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3. Running with purpose on the AAWT, and other ultra adventures
42 Plays4 months ago
Matt Gore and Giles Penfold join us to discuss their 2021 traverse of the Australian Alpine Walking Track, as they raised funds and awareness to protect wild places under threat. This conversation shares many aspects of their big adventure; from planning and logistics, to their time out on the trail, how they navigated fundraising and other challenges along the way. We then check in with Giles two years later, to reflect on tackling the AAWT, the challenges they experienced in creating a movie about their experience and what the keen trail and ultra runners have been up to since. You can watch the teaser trailer for the long awaited feature film here. You can also see clips at @655forthewild, or follow Matt and Giles on Instagram at @mattbgore or @gilespenfold. To hear more from For Wild Places, subscribe to our newsletter or become a member.
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Transcript
Introduction to For Wild Places Podcast
00:00:20
Speaker
Welcome to the For Wild Places podcast, a podcast that shares the stories of inspiring people and their adventures in running, adventure, and advocacy. I'm your host, Hilary, and today we are excited to bring you our trail chat with Matt Gore and Giles Penfold, the friends behind 665 for Takana.
Monthly Chats with Adventurers and Advocates
00:00:36
Speaker
Every month we catch up with athletes, leaders, activists and inspiring people to talk about past or future adventures, their favourite wild places and the connection between adventure and
Matt and Giles' 655 km Alpine Adventure
00:00:45
Speaker
activism. The first part of this conversation was recorded in August 2022, a bit over a year after Matt and Giles finished their 17 day, 655 kilometre traverse of the Australian Alpine
Acknowledging First Nations Custodianship
00:00:57
Speaker
walking track.
00:00:57
Speaker
Before we jump into the chat, I would like to acknowledge the First Nations people who have been custodians of land, waters and culture for tens of thousands of years. We understand the wild places we love to explore on this continent have been cared for by First Nations people for millennia. We seek to learn from this world's oldest living culture so we too can care for country, as the indigenous people of this continent have done since time immemorial.
00:01:18
Speaker
This podcast was recorded and edited on what are on country in so-called Australia where sovereignty was never ceded. This always was and will be Aboriginal land.
Planning and Reflections on Big Adventures
00:01:27
Speaker
Today's chat with Matt and Giles covers the many aspects of a big adventure from planning and logistics to their time out on the trail and how they navigated fundraising, as well as their reflections from the experience.
Ultra Running Achievements of Matt and Giles
00:01:37
Speaker
Matt and Giles are both keen trail road and ultra runners and have since gone on to run and podium at major races across Australia and beyond. This conversation is a must listen for anyone keen to take on big audacious challenges and raise funds or awareness to protect a particular wild place under threat. Matt and Giles generously share the ups and downs of their AAWT experience, which is on the bucket list for many Australian hikers and ultra
Film Project on the Alpine Walking Track
00:02:02
Speaker
runners. Following on from our conversation from about two years ago, I checked in with Giles in August this year to see what adventures he and Matt have been up to since.
Discussion with Matt and Giles Begins
00:02:10
Speaker
Keep listening to hear more about the challenges they've encountered when it comes to making a movie about their experience on the AAWT. Let's get into the chat with Matt, Giles and myself from August 2002.
00:02:24
Speaker
Thanks everyone for joining us. I'm Hilary from For Wild Places. Tonight we're joined by Matt Gore and Giles Penfold who a little while ago ran the Australian Alpine Walking Track to raise funds for the Bob Brown Foundation for 655 for Takina. We've been meaning to catch up with these guys for a while to hear more about not only those adventures but everything that they've been up to ever since. So um kind of know all about your journey but I guess on the Australian Alpine Walking Track but just keen to hear more about The two of you and I actually have no idea how you two even know each other and how you got into ultra running and why you both thought it would be a great idea to do this adventure together. So I first got into trail running back in 2015. Took a gap year basically after high school and just decided to to live in the mountains in in a place called Aosta in the north kind of western part of of Italy. So I trained for three weeks had absolutely no idea what I was doing at the time.
00:03:20
Speaker
which is always a lot of fun, and then did a 48k ultra in the mountains in Zermatt. And that was kind of my first intro slash smack in the face. Something like 3k of a cent and a cent in that race, which for me was just like ridiculous. i Yeah, anyway, it was, ah it was,
00:03:39
Speaker
It was so much fun um and it taught me a lot. It taught me that I knew absolutely and nothing about the sport and that's kind of when I first got hooked into it. I also spent a year living in Costa Rica and joined ah a lovely little trail community in 2019. Yeah, I've kind of been running running ever since 2015. Matt and I met, it was somewhat serendipitous, basically through mutual friends. I think I sent you a message because I i didn't know anyone in Australia that actually tra did trail running and liked to run
00:04:13
Speaker
stupidly long distances and so I think I bumped into Matt on or someone showed me his Instagram or something like that way back and when I got back to Sydney I essentially sent him a message and we went and did a 60k somewhere in the Blue Mountains and got along super well and he absolutely roasted me as because he's a bloody strong runner. It was like a test of your character jobs that I was on my final run before UTA 100 and really fit and you hadn't done a long run in about two years. Not for about 50Ks and I'm pretty sure you were blacking out at the end of it but you kept going and then I went oh this this guy's tough.
00:04:52
Speaker
not Not that fast at the moment. You start with nails. You can start with the toughness and get the speed and the training, but does it doesn't work the other way around. You've got to have that, I don't know, weird sense of satisfaction in you just pushing through. so We even shared compression diamonds because these legs were getting so smashed. and and one One leg each of the compression halves, I think it was. assume Yeah, it was quite funny. It was a good first experience together onwards and upwards. Now that you say that, I feel like AAWT was just like the perfect second date. Do you still like do races and stuff, Giles? Or are you more just like going out and doing your own thing these days? Yeah, no, a bit of both. I haven't raced a lot in Australia, in all honesty. I actually just yesterday signed up for a 100K Ultra in the Pyrenees, which will be on the 1st of October, which is super exciting. But yeah, I'm i'm less of like a
00:05:46
Speaker
serious racer and more of a, I just love playing and mucking around in the mountains. I mean, I love long distances as well. it It really excites me, the challenging side of it. You get to see and and traverse through these amazing and and humbling parts of the world and that for me is is very special and something that, I don't know, it's special. um And to to have done the the AWT With Matt something, I don't know. I almost feel like we we we haven't done it, Matt. Like it was all some weird little dream. I don't know about you if you've been thinking about this recently, but like for the past few weeks, particularly because I've been in the mountains, it's been, it's like some surreal experience. Like, holy shit, did we actually do the AWT? Like, was that me? what What's going on?
00:06:31
Speaker
yeah Yeah, I don't know. It's crazy because we spent so long thinking about it and planning it. And then but two and a half weeks feels like a long time when you're but your legs are cooked and you're you're in a lot of pain, but you come out the other side and go. That was like a kind of an almost 12 month.
00:06:50
Speaker
almost part-time job kind of experience building up to that and and it was gone in the blink of an eye and then yeah now we're almost a year down the track and you're right like it was such an important part of my life that I almost mostly remember all the logistics and that two and a half week blip is so yeah it feels like a dream sometimes you're right I know exactly how you feel. And how about you Matt? it Sounds like you've been doing it because that UTA when you met what year was that rough? That was my second UTA so I think that would have been 2019. Oh yeah yeah.
00:07:25
Speaker
Yeah, so I kind of ran all the way through school and then and then fell out of fell out of love with it during the first few years of uni as we tend to. And then I had a bit of a gap gap year during my third year of university. I was living and working in in Milan in Italy and just super, super, super poor kind of The only thing I could afford to do on weekends was take the the one euro 50 cents kind of train because it was still ah it was still a kind of city train up to Lake Como. And I just spent weekend after weekend hiking just with my day pack on and a sandwich and just sitting up the top of the mountains and just reading my book, looking over the
00:08:06
Speaker
the lakes and the views. And then after a while I realized that I'd have hiked all the trails and I started jogging them to kind of get further. And I went, you know, I'm pretty fit. I can just, you know, he's 20 kilometers. I don't think I can walk it in four hours, but I'm sure as hell run it. And that's how I fell into it. And I didn't know that it was an actual thing. And I got back to Sydney six months later and talked to a few of my running mates and and they were kind of catching onto it too and found there was a whole community and and started running with some more seasoned people and now is it hook, line and sinker. Mine was a very familiar story in that, yeah, I was a hiker and then was like, Oh yeah, actually I think we did Oxfam and started to realize that, you know, you you can, if you put your mind to it, you can cover 50K in a day. But then all of a sudden I was like, well, if you run, you can, it just yeah opens up a whole new world in terms of accessing faraway places. And and I guess fast packing is good in between in that you can get the best of both worlds, but then also camp because that's one thing I miss about trail running is you often do it in a day and then you end up at a home or somewhere at night, but you don't have those nights where you are just on the side of a mountain somewhere with but another person or sign of humans in sight. Yeah. Had either of you done fast packing before you set your sights on the AAWT? I had done Lara Pinter because I was on my gap here last year, kind of living in a van. And it was the exact same thing, but I was looking at these awesome long trails going, I can't run 230Ks in one day. And what am I going to, you know, what am I going to do for water? And, you know, and the bag was getting increasingly heavy. And then I'm putting in overnight stuff just in case. And then I didn't know fast packing was if I kind of discovered it out of necessity. And so I did Lara Pinter in a couple of days and then, um,
00:09:50
Speaker
And then I did a ah lot, a lot of the Tassie, the long Tassie ones, because it's such a slow going down there. It's beautiful rugged terrain. So slow. So I did a lot of that in the kind of build up to AAWT. So kind of like awesome training almost. Yeah. It's carrying weight and and trying to move quickly at the same time. That's right, but it's a very new phenomenon. I find it very different to trail running. but Trail running is is my sport. It's what I can compete at, but fast packing for me is my leisure. A different mindset, I guess, is taking it slower and soaking it in as opposed to just trying to complete a set path or whatever. Yeah, that's right. And often I feel like there are many places in the world where I'd want to actually not run it and just fast pack something like Mont Blanc.
00:10:37
Speaker
Because I don't want to be running through the night. I kind of want to be enjoying. You're missing out on half of the the beauty, aren't you? And everyone keeps telling me about all the huts around Mont Blanc. And I'm like, that just sounds like my idea of heaven as well. Getting back to a home cooked meal and a glass of wine and ah chatting to a bunch of strangers. on the side of a mountain also sounds pretty nice. Yeah. Yeah. So you came up with the idea with, I think you said in the newsletter, it was around February. Why why did you choose to kind of, was that a joint decision or did one of you kind of brought that to the table in terms of it being an awareness and fundraising mission as opposed to just doing it for the fun of it? Yeah, I think it was a joint decision. I mean, initially we had kind of thrown around the idea of, yeah, different organisations, but essentially we did some research. we Matt and I had both been down to Tassie before. We both absolutely loved the place. Yeah. Just saying the actual work that the Bob Brown Foundation are doing to me, like it it it made sense. to to choose these guys because they're on the front lines, they they're doing like it's tangible change. It wasn't like a no brainer or anything, but it was something that we both really aligned with and thought like, yes, this is this is the right thing to do. This this feels this feels good. I think what once we kind of done our due diligence on three or four kind of key charities and foundations that kind of do the work that we were hoping to promote, you kind of came down to what was but what was the most grassroots that we felt that we could get.
00:12:11
Speaker
the best dollar value out of and we thought the Bob Brown Foundation was really, really good on that front. you you You can see where every cent goes and it's such powerful impact for that for that dollar. And then I think the second thing was just what we felt most passionately about with I think one of the ones we were considering was something to do with the Great Barrier Reef but at the end of the day I think we both just connected most strongly with the forest and Tasmania and yeah once we kind of decided on it it was like that was what we were of course always going to do. It's like there was never really another option somehow and it just idiot yeah felt right no and it was right.
00:12:49
Speaker
And what came first, the idea to do the run or to fundraise like was that, was it kind of one in the same or cause you know, a lot of people do these things just cause they want to do it for the sense of adventure and to achieve it. But then I feel like now with kind of doing the tip to toe and you know, and a lot of people do it for mental health awareness and, and around different illnesses. What was your kind of thinking process in doing it for a cause as opposed to just as a, your own adventure?
00:13:17
Speaker
ah So initially it was going to be just Matt and I simply doing this um this AWT for ourselves for the selfish reason that so many people love to you know run through nature and and challenge themselves and etc etc but I mean after talking about it for a while we did realize that we kind of wanted to turn it into something a bit bigger than ourselves. Excuse the cliche. Yeah, we had a crack at obviously getting sponsors on board, raising money, like it all kind of pieces started coming together, but it did kind of stem from that one idea of like, holy shit, like let's go and do the WT together. Just like this very grassroots boyhood dream of wanting to tackle this massive, massive traverse through the Australian Alps.
00:14:04
Speaker
I imagine that while you were doing it, knowing that it was for a purpose greater than your cells would have been a big motivator throughout it and kind of given it a purpose outside of your cells as well. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, completely. And even from day dot, so as soon as we got to Wellhuller and we were on the start line, we were going, there's no way we're not finishing this. There's no way. It doesn't matter how hard it is. Doesn't matter if we break a leg or if we get bitten by a snake, like we'll get flown out to hospital.
00:14:32
Speaker
But Giles was out in the hospital, I just camp up and the second he's back, we'll we'll keep going. You know, because, yeah, you're right. If it's just the two of us, it's an awesome thing for us. And we've never shied away from like underlying selfish want of doing it as I'm sure every other adventurer that has done something like this feels but yeah that's kind of what got us so particularly particularly made towards the back end when stuff really starts to hurt and you just go yeah like i'm not I'm not hurting for myself because I'm doing this so that others can can kind of
00:15:11
Speaker
connect with us and then and learn about this cause and connect with the kind and connect with the Bob Mound Foundation and that helps a lot knowing that it was absolutely. It's interesting how it almost needs to be a selfless thing for it to actually be possible. If you're just doing it for yourself you can't just give up because you're only disappointing yourself whereas when there's a community and I can imagine having the good work that the Bob Brown Foundation is doing in the back of your mind because you traverse through such an incredible array of landscapes and I know in the newsletter you touched on of things that impacted on you in terms of the bushfire aftermath and invasive species such as deer and brumbies and
00:15:49
Speaker
um different climates. Like were your eyes more open because you went in that with that mindset of doing it to raise awareness for the preservation of wild places to actually be in those wild places and seeing the different things that might have caught you by surprise that are actually eating them and you know putting them at risk. I think so. I think i think over the last 18 months, I particularly have become quite sensitive to these kinds of things. 18 months ago ago, I don't think I would have noticed these things. But now, I think this is part of my my journey as a person. But certainly, you become hyper aware. And it's funny, we had this duality in the entire run where
00:16:30
Speaker
we were aiming to raise awareness of takana and its beauty but also the threat that it's under but then also part of the reason we were doing this was to showcase the beauty of the Australian Alps and and I did go into it thinking that it was more or less untouched beautiful wilderness and then you know to go through it and go oh no it's it's not really many parts of it are are totally ravaged and and this isn't some some story about going through this pristine wilderness and and it's almost, you know, is in dangerous to kind of in some areas. um Yeah, it's certainly struck a chord with me. And you come through these areas that are so beautiful and then it's just juxtaposed. Within the space of 15, 20 minutes, you can go from these pristine areas to not pristine and just the juxtaposition makes it so clear that that's what we have to prevent. I remember seeing footage of you just like hurdles, just tree after tree down and you just being like, where are we? Is this even the path? Whereabouts was that? It was in the Victorian section, kind of about 150 kilometres north of Valhalla. So kind of approaching Mount Sunday and the first real bit of the Vic Alps. And my understanding is that that bit had been burnt through and it was just super, super, super thick regrowth everywhere. And then they had those, that it was the massive storms that had come through and and cleared kind of everything. And and and it's funny, isn't it? because that's
00:18:06
Speaker
you're so isolated and it doesn't at all feel like it's, you know, anthropogenically impacted. And yet, and yet it is. um And that's something that even now I try and turn my mind to more because it's easy to miss if you're not thinking about it all the time. Definitely. And did you find that I can imagine your, your moods were a roller coaster and feeling positive and then feeling like, I remember you said a piece of shit basically other mornings, but did you find that that your mood was impacted by your surrounds or the two intertwined? Yeah, absolutely. For me, I think this is it's fair to say that this is the same for you as well, Matt. the kind of the The most beautiful areas were where we would feel incredible as well, um and being able to to soak that in. um
00:18:54
Speaker
And it's so interesting, the juxtaposition between that and also feeling absolutely terrible when, for example, I got drenched and got really sick on day six. Like, it was miserable in some of the hardest steps of my life. But just just being out there and seeing the different landscapes and being able to soak it all in, like, there was some absolutely incredible summer where you just look at and you go, like, this can't be real. And you feel euphoric. Connecting that ah to Takana and everything else was was was something very special and it made it even more kind of real and and heartfelt. A question I've always had when I've looked at your photos, I'm guessing you decided to match clothes intentionally. was that What was the the thought behind that? it Was it just easier?
00:19:40
Speaker
we We didn't plan it at all. It was it was our sponsor. that who We need to thank. Salomon sent us a ah bunch of amazing gear. We were matching little minions the whole bloody time. like pit We would bump into people on the on the track and people would bring it up. like They'd be like, why are you guys identical? like What's going on here? It was bizarre. I quite liked it. You're a real team. But I did see that you had your own tents. We had our own. It was one of the things that I love my current tent and it's a single person. And Giles actually ended up carrying a two person tent the entire way. So something could have happened. But we tried to have a bit of redundancy and gear in case something happened. One tent is a bit of an issue. It was probably a good thing Hillary, because I'm sure I'm speaking for Giles as well. Because you get to the end of the day, you've been you've been walking slash running together for 14 hours and need a little bit of space.
00:20:29
Speaker
I completely get it because I'm the same. I love my tent and it's a two person, but even then when it's just me, I think there's barely enough room for another person. And there's nothing better than escaping to your own tent at the end of the day, not even after spending 14 hours, two and a half weeks straight with someone. And you know, whether you want to laugh or cry or just sleep or curl up in the fetal position and say like, this is so fucking hard, at least you've got some personal space. right and And it was never that personal because we could always, you know, it's just two thin pieces of fabric. We could hear everything else going and going on in the other table. Like when, when Jars is recording, recording is GoPro, you know, little interviews at the end of the day. And I'm, I'm commentating from my tent. everything you're saying. But yeah, I think it's just having that little that little palace to call you at the end of the day. It's worth the extra kilo or a couple hundred grams or whatever it is. in paring and yeah It's funny, I think that people often forget that tents aren't soundproof. Some reason people think because they're in their little cocoon that they've got some privacy. But yeah, there's still not much privacy in a tent.
00:21:37
Speaker
Logistically it would have been you trying to obviously keep things to a minimum but then there's just the two of you and because it was I guess a couple of days between food drops so you were out there on your own and testing all your gear and knowing what to take and yeah you Giles having issues with your jacket and think little things like that that can of course come to be a huge problem like what yeah what were the main kind of takeaways with gear and what would you do differently next time.
00:22:01
Speaker
We tried to prioritize going lightweight as much as possible but at the same time we didn't really skimp on things like our air mattresses were were huge for us because we slept like absolute babies and they were so damn comfortable but like they do weigh a little bit.
00:22:18
Speaker
food as well. I mean, I think we mentioned before, bag drops for us were massive. We also had a film crew who helped us immensely across the the traverse. So we were lucky enough to leave dry clothes, medical supplies, etc, etc, with them, which I think without them, it would have been a whole different ballgame. We probably would have had to carry quite a bit more. In terms of food, I think we did pretty well, Matt, like we were we were carrying probably just under a kilo of food, probably, but yeah, between 500 grams, 800 grams a day of ah food, which in some certain sections, like there was an area where we had to go, our packs would have weighed like 12 kilos because we had four days of food and water and and everything. For the most part, like we probably carrying seven to nine kilos on average. What did you do for water? We were lucky that it would, it's been, it was a wet summer and we went early. I know that AAWT in some areas can be incredibly difficult come like December, January, February, particularly up on those kinds of Victorian mountains or in wilderness, the Viking razor wilderness kind of before Hotham.
00:23:32
Speaker
And the reality is either you drive in with four wheel drives and drop yourself water containers, or you take a huge amount of carrying capacity. we We were lucky that because we were covering ground quickly, we were kind of instead of, you know, for hikers that go two or three days between water sources, we that we'd get to it a guaranteed water source by the end of the day but even then a few days we went almost dry by the end of the night and we were lucky it was wet so yeah logistically in ah in a dry really dry summer that would be super super hard. I feel like it's such a roadblock. I was here down in Tassie over summer and it was great. Cause you never had to carry water cause there's so much water around. Whereas I've done hikes, the wilderness coast walk around Malacoota and I had to carry that 12 liters of water and it's just not fun. So you spent months like researching it and I'm sure there's an array of threads and blogs and all this stuff kind of work out where you could find water. And I guess is there lots of resources around for people that have done the AAWT as to where to do food drops and that kind of stuff? Yeah, there's an incredible community and also John Chapman, who is a fellow Victorian, and it was like gospel to us. yeah We got our own copies and we went through and underlined and highlighted everything.
00:24:55
Speaker
and because he'd recently re-hyped it with his wife over a year or so. um fires So he kind of had the latest intel and and we got a pre-release copy in our him and went, you said it'd be released kind of June 2021. Is it on the way? Because we're about to go and he and he said, oh, it's almost ready. We can send you a, might have a few typos in it and we said yes, please.
00:25:20
Speaker
So that was actually an incredible, incredible, incredible resource because he'd have all the topographic maps and he went at this spot, go down, you'll have to go through this Blackberry bush into this valley. like But if it's super dry, there's always water there. It's 800 meters southeast off this corner. You won't get another for 25k. So if it's dry, make sure you go here. That that kind of intel.
00:25:47
Speaker
I'm interested to know as well, let you both I presume have jobs of some variety and you're trying to make a living but yet spend as much time as we can disconnected from said world.
00:25:58
Speaker
What are you actually now and what's next? Yeah, so I've been overseas for the better part of six weeks now. It's a somewhat holiday, somewhat work holiday. So I run a small little video production agency, which basically lets me work kind of from from home. So I'm very lucky in that regard to the plan is to be overseas for kind of the next two or three months, possibly more, depending on how things go. um It's pretty flexible. It's exciting, but also daunting. In terms of running and and the rest of it, I honestly don't have massive plans. I'm ah going with
00:26:34
Speaker
with where I am like i don I don't know where I'm going to be next month or the month after that so it really depends I do like to kind of design where I am based on kind of the trails and nature around me but yeah like I said I've got this 100k race coming up which I'm really excited for it's my first race or proper race in Well, like a good year and a half. and Have you done a hundred K before? I have. Yeah. Yeah. I ran 120 K's on my own in lockdown in Sydney just because I wanted to to do something ah a little tricky. So that was a lot of fun. And then I also ran a hundred K back in 2019 in Mexico, in Chihuahua, up in the north in the canyons. You cut your teeth on mount blocks. I feel like you'd have your mountain legs well and truly dialed in by now. I've got the mountain legs. I don't know if I've got the running legs. That's the issue. Well, it's all about the hiking, isn't it? You're still a pole fan. Both had them on the AAWT. Yeah, definitely. I didn't actually bring my poles overseas. I'm planning on buying a pair of police next week. Yeah, my issue is I also do have kind of a competitive streak. Like I don't just like to walk ultras.
00:27:42
Speaker
I like to kind of push myself and and get in the pain cave every now and again. Yeah, it's it's going to be interesting. It's going to be a very few, an exciting next few months, that's for sure. How about you, Matt? Oh, I'm going to sound very boring in comparison. So at the end of last year after AAWT, I spent a bit of time recovering. Then Hopped off the grid again, went down, did some fast-packing around the same kind of Victorian Alps area. I just love it. Fast-packed the Grampians Peak Trail in ah in a few days. i think I think I might have been the first person to run it, actually. I'm not sure. It's unofficial. I was out there on the weekend and I did look up the FKJ because I knew that you did it quite early on. and um
00:28:25
Speaker
And I was like, oh, I wonder if Matt's got that. But um at the same time, you don't strike with someone who's as soon as they finish clocking it on Strive or submit to FKTC. If I'd run it particularly quickly, I ah might have popped my name in the ring, but um I didn't bother because I knew how to get beaten in about two seconds.
00:28:45
Speaker
And I was just enjoying it. And and now im I'm a commercial lawyer. So I'm working in the office, in the city, ah back in Sydney. the The longer I work here, the more I really want to just get off the grid at times. And I'm already planning my Christmas break when my family's traveling. I think I'm just going to just turn off all devices, pack enough food in my um hiking pack and just go hike. walking up into the Victorian house again and not talk to anyone for about two weeks. Sorry, sorry my girlfriend and family. and And in terms of the future... career-wise, I want to work in the renewable energy. This this transformation of the economy, I think that's a really cool space to be in and really important space to be in. And then running, I'm not too sure yet. I think I'm just taking it one. I do i do race a lot more than Giles. Just trying to figure out what exactly I want and whether I
00:29:41
Speaker
to want to keep pushing really long distances. um I'm kind of specialising in 100Ks at the moment. I've got GSCR coming up as 100 miler. Awesome. That's exciting. Which will be really fun. That'll be my second 100 miler. And the first one I did when I was very young, 22, I think, and that kind of beat me up a lot. so But since then, I've run a lot of 100Ks and I'm getting increasingly fast and precise with them. So I thought it'd be nice to push out in my comfort zone and then maybe run Lara Pinter next year who's with pilot the West Mack Monsters. I think get overseas. I think again in a lot of Australia, I've been very lucky to see a lot of Australia, but there's a bit of a bug inside me to go to go run in these incredible mountains. The Dolomites is certainly cool. yeah
00:30:31
Speaker
Especially now that people we know are over there and rubbing it in I feel like during COVID it was just out of your reach whereas now it's very much a possibility again and I think that trail bum life is calling all of us to some degree. That's right. I've got to figure out as a young as a young professional how I can reconcile that with ah with a full-time career. It's been at the end of the day you know it's what's important to me and then be part of who I am and it's be part of you know my mental and physical health and everything stems from that. And that's the most important thing. So in my mind, if I'm sacrificing that for a job, then the job isn't worth it. So this track or or a balance will be forced in a different way. When you were living in in Madrid, you learnt how to live off a pittance, and that probably sounds like a dream now. Playing in the mountains all weekend, living off a sandwich. It's a funny juxtaposition, isn't it? You think, oh, work and get the job and all this, and it'll just take me back to those days when I was poor and exploring the mountains every weekend. After I was kicking myself that I didn' didn't make the most of it when I was out, and where I feel like I could have extracted a tiny bit more, surely, somewhere.
00:31:38
Speaker
But as well, you you didn't spoil the the love of it. That's the good thing about trail running is that when you do get into it slowly, it's a slow burn and you grow to love it. It's never a chore, you know, it's always a privilege. That's what we talk about a lot with the Wild Places team is it's all about exploring wild places. But at the end of the day, it's also integral to our happiness and our mental health and getting away from the computer and people. and Yeah, totally. And that's when I when i knew that then my gap year was over. It was actually when I was doing the Grampians Peach Trail. I kind of still had it a month or maybe a tiny bit less before, but I'd kind of, and I was having it in Tasmania too. I was riding all these beautiful trails. I got it on Frenchman's cap when everyone's there was, they'd flown in from all over the country.
00:32:27
Speaker
and they were hiking with their family and I ran it up and back overnight and I was there and I just remember going oh you know but I think I ran I think the one I did last week was a Jerusalem I think that was a bit better I was going you know it's almost like I've been a bit saturated with too many good things and I need a bit of time away to make sure, because I don't want to like look back as I am now, going, wow, Frenchman's Cat was such like an incredible part of the world. But I didn't really make the most of it there, because i was just I just had so much of it. right Absence makes the heart grow fonder, and everything and everything in balance. It's also great to have a job that sustains you, and it sounds like what you're interested in in the renewable energy sector is incredibly you know interesting and impactful as well.
00:33:15
Speaker
looping back to your work trials with film and storytelling, you did have a film crew with you on the AAWT and that's I guess the next part of the project is to bring it back to life in a in a feature film so that way others can share the highs and the lows of it. So where's that project at the moment and what's the latest with the film? It's been a very long arduous process to say the least, but it's it's progressing. um I think the third edit at the moment,
00:33:44
Speaker
So it it should it's going to be out in the next few months, which is really exciting because we did have a few bits and bobs, obstacles that kind of where we had to to plan around. But it's yeah it's going to be a ah very good one. Madamaya, very excited.
00:34:04
Speaker
It's been a massive team effort to say the least from from the whole crew or all six of us. But yes, stay tuned because it's going to be out very, very soon, hopefully. And and so to add a bit more detail to that, that will be a Salomon TV video. So that that will be a a little bit shorter. And then hopefully a few months after that, we'll be able to get a longer cutout. So we're actually hoping to get to first one is yet almost done.
00:34:30
Speaker
Almost done. And we hope to get that out within a month or two. And hopefully that will go to to a global order. And, you know, 99 percent of those viewers will never have heard of Takaina or the AAWT. And that will be really special and and an incredible platform for the Bob Brown Foundation, we hope.
00:34:48
Speaker
to kind of and anyone that's interested from there hopefully will go to our website and and then go to Bob Brown Foundation um and then and then beyond that we hope to have something similar to what you would have seen at Run Nation a bit more we hope explores a bit more about ah our relationship with nature rather than just um an exciting action packed. Yeah totally and I guess you've got the fundraising platform still operating. Yeah your goal is to kind of use the film as kind of drawing in people to donate to that with the the funds going to the Bob Brown Foundation and the the awesome um on the groundwork that they're doing there. I think I saw you're yeah you're at 7k and your goal is 20 so I think that with the Salomon TV and the global audience plus
00:35:33
Speaker
a more long form that kind of goes into the story that will be really inspiring and excited to see more. It's amazing. It's kind of i guess but you know one of the more well-known ones, but by the sound of it, it's in pretty dire straits. Did that surprise you or were you kind of, because you'd done your you your research, you were expecting it to be in varying states of repair and disrepair? We expected it, but the degree of it was just completely unprecedented. like The burn through sections for me were absolutely mind boggling. And yeah, it reflected how damn slow we were going as well, which has, I don't know, some sort of teaching you can draw for it from it, I guess. It was stark, like these he burnt out, just all you could see was charcoal on charcoal. That for me was was quite confronting. And to know that obviously we have
00:36:23
Speaker
essentially created that and also need to stop it at the same time was it was powerful to say the least. Yeah because and I guess it would have been 12 months or roughly since the the Black Samifiers went through. Yeah and it made it incredibly challenging to navigate I think when John Chapman went through and wrote the book it was kind of the vegetation was ankle high any kind of in a few years this might be difficult to navigate well try twelve months on and it's kind of it's just shoulder high scraps for kilometers and kilometers and kilometers with no discernible markers because the trail sorry the trees with the track markers have burnt in the fire and and we're we're sitting there with our with our GPS literally about 10 centimetres from our noses trying to walk down a minus 15% gradient hill in the scrub and yeah, it's things like that.
00:37:20
Speaker
You can't, you can't know until you're in it. And and and not even on the kind of the AAWT forum afterwards, we were telling people about it going, it's tough and that people weren't really understanding and going, I'll be fine, like I'm pretty good with it. And we were like, okay, just be prepared.
00:37:39
Speaker
And then they they come out of it afterwards in ah and have gone, that was the hardest thing of my life. I can't believe people call that a trap. That's when get but not that bad. It was quite fun. We told you. it' help you i know It's hard to know what people's level of expectation is, I guess. And no not knowing you two, they're probably like, oh, these guys, they don't know what they're doing. When really you ah you gave them a good heads up.
00:38:09
Speaker
Oh, thank you to Matt and Giles for joining us. You guys are such an inspiration. It's amazing to to follow your travels. I did want to ask you about how you like obviously runners and then making that connection between running and running for a cause, but you kind of answered that. and i thought it was really interesting that it started as a run just for yourself but that led to becoming a cause but have you guys been involved in any other like campaigns or or causes or were you coming at it from from that angle or or was it the first time you'd done something like this because it's just really helpful to know how people come to that decision because obviously for a while places is trying to
00:38:45
Speaker
reach out to runners and would love more people to make that connection and try and link running with with activism, essentially. So is this the first time you've done something like this before or um or not? yeah Yeah, for me, it was it was definitely a first. I don't know about you, Matt. Yeah, it was it was a a total first for yeah you know doing something independently of everyone else. And I think, actually,
00:39:07
Speaker
Hilary, you asked before what would you change in terms of gear or food and realistically all of that is negligible. I think we we did our logistics planning, we nailed it. What I think I would change if I had my time again is the whole structure of campaigning and fundraising and I've had the benefit of you know, since our project, seeing some really great initiatives, such as, you know, Tom Petroni's Run Forever Project, which, and he's someone that's kind of in this space already, and he gets it. And he he just nailed it with the sponsors and the promotions, and the and the kind of live films, or as
00:39:50
Speaker
Giles and I, we were just making it up as we were going along. We were we were figuring it out, and you know, we learned from our mistakes. um Not that there are any heinous mistakes or anything, but yeah, but you just don't know what you don't know. Yeah. And and I think I think that's the beauty of an organization for for wild places. And I remember I can't remember if it was you, Heli, or someone that we talked to very early on with For Wild Places, but it was literally like two weeks before we were running and we'd never heard of For Wild Places before. And and the the comment was like, man, I wish we'd somehow connected like three months ago because this is exactly what we do. And Jars and I kind of just got to the stage. I think we were doing our drop boxes and we were like, yeah, we wish we'd done that too because we finally figured it out. But it's taken us a long time.
00:40:39
Speaker
Even now, like it post-finished, kind of once we have this film up making the most of that film, I think it's an important thing because we still don't really know what we're doing. That's when those kinds of relationships are important because someone has the platform, someone has someone else has the experience.
00:40:59
Speaker
yeah The meeting of the minds that make it like a big jigsaw, isn't it? And trying to put all the pieces together. And I think the reality is that everyone's still working it out. Like no one's got the full puzzle completed. We're all just still kind of jam pages, pieces in together and see what fits and having worked with Tom on project run forever. Like that was.
00:41:18
Speaker
We were flying by the seat of our pants there as well. like It's trying to find that that nice mix of admitting that you don't know what you're doing, but also putting a certain level of organisation forward so people think, oh, this is a thing. This looks great. I'll get on board. But also understanding that we are all just people trying to do the best we can and navigating that middle ground. but
00:41:46
Speaker
One of those things with being with The Wild Place is you always get people like, oh, have you heard of this? And like three different people send you the same a link. And I think it was that what happened with you guys in that there were a few different points of contact and people like, oh, these guys are running the AAWT. And it's amazing to see Tom's done Project Brown forever since and now we've got Tip to and Corinne is running the length of the Yarra and everyone's making some kind of film or documenting the experience and I just think this time next year there's going to be half a dozen films that tell stories of awesome trail running expeditions that are so much more than that.
00:42:23
Speaker
in that there are people connecting to the landscape, sharing the stories, and not only having your message, but a range of other people doing the same thing will be a really powerful group project that can say, hey, here's the power of trail running, but also why we should all become sports activists. Yeah, absolutely. I think ah since having done this, as you said, I think there have been a bunch of running activism really awesome campaigns and projects pop up. And I don't think it's that I wasn't aware of them before. I think it's just that with this momentum shift, I think it's really exciting and I hope soon everyone will be planning this big and crazy adventure to raise funds for something that is important to them. And yeah, it's awesome. you You can't be what you can't say. Even myself, I'm like, oh what am I going to, what's my contribution going to make? what What adventure am I going to go on? And we're all trying to
00:43:13
Speaker
come up with something that's that's new and exciting and it tells a different story about a different wild place or animal or whatever it might be that's under threat. Because I think that especially you Giles, you've experienced all around the world, but yet the AAWT is a very unique experience that in many ways doesn't compare elsewhere. Like it's so unique and the places we have in Australia are incredibly unique, but also incredibly vulnerable as you witnessed.
00:43:40
Speaker
and Absolutely. Well, that brings us to an hour. Thank you both for your time and for contributing to the newsletter back in January. We're really excited to see your short film when it comes out on Salomon TV and then the longer form as well. And we're excited to follow your travels in whatever's next and good luck for your race in a couple of weeks trials. How do you feel about the heat? I guess that's one thing you didn't have to contend with on the AAWT.
00:44:05
Speaker
look The heat's been pretty manageable in all honesty. I think I just missed the heat wave, what was it, like a month or so ago, which is lucky that I'm really
Appreciation for Guests and Contributions
00:44:15
Speaker
looking forward to to racing. We look forward to having you back in Australia when you are and hope that our paths will cross on the trails at some time in the near future, but I'll um be working on trying to keep up with you both in the meantime. Thanks so much, Hillary. I really appreciate you taking the time and from the table for wild places, keep up the awesome work. And thanks so much for joining us this evening and we'll let you get to your day, Giles, into your evening, Matt. So thank you everyone for coming. Have a good night.
00:44:49
Speaker
Now we'll jump forward to August this year when I checked in with Giles to see what's been keeping him and Matt busy in the intervening years and their experience in navigating the challenges of sponsors, filmmaking and funding.
00:45:02
Speaker
Thanks for joining us Giles. Where abouts are you dialing in from today? I'm based in Montenegro at the moment. so I've been here for two weeks. I've got another three in a bit. I'm at a funny little concept actually. it's like It's like a training camp essentially of like online coaches, entrepreneurs that like come together in this one space.
00:45:20
Speaker
in the mountains very beautiful not that many trails around unfortunately though like a lot of bush bashing the times I've gone out and like tried to explore um but it's beautiful and and bloody hot like it's 35 36 degrees we don't have aircon we've got one fan between like 25 people That's a fun one. That's awesome. And you've been traveling for a little while now. Where have you been prior to Montenegro? Yeah, I was in Greece for two and a bit months. I have very close family friends over there that have a house on a beautiful Greek island called Pardos. So every year or so I like to go over and soak in the sunshine.
00:45:58
Speaker
the water over there is just ridiculous. Like it's the the cleanest, clearest water around. And yeah, I was over there just kind of building out my, my online business at the moment. I've shifted from like video work to more like online coaching, but I'm still, yeah. And the initial phases, I guess, but it's, yeah, it's awesome. It's exciting. Yeah. We last spoke to you in 2022 in September when you and Matt had finished your six by five for Takaina.
00:46:27
Speaker
when you're raising money for the Bob Brown Foundation. And back then, you were described as amateur trail runners. So it's interesting now that I guess since that time, your life has probably taken a huge shift in direction and priorities and the things that you love to do. So looking back to that, your first experience, the 650Ks through the Australian Alpine and walking track. What do you think when you look back on it now with a couple of years' experience under your belt, what do you think of what you and Matt set out to achieve? Oh, I think we were both very naive, brave little little kids. That's the best way I'd put it. like Yeah, we had this big dream and and we we did it. um
00:47:07
Speaker
we yeah we We ran, I think it was close to 700 kilometres in the end in 16-bit days. Very, very special to to share that with one of my best friends. We had a film crew join us for that period and the idea was to put together like a proper feature film.
00:47:29
Speaker
Yeah, connected to to preserving, saving wild places. But over the past two and a bit years, we very quit. Well, yeah, it was kind of a a very difficult period in terms of like finding funds to get that film over the line. But yeah, lots of learnings there. But to answer your question, I'd say big thumb that thumbs up to Jails and Matt from three years ago. Good on you guys. for but giving it a whirl. I have no idea what i what I got myself into really, but it was yeah it was an incredible experience. like it's it's It is literally a once in a lifetime thing to like walk out three weeks of your life and go, I'm going to go run up and down these mountains with one of my best mates for for two and a bit weeks. Yeah, at least you learnt your bush bashing skills on the AAWT that you can put to good use now. But it sounds like from others who have done it since you guys, it's still in a very much a state of disrepair and requiring a lot of work to get it up to scratch to allow more people the opportunity to go and explore it.
00:48:31
Speaker
Yeah. You mentioned that yeah the film has been a learning experience because that's how we've been kind of keeping in touch, trying to support it. However, for wild places can with what limited resources we have and what has been your key takeaways personally. And now that you're, you're in the video space and now you're getting into the coaching and stuff, but what lessons have you taken out of that experience, trying to navigate funds and sponsorship and those sorts of things to, to get a project made and into the world. Yeah, I think there's two main things. it's a Great question, by the way. First thing is like the the planning, like it needs to be planned before you actually go and do the thing. At the time, we we didn't really have a plan. It was like we kind of felt like we struck gold in terms of having three friends come down with professional video equipment to get us on camera and get those 70 hours, but we didn't really understand like the implications of that and like what post-production was kind of like, we'll wing it, like we'll be fine, you know, we'll do it. people believe in the project and thus will will end up helping out. and Unfortunately, that wasn't the case. So yeah, I think the planning, like really building out a network, having important conversations with with people in the video space, in the videography space before, and maybe even during that run would have been invaluable instead of kind of just leaving it for months and months depend on certain people that, you know, had other priorities.
00:50:02
Speaker
And then, yeah, I'd say the other one, we left it a little late in terms of like, having really important conversations and building out our network and like, just, yeah, being put in contact with people like documentary Australia, for example, we only found out about them two years after the the the project or after we'd done the run. Whereas I feel like if we'd known that, you know, on the run or before the run, it would have been a completely different story.
00:50:27
Speaker
Yeah, and also, I don't know, I guess reaching out to people and I'm asking for help. I feel like Matt and I, because we'd already asked for funds to raise for Bob Brown, we felt like it would have been like, we didn't want that second round. of Hey, everyone, like, we need money to get this project on the line. Can you guys help us out? So, yeah, mix of learnings, I guess you could say that those are the the main takeaways. Yeah, I think it's really valuable to hear that because a lot of us think we've got a good story in us and whether that's expressed through video or writing, but these things don't just happen. They take a lot of planning, a lot of conversations, a lot of asking for help and getting knocked back. And you just hope that there's a few people out there who will say yes.
00:51:12
Speaker
And then to top it all off, there's timing and it's really hard. And we know this with for wild places, every company has a schedule at which they allocate funds and do and don't have money. And if you ask at the wrong time, it might be no, but if you ask at the right time, it might be yes. So there's a real degree of planning and luck and timing in there.
00:51:30
Speaker
So what has happened with that 70 hours of footage? That would have taken a lot of extra effort out on trail to capture and all the work of your friends. Will it live on in some some form for people to relive your experience? um I mean, Matt and I have said... But it still hasn't happened, unfortunately, which is kind of because it isn't like a huge priority. Like life gets in the way, like so many other things. We've said we want to get out like clips, like we want to summarize day one, put that out as like a two, three minute thing on YouTube, Instagram, just for our own like family and friends, followers, whatever, to view and slowly like tick off the days. But again, it's yet to happen.
00:52:10
Speaker
you So it it should happen sooner or later. It will happen because we refuse for 70 hours of ah golden footage to just die like that and never be put out there and into into the world. It'll happen at some stage. It's just more of a, yeah, I guess the question is when. Because it was three years ago to put into context, a bit under three years ago that we ran it. Definitely. And there's other adventures and races and travels and life to be lived in the meantime. and Yeah, it's really fun to often film the videos and watch them, but the editing is a big chunk of time spent sitting behind a computer, which is... Yeah.
00:52:48
Speaker
not what we always feel like doing. Yeah, it's like this this podcast has been a very long time coming because they're editing and all the bits and pieces require so much time and there's there's better things to be doing. Since that, what have been your personal highlights when it comes to trail and ultra running in the past couple of years? Yeah, so since then, I've run a bunch. I did. 110k in through the Pyrenees at Salomon Ultra Pity. Now it was what what it was called. So it happened here kind of like three hours north of Barcelona. That had 7,000 meters of dirt and i was on I was running on two hours of sleep because I missed my flight like the day before. So it was just an absolute train wreck of the race.
00:53:32
Speaker
probably the hardest hardest rest that i've ever done And yeah, I've been doing my own little projects as well, which I've absolutely loved. So in terms of like, not actually signing up for a race, I ran 80 kilometers around bottles, kind of like on a whim, like I didn't train, you know, specifically for it or anything. I was just like, I want to go out and have have fun and explore this beautiful island and and did that by myself for 10 and a bit hours and had the absolute, like I felt like a little kid, like just playing the hot the entire day. Like it was beautiful. What else? I ran, I went after the FKT of the Bondites to Manly Brew. So that also has some really beautiful, beautiful parts of trail. um So it's 80 kilometers one way. It ended up being 152 kilometers for me. I had a bunch of family and friends join me and
00:54:22
Speaker
and run with me, which I was very lucky to have. And yeah, ended up getting the FKT for it by like three hours, which was a huge surprise. That's massive. Congratulations. Thanks. We also put like a little feature film together for that with a friend of mine. So that was 20 minutes long. It's on my YouTube channel. If anyone wants to go out and watch it, it was, yeah, an experience and a half. And other than that, just like little fifties, forties, sixties here and there, but nothing too big. I did COSY 100 last year, which was, which was gorgeous. I had a lot of memories of the AWT when Matt and I were plodding away. But I'm preparing for a 200 kilometer run in Costa Rica next year. So I want to, I want to.
00:55:08
Speaker
start on the west coast to run um the mostly unexplored route to the east coast, which will be like just over 200 kilometres. I'm not quite sure the exact number. Why Costa Rica? That's quite an out-of-the-way country to be running across. um i lived I lived there for a year back in 2019 and while I was there I went and did this 80 kilometre hike which is in the south of the country. There's about people that actually know this route in this national park that is
00:55:40
Speaker
like the most unexplored virgin rainforest you can imagine. Wow. So I hiked this 80 kilometer route in Costa Rica, which was like absolutely incredible. And I've been speaking to one of the indigenous guys that knows the route. Amadeo is his name, he's similar age to me. And he's keen to run that section with me and has given me permission as well to to go through there with him.
00:56:04
Speaker
So just like a dream I've had since I lived there, basically, and I haven't been back to Costa Rica since 2019, because the pandemic and and all the rest of it. But April next year, it's it's going to be happening. And it will be like my longest run as well. I'll be pretty cooked, I think, by the time I actually start that rainforest section. So it's going to be a fun little experience. yeah Sounds amazing. Do you plan on documenting it? What's your kind of approach to these big things that you do for a personal reason and because you really want to see it, but will you share it with others? how What's your approach? I'll probably be doing, I'll likely be doing vlogs and just updates on on Instagram, putting some content up as much yeah here or there.
00:56:49
Speaker
but I don't have like a like a feature film goal or anything like that with it as you can imagine. Yeah, that that adds a whole level of complexity to things. It's a tricky one because especially when you're trying to film things properly with that in mind, there's so much stop start and you feel like you've kind of fake running half the time and turns what would already be a massive undertaking to do 200K continuously into a a week-long saga potentially. so exactly You chose to do chi kinda to raise funds and awareness for the Bob Brown Foundation and it did have a fundraising aspect. There's still that sense of wanting to explore and share wild places, but how do you incorporate that into your planning and maybe your storytelling as well? to so
00:57:36
Speaker
ah Yeah, it was Costa Rica. Yeah, because it sounds like an amazing part of the world that not many people have have seen before. And how do you, sharing the the uniqueness of this wild place, but that's one of the reasons why you want to do it and share it. Yeah, yeah absolutely. I plan on raising funds for the local indigenous community. like there's still It's still a relatively like undeveloped area.
00:58:00
Speaker
which is beautiful because it means they've kept a lot of the traditional aspects like they've kind of been um almost separated in a certain way and they're they're very healthy happy people in my experience. They haven't been influenced as much by you know, negative effects perhaps of like Western society as polarizing as that whole debate might might be. So yeah, I want to be raising money and I i think just overall, I continue the ah general bird's eye theme of the importance of of beautiful places, preserving them, like showing the most incredible virgin rainforest that I get to pass through with an indigenous person.
00:58:44
Speaker
the power of that. I definitely want to tie that in into to the stories and and the content that I'll be sharing throughout for sure. I'm here to develop like a proper plan because it it is in April so I still have some time but I won't be making the same mistake this last time with ah but with the Totally. And as Yvon Chouinard says, it's not an adventure until something goes wrong. So I'm sure that there'll be a ah plan in place and then things might go awry. And that that's such an integral part of the story as well. So that sounds exciting. Before I let you go, I need to ask how your friend Matt Gore is. Do you guys keep in touch on while you're off traveling? I caught up with him a couple of weeks ago. He's been running hard, running lots. Yeah.
00:59:30
Speaker
so good maths we still so exchange messages and he's he's just turned into a ridiculously fast runner these days. like um um that He calls me the chunky monkey because I enjoy weightlifting and I'm more of like a generalist athlete as he likes to put it whereas he's just like running is everything. like I want to get as fast as humanly possible. So we always we always have some funny little discussions about like performance versus injury rates and like all these things, but he's a great bloke. I think his plan, I'm not sure if you share this with you, but his plan is like, he wants to get really fast.
01:00:08
Speaker
on the road to then be able to transfer that speed over to the trail. Interesting. why that Yeah, I did feel like he was kind of neglecting his trail routes and he's been doing lots of road races recently, running extremely fast, but yeah I was like, oh, I hope we haven't lost him to the road running world. So it's nice to hear that it's just, he's got a long-term plan to come back to trails and absolutely dominate. coming back. He'll be back. I feel like it'd be very hard to go from trail running to road and not want to come back to the wild places that trail running gets to take you. Cause I feel like running around a track through cities and stuff gets well, personally, I find gets pretty old pretty quickly. Yeah. Yeah. And I understand. Nice one. Well, I'll let you get back to your beautiful hot weather and no air conditioning. or One fan between 20 blokes. But yeah, appreciate you taking the time and look forward to seeing those recaps when they come. Yeah. Hopefully there's a bit of time to make that happen. And all the best planning for your trip in Costa Rica in April and everything that's going to come before that. mark i Really appreciate it. thanks so Keep up the good work, Giles. And we'll, yeah, we'll chat to you soon.
01:01:19
Speaker
And we've come to the finish line of our
Conclusion and Gratitude
01:01:21
Speaker
third trail chat. Thank you for joining us for this insightful, inspiring and entertaining conversation with Matt and Giles. If you'd like to hear more from Matt and Giles, you can follow them on Instagram at Matt B Gore and Giles Penfold respectively. If you'd like to relive some of the moments from 665 for Takana, you can catch clips at 655 for the wild. If you'd like to learn more about what we do here at For Wild Places, you can stay in touch by subscribing to this podcast or our weekly newsletter. If you consider yourself a Wild Places Protector, then maybe you'd like to become a member. For a monthly or annual fee, you can support the ongoing worker for wild places and help bring new initiatives to life. For more information and to subscribe or become a member, head to forwildplaces.com or find us on socials at For Wild Places.
01:02:04
Speaker
Thanks again for joining us. We are stoked to have you here. And thank you to Matt and Giles for your time and to Lara Hamilton for our theme music. Until next time, happy trails. And as always, thank you for taking the time for Wild Places.