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STOP Shooting Coyotes Early & Reading Behavior Instead ft. DC Predator
267 Plays5 days ago
Most guys aren’t losing coyotes on the shot—they’re losing them before they ever hit the call. In this episode, Mike sits down with the DC Predator crew—Scott, Ken, and Kam—to break down what actually works in daytime coyote hunting. From stand setup and wind direction to calling strategy and reading coyote behavior, this is a real look at how experienced hunters consistently call coyotes in and get them to commit. We talk about the biggest mistakes in predator hunting, why most hunters shoot too early, and how small details like entry, movement, and noise can ruin a stand before it even starts. They also break down their coyote calling strategy, including what sounds work, how long to stay on stand, and how they’ve used years of data to refine their approach. We also get into how filming their hunts has changed the way they hunt—forcing them to slow down, read body language, and become more effective predator hunters. If you’re trying to figure out how to hunt coyotes, improve your predator hunting strategy, or understand why coyotes hang up and don’t commit, this episode will help you connect the dots.
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Transcript
Introduction and Social Media Question
00:00:00
Speaker
Why you trying to limit us? I'm not, I'm not. i appreciate that you asked that question because this is probably the most common question we get on the social media platforms. The more reps who get watching their body language and learning their behavior, better and better it gets. and The only time when you get a little anxious is if you're worried they're going to get the win. We shoot this coyote, and it's it's like they do sometimes. He starts that death spin. I put another round in him, and this thing jumps up and does a headstand and like stalls standing on its head and then tips over. The breakdancing coyote. really was. And I'm like, cow.
Guest Introduction and Host Update
00:00:40
Speaker
What's up everyone? This is Mike Hearn. I'm the Community Marketing Manager at Tricer. I hijacked the podcast because Drew's in Australia and I have the DC Predator crew here on the show. So from left to right as you're viewing them, I have Scott, Ken and Cam. What's up guys?
00:00:59
Speaker
What's up Mike? What's up? How's it going? this is This is round two due to some technical and difficulties with the last one. So what's ah what's good? What's new in your guys' world? Man, we got exciting stuff going on here.
00:01:17
Speaker
There's always good hunting stuff going on. But for me, nothing can compete with the excitement I have because three weeks from today, Cameron's wife is expecting twins and so I will be a grandfather and um I just it's it's interesting to see how my Instagram feed went from dead coyotes to baby to babies and uh so so for me um That is super exciting. Although Ken has long been a grandfather for me, this is the first go around. Yeah, that's awesome. Congrats. I'm stoked too. Yeah. Do we know, do we know, uh, boys, girls, what do we know about this? Two girls.
00:01:58
Speaker
two girls all right right out of the gate du just get them out man double girl dad are you guys gonna try again for a boy yeah we'll we'll try again but i think this will keep us busy for a little bit oh yeah yeah yeah definitely now my hunting time's off to either start getting into night hunting or going early yeah you're gonna be busy that's crazy twins yeah i'm i'm stuck we're so excited Awesome. Well, guys, let's ah let's jump into into some of the stuff. We talked about some really good stuff last time, but I think the biggest thing that I don't feel like a lot of people know is, like, what's the dynamic here?
Family Dynamics and Hunting Background
00:02:39
Speaker
Like, unless you, like, a lot of people probably see DC Predator. They see coyotes getting smoked, but I don't think a lot of people understand the family dynamic that that ever that we kind of just alluded to. So what's the what's the DC Predator dynamic?
00:02:54
Speaker
You want tell him? Yeah, sure. I don't mind telling it. So um I'm Cameron's dad, although I'm not in as many of the videos as you might see Ken in. And Ken's my brother. So all family connected through blood, ah connected for our love of hunting coyotes.
00:03:12
Speaker
And we... We keep it nice and tight knit for a reason, but it's it's also been a wonderful opportunity for us to to strengthen relationships that we have and to do what most of us would love, and that's to spend more quality time together with the people that we love. And so I will say hunting's always been of interest to me um but means so much more now because it's allowed me to spend time, more time with my son.
00:03:46
Speaker
And so for that, like, I just, I can't imagine a better scenario for a father than to be able to go out as often as we do be with my brother, who I love and spend time with my boy. I would literally give anything to spend one more weekend hunting with my father. So trying to make as many of those memories as we can now while ah time and health permits. Yeah.
00:04:09
Speaker
Heck yeah. Well, how did you guys, how did DC Predators start? you okay well um guess i i I started kyle hunting with my dad when I was pretty young. I can't remember exactly how old I was.
00:04:22
Speaker
um He worked hard and didn't have as much time to hunt as I do. I feel blessed that I have a schedule where I can hunt as much as I do. But when he only had opportunities, I went with him, sometimes with his brothers.
00:04:36
Speaker
and And I just, from a pretty young age, was very interested in it. I went along on some of their deer hunts, and for some reason, that just wasn't my game. um we When we were young men, we hunted jackrabbits a lot, and that was some fun because it was a faster pace. And for me, the coyote hunting was kind of the perfect storm. You know you have...
00:04:55
Speaker
a 365 days of the year season. You don't have to get drawn or any of that. And it's it's a lot more challenging than just going out and finding some rabbits. So I started getting the the love and the interest when I went with my dad a few times and wasn't until Probably, I can't remember how how old Cam was, but we went together, the three of us, the first time as a group when Cam was still pretty little. I was like eight, I think. Eight? and That's awesome. He's pretty young.
00:05:23
Speaker
He was eight, but still he spotted the coyotes before us. We were using an old hand collar and hunting on some property near my dad's best friend's farm where they had had problems with coyotes before. And that was part of what made me interested in it, too, was the coyotes. killing a bunch of chickens. Like they killed 40 chickens one night or they'd kill a goat. Once they spooked a horse and it was their prize horse and then tried to jump the fence and impaled itself. So I hated coyotes for those kinds of things.
00:05:49
Speaker
But I really loved hunting them. Cam spotted the coyotes on our first hunt together. We had a quad coming in. Scott was ah on the rifle that day and and shot one and and was like,
00:06:00
Speaker
like a switch flipped in me. And then I was like, I want to do this as much as I can. yeah And then it took a few years before my schedule and my circumstances were such that I could hunt more.
00:06:10
Speaker
And the height of it was probably about COVID because you could go out and do whatever you want
Impact of COVID on Hunting
00:06:15
Speaker
in COVID. you don't have to worry about it if you're six feet away from someone. I hated wearing a mask. I could just go out and be outside and do what I loved. And and I was having so much fun when I could talk someone else into it. I would. Cam was always game for it.
00:06:28
Speaker
we we started doing... hunts in some kind of nearby areas that didn't take a whole lot of driving to get to. And pretty soon, it just, the game kept escalating. You know, we we graduated from the hand calls to electronic calls.
00:06:46
Speaker
Cam was my, probably came with me the most in those early days. And and he started developing an interest in video. And so early on, we we tried to video a few things and it was it was really in its infancy then. um But over the over those first few years, Cam got really, really good at videography and editing. And he's like Spielberg out there now. we go out there and and we can record these awesome experiences that we have to share them with our other brothers and our friends and and to remember those experiences ourselves and share them with other people. And man, we're just having a blast doing it now. It's amazing.
00:07:25
Speaker
grown into something that uh is i think is really special yeah and and i can't get enough of it still yeah i i freaking i know that as a rookie coyote hunter essentially uh like the first time i coyote hunted and i i lived with a guy my roommate my former roommate was a big time predator hunter and this dude is taking off all winter like going for four or five days at a time to get to good ground and and staying down there and murdering. And I'm like, man, I got i got too much stuff to do. Like coyote hunting, what? yeah And then he finally talked me into going out with him. And that first the first time we called a coyote in, I was like, what have i been doing? Like, why? i don't i think people don't get it, and I think there's more people out there like me. Like, that was the whole point of War on Dogs and Hogs is I think there's more people out there like me that were like –
00:08:22
Speaker
cat yeah whatever go kill some coyotes like they don't understand how hard it is how much fun it is and like when you like when you hit the call and you see a coyote come running in like that is for me it is yeah it is the coolest thing ever and you can and then you shoot that coyote you drag it to the truck if you're going to keep it or whatever you're going to do with it and then you go drive to the next stand and you get a chance to do it all over yeah i have ah i have a i have a tinge of the add right and so for me like that is it's perfect like it is fast-paced because like you i've and i love hunting all all the way around right not just coyotes but but anything where you're calling animals and you're interacting with animals and you're kind of beating them at their game and then and then like you take it with elk it's cool like a big time archery elk hunter just because of the calling aspect i've never killed a bull with ah with a rifle. I've only killed him with bows because that's what you can call him. And anytime you get to interact with him and beat him at their own game, but
00:09:25
Speaker
coyotes what i found is it it completely changes the game because you you're trying to beat a predator at their own game and they have sharp eyes like their senses they're smart so um but yeah i think if more people tried it more people would would be hopelessly addicted to it yeah man for real what uh what they're missing yeah they don't hopefully we're gonna we're gonna try to change that i don't know if it'll be for the better because then there'll probably be a little bit more competition for coyote hunting ground and all that but but i just make us have to be better because they'll they'll be educating coyotes and we'll just have to work harder that's the that's the way to look at it i like that but what is what does dc predator stand for
00:10:09
Speaker
You want to take that again? You go take that. have You say it the best. I don't give it justice. So for a long time, we we did kind of play that card close to the best for a number of reasons.
00:10:22
Speaker
But the really where it comes from is the unique sound that happens when the bullet impacts the coyote. Yeah.
00:10:32
Speaker
And so the first several times we went out... Not suppressed. Not suppressed. It wasn't as noticeable. But then as as we started shooting suppressed, that sound was so unique and so cool. And the story I like to tell about it, which is kind of, i think, what when the the phrase was spawned, was I was sitting in a stand where I couldn't see. I knew a cop was coming in, but I couldn't see.
00:11:03
Speaker
And then someone squeezes off around and I hear that sound of the bullet impact. And I was like, that is clearly means we got a dead coyote. So DC stands for what I coined as the death clap.
00:11:20
Speaker
So we, we i in its infancy, I thought about some merch that would have death clap on it. But then as we considered clap,
00:11:32
Speaker
what that might be like to some of our partners who were kind enough to trust us with their brand. We didn't know if that would be frowned upon. And so we, we kept it as DC.
00:11:44
Speaker
But yeah, death clap is what it stands for. And it's been, it's been fun to, to up our game. And one thing that's really important to us is to try to recreate everything the best that we can on how we experienced it and share that with the viewer. And so Cameron has done a lot of research and we've invested heavily to get the right microphones to capture that sound. And so one thing that I believe sets us apart some from our competition is the the acoustics there and it's because of that. And so if you want next time you watch our content, pay attention and see if you don't pick up on the the different sounds that it makes. And then also just for a challenge, see if you can tell from just the audio the difference between a body shot and a coconut shot. That sound is also unique. And we've had situations where someone shot and I couldn't see. And I'm like, that was in there. Well, I mean, that's definitely, i would say, something that sets you apart, like the sound design. the audio and then obviously cam's amazing work behind the camera in general is just edge is top-notch there's really not many folks out there doing that there's plenty of folks out there killing coyotes but there's not many that are recording it on that level and and able to share the experience and and i i i
The Art of Filming Hunts
00:13:16
Speaker
mean i think it's great because i can't get like
00:13:19
Speaker
Anytime you guys post something, I watch it like three or four times because I can't get enough seeing coyotes hit the dirt, you know? What was crazy is in the beginning, we started filming to tell people about stories that we'd had. had And then you forget sometimes how stands played out and you watch it on camera and you realize it's different than in your head, how you play it. Sometimes it's cooler in your head than it happened or vice versa. Yeah.
00:13:43
Speaker
But it teaches us a ton and that put us into the analytical phase, which is something that we do a ton. But yeah, I remember filming those first couple ones and then you're just like, wow, he wasn't coming in as hard as I could put it, put it my brain or he was coming into a different sound. And then, then our wheel started spinning. Once we started recording it, of Hey, we got track this data. But yeah, it's fun.
00:14:06
Speaker
That's yeah. You guys, you guys are in a, I would say you're in a league of your own when it comes to that. Yeah, thank you. a yeah i would love to I would love to settle for what we have right now, but it's not in our nature and it's certainly not in his nature now i'm not gonna start to stay static. And so what we do is we continue to look at others, not only in our industry, but ah in other industries and try and learn every time we get a chance to learn. and improve and get better. And so i I appreciate that compliment. It's easy for me to accept it because it's not me doing it. It's my son and I'm a proud dad, but I will just tell you, I will just tell you this buckle up. It's going to get better. All right. I like that. Yeah. Is that all you can tell me? Yeah. for hate surprises. All right. All right. I'll, I'll shut up on that then.
00:14:59
Speaker
um So you guys do a lot of daytime hunting, probably because you're in Arizona, but um let's start, let's talk a little bit like what, you guys primarily hunter in the daytime, like what is your, what's your game plan for, cause we got a lot of people. I think we, we introduced a lot of people to coyote hunting through that war on dogs and hogs. And now that's over. Um, like, like let's, uh, just run a ah scenario. Like you guys getting set up, going out, making a stand. Like, how are you guys picking apart terrain? I know you guys have been doing it for a long time, right? I, I haven't, but I've been doing it enough now that like, If I go to a property, I know I know where to make a stand. But if I go into a new property, I still I still sit there and do a lot of second guessing.
00:15:42
Speaker
Right. So what's your guys is what's your strategy? I'll save my stuff first and then I'll let you guys roll it in. So it always starts on Onyx or wherever mapping software that I'm using. So finding the area is the first thing that we pick.
00:15:57
Speaker
We pick the area based off of several features, but that specific day I'll have several areas lined up. And as soon as we get together, usually at dark in the morning, we'll find where the wind's best and then we'll roll out to one of those three options generally is how it goes.
00:16:12
Speaker
But what I look for on maps is after we've hunted enough, I can look at a topo and see what kind of terrain features house the most coyotes. And then after I find where I house the most coyotes, I'm looking at areas that I can kill them. So kill boxes, open lanes, elevation.
00:16:29
Speaker
So those are the three things. I first find an area that's usually roads, far from people. I find an area where I know the coyotes are, what type of vegetation they're going to be at. And then the third thing is how am I going to kill them in that area?
00:16:41
Speaker
And I try to pick as many stands in that general AO so that I can maximize my efficiency. And I do that for three spots. And then I usually send these guys texts the night before, say, hey, how does this look? how does this look?
00:16:54
Speaker
And then in the morning, you know, wind switches, whatever, we can move on the fly and go. But would say first thing was finding on maps where we're going. The second thing I would say our kit is absolutely dialed. We've done this so long that like Ken's truck is always loaded. My truck is loaded. We know exactly what we need, what we don't.
00:17:14
Speaker
So that's already prepped. And then we roll out to the area. And once we get to the area, we're dead quiet. Most of the coyotes that we call in that are really good on camera are within like 200, 300 yards of us as soon as we sit down. So we're dead quiet. I'll let these guys go into how we call them in. Yeah. ah our Our individual stand setup varies from time to time, mostly based on the specifics of that exact spot that we've picked.
00:17:39
Speaker
Generally, what we're doing is we we're not just killing coyotes. We want to get them on video. So we've got to, we usually, we Cam will determine where he he needs the camera to be. And then we can position shooters based on that with what other cover or concealment, I should say, there is available.
Hunting Strategies and Setup
00:17:56
Speaker
And sometimes there's not much. um I have my favorite type of trees. Sometimes I get teased about, that's a Ken tree right there. We like to try to blend into the terrain as good as we can and use shade if we can. but The optimal situation is we have a favorable wind and we're able to conceal ourselves.
00:18:15
Speaker
Most important is the wind. So sometimes we'll sacrifice a little bit of concealment um to to have a favorable wind. And that could be a crosswind sometimes. And so we're setting up the call.
00:18:28
Speaker
Every stand is different, but we're setting up the call in a place where we can have shooters that can cover where the call is. Because the coyotes, even after you shut off the sound, they know where the call is, and generally they're trying to go right to it. yeah So you set up in a way that hopefully they're not going to get wind before you can get a lane on them to video and to kill them.
00:18:46
Speaker
So sometimes we have more guys. Sometimes it's just Cam and I. it's It's easier to conceal fewer guys, but sometimes we'll have more shooters and we'll be able to cover some bigger lanes. Sometimes there's there's a lot more trees or bushes, so it's nice to have other shooters to cover all those different lanes. on But the that's kind of the basics of a setup. standby Stand by stand, it can vary every time.
00:19:11
Speaker
Yeah, I appreciate that you asked that question because this is probably the most common question we get on the social media platforms. and and i will And so I think if this will be good for me to be able to say, hey, bud, like go to this Tricer podcast and listen from minute mark 10 to whatever. Yeah. And and we'll share it um But having said that, like, we love those questions. We love the interaction with everyone. We try really hard to respond. Every comment. Every comment. It's hard to the point where sometimes people will we'll ask a question on Instagram and I'll just call them and talk to them because we feel...
00:19:54
Speaker
that like if we could have learned this earlier it would helped bingo and and we also appreciate so much the people that helped us learn things too right so um we we have we feel a certain level of duty if you will to to the craft that we do to share um but the only other things i would add to what these guys said is I can't overestimate the value of the time Cameron and Ken spend on the maps prepping.
00:20:23
Speaker
okay We're not just rolling in. I can't overstate the importance of having a plan. So even the path we take to drive where we're parking the truck and the path we take to walking into the stand is calculated.
00:20:39
Speaker
And i I want to emphasize the importance of like the approach to the stand. And so you can buy the world's baddest gun.
00:20:51
Speaker
If you're lucky, you'll buy it a Tricer tripod to shoot off. There's your shameless plug. you can get You can get the best sounds and calls, all of that.
00:21:02
Speaker
if you're really lackadaisical about your entry to the stand, the noise you make, blowing your scent all over and and things like that, you're screwed.
00:21:14
Speaker
And so it's been really fun for us to see where sometimes we can be really good and on our game and drop the call down, flick it on and have coyotes coming in in seconds. And I know you won't believe me when I say this, but Cam and I had a hunk the other day. here It was real.
00:21:35
Speaker
He sneaks out, puts the call down. He turns it on and within five seconds coyote appeared. So you tell me how close was that coyote? He was under 150 for sure. Okay. He's close.
00:21:47
Speaker
So, so I, I, I feel like one of the mistakes we made, and I'm going to assume some of the people listening make is sweet. I'm going to go call coyotes and I'm gonna get really good at coyotes.
00:22:01
Speaker
What can I buy? Yeah. And there's a lot of things that will help you and have certainly helped us, but you can't buy your way into just using your brain.
00:22:12
Speaker
So practice all the skills you already know as a hunter about how to use the wind, how to sneak up, how to conceal yourself. Get really good at those. It's only gonna help you down the road to get all these reps. And understand that like when you're rolling in to hunt coyotes, you're rolling into their domain.
00:22:30
Speaker
And I promise you, it's not a walk in the park. So i think sometimes people see videos and they think, oh sweet, like i could do that if like I was there because they have like way more coyotes than me. That may be true, but I will just tell you what When we're looking at how to get better, we're not looking at how to get better than other people. We're looking at how to get better than we were yesterday. And that requires a lot of just calculated effort and intentionality.
00:23:01
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. absolutely and i'd say i'd say yeah like treating a coyote like it just a ah light bulb went off as you were talking like if you treat going into set up for a stand because i've done you're talking about being lax days ago going in to make a stand i've done it i'm sure you guys there's probably days where you do it too right all the time yep but if you treat every time you're going in to make a stand more like ah like you're going to make a stock on a mule deer right then you're you're gonna probably have a lot more of those experiences where depending on the country and the terrain you're in right uh you're gonna have a lot more of those experiences where you flip the call on there's a coyote within 150 yards of the call uh and there i mean and you're not gonna have those experiences period if you're just kind of romping in there like for me i do i have to cross a lot of fences and so like where i cross the fence matters and how much noise that makes like i can think of probably 10 times in the last five days that I've hopped a fence and made too much freaking noise but but some of sometimes you can do something about it and and I know Scott and Cam both know because you guys are vertically challenged as well um fence crossing fence crossing stuff for us start guys is under it yeah you a lot of sometimes sometimes they put it low though so i definitely i definitely will go under if i can um but but yeah so that that's a ah super good point i would so what getting out of kind of the stands and and i do want to talk about kind of some of your go-to sounds in a minute but but you made me think of something like what
00:24:43
Speaker
Filming like just getting a coyote shot and and I've had the opportunity to go out now and and have some coyotes yeah Shot on film and bring camera guys with me that aren't coyote hunters So I think I think it's huge to have a guy that is a coyote hunter Yeah, running the camera like that.
00:25:00
Speaker
You don't get that because most coyote hunters Like if me and my buddy go out, I don't want to run the camera. I want to pull trigger. Right. So you don't, you don't get that one. And then that's a ah selfless sacrifice on cams part to be able to create the content and share the content, right? Cam's obviously not pulling the trigger as much as, as the two of you are, but,
00:25:23
Speaker
but acknowledging that sacrifice but at the same time like i i've had so many like we went out with a group of guys for a company and they were filming and and those stands i i 89 sure some of them we had coyotes coming in and they they they stopped up at like 150 200 yards and i think it was probably because you know the the camera guys are are just they you if you're not a coyote hunter having a dude running a camera and moving and like you guys know how to move so but how how does that change the game like that it's still even with cam like i'm sure there's times where you get pop trying to move the camera or get the shot like how how much more difficult i i know it adds a level of difficulty but how much more difficult
00:26:13
Speaker
are you Do you want to get into like the gear set of what changes or the actual like where we're sitting and stuff? cause I mean, where you're sitting. like in and i mean do you Are you shooting every coyote that comes in? ors No. to so I guess here's how the stand usually rolls, and Ken touched on this earlier. we We roll in together. i find an area where the call is going to be that I can see the call and see the most amount of ground.
00:26:41
Speaker
And then they're second and third place. So they get to find areas that they can still shoot, have lanes over the call. But I get primary focus. And then you see me run headsets on every stand and running in some sort of comms.
00:26:54
Speaker
And that, I think, was the one thing, one gear purchase that, like, leveled up our couch film, like, night and day was because before we'd have to sit, Ken and I, like, this really close. And like you were saying,
00:27:07
Speaker
I have a camera that has like a 105 millimeter objective lens. It's like this big. If there's any sound that kind of, it's like a beacon, like a mirror sticking out to them. So it's like you've got Ken here with a rifle, has to move. I'm here. It's like just sticking your thumb out there. They're going to see you. So being able to split up, you take really good cover. I take really good cover in comms and the comm system we run, we just say green or red.
00:27:32
Speaker
So if a coyote's coming in, the first person that sees it says, hey, 10 o'clock left to right coming in hard or slow, circling, whatever. So you don't have to like look over, talk to the guy, or give hand signals. You're just on your tripod, 12 o'clock, 150 yards coming in straight. And then as soon as I hear the first call, I find it and I get on I say green. Camera's green means you're free to take it whenever. So we've had the last week we went out, we had a coyote come in.
00:28:01
Speaker
I think Ken called it out first. yeah He's like right in front of us. Okay, cool. ah Greens comes and stops right in front of a bush for me. So I'm like red. So Ken's sitting at this thing, looking at it, like going to ear hole him at 30 yards. I had to sit and wait. This coyote scared at the call for so long and decided he's going to go away. he kind of turns and walks away.
00:28:21
Speaker
dad ended up rolling them with the 28 but it's having the comms was huge because we're all concealed and then we don't have to do that but just like you're talking about the movement is what the cons pick up the most so it doesn't matter how big or flashy my camera is i mean i tape it up and i do a bunch of stuff to keep it concealed but It's mostly the, there's a coyote there, or I'm panning the whatever, or you're moving your rifle that they're going to see.
Communication and Learning from Filming
00:28:46
Speaker
oh yeah. So when they're coming in, we're we've all read body language enough on the coyotes that we can know, hey, he's locked in, we can get away with movement, or he's looking away, i can swing now. But yeah the comms are what separates...
00:28:59
Speaker
us getting them on film now versus not in the past. It was, like you said, we didn't kill every coyote because I have a lane. Ken doesn't have a lane. Ken has a lane. I don't have a lane. And now coyotes are walking in and out and just sucked. But yeah,
00:29:14
Speaker
And even the crowds that we killed may not have made it to the internet because yeah when when it was a good lane for the shooter, we didn't know the that it was behind a bush. And so it's on camera, but the quality of the content isn't up to Cameron's standard. And so there's been a number of those.
00:29:35
Speaker
situations where it's awesome experiences that we'd love to share, but we feel part of our brand is we're only going to put out quality stuff. And if that means less content so that we don't have to sacrifice or compromise, that means less content. I suppose that means we're just to have to go kill him another guy. These guys, these guys hate me for it. Cause I literally have hundreds of kills on camera that we won't post and will never be posted because I just have OCD and I'm only going to post the, you know, top tier stuff. But yeah, it's, I'll tell you, these guys hate me for it. It's one funny story. I'll tell but Hate's probably strong. yeah
00:30:14
Speaker
One funny story I'll tell about that, that I think was the first coyote we ever caught on camera. oh yeah And the camera was like a Sony hand. It was a Sony Handycam. was like the X one. It was like, it just got 1080p. It was like horrible. It was probably from like 1984. I bought it off Facebook. It was like 400 bucks. and And actually I think Cameron's, my youngest son was running it that day.
00:30:41
Speaker
He couldn't have been eight years old. yeah ah But the reason I have some regrets over that is we shoot this coyote. And it's it's like they do sometimes. He starts that death spin and I put another round in him and this thing jumps up and does a headstand and like stalls standing on its head and then tips over. the breakke dancing co was cock. It really was. And I'm like, holy cow. so But it'll never get posted. It'll never get posted.
00:31:12
Speaker
It's on video? it Yes, it is. why i mean, come on. yeah dude i'm sorry That's for our OnlyFans account, dude. You got to subscribe. yeah hey i don't subscribe that or something i like i don't I don't know, though. might be good to show people that it wasn't always you weren't always ah Before and after, right? Yeah. yeah or Or even do like you know stuff that didn't didn't make the cut, but here's our didn't make the cut Wednesday. you know Right. It's not a bad idea, I'm just saying. right um
00:31:49
Speaker
I'll think about it. Think about it. But how... but how Filming's got to make you slow down. I mean, you guys already said you're meticulous. Like you kind of treat going into stands like but like a mule deer stock for for for lack of better comparison or for a comparison that that most of our listeners will understand.
00:32:09
Speaker
How's that? But yeah that's got to make you, I mean, slow down. So you get to see, you get to watch that coyote. You watch that coyote a lot longer than I do, I'm sure. way if you're back green red green red green like as soon as i got a shot because i don't have cam there telling me i can't kill it i'm smoking the the coyote so that that has to teach you a lot about the behavior what you can get away with so talk about some of that because i feel like that is something that's probably overlooked and and that i feel like to me it's like
00:32:42
Speaker
yeah these guys you guys get to you watch these coyotes like i'm sure you see some come into the call and then blow out of there like yeah yeah yeah i'll say the one i'll say one thing and i'm sure these guys have stuff to add but the one thing we noticed for sure is i think jeff was the one that phrased this this um this quote but If they're not leaving, they're still coming. So, yeah coyotes, a lot of times. Jeff. Jeff.
00:33:10
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, he's a savage. We love that. Sounds like a Jeff quote. I love it. Yeah. But there're there's so many times when coyotes stop, and normally, like you said, when we weren't filming, we'd pop them.
00:33:23
Speaker
And they'll come in all the way to the call. it comes down to body language. Yeah. we have probably three X to how much behavior we've seen just on filming because now I know, Hey, when he's hung up at a hundred yards and normally I would shoot him, this Kyle would break another 50 for sure.
00:33:40
Speaker
And then, it then once you get into that 50 realm of you're in the comfort zone, Now we're learning how to stop them and know exactly how many paces they're going to take before we're going to kill them. So we've learned and watched enough footage that now Ken knows exactly how far based off body language he's going to stop the call so that he's, that Kai will walk into the lane he has. It's, it's, it's taught us a ton for sure. But the, the biggest thing is as long as you're not moving, there's they'll still come in and just got to make sure you got wind. Yeah. Every once a while we'll have somebody,
00:34:14
Speaker
I don't want to name names. so So someone might come with us who has not done it as much and they'll take a shot a little early. And it'll surprise me because I'm like, in my mind, I'm thinking, no, I got another 50 yards or whatever before I take the shot.
00:34:29
Speaker
And it's hard to wait. I'm mad at anybody because I, this is one of the hardest things in in life is waiting to take the shot. Oh yeah. So that's, that definitely what Cam said is, is so true. The more reps who get watching their body language and learning their behavior, the better and better it gets. And man, if you, the only, the only time when you get a little anxious is if you're worried they're going to get the wind.
00:34:55
Speaker
yeah And if you're, if you're careful and you're paying attention to where the wind is, then you, even that, you know, Hey, I got it. I got this much room before I got to smoke it where he's going to get our wind and leave. And it's way more fun to shoot a coyote that stopped than to try to hit a runner. mit It's better odds. I should say it's still fun to hit a runner. Yeah. Yeah. That's fun when you do connect for sure. they roll seem to got more pairs and double Yeah. So I'll,
00:35:20
Speaker
I'll add to this and maybe make a confession that that's not the first time I've had to make this confession, but I am the quick trigger. Yeah, that's that. And the the regret that comes from pulling the trigger,
00:35:37
Speaker
too soon is like 18 times worse than the regret that comes from letting the coyote come too close. yeah Does that make sense? I'll be like, who shot that? We knew who shot it. Like, why are we asking? We know it was me. But I'll say that it's like, what fixed it for me, or and it still hasn't fixed it, but what's helped me is understanding that these digital assets that we capture, this video and these pictures that we capture, really is our product. It's what we trade. It's it's the commodity. And so... How we learn.
00:36:10
Speaker
So as if as we capture more and more of this, i start to realize, look, even eight more seconds... of good, clear, crisp coyote content is gold, is gold. It is so hard to find footage of a coyote for long periods of time. They don't sit still, okay? And you gotta be really good to capture it. And so once I started realizing this is an asset that we're trading,
00:36:39
Speaker
it It made sense in my mind to let let's let them come in. And we've so I've certainly screwed up a lot more stands by shooting early than I have from shooting late. So from a training standpoint, those that are listening, I would just say, yeah, you're you're a lot more likely to make a mistake early than to make it late. So push yourself and see if you can get them closer. And I will tell you, the adrenaline dump is that much better. Yeah, when they're close. When sometimes I feel like these coyotes are looking at me in my face. yeah When I squeeze one off and that, like, that's really fun. As opposed to say, you're riding in your tractor and you see a Coyote 400, you pull out your rifle and you pop him and drop him. That's cool too.
00:37:23
Speaker
But to me, it's not as cool as the up close and personal. And then what Cameron referenced that I want to add to it is, we have found... way more often these coyotes are not rolling in by themselves. They're paired up. Okay.
00:37:38
Speaker
And so if you're smacking this first coyote early, i would tell you in ah in a large percentage of the time, you're handicapping your ability to get a double. yeah And so, and I've said this before too, so I'm sorry if I'm repeating myself, but the math isn't one coyote is 50 awesome, two coyotes is 100 awesome. The math is...
00:38:00
Speaker
One coyote is 50 awesome. Two coyotes is like 300 awesome. And then when you get a triple, it's like off the charts. yeah yeah The fun that we have in the stands when we're getting coyotes ripping in from all angles, and then you're able to one,
00:38:15
Speaker
drop them, but to get it on film, like that feels like insane. in us It's so amazing. And then to be able to like Cameron will have the video edited that same time. I'll get so jazzed up. I'll just spend them. clearstead but I'll get a text that night and get to rewatch You gotta go. You gotta go. And the adrenaline hits again, dude. so So don't, don't handicap your ability for multiples by just smacking the first coyote at the first opportunity. Yeah.
00:38:43
Speaker
Yeah, no, that's i mean, I never even thought about that aspect. Like now you got me sitting here thinking back to all the all the singles I killed them like, is there more? yeah i mean, I mean, I'm in a little bit different country. um So I can see a little bit further. So I think it is a little country dependent, like. The hard part about getting into my stands is so like, sometimes there's no way for me to get into, if there's a coyote there and I, I roll around the hill, they see me coming into the stand sometimes. So like I'm looking at your truck. Yeah. Or in the truck and I'm looking at like ghillie suits and I'm looking like, do I prone out in this stand? You know, and I don't really like coyote hunting from the prone at all, but, but like, There's some spots where I hunt where it's just, I mean, there's rolling hills, but there's no, there's no like eye high cover for the coyote. So it, it, uh, it is a, it adds a ah different factor to it. But now I'm thinking all these times I've smoked like the first coyote that I saw come up out of the river bottom. I'm like,
00:39:43
Speaker
Was there another one there? Yeah. You know, uh, let's, what's your guys is. So everybody, i i get asked this and, and my favorite answer is I'll ask you the question and I'll tell you my favorite answer when people, when people ask me, cause I, I'm new to it and I gotta, I have a system now. I kind of follow kind of what Jeff has preaches and, and, and cause he's basically the one that I lean on, you know, with our partnership with lucky duck and and he's a wealth of knowledge. but calling strategy, right? I, I constantly get asked, Hey, what sounds are working? What's working? Like people have asked me that on my like Facebook posts or Instagram posts. And I'm like, hell man, I just press buttons till a coyote starts coming in. Like it was in reality. Like I'm not the guy to give,
00:40:31
Speaker
I'm not the guy to give sound advice. I'm asking for sound advice from you guys, from the Jeffs of the world, right? The people that that have the experience and the reps. But but what what is your calling strategy? Like, what's your, like, you go up, you get the call set out, you got your stand all set, everything's good to go. Like, what sounds are you running? What's your favorite sounds? How long are you on stand for? Give me that kind of whole rundown for for the DC Predator crew.
Sound Choices and Hunting Tactics
00:40:58
Speaker
So the guys that have followed us know we're very analytical and we track data on everything. So we've been tracking data five years or six, maybe six years. i think it's six years and we've done whole years where we do All vocals, we've done years, we've done all bird, all rabbit. So now we have a very good baseline of what's hitting and what's not, because we can look back and say, hey, we killed X amount when we were running bird this year, X amount or doing vocals or whatever. whatever We found our area like baby cottontail. It's like our our biggest hitter.
00:41:28
Speaker
And we've also found starting soft in the beginning and then working up. And then the summers, we usually run vocals like Puff Distress and fights, but the cots we have are pretty small. So running like a big old, you know, big jack or something isn't going trigger them as much as like a little baby Cometail initially.
00:41:44
Speaker
And then we've also found in the very, very beginning that we're rolling up so close to these coyotes because we're quiet that you rip a vocal at 30 volume and it's going to blow him out because he was 200 yards and he knows there's not a coyote there ripping a how that loud. So yeah um Ken could go on the call sequence. He's the one that runs the call, but I'll say after the six years and tracking all the data, looking at the data, reviewing it, baby pound tail is the thing that's killing the coyotes every single month of the year. Yeah. Yeah.
00:42:12
Speaker
Yeah, we've done it. That's true. Every single, we've killed coyotes every month of the year on on prey distress. And I would say 99% of the time it's it's a cottontail sound. And and so most of the time now we start our sequence with Baby Cottontail Demise. it's That's like my number one sound.
00:42:31
Speaker
and And we usually, like Cam mentioned, we we'll start out sometimes a little softer, because we've had we've had multiple stands, several of them on film, where we've had a coyote come and killed in less than a minute. yeah So you know they're really close, and I think it's because of that. we didn't you know If you startle them with the full max volume sound were right off the bat, then You're sabotaging. Give them your top five sounds right now when you go for it. Yeah, that's what I want right now.
00:43:01
Speaker
Baby Cottontail Demise is my number one. And I'll usually play the first sound for about three minutes. yeah okay Then these days, my second sound is I can't remember the order they're in, I think it's Fuzz Butt yep and then and then Fuzz Nuts.
00:43:16
Speaker
and And each one of those I'll play for maybe three minutes, maybe two and a half. It depends on the stand. I might play it a little less. you guys You guys are running Lucky Duck, right? Lucky Duck, yeah. I'm going to interrupt you. So Fuzz Butt and Fuzz Nuts, is that in the baby cottontail? That's that's in the cottontail folder. And you I guess people might be able to organize it different. But, that yeah, it's in the cottontail folder.
00:43:37
Speaker
yeah Yeah, we have our little SD set up, you know, very specific and in certain order. So it's easy to get to. OK. So that that's probably my first three.
00:43:48
Speaker
Sometimes depending on the stand where we're at, I might go to like a woodpecker after that, but more often than not, I'm doing another cottontail sound and it might be, if it's a puff balls. Yeah, puff balls is a good one that's a small sound. If it's a windy day, I might go to a louder one like shelter belt or cotton ball or sometimes even TNT.
00:44:09
Speaker
And then there's some other, some of the other new ones like, uh, Cotton Mouth, I think is a good one. Hoptimus Prime. There's a, there's a lot of really good. I don't know i have Hoptimus Prime on there. yeah That's it.
00:44:21
Speaker
Yeah. Cool name. If nothing else, right. Those are on the Super Revolt 2.0. Yeah. Okay. I've got the Super Revolt 2.0. So I'll have to look in there. A lot of those sounds aren't on some of the other callers. So.
00:44:32
Speaker
You got to get the big, so big mamma jamma to get those secrets. you guys are running the super revolt 2.0. and We run all of them, but that one, when we need all the volume, that's the one we need. Okay.
00:44:43
Speaker
Yeah, but we've killed coyotes on literally every call that Lucky Duck offers. Every call that's really on the market. and you And I would just say this. That's a common question we get, too, about what sounds.
00:44:55
Speaker
And while certainly we're getting it refined and and it does make a difference, I would say, like... it's so much more about all of the other things. um and And like I said, I don't wanna diminish the the awesome quality of the sounds and the calls, but I would just say, because I think sounds can be geography specific, my advice to someone starting new is start with those, pay attention, track your data and do what works.
00:45:32
Speaker
yeah okay well that's why i told you guys you might drop your call in tennessee and and for whatever reason they like bird sounds i i don't know i can just say that like the way we learned it is get your butt out there pay attention to what you're doing make notes learn and get better so yeah absolutely i mean reps are reps are the key and i mean that's why i answer that That's why I answer that question the same way, right? Like I, hell man, I don't know. i just press buttons till I see a coyote show up, right? um Because there is a, I mean, you guys can tell me that, right? And I can go out there and run those sounds and I'm in a different state and way different vegetation, way different weather, way different everything, right? And those sounds might not work for me, but like, you're naming sounds that are on the call that I have that I don't even know about. And I'm like, you know, maybe I should, you know what i mean? Like you can always pick something up and it gives you something new to try.
00:46:31
Speaker
Right. So like, you know, maybe I can, I haven't really played any of the baby cottontail sounds like, I usually, my stand starts with like a lucky pecker. If it's not called out area, usually I start right with like a, some kind of louder, uh, cottontail or, or jackrabbit. And then if it is a called out area, I'm going to go to my lucky pecker. going to go to my mouse squeaks,
00:46:58
Speaker
some of those sounds because it's something they haven't heard me playing before and it helps that it works. Yeah, what you were saying on the flipping sounds to works, the more that we've seen, it's a triggered response. It's not a, it' you're not setting the scene so that they're going to come in because they thought through every every sound and now they're coming in. It's a triggered response just like bass fishing, whatever.
00:47:21
Speaker
So the more sounds you have, the more tools you have, it's going to trigger them. And you've seen this enough that You play one sound and you might have a coyote and he hangs up and then you flip another one and now he's coming. So it's just like you were saying, it's a triggered response. You've got to find what works in that area. But having the ability to just switch sounds and learn what works is huge. i remember in the beginning when we had not good calls or just when calls were early on, you had like eight sounds. And so...
00:47:48
Speaker
If they didn't come in those eight, the stand was over. You know, you're done. down Now you can sit in a stand for two hours playing ah all the sounds, you know, and you might get one to hit, so... well you know and and i think that's a big one to hit on too because that's another and again like jeff talks about this a lot he talks about you know coyote hunters there's no there's not a science there's not ah a study done on what sounds bring a coyote in right like there there is no no science to it but there is experience right so when i first when i first got my my lucky duck super revolt i went out and played the sounds
00:48:24
Speaker
that my roommate, who was you know my first coyote hunting partner and kind of exposed me to it and took me out, he had a lucky duck. So I knew ah Psycho Jack, and I knew what sounds. So I would go, those are the sounds I'm playing because I've seen them work before, right? And then until they're not working for me, I'm like, all right, well, let me try this sound, and then let me try this sound. then And then the other night, my my lady was up here cooking, or she was up here on a work call, and I was downstairs cooking. and I put my collar on one and I was like well let's see what some of these sounds sound like because some of I've never even played before and I was like I should probably hear it before I play it and the first time I'm hearing it's in the field so I'm in the kitchen cooking and she comes downstairs and when everything's all said and done she's like hey uh
00:49:08
Speaker
did you, did you hear those kids outside like or screaming? And I was like, Oh, that was me playing pup distress in the kitchen while i was cooking dinner. Um, ah but it sounds like, sounds like you've got the bug dude. Yeah. She was like, yeah, if you could not do that when I'm on a work call again, that would be awesome. I guess it's fair. I thought i want I want to jump in and say something here, a hot take for you.
Hunting as an Art and Science
00:49:32
Speaker
and And hopefully this doesn't upset him, but I'm going to disagree with Jeff. When you say that it's not a science, I would say this. I think it is a beautiful blend of art and science.
00:49:44
Speaker
And I think Jeff is part of the science. think he has it dialed. and And what I mean by that is because he's been so good to share information. his experiences and because other crews, including us, continue to share that and test and test and test.
00:50:01
Speaker
That to me is the science. And yeah so yeah you're right you're like, there's definitely a feel to it. And these guys have mastered that where they go in and they're just like, today really feels like this, but the more data we can capture. And like I said, Jeff's a big part of that.
00:50:17
Speaker
um Then, then you can turn it into a science. And I do think you can improve your efficiency time and time again, so that, you know, more often than not, you're getting the responses that you want. So,
00:50:32
Speaker
It's the fun it's a fun industry to be a part of right now. I think it's an emerging market. More and more people are coming to it. We're learning more. There's more and more coyotes to kill. And so I appreciate, again, another shameless plug, I appreciate companies like Tricer bringing it to light and making it a focus of what they do so that we can somehow kind of shed this I don't know. I feel like there's this unspoken kind of hierarchy within hunters that like, well, I only hunt Africa, so I'm like most important and you just hunt whitetails. So you're down there like two steps below me, maybe throw elk in there somewhere.
00:51:10
Speaker
And then you guys that shoot like coyotes, you're maybe like one step ahead of shooting like a dove. Yeah. Okay. And so, and so I feel like, there's there's there's this flexing that happens when I talk to people out hunting and they they feel like, oh, I do this, so I'm like way better than you coyote hunters.
00:51:29
Speaker
But to me, it's the total opposite. And what I mean by that is guys that are good at hunting coyotes- Can kill anything. will Will kill big game. And if you're a big game hunter and you hate waiting all year, guess what?
00:51:41
Speaker
Get your freaking rifle, go out there and stay fresh on your skills and and learn how to kill live animals. It's infinitely better than sitting on a bench and squeezing off rounds at a target that doesn't move. it'll teach you to read body language teach you to work the wind teach you to be concealed teach you to engage active targets and so to me like that's what is making all of this energy and excitement around predator honey i i couldn't agree more i mean just going from and again i'm in the wide open west right so i'm on the prairie going from binos
00:52:19
Speaker
to I need range-finding binos. I learned that this year. i need ray i i'm ah I'm a bow hunter by trade. Archery elk hunting is is my thing, and now coyotes because i have it's a problem.
00:52:31
Speaker
It's a great problem, but it is a problem. But but going from binos to rangefinder to rifle scope, just going from spotting the animal to spotting the animal in your scope, just from, I've killed 74 coyotes this year, and just doing that over and over and over and over again, i am so much faster going from, hey, there's a bull.
00:52:55
Speaker
I'm on them ready to kill them. Like that, the amount of time, and and I've guided some elk hunters and I've taken friends out for their first elk, and that's probably the number one thing that makes an elk or deer or whatever get away from a hunter is them spotting it and then not being able to find it in the scope.
00:53:16
Speaker
And I cannot tell you, like, I can't speak enough to how much more efficient I have become Because I'm doing it. Not only am I doing it, coyotes don't move like elk. They don't move like deer. Like elk and deer aren't running unless they're unless they're being blown out of there or they're maybe chasing a hot doe. They're not moving like a coyote. A coyote's moving. He's bounding left. He's bounding right. He's running straight at the call. So the coyote,
00:53:43
Speaker
the amount of time you have from the time you spot the animal even with the naked eye not even talking binos right you spot an animal with a naked eye and then you got to get it in the scope the amount of time like i've went from i've went from having to be on three power or the lowest the lowest zoom in my rifle scope to my scope stays on six or seven now and and i spot an animal and i'm in the scope and i'm usually for coyote distances right i'm usually six or seven i don't really have to zoom that sucker in anymore Right. Whereas, you know, like spotting big game out there, you got to bat. Oh, now I got to move it in Oh, I didn't put around in the chamber. Like all these things, it makes you that much faster and that much more efficient. Like exactly what you said, Scott, I am just after one full season of like going hard in the pain after predators. I am leaps and bounds a better big game hunter because of it. My skills are
00:54:38
Speaker
much sharper than they were had i just taken the winter off worked on the computer emailed you guys for deliverables whatever you know what i mean like i am i am i feel way more dialed way more confident and then the shooting aspect shooting at moving targets uh finding moving targets like all of it and the other thing the last thing i'll say on it is i'm starting to look at This terrain, and I'm starting to look at terrain through the eyes of a predator.
Skills Transfer from Coyote to Big Game Hunting
00:55:07
Speaker
Totally. i am I am looking at the wind, and you're looking at the wind when you're big game hunting, but you're not looking usually at how the animal's using in the wind. a lot like some guys are elk hunters do because they know bulls bulls are a lot i think killing a bull is lot like killing a coyote except for i'm doing it with a bow so i don't want to be able to see that bull till i'm in range right yeah but and that bull is gonna hang up don't matter how sexy your call is if you're trying to call him over 300 yards of open country and he hears a cow calling to him saying come get some and he doesn't see a cow where he knows that sounds coming from he's hung up right so But they come in, they circle downwind, like all these things. i'm
00:55:51
Speaker
I'm setting up for that time and time and time and time again. and now I go into the field and it is drilled into me after just... I've only been doing it hardcore since December 15th, you know, but it's it's ingrained in me now. Like I...
00:56:06
Speaker
am excited to get out and elk hunt just talking about this thinking about how I'm going to view the terrain differently how I'm going to approach animals differently all of it so that's a ah huge I think one incentive to to give it a try outside of all the other good things you're going to have more deer and antelope and whatever you're you're gonna help reduce some of the depredation on on the animals you do like to hunt and eat and you're maybe helping the ranchers with their their chickens and their cattle uh but outside of all that it will make you a better hunter one thousand percent and amen yeah i agree for sure
00:56:44
Speaker
um so let's let's talk let's talk a little bit about gear we kind of we talked about hunting and and let's get into into gear like uh rifle calibers i guess we'll start with that's a big one what gun are you using uh i this is an even better question to start with as i'm talking ah are we bolt gun guys or gas gun guys Why are you trying to limit us? I'm not, I'm not. But primarily like if you had to one, if you had to pick one, if they said, Hey, you can only hunt with one rifle.
00:57:21
Speaker
it's This is one of the funnest things that happens to every time. Yeah. Well, this is one of the funnest things that happens to us now because we've been doing it long enough. And so, so many people have been so incredibly generous in providing us with opportunities to shoot really cool guns and neat calibers to where now when we go out, I literally lose sleep the night before trying to figure out what I'm going to take. It's a problem. yeah So if you're asking me- Well, I've seen the wall. Yeah. yeah It's so awesome. And we've got some more stuff coming right now that I'm super excited to share with everyone. Like, really excited to share with everyone. But-
00:57:57
Speaker
um i'll I'll go first because to me, this is the easiest decision. I don't know why, but I lean bolt gun and I want to tack on to this. And this is something I've said 150 times.
00:58:12
Speaker
It's much, much, much more about the gun you're comfortable with and a lot less about all of the other things. So if you have a gun that you're confident in, I want you to take that gun and I don't care the caliber.
00:58:27
Speaker
Yeah. So that that is paramount. But for me, I still like a bolt gun. And I don't know if it's nostalgia or if it if subconsciously it forces me to be more intentional with my first shot because I know I don't have a super quick follow-up. But that's that's me. These guys, ah I think it's a little tougher struggle for them. yeah definitely. it's It's tough for me. you know I'm trying to remember exactly what year it was. But the first time...
00:58:58
Speaker
when I had my own rifle, not my dad's and tried to take a shot at a coyote was with a Colt, AR 15 sporter, lightweight iron sights.
00:59:09
Speaker
And I was not proficient. I remember vividly my, just my dad and I, he took me the spot. I, I killed this. I should have killed this coyote that I missed shortly after that. I upgraded to a Remington 700 in two, two, three,
00:59:26
Speaker
and, and, and that was better for me, but I think by and large, I've hunted more with gas guns. And so I'm probably more comfortable with that. 22 Nosler is my go-to in the gas gun. Um, I haven't done as much with my six arc, but that's another good choice.
00:59:40
Speaker
If I had to pick one of my rifles right now, I'd probably pick my 22 Nosler AR-15 because I've shot the tightest groups with that. My close second is I have a Six Creed bolt gun that I really love and it has been just dynamite for me. So it's probably about as best as I can do to sum it up. But there's a lot of good choices. Yeah. yeah My turn.
01:00:05
Speaker
I would go, i probably go Gascon. Because I like the versatility of being able to shoot runners. And then our shots are pretty close. yeah So I don't necessarily need the little bit of an edge that a bolt gun gives me. So I would say i would say probably Gaskin. Like Dad said, though, it's tough.
01:00:24
Speaker
Yeah, I think, I think, and it is situationally dependent, but I think that's a fun question that the guys will, guys and gals listening will like. um All right. So calibers, you guys, I know you guys, you guys have a ah very large weapon collection. And, and so what, what are your preferred calibers?
01:00:48
Speaker
Like if you, Let's talk through some of that stuff. Cause that, that's where I'm at right now in my game, right? Like I'm looking, I've been hunting with a, a two, two, three and then Noveski was cool enough to hook it up with a six arc. It's a shorter barrel. I want to put a barrel on it. Yeah. The Noveski crew, Scott over there has been super awesome to deal with.
Preferred Equipment and Ammunition
01:01:08
Speaker
Um, I'm, I'm like, I'm still trying to find the perfect one. I think the next two rabbit holes I'm going down 22 arc and And, yeah, because it's rabbit holes. I see you laugh. Like, the next two rabbit holes I'm going down is.22 ARC and.22 Creedmoor. Because I do, I need, I'm a gas gun guy, but I need a bolt gun for some of these properties just to be able to shoot some of these long coyotes that that I can see. Like, maybe belly crawl up and make a longer shot and and knock them down. Because there's no way I'm going get set up to make a stand to call them in. Um, but I still want to take coyotes off the landscape out there cause it's, it's ranch country. It's, it's properties that some of my buddies outfit on and, and, and just want to help them have better results in their seasons and in their, their businesses. So, so calibers, what what do we got for calibers?
01:02:00
Speaker
I'll go first and I'll try to keep it super short, and rapid fire. Top three. Thank you. Let's go 43, 22, 250, 22 creed.
01:02:10
Speaker
going. That's good. I'll just go by what I've killed the most coyotes with and I don't know the order. I can tell you from the spreadsheet if I had it in front of me, but Six Creed, 22 Nosler, and good old 223. would go i would go Let's do the first one, 6 Creed 243, very much similar. yeah Second, I would probably do your 6.5 Grendel or 6 arc.
01:02:36
Speaker
And then the third, I would just say 223 just because we've killed the most with that yeah that cartridge. Yeah, I mean, it's super capable. It's super capable. but Now there's like the 22 arc.
01:02:49
Speaker
yeah like ah ah It's like a... five five six on steroids right so yes it's just it the game keeps changing which is awesome for us because it gives us more stuff to play with and and new rabbit holes to venture down so those are your calibers now you guys recently showed you i'm surprised because i've heard it mentioned once here and i've seen it on the internet uh where's where's 28 nosler come into this where's 28 nosler come into this equation
01:03:22
Speaker
i'll I'll try to keep this answer brief, but that's my fault. I was preparing for a once in a lifetime elk hunt. I wanted to get reps with my rifle. I fell in love with the rig and the setup.
01:03:34
Speaker
And so to get reps on live action, I did it. i I did indeed. I'm the guilty party that has shot a few of the cops with the 28 Nosler. And I will say this. I was very interested to see the response of people on the internet.
01:03:46
Speaker
ah They loved that. So apparently we're going to have to bring it out occasionally. Yes, it's overkill. I don't care. coyotes dead and I'm getting better with the rifle that I love. So probably not at the top of the list of what you should get, but definitely at the top of the list of like, heck yeah, let's do it. worry you It's definitely not cost effective. No. Yeah.
01:04:10
Speaker
so yeah those are expensive coyotes and day i i'm just assuming 22 nozzle is not fur friendly 20-Nossler is not fur friendly. As a matter of fact, there's been some some content that probably doesn't make it to the internet due to the graphic nature of the wound that it causes. But super fun. And I subscribe to the idea that dead is dead. And so like some people say overkill, and I say he's dead. And he he you know he didn't have to suffer. So mission accomplished. Check. Let's go shoot another head. You know what's cool? but From the filming aspect, we film everything in slow-mo so that I can go back and watch each caliber, each cartridge, I should say, how it hits. And we've kind of made our bullet selection, particularly bullet selection, but cartridge selection as well based off of that footage.
01:05:02
Speaker
So splashes are bad. You don't want energy in the dirt. You want it to fill everything, but you want, more importantly, that bullet to expand. So anything Mach 3, which is over 3,150-whatever feet a second, Anything over that is going to make the bullet expand reliably. Anything a little bit under, sometimes the further ranges, they don't expand. But we've seen that the calibers that we use, we've had enough slow-mo footage and data to prove bullets going expand chest cavity expands, and then slugs aren't getting passed all the time through the coyote, which means it felt everything. So it is a rabbit hole. We've, we've done it all. I would say just like my dad said, shoot a rifle that you're comfortable, but more importantly, your ammo selection, don't shoot them with FMJ. you so shoot them with something that's going to expand and uh but yeah we've we've chose the calibers that we choose a lot of it is backed up by our data so um those calibers we know work so yeah yeah that uh so what what's your all right so we talked ammo we talked rounds and calibers but do you guys have a bullet that you prefer
01:06:09
Speaker
Yeah, we've probably done the most with the Nosler of Armageddon. um we we Early on, we were we didn't have a partner for ammo, but Nosler was one of our partners for a while. and We shot their stuff way before they started. Yeah, we yeah my my family shot Nosler partitions for generations. and So we we knew it was a trusted brand. Yeah.
01:06:36
Speaker
We were lucky enough to be able to have them providing our ammo for a while. But that Varmageddon is great in a lot of, they have it in several different calibers. All the stuff that we shoot, they were they were making it in. and So that's ah that's a great round. I'm sure there's some other good ammo out there, which now we have we're in a position where we're going to get to try out a lot of different stuff. And so yeah even some cartridges that we haven't had the opportunity to shoot before because Nossler wasn't making it. so Yeah, so you you talked about bullets. We like the.22 caliber,.62 grain varmageddon. It's an open tip. The polymer tips are fine. Your blessing tips are fine. Yeah. that 62 grain out of your 22 cows are great for your 22 nozzler 223 when you get a little bit higher like the arcs i want something that's around that like you know 70 to 90 grain anywhere in that it's sweet spot the the biggest thing and you want is you want speed and then you want rapid expansion and then you want reliable expansion so i don't want it to expand eight out of ten times i want it to expand 10 out of 10 times yeah
01:07:37
Speaker
And we've seen the closer ranges is where you can really see the difference. So we call it splash. So at 50 yards, you get a rips right through the coyote and splashes in the dirt.
01:07:48
Speaker
That means that bullet wasn't engineered to expand at that high impact velocity. Those are not what we want. We want something that as soon as it hits, it's going act like a grenade. So any of those bullets that are lighter, generally the speed is going to help open up.
01:08:02
Speaker
But polymer tips help act like a wedge. Open tips are great as well. But yeah, those very high velocity laddered bullets that are, you know, rapid expansion. So now that you guys, i and I might be putting you on the spot a little bit, guys, and I apologize in advance. so now but for me i'm gonna be selfish and i'm doing it anyway so now that you guys are kind of you're running you can run whatever you want ammo wise and and you have the ability are we gonna see some maybe some comparison content some content about testing and and how rounds are doing and what you think about you know this type of bullet versus that type of bullet uh are we gonna see some of that is the dc predator fan base gonna see some of that because i thought ah selfishly, I want to see it because I know you guys are out there doing it. Right. So, and I think that would be some, some really good stuff for, for just for people to be able to check out.
01:08:59
Speaker
Yeah, I'll say one thing real quick and I won't hear your input. But the first thing is we test everything that we've shot. So it's not like it's not like we're shooting something because we don't believe in it or we're getting paid to do it. I will say the one thing that is like across the board, the stuff you see us using, we really believe is the best on the market for what we have tested. But more importantly, it's the people that...
01:09:22
Speaker
back that that we like so anyone that we work with you guys see us collab with tag with we love the people and we're on like a not not like a hey i'm gonna email you basis but i can call this person or this company whatever because they are really good people so yeah yeah i'll add to that we we don't have anything set up right now to do what you said but we love that feedback meaning we love to know what people want to see and we're happy to provide it and i would add to what camp he's right like I think when you get in this upper tier, there's not a ah huge major, like,
01:09:59
Speaker
night and day difference between the quality of stuff. um A lot of it's really, really good. So to us, we make most of our decisions on partnerships, on people and relationships.
01:10:11
Speaker
And then I would add to it, like, even with the people that we deal with, including Nasr, because that's the one you specifically brought up, they've never asked us to do that and say, hey, like,
01:10:24
Speaker
only only use this because of. um They've always said, it means more to us for you guys to be authentic and organic about what you say.
01:10:36
Speaker
and so they've they've never held us to anything like that. And so hopefully, I know we've gotten some heat from folks in the past, like, yeah, of course, you're gonna say that because certainly there is a loyalty that we have um to folks, but it's never been a blind loyalty because of money. Yeah, we use what works. And I can't stress that enough. And until you get to know us, maybe you won't believe it. But my integrity to me is much more valuable than like the 30 cents I might make because you bought some Nosler stuff. And so when we go on and back something, it's because not only do we think the product is fantastic, but we like the people. yeah And I would say that to this day, the folks that we dealt with at Nosler have have demonstrated that integrity. So the fact that we're free agents now has nothing to do with us not believing in their product or backing it. And I don't think it has anything to do with them not supporting us. We'll still shoot their stuff, but yeah, we'll try out some other stuff and
01:11:43
Speaker
and And we'll give honest feedback. Yeah, for sure. People like to hear that. They want to know what works. and And it be it'd be about the worst thing I could think of for us to be dishonest about anything. That's like the the worst harm someone could do to me is to lie to me. And I don't want to lie to anybody either. So we're going to use what we believe in. And we're going to tell it straight. if you know If we find something that's not working for us, we're not going to use it anymore. We're only going to use stuff that... that works and what we believe in. i was going to say the amount of things that we've bought over the years that are obsolete now sitting in our garage that we have nicer gear we've upgraded and found that works is just sickening. The amount of stuff that we've tested just makes me sick thinking about it.
01:12:28
Speaker
Absolutely. No. and And I guess that question came. i already know you guys. So I'm glad Scott that you and Ken both said that because I already know you guys. So I know how detail oriented you are and how like down to the exact everything you guys do stuff. So that's why I think. doing some ammo comparison stuff and being able to get your guys's feedback would be fricking cool. Yeah. And that invaluable, like it'd be invaluable to to the rest of us out here. The guy that works at nine to five, and and doesn't know, like being able to ask, hey, yeah what do you think about this round at round A or round B or round C? Well, actually, we shot it and and we found out, you know, this one punches through them or or this one's a really good option. You know what I mean? So that that I think would be some fun content to see for sure.
01:13:17
Speaker
Yeah, we'll definitely shoot you straight. and At the end of the day, we all have jobs, too. So we're looking to balance. what's worth it and how much am I wanting to pay for what it's worth. And the kit that we have now, I could justify every single piece that I have in my truck, on my bag.
01:13:32
Speaker
I believe that it helps me that much. And it's totally worth buying because it's just, it helps you be that much more effective. for Yeah. It's a hundred percent. All right. We're going to wrap this up. I got a few more questions for you. Um, what's your guys' favorite hunt that you, the three of you have done together?
01:13:51
Speaker
is there a favorite hunt or do you dang it you made it tougher when you said the three of us because here's the problem i'm a bum like a lot of times these guys have been on epic hunts and i i haven't been there so now it's uh that's tricky but uh i'll tell one that's a contender maybe these guys will think of a better one uh we We took a week off for SHOP Show last year, and but we weren't flying out until Tuesday.
Memorable Hunting Experiences and Collaborations
01:14:20
Speaker
So Monday, we're all off work.
01:14:22
Speaker
So the Monday before SHOP Show 2025, we went out and made some stands. And there it might have been our first stand. We were set up facing basically north on this particular stand and a coyote came from over our right shoulder. I think Scott was the furthest right this time, but we could see this coyote and the camera and I were both to the left of it. And and we have this hunt on tape.
01:14:47
Speaker
He's trying to film the coyote and you can see the rifle, Scott's rifle in the way of the coyote. He's trying to film around Scott's rifle. Scott's paralyzed. He can't move. If he moves, that coyote's going to see him and we're busted. So he was amazingly, he restrained himself. He showed an amazing, remarkable restraint.
01:15:05
Speaker
He sat and wait and wait and wait. And we we watched this coyote. He's looking to the north the same way we are too. And before we decided to just take the shot, we realized he was looking at another coyote. Well, that other coyote ended up being at least four other coyotes, probably six as we go back and watch the footage. yeah We killed four coyotes on that stand and none of them were the first one that we saw because we waited and we killed one and then we killed another and we killed another and we cut the last one in the tree line. And the last one that that we shot in the tree line
01:15:36
Speaker
was not the one that I had seen in the tree line before. We went back and watched the tape, and there was at least five other coyotes coming from that side, maybe six. So it was a quad, which is rare for us to get that many to come in. That's that's one of my top ones. Dude, that was a rodeo. Yeah, that was awesome. And then that same day, to go back on the trip, the next day, we called in a double and killed another double, and then we killed another single. So it was like... We only did half day. i think we were out by noon. Yeah. And then it was every stand were calling in coyotes. And I remember the the second stand, we had one come in, dad shoots and misses right under it. Yep.
01:16:12
Speaker
And it ran away. And I was like, crap. We just, that was perfect footage. We called him back in and called up when you freaking shot him on the run. It was like, it was like redemption is, it was so good. It closed the book on a coyote, you know, he thought got away, but.
01:16:25
Speaker
Yeah. ah The days when it's always just happening the way you planned. Yeah. yeah those are though i mean Those are the days that keep you going out, right? ri When you're like, should I stay home or should I go out? i' like, well, today could be the day. And then the next thing you know, you're for me, I'm driving like an hour and a half, two hours yeah and and going to get after it. Well, that's freaking, that's awesome. And then we rolled right to Shosh. Yeah, that's so cool. We were riding high. yeah have another fun one that I'll tell that I know we were all there. We had A couple of our, I'll call them friends, but um from the rifle company Q came out and they were trying to get some data and some some content with an 8.6 blackout.
01:17:09
Speaker
And they wanted to test it on coyotes. And so they reached out we were honored to have them. They've turned out to be really good friends. We were texting with some them today. I love Jay. Yeah. And James, the cameraman. Great, great guys. But we had a stand with them where we, I think we'd been to this place before. And so we had a pretty good idea of where we thought the Couch would come from.
01:17:36
Speaker
And we set up. and I'm the farthest to the right and coyotes start coming out. We really were trying to get the content on their rifle, right? Like we wanted to shoot the 8.6 Blackout and these coyotes come out. I don't remember, was it four?
01:17:53
Speaker
I think it was four. But it was a straight rodeo shootout where Jay's popping coyotes. Cam Cam pop. But the the thing that made it so awesome for me is at a certain point, a coyote's maybe 30 yards from me in the bush, not going to be on camera, just to my right. remember And it's growling at me. It's growling at me.
01:18:15
Speaker
And I can't remember why I couldn't shoot, but I had a malfunction or something. But I had this like... You're right, you're right. that's what you know If you could have moved, you would have started this way. So I had this extended period of time where the adrenaline was just...
01:18:31
Speaker
humping because of everything that was going on and I couldn't shoot. Yeah, Jay was rolling him at the call and he has this one staring at him, growling at him. and bit Oh, man. So i i that one I will always remember. That day i will always remember. We had a blast with those guys. We had some epic things happen.
01:18:49
Speaker
And that stand was a straight rodeo. It was 26 minutes long. It was a long stand. Yeah. Yeah. I have it all on film. I would, would come out for a little bit and growl and go back in the bush and bark and come out and growl and bark. And yeah, yeah that was, that one was, I'll always remember that one. So that one, yeah. I mean, I've never had a coyote really like even hang up that close when stuff's like, once bullets are flying they're they're getting out of there so to be it that's quiet those subs are quiet yeah that's an experience dude that is that is freaking cool yeah well guys let's uh we can wrap this thing up um for anybody that's listening that doesn't know where can they find you guys
01:19:41
Speaker
but Well, we're on Instagram and YouTube.
Community Engagement and Encouragement
01:19:45
Speaker
Usually if you, if we were DC underscore predator on YouTube, and it's the same on Insta, right? If you, if you comment on our videos on YouTube, most of the time, I'm going to be responding.
01:19:56
Speaker
And then on Instagram, it's probably Cam and Scott are there. I don't know if you guys split that or, but yeah mostly Cam, mostly Cam. So yeah, check us out on Instagram.
01:20:07
Speaker
Check us out on YouTube. If you, if you, comment we're always going to try to respond unless you're just being a jerk and we might ignore you yeah um but we we'd love for you to watch our content and we hope you have half as much fun as we did making it yeah we love sharing our fun experiences we're having a great time doing it man so we're we feel blessed that we're able to share it with other people and we hope that you enjoy it I will say we also have a website that I'm really proud of. Cam's done a great job. yeah I put that out there, not because necessarily... We sell some merch on the website. We've priced it so we don't make money. It's just a break-even. cost. Yeah, it's literally at cost. so we I don't promote that because I want to like make six bucks off you. I promote it because...
01:20:53
Speaker
It's super cool for me to see a situation where someone bought our product. And so that's cool personally to feel like, oh man, that's neat. And then I think, well, that's really cool because the partners that have trusted us with their brand can now see that like,
01:21:10
Speaker
we're being good ambassadors for what they do. And so, uh, you can also go to our website and there's a little more info on us and some cool, you know, pictures and and videos and and stuff there too. Is that, is the hat that cam's wearing on that website? Cause that's pretty sick hat.
01:21:26
Speaker
If it isn't, I'll put it on there for you. Yeah, we we've had a few different ah versions and rounds and waves of of merch that we do. But yeah, we're about to do a drop soon.
01:21:37
Speaker
yep Sweet, sweet. Well, guys, any any final thoughts for for the Tricer listeners? Yeah, I'd say just get out there, dude. It's so fun, and it's addicting, and you've got the bug. and I mean, don't do it unless you don't want to be captivated the rest of your life. like It's so fun. Go hunt coyotes, man. It's blast.
01:21:59
Speaker
I can't. I mean, bear season's coming up, and I don't even care. And it's like you guys you guys deal with warm weather down there, right? We we happy we had a crappy winter, and it was 80 degrees the last two days, and it's going to be 80 degrees.
01:22:12
Speaker
And there's some depression starting to sink in. Like my little coyote corner in the house where all my gear goes when I get back, when I get home, like I'm starting to think about where I'm going to put that stuff down in the basement. and And there's some... There's some real depression sinking in around it. I mean, I know I don't have to, but it just gets out here. It gets harder as the year goes on and and I got to get ready for bear season. So I got to start getting the bolt guns out and like the six, five PRC out and start. Like I was thinking I was on the range today and I literally put a better zero on my thermals and my daytime coyote gun just confirmed zero. And, and I'm like, man, I should really probably be running the bolt gun right now. Cause bear season starts in April. I'm still, I'm still, it's the season's essentially over for me and I'm still thinking about it. So,
01:23:00
Speaker
but you'll get hooked for sure forever yeah you get hooked so bad like us you will still hunt in the middle of the summer in arizona when it's 115 degrees because you just can't stop you got to get that fix that's a that's a if i live down there i would say like that terrain is so cool it is yeah you guys are in a in a unique spot in the world but yeah that's for sure hunting at 115 degrees is definitely saying something about you have a problem as well that Well, cool,
Conclusion and Future Plans
01:23:30
Speaker
guys. I appreciate your time. I appreciate you guys you guys being on here. I appreciate you guys supporting Tracer. Working with you guys has been an absolute blast, and and i can't I'm excited to see what some of these surprises that are coming
01:23:43
Speaker
from you guys are and and just to to keep growing our relationship and working together and just and and having fun doing it and I'm gonna we're gonna hunt together at some point I know you're tightening a circle and and but either either you guys are gonna come up here or we'll come down there we can meet in Yuma cause Drew lives in Yuma now but but we we all need to get together and get out and just shoot and have fun so yeah cool yep you got it thanks for having us on yeah appreciate it right, guys.
01:24:14
Speaker
Thanks. Yep. See you later.