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Ep.124 Live Like A Plant: Finding Your Essential Nature with Mary Rothwell | ReConnect with Plant Wisdom
48 Plays6 days ago
What if living authentically was as natural as a plant growing in its right soil? In this episode, I sit down with therapist and podcaster Mary Rothwell to explore what plants can teach us about self-acceptance, adaptation, and finding your true nature.
What You’ll Learn
🌱 Why every plant—and every person—has an essential nature.
🌱 How to reframe limiting beliefs as “bodyguards” you can befriend and release.
🌱 Why authenticity means honoring your cycles, not constant blooming.
🌱 How therapy + coaching can complement each other in reclaiming your true self.
✨ Resources ✨
🌱 Expanded Show Notes
🌱 Join the Naturally Conscious Community
🌱 Mary Rothwell’s podcast: No Shrinking Violets
🌱 Mary’s Live Like a Plant quiz
👤 Guest Spotlight: Mary Rothwell of Mary Rothwell Integrative Wellness
Mary Rothwell is a licensed therapist, certified integrative mental health practitioner, and certified forest therapy practitioner. With 35+ years of experience, she combines traditional therapy with a holistic, whole-body framework rooted in nature. She coaches women on sleep and wellbeing in menopause, and hosts the podcast No Shrinking Violets. Her upcoming book, Live Like a Plant, and her interactive quiz help women rediscover their essential nature, break free from limiting narratives, and take up the space they were born to inhabit.
✨ Chapters ✨
00:00 Introduction
08:10 Essential Nature & Belief
16:30 Plasticity & Acceptance
24:45 Self-Awareness Tools
32:55 Natural Rhythms
40:17 Ad: Music of Plants
49:30 Plant Types & Self-Quiz
57:30 Closing & Community
🔗 Connect & Explore More
🌿 Website
🌿 Contact
🌿 Shop Eco-Conscious Partners
Socials
📸 Instagram
📘 Facebook
💼 LinkedIn
▶️ YouTube
🎵 Credits
Opening + Closing music by @Cyberinga and Poinsettia
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Guest Excitement
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello, hello, hello, everyone. Welcome back to another episode of Reconnect with Plant Wisdom. It's me, Tigria Cardenia. i am so pumped. I know you know, we all get excited.
00:00:13
Speaker
Look, when you do a podcast, what I have learned is that 98 slash 99% of the time, the guests you have on the podcast are freaking amazing.
00:00:25
Speaker
Amazing. I don't know where they come from. i don't know how I bump into them, how they come into my world. But I am so in incredibly grateful for the fact that they come into my world and that I can bring them into your world. And Mary Rothwell is definitely high on the list of that.
00:00:42
Speaker
And it all started because I was on her podcast, which, as you're going to hear, has a great plant-inspired name. And when we were talking, when we finished, I was just, I knew, knew, knew that I had to have this woman on my podcast.
00:00:57
Speaker
And I am so delighted that we were able to capture such a broad range of topics that is all about this essential nature, what I call your true nature, which is that part of you that just is, right? This is the way I am. And I am,
00:01:14
Speaker
flexible and I can change and I can modify. But in the end, I also still have to accept that this is my true nature. And this is from the the root, the root to use another plant metaphor of my authenticity. And that's why I'm so excited to bring this episode to you, which is episode 124, live like a plant, finding your essential nature with Mary Rothwell.
00:01:37
Speaker
Enjoy. Welcome to Reconnect with Plant Wisdom. I'm your host, Tigria Gardenia, nature-inspired mentor, certified life coach, and the founder of the Naturally Conscious Community.
Theme: Plant Wisdom and Ecosystem Thinking
00:01:48
Speaker
For over a decade, I've been known as a world ambassador for plant advocacy, working closely with plants to share their practical wisdom to help you consciously embody the elements of life that nourish your evolution.
00:02:00
Speaker
In this podcast, I delve into ancient and modern knowledge from biology to spirituality about the wondrous ways of plants. Together, we'll explore how ecosystem thinking helps you overcome limiting beliefs, understand the true nature of relationships, and live an authentic, impactful life.
00:02:20
Speaker
Mary, I am so happy to have you here, like, ah you know, because I was on your podcast. And as we were talking on your podcast, at the very end, I was like, you know what, you should be on my podcast, because I felt like it was such a conversation that we, you know, shared so many things.
00:02:38
Speaker
But before we jump into all of that, can you just tell the audience, like, who is Mary Rothwell?
Mary Rothwell's Career and Transition
00:02:43
Speaker
Yes, for sure. And actually, you were one of my favorite guests because it was such a – being able to talk plants, which I know we're going to yeah. So I am a trained therapist. I've been a therapist for 35 years, and I worked mostly it with college students.
00:03:01
Speaker
And I loved it. I really loved it. But I hit a situation where there was ah some personnel changes with supervisors and I decided to take early retirement. And then I was sort of adrift.
00:03:13
Speaker
And I'm like, what am I going to do? And there's so many things I love. So i have been sort of on that journey for the last, I'm going to say, three years trying to sort of, I do too much. So yeah.
00:03:26
Speaker
So I still have a private practice, but I ah have been, a i was a master gardener for 15 years because plants are like my love and I'm a nature geek. So i am now in the process of sort of combining that. And I'm also a certified functional nutrition counselor. So I'm pulling all these things together because I really believe that we are a whole person and and nature, we are nature. So I think connecting to that has always been part of my therapy.
00:03:55
Speaker
And I realized in my years as a gardener that plants adapt, but they also all have their own essential nature just like we do. So that's really been my framework. It's been now about helping people recognize that you have an essential nature and it is totally okay to be whoever you are. And that's informed by our nature, how we were born. and what we went through.
00:04:22
Speaker
And sometimes how we've adapted no longer works in the environment. And sometimes we have to change the environment. So I just love all of those um sort of analogies and combining wellness. And I work really mostly with women. So now I'm sort of combining all of those things.
Mary's Podcast and Book
00:04:41
Speaker
And i have a podcast called No Shrinking Violets.
00:04:44
Speaker
And I'm hoping to publish a book early in the year called Live Like a Plant. So that's where I'm at in my life journey. I really, well i remember when I came across your podcast and I saw the name, I was like, no shrinking violet. That's so great because I feel like, you know, for anyone, especially in the plant world, you get this, this sensation right away of like, oh, this is somebody who's going to help me think about how not to like hide, how not to, you know, put myself behind something. And and in fact, I mean, a lot of your work is about authenticity, right? Living your true essence and the fact that You are a being of nature and you also have a series of characteristics that unfortunately, especially working with women, I'm sure, you know, so many of our care of our natural characteristics of the things that make us us kind of have been told that something is wrong with it. And I was just having a conversation with a friend of mine at lunch right before, you know, we're here recording that we were talking about how even in the world of conversation where we talk about, you know, like,
00:05:44
Speaker
enter into your feminine, we actually kind of in the modern world don't really have a good definition or a good image of the feminine because I feel like we're coming out of an era where, you know, being a woman was about dainty and shrinking and all these pieces.
00:06:03
Speaker
And we don't want to be the like strong woman that really is just a male in in a female body. And there's this whole spectrum in between between masculine and feminine that we've just never explored as archetypes.
00:06:19
Speaker
And so I can imagine that in therapy, a lot of You know, the authenticity issue is not even just, oh, this thing happened to me, but I don't even know what this thing is supposed to look like. Like, what does it look like when I'm authentically me?
00:06:34
Speaker
mean, do you find that these are some of the situations that you're in? Yeah. so that is really an issue. And I think it really is a – well, I'm going to – I don't like to stereotype gender stuff.
00:06:46
Speaker
But I think for women, a lot of times we get such strong messages about what we're supposed to be that we get so lost. and i And so when we talk about authenticity and it's so – I just did a little mini episode on this this morning.
00:07:03
Speaker
– um by it's I think sometimes we have an idea who we are, what we want to be, or what message we have, or how we want to be in the world, and then we second guess it.
00:07:18
Speaker
And it and I think now that the world is so much louder and there's social media and we, we, you know, I grew up in a time where there wasn't social media.
Social Media and Authenticity
00:07:27
Speaker
So your comparison your, we check ourselves, like, am I okay? Like here, I've done this thing. we look how other people react to us. And that's how we sort of decide, am I okay?
00:07:42
Speaker
Am I alienating people? But now we are in this world where everything is public or we feel like it should be public or you know, so it's this next layer and there's so many more messages coming in that I think it's even more confusing or we see other women and they look happy and healthy and they're doing these things and it's like, but I don't feel like that. But we don't know how much is actually true.
00:08:12
Speaker
Right.
00:08:16
Speaker
someone comes to me they're often saying something's wrong and i have no idea what it's typically a disconnect between their essential nature And the person they're trying to be. And so then we can start to tease out what do you naturally want? Who are you naturally?
00:08:35
Speaker
And how do we um start to connect to that and really validate that you're okay just as you are? It doesn't mean maybe you don't want to make some changes. Kind of like A plant might be okay, right? They might be surviving, but they want to thrive. So maybe they start to, they might flower less for a little bit, or they might reach toward the light, or they might want more shade. So it's really thinking about naturally in your gut, what do you want?
00:09:07
Speaker
And then how do we make that happen and sort of separate that from, and then here's a therapy thing, the irrational belief. which is part of cognitive therapy, because our irrational beliefs are typically informed by society's ideas, our family's ideas, and they are, we call them irrational. And that word I think has been historically connected to, you know, women, you're irrational, your emotions are irrational.
00:09:34
Speaker
So I try to qualify that word that irrational really means something that isn't based in fact. So I combine sort of that nature analogy with these different underpinnings of let's look at cognitively. Is there evidence that your belief is true, that you're too much for someone or
Therapy with Plant Metaphors
00:09:56
Speaker
you're too loud or you're not producing enough?
00:09:59
Speaker
So that's, ice it depends on the client really how much, what I use, how we pursue it, what we what we look at. But i I always bring in that idea of nature to validate that you're okay just exactly as you are.
00:10:16
Speaker
Right. Yeah. And I think that's such an important part. I talk about, i use the metaphor of the idea that, you know, these, these irrational beliefs, these limiting beliefs, that anything that is of that nature tends to be, I call it the bodyguard that you put and in place to protect you of some from something and then forgot about. And then you went on and changed and modified and evolved and transformed and grew.
00:10:39
Speaker
and the bodyguard still remembers the old you. And so the bodyguard still doing what they were supposed to do. So probably there was some very short, small period in time where that belief maybe was useful for something or it was accurate, but it's not accurate today. And now you've got to go and befriend the bodyguard. So I i call it befriend your limiting beliefs.
00:10:59
Speaker
Like you've got to go and befriend the bodyguard and slide up to the bodyguard and say, hey, why did I put you here? Like, what did I tell you was the danger? And when the bodyguard then tells you the danger, you're like, huh? Does that danger still exist for me?
00:11:11
Speaker
And if it does, great, you stay. i need to go work on that. But if the danger doesn't exist, then you can be like, hey, I can now let you go. And the bodyguard's like, you never told me when to go. And I was like, I know that was my problem. Like, I put you in to protect some part of me that in reality today doesn't need to be protected anymore.
00:11:30
Speaker
And I think we're so out of touch with ourselves that we we forget that, you know, as you said, i love that you brought up the analogy of, you know, there are times when a plant will stop blooming for a period of time because that plant is restoring energy, creating the right conditions, moving into a new space, ah healing from a trauma. Like there's lots of reasons why plants a plant might not bloom temporarily.
00:11:56
Speaker
That doesn't mean that the plant will never bloom. The plant has the opportunity to bloom in the future. But in that moment, the plant has evaluated, no, I'm not going to put my energy into blooming because I need to put my energy in other places.
00:12:10
Speaker
And I think that this is an important aspect for us to remember for ourselves that As I'm doing this work of sliding up to that, you know, bodyguard of that belief bodyguard or as I'm doing something to heal myself, it is OK not to bloom in that period of time.
00:12:27
Speaker
It's OK for me to convert to conserve my energy and focus it on other things. I don't have to be always on because, like you said, always on is for some audience thing. And that's that's not authentic. That's not real.
00:12:39
Speaker
Reality is we have cycles and those cycles can be not just seasonal, but also periodical. Like the season of growing is very different from the season of restoring, like or the season of adjusting.
00:12:52
Speaker
Like these are all different periods of time. And I think it's really important for us to focus on that kind of piece. For sure. And, you know, when you talk about the bodyguard, if we talk about our brain, that's our amygdala. And our amygdala is you know, part of our limbic system. it it serves wonderful purposes.
00:13:11
Speaker
But the amygdala is a drama queen. And it's the overprotective friend, kind of like you're saying, that it's very good at when we're young, looking at where's the danger.
00:13:23
Speaker
And then the amygdala generalizes. So then anything that slightly resembles maybe a way we were treated in our family or something that hurt us in the past, it reacts like the smoke detector going off when the toast is burning.
00:13:39
Speaker
The house is not burning down, but it overreacts. So, you know, one of the ways I think about putting that in context, because I tell people often, Many people end up in therapy because what worked in the past doesn't work anymore. And i look at people through positive psychology. So you're not broken. You just survived what you had to survive in a certain way and it doesn't work anymore. So to me in the plant world, that's like a plant growing in the shade and then we cut the tree down.
00:14:12
Speaker
And it's like, holy hell, like what am I going to do now? Because yeah i what I did to survive is not going to work. Yep. What is this thing that is burning me?
00:14:25
Speaker
Exactly. Oh, wait. That's what gives me food. Hold on. Let me adjust. Give me a minute. Burn this piece over here while the rest of me figures it out.
00:14:35
Speaker
Sorry. I just got this image. Yeah. For sure. Yeah. ah For sure. And we keep trying to do the same thing and we're dying, you know, and it's and it's until we, some people have to burn so much of themselves before they realize, oh, I have roots, but I can also ambulate. So I'm going to go to this other environment exactly but where I can thrive and just learn to do some things differently.
00:15:01
Speaker
Yeah, I love that. And and I can also imagine, too like we we forget, once we start to study and understand how plants in particular react, we start to see a whole series of different capabilities within our own bodies. For example, we know that if you have a plant that ah grew up in a drought environment, they're going to code that into the seeds.
00:15:23
Speaker
So if the plant has discovered how to deal and thrive in that more drought environment, even though it might might have originally been a waterlogged plant or a plant that grew in like a rainforest or in an area with a lot of water, that next generation will know what to do inherently. But what happens is that if you take then that next generation seed and put it back into the environment that originally existed At first, the plant's going to be like, whoa, what's with all this water? I don't know how to deal with this water.
00:15:52
Speaker
And the plant's going to originally start to grow thinking that it's in a drought environment. And it's going to take a little while before those extra genes, those those past memories of, oh, wait a minute, my my parents grew up in a drought, but my grandparents didn't.
00:16:07
Speaker
So therefore, let me rather than work with the what I have turned on in this because this comes directly from my parents, I got to reach farther back into what was good for my grandparents and turn that back on. That plasticity actually exists in us a lot more than we as humans think about.
00:16:27
Speaker
And it's amazing how we've forgotten that we have that plasticity within us and that we can reach back into different parts of ourselves, that our genes are not all expressing themselves at once.
00:16:40
Speaker
that everything is not as it seems, but in reality, over time and with conscious awareness and with a focus, we can move things and adjust in different ways, even biologically speaking.
00:16:55
Speaker
And so um so it is this beautiful dance between the plasticity of our mind, which is way more flexible than we think it is.
Therapy and Coaching Synergy
00:17:02
Speaker
We're just unfortunately very much focused on, like you said, the drama queen who takes over because you know everybody gives attention to the drama queen.
00:17:09
Speaker
We don't know. And instead of really kind of reaching back and being like, wait a minute, you know, this is okay. This is who I am today. This is what is expressing itself in me today.
00:17:21
Speaker
Fine. I accept that. Now what, now where do I go? And I think this goes back to a conversation we were just having right before I hit record, which is, um kind of the places where there is an overlap between something like what you do as as a therapist and something like what I do as a life coach. And I know you also do coaching. And so, you know, you have the benefit of being able to even be on both sides of things.
00:17:44
Speaker
But I think it's really beautiful to share with everyone the fact that these two are not right? You know, these can be an and type of stuff because people like me who do, you know, life coaching, I love helping you think about the future. But sometimes that future has pieces that are not just in the past, but also, like you said, in the cognitive space that need to be evaluated with a certain level of expertise.
00:18:08
Speaker
And that's when it's better to work at that with a therapist and you can work with both at the same time so that you can work through all of those cognitive pieces and those trauma pieces and whatever it is that is coming from in that world that might be in the past or might be still sitting in the present and then have that work be sort of handed off consciously from you know between yourself with the coach and the therapist to the coach to say, OK, now, how do I put in mechanisms to help me integrate this into my future in a way that is good for me and that helps me express myself and all these types of things where the coach is really thinking more about let me help you critically think about this. Let me help you ah explore it in a really wide, present context.
00:18:56
Speaker
And I think that this is a really um important sort of partnership, you might say, or thruple, because in reality, the person is in the middle, that we don't talk about enough in our professions.
00:19:07
Speaker
We think we have to be a one-stop shop that does everything, but there is a lot of benefit to having both and to being able to focus you know focus in my sessions on this piece over here and then, you know,
00:19:21
Speaker
manage the overlap between the two in order for you to be able to flow between, you know, these aspects that need to be explored in one way and these that need to be implemented into the other. Do you find that also as something useful and that happens in your own practice?
00:19:37
Speaker
Oh, for sure. And, you know, we have a saying in therapy, insight does not equal change. So, you know, I think sometimes, there first of all, there are so many different um, approaches to therapy and coaching.
00:19:51
Speaker
And so now that coaching is much more prevalent, I think at first it was sort of like, what, what's going on with this? And, you know, the important thing to me is that somebody has training. You anybody can call themselves a coach. So I like to put a little asterisk there that, you you know, anybody can say I'm a coach, but you want to look at what are you getting?
00:20:13
Speaker
Like, what is the certification? how were they trained? But when we're talking about this exploring the past versus the future, I'm going to say it's really specific to the client.
00:20:26
Speaker
So sometimes, you know, my biggest thing is when you're looking, like we'll use, we'll look at trauma. When you're looking at trauma, for me, the most important thing is somebody, first of all, understands how that informed who they are now.
00:20:41
Speaker
And there, of course, is a lot that can go with that, the the offshoots of that. And again, it goes back to the amygdala overreacting is, do you have anxiety now that's keeping you from doing what you want?
00:20:54
Speaker
So in therapy, you can explore that, you know, and I think it also goes back to this idea of who are you really? So if we look at like the sensitive plant, which is mimosa pudica, that plant will, if you touch it, it shrinks and it shrivels because then it doesn't look appetizing to predators or somebody that might want to eat it.
00:21:15
Speaker
So, you know, I have clients who often have shame around how they reacted when the trauma occurred. I should have done this or all I did was stay small. And, you know, I frame that like you could no more change that trauma reaction in that moment, then you could change your eye color right now.
00:21:35
Speaker
There is something built into us. And you talked about epigenetics, really, like our genes are changed as we go through generations. It doesn't mean we have to be that.
00:21:47
Speaker
It just is some, you know, it's changes that express themselves or not. So if we put it in that context of just appreciate that you did what you had to, you know, unlike jewelweed, who when you touch it, the seeds explode outward.
00:22:02
Speaker
So maybe you are a fighter. Maybe you're a fleer. So there are ways that we react. But as as humans, the beautiful part is we can decide the next time.
00:22:14
Speaker
We are going to do something different. So that's where this, first of all, understanding and helping
Understanding Self and Strategic Change
00:22:21
Speaker
a client or a student or whomever you're working with understand that what they did was okay. They did the best thing in that moment and to have that grace for themselves.
00:22:33
Speaker
And then going forward, what does this mean? Are you keeping yourself small in certain situations? And then when we can tag team with a coach, because you would never have two therapists at a time, but i people can have a therapist and a coach.
00:22:48
Speaker
The communication is the biggest thing because you want to make sure it's congruent. You're sort of, you know, or you can go back and forth. And I think that's the beautiful thing. I know people that coaching works better for them than therapy. Yeah.
00:23:02
Speaker
So I think it's, you know, first of all, accepting that there's no one right way for anyone to feel better and to sort of learn new skills, but then understanding that the insight doesn't create the change, but a really powerful coaching situation. And therapists work on future change too, but I think coaching is so goal-focused and that can be really, really impactful and powerful for certain clients.
00:23:29
Speaker
Yeah. I love that. i love the whole way that you describe it. And I like that you bring in one of my favorite words, which i which is grace, giving yourself grace.
00:23:40
Speaker
I used to say permission and permission is still an important aspect of it. But I feel like grace is even more encompassing because it is kind of giving yourself that that space to say, OK, that's who this is who I am today. Who do I want to be tomorrow?
00:23:56
Speaker
And not looking at it as in something is wrong, but more of just an awareness. Where am i Because this is the only place I could be, right? It can't be anywhere else than where I am right now. Whomever it is that I am today, i'm not going to wake up tomorrow and magically be different. And like you said, insight, which I think is a beautiful way of saying it, doesn't doesn't mean change necessarily. There are plenty.
00:24:16
Speaker
I always talk about how... you know In my own progress, even, and and I see this in so many of my clients, we start off with the idea of getting to the comfortableness with the awareness.
00:24:27
Speaker
right I am comfortable with this awareness. Oh, my goodness, this is who I am. Like you said, I'm a jumper or I'm naturally anxious or I'm somebody who instead... ah immediately as contrary. Like I tend to be contrary. I'm walking to a meeting and I'm already thinking of all the things they are going to say to me that I'm going to be against.
00:24:44
Speaker
and And then again, over time, as I got to a comfortable understanding that that's how my mind works, I could then say, okay I need to build these pieces in to my meeting, to the way I listen in the meeting, to ensure that even if my mind is reacting with, screw you, we're not going to do that.
00:25:04
Speaker
That's not what's coming out of my mouth and it's not what I truly believe. That's my my initial reaction. And so, for example, I have techniques like I write. I'll often write as um I take a lot of notes or I doodle or something like that as I am in a meeting.
00:25:18
Speaker
And it helps me, one, with retention, but it also helps me to... Process through, okay, what's my, because I'm a critic, my primary kind of dominant personality is critical, but the critical can come out like no, but it can also come out as, huh, I hear what you're trying to do and now I get the project.
00:25:37
Speaker
Have you seen this situation over here? Could that be a causing a problem? And then it comes out in a different way. So it doesn't change my nature, the fact that I am critical. I can't say to myself magically tomorrow, do not react badly.
00:25:51
Speaker
But I can change the way that I use that information as it comes up in me and give it a direction that is useful. And I think that that's one of those things we learn from plants, that every single way that we are, and I love the example of Mimosa Perdica versus you know other types of explosive you know plants or the the different ways we...
00:26:12
Speaker
the the different mechanisms for seeding out that some are gliders and some are exploders and some are this and the same with defense mechanisms. Some give you a burst of of compounds. Some of them instead will call in friends.
00:26:26
Speaker
Some of them instead are going to like shrink and Once we know what our true nature is, the way that we just naturally without any kind of thinking react, we can put pieces in place to understand how do i use that going forward? And if it is a trauma response, I always tell people that there's a very big difference between something you do to get away, to like avoid versus something that is the way you are and that you use it towards another direction. It could be the exact same characteristic, but if you're doing avoidance, then you need to work through that.
00:27:00
Speaker
Why am I avoiding versus, huh, this thing is not actually good for me, so I'm going to go and do this, but I'm coming out of it from awareness rather than fear. And so I love these examples that you're giving with the plants.
00:27:13
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. And it's strategy. I think, you know, sometimes we get so busy feeling ashamed or why am I like this? I don't want to be like this. It's like, well, you are So it serves you somehow. So as we go through life, sometimes we can think taking up my space means being defiant and stomping my foot. And maybe every now and then, but mostly it means like you're saying, I have this core I know what I believe, but sometimes like leading with that isn't going to get me where I want to go. So I think once we sort of befriend that, we befriend that reaction, we understand like this is who I am, then it's like, okay, now how am I going to strategically use this to get what I need?
00:28:03
Speaker
i mean, we we're all trying to get what we need. but there's ways to do it. And I think that to me is strategy. And so then it becomes not sort of, I'm powerless, you know, against this essential nature. It's like, no, this is a really cool part of me, but sometimes, you know, the the cactuses spines don't keep away things that we don't want to keep away. So yeah, I think that I love that idea of as we learn we do things like use you write, like that sort of a buffer or taking a breath or as you're sitting in a meeting, just recognizing, okay, my shoulders are in my ears. I'm just going to let them drop. And nobody knows I'm unclenching my stomach and just recognizing like what's going on in my brain right now because I am ranting at this person inside of me.
Plants as Life Metaphors and Growth Partners
00:28:55
Speaker
Let me let that flow away and let me start to to really focus and be in the moment and be strategic. Yeah, yeah. and And use it like, you know, in nature, everything has a purpose, right? There is no dump, there's no place where I can just get rid of something, everything gets used by somebody.
00:29:12
Speaker
And so the question is to learn how to use it, right? How do I master the fact that this is what I am? If I'm not good at this, how do I partner with somebody that is good at with the at this? If I have this reaction innately,
00:29:24
Speaker
How is it that I create those buffer zones so that then and then what am I getting out of that? Like, why is it that I react in this way? Obviously, there must be something that's happening and that maybe there is a so a scintilla somewhere of truth or of understanding or of knowledge or maybe some sense that that is picking something up that I still can't understand.
00:29:46
Speaker
And so therefore, you know, if I tap into that plantness of my and how do I see this through different eyes? And I think that this is one of those places where the line between plant as metaphor and plant as partner becomes really interesting to kind of fiddle with.
00:30:03
Speaker
Whereas metaphor, there's a lot I can learn, right? There's a lot of different techniques of of different ways of looking at things, understanding how ecosystem dynamics work and why is it that these plants, you know, why is it that parasitism can be useful or when is the actual example of a predation being something that's super important?
00:30:22
Speaker
why do those spines of that cactus not just be a protection mechanism, but they're also the way you capture water. They're the way that you also create certain types of relationships. So they have these dual functions and sometimes triple functions. Okay. So if I stopped looking at my spines only as a way to keep things away, what if I look at how is it that I collect morning dew? Like what's the equivalent? So plants as metaphor and as You know, biomimicry for social innovation can be super useful as one step.
00:30:51
Speaker
And then the other one is plants as partners. Like if I go and I sit with the plant, breathe in those volatile organic compounds, if I work with nature and activate the nature within me and maybe work.
00:31:04
Speaker
whether you believe in plant communication or whether instead it's more of a biological reaction that happens when I spend time in nature. How do I allow that plant to become my partner in finding a solution that works for me?
00:31:17
Speaker
So how do I better hear the people that I'm working with as therapists or as coaches? Because the plant brings in a different element that allows me to then understand this whole process in a different way. And I love that we're starting to get more and more of this.
00:31:33
Speaker
You know, we're talking about it. I just received an email today from one of my favorite plantthropologists. She actually coined the term plantthropologist. And she's an anthropologist who works very closely with plants, plants as sensor, and Natasha Myers. And she she's created this cedar circle where they have included, like they work very closely as group of artists and plant scientists and such that are working very closely with cedar and they're doing these circles with cedar to just sort of get out of our humanness, to to retune our sensors,
00:32:06
Speaker
to be able to better understand that natural side of ourselves, that authentic peace that is coming out, because we're not dealing with things like anxiety and burnout and all these other stuff.
00:32:18
Speaker
And even she, who is somebody who works so closely with plants, is on burnout leave. Like shes she's in her academic job, she's in burnout. And so she's had to take a leave.
00:32:29
Speaker
And, you know, it just opens you up to like, oh my goodness, just knowing this stuff is not enough. I need to find ways to embody it. I need to find ways to connect. I need to find ways to change my life in order to create the environment. i I call it the living ecosystem. How do I create both an internal living ecosystem and the living ecosystem around me where I can walk away from certain things that I know are not going to be conducive to my health or I can make changes in the way that I experience things?
00:32:58
Speaker
And I just don't think we give ourselves enough grace, going back to that word, enough grace to understand that this is who we are and enough space to explore it and to kind of like be with somebody who's not trying to change how I do things.
00:33:14
Speaker
They're not trying to change me. They're trying to instead help me master who I am. And I feel like that is what people who are more nature inspired. I just find probably my own bias right there. But my I naturally think that they're much more open nature.
00:33:32
Speaker
meeting you where you are, and then helping you understand how that is a natural part of life, and that it is okay for you to be right where you are.
00:33:43
Speaker
And all you have to do is just learn how to use that and how to make that your own. Yeah. Yeah. And I think it's unfortunate that we, I think just generally as a society, I know you're not living in the United States right now, so your environment might be way different. But I think a lot of young kids are now, they're so divorced from nature or we've become afraid of it and we don't know how to access it. So I'm also a certified forest therapy practitioner. um And, you know, just being
00:34:14
Speaker
walking on a trail, I think, is people think there's bugs and there's this and there's snakes. We think about the fear first. So I think what I would say for people that have sort of this sense of I want to get closer to nature because also this is sort of i still have this asleep course that's connected to our nature and circadian rhythm. We're very divorced also from circadian rhythm, which is why we so have such trouble sleeping.
00:34:44
Speaker
It's horrible. i i just, sorry to interrupt you, but it's one of those topics. I just got into this conversation with one of my clients and I've talked about it recently in ah in a talk that I gave, which is i spent the better part of a year just trying to understand my own sleep cycles by allowing myself to sleep whenever the heck I wanted to and and also taking note of like, when am I creative? When am I strategic? When am I awake? When am I asleep? When am I tired? When am I this?
00:35:12
Speaker
Yeah.
Natural Sleep Patterns and Health
00:35:12
Speaker
Oh, my goodness. It opened me up to the schedule that I keep now and to being very graceful with myself when right after lunch, if I can't take a nap, I'm going to be a bit of a pain in the butt because I need my nap.
00:35:26
Speaker
Like I am a nap person. And hi And I'll let you describe because I think this is such such an important piece, but I just wanted to highlight that talk about a place that we lose our rhythms from the fact that we're tiny when our parents start to tell us, you've got to wake up at eight o'clock in the morning to go to school.
00:35:45
Speaker
ah What if my body doesn't wake up at that time? Or you're not allowed to do things before seven o'clock. ah What if my body naturally wakes up at five? Like, maybe we should think about this stuff in a little bit of a different way. Because this whole artificial clock, sure, can I adapt to it? Yes.
00:36:02
Speaker
But at least adapt to it consciously where you know, okay, this is not me. And not just saying I'm not a morning person, because I think that's a cop out. But like, like there's so much to learn learn about our own sleep cycles and they make us so much healthier. Now I'm going to shut up and I'm going to let you speak, but it's just like, ah, one of those.
00:36:20
Speaker
You're right. And, you know, I think to me it's just common sense, but Again, let's go back to what what were we hundreds of years ago? We didn't have, first of all, we didn't have all of our artificial light, but we also didn't have screens.
00:36:37
Speaker
And what we don't understand is, or what many people don't understand is that Our hypothalamus is reacting to light when it's helping us create melatonin. And we think, oh, I can get melatonin in a bottle. I'm just going to take melatonin.
00:36:51
Speaker
No, doesn't work. First of all, the dose is usually wrong and your brain already makes it. And all you need to do, and I don't mean to make to simplify this because I know many people struggle dramatically with getting good sleep.
00:37:04
Speaker
But I can tell you simply how to start is get morning sunlight in your eyes, go out for five minutes at noon, and try to see the sunset.
00:37:16
Speaker
Just try to, you know, get used to being out and getting that natural sunlight. And then start to kind of what you're saying, like, what is my natural rhythm?
00:37:28
Speaker
But recognizing that, first of all, you can't just randomly go to bed whenever you want and expect to just, I mean, in college, I could do that. I can't do it now. So I think that is the first thing. And the other thing is Nature ah is naturally an antidepressant. There's antidepressant properties in soil. So, you know, again, we're afraid. We we hear these stories about bacteria in the soil and whatever.
00:37:56
Speaker
But I think starting small, if you really want to move toward that, there's a great book called Last Child in the Woods by Richard Louve. And- Richard Louve's the best. Yeah. And it talks about, because I worked a lot in public schools when I first started my career, and we saw this increase in attention deficit attention deficit disorder. And it's like, duh. like Now we have kids on phones changing what they're looking at every seven seconds. Your neurons are not made to process that. So-
00:38:26
Speaker
if we think about, again, hundreds of years ago, or even when I was a kid, i was outside most of the day doing one thing, being bored and finding something to do.
00:38:37
Speaker
i was in the woods.
Connecting with Nature and Plant Resonance
00:38:38
Speaker
I found a patch of woods and I would just be there under a tree reading a book. I naturally did that. I didn't have social media telling me, you're so weird because you're doing that.
00:38:50
Speaker
It was just what I wanted to do. So I think Trying to reconnect to that, even if you find, go to a public garden and walk through that garden, breathe and look at what flowers do you identify with?
00:39:03
Speaker
Because I can tell you every gardener has a color palette They have a flower shape. They have some ah you know a growing habit. What does the foliage look like? I have my favorite plants.
00:39:16
Speaker
And they're not always the easiest to grow as a gardener. Sometimes they're a pain in my ass. But there's something that I respond to. So I know you have people. i think i'm go goingnna I think I'm right about this. You sort of have them get a plant companion, right, and really observe that.
00:39:31
Speaker
And I think we can start, if especially if there's some fear with nature – you know, whatever it might be. But go to somewhere that's, quote, a little bit safer. Go to ah a public garden. Just walk through and observe. And like pay attention to your gut.
00:39:48
Speaker
What do you look at that you respond to? Are you in a shade garden with a bunch of ferns and you just like decompress when you see that? Or do you go to the sun garden and see these echinacea and the shasta daisies and it's like, oh my God, I love this bright hot color. That starts to give you some clues about what do you need to build into your life more?
00:40:12
Speaker
Mary, let me just take a very quick pause and introduce one of our eco-conscious business partners. For over a decade, I've had the profound joy of working with the music of the plants, a musical instrument made just for plants.
00:40:26
Speaker
This very music is what sparked my own plant reawakening, guiding me to reconnect with nature in an entirely new way. Imagine in listening to the harmonious melodies of your plant companions and feeling their wisdom and presence through the language of music.
00:40:42
Speaker
It's an experience that has transformed my life and the lives of so many other people. If you're curious about the hidden songs of plants and want to connect to your plant friends in a completely new way, I invite you to discover more at tigriadagenia.com slash music of the plants.
00:40:59
Speaker
It's in the show notes. Plant music is great for healing, sharing, and personal connection. Let's continue our journey of personal evolution and plant consciousness together with the songs of plants.
00:41:13
Speaker
Oh, I love that. I love that. I love that, especially since I've got cactus cacti and aloes. Like, that tells you something about me. I'm like, just all freaking green.
00:41:24
Speaker
There's a very few, there is there are a few flowering plants in my house. And most of the ones that flower are either, you know, white or, like I said, aloes. Actually, that's not true. Jaina flowers in orange. So the aloe.
00:41:35
Speaker
So but but I totally i love that. And I do think it says so much and it helps us so much. I think about that sometimes so my own when I go to like botanical gardens, I always end up sitting kind of in I realized, like you said, we all gravitate naturally to certain areas. and And I love sitting there and consciously saying to myself, like, what is this, you know, what is this reflecting of me? um And I just recently in July taught a class called Enhance Plant Communication. It's a three hour workshop. It's a series I do called Reconnect with Plant with plant Kin.
00:42:10
Speaker
And they're at the last Saturday of every month, I do these three hour workshops. And the one of enhanced plant um plant communication, we had i had a person in the class who was an animal communicator. I didn't know this at the beginning. She was new to our group.
00:42:25
Speaker
And it was so cute because at the end, she was like, you know, I came here expecting this to be, you know, very similar to the techniques that everybody's talking about, you know, drop into your heart. And I'm not like that. I don't i don't do that that kind of stuff.
00:42:37
Speaker
Instead, I was like having them, taking them on these deep journeys through other worlds and ending up in What are you, my plant ally that I'm working with, what are you reflecting of me? Like, what am I seeing in myself when I look at you?
00:42:51
Speaker
And I think that's very connected to what you just said. If you gravitate naturally to some plants, what is it that those plants are are reflecting back to you? What parts of your understanding of self your psyche, your your way of doing things, your your deep understandings, can you understand or can you come into contact with that you might not be able to safely come into contact by coming into the human side? I often talk about how What I love working with plants is that it sort of takes me out of my animalness, my my human animalness for a second. It allows me to kind of walk into the presence of being of my plantness and then come back into my humanness from a different angle. And it just gives you an opportunity to see things in a completely different way.
00:43:36
Speaker
And I like the idea of if you're naturally being pulled to you know, more ah temperate areas and you love really going into these types of parts. Or every time you go to the park, the first thing you do, like I do, which is take my shoes off. And and it doesn't matter. There could be beautiful, like, trees of all sorts.
00:43:55
Speaker
And I'm, like, on the ground staring at the grasses going, hmm, um how many different kinds of plants are down here? Like, that's just who I am. I look at the small and that's how I am in real life. I love looking at the details.
00:44:09
Speaker
Get me into the details. Show me how these things fit together. Help me understand how is it that you're all getting along? What are the relationships between you that you're all sitting here squished up together and you've got like a little daisy over here and this beautiful, like all these different wild grasses. They're not the same species. I love that. And it it is a reflection of who I am.
00:44:30
Speaker
It's what i what I gravitate towards, the more mixed up the group is. And that's why even in Dom and Her, I'm one of you know the person responsible for the international, like the whole idea of how do we really be out in the world as initiates.
00:44:45
Speaker
And so I think this is such a great exercise to to just sort of play into and to to be a little bit more um playful in the way that you look at yourself understand yourself like you said and I think that's probably I'm taking a wild guess why you said live like a plant is the direction that you're doing can you tell us a little bit more about your philosophy around like live like a plant I know you even now have like a little quiz that you've created around this tell tell us more Yeah.
00:45:11
Speaker
So as I developed as a gardener and started to really see how different plants adapted and had their own um ways of being, and I just started to introduce it into therapy and talk to people about it. And it seemed to so much resonate.
00:45:29
Speaker
And I would find myself often saying, so like a plant, dot, dot, dot. And I would give these examples. So I got it into my head. I'm going to write a book called Live Like a Plant.
00:45:40
Speaker
And so I'm in the process of writing, which is a bear. if more um is So, you know, trying to be consistent with that. But it's basically, first of all, looking at defining what is essential nature and talking a little bit about some of the things I talked about that, you know, we all have instinctive ways of reacting to the world that are informed by our genetics, but also a little bit by our environment.
Book Framework: Plant Analogies to Authenticity
00:46:05
Speaker
And then it's broken down into into eight chapters. So I look at like what are your roots and nutrients? And so we have like a dandelion with a deep tap root. Do you go deep into your environment and, you know, you've, maybe you've lived the same place for 30 years or do you have more, are you, do you have adventitious roots? Do you know, you sort of get things from the environment in a different way? Or I look at pollinators, like what,
00:46:32
Speaker
sustains you, um your bloom time, how are you unique? So if we look at like the corpse flower, you know, the the big, huge 12 foot tall that smells like rotting garbage, but people come from miles around when it blooms, it hardly blooms, you know, every few years.
00:46:50
Speaker
But we don't say, we don't look at that and say, oh my God, it's so lazy. It blooms like once every, we see it's gargantuan. It's amazing. And so if we can apply some of these things to our own lives, like we need specific nutrients.
00:47:06
Speaker
We want to attach to our environment in a unique way. We have a specific way we give our gifts. You know, I have plants that will bloom all summer. But then we have bulbs who do an amazing display and then they die back and we don't see them for months. And we don't say, look at that tulip. It's not doing its thing.
00:47:24
Speaker
It is doing its thing. So it's really looking the whole 360 view of a plant. And helping, first of all, people identify what is my essential nature?
00:47:36
Speaker
And then are there things where I want to adapt or I need to adapt? Is my climate zone okay? You know, a dandelion can grow and grow in like zones three to 11, but does it grow the same in all of those zones?
00:47:48
Speaker
Not really. So maybe we have a tropical zone and you've sort of talked about temperate. Are we trying to grow in you know, I'll say United States, we're trying to go in an Alaska zone when we really are a Florida plant.
00:48:02
Speaker
So different things like that, really helping people with examples, not just from the plant world, but from my clients, from my own life, just a fun, even if it's not somebody who's like, oh, I love plants. I think It's in our bodies to respond.
00:48:18
Speaker
So that's the book I'm working on. So I just, I put together a little quiz looking at all of those areas. And it really, it's not one of those where there's a big answer key and here's what you have to do.
00:48:29
Speaker
It's really to help people look at all this different, you know, the way these things express themselves in their own lives and And then is there one area I want to start to focus on? If I feel like I'm in a job where there's a lot of attention, the heat is very high, there's, you know, it's a lot of pressure.
00:48:50
Speaker
Some people respond to that and they produce. And I think of that like a sunflower who can get 10 hours of sun in a day. But other people, they need some coolness. They need a little bit of shade. They need some distance from people. they Maybe they're more introverted.
00:49:05
Speaker
but they're trying to live in a way, because again, we get a message that if you're an introvert, you're weird. And that's so not true. It's so opposite of what an introvert really is.
Adapting to Introversion and Extroversion
00:49:17
Speaker
So just looking at all of these ways of being and honoring them just, you know, because that's who you are, but then looking to, so like we talk strategically, is there one area, like, do I want to have, do I want to develop my root system?
00:49:32
Speaker
Am i feeling like I need to reach out more to different sources of sustenance or nourishment? So it's kind of that. it's ah It's really fun for me. And it just, it echoes like so congruently in my heart with what I want to do and what I feel like people respond to.
00:49:50
Speaker
And one of the things I really love is that um in the way that you're describing this is that one part of it is finding your essential nature. And the other part of it, which I feel like you're well qualified to do, and I think that this is important to do it with somebody who's qualified, is, okay, what of that do I want to modify And why am I wanting to modify that? Because again, if I want to if I'm and a naturally introverted person and like, for example, I'm an extroverted introvert. Like I am, i love to be in public for, for a period of time. And then I have to retreat. I definitely have those super sensitive sort of principles in me and, and I can go and I can even go for a fair amount of time, but, but the longer the time, the more my alone time afterwards needs to be.
00:50:38
Speaker
And that alone time is usually spent in a very kind of, you know, very, very lazy-ish, intimate sort of way for me, you know, because I've learned over time that that's who I am and I'm very comfortable with. now That being said, there are moments when I recognize, OK, even though today's a day where I need to, you know, where I'd love to just be at home and not go anywhere, I know I need to go everywhere. So what are the skills that I want to learn? But, you know, doing that because i feel like the benefits of whatever it is that I'm supposed to go do outweigh what I would feel
00:51:12
Speaker
um if I stayed home and I didn't do anything versus really understanding myself and saying, no, no matter how cool this thing is to go out, today is definitely a day where I should just stay home because, again, the benefits are going to outweigh, you know, the what what I will feel and experience afterwards if I don't listen to myself.
00:51:30
Speaker
I feel like this is the delicate world where having and working with somebody specifically as a therapist or somebody even like me who is, you know, ah both a certified coach as well as somebody with deep experience in these types of things is really important because it is a small, fine line. You have to first break through the conditioning.
00:51:52
Speaker
You have to get to the place of complete self-acceptance to then be able to evaluate the things that are happening and put the strategies in place that are not coming from a sense of guilt or because society tells me to, or because you know, something is going to go wrong or whatever that might be. Like, it's just such a delicate balance. And I feel like that's why something like what you're talking about is important.
00:52:19
Speaker
When you start to get to that understanding, when you feel like you can't see why you're doing things, when you can't see your motivation clearly, when you when you're you're feeling like you're in the grips of that conditioning, why it's better to work one-on-one with somebody who can help you just explore that in different ways so that your essential nature truly does shine through.
00:52:44
Speaker
And then the strategies you put in place are because of that plasticity, right? Like, let me mess with my epigenetics rather than, oh but society tells me that introverts are bad. So therefore, I just want to learn how to not be an introvert.
00:52:58
Speaker
Yeah. No. No, it doesn't work. No, no, no. yeah And I think, you know, we we talk about climate change. And I think sometimes our climate's changing in our life, but sometimes it happens so gradually. And plants, when the climate changes, there are plants that can't grow anymore in that climate. And if they do well, they can actually migrate. Yeah.
00:53:21
Speaker
through seeds or different things to different areas. But I think when we recognize that, and it's sort of like putting the lobster in the water and turning up the heat, it doesn't even know. So sometimes I think when we can step back with someone like you're talking about and say, oh my God, I've had so many losses in the last three years.
00:53:38
Speaker
That's why I'm not thriving.
Life Challenges and Climate Change Metaphor
00:53:40
Speaker
And many plants, they just try to survive, but we can look at plants, especially when we know what they're supposed to look like and be like, oh, that's really struggling.
00:53:49
Speaker
But we don't always – we know how we feel, but I think being able to look at, oh my God, all these things have changed. And then when we start to address it, what you're talking about, this capacity to make judgments about what should I do instead of just I'm avoiding the whole world. Right.
00:54:08
Speaker
i'm I've nurtured these things now. i'm in I'm in a more solid soil that's given me what I need. Now I have the capacity to choose to sometimes say, I'm not engaging here, but this is where there's going to be some things that outweigh maybe this.
00:54:24
Speaker
sort of instinct to to hide or retreat. And that's really important to realize you won't always feel this way. It's just getting the information and finding somebody to help you figure out how to make the changes you need to.
00:54:38
Speaker
I love that. I love that so much.
Conclusion and Contact Information
00:54:40
Speaker
Mary, this has been such a delightful conversation. Before we wrap it all up, I'd love for people to know, how how do they get in touch with you? how do How do they hear about your podcast and the work that you're doing? And maybe if they want to reach out to you about potentially working together?
00:54:55
Speaker
Yes. So my website maryrothwell.net. And I'm guessing it'll be in the show notes. So they can click on it. Absolutely. And my podcast is No Shrinking Violets, which you can find everywhere, but there is a podcast tab on my website. And if you want to go directly to my little plant quiz, it's LLAP quiz. So it's maryrothwell.net forward slash for live like a plant LLAP quiz.
00:55:23
Speaker
And you can access that there. And there's also a link if you want to schedule a consultation with me to talk about working with me. Beautiful. I will make sure all of that is in the show notes so that people can find you quickly. And I just want to really thank you for this conversation. i feel like these are the types of conversations that for so many of us, we need to be having.
00:55:46
Speaker
And I love the idea of getting into your conversation. you know, I call it your true nature, you call it your essential nature, but I think it's the exact same thing, which is who am I at a deep level and how do I accept who I am? And then from there, decide the direction that I want to take. And I love that you're taking your clients through this journey. Thank you so much.
00:56:07
Speaker
And for everybody listening, if you enjoyed this conversation, as I said, go find Mary and her podcast um in the show notes. But also, if you want to have a place where you have these types of conversations, come into the naturally conscious community.
00:56:20
Speaker
We all need a safe space for our nature-inspired exploration and as well as a place where we can bring plants into the conversation. and go deeper and explore wider than we can on we own. we We need community. We all need community do this.
00:56:37
Speaker
And if instead you feel like you're on a place where you really want to have that one-on-one support, please reach out either to Mary or to myself, depending on what you're looking for. I'm sure we would love to help you.
00:56:47
Speaker
So that's it for this episode. I hope you enjoyed it. Remember, resist the urge to hold back your emerging green brilliance.
00:56:57
Speaker
Thanks for tuning in to this episode of Reconnect with Plant Wisdom. To continue these conversations, join us in the Naturally Conscious Community, your premier online ecosystem for plant reawakening and accelerated evolution and co-creation with other kin.
00:57:11
Speaker
Here you'll find expansive discussions, interactive courses, live events, and supportive group programs like the Plant Wisdom Book Club and the Sprouts Writing and Creativity Group. Connect with like-minded individuals collaborating with plants to integrate these insights into life. Intro and outro music by Steve Shuley and Poinsettia from The Singing Life of Plants.
00:57:32
Speaker
That's it for me, Tigria Gardenia, and my plant collaborators. Until next time, remember, resist the urge to hold back your emerging green brilliance. I'm out. Bye!