Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Double Tap KC: How to Open a Virtual Reality Bar
53 Plays1 year ago
In a world where technology continuously blurs the line between the real and the virtual, the demand for virtual reality (VR) businesses is growing at an unreal rate. As the desire for immersive in-person experiences grows, entrepreneurs are seizing the opportunity to transform digital dreams into reality. So, fasten your VR headset and prepare to embark on a journey where the virtual becomes very, very real.
Learn More about Facility Ally:
https://facilityally.com/
Learn more about Double Tap KC:
Be sure to subscribe here, and follow our social channels for more content
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/yourfacilityally/
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@facilityally
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@facilityally
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/facilityally
Recommended
Transcript
Opening Double Tap KC: Concept and Challenges
00:00:00
Speaker
On this episode of the Facility Playbook, I got to sit down with Terry Keith of Double Tap Casey. This entertainment virtual reality bar lives in the heart of the riverfront in Kansas City, Missouri. And what I loved about this was he opened an amazing concept years and years later, realized that he needed to add food. And so he got to really talk about the challenges behind that, what he learned, what he failed at, and how he's been succeeding. Hope you enjoy this episode with Double Tap Casey.
Podcast Introduction and Industry Focus
00:00:29
Speaker
Do you own or manage a facility? Well, you are in the right place. Welcome to the Facility Playbook. I'm Luke Wade, founder and CEO of Facility Ally, and this podcast is about helping facility managers and owners learn from pioneers and veterans in the industry who have already built and managed successful sports facilities, entertainment venues, and clubs.
00:00:48
Speaker
Did you know that most of the facilities I just mentioned use between four and six different softwares to manage their reservations, memberships, leagues, lessons, camps, clinics, and more?
Terry Keith's Journey to VR Innovation
00:00:58
Speaker
Revolutionize your facility with Facility Ally's all-in-one system. Learn more at facilityallie.com. And today, we're at a really, really cool entertainment venue. I'm joined today by Terry Keith, owner and operator of Double Tap KC. Thank you so much for joining me today. Thank you, Brad.
00:01:12
Speaker
Tell us a little bit about how you got here. Tell us about your background and what led you to the point you're at today. Yeah, no, it's an interesting story, but I worked
00:01:24
Speaker
in and out of different, if you will, like restaurants, bars, things of that nature, you know, all through like high school and then into college as well. And then after I graduated college, I went to a company, if you're from Kansas City, most people know, but Cerner, it's now Oracle. I was there for about seven and a half years, so on the tech side of things. So I've always had like an
00:01:47
Speaker
niche, if you will, or a knack for technology to want to learn more about it. And Cerner kind of gave me that opportunity to really dive into it. And then I played virtual reality for the first time, and it just absolutely blew my mind. I'm like, how is nobody talking about this, man? Absolutely. It's just mind blowing to me that there's not more places around here. And so I played it, and then that was where the iterations of the concept started taking place. It was like,
00:02:12
Speaker
How can we make this a fun venue that multiple people can go to enjoy without breaking the bank, but still allow them to enjoy this new age tech, if you will. That's awesome. So a little bit combination of your background in the hospitality world, some technology, and then just pure enjoyment of virtual reality. So tell me what Double Tap KC is today.
Evolution and Customer Experience at Double Tap KC
00:02:32
Speaker
Yeah, it's obviously like from where we started back in June of 2020 to where we are today. It's kind of morphed into what our customer base is like really kind of told us they want us to be. But to break it down double tap is a virtual reality arcade and sports bar.
00:02:48
Speaker
So VR being the primary focus, you have your own private base. Think of like a Topgolf or a bowling alley where you have that space and you rent it by the hour with a group of people and split the cost. Same concept except we do with VR instead. So our smallest Bay is going to have two headsets. Our largest Bay has five headsets up to 15 people.
00:03:06
Speaker
We obviously have like a sports lounge where you enjoy your local sports or even, you know, any other sporting venue that were, excuse me, sport that you would like to watch, full bar, full kitchen as well. Class car case, we got a little bit of something for everybody. So I'm going to ask the question I think I asked you years ago when I first met you was, you know, why would I come in here and play this and not just use, you know, one of my VR headsets at home? What's the difference?
00:03:29
Speaker
Yeah, the biggest difference is the playing with your friends, because most people, even though they do have a VR headset at home, the space for more than one headset is the piece that really sets us apart. VR takes up a lot of space. At a minimum, if a standing room only is a 6x6 space, doesn't seem like a lot, but when you're talking your flailing, your arms, your swinging,
00:03:50
Speaker
You have more than one of those headsets in an area. It gets pretty dangerous, right? But then the other side of what makes Double Tap unique is the vibe. It's the atmosphere. So you can play the VR with your friends, get a drink, grab food, enjoy some great music at the same time. And it's a lot higher quality, right? Isn't there a lot more behind it as well? Sorry, yeah. No, you're good. It's a great question. I'm sure you talk about this every day. But for most people, they don't realize that you guys have this amazing VR quality and high-end stuff.
00:04:19
Speaker
Yeah, no, that's a great point. And it's from even when we talked, you know, several years ago to where it is today. I mean, it's ever changing, right? But these are PC powered headsets. So most people are familiar with the Oculus Quest or the MetaQuest 2. It's a wide headset. Everybody is familiar with that.
00:04:35
Speaker
You can plug those into a PC, but the difference of barrier of entry, that headset is around $300, $400 now. The headsets that we operate are $1,500, plus you have to buy the PC. So you're going to have a much higher resolution refresh rate. Overall, the graphics are better because it's powered by a PC graphics card. So you're talking $3,000 entry for a single headset. That's awesome. And so when you first played VR, did you immediately know you wanted to open a place, or why didn't you end up deciding, hey, I'm going to open a VR bar?
00:05:03
Speaker
Yeah, actually, the VR bar, it just happened, right? So my background or my degree was in entrepreneurship and business management. So I always knew that I wanted to be—I always had that entrepreneurial spirit, if you will, and I wanted to own a business. I just didn't know what.
00:05:20
Speaker
And I feel like as I get older and I'm more into this business, I definitely overcomplicate certain things. So that model of keep it simple is something that I'm learning the
Double Tap KC in the COVID Era
00:05:29
Speaker
hard way. But I always wanted to open a business. But when I played VR for the first time, that was where the wheels really started turning. And it became like, OK, I think we can make something of this. And so that's the different iterations came to be. And then we opened Double Tap in June of 2020.
00:05:44
Speaker
That's awesome. Not awesome that it opened in COVID. You want to talk a little bit about like how that was and what kind of the timeline obviously started planning it before the pandemic. So let me walk me through that story. When did you start planning it and then how did it end up opening in the pandemic?
00:05:57
Speaker
Yeah, so we started the planning. I played for the first time. I think it was like June of 2018 is when I played VR for the first time. And then just the planning started from there. So bought a headset, bought a PC, and just started like, OK, this is cool. This can work. But what can we do with it? That's not already been done. And that was where kind of the lane design came to be. But that was about 20 iterations before we landed on the current concept.
00:06:22
Speaker
But it was about two years of planning try to find a facility or excuse me a location that could house us for the minimum amount of square footage that we needed in the price point. I mean we're you know a small business and everything that I own was into this business so finding that location the square footage we need at the right price point you know that took
00:06:43
Speaker
a year in and of itself, putting the business plan together. I spent six plus months, if not more than that on that business plan. It was a 35-page document. I really went into it because with my life savings going into this, I didn't want to open a business I was going to sink all that money into and not feel like I had all the tools necessary and all the data at a minimum to start off successful. You never know if it's going to work, especially with a brand new concept.
00:07:08
Speaker
Yeah, it was about two years. And then January hit, we started construction because this was just an empty warehouse. There was nothing in it. There was a garage door where our front door currently is. And I just love the warehouse feel, but it was just a blank canvas. So we started construction in January of 2020. And then February, March was when COVID hit. Construction delays. And then we kept pushing through, but slowly but surely. And then June of that year
00:07:40
Speaker
It's amazing that you were able to push through all that and still open in June. Kudos to you and the business plan. I never did any of that and I wish I would. So I'm glad that you were able to start that way. And I think I heard about you right after that and we had met early on. And so, you know, one of the things, you know, I had the idea of is from the Casey Greuside was starting a league. And so you guys run leagues. Let's talk a little bit about your leagues and how they work because I know every time I tell somebody there's virtual reality leagues, they're like, what are you talking about? Yeah, even work. So maybe talk a little bit about the leagues.
00:08:05
Speaker
Yeah, no, and I'll be honest with you. I'm going to fully give this guy credit right here for it because you did reach out to me. It was like, hey, I thought about a league and, you know, starting a brand new business. My main thing was just like, man, we've got to get some some revenue in the door. It's the middle of the pandemic when people aren't allowed inside at first. When we first opened, I think we started our first league was August, September. It was the fall league is when we started with you guys.
00:08:30
Speaker
And so that really just kind of got the wheels turning and this is possible to do because I wasn't thinking about it at the time. It was like I was just thinking like people play VR as a group like our main core concept but then oh wait we could do something else to drive up some revenue and have people enjoy the VR but in a competitive space. I hadn't thought about that. So our leagues have morphed a little bit since then.
00:08:54
Speaker
We're currently in Apollo's of our leagues because we're revamping how we do that.
VR Leagues: Social and Competitive Enhancements
00:09:00
Speaker
But yeah, so I think we've done 11 or 12 seasons of our league and it's minimum 2v2 all the way up to a 4v4 league. It takes up obviously most of our headsets that we have in here.
00:09:12
Speaker
So we do it on a specific night where it's my lowest revenue night. Makes the most sense to have those people come in. Those headsets are in use, which is what we need, right? We want to make sure they're being in use about 6-7 days a week. So yeah, 2v2 or 4v4 league. What makes it hard in the VR space is.
00:09:29
Speaker
I there's only so many games that can support that number of headsets playing in the same game at the same time obviously since we've opened that's changed drastically like there's more developers pushing out content that can support large parties but when we started our league that wasn't the case I had like maybe two or three games that we can do that with
00:09:46
Speaker
So yeah, it's really just kind of changing advertising. And yeah, I mean, the league has been a great success, but we put a little bit of a pause on it right now to try and I always want to like make sure I'm offering a great experience for people. So that's why we're taking a little break. Sure. And I think what I always tell people is exactly what you said is leagues are gap fillers. And this is what KCU crew has done for years is like, give me your slowest night of the week and let me drive people on right like
00:10:09
Speaker
pick a slow night, offer a league, and that's going to essentially get people guaranteed coming in every week for whatever time you decide to run your league. And so that's exactly the point of them. And then the other thing I loved about it is like people are, you know, concepting is like you go to softball field and you play softball against another team virtual reality.
00:10:24
Speaker
you're doing the same thing. You're all coming in here, you're coming with your team of four, your team of two, and then we're all just playing in virtual reality against another team in another game that's also here. And so you get that cool experience of the socializing, drinking at the bar, hanging out, talking to your team, the other team, and then you go into virtual reality and you play a game, you're able to smack talk and do all that stuff in there. So it was one of my favorite things that we've ever created and been a part of. So I thought that was really, really cool.
00:10:47
Speaker
glad you were open to it because not everybody's always open to when I have these crazy ideas. People are like, no, that'll never work. Or like to your point, you could have said no, we only have two games to do that on. Right. But you were very open to that. And I thought it was one of the coolest things that I've been a part of. No, it was absolutely fantastic. I mean, and I think like I appreciate you coming because like as entrepreneurs, like we've always got to try and push that boundary right and drive in revenue. But
00:11:09
Speaker
For me, it taught me, it's like, okay, well, let's challenge the status quo. Let's push outside of what I even thought this place was possible,
Branding and Revenue Streams at Double Tap KC
00:11:19
Speaker
or VR. And so it really morphed into something beautiful just out of nowhere. So yeah, it was great, man. Where did the name Double Tap come from?
00:11:27
Speaker
Great question. I get that a lot, actually. Initially, so double tap, if you're a gamer at all, was, and now because of double tap zombie land, this was way after we were created, by the way. But yeah, obviously, you got to make sure that they're dead, right? So that was one side of it. The other side was we knew we were going to have a bar, so multiple beers on tap. Those two kind of played together, the gaming aspect with the bar side. Oh, that's cool. I didn't think I knew the bar side, but that's awesome.
00:11:55
Speaker
So then obviously you got a bar, you got virtuality. What are all the revenue generators or what are all the ways that you essentially drive revenue in this business? Yeah, no, so obviously the VR, the bar, the kitchen, and then we have memberships. So those three, those four, excuse me, right there are really how we're driving in revenue. There's always different revenue streams like during the pandemic, trying to get creative and drive in different streams of revenue when customers
00:12:19
Speaker
we're kind of skeptical of coming inside, especially trying something so new, because when we first opened, VR, although it's been around for years, man, it was still new to your average consumer. And so it was like, all right, what can we do differently? Well, during the pandemic, we did to-go VR. So you could rent a headset, take it home for three days, and then bring it back. We don't do that anymore. But yeah, that was cool. We were just trying to do anything and everything, because you had businesses that were doing to-go food,
00:12:47
Speaker
and drink were like, OK, well, I didn't have a kitchen at the time. Well, we could talk about that later. That came after we opened. But we were doing to-go drinks. Nobody was doing it because it usually pairs well with food. So it was like, what else can we do to go to drive in revenue? That was where the to-go VR came into play. So I didn't know that you did that either. That's awesome.
Food and VR: A Perfect Pairing?
00:13:05
Speaker
So when you were obviously researching and planning to build this, what are some of the things you learned from, I mean, were there other VR places that you kind of pulled ideas from, or did this all just come from you?
00:13:16
Speaker
Funny enough, yes, there was another local place here in Kansas City I played VR in. I mean, small businesses, we all work together one way or the other, right? So I played VR there for the first time, went there twice, I want to say, and then that was where I took that and was like, okay, that's cool, but, like, I have a large friend group.
00:13:36
Speaker
And we're always looking for something to do, which, you know, like the concepts that you've come up with or people that you work with, it's like, OK, well, these large groups, what can we do together? And that was where essentially the concept came to be, was I played that it was more one on one at a headset, but I wanted to kind of flip it on its head and make it more of a group based activity.
00:13:55
Speaker
So obviously now you're almost four years into your business, you know, three plus. There's other VR facilities that have opened around the country. What's something that makes Double Tap unique compared to some of these other facilities? Good question. Yeah, it's our lane design. There are other places. Well, two things, right? It's the lane design. So our smallest base two headsets up to six people in there and you're splitting that cost. So
00:14:19
Speaker
our cost point on a weekend, it becomes 10 bucks in person. That is palatable to your average consumer, especially in today's economy. That was number one. I didn't want to break the bank for your average consumer that wants to enjoy a high-tech experience as well as with our friend group. Then the other side was the bar. At the time that we opened,
00:14:39
Speaker
there was maybe two places in the country that did VR and alcohol. My brother was first, he's like, you're about to do virtual reality and you're going to have people drink and get drunk. And I was like, yep, sounds all right. Yep, absolutely. Yes, we are. And it's kind of weird how it works, to be honest with you, because if you're drinking, I'm...
00:14:57
Speaker
I've had some pretty intoxicated people jump in that headset and all of a sudden they sober up because the zombies are coming at you, that adrenaline kicks in and you're like, that person's just been drinking this whole time and now they look perfectly normal. Then they take the headset off and they start stumbling again. But yeah, so those are the two things that really, I think, kind of make us unique. So, bar, obviously, you started with a bar, like you mentioned, and the food came later. So maybe talk about how important, you know, in contrast, you have VR. Obviously, that's the main driver. How important are the food and beverage side of things for you guys?
00:15:27
Speaker
Yeah, it all works together, right? And that was the vision of the concept, right? Having all of that together in the same spot that everybody could enjoy. VR being first, and then the restaurant came about a year and a half after we opened. I mean, I mentioned already, my life savings was in this. I didn't have the money at the time to open a kitchen. So I was like, all right, well, let's get the place open. Let's proof the concept first with the VR and the drinking, and let's add the food. Well, now that we've added the food,
00:15:56
Speaker
People, especially if you've been drinking, playing, even if it's just finger foods, I want something to snack on. Otherwise they're gonna leave or they're gonna wanna bring something else in. So once we brought the kitchen on, we've seen a significant jump in sales because you're keeping your guest here a little bit longer. They'll get that second drink, that third drink versus before it was like, okay, we'll play VR for an hour, we'll grab a drink, now we need to go eat. So we've been able to kind of capture some of that revenue.
00:16:24
Speaker
But at the end of the day, we're also not a sit down restaurant. So for me over this past year and a half, it's really like not trying to compare us to full sit down restaurants because that's been the hardest part for me, but capturing those guests that are here when they're here, you know, really just allowing them to purchase food and drink when they're here.
00:16:44
Speaker
Yeah, and we talked a little bit about this before we started recording. In my opinion, it's leagues or gap fillers. Food are things that keep people here. So everybody's going to want to eat, especially if they've had too much to drink. They're like, hey, we need to go get something to eat. Well, the difference between them leaving and staying is you having food or something. Exactly.
00:17:00
Speaker
Which again, like you said, it just means more revenue keeping those dollars here instead of them going somewhere else. I know there's challenges around that, but I tell every facility like you need to decide to your point, right? You don't have to be this high end restaurant and offer the every menu and all these food and chef driven items, right? It can be burgers. It can be hot dogs. It can be.
00:17:17
Speaker
good food, again, just enough to keep them there to buy the next drink or stick around for more VR. And so I think it's really important for people to think about that. But it's also not super easy, even if you're keeping it low end. So you mentioned you had several issues with your kitchen, you know, getting that in. And so maybe talk a little bit about the challenges there and your workarounds that you end up finding.
00:17:35
Speaker
Yeah, so the kitchen in of itself is another business and I remember talking to a friend that well doesn't own any more of a bar K David at Marquet. He told me before I opened the kitchen. He said it will be your biggest headache and I said man get out of here like I've worked in restaurants before like no way right. It is by far my biggest headache.
00:17:54
Speaker
And a lot of it's staffing, right? But when we first opened too, and to my wife's credit, she's normally right if I'm being honest. Don't tell her I said that. But the menu was so big. I was trying to compete with those big sit-down restaurants, trying to get people to come in and eat here. Well, that wasn't the focus. The VR is the focus. So we started with a huge menu. My turnaround time was crap.
00:18:19
Speaker
quality of the product because we have such a small kitchen with a large mini, we were trying to do too much in that kitchen. So it's been a learning experience in that regard where we paired it down and now we just focus on a high quality burger, fries, you know, a couple other small menu items, really quick win items that is good. Because food is the first thing that people will leave a negative review out. I mean, if it's not quick, if it's not fresh, hot, like they're gonna go leave that review. So that's really been the biggest learning curve for me was like,
00:18:47
Speaker
be true to who you are, specialize in something, and understand your demographic, if you will, and what consumer base you're trying to capture. The other side, obviously, is the staffing. I mean, it's just been, it's hard to get a good kitchen help, so the staffing and then the menu, just kind of learning who we are and where those fit into our demographic is, I think, the biggest learning experience for me.
00:19:09
Speaker
So would you say if I'm a new facility or an existing facility similar to you where I'm thinking of adding a kitchen or thinking of adding food, would you still say yes? I would say yes, but just know it has your smallest margins. Obviously, your bar is going to be your biggest margin depending on your other offerings as well. It is at the end of the day a net positive, but you have to
00:19:33
Speaker
monitor that like a hawk, right? I mean, because with the margins being smaller there, the labor can kill you. Your food margins, if you have a lot of waste, do it. Just know your demographic, who you're trying to accomplish, or trying to pull in from there. And then, I mean, really get that menu hammer down. I mean, that's really the big and biggest thing I've learned. And if I were to do it again, I would
00:19:56
Speaker
go through that really thoroughly because I built the kitchen. Let's get it open, you know, and I rushed it. And anytime I've ever rushed anything in this business, it's always come back to bite me in the butt. And I've had to circle back and redo it. Negative reviews. OK, now why are we getting these reviews and just kind of circle back and fix it? Whereas I could have just done it right the first time.
00:20:14
Speaker
Thank you for sharing that insight. I appreciate that. And every business fails, every entrepreneur, every facility fails. And so learning from our failures is the number one thing. It sounds like you're moving in that direction, which is great. I hope so, man. Yeah. Same. So what kind of memberships, you mentioned memberships
Membership Perks and Customer Management
00:20:30
Speaker
earlier. What kind of memberships do you offer and what's included?
00:20:33
Speaker
Yeah, so we are redoing the memberships, right? We've had this same membership since we've opened, but it was eight hours of VR per month and it was, it's per headset, per person. So it was $99 a month. The reason I'm revamping it, that's a very,
00:20:49
Speaker
although people will pay that for a gym membership and things of that nature. In this space, it's kind of hard for some people to justify that because like, what am I getting from it? I mean, yeah, it's fun, but it's not like a gym membership where I can see my health getting better and feeling that differently. So we're kind of revamping that. But yeah, it's eight hours of VR for $100 a month. And that includes a discount on drinks and then a special members only drink menu.
00:21:12
Speaker
Okay, cool. What's the special members only drink menu? Can you tell us because we're not members? No, I mean, you just can't purchase it, right? Yeah, there's like eight different drinks on there. One of them is a different iteration of our number one drink was which was the double tap that ass. You can blur that part out. But yeah, so it's a different flip on it. So yeah, we've got your old fashions and just different iterations of the drink menu that aren't all the ones that are conserved.
00:21:36
Speaker
That's so I don't think I've ever heard anybody offer a different drink menu as a membership. That's really cool. How did you come up with that? I was interesting enough. This was a couple years ago, but I went to a place that cut my hair. It was right before my one of my really good friends, his wedding. And so they had a bar in there, which I thought was kind of cool, too. I was like, I can have a drink and get my hair cut. And then I had she handed me the wrong menu. I'd already been looking at it for about five minutes at this point. She come back and I was like, I want this. Oh, sorry. That's our members only menu. I was like.
00:22:06
Speaker
That's kind of interesting, and I really like it. So that was kind of where it came from. And yeah, I mean, he said, beep, beep, beep. Haircut. That's awesome. I love it. I love it. That's a great. Never would have thought you would have taken that idea from a barbershop. I never thought they would have had a bar, though. That's why we went in the first place. I was like, I can get my haircut and grab a drink at the same time. That was great. That's awesome.
00:22:26
Speaker
That's so funny. So with the limited space that you have, obviously most of us taken up by the VR and the lanes, do you have issues with overcrowding and people waiting in line or how do you manage those sort of things? That's why hopefully at some point for those that are watching this, you get a chance to kind of see high level of the facility. We learned as we went because
00:22:47
Speaker
When we first opened, it was VR focus. I mean, we opened bare bonds, man. I mean, we just had the basics in here. I didn't have the lounge space. I did have all these high top tables for people to sit. That overcrowding came there because I didn't have a place for people to sit and wait for their turn.
00:23:04
Speaker
as or after the VR experience, where can I sit and chill? Because the people did want to stay. They really enjoyed the vibe. So I don't have a problem with that now, but we did in the beginning. And so that was part of the learning experience was after they were done, people were like, I really want to stay and I want to chill.
00:23:21
Speaker
This used to be a lane right here. We got rid of that. And this is now our lounge space. And then now, you know, with this year, we just added the patio that was we had nothing out there. So we built the patio out there. And it allows people just kind of hang out a little bit longer. Yep, people love that patio for sure. It's and you did a good job with it looks really, really nice. So back to the bar a little bit, you run specials every day, and talk a little bit about, you know, how you decide to run these specials when you run them, you know, and why you run them every day.
00:23:48
Speaker
Yeah, there's a couple different, like, it depends on who you talk to as far as, you know, the restaurant bar side of things. I guess maybe really any industry, but me being in this industry, depending on who you talk to, it's such a different ways of thinking. For me, some people will tell you, don't run any specials, especially on your core product, because it devalues that product.
00:24:08
Speaker
And I understand that, but I have my slow period. So for me, it's like, okay, when is our peak times? When is not? That's when I decided to run my specials. Um, so a lot of it is, you know, the happy hour timeframe like that, we don't open till four during the weekday. So that four to seven and then seven o'clock on that's when people are done eating, they're getting out and about.
00:24:28
Speaker
And so that allows them to come in, and I'm not discounting that product at that point. We do, other than the specials, we run events, right? So trivia, music bingo, things of that nature to pull people in. And we'll maybe do like a dollar off of a craft cocktail or something like that. But something that's not going to kill my margins, but also allows like, oh, they got these specials and this event. It pulls people in together to kind of fill in those low periods. Do you run specials on the VR as well? I only run it during happy hour.
00:24:57
Speaker
So I'm really trying to capture that, you know, you're getting off of work, especially now that people are back in the office. When people weren't in the office, it failed. It did not work because they're working from home. I'm already working from home. I'm not going to get dressed up or put clothes. I hope you weren't close, but you know what I mean? Like I'm not going to get ready to go out, especially when I'm already weary about going out. So that was when it wasn't working. But now, you know, we run that special during happy hour only, and then it's our normal prices from there on out.
00:25:25
Speaker
And so that makes sense. You're kind of pairing the drink and the VR specials together at your slow times to try and drive more people in.
Adapting to Customer Feedback and Business Evolution
00:25:33
Speaker
And you said it seemed to be working now that people are off work coming in for those happy hours. It's better. I mean, I'm and I think most entrepreneurs will say that we're never satisfied with where we are. It has definitely helped. We still have a ways to go.
00:25:46
Speaker
Right. So a lot of that's marketing. So really getting it out in front of the right audiences and there's so many different forums and ways that you can advertise your business. You don't know which one works but you just got to keep swinging for the fence. Yeah. Throw it out there. Try it. See what happens and and try it again. Right. And I think what you said earlier is.
00:26:01
Speaker
It's become what your customers wanted to become. And I can relate to that so much with Casey Krewis. We get feedback every week from our people, and we try and literally just listen to the customers and give them what they want. Right. And so I think it's a testament to you want your customers to be happy. So you're modifying your business to us and to give it to them away, but also meet your brand, which is awesome. I love that. It's really funny. I'll just throw this in there, because I was on another podcast last week, and we talked about it.
00:26:26
Speaker
We'll have this as one of the questions. Hopefully we'll get to, but I looked at my business plan for the first time in three years from when I first wrote it and I'm currently going through revisions of it and the vision that I had of double tap then and what it is today is completely different.
00:26:40
Speaker
Um, and I do, it was just fascinating to what I envision this business being where we are today. It's completely different. And that is because we listened to our customer base, allow them to like, what are you want from this experience when you come here? Like, so yeah, and it, it, it's helped me grow. So I do encourage everybody. If you wrote a business plan, go back and look at it every, every few years.
00:27:01
Speaker
Yeah, the opposite for me, where I just started a softball league for some friends and didn't think it was going to be a business, and then it became one. I was like, ah, crap, what am I doing? This works. Yeah, so I'm like, should have had a business plan, but didn't think it was going to be a business. So obviously, this is very tech driven. So how do you stay on top of all the new technology for VR and all the computers and everything you have to deal with? What are some of the ways you stay on top of that?
00:27:20
Speaker
This is kind of a double-edged sword for me if I'm being quite honest with you because I think as most people know tech changes I mean you will buy something six months later it's outdated so it can be something where it sends you down a rabbit hole and you're constantly just trying to be innovative on the leading edge if you will but your average consumer can't afford that anyways and on top of that a lot of times the developers even though the hardware has been updated the software isn't there to back it
00:27:49
Speaker
So I read forums, I obviously follow a lot of different YouTube channels as far as like CES out there in Vegas. You know, they're always talking about the latest tech coming out. So I try to stay up to date, but also understand, all right, where's my budget? Is this something that fits in with our model? Mostly I focus on the VR side, because that's the core part of the business, right? Where does that fit in our model? Can we afford to upgrade? Does it make sense? Is the software, is the games there to back that hardware?
00:28:17
Speaker
So that's kind of how I say up to date and then make the decisions from there. We have a new experience I'll show you here in a minute, but is it time to release that into it? Yeah, I can see. I just saw it. I didn't notice it earlier. That looks awesome. We'll definitely have to show that. Maybe that'll be something we do at the end. But you also mentioned events, which I'm an events guy. So you've talked about trivia. You talked about a couple of things on the public events. So how important are public events compared to private events for
Events and Corporate Engagement
00:28:43
Speaker
you?
00:28:43
Speaker
I mean, they both work hand in hand, right? The private events, a lot of that is your corporations, team outings, not corporations, but just team outings and team building exercises. Those are huge for a business like us. I mean, really any entertainment business, right? So your top golfs, your main events, you know, the double taps of the world. Those are huge for us because
00:29:04
Speaker
One, it serves a purpose that keeps the business afloat. You're hopefully driving in revenue during your slow times, but also it allows you to get your name out there and then those businesses to bring their team in. I mean, especially with this, VR is, it can be what you make it.
00:29:20
Speaker
If you follow along with it, which I'm sure you have, there's so many use cases in it. It's being used in corporations for collaborations and all the way to the entertainment side of things. So, you know, it allows that team building exercise or that collaboration amongst companies. And so that's huge for us. The public side, that's where the trivia's or those things, you know, really getting those people out. Because like for me, if I'm not at work,
00:29:44
Speaker
And I've been working from home all day. Man, I just want to sit down. I don't want to go out, but so to me those are important, because it it for not forces, but it hopefully encourages people to come out and try something new. Get together with a friend group and just have a couple drinks and don't sit at home Monday through Friday, because everybody knows in the bar restaurant. It's Friday, Saturday, Sunday. That's when a lot of the money is made. So your Monday through Thursday.
00:30:06
Speaker
are your slow seat, your slow periods. And so it kind of helps get people out of the house. Sure. And I are you using corporate events to kind of you mentioned this earlier to kind of fill your slow periods. Do you offer them before you open? I know you mentioned I open at four o'clock. So do you push most of your corporate events to those off peak times or do you allow them to book some of your times that are open to the public?
00:30:24
Speaker
Yeah, so it depends on the size of the group, right? I mean, because we have to work within our capacity, something we get. Yes, I'm right. We have 150 plus people. I'm like, we can't handle that comfortably. So it depends on the size of the group. But yeah, we do both.
00:30:39
Speaker
Um, if they want to do, if there was a hundred people, yeah, we're going to, a lot of them, they're coming in from at noon because we don't have until four, they'll be here during that time period. Then we get the place ready. Then we're open to the public. Um, if it's, we have a space upstairs as well, which I think hopefully you guys got some B roll of that. That space can be rented for birthday parties, corporate events, and that space can seat around 40 to 50 people. And that can be done during our regular business hours to where we're still open downstairs, but they have a private space up there as well. So I know we mentioned, and that's awesome. I think corporate events in my opinion are,
00:31:09
Speaker
you know, the challenge is like, it's a huge win, right? Company comes in and said, I'm going to give you all the money up front. We're going to bring a bunch of people in who probably have never seen you before. And it's coming in a time when you're not open. So it's a huge win. But the trouble is when they try and take a Friday night or a Saturday or the times that you're really, really busy. So how do you decide on whether you do that or do you not allow that at all?
00:31:29
Speaker
Obviously, in the middle of COVID, we took every dollar possible just to keep the doors open. But as we grow, the business gets busier. I make the decision based off the revenue because I have historical numbers now, but I typically don't.
00:31:46
Speaker
It depends on the size, but yeah, if it's a Friday, Saturday night like a lot of times man, they've been flexible to be quite honest with you. They really do work with us pretty well and it's like hey, I can't do that on a Friday night or you're going to have to run out the entire facility and if they have the money they want to work out, I'm not going to say no. There have been a couple times where they do that, but for the most part we really don't have much of an issue with that when anytime people are requesting to run out the place.
00:32:09
Speaker
That's great. And yeah, it's always that balance of like, you know, business or like, you know, how do I make sure you know, it's like, all right, if you're gonna pay me more money than I normally make, that's great for the business. But is it turning away my customers who rely on me to come in and they're looking forward to coming in. So one of those things is like, as a business, everybody makes that decision differently.
00:32:26
Speaker
And I mean, you're fighting with yourself, right? Cause you're, you're looking at the numbers, but you're like, what's the detriment to the business? If I'm going to close my doors to the public and you know, it's a Saturday, it's a Friday night. Like I can't do that when people are starting to come in there. They expect me to be open. Even if you post it on your socials.
00:32:43
Speaker
You have people that are out of town. They're like, hey, let's go check this place. It seems cool. Oh, we're closed. It is a very tough decision. Yeah, I feel most customers you can only get away with that one or two times and they're probably not coming back. Yeah, so yeah, difficult decision there. What's one solution you've implemented that you've been most proud of?
Operational Efficiency and Marketing Strategies
00:33:01
Speaker
Oh, there's been a couple. I mean, I think
00:33:04
Speaker
For me personally, it's been the instructional video. Because when we first opened, it was my wife, myself, one other person. She would be bartending. I would be running the VR, vice versa. By the end of the weekend.
00:33:19
Speaker
So when people, they come in, they check in, we take them out of their lane, we were giving instructional videos. I was doing that verbally. And by Sunday night, I was hoarse. I had no voice whatsoever. So it was record, you know, that same, because I would say the same thing over and over. And it just hit me one day. I'm like, why don't I just record this, put it on a video?
00:33:39
Speaker
hit the play button, come back when it's done. So ever since we've done that, it's allowed us to get more lanes started at the same time. Turnover has been much higher, faster. It's the same speech, so now I'm not reliant on my game host to give that speech, miss something, something gets broken because we didn't hit on it. So for me, I think that's been the biggest win. There's always been other little solutions that we've implemented, but that's been the biggest win.
00:34:01
Speaker
I love that is the next step is like doing it in VR so they watch it in the headset. That would be you and VR. Absolutely. And that's it's close. The software allows us to put video or not video, excuse me, we can put ads and stuff within the launcher platform, not videos at this point. But the new headsets that we're implementing on that experience, I was telling you, you actually can do that. That would be really cool. So I know we talked about a couple of things. But if you had to start all over today, you know, what's one thing you do differently?
00:34:30
Speaker
Man, for me, I think SOPs, just getting those standard operating procedures lined out, that's a double-edged sword, right? Because essentially if it's a new concept, which we are or we were at the time, it was like, you don't know what your SOPs need to be, right? But if I were to take this and do other, you know, locations,
00:34:52
Speaker
getting those SOPs lined out, training, that's another one too. Making sure before you open those doors to the public, your staff's trained, they know your SOPs. And then the third thing for me would be marketing. We did marketing, but you don't know what you don't know, right? Like, and so if I could do it all over again, hitting those different forms of marketing, realizing that you don't have to spend an arm and a leg on paid advertisements, you know, some of your gorilla, your grassroots marketing, like those are successful. For me, it was just, I just put
00:35:20
Speaker
Stupid amounts of money into paid advertising and it really kind of hurt the business a lot up front So those are some things I would change if I didn't do it again. Those are thank you for that list That's great. And so I can totally relate to all that So it took me about eight years to figure that I'm glad you figured it out quicker But we just had two new employees start this week and literally all they did was sit in trainings for three days That we've created and now after three days, they're able to essentially start working
00:35:43
Speaker
and it used to be me sitting next to them for eight hours a day for probably two weeks explaining, saying it differently, oh, I didn't ever teach you that. It was a completely crazy nightmare. But to your point, I struggled with for years of, well, if I create this SOP and it changes next week, that got to go update my SOP. It makes no sense. And so internally, I was always battling, don't create it. I'm going to change it anyway. But now I'm like, no, create it. And then just update it. It takes maybe 10 minutes to update it. And that way, you have this system that everybody can go look at. They're operating the same way efficiently. So I would 100% agree.
00:36:13
Speaker
write an SOP just like you wrote a business plan it's changed a lot but essentially update it try and stick to it the best possible and then training like you said video most of our training is all video training because to your point now it's not relying on my time or your time or whoever's time it takes to train them they just sit and exorbitate their own time and their own
00:36:28
Speaker
their own pace and then they can do a little challenge, a little quiz. That's one of the things we implemented is everybody learns differently. So we have it, we have it in video, we have it written, and then we have a task for them to do afterwards so they can actually go do the action too. And so that's been a huge game changer of like, they fully understand it and they didn't need any of my help. So that's, to me, I've been really excited about seeing that lately. So I'll definitely echo those. To your marketing side, what's been the, like you mentioned a bunch of things, but what's the number one thing you feel like your marketing today has been helpful? Like the number one thing that's helped you?
00:36:57
Speaker
I mean, obviously social media, right? So Instagram, Facebook. I mean, for those that aren't, I mean, I hate to say this, but if you follow Gary Vee, my God, he hits on it a lot, right? But I mean, the tech or sorry, the social media platforms we have in day, if you're not on it, you are missing out.
00:37:14
Speaker
So those have been the most successful, but it's also a double-edged sword as well it's like you got to be careful about how much money you're putting into those paid ads and Keeping an eye on like you're gonna see the numbers. You know, what are the conversion rates? What are your clicks your views? You know average time like that's all great. It's giving you numbers, but that doesn't mean it's leading into dollars like gained for the business So for me, we've also experienced other different avenues, right? So radio Billboards. Oh my god, like we
00:37:44
Speaker
I've tried a lot of different ones and be careful there because it's there's some cases where I've overspent and it's almost I've spent months recovering about how much I spent on that it was a hard lesson learned but yeah I mean it put us in a really tight financial situation for those months so yeah it's a balance man I social media for sure get on those understanding organic too there's a lot of groups and stuff that you can be a part of to post into that get a lot of eyes but
00:38:12
Speaker
It just takes my time, you know, create a flyer, post it in there. I don't need to put a paid ad behind it. So I think that's kind of been the biggest learning curve for me. Yeah, I think to your point, there's so many options out there. And I'd love your thoughts on this. But I think bang for buck, it's 100% social media, like spending dollars for advertising and actually knowing what happened to it is social media. Because to you, I feel like I forget every year. And I'm like, let's try a billboard, let's try a TV or whatever, right? And then it's like, how many people saw it? Yeah, how many people clicked on it? How many people land on it?
00:38:40
Speaker
there's no way to track it. And it seems way more expensive than me running these ads. And so my opinion, I think it's the level of business that you're at, depending on where you put your dollars. A great small startup. I think everybody should be using social media. But once you're to a point where you just want extra exposure, you want name recognition, billboards, TV, radio. So I think it's a level thing for me. And I'd love your thoughts.
00:38:58
Speaker
No, no, that actually makes the most sense, and I never thought about it that way, but that's something I had to learn the hard way. Because you're going to get, especially the longer you're in business, the more that name gets out there, that's when those ad agencies are going to start to approach you. I mean, I get approached weekly, hey, you want to put a flyer in here for Lowe's Hotel, or hey, we've got these billboards, radio, man, that's the way to go. I promise you, we're getting this amount of users. We did, for example, we did six months of radio advertising on a sports radio network.
00:39:27
Speaker
And we put a coupon code in that radio ad that they could use online or in person. It was used zero times. And zero. And I spent thousands of dollars on that radio ad. It is a level thing. Now, granted, just because they don't use it doesn't mean it wasn't a net positive for your business because that name's out there. I mean, people have to hear or see something an average of three to five times before they would ever even think about going to act on or seeing your business.
00:39:56
Speaker
I love that. Yeah, leveling up makes so much sense. It was something that I've just had to learn the hard way these past two years. Same. Like I said, I forget. I feel like every year and try something new. And I'm like, well, that didn't work. But hey, you don't know until you try, right? I've got to try it. So what's the next three years look like for Double Tap
Future Expansion Plans for Double Tap KC
00:40:11
Speaker
KC?
00:40:11
Speaker
Great question. Yeah, we're currently like I said, the reason I had to go revisit that business plan is because we're working on expansion. You know, during our pink season, we do fill the base, which is fantastic. But I'm at capacity at that point, right? So I really have that's when it becomes limited throughput, because I mean, I only have so many base available. So we're working on expansion upstairs, different VR experiences, because right now, our main experience is the group based kind of like arcade multiple games you could play together.
00:40:39
Speaker
The big thing right now is free room. That's what everybody wants to get into. So we'll have a free room space up there, a full kitchen, because this one's it does the job, but something that could feed that, you know, 300 plus people in the restaurant, a couple of the different experiences will wrap around bar. That is within the, I'd say the next 12 to 15 or 18 months. And then hopefully from there, we're going to start opening second third location.
00:41:02
Speaker
awesome well thank you so much for doing what you do i love having i love it when people create these really cool experiences for people it's not easy um so thank you for doing that and thank you so much for being here on the facility playbook we'll see you next time yeah throwing axes at you that's right