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00:00:01
Advancing Social–Emotional Practices Across the Early Intervention Workforce
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In this episode of Meaningful Moments, Lisa Terry is joined by Melissa Peacey (Norfolk) and Jessica Hale (Virginia Beach) to discuss how social–emotional development is being integrated across early intervention. They share insights on workforce training, common challenges, and how every discipline supports infant mental health.
Tune in for practical takeaways and a powerful reminder: Social–emotional development isn’t separate—it’s at the heart of everything we do.
Resources:
Virginia Early Intervention Professional Development Center (VEIPD) - https://veipd.vcu.edu/
VEIPD Learning Bytes – Brief learning activities already developed for trainers https://veipd.vcu.edu/professional-development/learning-bytes/
What We Bring Workbook - https://www.challengingbehavior.org/document/what-we-bring-workbook/
Recommended
Transcript
00:00:10
Speaker
Hi, everyone, and welcome back to Meaningful Moments. My name is Lisa Terry. I'm an early intervention professional development consultant with Virginia's Early Intervention Professional Development Center at Virginia a Commonwealth University Partnership for People's Disabilities. I know, it's a lot. I'm also endorsed as an infant mental health mentor in research and faculty, and I lead the Division of Early Childhoods and fit Mental Health Community of Practice, as well as I still go directly into the homes and provide developmental services.
00:00:43
Speaker
But I'm really glad that you're here today with us because we are going to be diving into something that's really been at the center of our work this past year in Virginia, and it's how we intentionally incorporate social-emotional development into everything that we do in early intervention,
00:01:00
Speaker
but also how we train and support the workforce so they feel confident doing it. And today I am joined by two wonderful guest speakers who have been leading this work in their locality. So we have Melissa who's been training teams in Norfolk and Jessica who's been training teams in Virginia Beach.
00:01:19
Speaker
They've both been doing incredible work, and I'm excited to kind of dig into what they've been doing, what's been working well, what are the challenges that they're seeing. But first, before we get into all of that, I'm going to have them introduce themselves. Hi, I'm Melissa. As Lisa said, I'm an educator for Infant-Sodder Connection of Norfolk, so I'm going into the homes and providing developmental services. I've also recently started supporting our staff with social-emotional trainings, at our staff meetings and kind of diving into some of those things that are out there and then have recently become the growing brain trainer for the Norfolk providers. So I'm very excited to share what we've been working on in our system. And I am Jessica Hale. I work with the Infant and Toddler Connection of Virginia Beach. In this role, I'm the service coordinator supervisor. And so I do a lot of training and development on the service coordination side.
00:02:13
Speaker
And before I stepped into this position, i was also a developmental service provider um going into the homes providing services to families, and I was infant mental health certified at the time. Thank you. So I am excited to get into it today with both of you. So Melissa, I kind of want to start with you. As you've been training in Norfolk, what kind of gaps and challenges have you noticed? What kind of themes kind of keep coming up for you?
00:02:41
Speaker
So as we've been doing some training, we've realized that social emotional development is not as clear cut as we had expected it to be. I feel like it's challenging to understand one as a whole um and just in general, but then also breaking it down into age expected skills because it's it's really not an isolated skill that has its own category, despite it being...
00:03:04
Speaker
a domain on our assessments and a score that we have to get for eligibility. um It's really interspersed through every developmental area with every day-to-day activity and routine. So um I think we're we're finding the struggle also is because most providers, speech therapists, physical therapists, occupational therapists, the most, they're not taught these developmental skills in their their undergrad or their graduate education. So this is a potential struggle for identifying and addressing those social, emotional needs and concerns and not looking at skills in such a checklist space like we do different other skills like gross motor and fine motor and things like that.
00:03:47
Speaker
Yeah, I think that's a really great point too, because we aren't taught about social emotional development, but yet it's all about relationships and it really does impact every single aspect of child development. So thank you for that, Melissa. Yeah, I feel like I'll echo and kind of add to that concern of Melissa's is because therapists are sometimes coming to the field with less exposure to social emotional development, right? our service coordination staff, our education staff get a lot more of that full range of child development, maybe in their coursework in school and in their clinical practice leading up to their position in early intervention. that I feel like we've heard challenges with people kind of feeling confident about their clinical opinion and exercising that same knowledge and comfort with social emotional skills. And so that's something thing that we're trying to tackle is like really empowering people who might not have a strong background to take this opportunity to get those knowledge and skills so that they can move forward um with the things that they need to feel confident working in early intervention. And another challenge that's come up just from a training perspective as a whole system is really how do we focus on this really fine-tuned and specific part of early intervention practice with social-emotional skills when we're hearing from the field that, you know, they might need support with more general Part C topics, right? So,
00:05:21
Speaker
They're requesting more information generally about annuals or um the role of the service coordinator, right? These much more general topics. And so it's been a challenge making sure that we're meeting the needs of people in the field while also addressing this kind of new initiative and trying to wrap those things together so that we're being efficient in how that we train. Right. It's kind of like just embedding that social emotional piece into the early intervention process right naturally like what does this look like tell me like how do I implement it at each phase or each stage right so I'm kind of curious then to what does the training look like Melissa if you want to explain kind of what the training looks like in Norfolk first and what kind of opportunities are you offering there
00:06:09
Speaker
Yeah, so um I started looking through all of the social emotional trainings that are available out there. And even just through the IPD, there's a ton. So trying to figure out what is the best way to navigate through them. So I've started to kind of put together a pathway for at least our in-house staff, so service coordinators and educators, and each month, we have some trainings that we do on our own, and then we get together at our staff meetings and talk about how we can implement them.
00:06:42
Speaker
We've really started working on ourselves because the the basis of social-emotional knowledge is knowing yourself. So we we've been using the What We Bring workbook from the National Center for Pyramid Model interventions or Innovations, um And it really dives into looking at yourself, your strengths, your triggers, your biases, so that we can show up with an open and supportive mind with these families and then be able to identify not only those strategies for ourselves, but how can we support the families to utilize them as well as carry them over to to the children in those those stressful situations. we have also
00:07:29
Speaker
started the growing brain training. We just finished up our first cohort. It was a lot of fun, but a lot of learning curves for that. So hoping that the next cohort that starts in a couple of weeks will be even better and even stronger. But it it was it was a lot of fun. We got a lot of good feedback from providers that they really enjoyed it and really needed those basic social emotional skills. as well as putting some of those skills into practice. um And then we're also doing the ACEs training for everybody in Norfolk. We have the trainer who is from prevention from the CSB, but she was a service coordinator for quite a few many years. So she's able to bring a really nice perspective to the ACEs training for our early intervention staff.
00:08:15
Speaker
I love that you're accessing those resources. And I'll give a disclaimer because I feel like anytime that you're doing a new training, it just it's like you're kind of like working out like the little keats of it. And as you continue on, it just becomes a lot smoother, a lot easier, and you kind of like learn as you go. That's exciting that there's so much going on and that, you know, you're starting to see some of that reflection. I love that you're really looking at how they're maintaining their own compassion, because I feel like that is such an important piece of our work, especially when we're thinking about supporting these families and their emotional well-being, because we have to be aware of how
00:08:56
Speaker
We're taking care of ourselves in order to take care and support all of these families and really being aware of our own biases that we have, too. Jessica, how about you? What does it look like in Virginia Beach? Yeah. So first, I have to say I love hearing what Melissa is doing with the team in Norfolk. um So many good ideas from that. I love the elements of self-reflection. um and that's a wonderful perspective that I hadn't really considered, you know, before hearing you talk about how you're rolling things out. Speaking of Norfolk in Virginia Beach, we are also focusing on ACEs and the growing brain training right now. um And i feel like it's worth mentioning that ITC Norfolk invited us to take part in the trainings that they, um,
00:09:45
Speaker
kind of facilitated, right? So the ACES training that they're presenting right now, the service coordinators and educators in Virginia Beach were invited to attend and they are going to that. And so I think it's really important, this collaborative element that we have kind of going on in the region. um Right now i'm working with Norfolk and Chesapeake to develop kind of an ongoing training that we can use regionally. and so that's one way. that we're addressing training is just like Melissa's pulling from these resources. It's what can we do regionally to help, especially because in the Tidewater region, so many of our therapists work in multiple systems.
00:10:27
Speaker
And so we really want to think harder or smarter, not harder, um and make sure that we're not asking them to do duplicative trainings. We'll hear the same thing too many times to the point where they don't feel like it's valuable to them.
00:10:41
Speaker
So we're really making regional efforts to make sure that therapists feel like this is valuable and efficient for them. um Internally, we have 16 service coordinators in Virginia Beach, and we have four educators that are within our um city program. And so like Melissa, we've really been taking the opportunity for our regular meetings, which we meet twice a month.
00:11:08
Speaker
to incorporate in-service trainings. We might watch talks on Tuesdays together or really access those pre-existing VEIPD resources. and what has been critical for us is to really have a focus on practical strategies.
00:11:26
Speaker
So we've really tried to make our training discussion-based, interactive, case study focused, so that all of this information and theory really comes down to what we're doing every single day. We also, in Virginia Beach, contract with seven different agencies. And so it's been kind of tricky um with, okay, how do we then expand this knowledge and information out? um because we have lots of opportunities to talk with our internal staff and definitely not as many opportunities to talk with our contracted staff.
00:12:02
Speaker
And so um we ended up creating a two hour training where we basically tried to pull the overall topics that we've been focusing on in our internal staff meetings. The goal of that was again to really retain that same interactive discussion-based piece. And so we broke them into groups of no more than 20 to make sure we could do that. Really wanted to maximize that limited time um so that when all of our teams go out, they have a shared knowledge base to work
00:12:36
Speaker
Thanks. That's so helpful it to kind of like see how you're both doing things in different ways. I love the practical implementation piece because I feel like that is something that people are always asking for. They're like, okay, I get all this information. I go and attend a training, but what does it look like into practice? How does this translate into service delivery? So i think that's a huge piece that you're doing.
00:12:59
Speaker
But I also love the collaborative effort between both of your programs. I think that's something nu to go over lightly because really each program, like you're at capacity, right? On your own. And so when you are collaborating across regions and you're sharing those resources, sharing those trainings, inviting others to your trainings, that's such a huge resource because it helps expand your own capacity that of what you can offer to. So that's a great thing. I think that both of you are doing and just that region in general. I love how really it's starting to become more of this collaborative training effort, because like you said, you do share a lot of the same providers too, right? So when we think about infant mental health, we think about social emotional development. One of the things that we talked about, and I hear really on it more of a national scale as well, those
00:13:53
Speaker
seems that I don't have an infant mental health endorsement or it's this big discipline divide, right? Like I'm an early interventionist, but I'm a speech therapist. This is my focus or I'm a PT. I don't really know how to support social emotional development.
00:14:11
Speaker
And I think that comes up frequently. And so there's there's kind of this gap between what social emotional development is and how that impacts every single family. So what do you do when you hear that? Yeah, well, for me, I think it's really important to honor the feeling that underlies um those kinds of statements, right? Which I think is probably just a worry,
00:14:39
Speaker
or a fear that they don't have the knowledge and skills to address these concerns the way that they feel they need to be addressed, right? And so I always look at it that way. um I don't think it's an unwillingness.
00:14:54
Speaker
I think people just want to do the best work that they can do on behalf of these families. And, you know, so the second thing that I do in that vein is to try and talk to them about what they're already doing, right? Because so much of what early interventionists are doing are social emotional in nature but because we don't really frame it that way right it's just like oh well that's how i talk to families or that's how you know we approach our work with coaching right that i think sometimes people don't even realize how much they're already doing and so showing them like look at all the work you're doing on joint attention and building rapport and creating connections between caregivers and their children right
00:15:38
Speaker
you're already doing such great work that maybe you don't think of as falling under this umbrella, but it but it does. um And then I think the last piece is, you know, sometimes we just have to have that conversation. Like early intervention is different. So many therapists have worked in different settings, right?
00:15:57
Speaker
And so they might be very familiar with their therapy modality, but early intervention is different. And I think sometimes it just takes some education to say like, hey, this is how we work, you know, and we're developmentalists and we're looking at the whole child and the whole family. And so I think trying to explain kind of the reason for why early intervention is early interventionists practice the way they do can be helpful um to understanding the why of why do I need to know this. Yeah. and I think you're absolutely right because, you know, people want to, they have the desire. i think they just aren't sure how it contributes or in what ways am I supporting that social emotional wellbeing of families, right?
00:16:43
Speaker
Like when you do think of even a child building their language, right? Sometimes children will avoid things that are hard for them or difficult for them and we have to work on empowering and building their confidence up in those moments and that's how that relates. So I love that practical implementation again that you're kind of thinking about. So like a a lot of us are looking at our professions through our discipline specific lens and and not thinking about just being human and being social. And when we think about being human, we have all of these different relationships. We have relationships with our children, with our family, with our friends.
00:17:23
Speaker
And yet there is like this line between relationships and being professional. And yeah, in early intervention, you really do have to teeter on that line because you're not having a client come into you and working on these checklist goals in your therapy setting, you are going into these families' homes where they live, where they they show their most vulnerability, and where they want to see the most success for their child. So remembering that we are all human. we We're all
00:17:58
Speaker
flawed, we all have our baggage, we all have our, you know, our underlying stuff going on, and that you are being welcomed into their home. And so really building that rapport, and saying, okay,
00:18:13
Speaker
I'm working with human beings first and foremost. Yes, there's goals. Yes, there's a checklist. Yes, there's things we want to make happen. But if you really don't look at the person, the family as each individual people and yourself as well, it's going to be really hard to dive into those goals and and actually be effective in them without building that that relationship with the families.
00:18:41
Speaker
Yeah, and that's a great point because relationships are really the foundation of infant mental health. It's that connection that we all seek, right? And there's so many different family dynamics that can impact those relationships. Like you said, stress, right? That's a huge one. And if we think that no families have stress, then the joke's on us because every family is going to experience stress at some point in time.
00:19:05
Speaker
We experience stress, right, at some point in time. And so there's so many layers and just dynamics and factors that can impact those relationships. And those are things that we want to work towards being mindful of.
00:19:18
Speaker
And when we think about all of those different disciplines, right, we have physical therapists, speech therapists, developmental services, we have service coordinators, occupational therapists. There's so many different disciplines that are providing these services. I'd like us to consider how each discipline, no matter what their background is, do play a role in supporting infant mental health.
00:19:40
Speaker
Yeah, so I feel like I'm so lucky to have the opportunity to observe um and work with such a diverse group of people.
00:19:53
Speaker
And when I go out and do observations or I'm going out to be, you know, the service coordinator role, I'm working alongside speech therapists, occupational therapists, physical therapists, vision specialists, and more, right? So like a couple weeks ago, i was out with a speech therapist and she was working on like simple sounds. so this little boy like love cars. He had every monster truck and So they were playing back and forth and the speech therapist is modeling all of the sounds, right? Like vroom, beep, crash.
00:20:26
Speaker
But as she's doing that, She's going like, oh, crash. Oh, no. Right. So she's very exaggerated and she's bringing this little boy in.
00:20:38
Speaker
And, um you know, when the little boy engages back with her and crashes the truck back, she's like, yeah, you know, she's giving this big praise and it becomes very much just this like truly shared experience. Right. And so. The speech therapist was definitely working on speech and language.
00:20:58
Speaker
um But then when the parent went to go, you know, practice that same skill, which is a focus on language building, the parent was then imitating the speech therapist.
00:21:11
Speaker
big praise and um really interactive style. And so there was all of this shared attention making that this speech therapist was modeling intentionally or not, right? um And building these social emotional skills for the child and the parent to make this an enjoyable experience for both of them.
00:21:34
Speaker
And, you know, the same thing is like OT. One of my favorite things is, you know, when OTs are out working on regulation strategies and um like watching the pillow squishes, right? So like when OTs are showing parents that like proprioceptive input and um then parents are practicing and they're saying,
00:21:59
Speaker
oh my gosh, that's the first time he's looked at me. Like he looked at me and smiled. And now we're having this shared moment um that the occupational therapy therapist has created, right? Through building these self-regulation strategies. And so watching that like a beautiful work all of the time amazing.
00:22:21
Speaker
like an honor. And I would say that if you ask those therapists, oh, did you, was that your intent? Or did you know you were working on these things? They might not realize it, but they're doing great work at it. That's a great point. Those meaningful connections, like that is so powerful. And I think you're right. It is an honor to be able to sit back and watch those and observe it because even the way that the parents' faces light up during those moments, like Wow.
00:22:50
Speaker
Like, how lucky are we to be a part of that experience for them? Yeah, I just love what Jessica said. it It just had me thinking like, we can't avoid play. an early intervention, I mean, that is the foundation of all of this. And you can't have play without a social experience and a social experience that's positive and fun and um and you know as as any provider that's really what what we're doing and i tell people all the time you know yeah i play with kids all the time that's my job and they're like okay that's all you do well no that's not all i do but but man is it amazing and and as an educator you know like we said with with the background knowledge of child development and social emotional development I feel like sometimes it's easier for the educators to kind of get into that because we're we're teachers, you know, we're used to to all that play stuff and engaging families. But I think we do have ah an advantage as well of like identifying those developmental expectations and those social emotional expectations and pointing them out and
00:23:58
Speaker
And having the families recognize them, because sometimes when these families are in the trenches of all this and just stressed and worried about, is my kid making progress? Is it appropriate? And then we do these engagements with them. It's so joyful to just see that, to be able to point out that, like, look, like Jessica was saying, oh, my gosh, she's making eye contact with me.
00:24:22
Speaker
still having those underlying goals of like, you know, we're we're regulating and that's why we're seeing this, but there it is. And there are these beautiful moments. ah Other providers like like physical therapists, you know, they they have to have the child has to have a level of trust with their caregivers, especially older children who are still struggling with walking. they They have that cognitive fear of, I'm going to fall. And if they don't have that that trust with the caregiver, they might not be encouraged enough to take those steps. So So being a physical therapist and being able to support and implement those those social connections and those social opportunities to make it fun so the kid forgets that they're trying to walk and just enjoying the moment ah instead of it being, you know, like you would see in a clinic, you know, this this repetition, stand up, sit down, move here, do this, go get that.
00:25:19
Speaker
It's more of just that that fun interaction back and forth. and then when we think about service coordinators, I mean they really are the forefront of early intervention. They're the first people that the families meet. They're the first people that they're building rapport with and learning that trust of early intervention, because you really do have to trust early intervention because we're coming into to their home. So establishing that initially and meeting them where they're at in their journey to find out where doth what do they mean
00:25:56
Speaker
Where can we support them? What community services or supports can they benefit from? And so being able to know and have those hard conversations to figure those things out is really, really important for our service coordinators to do and not just look at the families as, oh, okay, I need to do the intake, do the assessment, do the IFSP, check on the goals, you know, all of the checklist things that we we do need to do, they are important. But in order to successfully and efficiently or effectively get there, we really do need to have those relationships established and and continue with the families and the child.
00:26:37
Speaker
Yeah, Melissa, I love that. And like when you were talking about that, it made me think of kind of that challenge that we're having in training, right, is when people want more about the general part C. So when you're talking about service coordination is I've got to get this done and I've got to get these things signed and I've, you know, here are my deadlines and here are my, you know, my review date and my annual date and all of these intricacies in what we have to do. But then what you're saying is like, okay, but it's how we do it, right? Is um we can still incorporate all of these really social
00:27:16
Speaker
ah socially, emotionally driven skills in how we do what we have to do. um That helps it really just be more effective for everybody. Yeah, those are really great points. And it it kind of makes me think too about just the follow through of it when things come up, because we have so much going on. We have a lot of paperwork. We're juggling like multiple appointments all the time. And then of of course you have to go and document all of those appointments that you're You're trying to manage.
00:27:48
Speaker
And then let's say a family calls you and they're like, hey, like, you know, like I really need support in this or I'm looking for a resource for childcare because I don't know what else to do. Like we're kind of like in this urgent you know need right now because, you know, the child has to leave the other childcare that they're currently at.
00:28:10
Speaker
And that's that's a priority for that family, right? even though it might not be like our priorities or match like our timelines, this is something that has come up. And so it's really important to be responsive in those moments when families do need something because they will, that's what they're thinking about. They're like, okay, what do I do every single day? when they like Okay, what am i going to do next? What do I do? How do I, you know, help my child, but I don't know what's out there. And they're waiting for the service coordinator to respond, right?
00:28:38
Speaker
Yeah. And when you think of all of that, yeah, you know, we do have to have meet our timelines and and get all of that stuff done. But if the family, like the situation that you just said, if the family is stressing and thinking about those things, you Are they really taking in all of the things that we're working on in the session if we have a specific agenda? And that's what I love about early intervention is because you never know what you're going to step into. Even if you've been working with the family for months, years, and you have that thought of, okay, here's the progression and this is what I want to tackle this next visit, you might walk in and it may be
00:29:17
Speaker
absolutely nothing which you thought it would be. And it it makes it fun and interesting and challenging at the same time because you have to think on the spot and support in that moment.
00:29:29
Speaker
And it's just, I just feel like it's just so beautiful to be able to support and see the families just love what they're seeing, the progress they're seeing and not stress so much about getting to the next goal.
00:29:42
Speaker
Yeah, there's a huge difference of meeting requirements than quality of services, right? And I think the ultimate goal is that quality piece. And I i love supporting the social emotional well-being of all families because I think that's what it really gets to, right? It gets to that quality piece that we want to do.
00:30:03
Speaker
So we think about all these disciplines. I mean, every single discipline, no matter what your background, you're touching that social emotional domain because interaction is going to shape a child's sense of safety, their connection, and then their capabilities, right?
00:30:18
Speaker
So let's kind of break this down a bit because I know there's a lot of talk all the time about what is social emotional development because there's so much that really does impact it. So what are we talking about? We're talking about, you know, that attachment, those relationships, right? We're looking at the emotional expression and regulation.
00:30:39
Speaker
We're looking at social interaction, their engagement, not just with their caregivers, but with others, right? other peers, other people that are important in their lives, their sense of self, the confidence that they have, all of us trying to understand their behavior, right? We all know that behavior has meaning. so really unpacking that, figuring out what is contributing to that, what's impacting that child's behavior. And and that gives us a really better perspective to understand.
00:31:07
Speaker
And then coping and resilience. And all of these show up in different routines, like diaper changes, meal time, play, transitions, bedtime, all of the places that early interventionists are already supporting families.
00:31:19
Speaker
I agree with all of that. And um the only thing that I would add is sometimes we get really, we use the word routine a lot, right? Because that's what we do. We're we're there to kind of blend in with family routines.
00:31:34
Speaker
um But I've tried reframing it and maybe sometimes even changing the wording that I'm using with families to How can we do this right in every interaction? So like at an assessment recently, um the mom was talking about how they're like, go, go, go. Like she wakes the kids up in the morning. They're getting ready to go to daycare. They're at daycare really most of the day.
00:31:59
Speaker
Um, and then they come home and they're dropping their stuff at the door and she's putting on this Rachel so she can start cooking dinner. Right. We all know the drill. We've probably experienced that ourselves, but I think when I framed it around routines with that particular parent,
00:32:19
Speaker
She was kind of like, i mean, I don't know that I would call these routines. We're just kind of going through our motions. Right. And so then it was like, okay so let me reframe this. Right. Like, what is maybe two minute interaction that you get with your kid where it's you guys together and maybe it's just for the time it takes for you to take their shoes off?
00:32:42
Speaker
at the door before you run and put Miss Rachel on, right? So what are these small but meaningful moments that we could work these same concepts in without parents feeling the pressure of like, oh, I have to have a routine. I need to sit down for play time for this or, oh, my family needs to eat together because i'm i'm thinking about mealtime, but instead it's like, what are these brief moments where we can build connection between caregivers and their children?
00:33:16
Speaker
I love that too, like kind of reframing that thought process of thinking about those interactions. I know when I'm in the home, sometimes I hate feeling like I am just stuck in the same spot in a family's house all the time.
00:33:30
Speaker
And so one of like my go-to phrases when I'm there, I'm like, okay, if I was in here right now, What's something that you would be enjoying with your child? And let's just go from there. Like, go ahead and start doing that.
00:33:42
Speaker
And let's build off of it. And it takes us into so many different places. Like, that's where we'll end up outside. Or sometimes we end up during bath time because they feel like that's something that's a meaningful, you know, connection that they're having. But it it kind of takes you out of that sitting and playing, too, right? We're looking for more of those, like, playful interactions. So I love reframing like routines and thinking about those meaningful interactions. Like you said, great point, Jessica.
00:34:09
Speaker
I absolutely love that because it it hits home for me as a mom of just running, running, running all the time. And at the end of the day, you go, what did I accomplish today? You know, like, yeah, the kids are fed and they're in bed and, you know, next day is going to start. but But you sometimes do miss those those small moments. And i I have had so many families, like in assessments as we're going over goals saying, okay, so I need to practice this this many times a day. And at this time, because we do kind of, we get that information so that we can make the goals measurable. But then we have this conversation of,
00:34:48
Speaker
You don't have to have a checklist on your fridge. You don't have to time it. You don't have to do it in those specific every single day in that specific time and that specific routine. But being able to take a step back and and recognize and us being there as kind of like flies on the wall sometimes watching these interactions, it can be very helpful for us to to point out, oh, did you see what he just did? oh my gosh, I loved that interaction. How can we incorporate that into a different time of day? Or when would you like to see more of that? Or how would you like to see more of that? So I love that that beautiful concept of just the small little moments. I would also say that
00:35:34
Speaker
Like I was saying earlier, as providers, we come in with that that very discipline-specific lens. And we just have to remember that that we are working with these families in their homes. And ah we need to like all all of the things in in the social-emotional development, like the sense of self and control and understanding behavior and and all of that, like,
00:35:57
Speaker
it all comes with relationships. you know so So being present in the family's home, recognizing those small moments, praising those small moments, helping the families understand that Every single skill has small little steps. I like to to give families ah a visual of ah like a staircase.
00:36:21
Speaker
You can't get from the bottom to the top. I mean, somebody might be able to, but it's going to take a lot of work to get from the bottom to the top. Versus going one step at a time and making that small progress, especially with language development, it can be very frustrating for some families. So pointing out those those connection moments of look, there is that sound. And how did that feel for you? and Did it bring you joy? did Did you love doing that? Okay, let's let's move with that um instead of just, you know, okay, well, language is here and we want to be here. So let's just talk to them all the time. You know, like really finding those those social interactions and attachment moments that are just so meaningful and and impactful that sit with you, that when you're laying in bed at night, you go, that was a good moment.
00:37:13
Speaker
I think that's the most important. And I love that idea, the staircase. I use that a lot too, Melissa, because I think it's so important. But even thinking about where are we on the staircase? Like, let's say we just wake up in the morning. So we're at the bottom of the steps, right?
00:37:29
Speaker
And we all complimented your hair today, Melissa, because it looks beautiful. And we noticed it. it it's It's It's so curly and we love it. And we said, oh, your hair looks really great today. So that's like a moment of empowerment, right? So you're taking one step up.
00:37:44
Speaker
And then let's say that somebody else gives you another compliment. And so you're continuing like to build throughout the day. And what it does is build resiliency too, right? So like, let's say that on your way home from work today, you're driving and you get stuck in traffic, which everybody hates getting stuck in traffic, right?
00:38:01
Speaker
But if you are built up enough and your confidence is built up then you're like okay i'm not going let this like get me down right but if we are still providing services and families are as bottom steps then or children they're still stuck at that bottom step then they're not going to try as hard right or things will get to them a lot easier impact their mood a lot differently than once they're built up and that's why i love you know really focusing on some of that confidence building focus on praising the caregivers and the self-esteem as well as ourselves because we're doing a lot too. There's a lot of hard work with all of the families that we're providing services to. So kudos to you both for all of the work that you're doing there.
00:38:45
Speaker
I do want to kind of like take it back to some of the training because I'm curious what kind of questions you're getting during your trainings? Like what are early interventionists most curious about, or maybe like what they're unsure about?
00:38:59
Speaker
Yeah. So i feel like kind of calling back to one of the topics that we already talked about, like in these trainings, I think a a lot of people, and again, I honor the feeling that um that underlies the statement, right? But they're like, I'm not an LCSW.
00:39:17
Speaker
right, is I'm not, I'm not a therapist. I'm not a specialist in um emotional regulation, right? And so this isn't for me.
00:39:27
Speaker
um And so a lot of questions have been around that is kind of like, what is your expectation of us here? We're talking about all of these things. And I think really everything that we've been talking about up until now is how we've tried to frame our responses to that, right? Is nobody is suggesting that we want, I mean, we would love for everybody to become LCSW cell markets, but that's not the goal of this pyramid model implementation, right? And so um we've kind of been responding to that concern and that question about like, what are we really doing here, right?
00:40:04
Speaker
um by telling them, no, we're just here to um make sure that you can notice and respond to social emotional concerns in the same way that you do all the other areas of development, right? um And so trying to frame things that way, I do think helps ease some of that worry around this for people who think, oh gosh, I'm being asked to do something that is just not something I'm qualified for, right?
00:40:32
Speaker
And we've also had a lot of questions, interestingly, about goal development. So, you know, we go into homes and a lot of times, you know, we're asking families after they've expressed their concerns, right? So let's say their concern is that their child is like banging their head,
00:40:51
Speaker
um they're bruising themselves, right? And so when it comes to goal writing, you know, the parents are so tired and they're so worried. And so when it's like, what is your goal?
00:41:05
Speaker
It's like, I want them to stop that. Like, I want them to stop banging their head. i want that self-harm to stop. Like, that's what I want. It needs to go. And so a lot of questions we've gotten in trainings have been like,
00:41:19
Speaker
okay, well then how is the therapist, do I approach that? Because we want to honor what the parent says they want, right? That's their goal. And so we've been having to kind of really work on how we frame and how we can take those parent concerns and turn them into like, okay, well, instead of headbanging, what would you like to see? Right? Because You know, your child is always going to have moments of frustration. That's a very typical part of development. But like in those moments of frustration, what would that ideally look like for you? So just trying to work on that piece about framing behavior and social emotional concerns positively, um because I think sometimes there's that inclination to what we don't want instead of what we do want.
00:42:09
Speaker
Yeah, and I think a huge piece of it too is educating parents. If we are sitting here talking a lot about how, you know, a lot of early interventionists aren't quite sure how it social emotional development plays a role in to what they're doing.
00:42:25
Speaker
How would we expect parents to do that, right? And so we really do need to explain this is, you know, these are the steps. These are, this is how to help support regulation. This is how to get to that point, giving your child those words, right? Helping them to co-regulate. and being there with them and providing them some of those calming strategies and modeling that for them. So really, I think a lot of it is education too. But I wanted to go back to your other point that you made because ironically, i got that question today during my trauma course training where someone said, was like what's the fine line? like what is the fine line between like feeling like it's outside of our scope of practice? right And I think that is a very valid question.
00:43:09
Speaker
because there is a fine line. You really have to make sure that you are providing that caregiver the supports and the resources that they need, especially when there's mental health issues.
00:43:22
Speaker
And we want to make sure that they are connected to that. in At the same time, goal isn't to fix families, right? Like we don't fix. Our goal is to really just be with them in those moments along their journey of healing.
00:43:37
Speaker
And that is so powerful in itself. I think as early interventionists, like we have this desire all the time to like have immediate results, which we're not going to always get, right? And that's the the hard part, I think, I would say when we're thinking about and mental health, because there could be a lot of trauma that's going on. There could be a lot of family dynamics that are impacting that child's development. And so it can be very hard for us.
00:44:05
Speaker
But I can tell you, Just being there and the presence of an early interventionist is what the families need. And yes, it might feel like i I'm sitting here at you know all these sessions with families, talking to them about their stress factors and really collaborating with them to think about what are the next steps.
00:44:26
Speaker
But at the same time, it's building trust. right because they're opening up i'm listening to them they know that they have somebody that's listening to them but also it helps me identify what resources i can help get them connected to and then it gets to once we can alleviate some of that stress then it's going to build more of those parent-child interactions and that's where we want to get to right that connection piece and and really supporting all those external factors that are impacting that So I loved what you said about we don't have to know it all.
00:45:00
Speaker
And we we really don't. there' There's no way that we can. We can't be every single discipline under the sun. um And it it kind of me made me think while you were talking about becoming a mom.
00:45:14
Speaker
I didn't know everything. You know, I always wanted to be a mom. And so it was kind of ingrained in me already. And so that that love I had and that knowledge I already had was there. But I had to ask my mom questions. I had to ask my grandmother questions. I had to do research and observe other people with their children to navigate, especially when I had my daughter.
00:45:37
Speaker
who is my biggest challenge and and not know exactly how to do it. Yeah, I'm an early interventionist. I still didn't know all of the things to do with her. And I had to reach out to some of my early intervention people to say, hey, what do I do in this situation? and it was really a support for me. And so I encourage the the providers who are going, i don't know how to do this.
00:46:03
Speaker
Use your team, use your your people that you know. If you're an educator and you're still kind of building that social emotional knowledge, go with another educator or a service coordinator who may be a social worker and has that that background. And if you're other providers, you'll go out on visits, collaborate with with others. to to get that knowledge because yes, you can do lots and lots of trainings and get the the information, but until you really see it done in practice and see the the connection and see the responses and see the positive
00:46:40
Speaker
moments. It can be hard to kind of figure out what do I do with this information? So take the time to go out on visits with other providers and really see what that looks like and and be in it in the moment. and And it's not just observing, like it's feeling, it's it's connecting yourself with these moments as well. And it deepens it and it really builds on that knowledge and that confidence of, okay, you know, I really can do this because again, i am human as well as everybody else and and not everybody's perfect and not everybody's going to get there in the same way and giving grace to everyone around you to say, hey, you know, you want to do this in in the way that you need to? That's fine. I'm right next to you, supporting you. i have the knowledge to do it, but you're you're leading it.
00:47:32
Speaker
and and really get that that experience under your belt. That's such a valid point, too. i think, you know, as early interventionists, it's so easy for us to feel like we have, like, imposter syndrome where we're just, you know, like, I don't know if I'm cut out for this part of it You know, I don't know if I know enough. I have the expertise or the knowledge.
00:47:53
Speaker
But you're so right, Melissa, too, because, I mean, even for myself, I have five kids, and I would still benefit from having somebody there because, When we're put under stress, like we're in crisis management, right? We're not in that role where we're observing and we're thinking and considering everyone's perspective in those situations, right?
00:48:13
Speaker
So even as a parent, like it's hard work that we're doing, but I would still benefit. Nobody's perfect. I think that's the biggest part as you know we're training people in the field is that as long as you have this growth mindset and this idea that, you know what, I'm not perfect. There's definitely things I need to learn versus already know everything, right?
00:48:36
Speaker
Then we're going to continue to grow and expand our skills and be open to what you do. You have to be open to the opportunity to learn something. I always say, you know, go in with this gratitude mindset where, okay, I'm gonna learn one thing here. And there's gonna be one thing that I'm gonna take away from this training, even if you feel like you already know all of it, right? because We're all human, like you said, and we're all in this together. this is This is a journey for all of us.
00:49:07
Speaker
I do. I kind of want to go back. Sorry. um But as you guys were talking, I was like really struck, um particularly by the comment that you made, Lisa, about, you know, just being there, just sitting there with them. Like, you know,
00:49:24
Speaker
Melissa, you talked about maybe the challenges you have with your daughter. I have been i have a son who has obsessive compulsive disorder and it's hard, right? So the points that you guys are making about like when you're in it it's hard for you to zoom out and to have someone there not to counsel me, right? Or to tell me exactly what I need to do.
00:49:51
Speaker
um to help my son, but rather to help me even on those reflective pieces, right? So when you said sitting with you is, yeah, if somebody sat with me and asked me, like, you know, it seems like these behaviors are really increasing. Like, what do you think is going on?
00:50:10
Speaker
Right? These just like reflective questions that when you are so stressed, you don't have the capacity to ask, right? You're just making it from one moment to the next.
00:50:21
Speaker
But um when you said that, I really felt that because what people need is not always an answer, right? It's help me to ask questions, help me to reflect on this, help me to better understand what I need as a parent, right? It's like my husband and I will sit together and it's like, okay, we're checking with us, right? It's like, maybe our son is really heightened right now. And so like, let's ask each other, like, how are you? What's your regulation level?
00:50:52
Speaker
um And I think really as early interventionists, that's like, as we go through this pyramid model, just you saying that, I feel like I want to use that in future trainings because it is, it's kind of like sometimes you just need somebody to be there and help you process what's going on with you.
00:51:10
Speaker
um Even if maybe that isn't the person who's equipped to help you your so your kid, right? Yeah. And being a parent is so isolating sometimes too. I think, you know, social media is so big and you always see like these picture perfect examples of, of what children are doing or what parents are doing to support their children, but you don't always see the struggles, right?
00:51:34
Speaker
And I think that puts us at a really vulnerable place and we have to be okay with being vulnerable too and in order to help support these caregivers that are being vulnerable with us. So I love that as well. Thanks for sharing that and being vulnerable too, Jessica, sharing your story.
00:51:53
Speaker
So as we're kind of like wrapping up, um I want to talk about any aha moments. Did you have any like specific aha moments during your training? Initially, in in the beginning of the trainings, it was not...
00:52:09
Speaker
recogniz not realizing that we really struggle with knowing social emotional development and breaking it down. um But I think some of the big aha moments that have been shared with me are just Being able to do exactly what you just talked about, Lisa, just sitting with these families, taking a step back, taking a breath, um listening, working through some of those vulnerable moments really does help the families get to where they want to go or at least start getting there.
00:52:48
Speaker
There was a um scenario shared with us in one of our meetings where a mom had lost one of her kids recently and the other child was still in in services and those checklist things had to be done and there were visits scheduled after the typical timeframe of when you do your IFSP review or whatever that whatever it was.
00:53:13
Speaker
And that service coordinator made that choice to say, you know what, it's not appropriate today to review these goals. What is appropriate is for me to sit with you and navigate through this as best we can. And you know she had to make that quick text of, hey, I'm not going to make it to my next visit because I need to be with this family. I need to support this family. And so recognizing that it's okay.
00:53:41
Speaker
We do have to meet our schedules and and get to where we need to go and do all of the things, but it is okay if a family needs us to be that support to help them through whatever it is they're going through to find those resources, um but also looking at it through a nonjudgmental lens as well of, you know, you're here, maybe there's things that you could do to get out of this and you're just not ready and that's okay.
00:54:11
Speaker
but I'm here to support you. So really recognizing some of those things. And and maybe some some people aren't aren't looking at it in that way. They're they're still looking at it in their their goal um view or their discipline view and and saying, I'm not qualified. i shouldn't be you know sitting here and just talking about whatever is stressing you. i have I have a note to write that has to document what I did. and but If we don't, we're not gonna be as successful. a child The family's not gonna be as successful. The child's not gonna be as successful because they're not able to move past.
00:54:52
Speaker
They might be able to move past that stress. And I'm sure that they could utilize anything you know in their support system, but for us to also be that piece of the support system to to help them move forward a little bit more is really impactful.
00:55:08
Speaker
And it's nice to see as we're going through these trainings that the providers are really taking, taking the information and putting it into practice. After we finished our growing brain cohort, a speech therapist texted me and said, thank you so much. I actually use some of this stuff today in session. And it was, it was great.
00:55:26
Speaker
It's like I had, had such great progress. So it really is awesome. Yeah. I think families want to feel like we are invested in their family. We truly care about their family. And I think,
00:55:40
Speaker
When you are just showing that your priority is the child only, it really ruptures some of that rapport that you have established already with the caregiver.
00:55:53
Speaker
But when you show that you're truly invested in the whole family, like that matters to family. They know that you care and that you truly genuinely are there to support your whole family, right? So great points, Melissa.
00:56:09
Speaker
What about you, Jessica? Any last aha moments? Yeah, I mean, I guess the biggest aha that's come out of our training um would be really kind of Melissa's initial point about this recognition of our true, um
00:56:31
Speaker
trying to avoid a negative word, but kind of like what we're lacking in knowledge of social emotional development, right, is even very skilled therapists. It's hard sometimes to reconcile the fact that like, I'm a great therapist, I know what I'm doing, i care about these families, and i still have this thing that I need to learn more about. And so in our training, something that came up As I said, you know, we split into small groups. So something that was recurrent in all of those trainings was um basically it came through the lens of goal writing, but I think it really just speaks to Lisa, what you mentioned earlier is our ability to explain social, emotional development and milestones to families. So we did a lot of reflection on um how we write goals and
00:57:27
Speaker
kind of speaking to what Melissa was talking about, to really set families up for success. And sometimes when we write goals around social emotional development, we take really big leaps.
00:57:41
Speaker
So you guys use your staircase metaphor earlier, right? It's um skill mapping, right? Is a parent um really wants engagement with their child. And they express like, I just want him to come give me a big hug and a kiss when i get home from work.
00:57:59
Speaker
But where we're at right now is that child is really not um acknowledging that their parent is in the room at any point, right? And so by not explaining those steps that it might take to get to a place where that child would greet their parent in such a way, we're really reducing our potential for impact.
00:58:22
Speaker
And then when it comes to reviews and annuals, when we're looking at goals, we're really setting families up to feel like they failed um or like their child has failed. Right. And so that was a lot of discussion was around that. And that aha moment is like, wow, the way that we frame this and the way that we work with parents as we set goals as a team can really impact parents social emotional well-being right as they go on this journey um with their child so um i feel like that was a really valuable aha moment through trainings
00:59:03
Speaker
and i think that's so huge. I have a family. And when I first got the goals, it's the child will sit and play with shapes orders, will complete did know puzzles.
00:59:15
Speaker
And they have none of that in their house at all. So it's not not something that's meaningful to them. But as I got to know the family, the father was like, I just really want him to give me a high five.
00:59:28
Speaker
That was something so meaningful. And that should have been the goal, right? That should have been what his goal was to begin with, because it's something that's impactful to the family.
00:59:39
Speaker
But I guarantee you that he was trying to do that every single day. Of course, I still worked on it. And so and I can happily report that he is now giving his father high five when he gets home. from her But those are the things I think that we need to dig deeper and and find out a little bit more. So thanks for kind of bringing that discussion up around outcomes.
01:00:00
Speaker
So we are coming to the conclusion now um So any last comments you may have? would say just try to find the joy.
01:00:14
Speaker
in all of the moments, even if it's the smallest moment, the child is having a tantrum and the whole hour has just been stressful for everyone and it happens.
01:00:27
Speaker
Point out if you can find those moments of joy, because those are the moments that are really going to be impactful for our families. And I loved how you guys said about the goals and it being meaningful.
01:00:41
Speaker
And yeah, we can measure these skills with different um measurements and means. But if it doesn't mean something to the family, it's not going to be as impactful. And so just just remember that we are all humans.
01:01:00
Speaker
We are all taking in the world in our own ways. And we're there to support. We're not there to judge. We're not there to push. We're not there to make things happen. We're there to support and help.
01:01:14
Speaker
the progression of what the families want to see, whether it's what you want to see or not. It's their child and their family, and that's where they want to go. And that is okay, because nobody is going to know everything. Like we said before, nobody's going to do everything. We're all going to do things at our own pace, in our own way, with our own interests. And it is okay.
01:01:35
Speaker
Absolutely. Our presence, just being there in the moment matters. Okay, Melissa. Jessica, what about you? Yes, I love that. And I would just add how encouraging it has been to see so many people really get interested in this topic. So um obviously, we're working toward it as a state, but in these trainings to see people of all disciplines who, you know, are not resisting, right? They're like,
01:02:06
Speaker
yeah, where can I get more knowledge? Where can I get more training? um This is making sense. Or yeah, I want to build these connections. I realize that my practice can be more effective with families if I'm addressing these things.
01:02:19
Speaker
And so I really feel like we are moving toward a place where we're creating systems that really value social emotional development and attention to parents, right? So that's something that I think has been really incredible to see through all of the work that we've been doing in our system.
01:02:41
Speaker
Yeah, I agree with you. i definitely think that there is this desire to learn more. It's like once they get like a little bit of information and they're like, oh, i want to learn more and more about it. Even my short courses that are related to social mission development, the growing brain and the trauma course, they fill up so quickly because people are so interested.
01:03:02
Speaker
And so i I love that there is just this passion in the field to support families. I think that is the part that we have that is there for sure.
01:03:14
Speaker
And social emotional development, it's not a separate domain, right? It's the heartbeat of early intervention. It's when we train our workforce across Norfolk and Virginia Beach and beyond to really see themselves as part of that heartbeat. That's where we're kind of closing that gap.
01:03:31
Speaker
We're building their confidence and we're creating systems where every child and every family feels held. they feel understood and supported.
01:03:42
Speaker
So thank you both for being here today. That is all for today's episode of Meaningful Moments. Thank you for listening. Again, thank you just for the incredible work that you're both doing. And thank you for... all you do showing up for families every day. Your work truly matters more than you will ever know.
01:04:02
Speaker
So make sure that you subscribe to the podcast on iTunes or Spotify. For more information, visit the EIPD's website for resources, tools, and archived webinars. I'll also add any of the resources that we mentioned today under the description. So make sure you check that out.
01:04:18
Speaker
Thank you.