Transcript
Speaker: We're saving on average about 10% capex against normal project ah value. So when we're looking at given the scale of infrastructure projects, those are really significant dollar savings that we're seeing and achieving better sustainability outcomes.
Speaker: Welcome back to Infrastructure Connections, the podcast where we explore what makes sustainable infrastructure work. Brought to you by the Infrastructure Sustainability Council, I'm your host, Seth Scott, and today we'll be speaking with Toby Kent.
Speaker: You might remember Toby from episode one. Toby is the CEO of the Infrastructure Sustainability Council. Prior to this, he worked for PWC Australia, where he served as a partner in the energy transition.
Speaker: He co-founded and managed Resilient Co Consulting and has been an active board member of the Business Council for Sustainable Development Australia for four years. Toby, welcome to the show.
Speaker: Thank you. Thanks for having me back, Seth. And hello to all our listeners. So we've seen some amazing stats come out of our 2025 fiscal year impact report. And I wanted to start there.
Speaker: What did we do differently this year? you know Over the course of this past year, I think we've had spent a lot of time really working out on how we deliver value to our users and members, be that through revising the membership model, ah member committees, and so on a lot of that work happened in the year.
Speaker: twenty five here also a huge amount of work to get ready for ah the revised version 2.2 rating tool on design and as-built rating tool that is now out in the market. But those kind of things took up a lot of that that reporting period.
Speaker: And in terms of where both sort of signaling a direction of travel for ISC, but also what we did differently. I'm really pleased we were better able to start putting some financial ah numbers around the savings that were associated with IS ratings.
Speaker: And so um that was great. um i some of the training impacts we continue to grow our footprint there and so while I'm not sure that was fundamentally different it was really more building on the legacy and platform that was in place I think now as we go into the 25 26 year with partnerships that we'll soon be announcing with major universities, with um ah impact pathways training and so on. I think that's now what is a ahead of us is fundamentally different.
Speaker: But I think there's a lot um that the team and ah all of our various users and members should be really proud of him about the actual impacts that occurred as a result of our work last year.
Speaker: The ISE certified 29 as-built projects across rail, road, energy, and water, and they achieved combined emissions of 3.5 million tons of CO2e, as well as waste diversion ah reductions and material reductions.
Speaker: But one of the things we did differently this year is it looks like we put the financial value of those numbers together. What did those numbers come out to? Yeah, I mean, at the highest level, Seth, so um it's it's important to understand that we only used dollar values where there is a broadly agreed industry dollar value to put to it. So, um you know, when there are actual costs of sending waste to landfill um and so on.
Speaker: ah Similarly, we use the Infrastructure Australia's agreed relatively conservative dollar value for emissions. So across those almost 30 projects, we saw um about 76% average emissions in energy use,
Speaker: twenty nine cent reduction in energy use Overall, a 5% reduction in water use, for which in and of itself doesn't sound massive, important, but not massive. But actually, we've seen potable water reductions of three quarters against a normal basis, 76% on projects.
Speaker: And huge ah waste a waste amount diverted from landfill. um And, you know, in Australia, which has high waste levels, and that's a really important win.
Speaker: And so I hear you say, or our leaders thinking our listeners thinking, that's all fine, we didn't answer the question. So what is the dollar value? And we're seeing that for all of these projects, on average, they amount to about 10% of ah normal so as usual CapEx. So we saw across those almost 30 projects, about $1.2 billion in savings. And so, again, for any single project, given the scale of
Speaker: spend on your most infrastructure projects, you know, 10% CapEx saving is a really material outcome. That sounds like value for money. Yeah, I mean, for us at the ISE, we've always been about demonstrating better business as usual. And that means, you know, really using sustainability to make sure that we are getting better profits or our members and users are getting, I say, better profits, by own which I mean better for the world, better for the business.
Speaker: um And so it really for us underscores the fundamental principle that sustainability doesn't have to be a cost. It can and be a cost saving as well as a whole bunch of other benefits.
Speaker: So we saw 59 project certifications last year with 15 new projects registering. That's pretty good in the kind of atmosphere of economics that we had in the last year, I would think.
Speaker: what The team has done such a marvelous job of doing and again supported by so many of our users and members. is to make sure that we have not reduced the sustainability ah expectations associated with those tools, but we've reduced a lot of the administrative burden that was unintentionally built into the previous 2.1 version. And so we're doing our utmost to make sure and that um not only can we help be part of those 10% CapEx
Speaker: ah savings, um but we're also helping to achieve them or achieve the rating in the most effective and cost effective ways. It must be easy to be supportive of these projects when we're seeing these kinds of fantastic outcomes. i mean, 59 projects and 21 of them were certified at leading or gold award level with another 23 at excellent or silver level.
Speaker: What do you think is driving these high ratings in the last year? I think a few things. One is um how they were procured. So in a number of cases, ah a lot of proponents had demanded that they wanted a certain outcome and people built to the standards to make sure that they achieved that gold rating, silver rating, etc.
Speaker: um
Speaker: and On that, we actually don't necessarily advise that the best way to approach an IS rating is to say what level you want to achieve, but rather to say what are the real outcomes that you want see, where and the most important sustainability achievements you want to be met.
Speaker: And then we will work with the proponent and or the contractor, and the designers, of her so what if you do all that, that would equate to ah such and such a level. Nonetheless, we're obviously delighted that those proponents who demanded a certain outcome achieve them because fundamentally that means ah more sustainable outcomes on the ground.
Speaker: So that was part of it. um In terms of some of the excellent racing and so on, and this also touches on why we evolved the standard at all, but we have seen that as the sector, ah the direct infrastructure sector and its adjacent parties have become more skilled at sustainability, we are seeing more and more organizations actually delivering really, really good outcomes At the same time, you released the ISC 2030 strategy. a Big Picture, tell us what it's about and how does it compare it to the last one and why now?
Speaker: um and Big picture, and this is fundamentally about ISC providing even more value back into the market. um You know, really seeing ourselves as evolving to become a fundamental part i'm of the infrastructure ecosystem across Australia and New Zealand.
Speaker: um We've revised our purpose statement. We talk about enabling connected infrastructure that supports people to thrive on a healthy planet. And part of that um providing more value back into the sector is really and using the insights that we gained from doing ratings to be able to support um better outcomes between different assets, i really starting to, we're starting now, but looking ahead, really being able to provide much greater, as I say, value people so that they can see, you know well, how have and different ratings been achieved?
Speaker: So when you look at our data, We have really pretty thorough ah ESG performance data ranging from everything from indigenous procurement spend through to water use and bodied carbon across over $400 billion dollars worth of Australian and New Zealand infrastructure assets.
Speaker: So, A critical part of the strategy and ISE's future is being able to make sure um that people can get more insight about how um different assets are performing, have performed, which techniques, approaches, um materials are helping to achieve the different outcomes.
Speaker: um And that then flows through as well into the broader offering about how we um help to identify and um lift up new technologies, how we provide greater value back to our different users.
Speaker: um And really while we do it, um beautifully at times through events like IS Connect or IS Practitioners Network, but really being a greater convening and not in a commercial way a broker, but in an outcomes bringing parties together for greater collective benefits, more of a broker of outcomes for the sector. And I understand you do that through the Epic system, Epic values?
Speaker: Yes, we did take a look at our values. And um I was very pleased that when we looked at all the feedback and engaged with the team, ah we determined that our our values are indeed Epic.
Speaker: And so what that reflects is expertise. And we're really clear as part of our value proposition that we both need to be experts. We highly value expertise, but also recognize that where we are not experts, we will work with those who are to help ah achieve the outcomes that are needed.
Speaker: We also and it flows from that point about recognizing where we're not the experts is about partnership. And really, you know, we are a membership organization.
Speaker: We are a fundamental convener of the infrastructure sector. And we really need to make sure that we are an active and good partner ah in terms of how we go to market.
Speaker: um The, um you know, building from who we are as an organization, you know, we are a for-purpose outfit. And so impact sits very much, therefore, at the core of our values. And so um we want to be more market-driven.
Speaker: supportive but why do we want to do that is fundamentally so we see better impact on the ground and so um that's part of it and then there's an element which also then flows from that point about impact which is around care we want to demonstrate care to one another as a team we want to demonstrate care in how we use ah the resources of our members.
Speaker: Care felt like equally, as I say, a really important value to the team as whole. One of the strengths of the ISC is playing to our thought leadership, where we're connecting thought leadership with real-world policy.
Speaker: What are we focusing on in the next years for our strategy? Part of the feedback from members is actually wanting more working committees. And so we have stood those up for this year.
Speaker: And so um we now have seven member committees, all of which, and or not all of which, many of which, in one way or another, will be feeding through into ah new thought leadership and and and also supporting our advocacy positions and really helping to represent our members, as you say, with policymakers, regulators and so on.
Speaker: And so we do have a standalone policy and advocacy committee. So I'm really pleased about that. We've also got um committees around sustainable procurement capability, which is both understanding from the sector how we lift up ah the sustainability combat capabilities of others, as well as what they want to see through ISC's own training programs.
Speaker: um We've got a reignited contractor working group. got an ongoing ah working for around modern slavery. And then two new ones, which um I am both really pleased about, but also I see as fundamentally important <unk>m around AI and digital.
Speaker: In infrastructure, we've got a piece of work going on right now as we, both as you and I talk and as the podcast really is released around um digital in infrastructure and digital infrastructure.
Speaker: And so that will be, and so im just sort of on that, what I mean by that is, There's not a lot of sustainability oversight of a lot of ah the poles, wires, towers, and ah whole bunch of the assets that are fundamental to achieving and delivering a digital backbone that is a critical part of modern infrastructure.
Speaker: Equally, we're looking at what is our role in in supporting ah the use of digital in traditional infrastructure. So anyway that's going on and that'll be picked up in part by that committee.
Speaker: And then the final one is around sustainable finance. And, you this is because we're seeing more and more expectations of financiers being able to understand and report upon the impacts of their investments.
Speaker: But also we've got some great examples where IS ratings are now being used to support and or underpin ah sustainable finance mechanisms. And so we see it as a really important part of our future um in terms of being able to support that part of the sector.
Speaker: as well as seeing um as government are pushing more and more into or looking more and more to the private sector to meet infrastructure needs, our ability to play a role in there is is really, really critical.
Speaker: One of the other exciting things happening right now is the introduction of the version 2.2 for design and as-built. um Tell us about what why that developed and what makes it different and what people can people expect out of it?
Speaker: You know, again, we are as sustainability expectations change, as the market changes, so our tools have to evolve. And what had happened was um we had got to a point where our 1.2 rating tool writinging tool was um for certain parts of the market was being achieved in there as expressed by the market, um by the users of the tool, it was being achieved too easily. It was no longer lifting standards to the extent that it should.
Speaker: As we evolved it, we inadvertently built in um too many processes, too much administration, and frankly, in certain cases, too much duplication of effort to achieve the 2.1 rating tool.
Speaker: writing tool So with 2.2, it maintains the rigor of the 2.1 standard, um but it is really much more focused on being easier to use.
Speaker: um We took a really working again. We always work with industry and working with industry. and We determined that of the 37 credits in the full rating tool,
Speaker: um 12 were fit for purpose. 25 of the 37 were updated. um We also removed over 100 what are called must statements.
Speaker: no And so just giving more, little bit more flexibility in how some of the guidance is interpreted and implied. And I think one of the really big changes is that for projects,
Speaker: under 500 million dollars in value so basically from 100 to 500 million dollars uh they are able to screen out a number of the ah requirements and so overall still ensuring great uh outcomes with great sustainability outcomes through infrastructure but while again uh enabling it to scale down one of things that's going to provide a real benefit to the market is the uh our revised approach to ah verification.
Speaker: So historically and for good reasons projects would have two independent verifiers reviewing or in advance of their certification. What we've done, we were aware that we were finding too many ah inconsistencies that was leading to confusion and um at times ah delays in project delivery for some of our users.
Speaker: but also in certain cases an over-investment in projects because people weren't necessarily sure what outcomes were going to be assessed as as adequate.
Speaker: So what we've done is to bring or create an in-house quality control function. And so and then we will really be making sure that when projects come to verification,
Speaker: We still absolutely stand by the importance of independent verification, and that will be done by yeah one of our well-established external verifiers.
Speaker: And then what our role through the quality control function will be is to make sure that the projects are only being assessed on the base case, the materiality assessment they set at the beginning of the project and how they perform relative to the technical manual.
Speaker: so It may not sound in and of itself groundbreaking, but having tested this a lot before we rolled it out and um based on the initial feedback that we're getting from both projects and verifiers, we're really seeing that we're getting, this is gonna be really significant improvement in the market and our ability to meet the needs of it.
Speaker: Yeah, i think so too. We're definitely getting that feedback. So I understand along with this 2030 strategy and version 2.2, we've also had to revamp our training and it's aligning with these new systems.
Speaker: Can you give us an overview of the new IS Professionals Pathway? Yeah, sure. um I mean, fundamentally, the Professionals Pathway is a five-week program with about 20 hours of coursework in total.
Speaker: And so what the new model does, it blends 10 self-paced modules that build both theory and systems ah knowledge alongside the nine facilitated workshops where the participants actually apply what they've learned in simulated real-world contexts.
Speaker: Yeah, no, we're really pleased about that. And and we think we'll see equal excitement, I hope, from our from our users. What's the benefit of blending self-paced modules now with the workshops?
Speaker: There are very few our users, more than stakeholders who are not busy. And so what the self-paced modules allow us to do is to build on that theoretical knowledge and the systems understanding um in the sort of the set work.
Speaker: and then with the workshops they really allow participants to test that knowledge and practice and collaborate with peers and so on um and so it's that both the increased flexibility but also um the enhanced experiential elements of it um that makes it all um worthwhile and as i said to go back to the specific question that self-blended bit, or sorry, that self-paced bit is an important part of facilitating that.
Speaker: How much commitment does that take per week for participants? Yeah, i mean, if you see it as a five-week undertaking, about three to four hours per week should do it.
Speaker: And then there are 13 hours. um How that splits is 13 hours of workshops and about six of self-paced learning. learning What are they going to learn when they take these?
Speaker: course Yeah, I mean, it is called the IS Practitioners Training. And so, you know, really importantly, it is about them being confident in applying the IS Rating Framework. but also gives really good instruction or at least an advice in how to engage stakeholders both within the organization you you know an organization and outside it, how to document materiality assessments and sustainability management plans, how to set up the base case, prepare submissions and respond to verification feedback.
Speaker: um And so I think... That's sort of what it's designed to do at its core, but actually what we're seeing, and and this is really building from what we've done in the past as well, and I think takes it a step further, is helping people to gain broader skills around critical thinking and inventing sustainability into decision making.
Speaker: We'll put a link for the register in the comments below this. That'll be good. yeah um Are there any other ISC courses or opportunities for ISAPs to further engage with or build on their accreditation?
Speaker: No, absolutely. So beyond the ISP professionals pathway, um we've got i mean open to all members and ISAP, so ongoing professional webinars, annual ISAP days, their working groups.
Speaker: You know, I've obviously touched on ah earlier some of our new member committees, which people might want to look at joining. And while that's not a training thing, As design, i think it's a great opportunity for many people for ongoing professional development.
Speaker: um We've got the RISE mentoring program and we'll be announcing our new sponsors and partners for RISE soon. um We're really grateful for to Gamuda who's sponsored RISE over the past few years.
Speaker: um and And again, we have had absolutely incredible feedback from both the mentees but also the mentors through that program. And then there are things like IAS for managers course, IAS for execs, and of course our industry conferences, which we always are keen see people at.
Speaker: So, I mean, all of these are designed deepen knowledge, strengthen networks. And from that ISAP perspective, give our ISAPs a platform to contribute both to their ongoing development and to the future of sustainable infrastructure.
Speaker: It'll be good to get that kind of training and knowledge moving forward. There's a lot happening in the industry. What do you see looking forward to the next five years? What is the exciting challenges and opportunities coming our way?
Speaker: So I think... um
Speaker: I'll kind of break it into a couple of parts and obviously ISC has ah a role in all of them. but So one is um within ISC and perhaps I'll finish on that point. But, you know, I'm really excited about, you know, we're going through a transition period. A lot of companies are struggling, particularly in Australia.
Speaker: um and for those impacted by European Union, corporate sustainability reporting directives and so on. So a lot of our users and members really struggling with the carbon piece now. and But it is a moment of transition and I think what we're going to start see in the next five years is really sophisticated work on decarbonisation really becoming mainstream in a way that we have never seen today.
Speaker: Perhaps in some ways even more energising will be really more sophisticated approach to nature-based solutions.
Speaker: um You know, infrastructure has
Speaker: Traditionally, um forward-looking infrastructure has been seen as how do we mitigate impact on the night environment. Whereas I think within the next five years, we're going to start to see particularly in the water sector, but beyond as well, how do we use natural infrastructure to achieve those outcomes that we want from our infrastructure.
Speaker: um That's going to be so critical to climate adaptation, to creating more livable places for people and obviously um for ah for for nature and the environment of which we are a part.
Speaker: One of the lines I sometimes use there in relation to this is that our traditional concrete, asphalt, grey infrastructure necessarily depreciates over time.
Speaker: And one of the beauties of natural infrastructure, it's not that it doesn't require maintenance, but it almost inevitably appreciates its value increases the longer that it is there.
Speaker: And I think that's a beautiful and wonderful opportunity. um And I think as well, when you start to put those two things together and as we look at work underway across Australia and New Zealand and well beyond, we may be getting close to that sort of third pillar of sustainability around the circular economy.
Speaker: no um We're so
Speaker: unadvanced in really in relation to circularity at the moment. we um mainly talk about recycling which is really not a circular economy the clue is in the name it is about a fundamental restructure of how we do business and how we run our economies to be more regenerative restorative etc and so i while i focused on the carbon and the ecosystem natural piece i do think circularity over the next five years will really come to the fore and those
Speaker: different elements are self-reinforcing as we get better in any one of them, um we will get better outcomes in in the other two. um And so obviously he has a a fundamental role for ISC in helping to set the frameworks that encourage those kind of behaviors and to help proponents and users the ratings as well as those outside who want to know what the impacts are to um monitor and achieve those outcomes.
Speaker: So I'm excited that along that all fits within our five-year strategy. I'm excited that over the next five years will be important part of of helping to achieve those outcomes and that to go right back to the beginning when you asked about it, then we will be providing insights and data to the market to support better decision-making, better policy outcomes.
Speaker: Well, I'm certainly looking forward to it. It looks like the ISC has a plan. It certainly does, and you're very much part of it, Seth. So I'm looking forward to hearing a five-year review led by you on this podcast, in well, clearly in five years.
Speaker: Well, I hope to have you back on the show before five years. Well, i hope that I'm invited. Thank you very much for being on, Toby. Nice one, Seth. Many thanks. Thanks. All the best.
Speaker: Thank you for listening to Infrastructure Connections. Please take a moment to follow us wherever you get your podcasts. And we want your feedback. Leave a comment down below to let us know your thoughts. Or drop us a line at the Infrastructure Sustainability Council.
Speaker: Until then, stay tuned for the next episode of Infrastructure Connection.
