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Preparing for Christmas
577 Plays10 days ago
In this episode, Rachel and Sarah from the PDA Society begins a timely conversation about Christmas, and how the build-up can feel exciting, intense, and sometimes overwhelming for PDA children, young people, and their families.
We explore why this season can bring extra demands, changes in routine, sensory overload and social expectations, all of which can increase anxiety for PDAers. We’ll talk through the early signs that Christmas is starting to feel “too much”, and how planning ahead with a low demand, relationship-led approach can help.
This first part focuses on understanding what makes Christmas challenging in the first place, and how shifting expectations, simplifying plans and prioritising emotional safety can lay the groundwork for a calmer festive period.
Key Themes
- Why Christmas can feel overwhelming for PDA learners and families
- The impact of increased demands, uncertainty and sensory load
- Noticing early signs of anxiety and overload
- Reducing pressure through flexible planning
- Prioritising emotional safety and connection over tradition
Deep Diver Subscriber Episode
For those who would like to go further, Part 2, an exclusive “Deep Diver” subscriber episode, is available through our Training Hub. You can access it here: https://training.pdasociety.org.uk/pda-podcasts/
Disclaimer
The views and opinions expressed by guest speakers in this podcast are their own and do not necessarily reflect those of the PDA Society. While we aim to provide balanced and inclusive discussions, individual experiences and perspectives may vary. The PDA Society is committed to using language and terminology that reflects the preferences of PDA and autistic people, but sometimes our guests may use language and terminology which differs. Appearance on our podcast is not an endorsement of an individual, and not all of our guests will align with our position on the issues discussed.
Further sources of support and information
- PDA Society Training Hub: https://training.pdasociety.org.uk/pda-podcasts/
- PDA Society Website: https://www.pdasociety.org.uk/
- PDA Society Training: https://www.pdasociety.org.uk/support-and-training/training/
- PDA Society Support Service: https://www.pdasociety.org.uk/support-and-training/support/
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Transcript
Introduction to PDA Society Podcast
00:00:02
Speaker
Hello and welcome to the PDA Society's podcast. We're here to chat about all things PDA to help you understand what people with this profile of autism are experiencing and how you can help.
00:00:13
Speaker
We'll be sharing research, professional expertise and the insights of people with lived experience to help you understand PDA and have more tools to make life easier. So, whether you're a PDA yourself, a family member, friend or professional trying to make a difference, welcome from everybody at the PDA Society. We hope you'll find this useful.
Meet the Hosts: Rachel and Sarah
00:00:38
Speaker
Welcome to the PDA Society podcast, where we share lived experiences and practical insights to help families, professionals and PDAs themselves feel more supported and understood.
00:00:50
Speaker
My name is Rachel. And my name is Sarah and we're both regular hosts of this podcast. Today we're going to do things a little bit differently though. We're going to be talking about Christmas. In the first part of this episode we'll be focusing in the run-up to Christmas and then in part two we'll talk about the big day itself.
Understanding Christmas Challenges for PDA Children
00:01:09
Speaker
So that lead into Christmas feels like that period that everybody else seems to love, but that can feel just like a minefield and so overwhelming when you've got a PDA child. There's so much that goes on during that period, isn't there? that That, you know, all the lights, the noise, that constant talk of presence and all those changes that go on at school as well. It's meant to be a magical time of year, but for some families, it's actually the most stressful time of year of all.
00:01:37
Speaker
Yeah, and especially when you think you might have somebody coming down your chimney that you don't know as well. So we're going to be chatting about the build up to Christmas and why it can feel so overwhelming. What's really going on beneath the surface for our PDA is and how we can perhaps make it a little calmer and more predictable and therefore more enjoyable for everyone.
00:01:56
Speaker
Fabulous. OK, so I guess, a group you know, sort of ah a best place to start really is, is why is that build up period so stressful and for families with PDA children? And like I guess, you know, if you think about the build up for Christmas for anybody, you know, you've got all the shopping that needs to be done, all the presents, working out who wants what and when to get them and is it in stock. You've got the decorating, you've got the the planning the day, all of that sort of thing. And everything seems to be focused on just that one day, isn't it? And whether it's good or whether it's not, it's all on on that day. So i guess it's, yeah you know, for everybody it's stressful. but But then when you throw sort of PDA into the mix as well, then you've you've also got anxieties, people's anxieties to manage as well, which can be really difficult, can't it? Mm-hmm.
00:02:50
Speaker
And if you think about it, we know that PDA is a really good at picking up on other people's emotions. And if as parents, carers, family members, we're stressed, you know, making a big deal out of it. They're going to pick up on that and that's just going to escalate their anxiety as well.
00:03:03
Speaker
Yeah. You get into that bit of a negative loop, don't you? In that, you know, sort of you're getting anxious. So then because you're your child's safe person. The PDA will pick up that, oh, my safe person is anxious. Maybe there is something to worry about. What is it? But they can't, they don't know what it is, which makes them more anxious. And then that just feeds in because then they're showing more distressed behaviours, which increases the anxiety of
Impact of Social Norms on PDA Children
00:03:30
Speaker
the parents. And we get into this whole loop of and negativity and difficult to to get yourselves out of, really, isn't it? It really is. It really is quite difficult. And I suppose it's all...
00:03:41
Speaker
expectation I suppose is at the heart of it really isn't it yeah well it's like you say you know there's the expectation that this only happens on one day once a year so everything has to go right because it can't be repeated the next day or in most families it can't be repeated the next day so yeah there's that um and and also the expectation that goes with it um You remember my kids, a granny had bought them a jumper each and it was absolutely hideous. and There was the expectation that you still have to look happy and say thank you you know All those unwritten rules that go with Christmas can be really, really anxiety provoking as well.
00:04:19
Speaker
Yeah, it's hard, isn't it? i mean Also, I guess that builds up to Christmas as well. It's that, you know, with all those changes in routines. So things like, you know, um nativity plays at school or different trips they go on at school. and You've got, and you know, all those Christmas activities, making different things. The Christmas jumper days, you know, sort of going back to the jumpers that you just mentioned.
00:04:46
Speaker
And I guess all that change... increases anxiety, doesn't it? Because it's not predictable. They're doing things that ah they don't normally do. And I, you know, just thinking about the the jumper one, they might have, there's expectation that you're going to wear the coolest jumper or whatever it might be, depending on, it obviously, depending on your child's, depending on the age of your child.
00:05:09
Speaker
But that adds extra pressure, isn't it? Because when they're all in uniform, well, everybody's the same and no one bats an eyelid at what anyone's wearing. But when everyone's wearing it's like the non-uniform days, but if they've got the Christmas jumper day, then everyone's looking focused on that jumper, which just layers on more expectation and pressure for PDA children.
00:05:29
Speaker
um Yeah, and also we know that PGAers have a heightened um intolerance of uncertainty, so that fear of the unknown. So if things are changed at the last minute or, you know, lessons are replaced by rehearsals or, you know, mum's acting a bit odd, you know, she's been to the shops 10 times already this week, unless the child's got clarity on why that's happening, it can be really, really unnerving. It's just like, you know, everything's everything's changed. Yeah.
00:05:56
Speaker
Yeah,
Reducing Anxiety Through Choices
00:05:57
Speaker
yeah. And i I think, you know, some of the things that can help, I guess, is how is, you know, letting them choose their Christmas jumper, for example, involving them in what they want. I know my PDA yeah already has two Christmas jumpers just in case he's going to need them. and and And he's a particular one that he really, really loves. He has a Christmas T-shirt, which I always thought, well, why have a T-shirt at when it's Christmas? Because it's cold. But no, he insists on wearing this T-shirt. In fact, it had its first outing this weekend.
00:06:31
Speaker
And my PDA-er is obsessed with McDonald's, as are many PDA-ers. And it's a McDonald's Christmas jumper. He thinks it is a T-shirt rather. He thinks it is absolutely wonderful. And had it it had its first outing this weekend. I should say we're we're sort of midway through November at the moment when we're recording this. So we've gone early this year.
00:06:53
Speaker
But things like, you know, those those nativity plays, they're lovely, aren't they? They're lovely to watch as a parent. But for the child, it's really, really difficult, isn't it? Because you've got, you know, we often talk when we when we do training for around PDA about expectation and lowering, you know, sort of try to remove expectation because expectation brings anxiety.
00:07:18
Speaker
Whereas is when they're asked to perform in a play, it might not be the natural place for many kids. For some kids, they'll love it. My daughter would loved it. But for my PDA son, I can remember his first nativity play, and I think he was um a shepherd, but he was a shepherd that was lying down behind the back of the stage, point blank, refusing to stand up. And every now and again, his one-to-one would literally just pick him up, hold him up in the air so I could see him to get photographed.
00:07:47
Speaker
And then we'd let him lie back down again. It's like, why are you putting him through that? You know, it's just there' there's no need is there. There really isn't. Yeah. And again, if you think about it, you know, the nativity play, that's a massive demand. But within that, there's lots of micro demands as well. It is like, you know, getting dressed in your costume. um You know there's learning your lines, um you know, having to be quiet when everybody else is speaking, um not standing up and waving at your your parents, even though most kids do and that's really cute. But it's just absolutely loaded with those little tiny micro demands. and That is just like shaking that can of Coke for every demand that's placed on them. So it's no wonder that you get the avoidance and the lying down at the back of the stage because it's just so overwhelming. You know, they just can't cope with all those little tiny demands. It is, isn't it? And that's...
00:08:39
Speaker
It's the sensory stuff as well, I suppose, in the nativity play as well, isn't it? Because they've got, you know, there's lights on them, they're on the stage, there's noise, there's lots of people, there's lots of strangers sitting in the school hall in front of them that they don't know. i know You know, all the parents and the relatives and what have you. So there's the costumes might itchy and all that sort of thing. So it's there's a lot of stuff that is out of the ordinary. And we know that for many PDA children, It's that things that are that fear of the unknown, that not knowing what they're going into as they're walking into that hall for the first time when all the parents are
Strategies to Manage Sensory Overload
00:09:15
Speaker
there.
00:09:15
Speaker
It's huge overwhelm, isn't it? It's really, really difficult. And and maybe they're not getting those demand free times that we know are really important for to help them regulate again.
00:09:28
Speaker
and i Yeah, yeah. I mean, even, you know, if you're in a mainstream classroom and they're allowed to bring games in for the day or something like that, you know, that might feel like non-demand time for a neurotypical child. But for a PDA, you know, having to play a game at a certain time or, you know, obey rules that go along with that game or share all the social stuff that goes along with that. Again, they're all just micro demands. Yeah.
00:09:53
Speaker
Yeah. So i think, it's you know, it's really important that we acknowledge all of that, but what's going on. And, you know, as I say, we're recording in this sort of, you know, mid-November and that's all going on already, isn't it? That's already going on for our kids. So there is no wonder that, you know, from now, really, that some of this overload starts coming in, some of these you know, the more the anxiety gets increased and we can't as parents, we can't always put our finger on why. But actually, it's all this little, little changes, little changes, increasing that fear of the unknown and that intolerance of uncertainty is going to lead to overwhelm for our kids. And also, you can't walk anywhere now at the moment, can you, without list hearing Christmas music? It's in all the shops. It's all it's like as soon as Halloween is out the way, isn't it? That's all. Everyone is full on Christmas. That's really hard, isn't it? It's just sensory overload, isn't it?
00:10:49
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, I walked into our garden centre on Saturday and, yeah, like you say, Halloween is now gone and the next thing, it is just mass, you know, full-on Christmas. And how many weeks away is Christmas? About five or six? know. just thinking, oh, my goodness, we're going put up with this all that time. Yeah.
00:11:06
Speaker
Yeah, it's the so the constant repeat of the songs. You've got all of the decorations up everywhere. So everywhere... Feels a little bit more enclosed, doesn't it? It doesn't feel as open and as clean lined as normal because every shop's got all the decorations up. and And it's busier as well, isn't it?
00:11:23
Speaker
Totally. And that is sensory overload, doesn't it? With lots of lots of people, which means there's lots more unpredictability going on. There's and more noise, et cetera, et cetera. And it's just really, really, you know, complete overwhelm, I think, for many PDA
Balancing Expectations and Reality
00:11:40
Speaker
individuals. And I said also...
00:11:43
Speaker
that You also have them, in all of these images that we have around Christmas, whether they be in the decorations, whether they be in the shop posters or whatever it might be, they're all of people enjoying themselves, being happy, having this perfect Christmas. And I think, again, then, that just adds pressure, doesn't it? It adds pressure for the PDA, but it also adds pressure for their family in that, oh, well that's what maybe we should be like, but our family Christmas doesn't look like that, you know, where we're all sitting around watching each other open one present at a time, nice and carvedly, and the paper's not flying halfway across the room. You know, it's that, it just doesn't happen, does Yeah.
00:12:23
Speaker
but And then, you know, there's the expectation that everybody sits around the dinner table together and has a lovely family meal and, you know, pulling crackers and and all that sort of stuff. I mean, you know, I absolutely love Christmas. It's great. But you can see how you know totally overwhelming it must be because, you know, it's almost implied that there isn't a choice. You know, that's it. You will sit down and we will eat Christmas dinner together. You will pull a cracker. um And I think, you know, as parents, one of the most helpful things can be to, you you know, change that mindset that you may not have a typical family Christmas, there may not be, you know, the meal together, but that's okay. You know, it's whatever you need to do to make sure that you have an enjoyable time or, you know, a less stressful time um by putting in place those adjustments and just managing your own expectations.
00:13:10
Speaker
Yeah, I think it it's i think for for certainly for me, the the the but when I suddenly thought, OK, right, that this is my ideal family, Chris, is in my head, if this is not gonna how how this is going to play out.
00:13:25
Speaker
We're not all going to sit down around the table necessarily at the same time. We're not all going to be eating the same food. As soon as I let my PDA have hash browns fish fingers for his Christmas dinner... that calmed everything. As soon as I let him have it an hour earlier than everyone else was ready to eat, that helped calm things. And it's all those little micro moments that actually, if I'm a little bit more in tune to what he's needing in those moments, then it means the anxiety drops for everybody. And then, you know, he's already eaten. If he wants to join us for a second meal, that's absolutely fine. But we can have ours in peace because I've already met his needs. So Yeah, it is that. it's It really is.
00:14:04
Speaker
It is definitely, definitely. and I guess when you've got and younger children as well, and it's all those in the run up to Christmas. I know we've it started in our house already. and The presents, it's the wish lists, it's Santa coming. It's all of those sort of thing. And the huge anxiety. My son came out the other day with,
00:14:28
Speaker
Yeah, well, I'm going be on the nice list, aren't I? am i Already wait he's come out with that. am i you know and It's like, yes, of course you are. It'll all be fine. but And then whenever he has a little blip and whenever we have a little sort of bit of a distress behaviour or a meltdown or whatever it might be, as he's recovering, he's delivering that line already.
00:14:48
Speaker
Well, Santa, no. Will
Gift-related Strategies to Reduce Anxiety
00:14:50
Speaker
I still be on the good list? I say, don't worry, everything will be fine. So it's about really how to how to manage that run in, not so much about on the day, but that build up to presence, isn't it? It's really hard.
00:15:03
Speaker
Yeah, and not forgetting Elf on the Shelf. I mean, I'm glad my children are older and we don't even have to bother with that. I've never, ever done it. But they I get stressed. Look at the parents posted on Facebook what their Elf's done that day. And I think, oh, my goodness, that would be just too much for me. so We did Elf on the Shelf for a very a few years. And um it was more stressful for us because we kept forgetting. Yeah. him We kept forgetting. And then my daughter, my older child, a good house, would just come up and go, i can see the elf hasn't moved then.
00:15:34
Speaker
was just like, I forgot. I went to bed. I was so tired, to forgot I So it's like we go creeping down the stairs at five o'clock in the moon morning to move the elf. It's just pressure you don't need, isn't it? Yeah, you read see you especially if you do look at Facebook and see what everybody else is doing. so I know.
00:15:51
Speaker
So we're thinking about then these sort of um different strategies that can help with this build up. Because again, you know, lots of, I know for my child, it's a hyper focus. We know that PDAs can get hyper focus and my child gets very zoomed in on what's he having, who's going to buy what. And he's almost allocated for every family member, they can buy me that, they can buy me that. And he's sort of like, well, they haven't actually asked yet. Yeah.
00:16:18
Speaker
what you want so it's like well but if they ask as I'll say that and he's like and who else can buy me a present and it's it's just so overwhelmed but it's that thinking about okay what could we do what can you do in advance particularly when presents start appearing under the tree if the people have given him a present and he's and he's got wait or something like that what's the types of things that that can help and I know one um One that family that I know had had mentioned that they give the main present at the beginning of December.
00:16:55
Speaker
So whatever their main present is, that first week in December, they give it then. So they've already got it. So that stops all that anxiety about, am I going to get it? Am I not for the whole of December when everybody else is getting all hyped up?
00:17:10
Speaker
Then safe and secure and know that actually I've already got it. I've got that. Ah, that's a nice idea. Yeah, because I hadn't really thought of it like that. You know, you do your wish list, but that's not a guarantee that you're going to get everything on it. So it's that, am I going to get it or not? And I heard about a family that used to put their presents all under the tree, yeah their PDA just couldn't cope with that. So they used to, because they didn't know what was in it, they wanted to open it. So they used to wrap theirs in clear cellophane.
00:17:38
Speaker
now on the pda is And put those under the tree so he could see what was in it. But he still had the pleasure on the day of actually you know being able to open a gift. Yeah.
00:17:48
Speaker
Yeah. Uncertainty about what's inside. Yeah. Yeah. i another that Yeah. that that That's a great idea. I love the cellophane idea. And also things like. popping them in gift bags just with some tissue on the top so they can peek but you they don't it's not obvious that they peaked so that that's of like you know reassures them but also keeps the pretense up that it's a surprise type thing but they but but they know and you know that they know what's in it yeah and um more what else what else have i heard so it's it's that it's that some families will give
00:18:22
Speaker
will have almost like a present, a small present a week. So they might keep the big present back, but they give smaller ones. So it's almost like easing that anxiety as you go, rather than holding everything back until the big day. So maybe keeping like emergency presents sort of in the cupboard that are smaller, you know, but still things that they would want, but it's just eases that tension and as you go. So that can help as well. And,
00:18:51
Speaker
And there was another what family that I knew who, but most of the time we we all do a lot of online shopping these days. So when the parcel for the Amazon parcel arrives or whatever it is, they open it, see what it is so they can see what they're getting. And then they let the parents wrap it.
00:19:10
Speaker
Ah, nice. Yeah. So they know what it is before it's wrapped, then it gets wrapped, then they put it under the tree. And actually that just, again, eases that anxiety, eases that build up, isn't it Because I think personally, whatever you can do to ease that build up, to you know, to cut the tension on that anxiety is going to help.
00:19:29
Speaker
Yeah. And it is, I guess, about managing expectations, you know, for a lot of neurotypical children, you know, actually that anticipation of am I going to get this gift or not is quite a nice thing. um but for pdas it can become intolerable so um yeah just you know you may have to manage expectations and if they ask for something that is totally unreasonable and it's not going to happen have that conversation in advance so that on the day ah you're not going to you know get that distressed behavior it's not going to be a surprise that i didn't get x y or zed um or i did get something and it's it's It's knowing that budget as well, isn't it? I think, again, knowing that, right, OK, what is the main thing? What the one thing that you really, really want?
00:20:10
Speaker
And is it in budget? And have that conversation well ahead of time. So, you know, you've got that main thing that they want. And they also know what the budget is. So particularly for older children, they are able to you know understand that and understand that, OK, there's a fixed a budget. what do you want you know What do you want us to spend that budget on?
00:20:31
Speaker
And then it's all agreed ahead of time. And again, that will reduce some of that intolerance of uncertainty. But yeah it certainly is a tricky a tricky period. It really, really is. And I guess as well that allows for some negotiation as well, which we know PDAs crave. So actually being able to being able to say let them say well actually I'd rather do without base but have that so yeah yeah definitely it's that cut and also yeah that's that collaborative working as well isn't it you know we we often talk in our panda approaches we talk about negotiation and collaboration and if you collaboratively deciding what they're having for Christmas then actually that feeds into that as well doesn't it so
00:21:10
Speaker
yeah so So we know that many PDAs become overwhelmed at Christmas and they're overloaded, particularly in that that build up to Christmas, but it might not always be evident on the
Identifying Signs of Anxiety in PDA Children
00:21:25
Speaker
surface. You know, you might have some internalizers. So what do you think might be some of the and the the sort of the keys, the tells, if you like, of of that the anxiety is building, but it's not necessarily showing on the surface?
00:21:39
Speaker
and And I guess one of the key signs might be that some unusual behaviours kick in um or, yeah um you know, sometimes they get focused on something that's totally irrelevant um or, you know, all of a sudden there's nothing in the house for breakfast and whatever you offer them, they just don't want. and you're thinking, what on earth is driving this behaviour? This is just bizarre. And, you know, again, in our training courses, we talk a about lot about the the iceberg.
00:22:06
Speaker
So, what you see above the waterline is only 10% of the iceberg and 90% of it's below. So it's a case of thinking, you know you know instead of just focusing on that 10% above the waterline, which is the behaviours you're seeing, take that step back and think what is it that's actually driving that behaviour. And you may well find that it's it's it's all linked to the expectations they build up to Christmas. But, yeah, you might just so suddenly notice something strange happening or a relapse in terms of some some distressed behaviours.
00:22:40
Speaker
um Yeah, that's that's something I would say. Yeah. And I suppose it's also it's it's looking for those tells, isn't it? You know, I know with my PDA, ah his tell when his anxiety is increasing, but he won't tell me that he's increasing. He starts to bite his sleeve.
00:22:55
Speaker
but so So it might not do it in front of me, but I look at the clothes and I can see whether it's been gnawed that day or not. And if it has, it's just like, OK, yeah, that anxiety is building. And, all you know, sometimes, you know, particularly again, particularly with older children, they will do they will self-regulate, but you've got to give them that space. So maybe they're needing more screen time.
00:23:15
Speaker
And maybe, you know, our initial thought as a parent might be, oh, you know, you're just pushing the boundaries, but actually, do they really need it? Because that screen time is helping them to regulate. I know screen time is certainly helps, is my PDA is regulating activity. So i think being flexible around that as well can really help because if if they need it, they need, you know, give them that opportunity to regulate because it's going to help calm those anxieties that they're internalising.
00:23:44
Speaker
And also looking out for things that they they normally really enjoy doing, but they won't that but they're pulling away from. because you know that that there are certain activities that they might but particularly enjoy. i know my PDA loves going to trampoline parks and burning off all his energy and loves that thrill of the bouncing. However, he will pull away from those sort of activities when his anxiety is increasing, because obviously those activities, even though he enjoys it, they have more, they have demands on them. Obviously he's got to wear certain socks. He's got the sensory stuff, but
00:24:19
Speaker
He pulls away from things that he likes to do. And that's, again, another tell for me that that anxiety is increasing.
Flexible Traditions and Exit Plans
00:24:25
Speaker
So it's certainly being hypervigilant as a parent, I think, isn't it? Right. It's very key.
00:24:31
Speaker
So what about family traditions then? and How can, you know, sort of many families have... traditions over Christmas, whether that be going to church on Christmas morning or Christmas Eve, maybe it's um going to Winter Wonderland when they're they all open. But what, you know, how how can those traditions be balanced with that PDA's need for regulation and maybe that their autonomy and their their need to make their own choices?
00:25:02
Speaker
yeah And, you know, just visiting family or having, you know, peep at the neighbours in for a drink, all very, very challenging. So I guess really the key here is is choice, you know, that these are the activities we would like to do However, it's your choice if you join in or not. Now, obviously, that depends on the age of the child. But I think definitely giving them some autonomy over whether or not they do the activity or they join in. is definite um and also having an exit strategy so if they decide they do want to go to church what happens if I start to feel overwhelmed when I'm actually in there so having that agreed exit strategy in advance so they feel safe and know that if you know I start getting anxious or overwhelmed that I can just walk out or I can you know tell mom and she will take me out
00:25:49
Speaker
Yeah, massively. I think i think giving them that having that flexibility so that they can either not go or you they can leave. I mean, I know i know I've um talked before about and when I first go into a new situation. So if I was taking my son to church, if I was taking him to an activity or whatever it might be.
00:26:10
Speaker
The first five minutes I'm on a complete and utter meerkat mode, looking at where my exits are, what's my fastest route back to the car and how quick I can get him out of there if I need to. And actually being prepared, thinking ahead um is is really, really important because...
00:26:27
Speaker
wait them The longer that we try to go, no, it's fine, you're fine, don't worry, you know, here's your phone or here's your iPad or whatever it it is that you think, oh, okay, well, I'll take that with me and it'll be fine because i you can just focus on his phone. Yes, that might be fine in some situations and it might be enough to get them through.
00:26:46
Speaker
But there are points that actually we've got to recognise that, you know, sometimes it's not going to be. And sometimes we need to leave. And as much as we might want to stay, then we need to leave. I know that we will, where we can, we will try and go in two cars so that one of us can stay with our other child and one of us can leave with our PDA ah if but if we if we're all able to go, that is. So it is it is about being able to adapt and be flexible, isn't it?
00:27:14
Speaker
in those moments that actually yes they are family traditions and they are lovely things to do but think are we all enjoying it or are they just things that we've always done because we did them with our parents and actually our kids don't actually enjoy doing them Yeah. And because they're not enjoying it, then we're not either. So you keep pushing for this, this utopia that is just never going to happen. So again, I guess it comes back to that point about managing our expectations as well.
00:27:45
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. And I think, yeah, expectations as well, I think as also, I just, I mentioned Winter Wonderland earlier, and I'm just thinking back to last, our last year's visits to Winter Wonderland, which was a complete disaster. and if that In that,
00:28:00
Speaker
My son had these expectations of that he saw these, you know, those stalls where you have to throw things. And then if you win, you get these giant teddies. Oh, yes. Well, unfortunately, he wanted to have a go in those. And I'd explained that, well, you know, nobody wins on those. You know, but but you can have a go, but you won't get a teddy. And then somebody walked past who had one family walked past with two teddies. And they're like, well, they've got them.
00:28:24
Speaker
I was like, okay, well, let's try. So we had to go. we had three goes. And it i was like, right, that's, you know, we spent 10 quid on this now. let That's enough now. Well, the most almost mightiest of meltdowns happened. And it was just like, I knew this was going to happen. I could see us walking into it, but I couldn't get us out of it anyway. Yeah.
00:28:46
Speaker
And it is, yeah, so it is thinking about getting those expectations out before you go Getting those, you know, let that if we go this year, it's like we're just going on the rides. We're not even going to attempt any of the stalls. We're just going on the rides. We all go on certain rides and ah all agree ahead of time. and Because otherwise it's just, you know, I mean, his little world's just collapsed, love him, last year when he couldn't get one of these toys. And I was almost felt like saying, let me just buy you one. Let me just buy you one of those where everyone can be calm, but obviously that's not going to happen. But yeah, it's it's difficult, isn't it? So it's balancing balancing their needs, balancing what the family want to do, isn't it? And balancing and sort of planning ahead, I think, is key.
Handling Teenage Rebellion and Past Trauma
00:29:28
Speaker
Yeah, and being really crystal clear on what but the the demand is going to entail so there are no surprises. Yeah. Or you can mitigate them as as best you can. Yeah.
00:29:42
Speaker
So I think a so for some PDA children, as they get older, they almost like reject this idea of Christmas. um so and And that's really difficult then, isn't it? Because especially when there's parents, we're looking forward to it and maybe other children are looking forward to it. And so then that can be really hard for parents and for the other children. So sort of what do you think might be behind that of why some children might pull away from Christmas as they get older?
00:30:11
Speaker
um Well, part of it could just be normal sort of teenage behavior and just that that rebellion. um You know, we all know Santa's real, but they might not, you know, they might decide they're not going to believe anymore because it's too childish or whatever. um And again, again i guess it's for all the reasons that we've spoken about, you know, the intolerance of uncertainty, um you know, all that sort of stuff. I think that it's key to, you know, validate their feelings if that's what they feel. That's what they feel. Don't try and talk them around to your way of thinking.
00:30:44
Speaker
um Just, you know, offer understanding. um and personally, that's what I would do and just just leave it at that. Yeah, and I guess sort of trying to recognise where they're coming from, as well as being sort of the as they get older bit. It could be, as you say, it could be the normal teenage stuff, but it could also be related to trauma, I guess. If Christmas has traditionally been a traumatic time for them and that that yeah period of stress...
00:31:11
Speaker
then it's reasonable to understand that actually they might not therefore look forward to Christmas as they get older because they've made those connections between Christmas is coming, I get stressed, I don't want to be stressed, therefore I don't want Christmas. And likewise, they're safe people get stressed as well.
00:31:27
Speaker
us So again, if that's showing their safe person is distressed, then again, why would they want to go? Why would they want to do that? So and very often with PDA is it's we understand the why, then we can understand how we can help. But if we don't understand the why, why maybe they're rejecting Christmas, then it's really difficult. But apart from the fact that we've got to respect how they feel.
00:31:49
Speaker
And give them that autonomy. So, no, that's fine. You know, we we want to do this. You're welcome to join us. But this is what, you know, this is what we're going to do. But we respect if you don't want to do that, if you want don't want to join in.
00:32:00
Speaker
um Well, I guess really in summary, you know, weve we've spoken quite a bit about the preparation and the run up to Christmas. um You know, it it can be very stressful, but it doesn't need to be. So I guess in summary, what are the key takeaways from this, Rach, do you think? I think the first thing for me is that preparation is absolutely key. and That's preparation for us in terms of our mindset and our managing our anxiety, but also preparation so that you can get that low demand environment.
00:32:31
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. And I think it's it's the planning ahead. It's the giving them their autonomy, you know, we there's as where as well as what we've talked about so far, I suppose there's all the socialising that builds up, you know, the socialising builds up. There's a lot more social occasions to go to. And again, give give that your child the autonomy. they want to come along, that's great. If they're there, you know, at ah in a restaurant, as you're having a family meal or group a fretier group a meal with friends and they want to be on their phone, let them be on their phone.
00:33:04
Speaker
You know, we need to recognise that they it is a stressful time for them. It is not all about the happiness and the joy. It is about the stress is going to be the primary feature for for many PDA children. So let them let them, you know, manage it the way that they can. They feel feel their own strategies and for managing. So yeah, ah planning ahead, giving them that that autonomy, thinking about how you can decrease that anxiety around presents. And we've talked about different ways that you could do that. m
00:33:37
Speaker
And also I think the most important thing is take the pressure off ourselves.
Focusing on Quality Time and PDA Resources
00:33:41
Speaker
As parents, we put so ourselves under so much pressure around Christmas. And um what's what is the most important thing that everybody's happy with?
00:33:51
Speaker
that we might have spent some quality time, whether that's individually with our individual children and and between ourselves and or as a family, it doesn't matter. If we've spent it together, great. If we've spent it separately, that's also great.
00:34:05
Speaker
Yeah, lovely. Yeah. OK, that's brilliant. So if today's conversation has resonated with you, then please do remember that you're not alone and that there is support out there for you. You can find more resources, guides and community support on the PDA Society's website and hub. And we put lots of links in the show notes for you. If you found this he episode helpful, then please do share it with somebody else who might benefit. And don't forget to subscribe so you don't miss any future conversations.
00:34:34
Speaker
Remember, we also have part two, our deeper dive section of this podcast, where we talk about how Christmas Day itself can increase anxiety and strategies to make the day a little bit more manageable.
00:34:46
Speaker
If you'd like to listen, then please just head over to our training hub. So thanks again and for listening. and Please do take care of yourselves. and And from Sarah and I, please do have as relaxing a Christmas as you can.
00:35:00
Speaker
Thank you. So if you want to hear more from today's special guest, then there is a longer version of this podcast available over on our training hub. Sponsors of our training hub make it possible for us to create and put out this podcast for everyone for free.
00:35:15
Speaker
As a thank you, they get free access to all recordings and self-guided training on our training hub. Thank you, subscribers, for your generosity. If you'd like to become a subscriber, there's a link in our show notes.