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EP 69 - Skateboarding Life with Logan Dunning
20 Plays16 days ago
My guest today is Logan Dunning, a skateboarder with over 25 years experience. We have a wide-ranging chat about individual sports like Skateboarding compared to team sports.
For more info & to download a free PDF of today's episode notes, visit: www.chriskreuter.com/CDWI
Join the Kreuter Studios mailing list: https://mailchi.mp/810367311f3d/ksb
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Transcript
Introduction and Purpose of the Podcast
00:00:08
Speaker
On Chris deals with it, I talk about the frameworks and methods I use to clear personal, creative, and professional roadblocks. My goal is to help others bridge the gap between where they're at now and what they want to achieve.
Chris's Unique Background and Insights
00:00:20
Speaker
If you're new to the show, I'm an engineer, writer, parent, game designer, leader, and reader who leverages that experience to develop creative solutions to problems. An AI statement that all elements of this episode are products of the author, Chris Croyder, and made without the use of any AI tools.
Introducing Logan Dunning: A Skateboarding Journey
00:00:39
Speaker
Alright, I'd like to welcome Logan Dunning to the show. Hello, Chris. How are you? Doing good, man. How are you? Amazing. It's sunny. It's not raining. And I'm happy to be here. So thanks for having me.
00:00:51
Speaker
Yeah, so on a past episode of Chris deals with it talked about um kind of all rose lead to beer league is episode 60 on the podcast. And it was really talking about things from like a team sport perspective, which is where a lot of my experiences outside of a brief one month dalliance with it in college, you know, I've never really done skateboarding, I mean, a you know maybe a little bit of tennis here or there but even then it was in the context of a tennis team so I wanted to get somebody on that had a lot of experience with an individual sport um skateboarding is a great example of that so you wanted me to talk about your experience of skateboarding and how long you've been doing it preferences styles stuff like that yeah so like 25 years um I think I started when I was you know maybe around
00:01:35
Speaker
you know, 12 or 11 or 10, somewhere around then. I um ah got into it because I was copying my brother and I wanted to be, you know, I was like, oh man, like, you know, they do that all the time. And um I ended up falling in love with something accidentally as a sport or hobby. And then I took a,
00:01:59
Speaker
probably seven or eight i year hiatus in that 25 year block, I still count it. And that's for, you know, kids, you definitely want to be completely, yeah, you want to be focused on, you know, new baby. It's like, that's all that matters because you're getting adapted. Mummy's getting adapted. Yeah. Do you want to skateboarding with a baby Bjorn around the neighborhood?
00:02:23
Speaker
No, that would have been a good where were you back then that would be perfect for these ideas. Good.
Perfectionism and Style in Skateboarding
00:02:30
Speaker
Yeah. So what's your typical I mean, you know, style or preference for skateboarding nowadays. So I um I have ah an issue with perfectionism. And when I say issue, it's like um sociopathical, meaning that I know that I have ah ah an issue with perfectionism that I can try to you know, poke at, but I know I'm having it. And it's like a poisonous flower where if you do too much perfectionism, it'll just consume your soul. But the tricks and the style that I like to focus on is high quality. um Just when you see it, it's like textbook robotic. There's a lot, there's a bunch of scapers out there that are just
00:03:20
Speaker
hundred percent like this. That was the Wikipedia of that trick. That was the de facto standard of not saying any of my tricks are, but it's very high. OK, it flipped in perfectly. It got out perfectly. It's just boom. It made us very satisfying. Pop news like it's you folks more on precision and precision.
00:03:41
Speaker
Yeah, good flair. And yeah, exactly. And um I'm like stuck in the past a little bit with the clothing style because the clothing completely changes how you feel on the board. I'm not sure if you would experience the same phenomena in in in hockey and stuff because you guys typically wear, you know, the same stuff. Well, it's I think the difference, you know, if you're wearing just, hey, everyone wear your white jerseys and ever's just it's just a mishmash versus like, hey, we got new jerseys and we look really good, right? like our team last night, we played a team with a head like with the wah wah, like rust dust, like gas station chain. And they're really sick jerseys and they all with it looks pretty cool. I think, yeah, you know, when you get new jerseys, or or or the ones with the team, it makes you feel more legit, I guess. Yeah, yeah. So I guess it's kind of like, it's really like, you know, you have a certain look and style and and
00:04:31
Speaker
Yeah, that's a very great way of yeah, like it's like you imagine you guys just upgraded your jerseys and you just felt different. You're like you guys are playing different. It's like but almost like when the yes, so sometimes I'm like I'm like and skating different shoes are have complete different effects. It's like it's a completely different Bunch of tricks that are optimized and I can't figure out exactly why from like a physics physics level what part and it's also
00:05:07
Speaker
like a personal like muscle memory thing because the way that I distribute my weight on my left foot could be like this. And that shoe has this effect on that trick, but it changes everything, the shorts, the fact that you have can see your whole feet.
Impact of Gear on Performance
00:05:24
Speaker
um Then there's also like you know swag or that kind of like grit or that he's got, you know they they got that style where they're like,
00:05:34
Speaker
they you Do you just feel different on the board and you you have this confidence to do just different stuff? um Sometimes there's people that are about to do a trick. They show up at a park. They have great style. You're like you're just watching them and you're like, I don't even care if they do a trick.
00:05:52
Speaker
I don't even care they like that have all my screws around the outside. I don't actually know how to do anything else on the skateboard exactly. Yeah, I think that's it's interesting because I think that if you're just starting out, you can really doesn't really matter too much about the skateboard you're using the shoes that you're using the style that you have if you just but you know, same thing with hockey and a hockey stick, right? You just grab a stick and you're just learning how to, you know, stick handle and play stay on your feet. But as you get older, more experienced, you have that muscle memory, you know, just a small change in shoes like, yeah you know, a different soul or different pair of socks, maybe you're gonna have a very different feel you're gonna make a difference and you and you won't be able to perform to your normal standard. Same thing in hockey, you change like the lie of your blade on the ice, like, all of a sudden, you're you're missing passes or you're flubbing shots that you normally would hit 99% of the time.
00:06:46
Speaker
When you get to an advanced level, then the little details matter. They do. And I've, as like a, like computer science trained individual, I came at it from like a scientific perspective where. Okay. Every time I changed gear.
00:07:03
Speaker
I have to make sure that once I've found the most optimal shoes or the optimal deck to not change anything in this ah experiment environment, meaning that I'm going to have the same shoes every time, the same deck every time, because then I can in isolation change something small like the bushings or loosen the front truck by like, you know, a full 360 or half a half foot turn.
00:07:27
Speaker
And just see how and you have to go for a bit to see if that did anything.
Comparing Half-Pipe and Street Skating
00:07:33
Speaker
And you also have to have mindfulness because if you just skate around for a bit and you forget that you've changed something, you may indirectly internalize that you missed that trick because it's your fault. And it's like you come down on yourself. There's a lot of like ah mental hurdles and battles in skateboarding that get materialized in the physical world through the expression of the sport.
00:07:56
Speaker
Yeah, it's and it's not something where, you know, I'm just gonna listen to everything Tony Hawk said, or, or you know, his setup isn isn't necessarily gonna work for you because again, different body type or a different style or I mean, obviously different ability, but yeah, um,
00:08:13
Speaker
And he's a first grader, right? He's on the half pipe, right? Like yeah he, there's two different, two different types of skater, vert and street kind of, right? And you're more of a street skateboarder for yeah videos. So yeah have you ever done like the half pipe stuff, like indoors at all? Yes. And there's like a couple of different types of half pipe. There's like the one that he skates is like, I think 12 foot, 13, whatever. It's like a full half pipe. And that means it goes vert as in vertical. There's a part of the ramp that actually, you know, 90 degree.
00:08:42
Speaker
And the one that I like skating is like a four foot mini ramp, which kind of looks like a, you know, a bowl that doesn't go completely vertical, but you can do a lot of fun, like, you know, technical tricks, um, without the fear of falling 12 feet and having to need pads and stuff like that.
00:09:01
Speaker
So obviously skateboarding is very much an individual activity, but obviously you can do it with groups and and there's different, yeah you know, talk more about, do you skate with a regular crew or in the community? Every community has their local, like what's your local shop or your local park? So like kids will ask like, Hey, is this your, um, and I'm not the oldest one there. There's like, you know, on Saturday and Sunday, you know, Milton support center skate park, there's like probably 10.
00:09:31
Speaker
Like probably around that, Saturday and Sunday, every day of the year, um guys that are over the age of 30, and they're all like, you know, getting back into it, trying to relearn and stuff. But there is um the the team aspect of it.
00:09:52
Speaker
is like, if you're alone, it's you need music or you need to just listen to, it's very difficult to
Skateboarding as a Social Experience
00:10:01
Speaker
skateboard alone. It's very boring. This is like a unanimous feeling across the skateboarding industry um because of group hype or juice or ah loading people's special meter bar. It's the osmosis through hype that pushes the group to new heights and challenges.
00:10:22
Speaker
in Buddhism, they call it the Sangha. And you can achieve higher states of meditation through a group than you can alone. And it's because when you have a bunch of like minded individuals with the same goals, it creates this almost like, ah you know, spirit around, like that's its its own dynamic. So I won't try certain tricks, it was certain people, but then if those people show up, we're all hitting people push you in all sorts of different directions. And, um, I like being the, the cheerleader or the motivator. So like, if someone's trying something very difficult, I'm going to stand by them. Like the group typically will skate around, do their stuff and the guys that are a part of of it. But I'm going to like, you know, try to support that guy to, uh, you know, skate, whatever he's skating. If he's falling on it, I'm falling on it. If that makes sense.
00:11:20
Speaker
Yeah, it's really interesting because I guess there's a performative aspect to it that or or not even not accountability, but yeah you want to do better because of that group dynamics. so and And there's similarities to hockey in that regards, right? You don't want let the team down, um you you know, you rise and fall as it as a team. And, you know, if you play like, if you just don't put your effort in, you know, you're letting other people down, but there is no individual aspect of it where, you know,
00:11:46
Speaker
but to who's there that day, like, you know, especially with a hockey team, but you're always on like, you know, you can't play the game really mean, you can practice individual skills, but you can't play the game without having that team. Yes. Whereas keyboard, you do have that option. But it's it's interesting you state that, you know, it is better when there's other people there watching cheering. And and you there's still a collective aspect to it. I didn't really appreciate. Yeah. I got into skateboarding because I didn't want to have the dependency of a team. I can't play it without the team, but later in life I realized skateboarding is an unorganized team sport. It's unorganized as in, you know, it just goes around and it's organically evolving, but it is a team sport. Does that make sense?
00:12:33
Speaker
Yeah. And it's, it is a team sport without an opponent. I think that maybe that's the key, right? You're not facing off against another group of people. I mean, I said, you know, Oh, yes. What is the opponent points? And I think gymnastics, there's lots of individualized sports. I mean, you know, tennis is an individual sport in some, you know, like doubles, but like, where you're facing off against an opponent. Yes. You know,
00:12:59
Speaker
Golf can theoretically just who has a lower score, but it could just be you versus the course, whereas you it's young versus you the skate park. But it's really fascinating to get those team elements without necessarily the competitiveness. Yes, you get you get no competitiveness with all of the same team feeling. Imagine like competitiveness for me was one of the things that perhaps deterred me from team sports.
00:13:27
Speaker
I don't think a lot of people are pro competitive. Like, you know, I feel like I've heard it a lot. They're like, oh, I'm not into that competitive stuff. I'm like, and I i had to say to talk about video games, for example, it's like, oh, no, no, um we play a game that we're all on the same team and they would play.
00:13:46
Speaker
I mean, if you're all in the same team, that's inclusive. But if it's us versus them, it could be felt as divisive, right? These are creating these divisions, like this league, that league, and like the it's us and them. But when you said that I just had like a Archimedes in a bathtub, like epiphany, the opponent in skateboarding is yourself.
00:14:09
Speaker
or the things you're trying to get over the fear of doing. And if it's a group sport, we're all working to get over these fears. It's like a bunch of people flying around that are all afraid of certain things, but a year later, that thing, they're not afraid of. They've conquered, they beat that team as a team. It's a opponent list that if basically conquering fear, it's like a, you know, arena for comp, you know, growing yourself individually. Skateboarding is group therapy with Logan Dunning. Yes. yeah it It is very, very good for just relaxing. well Just yeah everything melts away. Does that happen to you when you play hockey?
00:14:49
Speaker
I mean, yeah, I mean, I talked about in the in the episode I was referring to before, where it's very much about when you're at the rink, you're at the rink, and it's really, it's really easy for you to forget about everything else outside of that, the time you're on the ice. And it's very relaxing, in a sense. I mean, obviously, it's physically demanding and and can be stressful. But it's just in a very different way. It's just it's it's having that focus sometimes has has a really nice benefit. But when you when you play, do you guys all leave at the same time?
00:15:19
Speaker
Yeah, some guys will leave, you know, they'll run out earlier as the other guys will stay in, you know, for a parking lot beer and hang out and chat. um Usually have, you know, people on the team will have different levels of engagement with the team, right? I have guys that won't even be able to text the group chat saying we're going to show up at the rank, they show up, they put the equipment on, they don't talk bears, basically, like, are we gonna get him to smile today? Yeah, it's like deep right. Yeah, fair enough. On the ice, you know, you kind of know their personality, and usually if they're still on the team, there's a reason, but Um, you know, that's kind of where the dynamics can change from season to season where, you know, people just kind of feel like, you know, they want to be on the periphery. And then, you know, because they don't want that, that firm commitment long term, right? whereas You have, you know, the locker room will be different depending on who's there that day. Right. And not just in terms of skill level in terms of personality. Yep. Yep. You have a lot of strong egos in unlucky.
00:16:07
Speaker
Is it, is it, it doesn't stem from like, you know, checking the guy into the world. He's the one guy on the team that won't pass the puck and he just wants us to stick candle and dangle with us. And there's other guys that, you know, maybe they're not the fleetest of foot, but they have good positioning or they'll be more of the cheerleader like you were talking about before. So yeah, it's interesting. You have some of the same dynamics with the, with the skateboarding crew, but I think the other major difference is you're not tied to like a league schedule. Hmm.
Flow State vs. Methodical Practice in Skateboarding
00:16:33
Speaker
Right. And that's why you get sometimes variation from game to game is like, all right, like Wednesday at the clock, I can't make it right. um Yeah. Whereas skateboarding, you know, you can go whenever you want. I mean, we're not sure about the weather for a second. But you know, I'll get together at a certain time on a Sunday morning, you know, you can stay as long as you want. If you only have 20 30 minutes, you can still go out and and work on a skill. So that you have
00:17:00
Speaker
more inflexible opportunities? Yes. does that Does that impact the role skating has in your life? Very much so in a positive and negative way sometimes, like the reason I asked you, you guys leave at the same time, like, and then you have a couple beers, there's like,
00:17:21
Speaker
The one of the problems right now with skateboarding and it's like and it's existed since the dawn. It's been born and I'm sure it's like this in a lot of non team team sports.
00:17:34
Speaker
um You have um it's very hard to leave. You're just having so much money. There will be skateboarders that will injure themselves before leaving because they just can't stop. They love it so much. And it's like the Healthiest addiction in the world take any other addiction Mentally, what would that do if you couldn't stop? is Right. Yeah, exactly. So but this is great. I mean, you know, they'll get injured because they ah they They can't get their foot out of the way from a fall because they're just so tired and that's typically how they so willpower is is not the highest with the
00:18:18
Speaker
I would say that personality traits like generally in skateboarding. um When I talk amongst the community, myself personally, it is so hard to leave, especially when you're having fun and you just landed something. someone else just did some um It's just an adrenaline dopamine like salad where everyone's like yelling and getting hyped and excited. like um Very hard to leave.
00:18:43
Speaker
so So I mean, well, how does that affect the benchmark you set for yourself in terms of effort, talent, you know, practice, like you go in with goals, or like, I'm just gonna get this kickflip today, or? Yeah, there's, there's people that are very methodical with their goals. And then I went, I started noticing more of a flow with the different I'm not saying there's a right way in the right wrong way.
00:19:09
Speaker
But as a kid, I was very much like Justin, where I'm like, okay, I'm going to go out and do 100 kickflips until my kickflips are pristine. Perfect. But as an adult, I've noticed some other skateboarders that just flow like water and I just copied them. And so when kids ask, when I say kids, I'm like, Luke's like 22. I'm like, you know, that's like kids. So like I'm 40 turning 41. Um.
00:19:34
Speaker
the They'll say, what trick are you going to try? And be like, I don't even know. Like, whatever happens happens when it happens. And then, you know, it will be fluidly reacted to at the time. Like, what time is it now?
00:19:48
Speaker
And what time is it? There's an immediacy to it. Yeah. You can kind of get into a flow state sometimes, you know, yes, for I mean, it's also more shift based where I know how am I gonna make an impact on the game, the shift and you're very much reactionary to what's going on, right? Yes, very different if you're trapped in your own zone versus you're trying to score a goal on yeah ah on the opposite side of the rink. So yeah. Yeah, I guess. Yeah.
00:20:13
Speaker
But you could also just do this. You can, if you're just by yourself at the rank, you could just practice slop shots for, you know, I'm gonna take 100 100 shots. Yeah. Or if I'm in a driveway shooting, you know, then then it's more methodical, whereas on a rank, it's more reactionary. So I guess I get the that flow state. That's pretty cool. Yeah. But how does skating impact you on a personal level? um So on a personal level, it's hard if you love something, and it's hard to leave.
00:20:41
Speaker
It makes balancing your life difficult. It points out things personally that I've had to work on and accomplish greater feats at over the years such as prioritization of and timing and the whole family versus work versus you know hockey slash skateboarding slash you know all these other things. The hardest challenge I've found personally with skateboarding is developing more. If I set, i now I set a timer on my watch for like an hour. And i as soon as that goes off, that's it. It's over. Like the inning is done. um It keeps me in check. It keeps my, you know, biometrics and vitals kind of optimized for a less is more thing because I can never heal my body if I go every day.
Balancing Skateboarding with Life's Responsibilities
00:21:36
Speaker
So when I take a four day break, which is,
00:21:39
Speaker
really good. I come back the fifth day, like landing everything. Those four days are like horrible for like wanting to go. yeah It is literally just, it is again, the world's healthiest, like that kind of sport, addiction, you just want to go, go, go. And then you just, you're just developing the willpower and inner strength.
00:22:05
Speaker
I mean, you plan that time into your day, it has it changes the whole makeup of your day, right? Like my days are different when it's a game night. Like I know that that I'm gonna go to the rink that tonight. Like, yeah, you just go through your whole day a little bit differently. um Yeah, next morning. And next morning, you go through your day differently to usually because you know, barely gets into me late at night, whereas yeah but you have trouble sleeping or like if you play late at night yeah because um like that's the thing like I I have to do it in the morning because that's like gives you the energy and when the sun's out but the the scene of skateboarding like just probably like the scene of hockey is like in the evenings so it's all messing up people's sleep and but now I want to ask you could the way that you said that like when you come down the stairs the next day after in the playing hockey
00:22:50
Speaker
Do you feel like an old man? Like you're like, Oh, I can't come down the stairs. Like it's like your body is killing the game. Right. Like fair enough. no where you may have been working through an injury or you know, had that bunch of like knee and foot issues recently. But like last night was like the hardest, you know, game I played physically in a while, but I feel great. Like, sometimes, you know, some guy will just weld you to the boards for the massive hit and you can barely walk the next day. um It just depends. I mean, just saying that you're sending a skateboarder, right? If also you fell on your tweet, your knee, your ankle, it's gonna affect you the next day.
00:23:24
Speaker
yeah Sometimes it's a good story to tell. Sometimes it's an embarrassing one to tell. But, you know, it's also because you did something you loved. I mean, it's um never gonna feel bad about making that choice. It's just, you know, maybe sucks in the moment, but it was with a purpose.
Joy and Community in Skateboarding
00:23:40
Speaker
So I want to get to kind of my last major question here. I mean, obviously, your last name isn't Hawk, you're not in the X Games. So, you know, what do you aspire to a skateboarding like, you know, down the road here? um And has that changed, like, as you've gotten older?
00:23:54
Speaker
Yeah, so I had a bunch of sponsors as a kid. um I was like, I'm going to go and I'm going to go pro. um um And they just I mean, a lot of that stuff doesn't happen. You know, like you're not like I think it's any sport. And I quit skateboarding as a kid when I when it was all about competitions, magazines like, ah ah oh, you didn't get in the magazine or you didn't place in the top five in that competition. It felt like work. And then I realized At the time, I was like, this isn't fun anymore. So I stopped and I got back into it as an adult because I'm like, for me, jogging was boring. I was like, let's just try skateboarding. I was like, oh, this is great. And I just, it completely changed my, my body, my, my mood. Everything had fixed so much. Physical activity is so underrated if you're an office worker or any kind of sedentary thing.
00:24:48
Speaker
And now that I'm at such a skill that I have right now, which in some ways have trumped a lot of the ability I had as a kid. I'm like, so if I've surpassed myself, I'm in this dangerous area again, where it could become work and then I could just abandon it. So then I thought.
00:25:13
Speaker
Like I had a friend say, or are you ah did you enter into that competition? on I was like, I guess I could. Like I could do that. And I was like, I should. But like maybe my outlook or my needs to be like, I would i don't i't really care. I don't really care about whatever. I'm just going to go there and have fun. But I have no expectations, which makes it so open to injuring.
00:25:43
Speaker
and never doing it. No expectations like sponsors and and so I'm just hoping that I'm hoping nothing actually. So I love it. I love that I get to participate in it. I love the that I can help ah coach and uplift new and upcoming positive skateboarder kids. But yeah, I have no goals.
00:26:09
Speaker
and no plan for skateboarding because that's what destroyed it in the first place. Yeah, I think yeah and I'll link to your videos and your channel ah YouTube channel where a lot of your videos do get that come across with that right where it's.
00:26:22
Speaker
someone meditative. It's also just focused on the joy of skateboarding. Yeah, some to some extent the community on certain videos, but yeah there's not like a forcefulness to it. But yeah, makes it appealing. Yeah. ah In the on the social media side. I appreciate that. I you know, like social media is typically Toxic. Toxic is putting it kindly actually these days. It's like we take a pic, it's like, oh, that's that person? Well, on their Instagram, they looked like this. It's like, AI aside, just the felt over filtering to make it look good or the face. yeah you're You're only getting highlights and you're probably getting fake ones at that. I said, I think I'm done posting only the tricks.
00:27:04
Speaker
And then he's like, yeah, like you need to show the journey. You need to show it unfiltered, like raw. And so then I was like, okay, ah I want to prioritize like a good trick with a horrible fall. So the past couple of videos I've done is like.
00:27:21
Speaker
It's real, but it's, it's still toxically filtered because of my perfectionism of like, okay, I want to release high quality content, but it is evolving in a more natural way of like, here's the grit and here's the result. It's actually probably motivational.
00:27:40
Speaker
Yeah, it's really interesting because there's a big trend. I hear um I hear more and more people discussing this in the hockey circles where you know you can go log in the next morning and get the highlights of the game and within five minutes like all the all the key moments of the game. Yeah, it's devoid of the most of the time doesn't get across the the pace of the game, the emotion in the game, because you don't see the build up, right? You see the goal, you don't see like, the five minutes beforehand, where they're pressuring and pressuring and pressuring and wearing down the other team, like, you're not going to get the nuance of the game. And a lot of kids are basically just, you know, they, they're from this generation that wants things really, really quick. They're the highlight generation. They don't want to say want to go through the hours of footage to understand those kind of nuances.
00:28:25
Speaker
Yeah, you if you're a skateboarder, everyone's just trying to optimize for a 15 second Snapchat video or whatever, as opposed to trying a trick 50 times like your friend or you you and your friend will do or you're getting out of like understanding what a flow state is where it's not necessarily it's not about the flash, but yes, that's interesting. Yeah, it's a he's very much a supporter of that vision of ah Is it making society more TikTok attention deprived, or is it actually adding attention? So he, ah sometimes, i um most of the time I won't have music, and I will have the videos a little bit longer, no special effects, no ah stuff, just to, it's more of um ASMR, or like you said, the-
00:29:21
Speaker
This is very chill. um If you have a really good microphone, really high quality, you know, iPhone or whatever camera, it's kind of cool. Like if you eat edit on CapCut and just post, but. you Yeah, it's um how do you do social right?
00:29:41
Speaker
ah Because in a world where a majority of the world does social wrong, and it's pretty much messed up so much of this world, like it's, yeah, we're trying to be, I don't know, counterculture in a good way. And skating has always kind of been counterculture. It's kind of ethos when it started, right? It was frowned upon. It's all the no skateboarding signs everywhere, you know. Yep.
00:30:06
Speaker
And now, uh, the cities are like, fine, you're going to wreck our stuff. We're going to build these little outdoor concrete daycares for you little kids. And now we feel like, you know, we don't leave the park. And then, and then kids don't even appreciate it's like, you know, I, you know, there's people that throw their boards at security guards back in the day, like just to get these things and you'll never appreciate like.
00:30:32
Speaker
You know, that's a whole old man. Back in my day, we didn't have color TVs. We had great ham radios. Yeah, we had to push our skateboards up the hill in the snow. Both directions. Both directions. Well, Logan, thanks so much for joining the show. It's been an awesome conversation. I will have links to all your you all different channels and some other resources for people. You know, maybe want to learn more about the hobby or just get to know you better. Yeah, thanks, Chris, for having me on.
00:31:06
Speaker
If you feel that Chris dealt with it, I'd appreciate your support of the show by sharing it with someone who might benefit. Ratings on your favorite podcast player are also helpful in growing the audience. Visit chriscroiter dot.com for free downloadable PDFs with notes and resources from today's episode, sign up for the CDWY mailing list, or to send in your problems or requests for future shows, that's C-H-R-I-S-K-R-E-U-T-E-R dot.com, or use the link in the show notes.