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Ep 124: Fair Warning, Scott's Ticked
65 Plays2 years ago
Rumors, TWIPYs, and the state of the pinball industy are just a couple of things we discuss this episode.
Recommended
Transcript
00:00:07
Speaker
Maybe.
00:00:07
Speaker
Maybe.
Upcoming Pinball Releases & Community Rumors
00:00:34
Speaker
Because I think another pinball release or two or maybe even three might be on the horizon the next couple months.
00:00:41
Speaker
I mean, we've got spooky sending stuff out to content creators.
00:00:45
Speaker
We have rumors floating about.
00:00:47
Speaker
We'll talk about later.
00:00:49
Speaker
If you want to get on these rumored lists, hit up Zach and Nicole Minney at Flippin' Out Pinball.
00:00:53
Speaker
They are amazing.
00:00:54
Speaker
Their customer service is great.
00:00:56
Speaker
They are a company that goes the extra mile for you.
00:00:59
Speaker
Like, I just...
00:01:00
Speaker
Zach does it all for me and I really appreciate what he does.
Personal Story: Recommending Pinball
00:01:04
Speaker
Okay.
00:01:04
Speaker
I actually have a personal plug.
00:01:06
Speaker
I actually had a, uh, someone who went to residency with me who reached out and asked me if I knew anything about Jurassic park.
00:01:15
Speaker
So I had a discussion with him and I was like, yeah, it's, it's a great game.
00:01:18
Speaker
And if you're looking for, if you're looking for a game, it is one of those games that the pro and the premium would really work.
00:01:25
Speaker
So he said, Hey, where do you get it?
00:01:28
Speaker
And legitimately, I just sent them a group message with Zach and Nicole and my friend.
00:01:35
Speaker
And of course he took the deep dive and went into pinball and now they got him a Godzilla premium that he's getting his first machine.
00:01:45
Speaker
And so they really were very, very accommodating to work with.
00:01:49
Speaker
Uh, they didn't immediately have a game, but they said they'd put them on the, uh, the, like the list of first refusal and they were able to get that for them.
00:01:57
Speaker
So it was really nice to see that personal touch.
00:02:00
Speaker
That's awesome, man.
00:02:01
Speaker
I mean, I'm excited.
00:02:02
Speaker
That's another person in the hobby.
00:02:03
Speaker
Yep.
00:02:04
Speaker
Into the industry.
Updates from Flippin' Out Pinball
00:02:06
Speaker
So, so, so if you want to buy hip Zach and Nicole, many at flipping out pinball, all their stuff is usually updated through their Facebook page to go there and see what's on the list.
00:02:15
Speaker
They're always updating.
00:02:17
Speaker
So.
00:02:18
Speaker
Let's
Warning: Drama & Controversial Topics
00:02:19
Speaker
dive into it.
00:02:19
Speaker
So I'm going to give a fair warning before we get into this.
00:02:23
Speaker
I know the first couple points aren't really on our notes.
00:02:27
Speaker
Hopefully they're not controversial because the last couple episodes we've done, right?
00:02:30
Speaker
Sure.
00:02:31
Speaker
But we are going to give some thoughts on some of the current stuff coming up.
00:02:35
Speaker
If you're not much of a drama person, we're going to give our takes without trying to be
Rant: Toxicity in the Pinball Community
00:02:41
Speaker
dramatic.
00:02:41
Speaker
I don't know.
00:02:42
Speaker
I don't know.
00:02:43
Speaker
I don't think I can hold to that today, Josh.
00:02:45
Speaker
Yeah.
00:02:47
Speaker
Well, fair warning.
00:02:48
Speaker
Fair warning.
00:02:49
Speaker
Scott is ticked.
00:02:50
Speaker
Okay.
00:02:51
Speaker
So like, like deep root level ticked.
00:02:53
Speaker
So what was that?
00:02:55
Speaker
Episode 80 when we had Zach and Dennis on.
00:02:57
Speaker
Yeah.
00:02:58
Speaker
Good cram.
00:02:59
Speaker
Only took another 40 episodes.
00:03:01
Speaker
All right.
00:03:01
Speaker
Before we get into that stuff though, Jack Guarneri interview reactions.
00:03:05
Speaker
A lot of people loved it.
00:03:06
Speaker
A lot of people thought kind of business as usual.
00:03:09
Speaker
Jack was, was he stuck to talking points.
00:03:12
Speaker
I mean, really he stuck to very,
00:03:16
Speaker
market friendly phrases.
00:03:18
Speaker
I, we tried to push him on a few, a few topics that he could say something about if he chose to, he really chose to defer, which is, is fine.
00:03:26
Speaker
It's his prerogative.
00:03:28
Speaker
Yeah.
00:03:28
Speaker
But yeah, it seemed like he was sticking to his typical talking points, which is great.
00:03:33
Speaker
It's typical Jack.
00:03:35
Speaker
Yep.
Twippy Awards Drama
00:03:36
Speaker
And I thought overall it was good.
00:03:37
Speaker
There was some information there.
00:03:39
Speaker
A lot of people have gleamed some stuff from it.
00:03:41
Speaker
I appreciate the coverage from nap and this week in pinball.
00:03:44
Speaker
it's really awesome that they pick up, you know, those interviews and run with it.
00:03:49
Speaker
Our next episode, the Twippy episode, I want to preface this because it's probably where some of the stuff's going to start coming in.
00:03:56
Speaker
Will Odding, a lot of people say Odding, it's Odding, like an otter.
00:04:02
Speaker
We had this discussion.
00:04:03
Speaker
I'm sorry.
00:04:04
Speaker
I have to.
00:04:05
Speaker
So Will,
00:04:08
Speaker
asks to come on our show, which is totally fine.
00:04:09
Speaker
It doesn't bother me one bit that he comes on the show and we talk about the Twippies because it's that time of year and the awards.
00:04:16
Speaker
It was a nice way to introduce it, by the way, just saying, hey, it's the season.
00:04:20
Speaker
These are some things and we really do try not to take sides.
00:04:25
Speaker
Yeah, exactly.
00:04:26
Speaker
And so Will reached out with Lucas and Emoto, and we wanted to get this all together.
00:04:32
Speaker
It was a great opportunity to talk about some of the changes going on in Twippy.
00:04:35
Speaker
And really, I felt like overall it was a great episode, right?
00:04:38
Speaker
Like, Lucas is a great dude, and Emoto, she works so hard behind the...
00:04:45
Speaker
the curtain, so to speak.
00:04:47
Speaker
And she puts a lot in a blood, sweat and tears into this.
00:04:50
Speaker
The interesting part though, is the reaction we got to the episode.
00:04:53
Speaker
First of all, we're not really associated with this weekend pinball.
00:04:56
Speaker
Like I know that we've had, yeah, we're not on the committee.
00:05:00
Speaker
Yeah.
00:05:00
Speaker
We're not on the committee.
00:05:01
Speaker
We don't own any stock in the, in the website.
00:05:04
Speaker
Like I don't know, like I, I don't know why we received emails upset that like we didn't ask why the,
00:05:13
Speaker
like there was a positivity change and why, why we didn't give certain coverage to certain people.
00:05:18
Speaker
Like they felt like they were neglected.
00:05:20
Speaker
And, and I just, I'm sorry.
00:05:22
Speaker
Like we were here to interview Will and what they are doing, what they think is best for the Twippy awards.
00:05:30
Speaker
And in the last two weeks, it's funny.
00:05:33
Speaker
I feel like we haven't had,
00:05:34
Speaker
any drama for 2023, right?
00:05:36
Speaker
Like it's been so far.
00:05:37
Speaker
It's been pretty nice.
00:05:38
Speaker
Like it's pretty smooth sailing, but it happens every year, right?
00:05:43
Speaker
Like every year, Twippies get announced.
00:05:45
Speaker
We had Will on last year because he has to come on, which is totally fine.
00:05:48
Speaker
But it seems like there's always drama, always.
00:05:53
Speaker
And I'm frustrated.
00:05:57
Speaker
Like, I don't know why you're barking at my door to tell you guys what should or shouldn't be done or who I should represent.
00:06:04
Speaker
I just, sorry.
00:06:05
Speaker
Like, that's
Debate: Focus of Twippy Awards
00:06:06
Speaker
what we're here for is a platform to give a voice to the people that we enjoy listening to, I guess.
00:06:13
Speaker
But like, if you like the Twippy's cool, whatever, if not, you don't have to tune into it.
00:06:17
Speaker
That's, that's my personal opinion, but there's been a lot of drama and I just kind of want to address it.
00:06:22
Speaker
I don't know if I want to address it first or Scott wants to address it first.
00:06:25
Speaker
Okay.
00:06:25
Speaker
My turn.
00:06:26
Speaker
Okay.
00:06:27
Speaker
The whole point of having an award show legitimately should be a celebration of the hobby.
00:06:34
Speaker
Okay.
00:06:34
Speaker
It should be a way of bringing people into the hobby to celebrate the accomplishments by the way of the manufacturers and say, these are the best products that are out there.
00:06:47
Speaker
I don't see car and driver magazine saying, Hey, these are the best autos out there.
00:06:51
Speaker
But by the way, this is the best person who talks about those.
00:06:55
Speaker
Okay.
00:06:56
Speaker
And the bottom line is I'm sick of it.
00:06:58
Speaker
I'm sick of it.
00:06:59
Speaker
And I'm sick of one person in particular.
00:07:01
Speaker
And I'm sorry that I cannot hold back.
00:07:04
Speaker
If you feel like your number one priority in life is to get a sticker on winning a podcast for pinball.
00:07:15
Speaker
We are such a small industry.
00:07:17
Speaker
You know what?
00:07:18
Speaker
Go for it, dude.
00:07:21
Speaker
You cross a line when you start threatening people, you start threatening to send your minions on them and to dox them and to put things out there.
00:07:32
Speaker
You have crossed a serious line, my friend.
00:07:34
Speaker
And I don't care if you walk things back and you try to...
00:07:39
Speaker
You continually do this and I'm tired of you trying to pick fights and then walking away and saying, oh no, we're all cool.
00:07:46
Speaker
Okay.
00:07:47
Speaker
You're a bully and you're a coward because you're doing it online.
00:07:51
Speaker
Okay.
00:07:52
Speaker
And so the bottom line is if that's what you want to celebrate as a, as a twippy voter, then go ahead.
00:08:00
Speaker
I have zero interest in that level of toxicity in the hobby.
00:08:05
Speaker
It's not about content creators.
00:08:08
Speaker
It's not about the best streamer out there.
00:08:11
Speaker
It's like I am actually calling for that to be completely eliminated from the Twippy because every
Rumors of Jaws-themed Pinball
00:08:19
Speaker
year that becomes the focus.
00:08:21
Speaker
It should be the best game of the year.
00:08:25
Speaker
It should be the best designer of the year.
00:08:28
Speaker
It should be the best company of the year.
00:08:30
Speaker
Not some troll who gets off on trying to stir up toxicity in the hobby and to call for people's jobs.
00:08:40
Speaker
And I'm sorry, if you're supporting this, you're part of the problem.
00:08:46
Speaker
If you're seeing someone who is in a fight on the street and you want to go and just look at that as opposed to try to defuse the situation, you're part of the problem.
00:08:56
Speaker
And so I'm calling on people to wake up, try to eliminate the toxicity in the hobby, because that is not what it should be about.
00:09:05
Speaker
If that's what it is about, then my friend do not come over to my house.
00:09:09
Speaker
Do not talk to me and pretend like you're my friend.
00:09:13
Speaker
And then immediately like trash people on the background.
00:09:17
Speaker
There is no need for that.
00:09:20
Speaker
And the bottom line is you need to grow up because this is not junior high.
00:09:25
Speaker
These are people's lives.
00:09:27
Speaker
These are people's hobbies.
00:09:28
Speaker
These are people's fans.
00:09:30
Speaker
And you know what?
00:09:31
Speaker
If that's all you want to do in your life is to pick fights and to cause angry people, an angry rant is what I'm giving right now because of your antics.
00:09:40
Speaker
Yeah.
00:09:41
Speaker
And I'm not even going to specify you personally, you know who you are.
00:09:45
Speaker
And I'm not even going to call out all the numerous antics that you have done to many people personally.
00:09:53
Speaker
Including us.
00:09:54
Speaker
Including us.
00:09:55
Speaker
And so, you know what?
00:09:57
Speaker
Just crawl back under the hole that you came out of.
00:10:03
Speaker
And just stay away because it is not helping people.
00:10:07
Speaker
You're a succubus on people's souls.
00:10:10
Speaker
Okay?
00:10:12
Speaker
Rant.
00:10:13
Speaker
Tell us how you really feel, Scott.
00:10:16
Speaker
Rant done.
00:10:16
Speaker
You know what?
00:10:17
Speaker
Get some therapy.
00:10:18
Speaker
That's what I want you to do.
00:10:19
Speaker
I want you to get some therapy and get over your narcissistic delusions.
00:10:23
Speaker
Okay?
00:10:23
Speaker
I agree.
00:10:25
Speaker
And you know what?
00:10:26
Speaker
It just, it's really sad.
00:10:29
Speaker
I think the thing that upsets me the most about all this is
00:10:32
Speaker
It's not, the drama's every year, so I guess I've become desensitized to it, which is kind of depressing, right?
00:10:39
Speaker
Like, that's really, really sad.
00:10:41
Speaker
But I think the thing that upsets me most is the false narrative, because we had Will on, we had Emoto on.
00:10:47
Speaker
They clarified, no one's getting, like, ejected from the Twippies.
00:10:52
Speaker
No one's, there's no positivity clause.
00:10:54
Speaker
They were very, very, very forthcoming that's saying, like, it's going to be the same old, same old that it has been for years, right?
00:11:01
Speaker
Yeah.
00:11:03
Speaker
And there's been this narrative created over the last two weeks that if you're not involved in the database of This Week in Pinball, which now doesn't exist anymore, has been taken down.
00:11:16
Speaker
All the content creators are not punished because of one person.
00:11:19
Speaker
Hey, well done.
00:11:20
Speaker
You're so toxic that they just decided
Impact of Game Rumors on Industry
00:11:22
Speaker
to shut everything down.
00:11:23
Speaker
Good for you.
00:11:24
Speaker
I hope you get a big old gold star on your butt.
00:11:29
Speaker
But my point being is like...
00:11:31
Speaker
There's this false narrative going around and it doesn't help anyone.
00:11:36
Speaker
No.
00:11:36
Speaker
And, and really it only creates more of a toxic and negative environment.
00:11:40
Speaker
Like it makes no sense because all this was clarified two weeks ago.
00:11:45
Speaker
Like it's all, it's just, it's all false narrative.
00:11:48
Speaker
Yeah.
00:11:48
Speaker
If you want to be, if you want to be mean, then that's the baseline of your personality.
00:11:52
Speaker
Okay.
00:11:54
Speaker
And you're only, you're only serving yourself.
00:11:56
Speaker
Again, get therapy.
00:11:58
Speaker
Yes.
00:11:58
Speaker
Okay.
00:11:59
Speaker
So, like, I agree with Scott.
00:12:02
Speaker
We've talked to Will, actually, about this.
00:12:04
Speaker
We've talked to a handful of people behind the scenes.
00:12:09
Speaker
We're really pushing for media.
00:12:11
Speaker
I think the media should be gone.
00:12:13
Speaker
Because it's negative.
00:12:15
Speaker
It detracts from the whole purpose of it.
00:12:17
Speaker
And it's not just been this year.
00:12:19
Speaker
I mean, I know that we're talking about this every year.
00:12:22
Speaker
We talk about this.
00:12:23
Speaker
Let me give you some behind the scenes.
00:12:26
Speaker
It's not because...
00:12:27
Speaker
you know, we're not, we're all losers, right?
00:12:29
Speaker
Like there's only one winner, right?
00:12:32
Speaker
It's the fact that it creates so much drama, so much negativity and toxicity around the, what has got to be the best year or best part of the year.
00:12:43
Speaker
In my opinion, like this is, this is when I go out and,
00:12:47
Speaker
I give more, I help more.
00:12:49
Speaker
Like I am, I'm already helping and stuff during the year, but like I'm actively, that's like on my mind of like things are slowing down in work and like you're spending more time with family and it should be all positivity and good vibes.
00:13:03
Speaker
Right.
00:13:03
Speaker
And it just, it isn't.
00:13:06
Speaker
And,
00:13:07
Speaker
You and I, we dealt with this from the beginning.
00:13:09
Speaker
Like I remember when from the beginning.
00:13:12
Speaker
Yeah.
00:13:12
Speaker
From like 2020 when we weren't on the nominated list for for this week in pinball podcast of the year or whatever it is.
00:13:22
Speaker
We didn't care.
00:13:23
Speaker
But all of a sudden we got thrown into the conversation because.
00:13:28
Speaker
We won the pinball industry award, not even like 24 days later before they even did the Twippy awards.
00:13:34
Speaker
And so it was fodder to talk about like,
00:13:38
Speaker
how flawed of a system it is and yada, yada, yada.
00:13:41
Speaker
Okay.
00:13:41
Speaker
In fairness, I will say the Twippy is the people's choice awards.
00:13:45
Speaker
Okay.
00:13:45
Speaker
And so the, the way the forum is set up and I, I have no problem with this.
00:13:50
Speaker
The way the forum is set up is people hop online and they place a vote.
00:13:54
Speaker
What I am, what I'm, so it's, it's fine.
00:13:56
Speaker
Like we didn't really do much active campaigning.
00:13:59
Speaker
And so it's, it didn't surprise me that we weren't on the list that year.
00:14:03
Speaker
But I got personal calls January 1st.
00:14:08
Speaker
Yeah.
00:14:08
Speaker
Like on a holiday for multiple people telling me I should call up Patterson, who was the owner of Twip at the time, and chew him out.
00:14:18
Speaker
And I was like, no.
00:14:19
Speaker
Because that's not our role.
00:14:20
Speaker
That's not our style.
00:14:23
Speaker
And if we were in this for the awards, we would have stopped doing this a long time ago.
00:14:27
Speaker
You know what I'm saying?
00:14:28
Speaker
Apparently in 2021, we would have called it quits.
00:14:30
Speaker
Yeah.
00:14:31
Speaker
So just, just, just get rid of it.
00:14:33
Speaker
Just get rid of that part.
00:14:35
Speaker
Yeah.
00:14:35
Speaker
Because that's the only, and I guarantee you when people think of the Twippies, they think of the toxicity around the content creator category.
00:14:45
Speaker
Yep.
00:14:46
Speaker
And I'm sorry, this is, okay.
00:14:49
Speaker
I like doing this and I know Josh likes doing this.
00:14:52
Speaker
This is not our day job.
00:14:53
Speaker
No.
00:14:54
Speaker
Okay.
00:14:54
Speaker
But you know what?
00:14:55
Speaker
It is some people's day job.
00:14:58
Speaker
And when what you are, when a stupid trophy that drives you to do toxic things to people personally, when it's online is or in person, of course, this person does not come in person, but online, I am sorry.
00:15:15
Speaker
That is, that's a, that is online terrorism because you are affecting their mental wellbeing.
00:15:23
Speaker
I, I just, I don't want to say here's, here's the sucky part about all this.
00:15:27
Speaker
this is the same attitudes and stuff we've seen for years now.
00:15:31
Speaker
You know, we, we don't talk about this for, because it never changes, right?
00:15:36
Speaker
Like, well, you, the list, we don't like getting the spotlight.
00:15:38
Speaker
This is one of the few times where I'm giving the spotlight to a toxic element that needs to be lanced and like a boil.
00:15:50
Speaker
That's the, that was quite the visual.
00:15:52
Speaker
Thank you.
00:15:53
Speaker
Yeah.
00:15:53
Speaker
Yeah.
00:15:54
Speaker
But my point being though, is it's like, if you want change, start with yourself.
Market Trends in Pinball
00:15:58
Speaker
Yeah.
00:15:59
Speaker
Like if you're sick and tired of it, stand up.
00:16:01
Speaker
Like a lot of people are afraid to stand up because the bullying just happens to them.
00:16:05
Speaker
And then there's like, well, they don't want to be a target.
00:16:07
Speaker
I've personally heard people who said, I don't want to stand up because I don't want to be another target of this bully.
00:16:15
Speaker
Yep.
00:16:16
Speaker
And it's not one person.
00:16:17
Speaker
It's multiple.
00:16:19
Speaker
It's constant.
00:16:20
Speaker
Remember when, when they got banned from expo last year?
00:16:25
Speaker
I heard multiple people saying they wanted to stand up, but they didn't want to be a part of it because they want to be a target and good for Zach many for standing up.
00:16:32
Speaker
Yeah.
00:16:32
Speaker
And he, he's, and this is us just talking as a friend.
00:16:37
Speaker
He has, he has been a target many times completely.
00:16:41
Speaker
And this is Zach's like livelihood.
00:16:44
Speaker
Yeah.
00:16:44
Speaker
And Zach is a, he's a good distributor.
00:16:47
Speaker
You can have your own opinion about personalities and the way, the way things are done.
00:16:52
Speaker
That's fine.
00:16:53
Speaker
And, and, and you can have opinion about Josh and me.
00:16:56
Speaker
I, I, I don't really care about that.
00:16:58
Speaker
I just hope that if we, we've repeatedly said, if you need, if you need help, like we're there for you, if you need help, reach out and look for things.
00:17:08
Speaker
But if you're, if you're just an online assassin,
00:17:12
Speaker
Just go away.
00:17:13
Speaker
Yeah.
00:17:14
Speaker
My personal opinion, because I hear a lot of this, that the truth is spoken through this podcast and whatnot.
00:17:20
Speaker
You know, honestly, you know who's a really good analyzer of the industry who gives a good poignant opinion that is for the people but still is respectable about the industry is Kerry Hardy.
00:17:32
Speaker
Yeah, Kerry's pretty good.
00:17:33
Speaker
Seriously.
00:17:33
Speaker
I like Kerry.
00:17:34
Speaker
Kerry's a good fit.
00:17:35
Speaker
And Kerry's got quite the following.
00:17:37
Speaker
It shows that I feel like he's very balanced.
00:17:40
Speaker
He may go off about topper prices.
00:17:42
Speaker
Well, okay.
00:17:44
Speaker
Kerry is irreverent, and he is.
00:17:47
Speaker
And it's, there's nothing wrong with having that type.
00:17:51
Speaker
That's, that's not my personality.
00:17:53
Speaker
It's not Josh's personality, but Kerry, that's his personality.
00:17:57
Speaker
And he's, he has a way of being provocative without being mean.
00:18:05
Speaker
Yeah.
00:18:06
Speaker
You know, that's his personal opinion.
00:18:07
Speaker
Yep.
00:18:09
Speaker
And I think that's the way, the reason I bring Kerry up, we love you, Kerry.
00:18:12
Speaker
You're a good dude.
00:18:12
Speaker
Thanks for coming on the show a few episodes back.
00:18:15
Speaker
I think the reason I bring this up is because it shows how you can have a very brash opinion about the industry, but still be respectable about it.
00:18:25
Speaker
Right.
00:18:26
Speaker
And, and calling out maybe something that needs to be called out, but doing it in a respectable way.
00:18:31
Speaker
Right.
00:18:32
Speaker
I feel like, Hey, we call people out too.
00:18:34
Speaker
I agree.
00:18:34
Speaker
Not to the same level, but it's,
00:18:37
Speaker
But you know, I'm just, I'm just, I'm tired of it.
00:18:41
Speaker
I'm tired of mean people.
00:18:42
Speaker
Mean people suck.
00:18:43
Speaker
Sorry.
00:18:43
Speaker
Mean people do suck.
00:18:44
Speaker
And that's why we usually don't talk about this because then the mean people are, you know, end up in our lives.
00:18:49
Speaker
I don't feed the trolls.
00:18:50
Speaker
Yeah.
00:18:50
Speaker
I don't feed the trolls.
00:18:52
Speaker
All right.
00:18:52
Speaker
Are we done with that?
00:18:54
Speaker
We're done.
00:18:54
Speaker
Move on.
00:18:55
Speaker
One quick question, though.
00:18:56
Speaker
I will not speak of him again.
00:18:57
Speaker
Okay.
00:18:58
Speaker
Quick question, though.
00:18:59
Speaker
All this feuding, all this ridiculousness, it's being plastered on Pinside, on Facebook, on whatever anyone can get their hands on to plaster all this drama and negativity.
00:19:09
Speaker
Is it harming the brand of Twippy?
00:19:12
Speaker
Just a quick thought.
00:19:13
Speaker
I think it does give people a...
00:19:17
Speaker
kind of a knee jerk feeling like when you sit, when you think Twippy and the number one thing you think of is drama over content creator.
00:19:27
Speaker
That's an issue.
00:19:29
Speaker
If you think Oscars and the number one you think of is Will Smith slapping Chris rock.
00:19:36
Speaker
That's a problem.
00:19:38
Speaker
Yeah.
00:19:39
Speaker
I mean, did it bring eyeballs?
00:19:40
Speaker
Yeah.
00:19:41
Speaker
Did it bring attention?
00:19:42
Speaker
Yeah.
00:19:44
Speaker
Not positive.
00:19:45
Speaker
No.
00:19:46
Speaker
And I know all publicity is good publicity.
00:19:49
Speaker
Like not always.
00:19:50
Speaker
No, no.
00:19:51
Speaker
I worked in radio.
00:19:52
Speaker
Like that was the thing, right?
00:19:53
Speaker
Like all publicity is good publicity.
00:19:54
Speaker
Right.
00:19:55
Speaker
But in this situation where you're trying to do something that's prestigious, that honors the hobby and the industry, I just, I feel like it's a black eye more than it is a gold star.
00:20:04
Speaker
Right.
Speculation on Stern's Strategy
00:20:05
Speaker
It's like having a charity event and you have the one person calling out a charity for what they're not doing or just being mean about the charity or whatever they're doing.
00:20:14
Speaker
Yeah.
00:20:15
Speaker
So.
00:20:16
Speaker
Let's move on.
00:20:17
Speaker
On the list, do we want to talk Jaws rumors?
00:20:20
Speaker
Well, okay.
00:20:21
Speaker
So let's, I don't want to, I don't want to deal with them specifically, but we can talk about rumors of Jaws and really any pinball machine rumors because this happens regularly, right?
00:20:34
Speaker
Oh, every release.
00:20:35
Speaker
Yeah.
00:20:35
Speaker
And so, and so go roughly about two to four weeks before it's shown.
00:20:39
Speaker
Right.
00:20:40
Speaker
Yeah.
00:20:40
Speaker
The, the only one that seems like it didn't like that totally took me by surprise was when they released Mustang.
00:20:47
Speaker
Yeah.
00:20:48
Speaker
It was like, here's Mustang.
00:20:49
Speaker
We're like, what, what?
00:20:50
Speaker
I don't know.
00:20:51
Speaker
I remember when, when they revealed Avengers and none of us were like from L1 and it was like, yeah, that, yeah, that was, that was interesting.
00:20:59
Speaker
Yeah.
00:20:59
Speaker
We weren't expecting that because of the way that they had released stuff around that time of year.
00:21:03
Speaker
Okay.
00:21:03
Speaker
Thought thoughts about leaks.
00:21:06
Speaker
I'll let you go first.
00:21:08
Speaker
Okay.
00:21:09
Speaker
I just really want to make a couple of quick points.
00:21:11
Speaker
The funny part is, so we interviewed Keith L1 back in February.
00:21:17
Speaker
Yeah.
00:21:17
Speaker
Yeah.
00:21:17
Speaker
Yeah.
00:21:18
Speaker
he had just had a brand new reset at that point.
00:21:20
Speaker
That was, uh, James Bond 60th anniversary.
00:21:25
Speaker
We talked about a ton of things about bond.
00:21:26
Speaker
It was amazing.
00:21:27
Speaker
It was a very fun episode.
00:21:29
Speaker
We always ask Keith, like, tell us anything about your next game.
00:21:34
Speaker
Right.
00:21:34
Speaker
Because it's,
00:21:35
Speaker
I guess people are intrigued.
00:21:37
Speaker
He told us there was four flippers, three on one side, one on one side.
00:21:41
Speaker
And the articles the next day were first details on L1's next game.
00:21:49
Speaker
Yeah.
00:21:49
Speaker
We don't celebrate for some odd reason.
00:21:51
Speaker
We don't celebrate the current game out.
00:21:53
Speaker
Like we're not satisfied with what's released, right?
00:21:56
Speaker
Like the rumors jaws.
00:21:59
Speaker
It's been for, that's been the rumor for two years.
00:22:02
Speaker
So, and if it's not great,
00:22:05
Speaker
I'm sure it'll be fine, but that's, that's been on a lot of people's wishlist for a while and been linked very heavily.
00:22:12
Speaker
Correct.
00:22:13
Speaker
I don't know if it was cause bomb 60th was, what was it?
00:22:16
Speaker
What like 15?
00:22:17
Speaker
No, it wasn't 15,000.
00:22:17
Speaker
It was more than that when it came out.
00:22:19
Speaker
It was a lot.
00:22:19
Speaker
It was a, it was a name your price.
00:22:22
Speaker
It was like unattainable for a lot of people at,
00:22:25
Speaker
Yeah.
00:22:26
Speaker
They usually go for a pro or premium, right?
00:22:28
Speaker
Like this was just, and maybe that was the other thing too, but like back to the point, the articles read first details on Ellen's next game.
00:22:35
Speaker
It didn't talk about like his current game.
00:22:37
Speaker
Yeah.
00:22:38
Speaker
And even the photo for, for it is the Ellie for Godzilla, which had been released.
00:22:43
Speaker
Right.
00:22:44
Speaker
like a year and a half before.
00:22:46
Speaker
You know what I'm saying?
00:22:46
Speaker
Like, I don't know what this fascination is with rumors in this hobby.
00:22:51
Speaker
And it's really like I joked because obviously, you know, we'll have Elwin on after his next release like we typically do.
00:22:59
Speaker
And I'm like, maybe we should just joke and be like, no one wants to hear about your current game you just released.
00:23:05
Speaker
Yeah, let's talk about your next one.
00:23:07
Speaker
Let's talk about your next one because obviously like you have a hit here and everyone's seeing this.
00:23:12
Speaker
But like what about the next one?
00:23:14
Speaker
You know what I'm saying?
00:23:14
Speaker
Like it's just – the other thing too, I don't know how much I want to touch on this, but I'm
Challenges in the Pinball Industry
00:23:19
Speaker
going to – I know there are people in Chicago that work for people that listen to this podcast.
00:23:26
Speaker
I'll put it that way.
00:23:27
Speaker
Okay, sure.
00:23:29
Speaker
people get fired over these leaks.
00:23:31
Speaker
They can, yeah.
00:23:32
Speaker
They can.
00:23:34
Speaker
And some of them think they're very smart with how they're releasing them.
00:23:39
Speaker
But if you look at the window of when the leaks are being released, it actually pinpoints the employees.
00:23:46
Speaker
So I just want to forewarn you, like you might want to- We're not going to speculate, by the way, which people, because we don't know who they are.
00:23:55
Speaker
I will state that.
00:23:56
Speaker
We don't know who they are.
00:23:58
Speaker
But we've heard of that timeline.
00:24:01
Speaker
I'm okay.
00:24:01
Speaker
Timeline.
00:24:02
Speaker
And they have a good idea of who releases these leaks every time.
00:24:06
Speaker
Sure.
00:24:08
Speaker
And I think the frustrating part to me is like, I have friends in the, like I've made friends all across this hobby.
00:24:16
Speaker
Right.
00:24:17
Speaker
And, and,
00:24:19
Speaker
It sucks that people's jobs are in jeopardy for a game that's releasing in two to four weeks.
00:24:25
Speaker
We can probably safely assume that, right?
00:24:27
Speaker
But you know what assume means.
00:24:29
Speaker
And we've got to be the first to the gate with the information of the game before the company releases it.
00:24:35
Speaker
Like, why?
00:24:36
Speaker
What's the point?
00:24:36
Speaker
Are we so rumor hungry in this hobby that we can't wait two weeks just to see a finished product?
00:24:45
Speaker
Two to four weeks?
00:24:45
Speaker
Yeah.
00:24:47
Speaker
I don't think it's, it's not unique to us.
00:24:49
Speaker
It's not unique to pinball.
00:24:50
Speaker
Okay.
00:24:51
Speaker
This, these are things that happen industry wide.
00:24:56
Speaker
Yeah.
00:24:56
Speaker
Like in any industry really, because if people are talking about it, then hopefully it, it, it increases interest, I guess, anticipation.
00:25:08
Speaker
I mean, this is the whole point of having like movie trailers and,
00:25:13
Speaker
and things that people say, Hey, that looks like a good movie.
00:25:16
Speaker
I want to, I I'm interested in it or, Hey, there's a car coming out and I'm interested in that too.
00:25:22
Speaker
There's nothing wrong with looking at what is coming up.
00:25:26
Speaker
Okay.
00:25:27
Speaker
It is common.
00:25:29
Speaker
Another point is I'm slightly skeptical about leaks and rumors because there are two, there are two ways that
00:25:42
Speaker
rumors and leaks happen.
00:25:44
Speaker
It is someone who is in the inside of the industry and they want to leak something out to say, Hey, this is a cool thing.
00:25:53
Speaker
You guys should hear about it.
00:25:54
Speaker
Okay.
00:25:55
Speaker
Yeah.
00:25:56
Speaker
There are also marketing campaigns that will use leaks.
00:26:02
Speaker
Okay.
00:26:04
Speaker
Yeah.
00:26:04
Speaker
True.
00:26:04
Speaker
And, and so there are ways that they will strategically leak things out.
00:26:11
Speaker
And this happens in sports too, where it's you, you hear, Hey, an unnamed source says that this athlete is doing this or is against the organization or with you or whatever.
00:26:30
Speaker
So the question I have usually when a leak comes out is who benefits from this?
00:26:36
Speaker
Because if the leak comes out that it actually benefits the company, there are questions about, okay, well, was the company itself a source for the leak?
00:26:47
Speaker
Yeah.
00:26:48
Speaker
Or if, and I'm using the athlete analogy, but a lot of times when you hear about negotiations with contracts between athletes and teams, and if an unnamed source comes out and says something,
00:27:03
Speaker
you need to say who benefits from it because if this makes the team look bad, then you have to suspect someone from the athletes, entourage, the group, PR, whatever.
00:27:15
Speaker
They're the one leaking it.
00:27:17
Speaker
If it benefits the company, then that.
00:27:19
Speaker
So the question I have is, do you feel that these leaks are part of a marketing campaign that companies have, but...
00:27:31
Speaker
Or do you feel that this is some gorilla tactic that an employee is having?
00:27:35
Speaker
Because I, and I, I don't think it has to be one or the other.
00:27:39
Speaker
I think there are different things.
00:27:42
Speaker
I just, and I don't disagree with you.
00:27:45
Speaker
It's like a paparazzi, the paparazzi, they get calls from the, the actors, agents to say, Hey, they're going to be walking on the beach in their shorts and
00:27:55
Speaker
And so they go and take pictures of their, you know, their latest, you know, body after having a baby or body after losing 40 pounds for a role or something like that.
00:28:05
Speaker
So it is publicity.
00:28:07
Speaker
And, and let's be honest, like we've already mentioned it earlier in the podcast, like this stuff gets leaked two to four weeks, almost like clockwork before the reveal.
00:28:18
Speaker
Right.
00:28:18
Speaker
Right.
00:28:19
Speaker
Like every time, except for there, there are a couple of times it doesn't happen.
00:28:22
Speaker
Right.
00:28:23
Speaker
So you're right.
00:28:24
Speaker
So either there's consistently employees leaking this information in a girl stuff, gorilla type fashion for marketing, or it is a planned campaign and it is leaked on purpose to a certain source
Rant: Positivity in the Pinball Community
00:28:37
Speaker
to then be dripped feet out to, to create encourage or encourage FOMO.
00:28:43
Speaker
That's what's been coined, you know, fear of missing out.
00:28:45
Speaker
And so I don't know.
00:28:48
Speaker
It just,
00:28:49
Speaker
I don't disagree with you, but I don't agree with you.
00:28:52
Speaker
I'm really in the middle of it.
00:28:53
Speaker
Which is fine.
00:28:54
Speaker
I, I'm just saying that company, and I'm not saying, you know, Stern, JJP, anything like that.
00:29:00
Speaker
They use these tactics.
00:29:02
Speaker
But what I am saying is it's a common tactic in the industry, especially when you're trying to, to create an illusion of scarcity.
00:29:12
Speaker
And right now,
00:29:14
Speaker
we're going to get into this, but the pinball market has significantly cooled down.
00:29:20
Speaker
Yes.
00:29:21
Speaker
So they are going to use anything they can to sell product.
00:29:27
Speaker
So does this help sell product?
00:29:29
Speaker
Does it not help sell product?
00:29:31
Speaker
However,
00:29:33
Speaker
The one argument that I can think of that you could easily counteract everything I just said is they're not allowed to take money for games that aren't announced.
00:29:45
Speaker
Yeah, that's true.
00:29:47
Speaker
So if there's, and sometimes this can hurt games too.
00:29:53
Speaker
And for example, and this was not a leak.
00:29:56
Speaker
This was a marketing campaign when Jersey Jack released Pirates of the Caribbean.
00:30:02
Speaker
And on their promotional information, the first 30 seconds was about a triple spinning disc.
00:30:12
Speaker
Yeah.
00:30:13
Speaker
Which sounded cool, but it really was kind of a marketing thing.
00:30:18
Speaker
It wasn't really anything that had to do with the gameplay, but it was a cool feature just visually.
00:30:24
Speaker
And then when they had to pull that back or decided to pull that back, it did affect game sales.
00:30:31
Speaker
Yeah.
00:30:32
Speaker
And so they can work both ways.
00:30:37
Speaker
But if you can't, if you have rumors for Jaws and they still can't take money for them, then you could argue this does nothing to help them.
00:30:48
Speaker
Well, and one thing that, because we've talked about this behind the scenes with different people as well, video games get announced like a year in advance, right?
00:30:56
Speaker
Like, or at least or two.
00:30:59
Speaker
Unless you're Nintendo, then it's like three months before or four months before or years before.
00:31:05
Speaker
It just depends.
00:31:07
Speaker
But with pinball, like we keep the title so under wraps.
00:31:12
Speaker
Do you think it would benefit a pinball company?
00:31:15
Speaker
I get you can't announce like a year and a half in advance.
00:31:18
Speaker
If the license doesn't work out and you've announced, hey, back to the future, Stern Zoom back to the future.
00:31:23
Speaker
This is all speculation, right?
00:31:25
Speaker
So we announced that and then like,
00:31:28
Speaker
two years later, like the licensor and Stern aren't meeting eye to eye.
00:31:31
Speaker
Right.
00:31:32
Speaker
And they decide to drop it and it gets moved on to a different company.
00:31:36
Speaker
Right.
00:31:37
Speaker
Then Stern's got like a black eye to say, right.
00:31:38
Speaker
Or they just got to pretend like we don't have it anymore, but we can't talk about who does, you know what I'm saying?
00:31:44
Speaker
Oops.
00:31:44
Speaker
Yeah.
00:31:45
Speaker
Yeah.
00:31:45
Speaker
But like four months before reveal,
00:31:48
Speaker
Or does that cut out the legs of the, well, I guess that cuts out the legs of the, if in this case it is Jaws, if we were to announce Jaws at Venom's time.
00:31:57
Speaker
Well, it is rumored to be Jaws, right?
00:32:01
Speaker
Correct.
00:32:01
Speaker
I haven't seen it.
00:32:03
Speaker
You haven't seen it.
00:32:04
Speaker
No, I haven't.
00:32:04
Speaker
Like we haven't seen the art of it.
00:32:06
Speaker
Like we, we don't know anything on it.
00:32:08
Speaker
So as bandit from blue, you would say, I've been watching too much blue with the kids.
00:32:13
Speaker
Allegedly.
00:32:14
Speaker
Yeah.
00:32:15
Speaker
Allegedly.
00:32:16
Speaker
Well, okay.
00:32:17
Speaker
I'll put this out there.
00:32:18
Speaker
Let's say it's 2020.
00:32:22
Speaker
Okay.
00:32:24
Speaker
And they announce early that, Hey, the next four games that are coming out are,
00:32:33
Speaker
The Mandalorian, Godzilla, Rush, and James Bond.
00:32:36
Speaker
Okay.
00:32:37
Speaker
Okay.
00:32:38
Speaker
So here's where pinball is different.
00:32:41
Speaker
Pinball, people don't typically buy every game, but with a video game, releasing like a Mario Kart is not going to affect Mario Wonder.
00:32:57
Speaker
Yeah.
00:32:58
Speaker
Because it's 60 bucks and that's, and they're, they're entirely different game styles.
00:33:03
Speaker
Like, right.
00:33:04
Speaker
It's not going racing versus platformer.
00:33:06
Speaker
Yeah.
00:33:06
Speaker
Yeah.
00:33:07
Speaker
But yes, it will, because there are people who are saying, well, I, I don't know what's coming out.
00:33:15
Speaker
So I'm, I have money and I want to buy a machine what's available now.
00:33:20
Speaker
Yeah.
00:33:20
Speaker
But if they're like, well, I'm not really interested in venom and I think
00:33:27
Speaker
I know that again, allegedly jaws is coming out next and it's my dream theme.
00:33:34
Speaker
You're just going to say sayonara to Venom.
00:33:36
Speaker
You're not going to worry about it.
00:33:37
Speaker
So yes, it, it actually would not benefit them to release these things early because if you look at the interest of a game, as soon as it's released, it's really hot or it peaks or something like that.
00:33:51
Speaker
And not every game,
00:33:53
Speaker
I mean, I would say that Venom, probably because it was rumored for so long.
00:33:59
Speaker
And when it came out, it really coincided with a lull in the market.
00:34:05
Speaker
It was the dreaded summer release.
00:34:08
Speaker
And it didn't sell as many as I would think Stern would hope.
00:34:15
Speaker
So anything that could possibly take away from that is not a good thing.
00:34:21
Speaker
And we've talked about it before.
00:34:23
Speaker
Does the Elvira like a red lip kiss edition or whatever, or the Jurassic park 30th edition.
00:34:31
Speaker
Yeah.
00:34:32
Speaker
Does that affect?
00:34:33
Speaker
Yeah, it does actually, because there are people who are like, well, I, I don't know about venom, but I know Jurassic park's really good and I can get like a, an exclusive version of some sort.
00:34:45
Speaker
And so the, the 30th, I think did affect the,
00:34:51
Speaker
the venom sales and not in a good way.
00:34:53
Speaker
And if they knew that in Elwin, I mean, right now everyone's chasing Elwin, right?
00:35:00
Speaker
They are.
00:35:00
Speaker
It's if you look at just by the stern production schedule, Elwin's first game just barely went off production.
00:35:10
Speaker
Yeah.
00:35:11
Speaker
Like they're still making Jurassic park.
00:35:13
Speaker
They're still making Avengers.
00:35:15
Speaker
They're still making Godzilla and they will be for the next 10 years, which Richie's only been gone for like a year and a half and none of his games are on the line.
00:35:25
Speaker
Nope.
00:35:25
Speaker
Nope.
00:35:25
Speaker
Is any of Borg's?
00:35:26
Speaker
Cause Russia isn't, is that a rush isn't on the line either.
00:35:28
Speaker
So Borg was his most, that's his most recent game.
00:35:32
Speaker
Yeah.
00:35:33
Speaker
And I mean, James Bond is still being made.
00:35:36
Speaker
Godzilla is still being made.
00:35:38
Speaker
I'm sure they'll still make the Mandalorian because it has the star Wars.
00:35:41
Speaker
Yeah.
00:35:44
Speaker
But yeah, turtles is done.
00:35:47
Speaker
Stranger things they did bring back.
00:35:49
Speaker
So, you know, so they can still vault stuff or, or semi vaulted, I guess.
00:35:54
Speaker
I mean, stranger things isn't really a vault.
00:35:57
Speaker
So there are ways of bringing it back, but you look at their production schedule and it is obvious that Elwyn's games are selling the most.
00:36:05
Speaker
Yep.
00:36:05
Speaker
They're ones that are in demand.
00:36:07
Speaker
If you're not aware of how this works, so they'll produce a game for a certain amount of time.
00:36:12
Speaker
So let's use Jurassic Park as an example.
00:36:15
Speaker
We'll put online for a couple of weeks.
00:36:18
Speaker
And then once it goes off, it goes to distributors and then distributors that sell all those orders.
00:36:22
Speaker
And then if they want more Jurassic Park, they say, hey, Stern.
00:36:26
Speaker
We have like five, six, seven more people that want Jurassic Park.
00:36:29
Speaker
And then that happens.
00:36:30
Speaker
That grows globally.
00:36:31
Speaker
And then Stern then goes off those numbers and says, hey, this is supposedly the demand we have.
00:36:36
Speaker
We're making these games.
00:36:37
Speaker
And so what that means is the reason all these L1 games are still online is because distributors, that's what they're asking for is these games.
00:36:46
Speaker
Sorry, we're shifting our next state of manufacturing.
00:36:49
Speaker
So we're pretty much into it right now.
00:36:51
Speaker
I want...
00:36:53
Speaker
I guess another thing, but okay.
00:36:55
Speaker
But the bottom line, do you think that, do you think that rumors help or hurt?
00:37:00
Speaker
Cause maybe we have different takes on this.
00:37:03
Speaker
I think it depends when they're released after our discussion right now.
00:37:06
Speaker
It really depends if, if allegedly jaws rumors dropped before venom, it could tank venom depending on the varying factors.
00:37:18
Speaker
Right.
00:37:19
Speaker
You release rumors right now, two to four weeks before we see the game, it could create some hype, especially if there's a lull in the line.
00:37:30
Speaker
Yeah.
00:37:31
Speaker
It's funny because I watch a lot of people on Facebook and stuff like that.
00:37:35
Speaker
I really don't like to comment on these because, I don't know, it's hard to convey message through text, right?
00:37:40
Speaker
Mm-hmm.
00:37:40
Speaker
But like the way it works, and this is what scares me.
00:37:44
Speaker
I really think Stern's way smarter and more involved in what they do.
00:37:49
Speaker
Right.
00:37:50
Speaker
But I really personally me, I don't buy LEs, but you got to drop that number from 1,000 to 500.
00:37:55
Speaker
I think with how rapidly people aren't buying anymore, and your LEs are your day one shot of adrenaline to your distributors and your dealers, right?
00:38:06
Speaker
That is like the quick cash flow that your distributors need.
00:38:10
Speaker
High margin.
00:38:10
Speaker
It's the high margin.
00:38:12
Speaker
Correct.
00:38:12
Speaker
And that's what helps put product on the shelf because let's be honest, like day one sales are awesome, but a lot of pinball slow burn.
00:38:20
Speaker
You have new people coming into the hobby.
00:38:21
Speaker
You have people that can't buy the game right now.
00:38:24
Speaker
They're waiting for it down the road.
00:38:26
Speaker
They do want to buy, like I'd prefer to buy new off the shelf versus like figuring out what the heck this guy did to the game.
00:38:31
Speaker
Like a lot of people are usually pretty nice to their games, but not so much, not so much.
00:38:36
Speaker
Or we've all got that game, right?
00:38:38
Speaker
We get at home, we're like, what the heck is this?
00:38:40
Speaker
What happened?
00:38:41
Speaker
Like, it worked when I was playing it for the five minutes I was in that guy's house.
00:38:45
Speaker
Now I've got it home.
00:38:46
Speaker
Something's not right.
00:38:47
Speaker
And they dig into it, and there's little gremlins that have built themselves in the game, right?
00:38:52
Speaker
So, but point being is, is like pros and preemons sit on the shelf.
00:38:56
Speaker
Like, they might go out door day one, but they're not as much as what Ellie's do, right?
00:39:01
Speaker
Right.
00:39:02
Speaker
But the problem is, is we...
00:39:04
Speaker
We're making L.E.
00:39:05
Speaker
's like every every month, every other month.
00:39:08
Speaker
Yeah.
00:39:09
Speaker
You just you just said it like Jurassic Park 30th, Elvira's Blood Red Kiss.
00:39:13
Speaker
We've had I guess Stranger Things was another L.E.
00:39:16
Speaker
But there's been several L.E.'s.
00:39:18
Speaker
I'm surprised actually that Stranger Things didn't have kind of a season edition or something.
00:39:25
Speaker
Yeah.
00:39:26
Speaker
Yeah.
00:39:27
Speaker
I'm I'm surprised.
00:39:28
Speaker
But okay, these games are $13,000.
00:39:30
Speaker
Yes.
00:39:31
Speaker
Okay.
00:39:33
Speaker
And yes, I know people who can buy these games, just they're on the every LE list.
00:39:41
Speaker
Yeah.
00:39:41
Speaker
Okay.
00:39:42
Speaker
However, the majority of the people who buy games are in the pro to premium range.
00:39:51
Speaker
And a lot of them are, you know, with the economies the way they are right now.
00:39:57
Speaker
They're looking for deals and used games.
00:40:02
Speaker
And right now supply has eclipse demand.
00:40:06
Speaker
Yeah.
00:40:09
Speaker
Well, and, and I think also too, is like, so with LE people that usually buy money is usually not an object, right?
00:40:16
Speaker
Like it could be with some, but I, I swear like if there's that person, I don't know if you know them, but it's like, they get every single LE, every release.
00:40:24
Speaker
I know, I know two who are on the,
00:40:27
Speaker
write a first refusal LE list.
00:40:29
Speaker
Like they just, and, and it's not like I, you know, I, I talked to enough people, but I know a lot more people who are buying, who are deciding between a pro and premium than the people who are deciding, well, should I get this LE or a premium?
00:40:48
Speaker
But the point being is, is like to these people, money isn't really an object, right?
00:40:51
Speaker
Like
00:40:52
Speaker
So what are you offering in an LE?
00:40:54
Speaker
You're offering something that a lot of people can't obtain.
00:40:56
Speaker
The problem is when you're making, how many Elvira editions did we decide after this?
00:41:01
Speaker
Between four?
00:41:02
Speaker
Between Super LE, the regular LE, the Blood Red Kiss, the 40th anniversary, and they were all 50 to 1,000 or 500 to 1,000 per run, right?
00:41:08
Speaker
Yeah, it's kind of around that.
00:41:15
Speaker
So let's roughly guesstimate about 1,500 LEs out there.
00:41:19
Speaker
Between the original run, it's got to be more than that.
00:41:21
Speaker
So also with the super LE, whatever you want to call it.
00:41:25
Speaker
I mean, it's in an industry where honestly, I mean, look at Spooky's numbers.
00:41:32
Speaker
They're producing about 1,500 per game now, anywhere from 1,000 to 1,500 depending on.
00:41:37
Speaker
So you're not really scarce at that point, right?
00:41:40
Speaker
Yeah.
00:41:42
Speaker
It's become the, well, this is why.
00:41:47
Speaker
I'm speculating that JJP went away from the limited edition.
00:41:54
Speaker
I think they actually shot themselves in the foot with the guns and roses limited edition because they're saying, Hey, it's limited.
00:42:03
Speaker
Now I don't think anyone really cares.
00:42:05
Speaker
They basically immediately said, okay, that's their equivalency of a premium pinball machine.
00:42:13
Speaker
And
00:42:14
Speaker
And so for them to transition over to, you know, the platinum edition or something like that is smart because it allows them the flexibility to run as many as they want or go back to the well.
00:42:26
Speaker
And I don't think that marketing gimmick for the limited edition really helped out anyone feeling exclusivity in owning a Guns N' Roses.
00:42:37
Speaker
The collector's edition, yes, but the other ones...
00:42:41
Speaker
I don't know what the answer is because it seems like the demand for pinball has actually plateaued.
00:42:54
Speaker
I don't think it's gone down because I don't know people who are just like, oh, I just kind of moved on and I'm not really into pinball anymore.
00:42:59
Speaker
Yeah.
00:43:01
Speaker
But I know a lot of people who they're in my category where they say, yeah, I could buy a game, but I'd have to sell a game.
00:43:10
Speaker
Yeah.
00:43:10
Speaker
Because they, they, they no longer have the space.
00:43:13
Speaker
They, they have maximized their space.
00:43:16
Speaker
Yep.
00:43:17
Speaker
So it runs into like, cause I love all my games.
00:43:20
Speaker
I have, so you got to show me something better than what I got.
00:43:22
Speaker
And that's the challenge.
00:43:23
Speaker
And this is where we got into, we were talking about them doing what basically every industry does, right?
00:43:32
Speaker
Every industry, like a car industry, they say, Hey, we are closing out the 2000, uh, 2021 models come down new year's Eve, get a blowout, get a huge deal.
00:43:45
Speaker
New ones are coming in.
00:43:45
Speaker
Okay.
00:43:47
Speaker
Yeah.
00:43:47
Speaker
I also understand that pinball doesn't get dated as much as like cars with different releases.
00:43:54
Speaker
Cause you can say that a pinball machine that was, you know, Lord of the rings, it's 20 years old, right?
00:44:01
Speaker
Yeah.
00:44:01
Speaker
People still are like, Oh, it's still fun.
00:44:03
Speaker
Even, even quirky and gimmicky with the limitations at the time, but because they have started dipping into that well and saying, Hey, we're going to blow out some of these old ones.
00:44:15
Speaker
it does cool people off a little bit.
00:44:18
Speaker
And the market is, it is a, oh, how can I say it?
00:44:25
Speaker
It's like a parliament.
00:44:26
Speaker
If you know much about politics outside the United States, a lot of it is parliament.
00:44:31
Speaker
So it's different groups getting together and they all say, well, this is my issue, boom.
00:44:37
Speaker
This is my issue, boom.
00:44:39
Speaker
And for them to get a majority in the parliament, they can't.
00:44:42
Speaker
cobble some of these together.
00:44:44
Speaker
Okay.
00:44:45
Speaker
Now that is like sales because there are going to be the group of LE buyers.
00:44:52
Speaker
There's going to be the group of premium buyers, the group of pro buyers, the group of new in box buyers, the group of used buyers, the group of routed.
00:45:01
Speaker
So you see where I'm going with all these different segments.
00:45:05
Speaker
Yeah.
00:45:06
Speaker
But you are moving the needle a little bit when you start saying, hey, you may be interested in that game.
00:45:14
Speaker
However, if you don't buy it now and wait till the closeout, then you could probably get it for $800 cheaper.
00:45:23
Speaker
Yeah.
00:45:24
Speaker
That doesn't help because you're basically saying,
00:45:29
Speaker
okay, there's going to be a, you're setting an expiration date on the ability to collect a premium price for that game.
00:45:38
Speaker
And that price does that.
00:45:40
Speaker
The price expectation will translate across all titles.
00:45:46
Speaker
We all know all titles aren't created equal, but how they have, how they have
00:45:54
Speaker
How they've tried to balance that out is not all equals are produced in the same amount.
00:46:01
Speaker
Yeah.
00:46:01
Speaker
If you want a Metallica, you can find a Metallica.
00:46:03
Speaker
If you want a Mustang, you may not be able to find a Mustang because they didn't make a lot of them.
00:46:09
Speaker
And so there still is that.
00:46:10
Speaker
And there's a reason why Stranger Things was so expensive for a while is because they cut the run short because it wasn't selling as much.
00:46:20
Speaker
And then it picked up steam.
00:46:21
Speaker
Deadpool was kind of the same way, actually.
00:46:24
Speaker
Deadpool didn't sell a lot.
00:46:25
Speaker
And then people said, oh, well, this is a fun game.
00:46:28
Speaker
And then they were done.
00:46:29
Speaker
And so the scarcity, you know, this is economics, right, kids?
00:46:33
Speaker
So that's how that works.
00:46:36
Speaker
But when you start teasing that
00:46:39
Speaker
you're moving those groups of people for the new inbox people to say, now you're creating a new segment and you're creating a closeout buyer segment.
00:46:52
Speaker
Yeah.
00:46:52
Speaker
Where they're willing to wait.
00:46:55
Speaker
And,
00:46:56
Speaker
that does have some long-term ramifications.
00:46:59
Speaker
Having extra LE options also affects the LE market because there are people, I am not one of these who says, I want to buy something because I don't want other people to have it.
00:47:12
Speaker
Okay?
00:47:13
Speaker
Yeah.
00:47:14
Speaker
But there are people who are like, oh, well, when Spooky,
00:47:21
Speaker
Spooky ran on this forever.
00:47:24
Speaker
Oh, there's only a hundred America's most haunted.
00:47:27
Speaker
There's only 250 Rob zombie or whatever they were.
00:47:30
Speaker
Yep.
00:47:31
Speaker
You're right.
00:47:31
Speaker
It was one 25, two 50.
00:47:32
Speaker
Yeah.
00:47:33
Speaker
So 500, they kept anybody who's played America's most haunted knows it's not that great of a game.
00:47:39
Speaker
It's not, it was, it was a good first.
00:47:41
Speaker
It was okay.
00:47:42
Speaker
It was a solid glorified homebrew.
00:47:45
Speaker
As Martin would say, it was a pinball machine that exists.
00:47:49
Speaker
Yes.
00:47:49
Speaker
Well, okay.
00:47:50
Speaker
It's not terrible, but it's not the same level as other things, but there are people who will buy them because they, it's like, oh, this is something cool that other people don't have, which I don't really care if that's your thing.
00:48:04
Speaker
Go ahead.
00:48:05
Speaker
To be honest, I've never played an America's Most Haunted.
00:48:08
Speaker
I've played it.
00:48:08
Speaker
It's okay.
00:48:09
Speaker
And that's not for an eye on one to try.
00:48:11
Speaker
Everyone I've seen has been broken.
00:48:12
Speaker
Yeah.
00:48:13
Speaker
Okay.
00:48:13
Speaker
Okay.
00:48:14
Speaker
But let's just, I mean, okay.
00:48:16
Speaker
We know Spooky can have some, especially the early games can have some issues.
00:48:20
Speaker
Yeah.
00:48:20
Speaker
They were starting to come out.
00:48:21
Speaker
I don't know me.
00:48:22
Speaker
Yeah.
00:48:23
Speaker
Yeah.
00:48:23
Speaker
Okay.
00:48:24
Speaker
But what I am saying is that it's not like the first game that they produced that wasn't limited was TNA.
00:48:33
Speaker
And that does start affecting their ability because some people are like, oh, well, if I can get it anytime, then there's no rush.
00:48:43
Speaker
But the limited should have some sort of urgency associated with buying it.
00:48:49
Speaker
Some FOMO.
00:48:51
Speaker
Some FOMO, absolutely.
00:48:52
Speaker
And it does affect that a little bit.
00:48:55
Speaker
Now, the reason why I don't care too much about the L.E.
00:49:02
Speaker
I actually like the Jersey Jack option where you're basically able to get an LE version that has all the bells and whistles without being limited by amount.
00:49:17
Speaker
Like the premium, I probably would like to get some of the bells and whistles on the premium.
00:49:24
Speaker
Like, you know, hey, if I could buy a premium that had pre-installed art blades, pre-installed shaker motor,
00:49:30
Speaker
you know, pre-installed expression lighting, just all that kind of stuff.
00:49:33
Speaker
I would totally do it.
00:49:35
Speaker
And I actually like the art package on Godzilla for the premium better than the, than the LE.
00:49:42
Speaker
So, and same thing for star Wars, actually star Wars.
00:49:46
Speaker
I didn't like the millennium Falcon edition because I love the empire strikes back theme that was on the premium.
00:49:55
Speaker
And actually iron maiden is the same way.
00:49:58
Speaker
Okay.
00:49:59
Speaker
The,
00:50:00
Speaker
The premium is the power slave album, which is their, that's the Zenith of their popularity.
00:50:07
Speaker
And so I wanted that art package.
00:50:10
Speaker
And I will say the, you know, the, the ACEs high trooper package was still really cool for the LE, but I wanted the premium.
00:50:17
Speaker
So that being said, I just want to be able to get all the bells and whistles without being limited.
00:50:23
Speaker
I gotcha.
00:50:23
Speaker
But there are some people who aren't going to pull the trigger if they can't have that limitation.
00:50:28
Speaker
True.
00:50:29
Speaker
All right.
00:50:29
Speaker
I feel like we've wrapped this one into a typo.
00:50:32
Speaker
Are there any danger zones we're toying with the way the industry is going, though, at this point?
00:50:39
Speaker
Absolutely.
00:50:41
Speaker
The reason why they allowed to have these blowout prices is because there were a lot of dealers that had their money tied up in existing stock.
00:50:57
Speaker
Yeah.
00:50:58
Speaker
And they still do.
00:51:01
Speaker
And they weren't able because they kind of caught up and the world changed at least for a little bit under COVID because people weren't traveling.
00:51:10
Speaker
And so they actually had this extra money that they wanted to bring stuff home that was fun.
00:51:16
Speaker
So people were buying these things at an incredible rate.
00:51:20
Speaker
And therefore there's no reason why a, a premium, you should buy it and then be able to sell it for more than you bought it for.
00:51:29
Speaker
I, that means that there's a margin.
00:51:31
Speaker
It's like a scalper ticket.
00:51:33
Speaker
Okay.
00:51:34
Speaker
There's a reason why, you know, if a ticket is worth $4,000, you shouldn't sell it for $200.
00:51:40
Speaker
Like that.
00:51:40
Speaker
And really,
00:51:45
Speaker
You know, by the way, I hate to break it to you.
00:51:47
Speaker
A lot of those reseller ticket things are actually from the actual artists and selling them at those prices.
00:51:56
Speaker
Shocker.
00:51:57
Speaker
Yeah.
00:51:58
Speaker
But that's what it should be, right?
00:52:00
Speaker
I shouldn't be able to go buy a Porsche for $20,000 and sell it for 90.
00:52:04
Speaker
Exactly.
00:52:05
Speaker
Porsche should sell it for 90 if that's what it's going for.
00:52:08
Speaker
Exactly.
00:52:09
Speaker
But what it does say is that the...
00:52:13
Speaker
the false escalation of prices during COVID are over.
00:52:20
Speaker
Oh, well, okay.
00:52:20
Speaker
Not false.
00:52:21
Speaker
I would say the COVID affected prices are over.
00:52:26
Speaker
Yeah.
00:52:27
Speaker
So, and you and I, you are in, we're in this hobby well before COVID.
00:52:31
Speaker
I remember right before COVID, you could almost any JJP, you could get anywhere from about six to $9,000.
00:52:37
Speaker
Yeah.
00:52:37
Speaker
That's just, it's what it was.
00:52:40
Speaker
Most sterns were in about the mid fives.
00:52:43
Speaker
On the pros, you know.
00:52:46
Speaker
Yeah, premiums were about $6,500 about then.
00:52:48
Speaker
Yeah, but then granted, the prices were lower then too.
00:52:51
Speaker
Like a pro was $62,000, $63,000 at that point.
00:52:55
Speaker
A premium was $75,000, I want to say.
00:52:58
Speaker
So, I mean, coming out of COVID, we're going into some interesting territory.
00:53:04
Speaker
Because even if you look pre-COVID, it's hard to have data points to tell you, hey, this is kind of where we're heading because...
00:53:11
Speaker
we're so different price wise.
00:53:13
Speaker
Okay.
00:53:14
Speaker
This is, this is where the problem is because right now I just, okay.
00:53:20
Speaker
I just pulled a pin side.
00:53:21
Speaker
I didn't even search for anything.
00:53:22
Speaker
I just pulled a pin side and I searched and I just said, show me the market.
00:53:26
Speaker
Okay.
00:53:26
Speaker
Okay.
00:53:28
Speaker
So show me the market.
00:53:31
Speaker
Okay.
00:53:32
Speaker
So stranger things pro with UV kit.
00:53:34
Speaker
How much do you think?
00:53:37
Speaker
Uh, 6,500, 6,500,
00:53:41
Speaker
Oh, wow.
00:53:41
Speaker
Venom premium.
00:53:45
Speaker
Five.
00:53:45
Speaker
Oh, okay.
00:53:46
Speaker
No, I'm sorry.
00:53:47
Speaker
You said premium.
00:53:48
Speaker
I apologize.
00:53:50
Speaker
7,500.
00:53:50
Speaker
8,700.
00:53:50
Speaker
Okay.
00:53:51
Speaker
8,700, but still.
00:53:52
Speaker
Okay.
00:53:52
Speaker
But okay.
00:53:53
Speaker
But that's the, the, the MSRP is 9,500.
00:53:55
Speaker
Yeah.
00:53:56
Speaker
True.
00:53:57
Speaker
Sorry.
00:53:58
Speaker
So that's a drop.
00:53:59
Speaker
Iron Maiden premium.
00:54:01
Speaker
8,800.
00:54:03
Speaker
Okay.
00:54:03
Speaker
And that's for a game.
00:54:06
Speaker
That's an L1 game.
00:54:06
Speaker
That's not being produced anymore.
00:54:08
Speaker
Yeah.
00:54:09
Speaker
Yeah.
00:54:09
Speaker
So there's Star Trek pro.
00:54:13
Speaker
5,900.
00:54:14
Speaker
So my question is, so this is, we're talking a lot of new box.
00:54:17
Speaker
Do you think, cause our, our used market, especially our Bally Williams has jumped significantly.
00:54:25
Speaker
Do you think those come down?
00:54:27
Speaker
But since they're not being made anymore and they're, do they stay high?
00:54:30
Speaker
Because this is kind of what the market's shifted to on the used market.
00:54:35
Speaker
I, they will sell for that.
00:54:38
Speaker
They're not going to lower prices again.
00:54:40
Speaker
Because they'll just modify their manufacturing stamp.
00:54:46
Speaker
But they may not get $100 or $200.
00:54:49
Speaker
But we have actually talked about this, that if you adjust for inflation, they're actually pretty much where they were.
00:54:57
Speaker
Yeah.
00:54:57
Speaker
Really.
00:54:59
Speaker
The challenge is going to be, though...
00:55:03
Speaker
Are they going to be able to manufacture the same amount if the distributors are still stuck with a lot of stock that they're not able to move?
00:55:13
Speaker
Yeah.
00:55:14
Speaker
I think really, honestly, the biggest telltale of the market is going to be with this next release.
00:55:22
Speaker
I think it's going to tell you a few different things.
00:55:25
Speaker
Either your consumer base is holding out for a specific product, whether that be license or a designer team.
00:55:33
Speaker
Let's say the whole team because let's be honest, L1 is great.
00:55:37
Speaker
We're just doing the umbrella, right?
00:55:39
Speaker
It's an L1 release.
00:55:40
Speaker
Okay.
00:55:41
Speaker
An L1 team release.
00:55:45
Speaker
So there's a lot of varying factors that go into.
00:55:48
Speaker
I'm really intrigued to see what happens with this next release.
00:55:52
Speaker
And it's not because of the rumors of it allegedly being Jaws or whatever else comes along with those rumors.
00:56:00
Speaker
My thing is, we've seen the industry do some pretty wild things in this last 6 to 12 months.
00:56:06
Speaker
And it was like we hit a crescendo, I want to say probably in the spring.
00:56:12
Speaker
And it seems like, as you're pointing out, the Guardians of the Galaxy, I pulled it up.
00:56:19
Speaker
we've got a guardians of the galaxy volume two refinery edition with the topper pro for six grand that's a refinery edition wow yeah dude that's that's something else oh yeah that's yeah okay i just barely saw that yeah and so that's a whole lot of purple
00:56:40
Speaker
And this is, I mean, Guardians of the Galaxy have sold so well.
00:56:45
Speaker
They've done, even though they said we're done running them, they're like, we're doing one more run.
00:56:49
Speaker
Okay, I'm really hoping that they just took it all with a purple light.
00:56:55
Speaker
Cause everything is purple on that game.
00:56:57
Speaker
Yeah.
00:56:58
Speaker
Shadows are coming down there in the mid sixes.
00:57:00
Speaker
Now they're down to 55.
00:57:01
Speaker
So I think it just, it just all depends on what you're looking for.
00:57:09
Speaker
It, it does.
00:57:09
Speaker
It's I I'm just hoping that I'm concerned about the longterm health for some companies because Stern Stern is going to be fine.
00:57:20
Speaker
They're still making excellent games.
00:57:24
Speaker
They have been in the industry long enough to weather ups and downs.
00:57:29
Speaker
And if they, if they, let's be honest, if they have a turd three months later, they can move on.
00:57:34
Speaker
Yeah.
00:57:34
Speaker
If they have one that falls flat, absolutely.
00:57:37
Speaker
Or they can dip back into the well, like they've been doing.
00:57:41
Speaker
Some other, other companies though, I, I'm concerned because you're, you're competing with Stern.
00:57:49
Speaker
I really, everybody is competing with Stern and the benchmark right now is Godzilla at 9,500.
00:57:57
Speaker
Well, I'm not even worried about manufacturing.
00:57:58
Speaker
Like I am worried about manufacturing.
00:57:59
Speaker
I'm worried about distributors.
00:58:01
Speaker
We created such a weird buying frenzy in these last couple, two, three years.
00:58:05
Speaker
And a lot of people joined in to be a distributor in the last two or three years.
00:58:10
Speaker
And it's never been like this where you just, you don't have to have products sitting on shelf.
00:58:15
Speaker
And all of a sudden the last six, 12 months.
00:58:17
Speaker
You do.
00:58:18
Speaker
It's overwhelmingly, I mean, that's why we, that's why they've said, Hey, you can sell rush.
00:58:24
Speaker
You can sell Led Zeppelin.
00:58:27
Speaker
You can sell.
00:58:27
Speaker
I'm still kind of shocked by the way that they like, I thought the demand was still enough for rush that they would have run more, but that's not just the weirdest thing.
00:58:37
Speaker
Like it's like, it won like game of the year last year.
00:58:41
Speaker
Yeah.
00:58:42
Speaker
It's really weird when, and the matter of the fact is too, it won game of the year and they had stopped running it by that point.
00:58:49
Speaker
Yeah.
00:58:50
Speaker
It just, it's weird.
00:58:53
Speaker
I will say granted pinball is driven by themes and rush is a very specific demographic.
00:59:04
Speaker
You're telling me it's a niche theme in a niche hobby.
00:59:06
Speaker
Well, my favorite was the,
00:59:10
Speaker
One time, Jeff Rivera was talking about Iron Maiden and he talked about Iron Maiden's music.
00:59:16
Speaker
And the funny thing is, I grew up on Iron Maiden.
00:59:19
Speaker
I grew up on Rush.
00:59:20
Speaker
And so I'm a fan of both of them and I own both of the machines.
00:59:24
Speaker
But he talked about Iron Maiden is like Rush took drugs and learned how to play metal.
00:59:33
Speaker
And he's like, I can't stand it.
00:59:35
Speaker
I can't stand it.
00:59:36
Speaker
So it was funny.
00:59:37
Speaker
But so I totally get it.
00:59:39
Speaker
And there are people who sold Iron Maiden because they couldn't stand the music.
00:59:42
Speaker
Yeah.
00:59:43
Speaker
Here, here's something that's, that is interesting though.
00:59:48
Speaker
With Rothrills.
00:59:49
Speaker
Okay.
00:59:50
Speaker
You know how we're getting more insider connected, right?
00:59:53
Speaker
Yes.
00:59:54
Speaker
Okay.
00:59:55
Speaker
Rothrills.
00:59:57
Speaker
They sell big buck Hunter now at home and there's two versions you can buy.
01:00:02
Speaker
Okay.
01:00:03
Speaker
You can, you can get a standalone version.
01:00:07
Speaker
or you can get a subscription version.
01:00:09
Speaker
Okay.
01:00:12
Speaker
The standalone version, it's, it's kind of cost prohibitive.
01:00:17
Speaker
You pay a lot of money and you're buying the content, but you're only, you can only play like, you know, five, six, five or six of the games or whatever.
01:00:26
Speaker
But I thought it was like, you get access to it, but you have to buy the license, like you have to renew the license.
01:00:31
Speaker
Well, you could, you can actually buy some outright, but it's kind of a ridiculous amount.
01:00:36
Speaker
It's like,
01:00:37
Speaker
you know, Terminator for 1500 bucks or something.
01:00:42
Speaker
And really, as long as you keep hitting the start button on a home game, you can blast through one of those games in five, 10 minutes.
01:00:49
Speaker
Yeah.
01:00:49
Speaker
Okay.
01:00:50
Speaker
So, and it's the same game and it's, it's not like there's a, the ball's live, right?
01:00:57
Speaker
So would you ever think that Stern would go down that rabbit hole and
01:01:04
Speaker
of having a subscription based thing for a home game.
01:01:11
Speaker
I don't know.
01:01:11
Speaker
They hired a guy from Disney that worked for Disney plus services.
01:01:14
Speaker
So he, he, he knows his way around subscription based services.
01:01:19
Speaker
Yeah.
01:01:20
Speaker
I is the, I, the internet connectivity.
01:01:23
Speaker
There's, there's some really great things about it.
01:01:25
Speaker
There are also some dark possibilities.
01:01:28
Speaker
Yeah.
01:01:28
Speaker
that it would just be really weird because what do you sell?
01:01:32
Speaker
Like it would have to be DLC, right?
01:01:34
Speaker
Like it would have to be DLC, but you can't just inhibit.
01:01:39
Speaker
It would just be, but it's not like there's features that you could leave out of the game physically and then put them in later, except for maybe like UV kid on stranger thing.
01:01:47
Speaker
Kind of do with the topper though.
01:01:49
Speaker
Like I know it's like silly.
01:01:51
Speaker
It's like goat mode or whatever on Jurassic park, but it's more of a novelty than it is.
01:01:59
Speaker
Okay.
01:01:59
Speaker
Right now.
01:02:00
Speaker
Yeah.
01:02:02
Speaker
I don't know.
01:02:03
Speaker
You're towing a fine line.
01:02:04
Speaker
And honestly, I'm going to leave that up to Stern.
01:02:06
Speaker
I'm not even going to speculate.
01:02:07
Speaker
I'm not giving ideas.
01:02:08
Speaker
I'm just wondering where they, where it's going.
01:02:11
Speaker
It's a possibility.
01:02:12
Speaker
Yeah.
01:02:12
Speaker
So, okay.
01:02:14
Speaker
Let's get to, we're over our hour.
01:02:16
Speaker
Yeah.
01:02:17
Speaker
I talked way too long and I ranted way too long.
01:02:20
Speaker
I, if you, yeah, I apologize.
01:02:22
Speaker
Before we finish this, if you want to get ahold of Scott, I'll get that information here in a little bit.
01:02:30
Speaker
We promised that we would be giving away or not us.
01:02:34
Speaker
I guess JJP was generous.
01:02:36
Speaker
JJP supplied us with a banner so we can give it away.
01:02:38
Speaker
We appreciate their effort and Ken being the marketing guy.
01:02:43
Speaker
Great guy.
01:02:44
Speaker
Yes.
01:02:45
Speaker
So Ken Cromwell has provided us with an Elton John banner.
01:02:50
Speaker
He will provide it.
01:02:51
Speaker
It's not been shipped out yet.
01:02:52
Speaker
Yes.
01:02:54
Speaker
But to save time, we did the trying right before the podcast and Luke Konecki.
01:03:01
Speaker
I hope I said your last name right.
01:03:03
Speaker
It's got to be Konecki like in Greece.
01:03:06
Speaker
Maybe.
01:03:07
Speaker
Okay.
01:03:08
Speaker
I'm kidding.
01:03:08
Speaker
I think it's Konecki.
01:03:09
Speaker
Yeah.
01:03:09
Speaker
So congratulations to you.
01:03:11
Speaker
I will be contacting you via the way that you contacted me and congratulations.
01:03:17
Speaker
We'll work out how to get that to you.
01:03:18
Speaker
And we appreciate everybody who entered by the way.
01:03:21
Speaker
Yes.
01:03:21
Speaker
Thank you so much, everyone.
01:03:22
Speaker
There was an amazing amount of response to our contest.
01:03:26
Speaker
It just blew up.
01:03:29
Speaker
And we do appreciate people reaching out.
01:03:31
Speaker
I don't want this whole thing to be negative.
01:03:33
Speaker
There's been some great emails in this past couple weeks.
01:03:37
Speaker
I do want to bring an update, too.
01:03:38
Speaker
Larry DeMar has been talking to me.
01:03:40
Speaker
He's been trying to find those home ROMs.
01:03:42
Speaker
There has been a lot of interest for those home ROMs.
01:03:44
Speaker
World Cup soccer, Twilight Zone.
01:03:46
Speaker
He said, if you want to get a hold of Twilight Zone one,
01:03:49
Speaker
It is actually on planetary pinballs website.
01:03:54
Speaker
So the people that own the rights to the Bally Williams stuff, they have it posted there in a zip file.
01:03:59
Speaker
So go ahead.
01:04:00
Speaker
Okay.
01:04:00
Speaker
Do what you need to do to take, but I can't burn it.
01:04:03
Speaker
Like it's a chip.
01:04:04
Speaker
I don't know how to burn it.
01:04:05
Speaker
Find someone that can burn it for you.
01:04:07
Speaker
There's someone nearby.
01:04:08
Speaker
I know that there is.
01:04:08
Speaker
If someone knows how to burn like the home version for Twilight Zone, get a hold of me because I would love to have the home version.
01:04:16
Speaker
So you can get direct to Lost in the Zone.
01:04:18
Speaker
Absolutely.
01:04:20
Speaker
So then like Larry was saying on the interview, it's really cool.
01:04:22
Speaker
Hey, if there's a home version of Black Rose, I'll take that too.
01:04:25
Speaker
He said that the way it works is it puts you into that mode, but
01:04:28
Speaker
Then you start the game over and you get no points awarded.
01:04:31
Speaker
You get to explore the mode without cheating the game.
01:04:35
Speaker
It's so cool.
01:04:36
Speaker
It's cool because not all of us can get to the end mode every game.
01:04:40
Speaker
I think it would just be fun to show people.
01:04:43
Speaker
Do we have any other closing thoughts before we wrap this up?
01:04:46
Speaker
No, I know I started with a downer.
01:04:48
Speaker
I really, a hot button issue for me is bullying.
01:04:52
Speaker
Like it really just, I have no tolerance for it.
01:04:55
Speaker
And so please be positive, help people out and speak up for people.
01:05:01
Speaker
If you feel like they are being bullied.
01:05:03
Speaker
Like be their support staff, because if you're not calling them out on their bad behavior, then it typically continues and it leads toward just condoning.
01:05:14
Speaker
So I apologize for nothing.
01:05:18
Speaker
I feel very strongly about that.
01:05:20
Speaker
And I'm, I really do want us to be a, a fun area and maybe a diversion to your day.
01:05:29
Speaker
And hopefully just something that we can experience pinball together.
01:05:34
Speaker
We don't care what your background is, what your income is, what your orientation is, what your religion is, what your politics.
01:05:38
Speaker
I don't care.
01:05:40
Speaker
Just come play pinball and be a good person.
01:05:43
Speaker
Like don't, don't be toxic.
01:05:45
Speaker
That's not a high level.
01:05:47
Speaker
Unless you're jamming your knee into the front of my corn door, you're welcome to hang out with me.
01:05:51
Speaker
Yeah.
01:05:54
Speaker
Don't hurt my machines.
01:05:55
Speaker
I'll escort you off the premises.
01:05:59
Speaker
But seriously, I mean, this isn't just about one specific person.
01:06:03
Speaker
This is about bullying and really stand up.
01:06:09
Speaker
What else can you say to that point?
01:06:11
Speaker
I see it too much.
01:06:14
Speaker
Online has made it worse.
01:06:16
Speaker
Yeah, it really has.
01:06:17
Speaker
And I talk to my kids a lot about this.
01:06:19
Speaker
There is a bravado that comes with online.
01:06:22
Speaker
But if you have an issue, there are appropriate ways of dealing with it.
01:06:29
Speaker
Correct.
01:06:30
Speaker
And so I appreciate those that have reached out to me in the past privately so we could discuss it.
01:06:35
Speaker
I don't think posting it on Facebook.
01:06:38
Speaker
I mean, I guess.
01:06:39
Speaker
And deleting it later.
01:06:41
Speaker
If you want to get ahold of us, we are loser kid pinball podcast at gmail.com.
01:06:45
Speaker
Oh, I just got my shoes, by the way.
01:06:47
Speaker
I forgot to tell you, I finally got my shoes.
01:06:49
Speaker
They feel awesome.
01:06:51
Speaker
Great.
01:06:51
Speaker
I'm glad you got your shoes.
01:06:55
Speaker
Sorry.
01:06:55
Speaker
Go ahead.
01:06:56
Speaker
Finish up.
01:06:57
Speaker
That's good to know.
01:06:58
Speaker
I appreciate that because there's other people that have ordered shoes that were, I got to talk to them and see if they've received theirs as well.
01:07:04
Speaker
So thank you for letting me know.
01:07:06
Speaker
if you do want to get some of our swag, silverballswag.com slash loser kid.
01:07:10
Speaker
Thanks again, Will Odding for all that you do with that.
01:07:13
Speaker
I was talking to a buddy outside of this hobby.
01:07:15
Speaker
He does fly fishing and he's trying to sell his own merch.
01:07:18
Speaker
And I'm like, why don't you have like a silver ball swag?
01:07:20
Speaker
And he's like, what's silver ball swag?
01:07:22
Speaker
So I explained it to him.
01:07:22
Speaker
He's like, that's very unique.
01:07:25
Speaker
And it's very like specific to your guys's hobby, like, like your industry or whatever.
01:07:29
Speaker
So I appreciate Will for like opening that Avenue to allow us to do that.
01:07:34
Speaker
So yeah,
01:07:36
Speaker
Back to what I was saying.
01:07:37
Speaker
So if you want to contact us, we are LoserKidPinballPodcast at gmail.com.
01:07:40
Speaker
You can get a hold of us via X, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Twitch, YouTube, all at LoserKidPinball.
01:07:51
Speaker
Or Gmail.
01:07:53
Speaker
Or Gmail.
01:07:55
Speaker
Go ahead and subscribe.
01:07:57
Speaker
We had an explosion of subscribers via Facebook in this last month.
01:08:03
Speaker
It was ridiculous, like 250 people in less than 30 days.
01:08:08
Speaker
Sweet.
01:08:09
Speaker
If you want to look at our beautiful faces, you can watch us on YouTube.
01:08:13
Speaker
And then maybe go back to listening to us.
01:08:16
Speaker
And we do appreciate it.
01:08:17
Speaker
Like I said, we did officially hit the milestone of 500,000 listens.
01:08:22
Speaker
Yeah, that's impressive.
01:08:27
Speaker
I don't even know what to say.
01:08:28
Speaker
That's awesome.
01:08:29
Speaker
Yeah.
01:08:30
Speaker
Obviously, you guys are listening.
01:08:31
Speaker
Thank you so much.
01:08:33
Speaker
I feel like we've made it.
01:08:34
Speaker
We've arrived.
01:08:35
Speaker
Hopefully nice guy famous.
01:08:36
Speaker
Yeah.
01:08:37
Speaker
Nice guy famous.
01:08:38
Speaker
So thanks again for tuning in.
01:08:40
Speaker
We'll see.
01:08:42
Speaker
We have a few things lined up, so it's, but today we want to do a little recap.
01:08:46
Speaker
So yeah.
01:08:47
Speaker
And what was the other thing I was gonna say?
01:08:49
Speaker
It's Christmas time.
01:08:51
Speaker
It's the holidays.
01:08:52
Speaker
Nice.
01:08:52
Speaker
It's Hanukkah.
01:08:53
Speaker
It's, it's, it's whatever you want, you know, whatever you believe.
01:08:56
Speaker
Okay.
01:08:57
Speaker
Whatever you put your faith in, whether, even if you don't put your faith in anything,
01:09:01
Speaker
So the schedule might be a little skimwampus here in December.
01:09:05
Speaker
Yeah.
01:09:06
Speaker
Because I'm going to U2 in two weeks.
01:09:09
Speaker
Yeah.
01:09:10
Speaker
So go enjoy your family.
01:09:11
Speaker
Go tell someone that you've had a feud with, like, hey, man, let's squash it.
01:09:16
Speaker
Let's talk.
01:09:17
Speaker
Let's break bread.
01:09:18
Speaker
All right.
01:09:20
Speaker
See you in two weeks.
01:09:21
Speaker
Okay.
01:09:21
Speaker
We'll see you later.
01:09:33
Speaker
Thank you.