Transcript
Speaker: Thanks for tuning in to the Loser Kid Pinball Podcast.
Speaker: It is episode 92.
Speaker: I am Josh Roop.
Speaker: With me, my co-captain as always.
Speaker: Scott Larson.
Speaker: And Scott, we have such an unusual week of news here.
Speaker: Yeah, it's, well, it's certainly been interesting.
Speaker: But do you know what's not unusual?
Speaker: Ordering a new pinball machine.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And we know that Stern has officially announced Bond is coming.
Speaker: We just haven't officially seen stuff.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So, anyway.
Speaker: So, if you want that new Bond...
Speaker: Who do you hit up, Scott?
Speaker: So I contact Zach and Nicole Minnie at Flippin' Out Pinball.
Speaker: And even if you have, you want one of the newer ones, Godzilla's great, Mandalorian's great, and Rush is great.
Speaker: Rush is actually, since I've had it up, is a lot of fun, and it's a good shooter.
Speaker: So I'm really excited about that one.
Speaker: If you want to get that pre-order in for Bond, definitely go ahead and reach out to them.
Speaker: They can certainly get you on a list.
Speaker: They also have some, I guess, museum quality pieces they're trying to sell.
Speaker: And you can definitely see that on their website too.
Speaker: So at least that section anyway.
Speaker: I don't know if it's necessarily on the website or on their Facebook update, but either way, you can figure it out.
Speaker: Also, Zach's kind of turning into the accessory king.
Speaker: I mean, if you want those toppers, he's got those toppers along with side blades, art blades, all the stuff.
Speaker: If you want any of that, go ahead, hit up Zach.
Speaker: He'll get it for you.
Speaker: And if you do, tell him who's their kid sent you and say happy anniversary.
Speaker: It was his 16th year being married to his wonderful wife, Nicole.
Speaker: So nice.
Speaker: Congratulations to them.
Speaker: Okay, so let's start off.
Speaker: I actually have a quick update on, for those of you who got the Iron Maiden mod, we talked to Steve Govea about and his mass production of the sarcophagus and as the replacement for the plastic.
Speaker: There is, he's not doing these for a mass release, but he did take the Cyborg Eddie and
Speaker: And he updated it and put some shooters on his, like some lights on his lasers.
Speaker: But he also modified the mouth to be more in keeping with how that cyborg Eddie has been portrayed.
Speaker: So that looks really cool.
Speaker: I did ask him if he was planning on doing this for mass production, but he said it's way too much work to actually do that because he's modifying the existing mod or the existing sculpt.
Speaker: But it does look really cool.
Speaker: It looks I guess it looks thematically consistent with his sarcophagus mod.
Speaker: So that looks great.
Speaker: Maybe if you throw enough money at him, he'll make one for you.
Speaker: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker: Say, Steve, I know you're not making this publicly, but hey.
Speaker: On the slide.
Speaker: No, but it's been super nice.
Speaker: And seeing his game progress, it looks really cool.
Speaker: Yeah, definitely.
Speaker: And then speaking of mods, I received a mod last night.
Speaker: And you know me, I'm not huge on mods.
Speaker: You're not a huge modder, yeah.
Speaker: I don't mind if they come with the pinball machine, but I'm not usually the guy that's going to buy one outside and install myself.
Speaker: But we were hanging out in the triple drain chat.
Speaker: We've made one with them.
Speaker: And I think it was Joel that sent us this picture of the Tokyo sign mod that was being made by Stumblr.
Speaker: And it was a limited run.
Speaker: And it's just watching it in action in the video and the pictures.
Speaker: It's quite the eye-catching mod.
Speaker: And I decided, let's give this a try.
Speaker: I ordered it.
Speaker: What's it been?
Speaker: It's been a couple months now.
Speaker: And finally it dropped.
Speaker: I got it last night in the mail.
Speaker: Installed it this morning.
Speaker: Only took about 15, 20 minutes.
Speaker: Not very long.
Speaker: And that's including with kids bothering me and running in and out.
Speaker: And I didn't want their hands inside the pinball machine.
Speaker: really really simple to install i think there's three screws total it's it's really not that bad and some zip ties you got to run the wiring through some wiring harnesses but it's not bad uh overall i am very impressed with this mod from the packaging uh very official showing up a box inside the box so you pull out the box inside of a box it's a black beautiful box pink neon lettering godzilla tokyo sign mod
Speaker: You open that up.
Speaker: It's all like even the feeling.
Speaker: It's not like packing peanuts.
Speaker: It's like this color coded.
Speaker: Oh, wow.
Speaker: Feeling that matches the box.
Speaker: And then you pull out your sign and stuff like that.
Speaker: All of it's prepackaged in Ziplocs.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: I wish they would stick like a post-it note or something in there though saying, hey, this is where you find the instructions because I opened it up and I'm like, this is very intimidating with a couple wiring harnesses.
Speaker: Right, yeah.
Speaker: And this mod, but even like the mod itself, what impresses me is when I think mod, sometimes I think homebrew.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: I think a lot of us think that, like unless you're talking like,
Speaker: a flat-out company like Muselmods.
Speaker: So I was half expecting this to be kind of like homebrew-ish.
Speaker: I've seen Stumbler stuff in the past, and it's really impressive.
Speaker: But pulling this out, it felt official.
Speaker: It felt like a company, which it probably is, a company that has been making these for years.
Speaker: I mean, even Stumbler's printed on the circuit boards.
Speaker: It's printed on the stickers that were holding together the boxes.
Speaker: I mean, it's crazy that like...
Speaker: This little thing is just, it just looks so official.
Speaker: So like I said, you take the two screws off, you pop out your old sign, you put the new sign in, you run the wiring harness down into the cab, zip tie in into place.
Speaker: You're pretty much good to go.
Speaker: The instructions, those like 25 points or whatever, really it's not too bad because there's extra optional stuff because of like a power splitter if you have one of those in your game or whatever.
Speaker: Anything like that.
Speaker: But honestly, I can't wait to see the other two signs because he's talked about making the two signs in the back that go on the buildings to kind of match the neon Tokyo up front.
Speaker: It is eye-catching.
Speaker: As soon as you turn on this machine because it's receiving power, it's totally black when you turn on the game except for the sign.
Speaker: You got this hot pink neon sign.
Speaker: It's gorgeous.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: It definitely adds to the game and makes it feel... I mean, this game already feels packed as is.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And that's one thing I dislike about mods is sometimes... It tends to clutter them up.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: I met a guy when I bought my first pinball machine.
Speaker: He used AstroTurf to cover the apron on his No Good Gophers.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That just seems...
Speaker: I don't know how to put it nicely.
Speaker: Like it just doesn't seem very professional.
Speaker: It looks very much like a, well,
Speaker: Okay, you know those dioramas you made in junior high?
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Again.
Speaker: Yes, that's a perfect example.
Speaker: That's always that fine line that you have to walk when you're putting stuff in a game because if it looks closer to something that would have come in the game from a professional company, then it certainly integrates a lot better.
Speaker: If it looks... I'm not a big fan of taking...
Speaker: like a toy and just throwing in a, like a car or something and just throwing in an led light in it and then just connect it to the bottom.
Speaker: Uh, that it, it, it feels like, Oh, well you just kind of grabbed something off your kid's dresser and put it in there.
Speaker: Um, but if it looks like it should be integrated, then I think it's awesome.
Speaker: I totally agree.
Speaker: And this does, it feels like it is part of the machine.
Speaker: Which number were you, by the way, on the list?
Speaker: Do you remember?
Speaker: 253, no, 230.
Speaker: I was in below the 250.
Speaker: So I think I was 235.
Speaker: Cause you're just right.
Speaker: You're right.
Speaker: Like 10 past me.
Speaker: So you should be getting yours.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I actually paid for mine.
Speaker: And so I should be getting mine soon.
Speaker: So I'm that, that's why I was like looking for, Oh, I wonder where Josh is.
Speaker: Oh, I'm 240.
Speaker: Oh, actually you're 239.
Speaker: I'm 240.
Speaker: Oh, nice.
Speaker: So you should be getting yours any day now.
Speaker: I should be getting mine any day.
Speaker: It probably, since Vernal is a little closer to New England, excuse me, then it should, that's probably why it came to you first.
Speaker: You would think that, but the weird part is they ship everything to Salt Lake.
Speaker: So they ship it past me and then they ship it back towards me.
Speaker: So unless if it went through Denver, but I highly doubt it.
Speaker: FedEx usually goes through Salt Lake.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But go check out his website, StumblerPinball.com.
Speaker: Davey is awesome.
Speaker: He was great to work with.
Speaker: I can't speak highly enough of this man.
Speaker: The mods are so professional, so well done.
Speaker: And if you haven't looked at his Creature from the Black Lagoon snack bar mod, go check this out as well.
Speaker: It really brings a lot.
Speaker: That's really impressive, too.
Speaker: The one they eat at, like the diner mod.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: And even each letter lights up and it looks, it looks like a, a sign you'd see out on the street going to a cafe or whatever, you know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Well, I am looking forward to getting my mod in then for, uh, for that.
Speaker: So,
Speaker: Yeah, it's always that fine line too, because you could legitimately dump in a $2,000 worth of mods into games.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And this wasn't a cheap mod.
Speaker: No.
Speaker: So it can get expensive really quickly.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I think that's the only reason I did switch out this one because even though the flat plastic works, I think that this adds more depth to the visualization of the game.
Speaker: Sure.
Speaker: Well, and that's why you see a difference between like, well, I'll go back to Iron Maiden.
Speaker: An easy way of making it
Speaker: of bringing down the build of material is to pull out 3D items and replace them with a 2D plastic printed item.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: And so, and that's cause that's super cheap.
Speaker: It's super cheap to manufacture.
Speaker: But actually if you have something that's 3d sculpted, it has to be manufactured, which I mean, if you're doing a volume run, it's not as big of a deal, but most of them, you know, it's that that's the reason why you're paying more for a premium or an LE and that's an easy way for them to scale it back.
Speaker: But it is eye catching when you see it to say, oh yeah, that does make a difference.
Speaker: And like I said, where it kind of integrates with the game, like where it's already replacing something, it makes it look a lot better in my opinion.
Speaker: And Godzilla is a beautiful game.
Speaker: I think that's the other thing too.
Speaker: I don't foresee Godzilla ever leaving my collection.
Speaker: I love this game.
Speaker: It has officially went to the top of my favorite game of all time.
Speaker: I think that having any Elwynn game is actually, like I will always have at least one, but currently I have all four.
Speaker: And I don't really see me moving any out anytime soon.
Speaker: Probably the next one to go for me would be Led Zeppelin just because even my wife's like, I don't really like playing this game.
Speaker: And the theme's great, but I don't have a lot of fun shooting it.
Speaker: I'm also considering like Mandalorian, but I haven't had enough time on it.
Speaker: But it's very similar to, well, I wouldn't say similar, but it doesn't engage me as much.
Speaker: And since I am not a huge fan of a gimmick taking up a huge portion of real estate, that little tilty upper play field, it feels like it shuts the game off a lot more than having a more open play field.
Speaker: I did end up selling Earthshaker, speaking of being a rip games.
Speaker: So I'm just kind of waiting.
Speaker: I'm waiting to see what comes out.
Speaker: But before we move on to that, because we do have some stuff to go off with Bond, I guess.
Speaker: We want to hurry and talk to you about Expo, right?
Speaker: Go ahead.
Speaker: I was going to say, a lot of people...
Speaker: A lot of people, this is their first time going to pinball expo in Chicago.
Speaker: Some of the highlights we'd recommend.
Speaker: Um, and obviously people want to know about this stuff because one of our top listened episodes is pinball expo recapped from last year.
Speaker: Really?
Speaker: Like the one I went around with like my voice recorder.
Speaker: No, that was, I was like that.
Speaker: That was okay.
Speaker: That would have surprised me.
Speaker: No, I'm talking about the one after we came back.
Speaker: It has me and you playing pinball Olympics is our picture.
Speaker: Oh, yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Pinball Expo is great.
Speaker: The free play area, we hope, is a little different than it was last year.
Speaker: But really, the main focal point of Expo is the manufacturer's area.
Speaker: The place is beautiful.
Speaker: I mean, it's very well lit.
Speaker: I wish this is the one problem I have with it, too, is they only have it open from like 5 to 10.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I will say I did look because of that.
Speaker: I did look at, cause I actually talked to one of our listeners.
Speaker: Her name is Julie and she is, she was asking about going to going to expo.
Speaker: And so I talked to her and I said, well, okay, so here are the things that are a lot of seminars that go during the day, but the event hall is more limited.
Speaker: However, I pulled up to see when the event hall is open and I
Speaker: Thursday, it is open at noon.
Speaker: Oh, wow.
Speaker: Cool.
Speaker: And it goes till midnight.
Speaker: Friday, it is open at 10 a.m.
Speaker: and then goes till midnight.
Speaker: And Saturday, it opens at 10 a.m.
Speaker: So that is a change from last time.
Speaker: But wait, is that specifically just the free play area or is that?
Speaker: It says event hall.
Speaker: I'm not sure what the event hall is.
Speaker: does that include the free play and the vendor area or just the fleet free play area?
Speaker: I'm not sure.
Speaker: I'm not sure either, but that would be exciting if that's the case, because that is my one problem I had with that area is not only was the manufacturer area closed off from like five to 10, but
Speaker: But they also put all the homebrews back in there.
Speaker: It was kind of strange.
Speaker: It was... And that was one thing I walked away kind of regretting is I didn't get to play.
Speaker: I saw Sonic.
Speaker: But everyone was always playing it.
Speaker: And I didn't have time.
Speaker: And even Saturday night when I'm like, Scott, I've got to go to bed.
Speaker: I know it's only 10, but I have to be out of here at 3 in the morning to get on my flight.
Speaker: And you're like, well, just come play at least just a round or two.
Speaker: I'm like, but with the line the way it is, it's insane, you know?
Speaker: But...
Speaker: If that's the case, if the whole thing's open for 10 plus hours.
Speaker: It'll be nice to see.
Speaker: It'll be nice to see.
Speaker: The other thing, too, is know that if you're playing pinball right at midnight when it does all shut down, they will shut off the game.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You'll be in the middle of the game.
Speaker: They won't say anything.
Speaker: They're just like, you're done.
Speaker: And click.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I was like, oh, well, I guess we're done.
Speaker: Like there was no negotiating.
Speaker: It was like, I'm on my last ball.
Speaker: Let's let's let's finish this out.
Speaker: No, they were just like, you're done.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Seminars were great.
Speaker: I do recommend hanging out for, I hope Dwight does family without the feud again.
Speaker: Yeah, that was fun.
Speaker: That was, that was awesome.
Speaker: I'd highly recommend that one.
Speaker: Uh, any of the manufacturers seminars are fantastic as well.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You get a lot of good information there.
Speaker: Plus they give away, they give away prizes and stuff that like that.
Speaker: There's another seminar too, but I'm not allowed to talk about it yet.
Speaker: So, Oh, done, done, done.
Speaker: Um, there's a, okay.
Speaker: Are they doing the, uh, the pinball Olympics, um, again this year, do you know?
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I was going to actually look that up really quick.
Speaker: If you do want to do, I assume they're going to do pinball Olympics.
Speaker: It's just kind of has been going on for years now.
Speaker: And I don't see why they wouldn't do it unless if Banger J says, Hey, that's, I'm not doing it this year.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But they've had repeated things on it.
Speaker: Let me hear you.
Speaker: I'm doing the Googles.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I, I saw Jay announced last.
Speaker: Oh, okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Actually, the last update I see on their Facebook is from 2021.
Speaker: Yeah, same here.
Speaker: So we'll just have to keep a close eye on that.
Speaker: We are a month and a half out from Expo.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So we'll kind of try to update.
Speaker: If you can get in on this, it's usually a limited number of tickets, usually about 100.
Speaker: They sell it quick.
Speaker: But if you can go do pinball Olympics, it's definitely experience that is like none other I'd say in the whole world.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And you will have a great time.
Speaker: It was a blast.
Speaker: It is.
Speaker: You are committing that Saturday though.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Cause it's about a 45 minute drive.
Speaker: So you need a combination of a ride and,
Speaker: And the ability to stick around for four hours.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Four hours plus.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But they feed you.
Speaker: They have refreshments.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: It was totally worth it.
Speaker: It was totally worth it.
Speaker: I'm actually kind of surprised the tickets.
Speaker: When we first paid for them, they were $100 a ticket, which that might go up.
Speaker: But there was a lot that they gave you.
Speaker: For your ticket money.
Speaker: Yeah, it was an event.
Speaker: So you played all the games and they had even brought in extra games for, they had a head-to-head Metallica, which was kind of fun because if you went and hit the cross target, it would immediately tilt out the other machine.
Speaker: So just, you're not going to have that set up just all the time, but they pulled in extra games, pulled in a friend to do that.
Speaker: So...
Speaker: I hope they do it again because it was a blast.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: Also, Expo, it's the same area.
Speaker: There's not a ton of food there, so you will have to probably find some kind of travel.
Speaker: The hotel does have a shuttle, if I remember correctly, and there are some places close by that weren't too bad.
Speaker: Yeah, it seems like you'll probably be doing a rideshare app and finding a location that's close.
Speaker: It is not in downtown Chicago.
Speaker: I mean, it is kind of in the industrial area where it's not, there's a lot of, I guess, event centers, but it really isn't centered around a place that people gather.
Speaker: Yeah, it almost feels like a suburb to me.
Speaker: It's solely a suburb.
Speaker: Yeah, it's it's also like a it's a suburb.
Speaker: But OK, just imagine your town and then driving like 25 minutes out of town, out of the center of town, because there's always some convention center because the land is cheaper out there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But it's not really next to any major restaurants because there's not as much traffic out there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So that's how that happens.
Speaker: It's a great location, though, and there's some really great food nearby.
Speaker: We'd recommend the Chicago deep dish pizza.
Speaker: It's always a fight, though, so I don't know who you'd want to get the recommendation from, but we hear Illuminati's, which I had while we were there.
Speaker: It was delicious.
Speaker: It was really good.
Speaker: And Giridano's, which I think is better, in my opinion.
Speaker: And I think Gino's East, I think that's another one.
Speaker: But, okay, I will say...
Speaker: I think they're all pretty good, but realize it is thick.
Speaker: And so it's like eating a big slice of lasagna.
Speaker: So you are, you're going to have one, maybe two slices.
Speaker: If you go for three, then you're, you're probably going to bust your belly.
Speaker: How many did we, we had, I want to say about 10 people at our booth, maybe a little less.
Speaker: We only had three pizzas and there was plenty of leftovers.
Speaker: There was, yeah.
Speaker: Which is impressive.
Speaker: In my opinion, you always do pizza math, right?
Speaker: You go to the party, they open up the boxes, you count out the people, you're like eight slices per pizza.
Speaker: That gives me about two slices at how many people stare.
Speaker: Sure.
Speaker: Keep an eye on, you know what I'm saying?
Speaker: Everyone does the pizza math.
Speaker: If you don't, you're lying.
Speaker: I promise you that.
Speaker: You didn't do the pizza math correctly at Texas pinball when we had rando dude who walked up and just opened up our pizza box and grabbed three slices and walked away.
Speaker: Folded into like a massive sandwich and was like, thanks.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: No, he didn't say anything.
Speaker: Just picked it up and walked.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But at the dish places, realize your time is going to be longer.
Speaker: It's going to be 45 minutes to cook it.
Speaker: So sometimes people call in and place the order before they even get there.
Speaker: It didn't feel that long because we had a lot of great people there.
Speaker: We had Jeff Teolas.
Speaker: He had Tim Lee.
Speaker: We had Joel with Triple Jam.
Speaker: Triple Jam.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Triple Jam.
Speaker: We were just surrounded by all these wonderful people.
Speaker: Tim Lee's wife was there.
Speaker: Amy.
Speaker: It was great to meet her and get to know her as well.
Speaker: Um, so there is that.
Speaker: And then we went and hit lunch with eclectic gamers at Portillo's.
Speaker: If you want to try Italian beef, this is a place to go.
Speaker: Fantastic.
Speaker: Weren't you the only one who like, there was something about your order that was completely different than, uh, Tony and Dennis and mine.
Speaker: You, you all got, I didn't know you could put a sausage inside the sandwich along with your Italian beef.
Speaker: So there was that.
Speaker: And then I got the hot peppers, which are not hot.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: They were good.
Speaker: They had a lot of flavor, but they were not hot.
Speaker: I think I just got the standard.
Speaker: You know when you walk up, and there's always that one thing.
Speaker: It's like you go to McDonald's, and you're getting a Big Mac.
Speaker: And so I just went and got whatever standard thing they had.
Speaker: Well, I wish I would have gotten the Italian beef with the sausage in the middle.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But if you like French dips, it's very similar.
Speaker: They take the beef.
Speaker: It's got a lot of good flavor.
Speaker: They soak it in like an au jus.
Speaker: And then they put it on your bun.
Speaker: I went with the hot peppers.
Speaker: I recommend the hot peppers.
Speaker: I think it was good.
Speaker: I think I ended up just eating the meat and leaving the soggy bun, but...
Speaker: But other than that, if you have any more questions, I'm more than happy to tell you about Expo.
Speaker: We're really excited.
Speaker: Flipping the script is good to go.
Speaker: I think we've got the schedule pretty well set.
Speaker: We're doing a little adjustments here and there.
Speaker: Some of the guests, Eric Meniere, Keith Elwin, Robert Sharp has agreed his movie premiere does not conflict with Expo.
Speaker: So he will be there and he's on the schedule.
Speaker: We're excited for that.
Speaker: Maybe we'll use this as an opportunity.
Speaker: If there's some product there, we'll get it signed as well for the auction.
Speaker: We're going to be doing 12 hours, 10 a.m.
Speaker: to 10 p.m.
Speaker: on Thursday.
Speaker: And with this going till, did you say midnight on Thursday?
Speaker: Well, it says Thursday is, yeah, it goes to midnight.
Speaker: There's also the, well, finish up what you're talking about, flipping the script.
Speaker: Well, I was just going to say, we're going to be open the whole time, but it sounds like we'll wrap up a little bit before Expo's done.
Speaker: So if you want to come over and hang out with us afterwards, we're going to have the poor man there.
Speaker: We're going to have Zach Many with Pinball Show slash Straight Down the Middle slash Flippin' Out, whatever you want to talk about.
Speaker: Amanda Hamilton, Bill Webb's going to be there.
Speaker: We've got Craig Bobby is going to do some of the interview as well.
Speaker: He's excited for his guest.
Speaker: Jan Rupert of NoCoinDrop added, which congratulations on the new job, Jan.
Speaker: Hope the move goes well.
Speaker: That's awesome that you got that job over there at Joann's.
Speaker: But other than that,
Speaker: You know, we're going to have so much going on with this.
Speaker: We've got so much product.
Speaker: I'm going to.
Speaker: I want to talk about one of the items donated.
Speaker: I don't know if I can officially talk about yet, but this is a one of a kind product donated to us.
Speaker: I will tell you is a play field, but it's a play field like nothing you've ever seen.
Speaker: And you're going to want this.
Speaker: I want this.
Speaker: Everyone I showed in the group, that's part of the flipping out group.
Speaker: Yeah, I looked at that and I said, I may have to bid on that.
Speaker: Yeah, I'm just like, I really want this.
Speaker: And yeah, it's going to be awesome.
Speaker: So when we get the opportunity to, we'll show up probably on the Facebook.
Speaker: Right, on the Facebook.
Speaker: On the book of face.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So looking at the schedule of events, a couple of things that people may be interested in.
Speaker: Jersey Jack has an in-tour option.
Speaker: It looks like it says 9, 9.45, 10.30, 11, 15, 12, 12.40.
Speaker: So that's on Thursday.
Speaker: Stern is doing a virtual tour on Friday at 10.30.
Speaker: So, Josh, what is your thought on a virtual tour versus a group tour?
Speaker: I enjoyed the virtual tour.
Speaker: I felt like we got to see more in depth behind Stern and you kind of get the best of both worlds with this one because you do have the virtual tours for Stern, but they will have an in-person JJP tour.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So if you want to physically go to a pinball manufacturer, you can definitely go to JJP and I guarantee that.
Speaker: it's going to be a similar production line that what Stern has.
Speaker: And with Stern, I agree with you that having the, it was Jack Danger who did it last year where he went around with a camera.
Speaker: He walked into a lot of places that there's no way a tour could go into.
Speaker: So it was, it was quite nice to see that and just a little behind the scenes.
Speaker: No, I totally agree.
Speaker: And I, I highly recommend it if you got opportunity, that's on Thursday too.
Speaker: So, and also there are, there's also tournaments too.
Speaker: So if you're looking for tournaments, there's definitely something about something for almost everybody.
Speaker: There's main A and B there's women's classics kids.
Speaker: There's an Atari pinball expo tournament.
Speaker: So just keep that in mind.
Speaker: If you're looking for some sort of tournament for your skill level, there will be something.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And the tournament is fun.
Speaker: I just recommend if you're going for expo and you want to see the vendor stuff and you want to see what expo has to offer, I would recommend maybe not playing in the tournament on last year.
Speaker: Thursday was really fun.
Speaker: not packed with anything.
Speaker: And so after the Stern tour and with the vendor hall being shut down till five in the afternoon, I'm like, well, I'll just do the tournament then.
Speaker: And so it was nice to do the tournament on Thursday, but then Friday rolled around and it really cut into my schedule because of, well, just the way that the tournament set up.
Speaker: So I recommend if you're going to go for tournament, play in tournament.
Speaker: If you're going to go for the show, go for the show.
Speaker: Other than that, that's, that's my biggest recommendation.
Speaker: I think that's enough about Expo and flipping the script.
Speaker: We're excited for it.
Speaker: Things are ramping up.
Speaker: We're getting so close.
Speaker: Let's talk about what everyone wants to talk about right now.
Speaker: Is that your James Bond?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I thought you were going to... Oh, yeah.
Speaker: Great.
Speaker: He's doing his own theme music.
Speaker: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker: No, James Bond.
Speaker: So it was supposed to be revealed today.
Speaker: We're recording at 1154 on Tuesday.
Speaker: It was officially announced by Stern last week that they would be revealing today.
Speaker: But they did not.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But the interesting part is, is they were supposed to be doing it in conjunction with IAPA out in England.
Speaker: So they were setting up the game yesterday and someone took plenty of photos of it.
Speaker: Unbeknownst to, I guess, the guy setting it up.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Who knows?
Speaker: I guess I won't get too much into the origin of those photos, but I think everybody who's interested in pinball has seen them.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: I think, though, let's try and hit the official notes.
Speaker: So Gomez was on Marco's tech stream last week.
Speaker: If you aren't watching that, you should.
Speaker: Scott's always been talking about this.
Speaker: Like, we need someone to teach us how to fix pinball machines.
Speaker: Marco's picked this up, and they're doing fantastic with it.
Speaker: And they're all recorded, so if you want to go back and look at them, go look at them.
Speaker: But Gomez was on, and he was talking about, yes, I'm doing Bond.
Speaker: Yes, it's...
Speaker: was originally Steve Ritchie's design, but I started, it was so early in the process, I decided to rebuild it from the ground up.
Speaker: He showed off the scuba diver toy.
Speaker: It was really, he did it so quickly.
Speaker: You had to kind of take a screen grab of it and figure out what he was holding up.
Speaker: We're thinking that's under the play field somewhere.
Speaker: He also talked about the Aston Martin car, which is very famous from Goldfinger and having the injector seat from that.
Speaker: in the game as well.
Speaker: And that's kind of what we officially know about bond.
Speaker: Now, unofficially, what are your thoughts of these pictures, Scott?
Speaker: This does look to be a premium because I'm looking at the lower scoop and it looks like it has the illuminated cutout on the left side.
Speaker: So, and that's, that's at least all I can see on that.
Speaker: The game is not powered on it.
Speaker: It obviously has insider connected on one side has what, I don't know if these are directly from the movie posters, but they look very much like they were made in 1960.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Or 19 directly from the movie posters.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And then on the right side, the art has other movie posters that,
Speaker: Then you get into the playfield.
Speaker: You have a looks like a rocket with a looks like a horseshoe ramp in the upper left.
Speaker: On the right, you have a couple of wire forms.
Speaker: You also have what looks like the pop bumper nest that looks in the upper right part of the playfield.
Speaker: A lot a lot of wire form ramps in this one.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: So there's a lot of stuff.
Speaker: And it looks like you have Diamonds Are Forever, You Only Live Twice, Thunderball, Goldfinger.
Speaker: It's all the Connery movies.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: It is the Connery.
Speaker: Well, it also has You Only Live Twice because wasn't there like another Bond that like Roger Moore had already started being Bond and then didn't Sean Connery come out with like one more movie?
Speaker: Yeah, they brought him back.
Speaker: Yeah, it was kind of weird.
Speaker: So there was actually two Bonds.
Speaker: There was one that they brought on from one movie and then they did Roger Moore.
Speaker: No, they had like a spoof like Casino Royale, which was originally kind of like a spoof movie.
Speaker: And then they brought that Connery to.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But I think there was some sort of issues with the licensing at that time in that it was, even though it was Bond, it wasn't really officially released through the Bond network.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: There was something very weird about that because Roger Moore had already done one or two movies.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, yeah, and it looks like they're bringing back the crane or something similar because it looks like an arm with a guy in a tux and a jet pack, and it looks like it moves out on the play field.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: The rumor has it that this is Gomez, which has a shot that's quite similar to the Katana shot in Deadpool.
Speaker: So that actually... It's not a rumor.
Speaker: He did officially confirm last.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So it does feel like a Gomez game.
Speaker: And I don't know.
Speaker: On a scale of excitement, Josh, given the limited amount that we have,
Speaker: How excited are you?
Speaker: And right now we're also going to get into more of the weirdness of this week, but I'm just, I'm going off your initial impression.
Speaker: So on Monday, the photos were leaked and you saw them.
Speaker: What did you think?
Speaker: just looking at artwork alone, wolf, it's rough.
Speaker: It's weird to me.
Speaker: It's weird to me.
Speaker: Like typically you look at a pinball machine.
Speaker: They're pretty symmetrical on the artwork, which is fine.
Speaker: You can use the excuse.
Speaker: Well, slides into my lineup, yada, yada, yada.
Speaker: But like the idea of putting movie posters on one side and then having like a,
Speaker: firefight action scene on the other side with connery who for some odd reasons not holding the airplane controls he's doing his classic bond pose with the the gun up in the air which you know everyone does in the middle of a firefight when an airplane it just it's weird to me it almost looks caricature-ish and so it was really weird and then digging into the play field after looking at these pictures
Speaker: it's definitely unique i don't feel like there's a gomez game that has been made like this before there are similar shots are classic signatures from gomez but i feel like it's kind of a fresh take from gomez versus what we've seen in the past i mean batman 66 was a remake of dark knight uh deadpool was pretty fresh um
Speaker: Beatles was a rehash of Sea Witch, which was just an updated version.
Speaker: So in terms of seeing something new from Gomez, I feel like that is it.
Speaker: I want to see the video on this because looking at the play field, it looks like it could be a lot of fun.
Speaker: I'm concerned at some of the shots because like that, there's like a double ramp on the right side of it.
Speaker: You got the ramp that curves in and then almost T-bones into the side of it.
Speaker: I want to see how that works in action.
Speaker: I'm concerned though of rejects.
Speaker: You shoot that shot and it doesn't actually like hit the metal and turn, do the 180 and go down the ramp.
Speaker: I'm nervous.
Speaker: It'll hit the metal and bounce back down towards you.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: We'll see.
Speaker: Um, and it's hard too, cause there's like foam in the picture, holding the missile into place.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: That's obviously what it shipped with because anytime you're, you know, when, when we got Mandalorian, the razor crest was all, you know, packaged up so it doesn't get banged up, but there's a lot of vertical up kickers in this.
Speaker: It looks like that's the only way to get to bond.
Speaker: That's on,
Speaker: the jet pack, but it's cool that there's a, there's a target from above.
Speaker: So it'd be interesting if you can control bond on the arm and then you have to line it up to drop it on the target.
Speaker: Has that ever been done before?
Speaker: I'm not for sure.
Speaker: I know like I'm getting rescue 911 vibes with, with bond on.
Speaker: We had Mick on a stick, right?
Speaker: This is bond bond on a wand.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: There you go.
Speaker: So,
Speaker: With the Bond on a wand, are you going to be able to control Bond or is it just going to come out and you just hit the action button when you think it's close enough?
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I feel like Gomez is really known for his mechs.
Speaker: So I feel like this does have some cool mechs in it between the rocket, the jetpack, the ejector seat from the Aston Martin, which appears to be a lid on the car that the ball comes up through, assuming through another vertical up kicker.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: It looks fun.
Speaker: And it's hard to, so we don't know exactly who's doing code, but based off of the shots of the play field from the leaks, you're able to move your multiplier and lock it in with your lockdown bar button.
Speaker: And the only person I can think of that's ever done that before is Dwight with Star Wars.
Speaker: So I'm half wondering if Dwight's on this.
Speaker: That's who I'm leaning towards.
Speaker: Yeah, and Tanya did Deadpool.
Speaker: It wasn't a deep rule set, but it's been very popular because of the balanced nature of it.
Speaker: But Tanya has been really busy with doing Insider Connected from what I understand.
Speaker: And so I don't know if he has time to do something like this, but it could be another Dwight.
Speaker: And since there was enough time between Rush and this one, I think you could
Speaker: probably put anybody in there that you wanted.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Sexton and Ray Day, I think would still be too tied up.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: That would be a little tight.
Speaker: I think those are, those are the ones that are out just because they just released rush.
Speaker: But I think the other options are there.
Speaker: Well, and Rick Nagel's always with Elwin and that was, you know, on Godzilla.
Speaker: So, right.
Speaker: Really?
Speaker: What does that leave you with?
Speaker: You've got Dwight, maybe Lonnie Ropp.
Speaker: I'm trying to think who else was, who else was,
Speaker: Who else is there?
Speaker: Dwight, Lonnie, Tanya.
Speaker: And those are the, those are the three that typically come up.
Speaker: So, but let's get, can we get into the weirdness of this?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So this is the elephant in the room.
Speaker: They, they announced that, Oh, we're going to have this big announcement on, you know?
Speaker: So the teaser came out, what, like Thursday or Friday, something like that came out Tuesday of last week, Tuesday of last week.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And then in the meantime, there,
Speaker: We had the death of the Queen of England.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And, okay, it's not too much of a shock.
Speaker: She was 96 years old, and she had some health issues associated with age, obviously, in the last couple of years.
Speaker: And so she passed away.
Speaker: Now, it was still announced and set up at the expo or whatever they're calling it.
Speaker: IAPA.
Speaker: IAPA.
Speaker: And that's where the pictures came from.
Speaker: It looked like they were setting up the game and that's where the pictures showed up.
Speaker: However, after that, Stern put an announcement out that, oh, well, in respect for the queen, we are delaying the launch for a week.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Which is even weirder because that was followed by a statement from IAPA saying that.
Speaker: Nothing's happened.
Speaker: Nothing's changing.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And so it seems like, you know, when there's a statement that is released that it doesn't seem to line up.
Speaker: Something smells funny.
Speaker: Something smells odd.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Because it seems like, okay, I don't really care why they delayed something.
Speaker: I mean, things get delayed all the time.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But it seems like a false flag to say it was because of the queen when nothing else was delayed.
Speaker: Well, there's nothing.
Speaker: Honestly, let's say, let's be realistic here.
Speaker: This has to either come down to a licensor or there has to be something like they forgot to convert these over to
Speaker: uk voltage like there's there's gotta be some kind of major thing there's zero chance that they forgot to to convert it to uk voltage they've been doing they've been doing games uh for europe forever and so my point being is it's like if people saw the leaked photos yeah and then like stern for some odd reason got a bunch of backlash from this it's not like they're changing the artwork in a week they're they're not dumping the game no um yeah
Speaker: Okay, this is what I suspect.
Speaker: I suspect that they were waiting on full approval from the licensor.
Speaker: And the licensor dragged their feet on giving it.
Speaker: Now, we've seen that before.
Speaker: We saw the leaked photos of the Star Wars R2-D2 topper.
Speaker: And then that was in no man's land forever.
Speaker: And then eventually it came out and guess what?
Speaker: It was exactly the same.
Speaker: So are they going to change a game based on a leaked photo?
Speaker: No way.
Speaker: No way.
Speaker: Well, that's if the licensor saw it and was like, what the crap?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: If the licensor only saw the game from a leaked photo and they hadn't been previewed on it, then that's a major problem.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But I don't, I don't think that's the case.
Speaker: Like, and that here's the other hard part too.
Speaker: Like the queen is a fine excuse.
Speaker: I guess that's what we're calling it.
Speaker: It's a convenient excuse.
Speaker: It's a convenient excuse.
Speaker: But,
Speaker: But it really puts Stern in a hard spot when it comes to licensors because it's not like they can come out and flat out say, hey, we're pushing it out because people at Bond said we had to.
Speaker: Because we don't have approval.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so it really puts them in a rock and a hard spot when it comes to licensors because these are the people they're dealing with and they have to be very –
Speaker: Well, you have to play nice with licensors.
Speaker: You can't come in hardball because the bottom line is it's their intellectual property that you are licensing from them to make the game.
Speaker: You don't know the relationships.
Speaker: Well, we don't.
Speaker: They do.
Speaker: They don't know what they know what other relationships will be involved in future titles with a licensor.
Speaker: It's not just James Bond.
Speaker: MGM owns part of this licensing or most of it.
Speaker: MGM owns a bunch of licenses, especially from the 60s, 70s, 80s, which seems to be Stern's wheelhouse of pulling from.
Speaker: So you can't upset the licensor now without...
Speaker: making ways for what could be future problems.
Speaker: So that's where we're at with this.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's so, okay.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: What's your initial thought on this?
Speaker: The delay.
Speaker: What do you think?
Speaker: I've already stated that I think this is just pending licensure approval and they anticipated they were getting it and they didn't have it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I think that's what it is too.
Speaker: Because all the other things don't sound like there's a lot.
Speaker: And the rumor mill is going wild.
Speaker: Insanely wild right now.
Speaker: You know, like that they're pulling that or Elwynn's releasing his own version of the game.
Speaker: Okay, should we talk about that right now?
Speaker: Okay, go ahead.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So it was posted this morning by Canada's Pinball Podcast.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That L1, because Gomez last week, this is coming from some factual evidence.
Speaker: Gomez last week on Marco says, we're making a pro, a premium, an LE, and then we have a fourth edition.
Speaker: No, I don't think they said that they had a fourth edition.
Speaker: We have a fourth surprise.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: involved with this sure so a lot of people have been speculating well we're going batman style we're going to do a super le right there's gonna be right well but canada then released a post on his facebook page stating that l1's actually making the fourth game that it's not going to be limited so it's going to be readily available for whoever wants it and the distributor gets to set the price that seems super unlikely to me
Speaker: Because when, and again, we are, we don't have any inside information.
Speaker: We are speculating on someone's speculation.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So we are on, we are indefinitely, there is nothing that is concrete about our opinions here.
Speaker: However, let's, let's look at this factually though.
Speaker: How much resources go into producing a single game?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: How many, and this is obviously calculated into the building materials.
Speaker: How many do they have to sell to break even?
Speaker: I don't know with Stern.
Speaker: Obviously, I don't know either.
Speaker: But Stern has a reputation of making their money off volume sales.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: They have, you know, 80, you know, whatever Gary's claiming it is, like 85% of the market share right now.
Speaker: And so it is a crazy amount of stuff.
Speaker: And the reason why they're doing it, we saw this with Toy Story.
Speaker: When Toy Story was released and it was a ultra premium price, the first day it was gangbusters and then ghosts.
Speaker: Because everyone's like, well, $12,000.
Speaker: Is that, is that what I want to pay my money for?
Speaker: So you have to say that JJP at least had the model.
Speaker: I'm not going to make it in volume.
Speaker: I'm going to make it in maximizing my profit per each game.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So that, that would seem completely different than Stern's model.
Speaker: And the,
Speaker: It makes a lot more sense to have a super limited premium edition, the double O's edition, maybe.
Speaker: Because that would actually say, okay, it's the same play field.
Speaker: We're not investing any more resources into it.
Speaker: But we are putting a special art package in it or something like they did with the SLE Batmans.
Speaker: Some sort of special gimmick that sets that aside.
Speaker: However, the play is exactly the same.
Speaker: So that is a complete marketing slash money decision, which I think is smart.
Speaker: I mean, it's not, I'm not, I'm not the whale.
Speaker: I'm not the target, but there are whales and targets out there who say, I want to pay for the exclusivity of my super.
Speaker: So that is my thought process on that.
Speaker: I also think it's super unlikely that Stern would compete against themselves with competing designers.
Speaker: Yeah, that's so weird.
Speaker: This has never been done in the history of pinball, right?
Speaker: We've been doing this almost.
Speaker: Pinball's been around since the 1930s.
Speaker: We're almost at 100 years of pinball.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I don't think ever once have they ever had the same theme designed by two different people.
Speaker: It just seems kind of weird to me.
Speaker: The only difference you could say is, yeah, well, okay, there actually have been.
Speaker: But it has been Gomez doing the home pin version or the home version of Spider-Man.
Speaker: or Gomez doing the home version of star Wars or Jack danger doing the home version of Jurassic park.
Speaker: So yes, it has been done, but not simultaneously released and not something that I would say like aggressively competes with the other product.
Speaker: It just so weird to me.
Speaker: What realistic, let's be realistic here.
Speaker: Gomez spends 13 plus months on bond, right?
Speaker: Designing this with his team, right?
Speaker: Say it is Dwight.
Speaker: They've dumped everything into this game.
Speaker: Why would you have Elwin, which is arguably the best designer?
Speaker: He is the best designer right now.
Speaker: He's currently your golden goose, yes.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Out of any of the corporations, any of the manufacturers out there.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Why would you release an Elwin versus a Gomez?
Speaker: The only thing I could come up with, they want a barometer test.
Speaker: They want to gauge...
Speaker: what keith and one does against someone that isn't 100 always a designer because gomez only does designs when when the occasion arrives right right it was never like he did deadpool because uh we know the story about why uh the original designer of that was yes yeah um and then but but look at batman 66 and see it's not see which beetles they're both remakes
Speaker: They're not, they're tweaking.
Speaker: They're not a hundred percent commitment.
Speaker: And it's tweaking an older design.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And so really the last Gomez game besides Deadpool has been six plus years ago, right?
Speaker: Six, seven years ago.
Speaker: Gomez just isn't designing.
Speaker: That's not his job.
Speaker: He's creative chief officer.
Speaker: But why would you, why would you even bother having Gomez and Ellen simultaneously designing the same play field?
Speaker: like I said, unless if it's a barometer test to see what they can get out of an L one, cause it does make sense if a distributor sets the price.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So they're trying to find the ceiling, but they usually do that.
Speaker: They did that for Beatles, right?
Speaker: They did that for the, the platinum or the diamond edition, I think.
Speaker: So the diamond edition, because my understanding is with Beatles, you got 10, you had to buy 13 of them.
Speaker: You got 10 golds.
Speaker: You had two diamonds and, or three diamonds and one, uh,
Speaker: Sorry, three platinums and one diamond or something like that.
Speaker: So it was like you bought 14 games for all the same price and you could sell the other two at whatever markup you wanted.
Speaker: But the difference in this case, though, is those weren't Elwyn's.
Speaker: Well, this is they also weren't a competing design.
Speaker: Like you didn't have the Gomez design Beatles.
Speaker: And it was like, oh, and by the way, here's the Ritchie design Beatles.
Speaker: I think if this is true, it's because they're trying to figure out what they can get for Elwin versus everyone else.
Speaker: Sure.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, it could be a good idea.
Speaker: It could be a terrible idea.
Speaker: But if this really is the case that Elwin has made a totally separate game and done his own spin on it and Rick Nagel's on code or whoever's on code, I mean, there's some...
Speaker: there's some things that line up that would make sense.
Speaker: I mean, they push back Eddie's title.
Speaker: If you push it back, that gives you Danger and Eddie in between the next L1.
Speaker: Are we really, is Stern really going to wait another year?
Speaker: They're going to wait two years between L1 releases?
Speaker: That's quite the vacation for L1, especially for a man that's been proven to design games in less than 12 months.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And multiple games.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So do you let your golden goose not make you anything for two years?
Speaker: It doesn't sound right to me.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I will say there is a sliver of possibility on this.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Being competing design.
Speaker: I'm looking at it from a business standpoint to think I don't understand the resource allocation that would be required to do two competing games.
Speaker: And then you are also competing with yourself.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I would, if that is their decision, I would disagree with it from an amateur business standpoint.
Speaker: Like it, it doesn't make sense.
Speaker: I say yes and no.
Speaker: And the reason being is, is I think it makes sense because Elwin sells games and they know that.
Speaker: And so making a fourth game like that, just one standard model where you only have to buy those parts for one model versus across three or two, but yeah,
Speaker: And then it's smart in a way that like L1's your biggest seller.
Speaker: If you can narrow it down to one path and maybe this bond is one they want to keep on the line for a long time.
Speaker: It's hard to keep three models or at least two models on the line at all times.
Speaker: You chop it down to one.
Speaker: You focus that.
Speaker: that energy all in that one.
Speaker: I just don't know.
Speaker: I think it is wise in a couple of ways.
Speaker: I think it's bad in a couple of ways.
Speaker: I think if you release a competing L1, Gomez Games is dead on arrival.
Speaker: Maybe, but Deadpool was dead on arrival and now it's become a very popular game.
Speaker: No, Deadpool was not dead on arrival.
Speaker: People liked that game.
Speaker: No, they didn't.
Speaker: They just didn't like the clunkiness.
Speaker: No, they didn't like the game.
Speaker: They thought it was a miss.
Speaker: And then it, cause people weren't buying the Deadpools.
Speaker: So they cut the production short and then it became a desired thing, kind of like stranger things.
Speaker: That was not a big hit when it first came out.
Speaker: And then people decided they really liked the game.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I don't, but the, with, with that, it just seems like if, again, I'm just saying that's not, do you think the name James Bond is,
Speaker: sells more games or do you think the designer sells more games?
Speaker: I think the designer right now, I think I disagree.
Speaker: I disagree.
Speaker: I disagree because people are still buying thing, uh, games based on theme alone.
Speaker: We have data East one, that war, that theme was King.
Speaker: Like people are paying crazy money for back to the future.
Speaker: Because it is back to the future and it's not a great game.
Speaker: But the game has been elevated for the, over the last 30 years.
Speaker: Yes, I agree that theme.
Speaker: I, I think once you're getting into the hobby and for the person that is very casual, enjoys pinball, wants one or two in their basement.
Speaker: Cause there are people, I know people are like, you get the one, you get the bite.
Speaker: No, there is a whole different market out there that you don't know about.
Speaker: That's literally like, Oh, Toy Story is coming out.
Speaker: I'll get one of those.
Speaker: And that's what I'm saying.
Speaker: That's what I'm saying is like, we are talking to a very small demographic people who listen to pinball podcasts.
Speaker: They know who the designers are.
Speaker: They know the game flow.
Speaker: They know the different games.
Speaker: The vast majority of people who playing pinball out there are not in this category.
Speaker: They, they just look at a theme.
Speaker: But theme, speaking of recognizability in this day and age,
Speaker: If theme was king, then Toy Story would have sold gangbusters over Godzilla.
Speaker: Well, okay.
Speaker: I would say that theme.
Speaker: So people bought Toy Story mainly because of the theme and not the designer.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But the price was the limiting factor on that one.
Speaker: The price really way outshot the market when we're starting to see a slowdown in an economy.
Speaker: And so I, I, that definitely affected the toy story sales.
Speaker: Well, I just think though saying that theme is what drives everything.
Speaker: I think that's just too simplistic of an answer.
Speaker: Now, after us diving into this hobby for like just the podcast alone, we've been doing this for almost four years now.
Speaker: I think saying theme alone, just, I didn't say theme alone, but I said the, the primary driver in sales.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's the primary driver.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Everything else, the art package, because we always talk about the art package.
Speaker: We talk about the designer, but it really comes down to the theme is the most important thing in an, in a design, which is why Stern doesn't do unlicensed themes.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And they, even black night was, it was a recognizable theme for pinball, but it wasn't a licensed theme and it didn't sell as well.
Speaker: I bet the black night sold better than Led Zeppelin though.
Speaker: It may be.
Speaker: Maybe.
Speaker: My point being is, is theme is theme is the candy wrapper, right?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But the actual gameplay, the code is the taste of the chocolate bar.
Speaker: I agree, but most people are not.
Speaker: The vast majority of players are hacks.
Speaker: They are not your, your top, top 100 players.
Speaker: Yeah, but like a game like Godzilla, even if you're a hack, you feel like you've accomplished something if you don't leave Tokyo.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: If you destroy a building and maybe defeat a monster, you still feel accomplished versus Whitewater, which is, it's very woodchoppy.
Speaker: It's getting the rafts down the river.
Speaker: People still love it.
Speaker: But do you really feel accomplished at the end of that game versus Godzilla?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's also a 30 plus year old game, which is different.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Uh, I, I'm not going to go comparisons right now.
Speaker: Cause my mind's totally far from that.
Speaker: And it's honestly, it's time for us to get wrapping up.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Um, but I just, okay.
Speaker: So your gut feeling yes or no one game, two designers, my gut feeling.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: My gut feeling is no.
Speaker: I figured as much.
Speaker: So we'll see who's right in two weeks.
Speaker: Not even that, because it'll be Tuesday.
Speaker: Well, I guess, yeah, two weeks.
Speaker: In two weeks, yeah.
Speaker: Maybe we'll record sooner.
Speaker: Who knows?
Speaker: Okay, so where are we at on the scoreboard?
Speaker: So you think it's just Gomez.
Speaker: I think it's Gomez, and I think it's a variety art package, like an SLA thing.
Speaker: And I think that they were delayed because of just licensing pending approval.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: It has something to do with the license or not the death of the queen, but we'll go with that.
Speaker: And I really think it makes sense.
Speaker: I'm sorry.
Speaker: I'm a puzzle person.
Speaker: So the fact that they pushed back a title, blamed it on production, and then pushing Elwin's game out for two years versus one, it doesn't make sense.
Speaker: Have your golden goose not laying eggs.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So I think it's a possibility.
Speaker: I think it's an interesting marketing challenge.
Speaker: And I don't know.
Speaker: We'll know in a week.
Speaker: We'll know in a week.
Speaker: So, yeah, I guess that wraps it up for us.
Speaker: Do you have anything else, Scott?
Speaker: No, I think it's good.
Speaker: I'll be really interested to see.
Speaker: I'm a wait and see on this theme.
Speaker: Um, it's not an instant buy for me.
Speaker: Um, I've never been a huge bond fan.
Speaker: I, I, I've seen probably half the movies and I appreciate them, but they're it's, it's okay.
Speaker: It Austin powers kind of ruined bond for me because it just made a lot of the older bonds look kind of ridiculous.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And, and the last five James bonds have been basically, uh, they have retooled as the born identity.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, it's worked for them.
Speaker: It's worked more.
Speaker: Oh, absolutely.
Speaker: More serious tone.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: If you want to get a hold of us, we are LoserKidPinballPodcast at gmail.com.
Speaker: We're also on socials, Facebook, Twitter, Twitch, and Instagram at LoserKidPinball.
Speaker: If you'd like to get a hold of us, the easiest way to do it is on Facebook through Messenger.
Speaker: And we hope to see you soon.
Speaker: We hope to see you at Expo.
Speaker: Yeah, that'd be great.
Speaker: Want to send us off, Scott?
Speaker: Yeah, I actually am curious to see what the listeners are thinking.
Speaker: So if you have a take on what, well, one, what the delay was, and two, do you think two designers or one, just send us an email or message us because I'm really curious to find out what the general market feels.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: See you in two.
Speaker: Okay, see you.
Speaker: Shut up and sit down.
