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The Travel Expert's Guide to Living (and Sleeping!) Abroad with James Doran
26 Plays1 year ago
When we travel internationally, we often think about how we'll experience a new language or new foods. But what about sleep? Travel expert James Doran explains how to adjust to a new time zone and make the most of your experience abroad, whether you're there for a week or a year.
James Doran is an engineer and podcaster. Connect with James on "The Expat Pod" wherever you get your podcasts, and follow The Expat Pod on social media.
In this episode:
- Expat vs. immigrant: Why people travel abroad
- The everyday challenges of living in a new country
- Strategies for sleeping in a new place
- How to adjust to a different time zone quickly
- Advice for making the most of a short vacation
- Combatting homesickness
- The benefits of exploring a new culture
- Encouragement for anyone planning time abroad
Connect with us at SuenoLabs.com. We're currently looking for contributors and podcast guests!
Disclaimer: This show is for informational purposes only. Sueño Labs does not provide medical advice.
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Transcript
Difficulties of Traveling Abroad
00:00:01
Speaker
What is the most difficult thing about traveling to another country? Is it the language, the food, the culture, or even the sleep?
Post-COVID Trends in Living Abroad
00:00:13
Speaker
World travel numbers have continued to rebound since the COVID-19 pandemic, and not just for a week-long trip in the summer.
Introduction of James Doran and Expat Life
00:00:22
Speaker
Hundreds of millions of people are currently living as expats, residing in countries other than the place where they were born, whether it's for study or gap year or taking a new job,
00:00:33
Speaker
Today, we are talking about the adventure of living abroad and also some of the challenges that come with it, particularly sleep. To start this conversation, I'm making my own call overseas to someone who's truly an expert in the expat lifestyle.
00:00:54
Speaker
Today, I talk with engineer and podcaster James Doran. You know him best as the host of the expat pod.
Podcast and Host Introduction
00:01:03
Speaker
We discuss the joys and the trials of living abroad and how to acclimate to a new place.
00:01:13
Speaker
I'm Jimmy Leonard.
England's Football Match Discussion
00:01:14
Speaker
This is Swanyo Labs. James Doran, welcome to Swanyo Labs. How are you today? I'm good, thank you. yeah Thanks for having me. It's quite unusual being on this side of the podcast. A bit more nervous than usual, because it's been a while since I've been being asked questions by someone else. What can we say to put you at ease? i I suppose not talking about England football, that would sort of have the opposite effects, where it brings all the nerves up to the surface. For those who don't know, England just played back here in the Euros, and we just about won. that Half an hour ago, I was not in a calm state of mind, shall we put it, but
00:01:54
Speaker
Now i've ah I've wound down a little bit. Yeah. Should we go ahead and wager a prediction? So we're recording this episode on the day that England played in the Euros. By the time this episode is published, at what stage of the Euros will England have been knocked out? I'm hoping the final. ah they not thing Okay. I just want to pop back in here. For those of you who don't know, England really did progress to the Euro final. So way to go, James. You believed in your team.
Expats vs. Immigrants: Privilege and Motivation
00:02:19
Speaker
All right, so so James, you are an expat expert. I was really practicing trying to say that earlier. So we're talking about expats. this is good This phrase gets thrown around a lot. Is this really just immigrants? I want to start there. What is the difference between someone who's an expat and someone who's an immigrant? I mean, to me, there's no difference, right? this it's just um You get a thesaurus out, you can use different words in different ways, and you can there's so many similar sorts of things. and
00:02:47
Speaker
you know I understand the idea of expats being seen as a point of privilege and people using expat as an immigrant but with privilege, which I completely get. you know it It's quite a fair... It comes from a fair place, right? It comes from a place of usually expats, I've already got a job, they're being bankrolled by a company and and they're going somewhere to get a lot of support. And immigrant immigrants, usually the opposite, they've really fought for that opportunity to move somewhere new and And it's usually to have a chance to do something better than they had before. So I think that's probably to me what how the two words have been kind of differentiated over time, it would be
00:03:26
Speaker
you know have you come have he gone somewhere with more prosperity or have you been paid a lot of money to go somewhere else because they need you there and it's ah um it's not as comfortable as home for you kind of thing.
Personal Experiences and Reasons for Living Abroad
00:03:40
Speaker
so For instance, a lot of people um would have gone to the Middle East for oil money back in the day for expats and they would have quite a comfortable life, relatively. Obviously, it would be very hot and it's not home, but they would have had a comfortable life in terms of the payback, it's better, there's no tax, all that stuff. and an immigrant immigrant might have come might have been refugees or might have been you know someone who's traveled a long way to get somewhere for, let's say, the American dream, perhaps, which is you know quite often touted. And in the EU, it's a similar thing. We've got a lot of migration coming from war-torn parts of the world. and
00:04:14
Speaker
they've left their homes because they have to. To me, everyone who moves home or moves country is a brave person because they didn't need to do that. They could have stayed at home and been comfortable. We all strive to be to have more prosperity in life. That's you know what we've been unfortunately told is the best thing to do is keep trying to get more money or get more opportunity. um And everyone's got a different displacement or different kind of baseline of of what that means. so To answer your question, I don't think they're different, but I understand where the differences can be gleaned from in that sense. And I think it's important that you pointed that out that sometimes it's more voluntary than otherwise, you know especially if someone is is in a refugee situation where they may be fleeing for reasons of safety versus someone who's he's just seeking economic opportunity or adventure, but maybe could have had that back home.
00:05:05
Speaker
and it has a little bit more agency in the choice there. So you talked to a lot of different people about living abroad, and you mentioned prosperity. What are some of the other reasons that take someone to seek a life in a new country? Is it always economic? Are there other driving factors, push-pull factors? Yeah, there's loads. like For me, it wasn't economic. I was actually worse off going abroad. Well, I got paid a similar amount of money, but it cost me a lot of money to move abroad. and and I kept coming home to see family friends and but my rent was more expensive in Sweden than it was in the UK. And I ended up spending more money being abroad than I did if I'd said at home. But for me, it was the opportunity to learn a new culture and and experience more of the world. So I'm very much, I love traveling. I've done it since I was a very young child. My parents are very kind to giving opportunities to travel. That was their priority when I was growing up was they had, we had good holidays. That was that was the main thing that they didn't sacrifice or when we sacrificed for many other things. but
00:06:01
Speaker
not a holiday. which So I got to travel a lot of lot of the world when I was younger, which then kind of instilled in me this opportunity to you know learn about culture and learn about language and and other people and always had international friends
Cultural Immersion and Personal Growth
00:06:15
Speaker
as well. So I play a lot of sport, volleyball being what I played a lot at university with a lot of internationals who would tell me great stories about where they're from and the culture, the food, you know the environments, all the places you see and you go, I want to see more of that. Now, when I graduated my from my degree, I was like, oh, okay, how how can I get into abroad? So I was very lucky to have joined a company which was a Swedish company. And when I joined the company, I said, oh, how can I possibly go? And that's, for me, how why I wanted to do it. And speaking to lots of other the people, it's similar things as well. It's gaining empathy. And I think actually we should have a thing where everyone
00:06:51
Speaker
should have the opportunity to live abroad because you gain so much empathy for how hard it is to move abroad. So you understand what it's like to be an immigrant because every expat is an immigrant, it's just different things. But you understand, okay, what queuing a line ah ah migration services ah line is like you know trying to get a visa or trying to get an ID card or all these things you might not have heard even thought of. But you if you move abroad, you gain that empathy and that then all might might hopefully make the world a bit more tolerable, a bit more open to understanding why people are doing things and the struggle. and I think that's really important and that's another thing why I think people go abroad is because they want to see the other side of the story. They want to be involved in you know different cultures, different languages. yeah It's romantic as well. There's a romantic element of living abroad. It's
00:07:41
Speaker
you know Like a Euro trip would be obviously a romantic experience, but that the idea of, I lived a year in Tuscany or I lived a year in South America. you know it's It's often romanticized quite a lot and that's why people probably try and do it. and Especially as you said off mic about having the digital nomad lifestyle where you can remote work remotely, that's only opened up so much more because opportunities to to work whilst you know on a beach somewhere in Madeira or in Thailand where cost of living is really cheap. That's another reason why people might go. Oh, absolutely.
Challenges and Humbling Moments Abroad
00:08:14
Speaker
I agree. it It sometimes is romanticized almost to a fault. I think sometimes we you know we forget that it it can be really challenging to be in a different culture too, but there's a lot of good learning that comes from that too. Empathy, I think also humility
00:08:28
Speaker
being in a situation where you are the idiot, I think is so important for someone's personal growth, where you don't know the language, you don't know the customs. I actually had the opportunity to study abroad in Istanbul when I was in college. And, and you know, there's so many different stories I could tell of of language barriers and culture barriers. But I remember one of the most striking things was after I'd been there for about 10 days, I needed to do laundry. And I didn't know how to do laundry in this country. Because where I grew up, you would walk down the hallway, at the building where you're staying, and there were machines that you would put coins in. And that's how you would do your laundry. But that didn't exist in the building where I was. And I just I remember this very simple thing. Like, I don't know how this works in this country. I don't know what you're supposed to do. I don't know who you talk to. you Sometimes those things can happen where you just feel
00:09:17
Speaker
So dumb, in a good way, in a humbling way. I wonder if there was anything like that for you when you first went abroad, if there was a moment where you just realized, I don't know what to do in this situation. There's probably a thousand different things, just going to the supermarket and doing my local grocery shop. right So I lived in the UK and I know what brands and I like, I know what food I want to get. Fine, brilliant. You then go to ah to your grocery shop while you're living somewhere new. You walk in supermarket. It's all in different orders. So what might be a logical aisle placement of putting like fruit and veg next to chilled stuff because it keeps it cooler. Or then you have like a natural order and do the freezer at the end because it doesn't melt in a shopping basket.
00:09:58
Speaker
that kind of thing you may think of is a a normal thing to do. Go to a different country, it might be different. But then you look at the shop and you go, I want to buy some bread. Okay, I know I can read that in English. I know what bread that is, but you go to a different language or different a culture. And it's it's not in that you're trying to guess what bread it is. And, you know, you you might get it wrong. That's fine. I know a good friend of mine, he moved to Sweden, he he didn't eat meat. And the word for meat in Swedish is shot. So it's K or TT. He found an item which said not shot. So he might have thought that means not meat, but the word for beef in Swedish is not shot. So he ended up buying some something that was beef, thinking it was not meat. And it's that kind of thing of just, you know, you spend two hours in the supermarket rather than half an hour because you're there reading every single label, making sure it's right, making sure even doing the currency conversion in your head or on on your phones, yeah am I getting ripped off for this thing? is Should this thing be five pounds or five dollars when it's actually three dollars at home, you know,
00:10:58
Speaker
That is a thing which I'd show at the start and then you you you get to know the brands, you get to know or you ask your friends who are local, go okay, what's but's good cheese or you know all those little things which you come to think about it as such a ah minor thing and you never think about it before you go abroad, but that's your evening spent after a long day of work or you then lose an evening just because you've had to do this one quite remedial task. And then of course the next time it gets easier and the next time it gets easier and and pretty soon you'd...
00:11:29
Speaker
you're even more familiar in that market than you would be at home. ah But yeah, that's that's a really great example. Yeah, sometimes even just the fruits and vegetables are different too. You're like, I don't know what this is. I've never seen this, I've never cooked with it, but here it is, it's in the store. So of course we can we can talk about a number of things, but Swender Labs, you know we talk about sleep, memory, and dreams. Here's one of my biggest challenges when I'm traveling, and whether it's just traveling for a week or traveling for a month, It's sleep,
Adjusting Sleep and Overcoming Jet Lag
00:11:59
Speaker
right? Of course, when we stay somewhere new, there are tons of scientific studies and research that really look at what's happening in the brain. We sort of get into this survival mode kind of instinctual response of I'm in a new place. I don't know what danger could be here. And it's actually instinctual to not sleep very well in your first night in a new place.
00:12:20
Speaker
But sometimes it persists. It goes beyond the first night where there's maybe just a temperature difference than what you're used to at home. Maybe there's no air conditioning. Maybe the bed is harder or softer or all of these other things when you're in a new place. So as someone who has traveled a lot and he's talked to people who've traveled a lot, I'd love to get your perspective on this topic. Before we even dive into some of the specifics and how to, is there any hope for sleeping well when traveling? or Or is it actually this thing that there's no place like home and we should just give up on the dream that if I'm going to go somewhere else, I will never get as much rest as I would at my childhood home or something like that? I think it's a very interesting topic, a very good question you raised. I've actually managed to move house every year since I was 18, at least once so in Sweden, I had three in a year because it because it was the way forward. So lots of different beds.
00:13:13
Speaker
One thing I always try to do is keep a routine before going to bed and always try to be quite strict with with with that. So do a routine, which kind of got me in the mood for sleeping. And then one thing also which is is quite difficult to go over with is is if you move to the Northern Hemisphere or the Far Northern Hemisphere in the summer, you get a lot of daylight. So there's there's about four hours or six hours of of of darkness. So be prepared for that. So if you know you're going traveling to somewhere which has got, you know, doesn't sun doesn't set till after 11 or after 10 o'clock at night or rises at 5am, then have a blackout curtains or have a sleep mask if you haven't got opportunity for that or it's a hotel staying here or an Airbnb or something you don't really know.
00:13:56
Speaker
make sure you've got something which can support that because it's very difficult. And the inverse of that as well, which is very dark, which is was the winter have a light source to wake you up. I've got a sun lamp, which I used a lot in the winter to help regulate my my waking waking time rather than an alarm, which can be quite ah alarming, I suppose. It can be you know very annoying. It can break your cycle, whereas I used the the light, which which really helped me in terms of after a while. But the first night is always difficult, as you said. it's But if you try to build a routine and and try not to try not to overthink it, I used to try and get overtired. So if I was moving somewhere, if I was traveling somewhere the first night, I would try and stay awake as late as possible. So I could then try and reset my rhythm. So the next day I was awake up at a normal time, especially be moving
00:14:43
Speaker
backwards in time. So if I was traveling West, I would try and elongate my day to maybe 26 hours or something, but then fall asleep at 9pm or 10pm. So I wake up at a normal time. That would be something I would say helps me in terms of if it was shifting a time zone. But if it was not that, then just trying to keep the routine the same you have at home, try and have similar things you have in your bedroom. You might be somebody like sensitive lavender, which can often help as well. Yeah, it's it's a difficult thing to do and everyone's different and everyone's got a different thing. Some people might try mindfulness or meditation, which can help. I know it all depends on the person. It's quite difficult thing to say, but for me, it's about a routine.
00:15:23
Speaker
So I've heard that from a number of people that that's the best thing to do when you travel to a different time zone is to go to bed at the right time in that time zone. So even if your body is telling you it's one o'clock in the morning, you should still try to go to bed at the time you would normally go to bed in the time zone, if that makes sense. Is that also your recommendation? Oh, definitely. Yeah, ah for sure. I think when when whenever I go to the US or anything, then I would always try and stay awake until 10pm us time or something or as late as possible. The other way is more difficult. I think going east going forward in time, I think it's a lot more difficult. It's easier to delay falling asleep than it is to kind of preempt it or or will make it happen. i'm I'm much better at staying awake than I am at trying to sleep earlier. um And if you go forward in time, your day gets shorter. So you know the clock might have moved 16 hours, but you've done 10 or you've done 11. So you're you're not tired because you've only been working 11 hours, but
00:16:20
Speaker
you left somewhere ah at 8am and you're trying to go to bed there at 10pm, but it's actually only you in your body, 5pm or something. So it's difficult to to kind of force yourself to sleep at that point, which which I think is why it might take two or three days to kind of shift over time. Yeah, that makes sense. I know there have been a few times in my life where I've done the dreaded red-eye flight going from the west coast of the U.S. back to the east coast of the U.S. and so see if I can get this math right on the spot. But it's like if if you leave at 10 p.m. in California and then it's a four-hour flight, but then you also gain those three hours. It's it's like by the time you land, night didn't happen.
00:17:00
Speaker
You got on the plane and then you got off the plane. And now it's like there was no night that happened. And of course I never sleep on a plane either. So then it's the challenge becomes, can I now stay awake for the entire day? And so I would normally go to bed because otherwise you just get caught in that cycle where it's messed up. So I can see that where that is a problem. Do you sleep on planes? Does anyone sleep on planes? I'm i'm two meters tall, six foot six. So I don't fit on planes very well. So sleeping on planes is a different story. I think for me, especially with my My knees are touching the seat a bit in front of me and my my my shoulders are above the headrest, so I find it quite difficult completely. and i've done't I've done a red eye. I'm doing a red eye this summer, actually, as well, which I'm looking forward to with... Well, I'm not, but it was cheaper than a hotel. That's why we chose to do ah ah it. It's hard. It's a lot of change for your body to adjust to in one go, but often it can be the right reasons to do it. so For us, the cost of a hotel in San Francisco was significantly more than the flight on the red eye.
00:18:00
Speaker
so it's paid for itself already if we took that flight rather than one six hours later and go to New York a bit later. But you then, yeah, you need to, you need to force yourself, Red Bull might be the answer or some, you know, if you don't want a caffeinated stimulant, then maybe a nap, a nap could be a a good solution if you take a midday nap for an hour or two just to, you know, revitalize yourself. or just a cold shower is always always a ah good answer. Yeah, I wouldn't recommend it doing it often, but for the odd occasion, it's...
00:18:34
Speaker
you You will recover. Yeah. All, all very practical advice. I don't know are if you're familiar with this moment in history, but when Magellan's expedition first went around the world, there was some debate when they got back to Spain about what day it was because of course they didn't have any concept of the international date line yet. So they yeah had been keeping meticulous journals, but then when they got back, they were one day off from everybody else in Europe because they didn't know that you're supposed to at a day when you cross the international dateline didn't exist yet. and But I always think about that, that, you know, before airplanes travel through time zones was so incremental that your body could just adjust naturally. And now we, with the help of technology, we throw ourselves in this very unnatural state where you are now
00:19:22
Speaker
in the other side of the world, but your your brain and your body is not ready for it at all. In many ways, we've created this convenience to be able to travel, but it it seems to be against human nature a little bit. We talked about this a little bit, some things of the day of, but especially when traveling, significantly. So I'm talking like seven, eight, nine different time zones. What are some other things that people can do? When it comes to jet lag, I think this ah becomes significant when someone's on vacation, maybe more so than moving to another place. Because a lot of times when you're traveling on vacation, you really only have those one to two weeks. You know, maybe you're you're privileged enough to be able to take a vacation longer than that. But at least ah
00:20:05
Speaker
you know most people in america we don't have that much paid time off to be able to travel for that long so you know you might. Have this opportunity to to fly from the us to asia or you know this this big trip but then if a whole week of that trip is just spent suffering from jet lag it it really can take away from some of the. the opportunities to enjoy the trip to you. So I'm curious if you have any other thoughts about dealing with jet lag on some of those really long gaps, where it is that seven, eight, nine, 10, 11, 12 hour difference. Maybe take the first day when you arrive quite easy. So whether you're, your shift, you're getting east quite a lot, I suppose, or you're going forward in time quite a bit. So it's quite, quite difficult to get over quickly. yeah Apparently it takes one day per hour you've moved forward to recover.
00:20:53
Speaker
So if you're only going for a week and you've traveled 10 hours, you're not going to be able to recover in time. So taking the first day, don't pack it full of activities. Maybe have to have a chance to have a nap or have a chance to catch up and sleep in that sense. I always do the opposite because I'm a bit of an idiot. I always go and do as much as possible on the first day, so I get really tired and fall asleep. But I also have a complete understanding for the other way of things and to try and make it as relaxed as possible so you can really rest for the following six days. it's a week Either one of those is fine. I would really try and do as much as possible so you have to fall asleep because you just you're just so tired from walking around Tokyo or you know it's seeing all all of everything or do the opposite and just chill by the pool or maybe just do a dual walking tour, have it have dinner, go to bed.
00:21:44
Speaker
The walking tour is good because you've done you've seen all the city, you've got some good advice from where to go and and explore the rest of your trip. So it's not been a wasted day, but it's not been a day where you've done about a thousand things. If you're enjoying the Swagnio Labs podcast, please take a moment and post this, share it with a friend, or leave us a review. Your support keeps new content coming.
00:22:07
Speaker
I like that. And I'm glad you gave room for the option to just have the really busy day because that is how I am as a traveler too. I don't and don't really take restful vacations. I'm definitely the sort of person like you where if I'm going to be somewhere and I'm going to be there for a limited time only, i I do want to pack in as much as I possibly can. So that's a good challenge for me to still consider a rest day as well, especially. I mean, this is probably good advice even if you aren't traveling time zones. I went to Singapore for to watch the Grand Prix, which is the Formula 1 racing event. And that's in the evening. So my friend and I, we we both went from the UK, so it's quite a bit of a time shift, I think it's about eight hours. And we we did everything in the daytime, so saw the entire city, and then went to the racing in the evening. And then went to ah the after party afterwards, which was ah you know ah like a festival vibe where you've got ah Swedish House Mafia or Virtue Leper's playing after the race has finished or the day's racing's finished.
00:23:04
Speaker
And that was, you know, 16 hour, 18 hour days. It was just nonstop. And after a two days of that, we were fine. You know, we we were complete. And then we also sent down the Ruby World Cup was on. So there was sport, other sport on. So we went through a bar and watched that, you know, there's always things going on. So we made sure we just absolutely packed it because not many often, often you get these times to see all this amazing things in in in a culture. So you'd need to just pack it in from my point of view. I'm very much a. ah how can I fill my glass more or I need to get a big glass because I just want to get as much things as possible inside. So James, earlier I introduced you as being ah a bit of an expat expert.
James Doran's Expat Podcast
00:23:43
Speaker
So you also have a podcast. So tell us a little bit about that. Who are you talking to? What are you talking about? Sure. Yeah. So thank you for giving me the space to do that. So, um, when I moved to Sweden, it was, it was beautiful summer. It was, you know, the as you can imagine, all the daylight you're going to have. So beautiful, like, uh,
00:24:02
Speaker
evenings in in in in in a summer climate come to winter when you have about six hours of daylight and that's all covered in clouds so it's not very pleasant to be in and it's raining or snowing or it's you know not not not not the funnest place in Sweden or touristy not very social especially in the winter. um It was quite difficult and I got talking to a lot of friends who are also living abroad away from home in the place I was living And we just started giving advice to each other on on how how to survive and how to survive moving abroad and you know getting a bank and all that other stuff. And I had an idea that I was doing a blog beforehand of my own daily activities, but then I started talking to my friends about their lives and going, I should probably start recording this because this is a really good podcast to help other people who might have moved and they're struggling, who want to move or just want to you know reminisce about their times abroad. so
00:24:55
Speaker
The purpose was it will be a place where I would interview my friends initially or and other people who've spent time living abroad and their incredible stories. Because you can get 10 people who've moved from the US s to Istanbul, but they've all got 10 different stories and 10 different lived experiences. So it's worth speaking to all of them because someone might resonate with something. So that was the idea behind it is just to give a true representation of what that journey is like in many different facets, many different viewpoints because it's it's hard, right? Living abroad is not an easy thing. It's fun. It's really romantic. People love the idea of it. Great. But it's still difficult. You still have to go get the laundry doing. You have to go get your shopping doing. Immigration card, all these things. You got to pay your taxes, all these things which which you don't think about when you're traveling for vacation.
00:25:41
Speaker
you have to do as an expert because you have to live there and get rent and and and all all all that stuff. So the idea was it would just prepare people for what it's really like to move abroad, all the things you need to do before you have to get visas, ah if you have to do English language tests for work or for college or for different things like that because it happens quite a lot. And then any advice of making friends, if you move abroad as an adult, it's really hard to make friends because you're one person going into a society which already functions without you. You've then got to try and find people who want to give up their parts of their day to spend time with you and they've already got their friends, they've got their families, they've got the the work colleagues. Go to university or go for
00:26:25
Speaker
a graduate scheme, it's a bit different because you're joined with other people in the same situation. So you're more likely to find friendships in that way. But going by yourself for a job as an adult or with your family, it's difficult. And if you bring your spouse with you or your children, it's difficult for them as well because it wasn't a choice either. They've gone and don't know anyone. So the idea was just to really find advice for anyone who's having those issues, how to make it a little bit better. Not perfect, not solve the problems, but at least put them in the right way or know that they're not alone because any expat has experienced a lot of things. Homesickness being a huge one of it as well. What are some of the common things that people talk about, particularly with that with homesickness?
Coping with Homesickness
00:27:08
Speaker
I know there there is no one size fits all, but I wonder if there are certain things that pop up in many conversations.
00:27:15
Speaker
The main one is is is call home or get in touch with them. I have mechanisms which can allow you to to raise the alarm. so My girlfriend and I would would often you know message her saying, you know I'm really struggling today, can we get on a... We would have a call as soon as possible. even if we're both doing busy lives because she was still living in the UK at the time, my family as well. That's something that worked for me was was having that kind of safety net of I could say something to a few people and I knew someone would get on a phone call with me as soon as possible. That that was really, really pale powerful for me. Another thing is trying to make where you are more like your home.
00:27:51
Speaker
so look listening to DBC podcasts or the news or just finding like your local TV shows or things you find funny or familial, put those on. If you if you are either living in a country or culture, which is a different language to yours, put it on in your home language because it's really exhausting living in a little language. you know Get something which which which which you can listen to subconsciously. Acknowledging homesickness, no not trying to push it aside saying, Oh, it's not that i'm I'm fine. Go, you know, I'm having a hard day today. It's difficult. and And even just journaling, it's yourself. Don't don't forget to broadcast as everyone else. But you can just tell yourself or write it down saying I struggled today because I missed my favorite cereal from home or I missed this TV show or I miss my mum or I miss my girlfriend or my dog or whatever. And be honest with yourself because you're not honest to yourself. And what's the point? You're not fooling anyone else. i Only you care about you more than
00:28:49
Speaker
that That's that's how how I think it went. One concern that I have is that even just thinking about this conversation that we're having is it's almost like we're making it sound like that moving abroad is a horrible idea.
Encouragement for Experiencing Life Abroad
00:28:58
Speaker
you know you' It's like, oh, you're going to have the terrible night's sleep and you're going to feel homesick and you won't know what to shop for. So I wonder if we could just, as we're getting close to the end here, maybe put this on a positive note. If somebody is listening to this episode because they love to travel or because maybe they've thought about living abroad or maybe it's even just a semester, maybe you're a college student, you're thinking about studying abroad, maybe you're actually looking at
00:29:20
Speaker
work opportunities for a gap year, maybe even longer. But what encouragement could we give to somebody who has always wondered what it would be like to live abroad and is thinking about doing it for real? Just do it. like is It's that easy. Okay. For all the things that are so difficult about it like that, there's day-to-day struggles. But if you speak to anyone in life who spent time abroad, they will look back at it so fondly. You know, you've got a lot of friends who are my parents' age going, oh, I spent a year living in this country. country And they list off all the reasons why it was great. Some things were difficult, of course, but there are they're a better person because of that trip. They've learnt a language or studied it more. They've gained empathy for people. They've been able to really um find themselves because they've had to struggle more or had to go out of the easy lane.
00:30:13
Speaker
understood what they want from life. It could be a ah professional development, they've you know improved a lot of things in their careers. And for all those many reasons, it's worth doing. I would recommend trying to understand what you want to get from life abroad. Is it cultural exchange? Is it economic opportunity? Is it learning a language? Is it learning how to cook a different cuisine? Because that's really cool as well. literallyley It's amazing food or France or you know parts of Nigeria, incredible food, different different cuisines everywhere, understand your why, why you want to do it. And then from there, you'll start to to find ah the place that's right for you and the opportunity that's right for you, whether it's a job, whether it's cultural exchange, whether it's a semester abroad, as you said as well.
00:31:00
Speaker
I like that. Yeah. It's instead of thinking of, of reasons why it's not going to work, spend some time listing out the reasons of what you want to get out of it. And so I think to you, just remembering that staying where you are can be hard too. There really isn't an option where you're not going to have hard things in your life. Like that's not like we're choosing between a life of a hundred percent comfort and you know, cause that doesn't exist. There's always going to be hard things. So, so embrace the, the adventure. I like that.
Where to Find James Doran's Work
00:31:32
Speaker
So James, where can listeners go to learn more about you, your podcast, your thoughts, your writing, whatever it is. Sure. So I'm um on kind of all major social platforms under the expat pod. You can find me there, but the podcast itself is on Spotify, Apple, Amazon, I think any major podcast platform it appears on and YouTube. And if you want to find a bit more about my writing and
00:31:59
Speaker
I don't do enough. It's on a website called tallmantravels.co.uk. As I said, I'm two meters tall or six foot six in Albany, so I'm all right. Well, James Doran, thank you so much. Thank you for the opportunity.
00:32:16
Speaker
Swinyolabs is a show about sleep, memory, and dreams. For more content, visit our blog at swinyolabs.com and connect with us to learn more about how you can share your story related to brain health and the daily habits that help us to rest and live better.
00:32:34
Speaker
Thanks for joining. We'll be back soon.