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Choosing Regenerative Bedding in a Microfiber World with Greg Bailey
42 Plays8 months ago
Synthetic comforters are essentially giant plastic bags — and they may be to blame for your poor sleep. Regenerative, naturally breathing materials help regulate your body's temperature at night, leading to deeper, healthier sleep. Learn why wool is an ideal bedding material and how to source quality products that won't break the bank.
Greg Bailey is an advocate for regenerative living and better sleep and is the founder of Antipodean Home, a regenerative organic bedding brand from New Zealand. Connect with Greg and learn more about the brand at https://antipodean-home.com/.
In this episode:
- Why microfiber is bad news for bedding
- The inspiration for Antipodean Home
- What makes wool an ideal cooling material
- Research on how materials impact sleep quality
- The relationship between cooling and circadian rhythm
- Regenerative vs. organic farming
- Expanding the options for bedding materials
- The first steps to healthier sleep
Connect with us at SuenoLabs.com. We're currently looking for contributors and podcast guests!
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Transcript
Introduction to Wool Bedding and Sustainability
00:00:00
Speaker
You've heard of counting sheep before going to bed, but what about sleeping sheep? Specifically, I'm talking about wool bedding. Tonight, I have the privilege of talking with Greg Bailey, who's the founder of Antipodean Home, which is a company selling wool bedding made from regenerative materials, something that is different than the plastic-based mattresses and mattress covers and comforters that we're usually encountering, at least here in the United States.
00:00:31
Speaker
It's going to be a fascinating conversation about how materials matter when it comes to getting a good night's sleep. So if you are interested in all things sustainable or just simply sustaining a better night's sleep, I really hope you enjoy the conversation.
00:00:51
Speaker
Tonight, I talk with Greg Bailey, founder of Antipodean Home and advocate for regenerative living and better sleep, about how all natural, breathable materials make a difference in the quality of our sleep.
Greg Bailey's Journey to Wool Bedding
00:01:10
Speaker
I'm Jimmy Leonard. This is Sueño Labs.
00:01:19
Speaker
Greg Bailey, welcome to Swinier Labs. How are you today? good, I'm good. Thanks for... Yeah, I'm super excited for this conversation tonight. It's about something that we don't normally talk about on the show, believe it or not, considering how many episodes we do related to sleep. It's not always about the sleep equipment or how some of the things in your environment could be affecting your sleep. Usually it's a little more focused on the lifestyle and the routine. So a lot to get into here today, but I thought we could start with you. So tell us a little bit about your background. How
00:01:52
Speaker
Did you get to a place where you are so passionate about helping people sleep better? So I'm a New Zealander, and I've been living in the United States for about five years. ah My wife is American, and we have a have a young boy.
00:02:06
Speaker
and we live here in Scottsdale, Arizona.
Challenges of Synthetic Bedding
00:02:10
Speaker
And a few years back, ah probably around the time of COVID, I started to get served a lot of ads for sleep products, products, et cetera, because I was having difficulty sleeping. So the algorithm...
00:02:26
Speaker
So I decided, okay, here you go. here's some Here's some stuff to buy. Here you are squirreling at 2 a.m., m so you might need a new pillow. You know, we put it together. Yeah. And ah all of these ads that i was getting served would make claims about the bidding's ability to ah keep you cool during the night.
00:02:47
Speaker
And when I say bedding, I mean comforters and duvet inserts, basically the things you sleep under. What became apparent to them very quickly is all of these arterians were, for the most part, synthetic, meaning they were essentially plastic.
00:03:05
Speaker
But they would have fancy names like microfiber materials. or polyfiber or cooling gel fiber or something like that because people sleep hot.
00:03:18
Speaker
there There's a bunch of folks out there who sleep hot and there's a whole range of reasons for it. There's physical, there's chemical, there's emotional sometimes.
00:03:29
Speaker
Lots of things cause sleep disturbances. ah But one of the main culprits is simply the ah bedding that you're using.
The Supernatural Qualities of Wool
00:03:38
Speaker
And a lot of it, most of the bedding material in the United States is synthetic.
00:03:44
Speaker
So that means you're essentially sleeping underneath ah plastic bag or or a shower curtain, but it does not breathe. It's synthetic, and it traps heat, it traps moisture, and it traps bacteria.
00:04:00
Speaker
And so you get a very poor, uneven sleep. You toss and turn. You wake up in a sweaty mess. ah You've had your eight hours, but you feel like you've been hit by a truck.
00:04:12
Speaker
And it's often what you're sleeping under. And so as a New Zealander, was aware of wool-based bedding, W-O-O-L. ah We use it a lot in New Zealand.
00:04:25
Speaker
it's ah It's a natural material. And it's actually... ah What we refer to as a ah supernatural material because it has these incredible properties to to breathe and to move moisture away from the skin and keep a balanced temperature all night.
00:04:48
Speaker
And you might know if you're if you enjoy the outdoors, ah then maybe you've been ah skiing or fishing or running, and you'll wear wool ah undershirt or wool socks.
00:05:09
Speaker
And ah folks might they might think, oh gosh, that's going to make me hot. But it in fact, the reason for it is the opposite. It's an active fiber and it adjusts to your body temperature.
00:05:24
Speaker
And so that's essentially, it's the chemical structure of the wool itself that allows for this. It essentially allows ah ah you know a flock of sheep to exist in extreme temperatures, in extreme cold and extreme heat.
00:05:40
Speaker
With all that wool, it's because it's an active fiber and it breathes. And it's it's an ideal material for bedding because it's an active fiber. And there are people use it here in the United States, wool bedding.
00:05:56
Speaker
You're often ah the more sort of ah crunchy, inclined folks or older folks who have trouble ah sleeping.
00:06:10
Speaker
and So ah it's here, but it's just not widely known enough.
Barriers to Wool Bedding Adoption in the US
00:06:16
Speaker
And that essentially was the the starting point for the um for starting to bring these materials into the United States from from New Zealand where they're made.
00:06:28
Speaker
Sure, and I'm glad you brought up that example of the wool socks because that's exactly what I was thinking. I live in the Smoky Mountains and so I love hiking, but of course it is warm here. And so that that's the best combo is to have wool socks with hiking boots because of of all the reasons that you said. But it is interesting that even though Many people think that way about apparel. We don't necessarily think about wool bedding.
00:06:52
Speaker
And so I'm sure we we'll get into that a little bit. But, you know, you mentioned it it's common in New Zealand. It's not so common here with with so many companies purporting to have cooling technology.
00:07:04
Speaker
Why do you think there aren't more companies that are looking for natural alternatives? I mean, like I guess a lot of it probably has to do with cost, but are there maybe other reasons why it's it's not more common that companies in the U.S. are using natural alternatives?
00:07:22
Speaker
Yeah, that's exactly right. It's cost. it's ah It's a cheaper alternative. alternative of So, yes, it's not widely known, ah but...
Growing Awareness of Sleep and Health
00:07:31
Speaker
mainly because ah the American exchange broadly has two choices when it comes to their bidding.
00:07:38
Speaker
It's feather or it's plastic. you don't think too much about what the betting you're buying. Um, I mean, why would you, uh, it's not, you know, you go, you, you just to assume these stores have the, ah best materials available to you to choose from.
00:08:00
Speaker
Um, but and it's not really then the best materials aren't necessarily available. It's, the best materials at the right price point, ah which which are available.
00:08:11
Speaker
um So wool is a little bit more expensive than plastic, but no more expensive than ah some of these high-end feather brands, for example, feather and down duvets that you might find.
00:08:30
Speaker
Around 30, 40 years ago, ah there was a shift away from natural materials towards synthetic ah petroleum-based materials ah because ah there there are cheaper alternatives. Easy to make, they're lighter, you can ship them more easily. There's a whole range of benefits, except they don't work.
00:08:58
Speaker
Yeah, but benefits for the company, maybe not benefits for the end user. Yeah, that's right. um And so it I find speaking, you know talking to people about, so there's so many folks who want...
00:09:15
Speaker
better sleep. there's it's it ah you know There's a massive train line underway. People who are just becoming more aware of the importance of sleep to their physical and emotional and mental well-being. just so critical.
00:09:33
Speaker
And when I don't sleep, Well, I had a medical condition which meant my sleep patterns were disrupted. It took a long time to figure out that sleep was the culprit ah because, well, when you're asleep, you don't know what's going on around you.
00:09:53
Speaker
And so without doing a sleep study, you know you wouldn't have known that it was tossing and turning all night and that sort of thing.
Regenerative Farming and Wool Sourcing
00:10:01
Speaker
um But it ah people are becoming so much more aware of it in the same way that they're becoming aware or just more aware of ah what's in the food system.
00:10:12
Speaker
um I think a lot of folks, myself included, have relied on ah ah you know companies providing the food that ah nutrition has a nutritional density that has it doesn't have chemicals throughout.
00:10:33
Speaker
What I found, what a lot of other people are finding, is that you actually have to you have to seek that fit those things out. then they're they're not just there ah presented to you.
00:10:47
Speaker
So Greg, tell us a little bit about what you're doing. You said you are, you're bringing materials in from New Zealand. Tell us about the company. Tell us about the whole setup you've got here. Yeah. So we are called Antipodean Home.
00:11:02
Speaker
ah It's a funny word, Antipodean. It means ah somebody from the far side of the world, which is the name given to New Zealanders and Australians.
00:11:14
Speaker
we We are Antipodeans from the Antipodes. but's So that's the name. And we're ah and an organic regenerative bidding brand. ah So we sell comforters and ah sheets and duvets and that sort of thing.
00:11:31
Speaker
What's different about us, there's a whole bunch of things that are different about us. ah Number one is we have wool products at the core of the brand.
00:11:43
Speaker
ah But also we ah we source our materials from exclusively regenerative farms. Okay, so pause there. What is a regenerative farm?
00:11:55
Speaker
It's starting to get some attention, particularly here in the United States. ah There is a our regenerative farming movement ah ah across the United States. What it means is there's this ordinary industrial farming with pesticides and chemicals and all of that bad stuff.
00:12:16
Speaker
ah Then there's also organic farming. and And most people know about that. What it means is ah they don't put chemicals onto the plants that are growing the fruit and vegetables,
00:12:32
Speaker
or um but they use fertilizers and other industrial chemicals on the soil. okay Regenerative farming uses no external...
00:12:47
Speaker
ah chemical no external inputs, meaning that they don't bring things onto the farm. sure it's It's essentially a closed-loop system that ah there are no um industrial fertilizers or chemicals used to grow the wool or grow the cotton.
00:13:10
Speaker
And it makes the soil way more healthy, full of life and oxygen and water. yeah improves the yield of whatever you're growing.
00:13:24
Speaker
ah That to maybe fruit and vegetables could be livestock. From a climate change perspective, ah it helps absorb uh, excess carbon.
00:13:37
Speaker
That's the bad stuff, the greenhouse gases sharing that that are up in the, up in the atmosphere. Uh, it helps, uh, absorb them. It draws them down, literally pulls them out of the air, um, through the process of photosynthesis and it's, and it sequesters, puts that carbon,
00:13:59
Speaker
back into the soil where it belongs. ah So there's there's a whole range of benefits to two regenerative farming. It's better for the earth. It's better for the farmer.
00:14:11
Speaker
ah The yields are are are better. ah Their costs are lower um because they don't need expensive chemical fertilizers.
00:14:23
Speaker
the regenerat regenerative farming is starting to gain a foothold here in the U S and there's dozens, if not hundreds, potentially for thousands now of regenerative farms across America.
00:14:37
Speaker
Uh, they're mostly, independent. You're seeing most of the, the ones that have the the most ah visibility are usually in the livestock space.
00:14:50
Speaker
So meat, beef in particular, and like fruit and veg, the meat itself is just so much better, more nutrient dense, less chemicals, all of ah all of that great stuff.
00:15:07
Speaker
So there's loads of people ah coming into the space, ah with different motivations, different priorities. ah But there is ah there is a movement um that is starting to to to grow.
00:15:24
Speaker
So how are you connecting with these suppliers or these farmers in New Zealand? What's that networking process like? It's pretty straightforward. um i We have a relationship with a company ah called NZ, a New Zealand Merino company.
00:15:41
Speaker
And they're essentially the they were kind of like a yeah a middleman, if you like, ah between brands and um and the farmers.
00:15:54
Speaker
NZ Merino is the company that is responsible for for sourcing the wool and selling it to me, but ah they're also responsible for ah all of all of their certifications and their on-farm auditing ah to make sure that ah it does what it says on the tin.
00:16:20
Speaker
if the soil from these farms contains more oxygen, ah more moisture, more ah biodiversity,
00:16:31
Speaker
ah and more carbon, ah then they will send out independent scientists to actually go onto the farms and test the soil.
Scientific Support for Wool Bedding
00:16:43
Speaker
And so ah brands like ours can come along and instead of going to every single farm ah across New Zealand ah that has different methods and different priorities and all that stuff.
00:17:00
Speaker
ah there there's ah There's a layer. Yeah, it's like a certification or a vetting process to ensure you're getting the materials. And the thing is with New Zealand, we typically take these things very seriously.
00:17:14
Speaker
if If we won't make a claim, unless we can stand by it and prove it, Tell me a little bit about the results. So we we've talked about the experience that many people have where you invest in a mattress that's supposed to be cooling or supposed to be more comfortable and you're still not sleeping well.
00:17:34
Speaker
What is some of the research showing or even what kind of stories are you hearing from people who are making the switch to regenerative organic wool-based bedding?
00:17:46
Speaker
you don't necessarily need to buy organic and regenerative, uh, but, but if you want, uh, a good sleep experience, you can just buy run of the mill, uh, we'll do the, that you might get on Amazon from China.
00:18:02
Speaker
i Um, and you sleep. Okay. Uh, but there'll be, you can't rely on what's in the material. If, if you, you may be an allergy sufferer, for example, and there'll be chemicals in that bedding that you don't, that you're unaware of.
00:18:21
Speaker
So, yeah, what do we what what research has been done? Yeah, so going back as far as 1980, New Zealand and Australian wool, the industry basically, conducted research ah through ah universities and with was able to um show that The sleeping with wool comforter or a duvet, or indeed with wool undergarments, ah improves your natural sleep cycle.
00:18:59
Speaker
So how does it do that? Well, the wool keeps you at a balanced temperature throughout the night and adjusts to your body temperature throughout the night.
00:19:13
Speaker
ah And as a result, you have the more balanced sleep and suffer less sleep disturbances throughout the night.
Contrasting Wool and Synthetic Materials
00:19:24
Speaker
And those disturbances... will disrupt your natural sleep cycles. And ah so if you ah if you're interested in tracking your health and fitness like I am, have a ring that does that.
00:19:46
Speaker
I can see in a visual form when I go into a deep sleep. And that is... vital for restoration i'm not a scientist or or a psychologist um but i do know that if i get more deep sleep i feel better the next day and uh so what what the wool bedding does is it uh prevents you it gives you a more balanced sleep and stops disrupting your ah sleep cycle so uh you know people will say
00:20:20
Speaker
ah that the difference is night and day because they they weren't they didn't realize that, like me, that their lack of energy or their tiredness, their low mood, whatever, was actually attributable to ah poor sleep that was caused by ah poor betting choices.
00:20:45
Speaker
We have um actual clinical um evidence that it's better um through these ah universities that conducted the research you know as long ago as 1980 anecdotally.
00:20:57
Speaker
ah and anecdote
00:21:04
Speaker
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00:21:25
Speaker
Yeah. and I think that it's probably a universal experience that we are familiar with the the temperature shift throughout the night. you know it's It's one way or the other. Maybe you're hot when you're going to bed, so you don't have a lot of covers. And then you wake up in the middle of the night and you're cold or or vice versa. You'll wake up and you're hot just because you're a hot sleeper because of the materials or something like that. And you know i I know all sorts of strange things that I hear from people because I talk to a lot of people about this. you know Some people swear by sleeping with the covers kind of half over you and like one arm's hanging out or or sleeping with one sock on and one sock off. Or you hear all these crazy things that really come...
00:22:02
Speaker
back to this idea of helping the body regulate its temperature. and And that's what I'm hearing you say is with the right materials, you're leaning into that idea of of the body is trying to regulate. If you think about what's happening in your body, like your systems are slowing down as you're going into sleep and you know your heart rate's getting slower. And so that there are some natural temperature shifts that are happening in your body, even when you are sleeping well. And so a material that moves with that is going to be helping you stay in that deep sleep longer, exactly like you're saying.
00:22:32
Speaker
Yeah. So we like to say ah that it works with your body, not against it. Yeah. ah ah Like a synthetic comforter would be, for example, ah trapping heat and and causing you to heat up and toss and turn.
00:22:46
Speaker
And we like to say that ah nature had it right from the start. yeah It's relying on nature's wisdom.
Greg's Recommendations for Better Sleep
00:22:52
Speaker
ah whereas a cooling mattress gimmick product for that you might buy for $5,000, $10,000, that has you know electric pumps and heaters and cooling and whatever and gadgets, you don't need to go to that extent to have good sleep.
00:23:12
Speaker
You just need to use natural materials. So Greg, I want to ask you a question because you've mentioned a couple of different things here. if If maybe someone's listening to this and they're like, oh, but i have a $5,000 mattress and I'm not about to go buy another one. I've already invested in this. you know yeah You mentioned um covers, you mentioned clothing.
00:23:31
Speaker
but If somebody's wanting to give this a try, where's a good place to start? What would you recommend as maybe your first purchase? Honestly, the the lowest price point.
00:23:42
Speaker
Uh, for a product that will improve your sleep is starting with a will-do-day. Folks might try sleep aids like gummies and things like that to help them drift off, but it's it's about diagnosing the problem.
Antipodean Home's Product Offerings
00:24:01
Speaker
um You can take a gummy and drift off, but you're goingnna you're going to overheat and wake up because of your bedding.
00:24:08
Speaker
um So you need to start with breathable, natural material. A plastic bag for a blanket is going to cause problems no matter what you do. Yeah. And you know one thing that we've talked about before on the show is if if you're thinking about trying to calculate the cost of a better mattress or the cost of better bedding, think about the sum total of what you're paying on poor sleep, exactly like you said. you know Maybe it is medication or sleep aids or even just how much you have to pay for your drive through coffee every morning because you're waking up exhausted, you know, that, that adds up over time.
00:24:45
Speaker
Tell us a little bit about the the collection then. So if somebody is looking for and a wool duvet, you know, what kinds of products could they shop? Yeah, so we've got a wool duvet. They're actually quite different to your standard wool duvet. We use ah a spun wool technique, which is it's a it's an innovation that makes our comforter lighter and actually more breathable because the ah
00:25:18
Speaker
the air lay process spins the wool into tiny of air. balls of air ah So air circulates through well.
00:25:28
Speaker
um And then we have sheets and duvets, sheet sets from regenerative organic cotton, as well as duvet colors. you can get a a full suit.
00:25:42
Speaker
Yeah, i was on the Antipodean website before this, and I think you actually call it that on there, right? like you know You sell it like in a bundle. Yeah, yeah. So we we sell it we can sell the comforters on their own or the sheets on their own, but they're bundled for, um and you get discounts 20% for a bundle and then 30% for a full
Contact Information for Antipodean Home
00:26:02
Speaker
bundle.
00:26:02
Speaker
But via folks can go to the website Antipathy and Home. should Should we try to spell that for listeners? I'll drop a link too, but I yeah know. I know. It's... you know it It's a funny, it's a funny, it's, uh, when you choose a, choose a name, we wanted something that was distinctive and it certainly is.
00:26:20
Speaker
it is a N T I P O D E A N Antipodean home. Got it. And there's a hyphen in there, right? It's ah it's a Antipodean hyphen home.com.
00:26:34
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Appreciate it. Got it. Yeah. We'll drop the link too, but. Greg, on on more of a silly note, since we're talking so much about wool, what is your opinion about counting sheep to go to sleep?
00:26:47
Speaker
That's also and an all-natural method, i will say. ah Yeah, I think it's a great idea. you' come Count the sheep. I myself don't. I actually use breathing exercises to do it.
00:27:04
Speaker
yeah That's how i But counting sheep is great way go. I do some breath work too. And a lot of times I will count as part of it, you know, like many people do. It's like, you know, you breathe in, you breathe out for a certain count. And so I, there is some validity to the counting sheep thing. It's just getting the, the mind in that.
00:27:23
Speaker
Yeah. I don't know where that came from. I wonder where it came from. Why sheep? know I'm going to have to do some research. Why sheep? Why not cows? I know, maybe it is just the the ancestral knowledge that sheep are associated with sleep. And maybe we've always known we've just lost sight of that.
00:27:41
Speaker
So Greg, we got to talk about a lot here. Just um as we're wrapping up, is there anything else that you wanted to mention that we didn't have a chance to get to? you ah No, well, we would have talked more about regenerative um and what that means. um ah But it's a simple way to understand it. It's kind of like organic plus.
00:28:00
Speaker
um And it's just, it's way better that for for your home, for your future, for the planet. ah And if you ever get a chance to check out a regenerative brand, give them a shot.
00:28:16
Speaker
Well, Greg, this has been so great. Where can listeners go to learn more about you? but let' Start with the website, I would say, antipodean-home.com. Check us out on Instagram. We're on LinkedIn, too. There's a little bit more detail, bit more sort of scientific ah kind of stuff on LinkedIn, if you're really interested.
00:28:35
Speaker
um But yeah, we're on Instagram and Facebook. ah Just ah search our name, antipodeanhome, you'll find us. Well, Greg Bailey, thank you so much for joining us on the show.
00:28:48
Speaker
Swenyo Labs is a show about sleep, memory, and dreams. For more content, visit our blog at swenyoelabs.com and connect with us to learn more about how you can share your story related to brain health and the daily habits that help us to rest and live better.
00:29:06
Speaker
Thanks for joining. We'll be back soon.