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The Business Behind Restomods with Assyl Yacine #3
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This week, Anwar and I have managed to convince someone to come talk to us. We dive in deep into the restomod industry, with Assyl Yacine, the GCC agent for Kalmar Automotive and Giamaro Automobili.
- What's caused the surge in interest in restomods?
- What does the market look like in the Middle East?
- Are these "improved" versions of older cars actually any good?
- Who is Assyl Yacine, and why is he so cool?
Find out more about Assyl here:
Instagram: speedbird.cars
If you've got feedback, we'd love to hear it. We didn't have these ready for the episode, but you can reach us at:
Gulf.specgcc@gmail.com
https://www.instagram.com/gulf_spec_podcast/
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Transcript
Introduction and Guest Introduction
00:00:01
Mohammad Khan
Welcome everyone to episode three of the Gulf spec podcast. We've made it to three episodes, which means hopefully by the end of it, we'll have 15 listeners. um
00:00:11
AssMan
Thank you.
00:00:12
Mohammad Khan
Or it'll be it'll have been listened to 15 times. um
00:00:15
Anwar
Well, we keep having the listeners on as guests because then there's no one to listen to them if they're only guests.
00:00:22
Mohammad Khan
So I'm your host, Mo, and Anwar is with me as always. And what we did is we were running out of ideas, so we decided we should just start bringing our guests on.
00:00:33
Anwar
It was a...
00:00:33
Mohammad Khan
Oh, sorry, our listeners on. And um if you don't know him, this is Asil Yassin, who is huge and who is huge in the UAE car community and the car community at large actually.
00:00:46
Mohammad Khan
So there's a good chance you'll have heard of him and he has been a big supporter of our podcast. And um before we get into why specifically we've brought Asil on today, other than we ran out of ideas, um was Asil, why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself?
00:01:03
Mohammad Khan
Who are you? Where did you come from?
Guest Background and Passion
00:01:07
AssMan
I'm ah everyone's third favorite Algerian car YouTuber. I drive and sell other people's cars and I have a ah passion for post-war European classic sports cars and I've been um in the the collector car trade industry for just over a decade and I represent a few companies here in the the GCC, the Gulf states.
00:01:11
Mohammad Khan
over time.
00:01:30
Anwar
And Mr. Asil, if you don't mind coming a bit closer, I think you were much louder before. I feel like now we've started recording, yeah the energy's gone. We need some of that real, everyone knows you.
00:01:39
AssMan
ah After that introduction that Mo gave, I got so shy.
00:01:45
Anwar
Yeah, literally, we can sit big on the recording, we can see the wavelength and Asil just went, oh, actually, someone's taking me seriously. when And you are a serious man.
00:01:51
AssMan
but but
00:01:53
Anwar
Actually, I think what's interesting about Asil is he's one of the most giving people.
00:01:57
Mohammad Khan
purchase
00:01:58
Anwar
Hmm?
00:01:59
Mohammad Khan
What's interesting about Isil is that he's wearing the same shirt as you.
00:02:02
Anwar
I didn't want to mention it. want to just like see if we can continue and just like leave it. It's like the elephant in the room, but yeah.
00:02:07
Mohammad Khan
Let me just plug um Spectrum, which is like when ah another friend, car friends, without...
00:02:14
Anwar
Who's going to be on podcast at some point?
00:02:15
Mohammad Khan
Yeah, anyway.
00:02:17
Anwar
Hmm.
00:02:18
Mohammad Khan
We'll have to talk to him later as well.
00:02:18
AssMan
great to run yeah i mean kind of thinking
00:02:19
Mohammad Khan
but
00:02:20
Anwar
What I wanted to add as well was that a really interesting thing ah I've always thought about Asil and I've met Asil through the classic car world and we've we've tried to work together. I've tried to con you into doing business with the agencies that me and Mo are at and you made the wise decision.
00:02:34
Mohammad Khan
Together, if you remember, we went in with the PowerPoint presentation of the SEAL.
00:02:34
Anwar
no
00:02:38
Mohammad Khan
Please spend your money with us.
00:02:40
Anwar
Pretty true. But what is interesting, I think, about Asil is you have been one of the biggest ah introducers of the classic world to me. And some experience that I've managed to have through you as well of classic cars. I think basically all of the interesting classic cars I've driven almost have been through an interaction I've had with either basically you or Freddie.
00:03:03
Anwar
And that for me feels like something I've always valued from you, Asil, that you you are more than just me and Mo to certain degree of armchair enthusiasts, let's call it, or maybe you know business people.
00:03:16
Anwar
You are a person who's experienced a lot of these, as you've said, um post-war collector cars and have a very um finely tuned opinion um on them.
00:03:29
Anwar
And I think, Mo, do you want to introduce the first topic or shall I? Because I don't want to keep
Resto-modding and Nostalgia Trends
00:03:35
Mohammad Khan
I think, yeah, I think one of the things is, Asil, you said you represent some of the, ah so a couple of companies here in the Middle East.
00:03:35
Anwar
babbling.
00:03:35
Anwar
ah Yeah.
00:03:45
Mohammad Khan
One of them is Kalmar. Is that the correct pronunciation? um
00:03:50
AssMan
Yeah. yeah
00:03:50
Mohammad Khan
And I think that's particularly interesting because what we want to talk about today is the resto modding space in general. Resto mods or modernism, or even beyond that, because I think ah the line gets a little fuzzy sometimes.
00:04:05
Mohammad Khan
Sometimes it's modern recreations of... um previous cars, not necessarily Restomods. But I think this is part of a larger movement. And i you know've I've been sitting there watching videos on YouTube for about Restomods for the last week because i I frankly don't know as much about them as you and Anwar will.
00:04:25
Mohammad Khan
But um I think this is part of this entire, we're seeing this movement overall. It's not just cars. This is your soda cans. This is your shoes, fashion trends. This is pretty much everywhere you can you can look, the people are reaching back, they're getting nostalgic.
00:04:42
AssMan
right.
00:04:45
Mohammad Khan
And this is, you know, partly a I guess a product of some of the uncertain times that we live in right now. They're, they're reaching for comfort to a certain extent. Anwar, I think you were putting your hand up.
00:04:58
Anwar
What we're talking about, as I think, if I could put it in a sentence, is the rise of retro, and especially with cards.
00:05:02
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
00:05:03
Anwar
um And I'm going to give examples of what we mean, just in case people don't know, because i there are some people who might not know what we mean by these WrestleMods and like the Kalmar.
00:05:05
Mohammad Khan
And I've seen, you know, I'm sorry.
00:05:14
Mohammad Khan
oh Well, I think there's a simple, really simple entry point for this. And I think it started the modern or the current wave of RestoMod or reimagination, if that's what you want to call it.
00:05:20
AssMan
All right.
00:05:25
Mohammad Khan
That's certainly what they call it. But I think Singer popularized what we're seeing now. um I think they they were the ones that went there. They did it at a certain level. And they they taught the entire market that...
00:05:38
Mohammad Khan
there was money to be made here. I think that was one of the most important things. I mean, we saw Porsche putting out sport, I think personally, and Alex, maybe you're better informed about this, but cars like the 911 Sport Classic and then the even the 911 R are kind of, they are Porsche trying to get a piece of that market with their more modern vehicles, you know?
00:05:58
Mohammad Khan
um
00:05:58
Anwar
just
00:05:59
Mohammad Khan
but Yeah.
00:06:01
AssMan
the
00:06:01
Mohammad Khan
Asil, please.
00:06:03
AssMan
I mean, Singer, like you said, were by no means the first, but they definitely popularized it. You had companies and you still have companies like Mechatronic, for example, who Restomod, W111, Mercedes, and Pagodas as well by horseshoeing or or shoehorning an AMG V8 from the ninety s into them.
00:06:08
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
00:06:20
AssMan
They've been doing that for a while longer, some Jag companies as well.
00:06:23
Mohammad Khan
Well, even older than that, like, you know, I recall um that when you had, I was briefly, briefly in high school, I was into muscle cars and hot rodding a lot. um I picked up the magazines and I'd see like converted Chevy Nomads and 69 Camaros, all numbers matching, of course, you know, but then there was also a big resto mod part of that. And I feel like that was, that was really big in the American car scene for a long time.
00:06:51
Mohammad Khan
But i think it's Singer that put it elevated it to where it is now or at least popularized that version of it where you've got ah you've got I mean like let's let's let's get right into it I mean quail the quail is happening now it happened a couple days ago sorry like and we just everything was a resto mod everything And this is and I think this is where I want to take the show a little bit. And under where I think you'll agree is that this is what what is happening with the automotive industry right now. This is the automotive industry right right now is that everything is going like whether you're looking in the mainstream um and you look at something like the Renault 5 electric um or you look at something like Gordon Murray basically remaking the McLaren F1 in a way with the S1.
00:07:38
Mohammad Khan
there There's so much, and i understand those are not strictly resto mods, um but yeah.
00:07:44
Anwar
Retro cars, I feel like, yeah, retro is the trend.
00:07:45
Mohammad Khan
yeah
00:07:48
Anwar
um And I wanted to interject just about a good case study and maybe, like you said, the jumping off point. There was more than one car that Gordon Murray showed off, right? had two cars right beside each other. One, a modern, more modern look And won a very clear um aping or um tribute to the GTRLM.
00:08:09
Anwar
And what's interesting is the, and I think we all live in the same social media bubble, everyone was talking about only one car and the second car. and And I think it's a stunning car, the front, the back, every had almost no attention on it.
00:08:22
Anwar
Lexus had a different concept card to show that no one could care less. All of the energy is you're saying, and I think you made a good point of saying it's not just in cars, but maybe it links to a larger point at the moment we get into it is in looking back and not looking forward.
00:08:39
Anwar
And the interesting thing with having a seal on here is I would, i think you may have a unique opportunity to inform both of us and the the other three listeners who aren't you and everyone else, um,
00:08:52
Anwar
why what the feeling behind the companies who made these cars is, or and the customers who decide to buy this instead of a modern car.
00:09:03
Anwar
So I think, again, sorry if it's okay, Mo, I think we've been blabbering quite a while.
00:09:04
AssMan
read it.
00:09:07
Anwar
I'd like to hear from those two perspectives of talking to the makers of the cars and the buyers of those cars, how they feel about it.
00:09:15
AssMan
Well, there's a lot to dissect there as well. To to touch on most points, ah just just to go back on um Singer, yes, they they popularized it, but also they were the first ones to to to do these rest models with such an incredible attention to detail.
00:09:28
AssMan
So they knew what sold because your average Singer client is probably obsessed with watches and loves attention to detail and little things that click and feel nice in the same way T50 buttons do, right? um I'd also argue that American hot rodding was probably the first rest model.
00:09:44
AssMan
i think i think I think that's safe to say. You're taking a 32 Ford or whatever and you're you know you're you're putting a 351 Cleveland in it, a V8 in it.
00:09:51
Mohammad Khan
Thank you.
00:09:53
AssMan
So to Anwar's question of of ah the motive behind the companies, I mean the motive behind the companies is simple. they They're car guys and they want to make some money, right? um And they find a ah gap in the market.
00:10:06
AssMan
One could argue that the Porsche Restomod world is oversaturated. you know ah What I love about Kalmar Porsche, which is a a Danish company which bases their back dates on 993s, is the attention to detail in terms of the engineering, the technology. The first brake caliper I saw in my life that was beautiful was done by them.
00:10:27
AssMan
So you've got elements of this attention to detail that Singer has introduced to to the market, but then also the engineering
Engineering and Appeal of RestoMods
00:10:34
AssMan
behind them and reliability behind them. is insane. um The motive behind buying RestoMods, my clientele, I recently so i sold a RestoMod in July actually, which will be ready in 20 months.
00:10:47
AssMan
um But it's because, well, I don't want to be stranded on the the side of the road with my dodgy weird 1970s fuel-injected Mercedes that's very finicky that even the Mercedes dealer over here can't really work on or maintain. I want something that starts every time, remote lock.
00:11:05
AssMan
um when you When you open the door, but exactly like a modern car, the window creeps down by half a centimeter before the door opens, you know. um and so it's that usability. I mean, there's ah one of the showrooms I worked at previously, we had mechatronic, the Mercedes Pagoda that I was mentioning to you.
00:11:24
AssMan
And we had it registered. And that was my go-to car for events because I knew it wasn't going to give any problems. It is a classic, but it's an absolute joy to drive. And I mean, an absolute joy to drive. And that's why these companies charge a premium is because, you know,
00:11:39
AssMan
you you know there's There's one chap over here in Dubai who has tried to make his own sort of Restomod Mercedes. um and to Hats off to him. He's done it. I haven't driven the car.
00:11:50
AssMan
Great guy as well. ah But it doesn't look right. And it looks like it's been played with. You know you can tell. The bigger wheels to accommodate larger discs or whatever. um One dark horse of the Restomod industry is Thornley Kellum.
00:12:05
AssMan
ah the guys in the UK who were made famous, I think, by Henry Catchpole on YouTube the for the Lancia Aurelia that they did.
00:12:15
Anwar
oh the muscle car one with the low roof yeah
00:12:15
AssMan
and Exactly. And a client my is a client of mine is a sport.
00:12:19
Mohammad Khan
I have no idea what you guys are talking about.
00:12:22
Anwar
i'll find it mo ah while you're talking asil and just tell everyone else mo i'll find it to you and send it to you yep
00:12:28
AssMan
A client of mine has bought three cars from them. He he can't help it because the quality of workmanship the ah The attention to detail that takes place, the thousands of hours in creating these aluminium bodies.
00:12:39
AssMan
I mean, you know they've also done ah an XK120. They're doing Porsche 356s, and they've just taken on, probably can't say this, but there's seven people listening. I think it's fine.
00:12:50
AssMan
They're also working on doing a mini Resto mod as well, a Mini Cooper, which they haven't announced yet. So I really shouldn't have said that.
00:12:56
Anwar
um if i if i could If I could then ask you question, because you mentioned something interesting. You said at the beginning that ah the the good thing you've experienced and other people have experienced is that you get to have a classic car shape with um none of the headaches that can come with owning a classic car.
00:13:12
Anwar
But there's almost two different ways that you would end up in that space of, You either don't want a classic car enough to deal with some of the headaches or you don't want a new car as well.
00:13:23
Anwar
Because in many ways, these used to be as expensive as new cars. But now, as Mo mentioned, all those different cars, they are much more expensive. A Resto Mod Porsche, if you get it for 250,000, I'm talking euros now, you're doing you you you're probably doing okay. Singers get a million and Porsche will sell you a brand new car, which to many for many eyes is exactly the same shape as the one that was made 20, 30 years ago.
00:13:48
Anwar
But somebody's decided they do not want the current 911, for example, and they do not want the one from the 70s that hasn't been, restore you know not even restored, but just as an original. They want this thing.
00:13:59
Anwar
So, there are two decisions, ah like there's two no's you have to kind of think about to end up in that space. What's your experience with people? do they Do they see it that way? Or is it really mostly in your experience, people who just want a classic car with none of the drawbacks?
00:14:15
AssMan
Yeah, I'd definitely say the latter. I mean, you know, despite the fact that I do, that I represent the rest of mod company here in the GCC, um rest the rest of mod market has become ridiculous. I posted a spoof video on it on YouTube.
00:14:29
AssMan
um
00:14:30
Mohammad Khan
ah yeah
00:14:32
AssMan
You know, it's always a European um middle-aged hipster man who, you know, has thick-rimmed glasses or something and speaks in an accent and talks about the philosophie and the essence of the cow, you know.
00:14:32
Anwar
Yeah. but but yeah
00:14:45
Mohammad Khan
I'm halfway there.
00:14:45
AssMan
ah
00:14:46
Mohammad Khan
got the glasses.
00:14:46
AssMan
but i mean I mean, Unwater and I, a few years ago, we had some fun in a 2.7 RS 1973 that we took out. Now, and you drove it as well, right?
00:14:55
Anwar
Yeah, and you you told me that I did need to send the arse out a bit more than I was.
00:14:56
AssMan
Yeah.
00:15:00
Anwar
I wasn't this as enthusiastic as I think you were able to be.
00:15:01
AssMan
but okay
00:15:04
Anwar
But it was a genuinely, actually, I think one of the greatest experiences ever had.
00:15:05
AssMan
yeah
00:15:08
Anwar
And I've used it in reference when I've spoken to Porsche. I use it as a benchmark of like what it feels like to drive car. Sorry.
00:15:15
AssMan
So, so the reason I bring that car up is because, i mean, you can spend more money with a company like Singer to get a car that is probably more pleasurable to drive and just in terms of the driving dynamics.
00:15:30
AssMan
But, you know, it it's not the real thing. it's it's it's a strain It's almost like a strange AI pornographic version of what the real thing is. And they're so much more expensive. So, you know, that that brand that does the Diablo, the Eccentric car.
00:15:41
Anwar
Mm-hmm.
00:15:43
AssMan
I mean, I've driven a ah couple of of later Diablos, and they're wonderful. So just pay up for a well-sorted car and service instead of spending double the money on the resto mod.
00:15:53
Mohammad Khan
it's It's interesting that you said that because I watched the Top Gear's review of the Eccentrica yesterday and I forgot the journalist's name. He's one of the more popular Top Gear guys.
00:16:03
Mohammad Khan
I forgot his name, but um he was comparing it.
00:16:04
AssMan
Yep.
00:16:07
Mohammad Khan
He kept comparing it to the early Diablo, right? And he's just like, oh, I love early Diablos and this is so much better even as a development car. And I'm like, yeah, but the Diablo by the time it went out of production was a whole different animal.
00:16:22
Mohammad Khan
So it was, you know, by then it had some amount of input from Audi in it, um access to money, some headlights from Nissan, you know, for better for worse.
00:16:29
AssMan
yeah
00:16:32
Mohammad Khan
so um So it was a different car at that point. and i think I think those are the ones. Yeah.
00:16:39
AssMan
work.
00:16:41
Mohammad Khan
ah So, yeah, so I think this is it brought up an interesting point for me in that respect. And I think there's there's there's more driving this than just I want my classic car to be reliable.
00:16:53
Mohammad Khan
I think there's a certain amount of and what Alex touched on. I want to explore this point a little bit is that our our cars today. Have we gone too far? You know, is it that moment where it's like we've gone too far with and, you know, I've on previous episodes, which you've listened to a seal, thankfully.
00:17:10
Mohammad Khan
um
00:17:11
Anwar
Thank you.
00:17:11
Mohammad Khan
argued for the electrification of cars. I'm excited by it. um you know i don't think I don't think it should be the only way, but I think I am excited about it about a lot of the stuff that comes out. um But on the same note, I'm i'm also wondering, what up is is the market for these cars, there's so many of these now, and they're done at such a high level as well, right? Like I was watching the video about the eccentric, I was watching the...
00:17:37
Mohammad Khan
um or Eccentric, the guys that do the the modern Stratos and stuff like that in Italy, MAT. um And I'm like, how are these people, these little garage shops, I'm not counting Singer amongst them anymore because they're getting input from Williams and Red Bull and who knows who else, um putting together basically cars that are...
00:18:02
Mohammad Khan
better to drive um and better, like the more like you said, more pleasurable than a modern day car with all the resources in the world from, and and let's not let's not like downplay the fact that Porsche is still trying to make cars for the enthusiast for the most part. um The Corvette division within Chevrolet is doing the same thing. They're trying, you know? So so what is it? Why are these, what's bringing about this market in that way? is Have we really gone that far? Is that what's happened?
00:18:31
Mohammad Khan
Sorry if that wasn't coherent.
00:18:31
AssMan
I mean, companies like MAT or Nardone, the 928, or the Chimera, or Eccentrica, the reason they're able to do what they do is, well, it's one word, it's Podium.
Industry Impact of RestoMods
00:18:42
AssMan
There's a company in Italy called Podium who just streamlines the entire process, engineering as well, um and and they are the ones who are able to make make that happen. Giannarelli's...
00:18:54
AssMan
new car is also being developed by them. And so and but they're the ones who are, who are making, who are make who streamlin streamlining this entire process and making it making it so easy for these guys.
00:18:57
Mohammad Khan
Interesting.
00:19:05
AssMan
And there definitely is a market for it, yeah.
00:19:07
Anwar
What I want to add as well is looking at from the other perspective, um as a larger OEM, well, it's very easy. Let's put it this way. It's very easy.
00:19:19
Anwar
It's much easier to make your car a lot better and sell it for a very high price, but then trying to make something much at scale,
00:19:31
Anwar
And at a much lower price is a different exercise completely. Building one 911 that's fantastic is a lot simpler of a task than building 100,000 a year on a production line that's homologated for every single country in the world at 100,000.
00:19:47
Anwar
100,000 euro, for example, if you know what i mean. So it's like, it's it's a different ballgame of buying a, even if it's a 911, some really, you know a mass produced product that comes off a line that then has to be, you know, every single one has to be done within a few hours, whereas you can spend half a year on one one specific specification of car. It's almost like two different things.
00:20:11
Anwar
And just just to you know, allow the oems to you know stand up for themselves what porsche do and some of the the stuff that you can do with the mass production you can do with um when you are an oem like that big is stuff that these smaller manufacturers could not even imagine like light weighting to a certain degree that even with williams and even with cosworth and all these different people um the weight and the tuning and the years of development that goes into building one, like ah building the new 911, for example, is something that these other small companies can't do. They can take your homework and improve it and maybe take out of the cost savings you had to do.
00:20:55
Anwar
For example, suspension is probably one of the most common places that a lot of OEMs have had to kind of pull back on. You can upgrade that, but to do it 100,000 times and finish it off in five to 10 minutes is and that's not this is an exaggeration long it takes that's a different kind of exercise so do you know what i mean i don't want stand up for the companies but like if you look at it from their perspective it's a different ball game
00:21:06
AssMan
Yeah.
00:21:19
Mohammad Khan
So I want to circle back to this podium thing because I wasn't aware of it, but this was a point that I wanted to touch on in relation to Cosworth as well. Because Cosworth, after I remember like Williams canceled their contract with them for Formula One, was slipping into obscurity as far as I was concerned.
00:21:37
Mohammad Khan
Now, all of a sudden, you've got everyone from Bugatti to Singer to whoever putting their engines... I mean, TVR before they... I believe that project is completely off the table now.
00:21:47
Mohammad Khan
um ah Never made it, sadly. um But they were also developing a Cosworth engine car. I think the Gordon Murrays, they have Cosworth input on their engines? Yeah.
00:21:57
AssMan
Lots of value as well.
00:21:57
Mohammad Khan
So... but Yeah. and And this is the thing, right? Like, why are the Chinese so good with consumer electronics, right? The entire world. It's not because they have particularly good or strong. They do, for the record, um consumer electronics brands themselves.
00:22:14
Mohammad Khan
But what they have done is they've built capacity, rentable capacity. So they no longer have to own anything. any of these um production processes. Anybody, if I want to make a watch tomorrow, if I want to make a high-end watch and look up where the French brand Baltic makes their watches.
00:22:32
Mohammad Khan
um There's a French micro brand. I think Catchpole wears one as well. um ah They were, it's called Baltique, got a lot of good reviews and stuff like that.
00:22:43
Mohammad Khan
They're not made in France. They're not made in Switzerland. They're made in Hong Kong, I believe. But what the Chinese have done, and then they get the movements, get calibrated. They use, you know, like many watchmakers, they use they bring in external movements and then caib calibrate them in France.
00:22:59
Mohammad Khan
And that becomes their, you know, ah
00:23:01
AssMan
and
00:23:01
Mohammad Khan
and But and the designs are theirs, of course. But what with what's what China is offering consumer electronics and increasingly automotive as well is production scale and the capability to do so.
00:23:14
Mohammad Khan
um Pakistan and Portugal, for example, do the same thing with clothing. There's a lot of white labeled clothing that gets made over there at a very high standard um because of this. And I think this is what Podium has started doing, Cosworth has started doing.
00:23:28
Mohammad Khan
And it's interesting that um lotus missed the boat on this um because i felt like they might have been one of the ogs of doing this is that they i guess a lot of these micro brands i mean if you look at it singer calmar i don't know what calmar does from a production perspective but like um mat all these guys are out there they're able to get they're able to become profitable because they don't have to build these competencies in-house anymore they can now outsource them to they can rent that capacity.
00:24:00
Mohammad Khan
And that is kind of the future of that's the future of consumer electronics is the current of consumer electronics. I mean, Foxconn builds your iPhones, right? So um or your Samsung's, whatever you want.
00:24:11
Mohammad Khan
um Foxconn is going to build cars as well. So this is it. it's production It's production capacity and technical know-how for rent at scale.
00:24:22
Mohammad Khan
So anybody can get into the game. The barriers for entry are much lower. I do not need to set up a multi-million dollar or multi-billion dollar production facility to compete with Toyota to build my car now.
00:24:37
AssMan
Yeah.
00:24:38
Anwar
I mean, what I wanted actually add, Mo, was that I think, I'm not sure if disagree as much as like, maybe this isn't something that's new, but maybe this is something we started to notice. Because if I'm looking back at one of the original 90s supercars, or two of them, TWR was a bespoke little shop that kind of designed the XJ220 and the XJR15.
00:24:59
Anwar
And I'm trying to check now, I think the company's called RML, who ah also engineered for OEMs that system. So maybe it's more like in the past, the only companies that could get access to this ah ability to to use a small shop like BMW did with their M1, using Lamborghini, who at the time was almost like a micro engineering company to build their car.
00:25:12
Mohammad Khan
Mm-hmm.
00:25:25
Anwar
I think what's interesting maybe is that that that scale of a larger company going to a smaller company was something you could only do in the past but what's interesting now is you've got almost like middle level brands or companies who are going to these smaller engineering places like you said like lotus and they're doing it themselves whereas the big oh
00:25:44
Mohammad Khan
and what's go ah I don't know if anyone's going to Lotus. Do they even exist anymore?
00:25:50
Anwar
what Lotus Engineering, yeah, was kind of what they did. You even said it, like the Vanquish at some point. The Vanquish was developed by Lotus Engineering and because Aston Martin.
00:26:00
Mohammad Khan
found that out last week, that the bank yeah original Vanquish was basically just a giant Lotus.
00:26:01
AssMan
Which one of the really the the early developed by
00:26:01
Anwar
But Aston Martin,
00:26:09
Mohammad Khan
Yeah, Aston didn't have the capacity for it. I found this out recently. I think I shared it in the group chat with Alex and Aranwar. And yeah, that's what you known.
00:26:16
AssMan
no wonder
00:26:16
Anwar
yeah. mean, Lola...
00:26:17
AssMan
yeah
00:26:18
Anwar
if you If you've driven a lot of different um carbon fiber cars, racing cars or road cars, you will be very likely sitting in a car that was developed by Lola. Lola, obviously very famous for the the racing cars. But I think maybe the larger point is that um many cars you think are made by one person aren't made by one person, but made by subcontractors.
00:26:40
Anwar
And I think what's interesting now is that those subcontractors are becoming brands themselves. You know what i mean? Like, yeah.
00:26:46
Mohammad Khan
you know You know, okay, I think we had this discussion we had a very cynical discussion, you and I, about influencers a while back, right? And we were talking about everyone is trying to attain influence so they can all start selling hoodies on Instagram, right?
00:26:58
Mohammad Khan
And um it's funny, but effectively, that's the way business is moved, right? You build a following And then you start producing a product and that that production scale is available to you now, right?
00:27:10
Mohammad Khan
and And I think that maybe i think maybe that's the shift that we're trying to nail down. I wasn't saying that this is necessarily new to the automotive world, but the way it's being and put out there now is a bit different.
00:27:21
Mohammad Khan
So for example, I mean, like, I'm not calling them an influencer or anything, but who's the guy that does the the um reimagined or whatever, the the modern integrale?
00:27:30
Anwar
Yes.
00:27:32
AssMan
Yeah, automobiliamos.
00:27:34
Mohammad Khan
Automobilamos, that guy built a huge social following before he ever made a car or even announced it, yeah. And then there were sunglasses before that. But once again, i feel like this is one of those capacity for rent scenarios, right? um
00:27:50
Mohammad Khan
People are are able to buy that capacity for hoodies. I believe the Prime Energy drink is done the same way. We've already talked about it with watches, you know. um And I think Singer unique once again in that respect that they they've largely done it in-house and then they've also brought in – those guys are artisans, man.
00:27:50
Anwar
yeah
00:28:08
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
00:28:09
AssMan
Cool.
00:28:09
Mohammad Khan
Uh, and they've brought an experience where they needed it for like the powertrains and stuff like that.
00:28:09
AssMan
Two of them.
00:28:14
Mohammad Khan
But, uh, but when it comes to a lot of these other cars, I'm, I'm, I'm wondering now, like, is this kind of just, you know, your basic building? I mean, know nothing against it. Automobile almost that integrale is gorgeous. The one that he makes it is, it is lovely.
00:28:28
Mohammad Khan
Um, yeah.
00:28:28
AssMan
who
00:28:29
AssMan
to um
00:28:29
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
00:28:31
Mohammad Khan
And I think this segues nicely. i mean, do you guys want to add anything else? But there's there's another topic I wanted to talk about, but it it'll segue nicely.
00:28:38
AssMan
Well, I don't have a...
00:28:39
Mohammad Khan
But yeah.
00:28:39
AssMan
um but I'm sorry that I keep singing about Singer, but what's interesting about Singer is I think it's safe to say they're first restaurant company whereby their car became collectible and increased in value in the grey market.
00:28:51
AssMan
So a Singer Classic, um whether it's the 3.6 or the 4 litre, that sells comfortably in auctions for a million dollars basically, plus or minus $100,000 or $200,000. And sticker price for those early Singer Classics is $375,000.
00:29:09
AssMan
and So that that's that that's pretty,
00:29:10
Mohammad Khan
Just keep singing in my presence. Yep.
00:29:13
AssMan
so
00:29:13
Anwar
Well, that became a business case. And I think that's the thing. Like, the cars don't make money. um And almost nobody makes any money may selling cars. But this was an instance where though the economics somehow made sense of going, I can make cars, sell them to people who then themselves aren't just in it because they love it so much and willing to sacrifice a hell of a lot of money to lose money on this car.
00:29:36
Anwar
it may It made economic sense to get a singer, sit on it, and sell it. It's like, because, again, like... um Apple couldn't figure out how to make cars. Apple, the world's, well, basically one of the world's biggest car, ah cut sorry, one of the biggest companies.
00:29:50
Anwar
They went, you know what? This thing, making cars is not for us. Thank you very much.
00:29:54
Mohammad Khan
they tried to outsource the capacity they tried to buy capacity from hyundai uh if i remember correctly um they wanted to partner with hyundai and hyundai said no thanks uh because the financials didn't make sense they're like we're gonna help you engineer this and whatever and apple typically wants to keep the lion's share of the profits right on everything that they did do whether you're selling something on the app store or whatever
00:29:54
Anwar
um
00:30:18
Mohammad Khan
apple keeps Apple keeps the profits for the most part, right? um You get a small chunk of that. And that's the way they were trying to operate with Hyundai. Hyundai wasn't interested. i think they tried something. I think Nissan wanted to get in the door because Nissan will take anything at this point.
00:30:32
Mohammad Khan
um But I don't think that that panned out. What's interesting, though, and I think the same thing happened to Dyson, right? But Dyson was trying to do it all in-house. um What's interesting, though, that Sony seems to have made it across the line with us. We're going to see a production car from Sony very soon.
00:30:47
Mohammad Khan
um
00:30:47
Anwar
You mean Honda?
00:30:47
Anwar
Yeah.
00:30:49
Mohammad Khan
Well, you have that's the thing. You can't build that capacity from scratch, right? You're ultimately going to be taking capacity from someone. I think it's just one of those industries where a lot of this, all this expertise, all this stuff, like, I mean, you want a Formula One team, it's going to be based in the UK for the most part. That's where all the to engineering talent is.
00:31:09
Mohammad Khan
You want to build a supercar, a lot of your know-how is going to come from Supercar Valley. Hence, that's where Podium is based, you know? Yeah. Which makes lot or MAT or whoever else you want to work with, right?
00:31:20
AssMan
ah
00:31:20
Mohammad Khan
Brembo.
00:31:21
AssMan
The company that I'm a GCC agent for, Giamaro, that's in Motor Valley as well, right?
00:31:25
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
00:31:27
AssMan
And that's everything in Italy.
00:31:28
Mohammad Khan
Mm-hmm.
00:31:30
AssMan
it's um It's not like... Sonda's a great car. It's one of the greatest cars I've ever driven. phenomenal. ah It's a German engine. But what's different about Giamaro is it's all all done in-house. It's all in Motor Valley as well. Although the engine is built by a company ah ran not far from Milan.
00:31:46
Anwar
What is that engine, by the way, the seal what' What shape and what a specification is that?
00:31:46
AssMan
But what basically
00:31:52
Anwar
Because I think that's where it needs to So...
00:31:52
Mohammad Khan
This is my ah before Before we get into that, i want I want to bring this whole...
00:31:52
AssMan
so
00:31:59
Mohammad Khan
I was jumping the gun a little bit. Let's let's bring this RestoMod thing full circle. Asil, what are the general...
00:32:05
AssMan
so So just before that, the two things I noted down, imagine when you're about an Apple car. Imagine if the lead designer of the Apple car was a proper car designer and a proper car enthusiast, but it was built and engineered and and macro designed by Apple. I really think it would look stunning. I mean, they would they would make it look great, I think.
00:32:25
AssMan
But I think of
00:32:26
Mohammad Khan
I think
00:32:27
Mohammad Khan
i is head by the time this project came around and Johnny Ive is what makes Apple stuff look so good. And he's gone.
00:32:27
Anwar
but But they didn't make compromise.
00:32:34
Anwar
That's true. but But Apple don't, like... Apple, I wouldn't think, would make a car for car people. They would make an appliance. That's what they do.
00:32:42
AssMan
Yeah.
00:32:43
Anwar
They make appliances. And I think what's really interesting with all the examples that you've worked with, Asil, and Mo has mentioned, is that these people are either people who've worked in the industry or are massive enthusiasts and then decided that they can make a better product than the OEMs can make themselves.
00:33:00
Anwar
And like you said with the sorry zeel like you said, with the price of a singer, the markets decided that they're absolutely right. And i what ah one point I wanted to add for you, um just because I know you you deal with both of them,
00:33:14
Anwar
um the The thing that these OEMs are noticing, these big car companies, is that they need to get into this game. And there are so many more modern, like you said, versions of them the ST, the 2, 3. The SP3 just sold the limited edition one, special one, auction, but blah, blah, blah, for charity, 25 million.
00:33:35
Anwar
for a resto car. Now they're talking about what that manual F40 that they're gonna bring back. Isn't it very interesting that they see where the money is?
00:33:43
AssMan
Yeah.
00:33:46
Anwar
Especially Ferrari being a private company now, the Ferrari's in the business of making money.
00:33:46
AssMan
Yeah.
00:33:50
Mohammad Khan
company.
00:33:51
AssMan
In public.
00:33:52
Anwar
Yeah, but but but what what what I wanted to like push you towards telling us more about is you've experienced more modern supercars and these resto mod cars. And I think the market's decided one of them is more valuable than the other.
00:34:07
Anwar
How do you feel about that move? what What's your kind of feeling about this
Personal Enjoyment vs. Show in RestoMods
00:34:15
AssMan
i think there
00:34:15
Anwar
transition?
00:34:17
Anwar
Yeah.
00:34:17
AssMan
I think um but on the one hand, you have and cars that you experience, and on the other hand, you have cars that you kind of pose in, for lack of a better word. um I feel like when you buy when when when one of these collectors buys a restar mod, they're usually buying it for themselves.
00:34:33
AssMan
um And I think oftentimes when someone's buying a modern hypercar, they're kind of buying it for other people, right? And, you know, I think the three of us are on the same page whereby we don't buy cars for other people, we buy them to experience them. The right road, the right day, the right mood, the right weather, sometimes the right company as well.
00:34:52
AssMan
um ah Like we were saying earlier, we've done one of the 2.7 RS, right? it's It's making those memorable experiences. I first met you guys with ah an XJ220 and a Jaguar F-Type R, right? That's where we first met.
00:35:05
AssMan
got nine years ago, back when I had hair.
00:35:07
Mohammad Khan
I mean, Unruh, you go first, sorry.
00:35:08
AssMan
um
00:35:10
Anwar
No, no, no, no, because I want to see what's finished because I have a question about the GCC about this specifically, but please continue, Azil.
00:35:16
AssMan
so so um so So, see, I think a a lot of think it's the duality of of ah posing versus versus versus yeahosing v purpose.
00:35:26
Anwar
The purpose of why you're purchasing, yeah.
00:35:29
AssMan
and you know and And again, when these resto mods are done well, I haven't driven that many resto mods though. um I'd love to. I've never driven a Singa. I'd love to. um but but But I think when it when it's done well, that is a wonderful experience.
00:35:41
AssMan
i mean, the Pagodas, for example, the The 280 SL Pagoda, um ah for all intents and purposes, is a shit car to drive. um it's ah it's It's boat-like, it's vague steering. Yes, it's comfortable and it's beautiful, but that's about it.
00:35:55
AssMan
And then a company like Mechatronic actually made it a powerhouse to experience. It's incredible. It's absolutely incredible. I remember a client um came over in one of the previous showrooms I worked at where we had a Mechatronic. And we spent an entire day driving a few different cars. He's a in Abu Dhabi.
00:36:10
AssMan
and um And I took him out in everything so he could experience these different cars. So we had the Ferrari Daytona, the 964 RS, NSX, two-litre 911 from 1965. And we ended the day um with the Mechatronic.
00:36:25
AssMan
And he said the NSX is the best gearbox he's ever driven, and he owns an F40, which is actually a good gearbox in the F40. um But then the Mechatronic was like, yeah, this is more this is more for when I'm older, or this is a car for my dad kind of thing.
00:36:37
AssMan
ah
00:36:37
Mohammad Khan
It's a car for me. f
00:36:39
AssMan
Yeah.
00:36:39
Mohammad Khan
But I think what's interesting – sorry, go ahead, Anwar.
00:36:44
Anwar
Yeah, I wanted to have that question. And because the the podcast is called Golf Spec. And the golf has become one of the most popular destinations for these cars.
00:36:49
AssMan
Yep.
00:36:54
Anwar
And I think that Jaguar XJ320 experience kind of is a good example of it. I don't think that they're the best places to own these kinds of cars because the roads, the not the infrastructure, the roads are like smooth, they're great, but they aren't, I'd say, the most interesting.
00:37:11
Anwar
And coming back to this market of like showing off versus driving, it is very funny um how popular these things are in a space I don't believe is conducive to enjoying them very often and and i'm going to speak for you now mo we've had so many years of conversations about owning different cars sports cars for you and you just turn around and say you know it might not be for me because of the the like the roads aren't that good here so how is it that we've got so many buyers of these kinds of cars in a space that just might not be the right run for them
00:37:45
AssMan
Well,
Challenges in Classic Car Maintenance
00:37:46
AssMan
that's the...
00:37:46
Mohammad Khan
and i want I like before it before you answer that, a seal I want to I want to go a little more macro level here, right? Like we Gulf spec and I want to um are there any, you know, in general? Okay, yes.
00:37:57
Mohammad Khan
Why are we why do we have so many buyers? But what are some of the general trends you're seeing with this type of customer with these types of cars in terms of sales or in terms of demand that maybe perhaps you could speak to?
00:38:08
AssMan
Well, first of all, you guys are assuming that there is a market of for XG220s in the region. um Yes, there is, but they're very hard cards to move. So that XG220 that we experienced and had a good old time in sold to Monaco.
00:38:22
AssMan
um you know it was It was sold for...
00:38:23
Mohammad Khan
Mm-hmm.
00:38:26
AssMan
for export. the other The other problem with owning cars like this, to to touch on them the the beginning of what Anwar said, um it's it's not only that the roads are bor relatively boring, you have to drive two hours out of Dubai, for example, just ah to have some fun roads.
00:38:40
AssMan
It's also the maintenance. Where are you going to maintain an XJ220 in Dubai? you know we we sent its to or We spoke to to Jaguar, Altair, and then um about a few hours later I received a phone call from Don Law, the the legendary X-220 guy in the UK, and he said, is that your X-220 that Jaguar called me about? it was like, yes. so you know that they'll They end up going going to Dom. and That's just the next J220. Now, if you have a Di Tommaso Mangusta, where the hell are to take it? i mean There may be two workshops in the the region that I would trust with it.
00:39:12
AssMan
So because this country and this region to a certain extent as well is so young, it hasn't had the time to create an ecosystem of specialist workshops. It's the ownership of these cars that's pain. I have clients who fly or ship their cars to Europe to be maintained and then bring them back over here.
00:39:29
AssMan
um ah It's changing. It's getting better. We have some world-class service centers over here. 911 RSR are a Porsche specialist here in Dubai. They're they're incredible, world-class. Tensai Tuning, where I took my R32 GTR back in the day.
00:39:43
AssMan
Incredible, world-class place. so so But the thing is, those are specialty places. so but You have an air-cooled or older Porsche, liket you take it to there. You have one of, they don't touch Honda's Tensai tuning for some reason, but you have one of the big Japanese manufacturers. It's not a Honda.
00:39:59
AssMan
You say that you send it to Tensai, but other than that, if you have a, you know,
00:40:04
Anwar
What about Ferrari 250? like one of Because in the region, there are people who have some of the most incredible collections. They live in the region because they're from the region. But
00:40:17
Anwar
what do you do? That's a good point. like yeah It's actually a very good point because people think about owning the thing, but they don't think about the complete ownership of use and maintenance.
00:40:23
AssMan
yeah If you have a Lamborghini 50 GT and you you send a Lamborghini 50 GT to the Lamborghini service center in Dubai, forget about it. But if you send a Ferrari 250 to the service center in Dubai, it will actually probably go okay because they're going to be talking back and forth so much with the factory um just to get it right.
00:40:41
AssMan
um so So I think you'll be okay there. I mean, carb tuning is is a whole other question. But they're going to be back and forthing with the factory a lot. so so so So I think you're kind of okay. But again, with a Lamborghini, a classic Lamborghini, or a classic BMW, you think the BMW service center here don't know how to work on an M1, you know, maybe not even a one m so
00:41:01
Mohammad Khan
I mean, I had a friend back in the day that where I'm not going to take the name of the GCC service center, but could not work on his Cooper S and he was stuck on their service contract.
00:41:12
Mohammad Khan
And the second it was over, he took it to a specialist and he, huh?
00:41:15
Anwar
Mini Cooper. The Mini Cooper.
00:41:19
Mohammad Khan
The Mini Cooper S, the same generation you owned. i had a friend with one that was maintaining it at a i will regional service center.
00:41:25
Anwar
Yeah. Yeah.
00:41:28
Mohammad Khan
And um and it was it went very poorly. He was constantly there with issues. And when his service contract ended and he decided to try somewhere else, like a specialist, a BMW specialist, he found out that there were certain things that were just going wrong.
00:41:45
Mohammad Khan
just gone unchecked or undone or whatever, you know, and it was just such poor quality service. And he's not like, you know, he's he's a busy dude. He wasn't going like get involved in the nitty gritty of it. But yeah, so...
00:41:58
Mohammad Khan
Yeah, that's that. But yeah, I guess back to it. Okay, so that's so are we seeing um these retro mods, these modern remakes, are we seeing this as like a growth area here? Is there an increased demand all of a sudden for them in this region with this type of car buyer? Are they still veering more to towards the more conventional supercars or anything like that?
00:42:20
AssMan
I'd say the latter. i think that we're still going to need some time before these become more popular over here, right? I mean, um if if you live in California, Many of these brands sell cars over there, parts of Europe as well.
00:42:31
AssMan
um but But it's slow. I mean, I know of only one Automobil Amos in the region, the the Delta.
00:42:36
Mohammad Khan
Oh, there is one.
00:42:38
AssMan
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:42:38
Anwar
right.
00:42:39
AssMan
that's It's like a very dark blue or black. um And the same guy owns that Stratos Restomod and the Chimera as well.
00:42:47
Mohammad Khan
There's all of them here.
00:42:49
AssMan
In the region.
00:42:50
Mohammad Khan
Oh, geez.
00:42:51
AssMan
yeah you know
00:42:52
Mohammad Khan
Okay.
00:42:53
AssMan
but I mean, you know obviously collectors like this, they fly their cars around depending on where they are right to to use them. and But he's he's a minority. right um the The Saudi client of mine who who's who's a good Thorny Kellam customer, he's also a minority.
00:43:02
Mohammad Khan
Okay.
00:43:08
AssMan
these Because the thing is, yeah you have many billionaires over here or people who are worth them what nine figures.
00:43:13
Anwar
Thank you.
00:43:14
AssMan
But how many of them actually have the sort of hasten car knowledge to pursue something like this. So, you know, most of these collectors and hypercar, supercar drivers, if they're sitting in the room with the three of us, they won't be able to keep up, right?
00:43:30
AssMan
Because we're we're proper car nerds. And if we had many, many, many, many zeros in our bank account, um we would be buying this cool shit. You know, we I don't think we'd be going through a Rolls-Royce Cullinan.
00:43:42
Mohammad Khan
And I think, um sorry.
00:43:43
Anwar
but was so yeah Was Singer the first time that that enthusiast retro space car, whatever you want to call it, broke into the mainstream?
00:43:54
Anwar
Because I feel like it it it was a crossover point, if you know what mean, between like regular...
00:44:00
AssMan
Mm-hmm.
00:44:02
Anwar
the hardcore annoying enthusiasts and the much larger much more casual audience and i think one of the reasons that the price was able to you know keep going up is because they broke into that market and i think the gcc as you said in the past without there's no workshops here there's no um like there's no rest what's really happening apart from generelli which i know that i've actually i went down to see the space um this market has been a much more traditional super car market for its entire history.
00:44:35
Anwar
um But you are doing good business in the UAE, selling collector cars and some restomod cars as well. And I think that's what Mo was trying to get, ah you want to get to, right? You want ask a question like, um is there that you know or you you ran is there a market for these things now here?
00:44:52
Mohammad Khan
I think, yeah.
00:44:52
AssMan
There is growing. but It still has it has some space to grow for sure. It's ah it's it's in its early days. It's in its infancy.
00:45:01
Mohammad Khan
And you do think that this is going to continue growing or is this, are we seeing it peak because, you know, um Alex called the extinction level event ah with the EVs coming on.
00:45:08
AssMan
ah the i
00:45:13
Mohammad Khan
So.
00:45:13
AssMan
i mean i I don't think it's... um If it is a bubble, it's a bubble that still hasn't reached its maximum size yet.
00:45:20
Mohammad Khan
Okay.
00:45:21
AssMan
um will it Will it burst? what may Is it a fad thing? I don't know. I don't think it is, but I don't think it's a bubble because you're always going to have people who want all the aesthetic perks of a classic car, but none of the pain in the arse ownership.
00:45:26
Anwar
Yeah.
00:45:29
Anwar
yeah
00:45:38
Mohammad Khan
Oh, yeah.
00:45:39
AssMan
mean, you know, if if ah if I were richer, then I definitely would. I but i have a 1966 Lancia-Fulvia, and that never works. And if I had the money, I'd i'd love a WrestleMod version of it.
00:45:50
AssMan
As long as it keeps the same character, I'd love one. so so So I definitely think it's ah it's going to continue to grow, and I don't think it's a bubble.
EV Transition and RestoMod Market Growth
00:46:00
Anwar
ah What I wanted to add as well was, and and with that extension extension level event, um as management ah many more car companies are moving towards having to build more electric cars and less cars, I think maybe you'll just naturally see more people flooding back to where cars were coming from restomods because the alternative just isn't there.
00:46:22
Anwar
So like I don't want to use the term, but it's almost like you can imagine refugees from the supercar market ending up
00:46:22
AssMan
The
00:46:30
Anwar
in classic cars or resto mod cars because ferrari just will not build you uh you know a car with an internal combustion engine anymore um jaguar now has and jaguar is one of the probably the quintessential enthusiast car brands in its entire history they have now said we will no longer build anything that's not an electric car so maybe we'll actually just see people moving there because there's nowhere i know they've decided i know they've decided to change that yeah
00:46:56
Mohammad Khan
No, no, not about that. Jaguar, even while they were saying that, would still build you ah ah and a brand new E-type for XYZ millions of dollars.
00:47:09
AssMan
Yeah.
00:47:09
Mohammad Khan
That's a special special order thing you can do with them.
00:47:12
AssMan
JLR classic.
00:47:13
Mohammad Khan
Yeah. So I think, yeah, but to your point, yes, it was them reaching back, right? It is the quote-unquote refugee from the supercar market going to towards a brand new classic car instead.
00:47:26
AssMan
Yeah.
00:47:26
Mohammad Khan
um
00:47:27
AssMan
Eventually they get bored of driving at 370 kilometers an hour on highways around the world. You know, it's, it's, it's, it, they, sorry. they we
00:47:36
Mohammad Khan
Gumball's lost his chance.
00:47:38
AssMan
sorry
00:47:38
Anwar
But Porsche cannot make, like, right I'll speak from stuff I've read. Porsche can no longer continue to make the GT3 that they would like to make. The 992.2 GT3 has extra butar a particulate fill particulate filters in its exhaust pipe, and it's actually had to reduce its power and torque just to maintain it being not normally aspirated and a manual, they can no longer build the cars they want to. So they may have to resort to just offering Restomod. Have you seen that 993 Speedster that they released, that yellow one, um the Sondervunsch car?
00:48:14
Anwar
That's something I feel like they, and you know when you speak to the people there, they would love to continue making those kinds of cars. They simply cannot. they're being They are being um extinguished Rightly or wrongly, just for, you know, we do need to do something about the climate. um But this is a consequence of it.
00:48:32
Anwar
And the people at those car companies, they're not luxury enthusiasts. The people who work at Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, they're not, you know, luxury brand enthusiasts. That's bollocks. What they are is car enthusiasts, and they would like to continue making cool cars.
00:48:44
AssMan
Thank you.
00:48:46
Anwar
They're just being restrained. Exactly.
00:48:49
Mohammad Khan
I and think there's multiple ways to cool cars, and I think it's i think it'll take some adjustment. but they I mean, I think the GTS was the first step of them. The current GTS was the first like step of them trying to figure it out a different way than usual, right?
00:49:04
Mohammad Khan
I wouldn't have thought of that. It is technically a hybrid, but it is not at the same time. Right?
00:49:09
AssMan
it's i i joke it It's incredible.
00:49:09
Anwar
It's race-born technology, by the way. Have
00:49:11
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
00:49:13
AssMan
It is absolutely incredible.
00:49:14
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
00:49:15
Anwar
you been in one?
00:49:15
AssMan
It's unbelievable.
00:49:16
Anwar
The new hybrid GTX.
00:49:16
AssMan
yeah ah yeah Yeah, the 992.2 GTS, I drove one um four or five months ago. it's It's amazing. And it just reminds you that, no, Porsche are an engineering company who just happened to build cars on the side. It's like, that's how it feels. They are unbelievably smart.
00:49:29
AssMan
And you kind of think about it and you go, okay, are we moving away from from from a real connection with the automobile, with all of this advancement and everything? But then you look back ah again to bring up the 2.7 ah for its time is very technologically advanced. In 1973, fuel injected car with a fuel injection worked really well.
00:49:47
AssMan
um The cylinder wall linings were a lot slipperier, for lack of a better word, the technology that they brought from the 917. So maybe back then, it would have been seen as linings.
00:49:56
Mohammad Khan
two episodes in a row now. oh
00:50:00
Anwar
No, I made the same hand gesture as you, Sio. It's very important when your cylinder is slippery.
00:50:04
Mohammad Khan
um ready let do it ah
00:50:07
AssMan
um from the 917.
00:50:10
AssMan
But but yeah totally that's yes yes hello and but the the my my the my point being that that maybe the 2.7 RS in its period was looked at as a car that's that's overly but synthetic and too technological technologically advanced.
00:50:10
Anwar
Well, no, because it would be like this.
00:50:12
Anwar
It's this, isn't it, Sio? Because it's flat. So, yeah. Yeah.
00:50:28
AssMan
But then here we are 50, 60 years later and it's no, that has that car as character, as personality.
00:50:33
Anwar
Water cool to air cool, that was an extinction level event many people believed.
00:50:33
AssMan
So driving
00:50:38
Anwar
What I love to do is check my own, not biases, my beliefs by going back in history and reading to see like, is this new or is it always been that way?
00:50:49
Anwar
And what's really interesting, if you look back, we like to think, of with this is just to bring it all the way back.
00:50:49
AssMan
Mm-hmm.
00:50:53
Anwar
We like to think that this Resto Mod trend is something that needed a conversation. But as you both indicated, nostalgia has existed from you know time of memorial the The Renaissance was nostalgia for the Roman period.
00:51:04
Mohammad Khan
Circular.
00:51:07
Anwar
And in the 80s, the nostalgia was for 60s muscle cars. So maybe nothing really has changed. Maybe this is like this is not the ah the the big trend we we think it is. It's just these rest muds have always existed. Maybe the thing that...
00:51:25
Anwar
now is this electric car transition. Maybe I think that might be ah an actual bit of a big difference. This isn't just moving into like cars that are no longer carbureted to fuel injected. This is cars that no longer have an engine.
00:51:41
Mohammad Khan
You know, well, technically they still have propulsion at the end of the day, right? um And...
00:51:46
Anwar
And they still need to drive them, which is something I really think is going to... Like, the electric car will not kill driving enthusiasts. The thing that will kill us is the fact that cars may no longer be driven by us in the future.
00:51:57
Anwar
That's...
00:51:57
Mohammad Khan
yeah.
00:51:58
Anwar
know
00:51:58
Mohammad Khan
um But I think the, I mean, in terms of retro cars, I think something that comes back to mind is the, remember the Volkswagen new Beetle and what that kicked off?
00:52:05
AssMan
No.
00:52:08
Anwar
Yeah.
00:52:08
Mohammad Khan
There was the Beetle, there was the Mini, there was the PT Cruiser, the Mustang, there was the Ford, my favorite, the Ford Thunderbird, um which, but all of these cars, other than the Thunderbird, were actually successful.
00:52:10
Anwar
I'll start...
00:52:14
Anwar
Come here.
00:52:19
Anwar
Yeah.
00:52:23
Mohammad Khan
um The Mustang, the Cooper, even the PT Cruiser, um hate on it all you will, but it was a massive success in those first few years. It was a good car. um People forget that. Yeah.
00:52:33
AssMan
When the Mustang came out in 2005, it was just the coolest thing. i think it was a big player in the the retro movement, right? Your challenger came afterwards, etc.
00:52:44
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
00:52:44
AssMan
But I remember first seeing the Mustang as a kid walking from PE at school. and Me and my brother just saw this bright red Mustang outside the municipality in Abu Dhabi, 2005, with this older dude twirling the keys around. And we looked at him and said, this is the bee's knees, man. It's so cool.
00:53:02
AssMan
And I still think it is cool. and and The V6 actually, I think, looked better at the front because it didn't have the extra lights there. And then when the GT500 came out, I mean, that was just but so tasty. And I still want one of those with a 5.4-litre supercharged engine, you know, ah the white with blue stripes. a Great car.
00:53:18
Mohammad Khan
But I mean, let's talk about EVs and let's bring it together with this retro thing for a second. Renault 5, right? They've done the Alpine version of it. um ah And the reviews are really good.
00:53:30
Mohammad Khan
It's supposed to be a really fun hot hatch from what I recall. Auto intercooler, all spoke very highly of that thing. So you've got that retro body with the modern mechanicals, yet enough of what makes us love cars.
00:53:47
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
00:53:47
AssMan
i't No, no, I just completely disagree. No, no.
00:53:50
Mohammad Khan
What makes me love cars.
00:53:50
AssMan
ever the
00:53:52
Mohammad Khan
um
00:53:52
AssMan
the the
00:53:52
Anwar
but
00:53:53
Anwar
Are
00:53:54
AssMan
It looks looks right. It's it's right good. It's the correct looks, the correct conceptual idea, but the wrong powertrain, man. um um I mean, you know, electric cars are like um having sex with a deaf person, you know. It's like you you want you want one of the... All the senses should be ignited.
00:54:15
AssMan
And so I don't find...
00:54:15
Anwar
ah you deaf in this analogy or are they deaf in this analogy?
00:54:18
Mohammad Khan
I think he's done in this analogy.
00:54:19
AssMan
Yeah. Yeah.
00:54:22
Mohammad Khan
This is we're not all ignited.
00:54:23
AssMan
Yeah.
00:54:23
Anwar
No,
00:54:25
Mohammad Khan
man. We're going to have to give this one the explicit rating.
00:54:28
AssMan
um
00:54:30
Mohammad Khan
but
00:54:32
Mohammad Khan
um
00:54:32
Anwar
it's okay.
00:54:32
Anwar
I think it's within the first 30 minutes. If you don't swear or do something wrong there or do any of these things, you'll be fine. It's just after the pain in this, you can do whatever you want.
00:54:38
AssMan
yeah
00:54:40
Mohammad Khan
and we're so We're coming up to about an hour. um Let's cap this off with, ah I think, um let's ah Let's make it a little bit fun. Which one of these retro mods or new creations of older cars do you find what would you buy?
00:55:00
Mohammad Khan
And what is the one that perhaps doesn't exist that you would create? Asil, you go first. You're the guest.
00:55:07
AssMan
Calmar, Calmar, Porsche DM for inquiries would obviously be my number one.
00:55:10
Mohammad Khan
Okay.
00:55:11
AssMan
ah Number two choice. Not sure. I'm not sure. Probably something from Thorne and Callum. Yeah, I'd get there. Lance or Aurelia. Yeah, definitely.
00:55:21
Mohammad Khan
But which is the one you'd actually that doesn't exist that you would have created?
00:55:25
AssMan
More Fulvia. Lance, Lance, your four via restomods done right, done tastefully with the right bits of attention to detail, certain nods to the HF and bits and pieces like that.
00:55:27
Mohammad Khan
sorry.
00:55:36
AssMan
That would be very tasty. It's such a lovely.
00:55:37
Anwar
Like an Alphaholics Lancia.
00:55:40
AssMan
Yeah, exactly.
00:55:41
Anwar
Yeah.
00:55:41
Mohammad Khan
I'm do it.
00:55:42
AssMan
Exactly.
00:55:42
Mohammad Khan
They'd probably do a great job.
00:55:44
AssMan
Yeah.
00:55:44
Anwar
What about you, Mo?
00:55:47
Mohammad Khan
Uh, okay. So I, 15 minutes before I got on the podcast, found out about something called s m two um, which is, a company out in France that does resto mods of the Citroen SM, which is my all time dream car.
00:56:03
Mohammad Khan
So, um, that would be high on my list. Um,
00:56:07
Anwar
Thank you.
00:56:07
Mohammad Khan
I'd want I really, really, really like what Gunther Works is doing. um I know a seal and I have a mild disagreement on some of the stuff there, but um I don't think I'd go all out with it. They can be a bit extreme. I'd want one that's a bit dialed back, but I like what from an aesthetic perspective they've done. And the 993 is another one of my all time favorites ah in terms of one that doesn't exist.
00:56:35
Mohammad Khan
I'd like to see someone do like a maybe like ah somewhere like a well, that's probably how much they cost. and I don't know. But and and I know Mazda has a program for the N.A. Miata where they will actually um rebuild them for you or whatever.
00:56:51
Mohammad Khan
um ah Mazda has an in-house restoration program for N.A. Miatas now, by the way. um But I think it'd be nice to see, you know how like all the all the companies, like the wooden picket mini and stuff like that, it'd be nice to see someone doing a like Luke's version of the NA Miata, right?
00:57:09
Mohammad Khan
Where it's all screwed together, green over tan, you know, um just a really, really, really nice MX-5 Miata. That would be nice. I would love that.
00:57:17
AssMan
and This virtual modding of modern cars, i find i do find weird. i mean
00:57:21
Anwar
but but I want to just add that. you would
00:57:23
Mohammad Khan
MX5 came out in like 1980.
00:57:25
Anwar
but um
00:57:25
Mohammad Khan
nineteen
00:57:26
Anwar
Somebody that you just met, and I am really annoyed you met, you met Mr. Tavares himself, one of the biggest YouTubers in the world. And he's doing retro, a resto mod of a McLaren P1.
00:57:39
Anwar
And my point with that is, i don't care, it's not my car, I'm really glad he's doing it and he's bringing it back to life.
00:57:40
Mohammad Khan
yeah
00:57:44
Anwar
My point is, It's, is it old enough to rest a model ready? Isn't it really interesting? I would, would you put it in that bucket? And how do we feel about a car so new, almost getting that treatment?
00:57:58
Anwar
Do you know mean?
00:57:58
AssMan
i I would say what he's doing is a restaurant. i mean he's he's He saved ah a dead car. And he's insane. nuts He's nuts. He's a crazy maestro. It's unbelievable. But I think what I would say he's doing is MSO plus, in a way.
00:58:14
AssMan
yeah i think I think that's that's more like... Yeah.
00:58:15
Anwar
but have you no Have you seen what he's doing with Frank Stephenson, the guy who designed it?
00:58:15
AssMan
what
00:58:18
AssMan
a
00:58:19
Anwar
Yeah, like that that body work, that feels like the same ethos applied to, what, like a 10-year-old car? Sorry
00:58:28
AssMan
yeah Yeah, it's it's it's it's awesome. i mean A, you're saving a dead car, which is great.
00:58:32
Anwar
about that.
00:58:33
AssMan
That's charity as far as I'm concerned. it's um but but But what he's doing is absolutely insane. And the stuff he has in the works as well is is is absolutely bonkers. And proper car guy as well.
00:58:45
AssMan
Ed Bolian as well. Proper enthusiast. What's interesting is if we were having conversation 30 years ago and we were talking about...
00:58:51
Anwar
Because Bugatti is a real... I
00:58:54
Mohammad Khan
Zinwicky? Is that the guy we're talking about?
00:58:56
Anwar
think we keep...
00:58:56
AssMan
Yeah, great guy. great go Actually, Freddie introduced me to him. and we We had a chat on the phone.
00:59:00
Mohammad Khan
Okay.
00:59:01
AssMan
Proper enthusiast. um If we were having conversation 30 years ago and talking about an automotive influencer, it would be the car journalist, right? And i'd I'd wager that most of them 30 years ago, the bigger ones, would probably not be very pleasant people in person.
00:59:14
AssMan
But what's interesting about all these big YouTubers I've met, um is that they're all just really nice guys and proper enthusiasts. And most of them are always willing to talk to to to strangers or fans and things like that.
00:59:26
AssMan
And it's it's an interesting new new world of, you know, they're not card journalists, but they are the new card journalists. in in many ways
00:59:33
Anwar
I think might disagree with you um for one thing. And your your point you made earlier, Mo, was and an interesting with the Top Gear video. um I think journalism is dead and everything now just becomes fluff and PR.
00:59:50
AssMan
I like him. Yep.
00:59:51
Anwar
Like when you see these videos and they, like I watched the single one now with Tom Ford and i don't know him. And again, he won't be listening and I don't think it's...
00:59:59
Mohammad Khan
that, man. get um
01:00:01
Anwar
yeah Yeah, obviously his name's Tom Ford.
01:00:02
AssMan
ah like him
01:00:03
Anwar
But my point is that like everything is good or great. In these videos, I think now because everyone's a bit chummier, I think what we have seen is a death of critical analysis.
01:00:16
AssMan
ye
01:00:17
Anwar
And and what's happened now is because we have only really consumed these things through the communication that's come from these influencers and you know still journalists,
01:00:29
Anwar
but But it is still slanted to make these cars look positive. And I feel like those old farts who ah might have been really annoying, the thing they would be.
01:00:40
Mohammad Khan
I'm journalist.
01:00:42
Anwar
yeah right But like those people would be critical and they are not there to just simply, you know, gloss or glaze, as the kids like to say, these new
01:00:51
Mohammad Khan
That is I'm here to tell everyone that the Grenadier is a stupid, stupid car, right? Because every journalist basically said it was it was stupid, but, oh, I like it. No. Fuck off, all of you. It's crap.
01:01:05
Anwar
Right, exactly. like i yeah i know this is something Oseel has had feelings towards.
01:01:08
AssMan
move on It's okay.
01:01:11
Anwar
PC culture, and I know we don't want to get political. I think this is a really good example of like maybe we don't need to be nice to each other. Maybe sometimes being critical is a good thing. And I think if we love the car like the the car world,
01:01:19
AssMan
Yeah.
01:01:23
Anwar
maybe being a little less nice to the all of these wrestlers. I bet you some of these things are complete
Critical Analysis in Car Journalism
01:01:29
Anwar
like piles of dog shit.
01:01:29
AssMan
Yeah.
01:01:30
Anwar
And nobody's brave enough because everything's become PR to say that these things, and maybe the original was better. Like, hey, these guys, ah okay, screw it, whatever. I'm i'm not going to make some friends now.
01:01:41
Anwar
um The Gunther Works flipped and it was a terrible car. It could not survive a track at 700 horsepower. And a Laguna Seca, that thing flipped. And it is...
01:01:50
Mohammad Khan
what was What was this?
01:01:52
Anwar
This is Patrick Long, one of the ah most famous...
01:01:55
Mohammad Khan
but but i just said I wanted.
01:01:57
Anwar
Yes. So, all right, let's into it now.
01:01:58
Mohammad Khan
I
01:01:59
Anwar
The end, no one's listening. Gunther Works is a very good example of, I think, a case of, hey, you know what? You're being stupid and someone needs to tell you that. Because building a 700 horsepower car with absolutely no roll cage that flipped and nearly killed that man who was driving that car. And that man is not any man. That's Patrick Long driving that car.
01:02:18
Anwar
I think maybe we should stop being so nice to these things.
01:02:22
AssMan
Yeah. Yeah.
01:02:22
Anwar
And if we want the thing to continue, and and i guarantee there's to be a lot of people who only read the press and watch the videos from, you know, Top Gear that's all glowing and stuff. Bollocks for that.
01:02:31
AssMan
yeah
01:02:31
Anwar
Maybe it's time that we we, like, I want to know critically, hey, these guys put a lot of effort, and you know what? It's then just shit. And I'm sorry. It it is shit.
01:02:40
Mohammad Khan
Well, I read previous statement about wanting a gun to work.
01:02:41
Anwar
I think...
01:02:43
Anwar
No, no, no, absolutely fine. and well and And look, we're friends as well, and I will tell you if you're being stupid.
01:02:48
Mohammad Khan
um so
01:02:49
Anwar
No, no, absolutely fine. It looks good. um But I think it's a good example of this wrestler thing is a...
01:02:56
Mohammad Khan
so
01:02:57
Anwar
Sorry, go ahead, man.
01:02:58
Mohammad Khan
but So this is exactly what I was thinking. So the last week I've been watching all these videos. I've been watching all these guys pop up. Now, did we just get to the meat of the podcast? An hour and three minutes. But what's called? I've been watching all these videos. I've been seeing all these guys put together these cars. Everyone's talking about how amazing they are, how nice they are. And I just heard the guy. And look, no discredit. I've never dream i've only sat inside a singer. And so the thing is,
01:03:25
Mohammad Khan
He's talking about how a lot of the engineering and like decisions that made are aesthetically driven. And I'm wondering, are these actually good cars to drive? Now, the DLS, yes, probably, because that car has significant input from Williams, you know, and is built in a completely different facility.
01:03:42
Mohammad Khan
And that's its entire shtick. But the other singers, are they actually any good to drive? Like, the Gunter works, I've just been told, is like, ah you know, at least one of them, one of the commissions was a death trap, okay?
01:03:54
Mohammad Khan
So, or maybe it was a freak addict accent. I don't haven't read on it properly. But all of these guys can't be getting it all right, right? They're tiny. Like, as in, I applaud them for doing what they're doing, but, yeah.
01:04:06
AssMan
yeah yes
01:04:06
Anwar
Can I give you statistic?
01:04:06
AssMan
But from everyone I've spoken to has driven them, they've said, no, this really is astonishing.
01:04:08
Anwar
um
01:04:13
Mohammad Khan
Okay, cool.
01:04:13
AssMan
I have a client who is ordering a DLS, but he said, all right, here's my deposit, but can I test drive the car? And Singer said, no, you'll receive it when you receive it. We don't have a car for you to test drive.
01:04:24
AssMan
So he took his deposit back. Then a friend of his received his DLS. This guy drove and he's like, that was the biggest automotive mistake I've made in my life. This thing is subplugnant.
01:04:31
Anwar
mario pranchitti worked on that car like if if if i was worried about some of these restomants having somebody of that caliber you know be involved in the development that car makes me feel good that it would probably be developed well hold on i want to make another point and i wanted your opinion on it i learned recently that like journalism is a dying industry because there's no money in it we have um
01:04:44
AssMan
Oh, yeah.
01:04:55
Mohammad Khan
Hold on. Unruh, wait, hold on a second. I'm really sorry. But before we keep going down this road, you got to answer the questions, man, because we're loose track. So Asila and I gave you our resto mod of choice.
01:05:08
AssMan
yeah
01:05:08
Mohammad Khan
And yeah.
01:05:10
Anwar
Who cares? Who cares? um
01:05:12
Mohammad Khan
yeah I do. do.
01:05:16
Anwar
All right, fine. like i you know what's interesting? I'd love to see a Testarossa done slightly sportier. And I think the reason I like that idea is because I want to change the character of the car.
01:05:26
Anwar
And that's supposed to be something you're never meant to do with these rest of modules. meant to amplify the you know the European wanker that Asil was talking about. was like, oh, you need to find the spirit. He's French now. Find the spirit of the car. No, fuck off.
01:05:38
Anwar
The spirit the car has been wrong. And I'd love a Testarossa that probably drove more like the ones in the films in the 80s. you know what i mean?
01:05:45
AssMan
it exists the and what It exists, it's called the 512TR.
01:05:45
Anwar
I want to Miami, Miami. But ah
01:05:49
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
01:05:49
Anwar
like
01:05:50
Mohammad Khan
but them Like, it was hideous, but that the last the final 512s were really much better than the Testarossa's
01:05:57
AssMan
The 512M was the best one to drive, but it looked like a frog sitting on something uncomfortable.
01:05:57
Mohammad Khan
i
01:06:01
Anwar
the target market for that car was wrong because it's a car that's meant to be driven, but can only be enjoyed by a blind person. So if you're blind, you can no longer drive it. So you really to catch 22.
01:06:12
Anwar
So maybe like a rest.
01:06:12
AssMan
And also...
01:06:13
Anwar
Yeah. Yeah.
01:06:14
AssMan
The 550
01:06:14
Anwar
You see what I mean? One person here, one person here. Yeah. Yeah.
01:06:18
AssMan
was in the works and the 512M was kind of like a filler that actually worked. Was the the first... but the five twelve m the first
01:06:25
Mohammad Khan
There's a, there's a resto mod I don't like. The Superleggera Touring or Touring Superleggera. They've done the 550 and the 575 or whatever it was. The Coupe, and now they've done a Barchetta version as well.
01:06:37
Mohammad Khan
Like, ah yeah, the styling, they took one of the all-time great front engine Ferrari styling like pieces and turned it in.
01:06:48
Mohammad Khan
I don't know what they were doing with it, what they were thinking, but sorry, Anwar, you can go back to your point now.
01:06:50
AssMan
Oh, yeah.
01:06:53
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
01:06:53
Anwar
No, Ruma 355.
01:06:53
Anwar
Do you remember the 355 Resto mod? That didn't look good either.
01:06:58
Mohammad Khan
yeah
01:06:58
Anwar
And like, so like what was the first question? First question, what car would you make? I think the Tesla has not been made.
01:07:04
Mohammad Khan
but just yeah
01:07:07
Anwar
And then I think the one I'd like to buy...
01:07:08
AssMan
but
01:07:09
Anwar
um
01:07:11
Mohammad Khan
which one Which one would you get that exists already and which is the one that you would create? You've already told us the one you'd create.
01:07:18
Anwar
um ah Oh, you know what? The the one I really liked is that 037 was really cool. and that ah
01:07:25
Mohammad Khan
The Chimera?
01:07:25
AssMan
Yeah.
01:07:26
Anwar
and Or the Diablo. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think those two for me, like so let's put it this way. i yeah i never think of a, I'm going to pull up a car. I've always got Hot Wheels near me. I don't think of a car in isolation. The car needs to come in a setting. It's not like in a white background that exists in a in in a cloud somewhere.
01:07:42
Anwar
i I see resto mod car driving through Tokyo, right, at night in the rain. And the car that I would love to do that in would be, I think, yeah, the 037 would just be incredible driving through some like...
01:07:49
AssMan
yeah
01:07:58
AssMan
would beni What colors would you choose if you expected?
01:08:01
Anwar
You know, me and Mo watched the same video together, um that that that Italian company that did the 288 GTO. that
01:08:08
Mohammad Khan
M-A-T.
01:08:11
Anwar
They did this, like, burgundy...
01:08:14
Mohammad Khan
Oof.
01:08:14
Anwar
ah with the With the bronze wheels was a move I wasn't expecting. And I hate colour wankers. I really hate colour wankers. My car's red, and it's the shade of red that is red.
01:08:22
Mohammad Khan
Alex?
01:08:25
Anwar
ah All of these, i I'm sorry. and Again, I'm probably wrong, but it's meant to be...
01:08:28
Mohammad Khan
um Alex?
01:08:30
Anwar
but I can't give a fuck about these different, like, people wankers are getting but like obsessed about this. is is I like purple car. I like dark purple car. I like red car. So I think I would have dark red or purple.
01:08:44
Anwar
with But the dark red with the bronze and and and to piss people off, to live to offend, I would do a ah purple with like a darker gray or my favorite spec, silver car.
01:08:44
AssMan
and
01:09:00
Anwar
We look at those wheels.
01:09:03
AssMan
That's just cool.
01:09:03
Anwar
Silver, look at that.
01:09:04
AssMan
but Blue wheel. but yeah But yeah, buying it in a spec to piss people off, it takes us back to buying cars for other people. But if you get the Chimera in a dark red or maroon, then it's also a throwback to to the Lancia Delta Integrale Edizione Finale, the last edition, which is that dark red which with the blue and yellow stripe in the middle,
01:09:24
Anwar
Oh, with the yeah, with the... Yeah, yeah,
Evolution of Automotive Journalism
01:09:28
AssMan
which is a...
01:09:28
Anwar
yeah. No, but I'm thinking darker.
01:09:28
AssMan
Okay.
01:09:30
Anwar
I'm thinking darker and metallic. you know I mean? Like a dark metallic with the bronze wheels.
01:09:33
AssMan
oh
01:09:37
Anwar
it's It's a move I never thought I'd see and it's really cool. um I'll forget what I was going to say I don't care anymore. um
01:09:43
AssMan
yeah
01:09:44
Anwar
But...
01:09:44
Mohammad Khan
Well, I'll tell you why you shouldn't care because we were treading down the path of, and sorry listeners, but we were treading down the path of how automotive journalism has changed.
01:09:55
Mohammad Khan
And think, i think okay, I'll let you say your piece because I don't want to dick, but um i think just as with RestoMods, we got a seal on, we do know of quite a few automotive journalists and I think we need to have at least one of them on to help talk about this when we do talk about it.
01:09:55
Anwar
Oh
01:10:01
AssMan
okay
01:10:11
AssMan
Yeah.
01:10:13
Anwar
Making money by being a journalist is a foreign...
01:10:13
AssMan
Yeah. of
01:10:17
Anwar
It's a foreign historical idea. There is no more money in being a critical, unbiased journalist now.
01:10:19
AssMan
yeah
01:10:23
Anwar
The only money is in PR. And the statistic I read recently was, I think it was like 10 to 15 years ago, you get the point, um there was like... the the the the balance between the number p a number of people working in PR and the number of people working journalism was about 50-50.
01:10:39
Anwar
Now it is one journalist for six people in PR. Now what happens when that happens? Now what happens is that every single in piece of information you'll ever hear about a company because there's so many more people working in ah PR will be checked, refined for that company and make them feel good.
01:10:59
Anwar
Whereas a completely unbiased opinion will be much harder to find and probably behind a paywall. So the opinions of all of these things will be shaped not by a critically unbiased, ah like hopefully as they're trying to be objective um perspective, but will be from somebody who's
01:11:05
Mohammad Khan
So,
01:11:17
Anwar
objective is to make you like the thing that they're trying to sell, which I think is awful. And I really miss those muckraking journalists who smoke cigarettes and was friends with nobody.
01:11:27
Anwar
And at the moment in Action Formula E, there is a journalist who's pissed off the entire grid. but and And a lot of the people I know really don't like him, but I do because he doesn't give a single you know F. And I think I miss that.
01:11:42
Anwar
And I was talking to few people in the sport to say, you need that.
01:11:43
AssMan
thank Absolutely, Matt.
01:11:46
Anwar
You need it. Because if it just becomes too polished, it becomes unnatural. I want the jagged edges. Do you know what mean? Yeah.
01:11:54
Mohammad Khan
So I, you now you know this, I've recently moved over.
01:11:55
Anwar
Yeah.
01:11:58
Mohammad Khan
I said I don't work in advertising anymore. I work in strategic communications advisory, right? And this is with largely with corporate and business clients or whatever. So I'm not gonna spill the beans yet, but I think what you're saying about um the PR people versus and the polished and whatnot is it depends on the market. It depends on the industry.
01:12:20
Mohammad Khan
um And I think we let's pick that back up when we have our journalist friends on ah to talk about this in much more depth than we can cover it as well.
01:12:29
AssMan
And do do man do ask them about to reviewing cars honestly in the Gulf because over here, you know my my enormous 1,200 subscriber YouTube channel, I would never do a car that I borrow from one of the manufacturers because like I'm not allowed to be honest with it.
01:12:29
Mohammad Khan
So I think I'll have a lot. Hmm. All
01:12:46
AssMan
I think they usually have a clause whereby if you say anything negative about the car, they take it to court. um And so, like you guys said, like Unwin said, journalism, journalism it was at least in the Gulf, since this is a Gulf,
01:12:57
Mohammad Khan
I think the Grenadier is actually a great car. I was wrong.
01:12:59
Anwar
ah
01:13:00
Mohammad Khan
The Ineos...
01:13:00
Anwar
If you know that's it.
01:13:01
Mohammad Khan
the
01:13:02
Anwar
That's what you do.
01:13:02
Mohammad Khan
ah
01:13:02
AssMan
What
01:13:04
Mohammad Khan
He's in the same room as me as we speak.
01:13:04
Anwar
Same
01:13:06
Mohammad Khan
So that if we want that guy...
01:13:09
Anwar
person, there's our friend who hopefully listens to this. I have it saved. You know who you are. um I'll send it to, i no, actually no, I need to check in with him.
Challenges in Honest Car Reviews
01:13:17
AssMan
was that?
01:13:17
Anwar
This is the article that got him nearly fired, got his boss fired and got the newspaper in so much deep shit because he reviewed a car honestly. And it was like it's one of the first weeks here and it's brilliant.
01:13:25
AssMan
Oh my god.
01:13:29
AssMan
Which car?
01:13:29
Mohammad Khan
And I just want to reiterate how much I love the Grenadier.
01:13:31
Mohammad Khan
The Ineos Grenadier is amazing. What a great car. Yeah. What?
01:13:37
AssMan
It's cool, but it's cool.
01:13:37
Anwar
Should we bring this into land? I won.
01:13:38
AssMan
ah
01:13:39
Mohammad Khan
but
01:13:39
AssMan
yo you your previous The Ineos Grenadier is cool, but it's stupid. and Yesterday I was listening to one of the most recent podcasts about playing Red Dead Redemption 2.
01:13:44
Mohammad Khan
if
01:13:48
AssMan
I was on my way to Valentine ah so to play some poker. and and as soon as you yeah whereas as As soon as you said, the Ineos Grenadier is a stupid car, it had me cracked up because you're right.
01:13:59
AssMan
It doesn't make sense. It shouldn't really exist, but but but I'm glad to be this you know and and it's it's it But it is cool. There's no denying that it's cool. you know, the, the interior is cool.
01:14:10
AssMan
Um, I, I haven't taken it off road, but.
01:14:12
Mohammad Khan
I like the idea of the Grenadier. I want it to be i want it to be a good car. I just don't think it is. And I think that's true from anyone that matters.
01:14:18
Anwar
got and I got served a YouTube pre-roll ad for an Ineos Grenadier here. And do you know what the ad was for? ah Mo, you've gone on mute. But um the ad was for the that new limited edition one that's lifted with the portal axles.
01:14:33
Anwar
They're actually really trying to position themselves as a bit more of an even more expensive specialist resto mod. Because isn't that Ineos actually just a resto
Critique of Ineos Grenadier
01:14:42
Anwar
mod? Isn't it really just the... Like, literally, there's a court case because it's meant to be a defender.
01:14:45
Mohammad Khan
but
01:14:47
AssMan
Wow.
01:14:47
Mohammad Khan
it's It's like the, I guess, no, the Twisted is a resto mod, right?
01:14:50
AssMan
Yeah.
01:14:51
Mohammad Khan
This is more like... What you think?
01:14:54
AssMan
Yeah.
01:14:54
Anwar
All right.
01:14:56
Mohammad Khan
Like the like the the Stratos or the 288 GTO that we're talking about from... ah Actually, even it goes even beyond that because those are still cars based on existing Ferrari platforms, right?
01:15:06
Mohammad Khan
Like I think the 288 Tribute is based on an F8 and the Stratos was on a 430, I think. Oh, no, no.
01:15:12
AssMan
Yeah.
01:15:13
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
01:15:13
Anwar
right
01:15:13
AssMan
but for yeah
01:15:14
Mohammad Khan
Yeah. The Grenadier is its own platform. So that's all new there. So i think i think the closest analogy for me would be the the Gordon Murray T50.
01:15:25
Mohammad Khan
The T-50 is really just the new McLaren in the way that the Ineos is the, you know, the only difference is the T-50 is amazing and but Grenadier didn't get it right in my opinion.
01:15:35
Mohammad Khan
But yeah.
01:15:35
AssMan
they're odes o-d-e that's what they are they're an ode to something uh from the park
01:15:41
Mohammad Khan
Yeah. Maj.
01:15:43
Anwar
But that's what I mean by simulacra. It's a simulation of a thing that never really existed. That idea of the offender that people are married to is not a real car.
01:15:54
Anwar
It is a piece of crap that every single person owned them will say it's a piece of crap.
01:15:55
Mohammad Khan
Yeah. ah like our Land Rover.
01:15:57
AssMan
it's a
01:15:59
Mohammad Khan
and Just want you to know, um, no, uh, but yeah, no, I also the, the whole, ah we're rambling now. Um, you guys want to wrap this up?
01:16:09
AssMan
I can go for another hour, man. No problem at all.
01:16:11
Mohammad Khan
but
01:16:11
Anwar
Let's wrap this up and let's the let's let the any like the other people who listen to this ask us the questions because I'm more than happy to discuss the article, but not on a recording because there's a lot of stuff and I'd like to hang out with you guys.
01:16:24
Anwar
um
01:16:24
AssMan
Yes, send it.
01:16:25
Anwar
I am always very reticent to have a very long podcast because it prevents people from even starting because if it's more than now, not going to start it.
01:16:30
Mohammad Khan
Yeah.
01:16:32
Anwar
I've done that before. So maybe we want to maybe it's a good idea to wrap it up and say thank you.
01:16:37
Mohammad Khan
but yeah you know
01:16:37
Anwar
i
01:16:39
Mohammad Khan
Thank you for being so generous with your time. And ah where can people find more about you in case they're looking for all the things that you do?
01:16:46
Anwar
ah so Make more videos.
01:16:48
Mohammad Khan
Hmm?
01:16:48
AssMan
It's
01:16:48
Anwar
are you not making more videos, Cecile? I hate you. i really enjoyed them. You're very good. And now you're not making them and you've annoyed me.
01:16:55
AssMan
it's it's hot over here and and they're expensive to make, but when the weather gets better, there's very exciting stuff in the works. Getting cars isn't a problem at all. It's more...
01:17:04
Mohammad Khan
You can borrow my Mazda 6 anytime.
01:17:06
AssMan
Habibi, God bless. It was a great car.
Podcast Journey and Conclusion
01:17:09
AssMan
ah but enough People can find me um at speedbird.cars on YouTube and and Instagram. My brother named
01:17:17
Mohammad Khan
And you you are the agent in the Middle East for which brands again? Mm-hmm.
01:17:24
AssMan
So for Amalgam Collection, the Amalgam Model Cars, the Kalmar Porsche, the new Naran Supercar. i I represent Jan Lewin as well in the region. I'm his Middle East director, so he's a collector racing car dealer from Germany.
01:17:42
AssMan
Giamaro Automobili, I'm the agent for them. And I'm also on the steering committee of the Royal Bahrain Concours, which is organized by thorough events who do the Hampton Court Concours.
01:17:52
AssMan
I do a lot of stuff.
01:17:54
Anwar
Yeah, you do.
01:17:54
Mohammad Khan
So yeah, watching watching free videos on YouTube, there's a high chance that you can afford a V12 supercar from Italy.
01:17:54
AssMan
And redemption.
01:17:54
Anwar
ah
01:18:02
Mohammad Khan
But yeah. but yeah ah
01:18:05
AssMan
Guys, in please keep up this podcast.
01:18:06
Mohammad Khan
yeah
01:18:08
AssMan
i'm I'm happy to come back any time. um And I thoroughly enjoy it I'm so glad you guys have done it. I mean, you know, we've been waiting nine years for you guys to do this. So it's it's great. I really love it. So please, please keep them.
01:18:19
AssMan
Keep them up and keep them regular.
01:18:20
Anwar
what What's funny is we've each ah one of us had an idea of doing a podcast with one another.
01:18:21
AssMan
There's always...
01:18:26
Anwar
It's just funny that we did end up on a podcast together because it's kind of what happened because I talked to you about doing a podcast and you talked to Mo about doing a podcast and Mo talked to me about doing a podcast.
01:18:27
AssMan
Yeah.
01:18:34
Mohammad Khan
Thank you.
01:18:34
Anwar
So um again, like I think the problem is that the listeners already on this podcast. I hope you've enjoyed it. And do you want to sign us off, Mo?
01:18:45
Mohammad Khan
Yeah. so you can find us on Instagram at golf underscore spec underscore podcast. um We will eventually post there other than on the stories, but we are definitely looking at the messages as they come through, which no one's done anyway.
01:19:00
Mohammad Khan
um and I get most of I get, we get most of our fan mail on our personal Instagrams or on WhatsApp so far. So it's still five of our friends listening. Um, And ah I've forgotten our email address, which will tell you what will happen when you email us.
01:19:15
AssMan
it was it was I think I remember it was golf underscore podcast underscore GCC at Gmail.
01:19:16
Mohammad Khan
We might not check.
01:19:22
AssMan
Was that it?
01:19:23
Anwar
I think you're right. I think it was, hold on. No, I'm going to tell you now.
01:19:27
Mohammad Khan
It is gulf.specgcc at gmail.com.
01:19:33
AssMan
There you
01:19:33
Anwar
It was the only one available, by the way, because I made it and I don't want to say.
01:19:37
Mohammad Khan
Very professional outfit.
01:19:37
AssMan
go.
01:19:38
Mohammad Khan
We know all our handles. Maybe we don't even know the passwords. Okay,
01:19:42
Anwar
Okay, hang it up now before it hits 120, because if it's 120, it'll look longer than 119.
01:19:42
AssMan
Sponsored by Bluetooth.
01:19:47
Mohammad Khan
bye.
01:19:49
AssMan
like Thanks, guys.