorts of tech and all sorts of innovation. If we don't have folks from all.
Speaker: different viewpoints and all different representations. helping us build products. We won't. Deliver. We won't deliver holistic products. We won't deliver products that mean.
Speaker: something to everyone. And then today is. in today's internet and today's Globalism. community We as marketers, we as technical folks, we have to get products out there that as many people can use them as possible. That is... One of our biggest goals is to build.
Speaker: products that capture the market. And so. When I think about AI, I think about what does... the language model. what inputs is does What inputs does the late... language model have. Are we?
Speaker: giving fair and accurate and Unbiased. information. If so, Let's... And that let's use that with... the we We need to use those models more frequently.
Speaker: If we don't use those models and we give our attention to worse models. those models will succeed. I think specifically about I'm trying my best to like knock all people out right now, but I will call this one out.
Speaker: I think. Rock. is a is a model that is... wildly. biased. Study after study shows it. Its team is constantly... Putting more.
Speaker: un fact -checked or or proven wrong information into it. Waiting. And that's hurting you. people. But I think as As the world goes, the more that we don't use. Rock.
Speaker: The more we don't give it data, the more we... prevent ourselves from from leveraging it. the less it will be utilized. And the lesson. and the less but trust it will receive. And. I think we have our we have power in that choice.
Speaker: I'm really really proud of Adobe. Because we and our AI models. Heaven. trained on data that our customers let us use. We pay for our data. We were at the inaugural aspect of of content authenticity, making sure that we watermark our our AI generated. content So it's our job, again, as queer people, as citizens of the world. to...
Speaker: Stand up for the tech that you believe in. Don't use, just simply do not use it. Go on protest. Go on strike. Do not use the tech that you find problems with. because I promise you that there will be a ah substitute for it. It may be more expensive. It may not be. as perfect as the one that there.
Speaker: but the more attention and the more market and the more value you give to Better products for you. the better they those products can rise and can do what we want them to do. Right on. Sounds like.
Speaker: A approach would be. kind of making Mark the market. Like... to be the corrective rather than regulation. And.
Speaker: I don't know if i'm if I buy all that either, because I could it because i do think, in a way, like something like ah a Grok, which is intentionally... creating misinformation is kind of akin to false advertising. And I think that's actually quite dangerous. and i intervention. is perhaps necessary because it's not.
Speaker: It's it's virulent. It's not benign. Right. as i expert It's malignant rather than benign. and ah And it's... more than just saying, just don't use it. Although I'm sure that would really create the death knell to.
Speaker: to the company. It doesn't curb other people or other companies that kind of do something similar. and kind of get away with it right But. Still on track.
Speaker: Yeah. I was going to say. I agree with you. And I think in an in an an idealistic world, that's the we would hope that our government and our practices would help that. But we look at ah we we exist in a world in which...
Speaker: we've had years and years of malignant or malicious. On. fact regulated false advertising. What's called news is not news. It's entertainment.
Speaker: Right. We live in this world where we. We had lawsuits that specifically called out defamation. and didn't do much of anything. So... to hope and to want for. government intervention or any sort of intervention, legal intervention to to take hold and take up these issues.
Speaker: I agree with you but i don't think it's realistic in this print in this current reality that we're in right now. Which is why I say. If we don't use... I use grok as an example. If we don't use grok,
Speaker: There are many. IDE is that. could use Grok. that also would be punished if they did, right? So cursor or... I was i used Cursor for for months developing my startup.
Speaker: I definitely didn't use Grok, and I... or see them. getting punished if people if people saw grok saying i'm not gonna use crop cursor because they support rock. And then it becomes kind of. this very fascinating world of what's going to actually...
Speaker: cause pain and And that's where we make those decisions as consumers. Yeah, I mean, I think a a multivalent approach is always going to be. be a way to kind of i To curb.
Speaker: Yeah, malicious kinds of. but products and technologies and stuff like that. I mean, which is all kind of... kind of brings me to my next question, which is looking to the future.
Speaker: What to you? does tech look like in the next 10 years. If. This is kind of as a thought experiment if if it leans towards a more kind of just and equitable. space.
Speaker: For me, a lot of. I'm an ecologist. general general like tech in general. is democratizing access. Allowing. folks of all backgrounds to to build out and leverage technology.
Speaker: the more that we can. provide more access to different tools, I think we're going we're in for a really fascinating ride. as people standing up their new shops. I think we've we've been over we've been on rides of of dropshipping and blockchain and NFTs. And we've seen a lot of bells and curves. and I think.
Speaker: Some of them... provided access to people that didn't necessarily have it. This one. This specific chain, AI. is the first. big interruption or the big interrupter that allows people to, of all I think it allows all people to access.
Speaker: new information. new abilities and the and new access new abilities is and D. Opportunity. to have real world implications in a really positive way for themselves.
Speaker: Absolutely. We're gonna take a... Short break here. Stay with us because we'll be back with our speed round of questions. We'll get to know Jake just a little bit better.
Speaker: Welcome back to Power Beyond Pride. I am Sean Aaron here with my co -host Daniel WK. Lee, and we are having a very interesting conversation with Jake Tannenbaum.
Speaker: So we're going to go and jump into our speed round of questions. Okay, let's do it. And I promise I will do my best to be. Not so verbose. But it may.
Speaker: Don't make any promises you can't keep. I know. The minute I said it, I was like, oh, damn it. So the first question, what's one tech gadget you cannot live without besides your two phones?
Speaker: Besides my two phones, recently it's been... a device that I can scroll through TikTok with from ah my finger. and allowed me to knit while scrolling tiktok And I love it.
Speaker: ah What is this device that you just... It's honestly is so sad. But it's like ah it's just a little remote thing. It has an up, down, and like button. And I just sit here knitting and I just like, I like knit, I scroll, I knit, I scroll. And that's.
Speaker: Yeah, it's become my my daily gadget. The. pull from. It's... It said it. For anyone who can't see it for our listeners, it's like a ring. yeah That basically enables...
Speaker: Brain rot. Oh, that's hilarious. That's hilarious. All right, next. If you could describe your relationship with technology in one word.
Speaker: What would it be? Oh. relationship technology. abuser but ah i I think a lot of people can say that.
Speaker: i i I used so much tech. i'm ah We talked about this. I'm on my i'm on my computer and my phone about 10, 12 hours a day for my day job, my day job, my my podcast, my... startup that I'm working on.
Speaker: So I'm i'm using... the absolute limits of my MacBook Pro. I've used and abused multiple AI solutions and tools to build my vibe -coded app. I am a power user of.
Speaker: on my fitness apps because I i track of everything on that. So. i Sorry to the tech world, I'm using all the tools. and Yeah. Where do you turn to for inspiration? Is it music, movement, or meditation?
Speaker: Definitely music. over meditation. I cannot meditate. Cannot turn this brain off. I. I get inspiration from a lot of places. Music is is a top place. it Actually, my startup is built for the music community. So a big fan of of music.
Speaker: But I'll also say. in real life events. IRL moments. I... When I'm walking down the street, I very rarely have my phone in my hand unless I'm playing Pokemon Go. And so. And I still play. Today is an event day.
Speaker: but I try to... really just either have AirPods in or have nothing in at all. And I'm just walking down and looking, seeing what's happening. What are people interacting with? What are problems people are facing? I think that helps.
Speaker: inspire me into building new solutions. changing how we're building solutions. or think about new ways to accomplish and solve problems. Right. I'm just going to take a quick... PSA moment here to kind of disabuse this idea that meditation is about calming the brain.
Speaker: It's actually about training your brain. It's actually about taking what you do with your brain and also... essentially, at least with certain traditions like letting go of the things that are kind of keep on running through your head.
Speaker: so you're like you think this and then you Exhale it. You let it go. So it's taking this kind of kinetic. insanity because I'm I find. Meditation is very difficult oftentimes too.
Speaker: But it's not really about shutting it. up It's actually about training it to do something, which is to. Two. to release all the kind of The insanity and maybe the. the voices experience as an as someone with ADHD and on the autism spectrum it is so hard for me to to do that.
Speaker: And I remember being very young and my mom and i and my grandmother. both trying so hard to help me go to sleep. Just like, please go to sleep. And I couldn't do it. These days I have.
Speaker: a sleep band with with Bluetooth. earbuds in them. And I just fall asleep listening to some crappy cartoon every night. Because that's the only way I can kind of. Let my brain.
Speaker: disconnect with what's going on in the outside world. so Well, what's the cartoon? i I said, which mean American dad. Futurama Family Guy. and solar opposites. Where's the crappy part? I mean, I could just listen to super cuts of Roger all day. That would be my dream TV show. That is.
Speaker: Roger was was revoted. like Drag queen of the year by Katya and Trixie. Truly iconic. I love Roger. I need a TV show just by Roger and I could watch that. ha Absolutely.
Speaker: Absolutely. All right, the next question. What's the most unexpected place you've... ever gotten a great idea. This on up. and And this, I think, Daniel, this touches on your point about Disconnecting or. like those moments I...
Speaker: Remember, I had an idea not too long ago where I was just sitting in the sauna here in my in my building. And. I was just in there sweating and like. Gross. ah And I just I had this idea of, oh, if I just.
Speaker: change this and and build this out, then this would solve this problem. And it kind of really. it gave It gave me the momentum to say, I need to start doing this more often. Because... To your point, like this, that for me was a meditation moment.
Speaker: They're not my all. most of the time I can't do it. But that one alone, I was like, wow, this was transformative for me. i I was going to say that my unexpected place, um it's not and innovation, but I actually had a...
Speaker: An artist, I commissioned an artist to do a piece. We were having a conversation and I told him that but I often have these These great lines of poetry come to me while I'm at a urine at the urinal. Okay.
Speaker: It's a beautiful moment for a lot of people. Sure. Like why not? Exactly. I know a whole community of people who would love to see that poetry. to say not part of it The poetry doesn't necessarily reflect the... The urinal experience. Yeah. yeah Definitely different from the Sana for sure. yeah or not so different because i don't know and yeah yeah
Speaker: I really love this question and as we had talked about tech, but if your life had a system update right now, what feature would you add? I need.
Speaker: A better. to -do list app. that I can just speak to and it shows up. i I have... all the i have all the assistants i have all the g home assistants i have all the phone assistants Nothing can do what I want to do where I simply... Whenever I have an idea of any sort,
Speaker: I just simply email email. email myself. It's usually an idea in the subject line, send it to myself. That's it. My inbox is usually hovering around one to two emails. and it's just my to -do list.
Speaker: And as soon as I do it, I archive it. That is all I need in this life. I've tried. i've I've had the notebooks on me at all times. I've had... the to do list app, I've had the notepad app, I can't remember to look at those things. So I just need something to say.
Speaker: Here's my here's my to do list item. Email it to me. I will be done. That is it. That's simplicity. Was that stunning? Was that like a so little fair moment? oh you kind of cut out a little bit oh damn okay i was like i stunned everybody You did. It was stunning.
Speaker: done by the concept of email i know it's wild What's your queer superpower in the workplace? Oh, I... I used to say this a lot and my manager told me I had stopp how to stop saying it. I am the personality hire.
Speaker: Yeah. He's like... She's like, you have to stop saying that you are like a principal and you are like the highest biller on this. the highests billing person on our team. You're not just personality hire, but I bring I bring the culture.
Speaker: I'm also... It's not necessarily the queer side of things, but I am a cis white dude and I know what privilege I have because I'm at the top of my team. And so I just ask questions. i'm the I'm the person who's kind of pushing buttons sometimes because I'm like.
Speaker: I have like I have that privilege. I'm going to help. the The non -cis white dudes is typically what I say. Early bird, colder or late night innovator? Yes.
Speaker: Peace. I do both. i Because at this time, like... I don't have enough. There's not a time in the day. So typically I wake up around 530 545 to go to the gym. I wake up, I'm at the gym. I'm a, yeah.
Speaker: and andrew I mean, Daniel, we're at the we're at the gym. Early in the morning, around 5, around 6 o 'clock, 6 .15, I'm going to... Get it done. I work out but five times a week. And then I work all day. And then when I'm building my app. There's just not enough time in the day. So typically I start coding when I get home on my app.
Speaker: usually around eight or nine o 'clock. And I finish, I'll hop back and into bed around 11 or 12. And so that's how and then the weekends are meant for a catch up on sleep.
Speaker: i've I just turned 47 and I've finally become one of these people that. Gets. six, seven hours of sleep. I've been a short sleeper all my entire life. So I would go until midnight and then wake up actually even been earlier around 4 a .m. Are you saying you'll come to me? Because i when I turned 35... 34. I turned 34. It just like all of a sudden it's like, oh, it's been four and a half hours. like Go pee and now you're awake for the rest of the day. like
Speaker: I think your body may have a reckoning because I literally have been doing this since I was like in junior high, sleeping five hours. And now suddenly. I'm kind of like, oh, no, you want to go to bed at 830.
Speaker: I mean, no, I doubt. Don't get me wrong. I want to do that. i just What to do? I highly recommend Sleepy Time Tea. ah It's like tea with melatonin in it.
Speaker: And it has been a savior for me to have a full night's sleep. Oh, I love the Sleepy Time. Sleepy Time with Lavender is... is one of my favorites. All right, next. Extra time is currently in my in my closet right now.
Speaker: What's a feature tech trend you're secretly obsessed with? if it's Even if it scares you a little bit. i think it's people's ability to build their stores. So we're seeing TikTok shops, we're seeing Shopify continues to build stores.
Speaker: I'm really bullish on people having that. A billet. People having the ability to open up their own stores, their own e -com stores. I haven't seen too many connected ones yet. I think the more sophisticated companies have these.
Speaker: interconnected. toolings, but I think we're getting closer and closer to especially with the help of AI, is helping people. run and a Shopify store that also connects to TikTok shop and also has an Instagram shop and letting people.
Speaker: build the world that they want to see if they were a consumer. That is where I see things going. Very cool. I don't indulge in a lot of TikTok shop. Ciao. Bing. But sometimes Timu gets me. I don't know.
Speaker: All right. that app does not help the adhd brain every time i i i'm like i don't know where i am What's going on? I am overwhelmed. Like it is.
Speaker: It is not. 10 ,000 choices. And I somehow always get three free. things. Every single time like this sucks. I hate this. So much. ifve If innovation were a love language, which one would be yours? Words of affirmation, acts of service, quality time, gifts?
Speaker: Acts of Charity. Hmm. And that goes for life. That's just, I'm an accept service guy. So I'm constantly like, like Doing things. I'm. I have this border of like...
Speaker: doing things like gifting because like it's still just giving That's kind of like my act of love. or my my love language. And so. F. If tech could just give me... More time?
Speaker: We solve all the problems. But reality is like the more agentic work that I work on and i I'm currently Starting next week, I have this project to build these interconnected agents to talk finish this, then hand it off to this, then do this.
Speaker: End slide. Give me back. time by doing things for me. That is... We're unhopeful. For sure. Our second to last question, what does power beyond pride mean to you?
Speaker: We. all have the responsibility. we We all have voices and we have to use our voices to stand up for those without or quieted voices. It means we stand up. When we have privilege.
Speaker: It means we give when we can. And it means that it is our responsibilities. responsibility as members of the community to consistently give back to their community.
Speaker: and show up for the community. and be there for the community. it is we are not Our whole personality is not. being queer or being a member of the LGBTQ plus community. if so all We offer so much more than that. So it's our job to continue delivering on that.
Speaker: Absolutely. And where can people follow you and your work? Instagram. My Instagram is jakedelon101. My knitting Instagram is... getting knit in the club And my startup is... Sound off the app.
Speaker: S -O -U -N -D -T -H -E APP. ah Sound off. Sound off the app. It's also sound off. app. dot io I'm on LinkedIn, Jake Dillon 101. That's where you can find me on all socials, all things.
Speaker: And come join Allantech, allantech .com backslash discord. You'll find me there. That's so awesome. Thank you so much for taking the time with. tip for being with us.
Speaker: We're out of time, unfortunately for the podcast. Bye. Please join us again. We'd love to have you back. Anytime. Thanks for having me. Appreciate it. Yes, and thank you again. Everyone can follow Jake in all the places that Jake mentioned. I am your co -host, Sean Aaron. He, him, his. And you can follow me on Instagram at themboysinc. And then my personal page is SeanAaron81.
Speaker: And I'm your co -host, Daniel W .K. Lee, and you can follow me at StrongPlum. On Instagram. and upscrolled and daniel wk lee at bsky .social on Blue Sky.
Speaker: Remember to subscribe and get your friends to subscribe to Power Beyond Pride on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and wherever you get your podcasts. And check out our site at powerbeyondpride .com.
Speaker: Power Beyond Pride is a project from a great idea, a queer owned design and content agency. Learn more about them at a great idea dot com. This episode is produced by Shane Lucas. Maddy Bynum is the project developer. Our editor is Jarrett Redding. With support from Ian Wilson.
Speaker: We are both part of this podcast also host team, and we invite you to send in your questions and comments at powerbeyondpride .com. Check out our new episodes each week and... We need look forward to queer changemaking with you next time. Thank you from all of us at Power Beyond Pride.
