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Top of the West is just as good as top of the East
0 Playsin 2 hours
The general consensus seems to be that the Eastern Conference is far better than the West this year. While that may true in terms of depth, the reality is that the top four or five teams in the West can stand toe-to-toe with their Eastern counterparts.
To help make that case, we brought back Backheeled.com’s Joe Lowery, who also shares some of his early end-of-season award picks.
You can support Joe’s work as well as ours by upgrading your membership to the Advocate level or above, which includes a complimentary subscription to Backheeled.
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Transcript
Introduction to Will Bruin and Seattle Sounders Moments
00:00:01
Speaker
Hi, I'm Will Bruin, and I was just recognized as a Seattle Sounders legend. Now I get to do voice reads for the Sounder at Heart Podcast Network. Here we go. Come on. Hey, O'Shaan.
00:00:14
Speaker
Let's go. Seattle Sounders have done it. MLS Cup winners. Here comes Ruiz Diaz through the middle to crown it for Seattle.
00:00:25
Speaker
The Sounders rule the region. of
00:00:59
Speaker
you know what was the thought process in terms of who you decided to use and who you didn't? Ever since Sander Hart wrote a commentary that we didn't take the overcome seriously.
Sponsorships and Wine Talk
00:01:18
Speaker
This episode of Nos Arietes is sponsored by Full Pull Wines, a Seattle-based wine retailer and proud sponsor of Nos Arietes since 2011. Full Pull was founded in 2009, is based in Seattle, and is owned and operated by longtime Sounder supporters.
00:01:32
Speaker
They offer the best boutique wines of the world to members of their mailing list, with special focus on their home, Pacific Northwest.
Guest Introduction: Joe Lowry
00:01:41
Speaker
Welcome back to another episode of Nos Adientes on the Sounder at Heart podcast network. I am Jeremiah Oshan. Joining me today for ah irregular episode of How the West Will Be Won is Joe Lowry, one of our favorite people, representing Backheeled.com, which is, of course, a partner of Sounder at Heart.
00:02:01
Speaker
Welcome back to the show, Joe. Hey, Jeremiah. Thanks for having me, man. Yeah, it's always good to
Discussion on Teams Facing Challenges
00:02:06
Speaker
to catch up. So I'll just share. I just was listening to a podcast. You do a little like a sort of a mini podcast. It's like 10 minutes.
00:02:14
Speaker
It's a very easy, a very easy listen. you yeah You give people some useful information that they can take into their life. And I just finished listening to the episode you did last week, which you were talking about teams that should be a little worried.
00:02:28
Speaker
And the one that I think, I think for the most part, you nailed it And I think actually all your observations are fair. ah You noticed noted that the the Timbers are in some trouble. You noted that the Rapids are in some trouble.
00:02:41
Speaker
I would say both those situations got actually worse this week. ah But one of the other teams you highlighted was the Vancouver Whitecaps, who you are understandably expressing some concern about over their injury situation.
00:02:55
Speaker
And it's and it's pretty bad. i don't know if if people in Seattle ah fully appreciate, but as bad as the Sounders injury situation has been, the Whitecaps may be worse depending on how you look at it. Like it gets the Sounders.
00:03:09
Speaker
They were yeah they didn't have any natural center backs. Tristan Blackman's hurt. ah Why am i blanking on the other starting center? Yeah. and And also the two center backs assigned in the summer to replace those guys.
00:03:20
Speaker
Yeah, they're also right. Right. So they're they're they're like sort of deputizing players at this point. Mateus Laborda was the guy who started ah for and the center. He actually looked pretty good there. And ah Ralph Preso, I believe, is the other one that's yeah been playing.
00:03:34
Speaker
that's been playing and Whether or not that's a long-term strategy, like how long they can go with that remains to be seen. But they did look fantastic against the Sound the Earthquakes. Now, you know, they they gave up some chances, but ah they they win for one The Earthquakes are not a horrible team. They are a den definitely a dangerous attacking team.
00:03:57
Speaker
Would you say that the Whitecaps answered some of your concerns this week? Some, although I care less about the result against San Jose, who you're right, are not a, they're not a tragic team. What they are is a tragic defensive team. And so that the Whitecaps put up four goals on them is not a surprise that Bruce Arena has been as open tactically with San Jose and and with this personnel as has all year long, just never backing down from it has really, truly surprised me to my core in how he's gone about things in San Jose.
00:04:24
Speaker
So there's lots of open lanes there. There are multiple sequences where San Jose are are trying to high press Vancouver and they look like they've never seen off ball rotation before. And they they just don't seem to know how to close space and and cover those players rotating into the central midfield.
00:04:38
Speaker
So that Vancouver put up goals does not surprise me. It does not really move the needle for me. What does is Ryan Gould coming back. and And when I did that show for the backfield show, ah which you said lots of nice things about Jeremy, think. Thank you for that. it's It's not that I think the listeners attention span is too short to do more than 10 minutes. It's that don't have time. That's the secret.
00:04:55
Speaker
um If I did, if I did, there'd be more episodes. But with Vancouver, what moves the needle is that Gould gets back playing. And I recorded that episode on a Tuesday morning. He comes back in the Canadian championship and comes off the bench as Vancouver win that on Wednesday.
00:05:08
Speaker
And then he plays off the bench again on Sunday against San Jose. I didn't know when that was going to happen. Jesper Sorensen has told me and everybody else on planet Earth that Gald was going to come back, but they didn't really seem to know when, and there been setback after setback, and so finally he's back on the field.
00:05:22
Speaker
No, I don't expect that he's going to start games for them between now and the end of the regular season. Maybe maybe not even in the playoff run. I don't know where his fitness is. It's clearly not at a and a stage where he can play 45 minutes, let alone 60 90, but...
00:05:34
Speaker
but Vancouver in a position right now where they just need bodies and and they need talented bodies. They've been ravaged at center back. Sam out Kugbe is out for the season. If memory serves at left back, they're, they're down Brian White up top where he's been in and out of the lineup with injuries
Western Conference Playoff Race
00:05:48
Speaker
recently.
00:05:48
Speaker
Thomas Muller has been dealing with an adductor and he was able to play 90 over the weekend, which is a really good sign for him. But can you really fully count on that? I'm still super high in Vancouver as a team. I still, I still think they very much have a chance to make it to MLS cup and to win it.
00:06:02
Speaker
But I think that they had been, and I still probably stand by this, knocked down like half a tier in the Western Conference, where I still have them in that top tier. But before, I think they had a really good shot to be just the straight up best team in the West. And I don't know that they had ah team maybe other than LAFC, but we need to see them play some good teams that was right on their tails.
00:06:19
Speaker
And now I think Vancouver are are kind of in that group with a number of other teams in the West. Yeah, the the West right now is pretty is pretty interesting. At the top, you really you have four teams that could finish anywhere from one to four, all with pretty good point totals. you know i would say that they probably have four teams in the West that will finish on 60 points or better, which I'm pretty sure is unprecedented. I don't know. that I don't certainly remember a ah Western.
00:06:45
Speaker
i don't know if it's happened in the East, but I'm almost positive it's never happened in the West where you've had four teams. Overall, you actually might end up with a bunch of teams. You could end up with seven teams this year that get to 60 points, which I don't, again, i don't know that that's ever happened before. That seems like an awful lot.
00:07:03
Speaker
ah But anyone in the West, you know, Vancouver is tied on points with San Diego. They're currently ah losing the tiebreaker, which is wins. And they have, but they have two games left.
00:07:16
Speaker
San Diego has only has one. So Vancouver in pretty decent position to still finish top of the West. They could get as high as 66 points, which would be the equal to the union, but the union would would have the tiebreaker.
00:07:29
Speaker
Anyway, yeah for the supporter shield. But then you have San Diego who's on 60 points. They have one game left. You have Minnesota United who's on 58 points with one game left. And then you have LAFC is sort of like the the the meme about ah things in the rearview mirror are closer than they appear.
00:07:46
Speaker
They're on 56 points, but they have three games left to play, ah which I guess is sort of a sort of a double edged sword on one hand, there's still a lot of points. They could get to 65 points.
00:07:59
Speaker
That's still a lot of points on the board, ah which could push them all the way up to first, but they also have to play three more games at a time when ah bunch of other teams only have to play one going right into the playoffs.
00:08:11
Speaker
Yeah, it's going to be a tough. Oh, sorry, Jeremiah. Go ahead. Finish. I was going to say I was just going to I said there's no question there. The question to you was how do you sort of handicap the the top four of the West at this point?
00:08:22
Speaker
So it's interesting. My my thinking on the West is actually like let's let's just go ahead and loop Seattle. And I know that's not where you were going, but I will because I think they're good enough to belong there. I think it is. It's a top five in the Western Conference. And if you really pressed me.
00:08:37
Speaker
I would say it it actually might drop down from being a five to a four with Seattle still in the four in Minnesota United, maybe dropping out of that group. Now, Minnesota been a ah weird team all year long because they've been set piece FC. I think that's in their their social media bio like they have leaned into under Eric Ramsey. Trying to to take every marginal advantage that they can find.
00:08:57
Speaker
And that's their credit, right? Like that's not a knock against them. But they have done that in in some ways instead of becoming a really effective possession team where they don't they don't control the ball super well.
00:09:08
Speaker
They don't create a ton of chances from established possession, although they can from time to time. But right now, what Minnesota United are is they're hurt as well. And I don't know that they have the Vancouver level of depth to cover for things in the way that the Whitecaps have relatively successfully, although not fully successfully because they were in the Shield race as of like two weeks ago, and they're not anymore because they lost it.
00:09:27
Speaker
But Minnesota, they they moved Tani Oluo Shea to Villarreal for big money. Good for them. That's how it is in MLS as an MLS team. And then Kelvin Yaboa got hurt in the Open Cup semis. So they're missing multiple pieces top that's forced Eric Ramsey at Minnesota to completely shift his structure, where now sudden, instead of being a back three team, he's been a back four team trying to figure out who play up top.
00:09:48
Speaker
Now over the weekend against Sporting Kansas City in a win for Minnesota United, they started two attacking midfielders as their're their two strikers in Joaquin Pereira and Robin Ludd. So Minnesota are trying to figure out where where to find solid ground right now. And they may well figure that out and they're still well-talented enough to make a run all the way to MLS Cup. But Seattle...
00:10:05
Speaker
I think just feel like so much more of a sure thing right now, where if I had to tier things in the West and you said, I only get four teams because it's clear there's a top five, but only get four teams. I'm dropping Minnesota out and I'm bumping Seattle into the four.
00:10:19
Speaker
So I i guess to to narrow in on my specific question, you it sounds like you really have. Yeah, just dodged that whole thing. Yeah, was that was good of me. No, and I appreciate you giving the Seattle love there I was sort of going to get there. It's warranted. It's warranted.
00:10:33
Speaker
No, and I think it's – I agree with you. So you really think as a three-team race, it sounds like. Who like ultimately, who do you think going to end up with that top spot in the West? If you had to guess between LAFC, San Diego and Vancouver, because that is sort of the that really feels like the the race, right?
00:10:50
Speaker
Yeah, no, it it very much does. And that Vancouver and LAFC both have games at hand, as as you've detailed, makes things a little complicated. Honestly, if I really had to pick it ah pick a team here, I would probably lean LAFC, even with the fact that they have extra games to play. They have three, Vancouver two, San Diego have one, ah just because they don't have anybody to play.
00:11:09
Speaker
like They play Toronto, they play Austin and Colorado. None of those teams are any good, right? I mean, like yeah none of those even if you rotate for some of those games, and I expect that Chirondola would to an extent, None of those teams are very good. Now, San Diego of Portland, I don't think Portland are any good either, but it's away from home.
00:11:24
Speaker
And Vancouver, they've got, I think, the toughest of these schedules where they've got Orlando away, and NFC Dallas at home, and Dallas all of a sudden have become a team that nobody really wants to play in the postseason because of how Eric Quill is setting then ah them up and maybe we'll get to that later.
00:11:36
Speaker
But I would lean LAFC even with the fact that they have some ground to cover just because they have smashed minnow after minnow after minnow in this run of theirs. And I don't know that that's slowing down anytime soon.
00:11:48
Speaker
Yeah. LAFC have just come on like gangbusters ever since son essentially got involved in this team. They're currently on a five game win streak.
00:11:59
Speaker
ah Weirdly Atlanta was their least productive performance. I guess maybe that was because Atlanta set up in a very conservative, took a very conservative approach. They only took three shots.
00:12:10
Speaker
ah None of them from inside the box. They, they just were not exposing themselves and LAFC ultimately needed a ah relatively late goal to, to pull out three points in that one.
00:12:21
Speaker
But again, that was Denny Bwonga scoring ah yet again. I believe that is now 18 goals between him and, ah and son over the last five games, all 18 goals they've scored, I believe still, right. That's still right.
00:12:38
Speaker
Yeah, so they've scored. Son and Boanga have scored 18 goals. It's more than five games. i think it I think it's taken them seven, if memory serves, to get to that point. Let me get quick to the math. 12, 14. Yeah, i believe I believe it's seven games.
00:12:49
Speaker
Over the last seven games, they've scored all the goals for LAFC. Right. and And that's fine. like they can They can totally ride with that. So, it yeah, the streak there is insane, Jeremiah. ah So does that give you any pause in terms of like, look, this is an amazing thing to watch. I think we can say that this is the most impressive run that any two – They are on an unbelievable heater.
00:13:13
Speaker
And it's I think you can argue that it's not even a heater, that this might just kind of be their level. But there does something to be like an X factor here that you go into the playoffs and you'd like to have something else in your bag. Even though you know when you when you're that good when your driver is that good, sure, hit it off the deck. that's you know If we're going to use the the golf analogy, right? Maybe you just hit driver all the time.
00:13:39
Speaker
But you do need like some short irons every now and then, don't you? Yeah. I mean, yes, sort of, but I feel like we always move the goalposts on these sorts of discussions where I think about, what was that? Maybe 20, it was a few years back where the Rapids had a really good season. I think they finished second in the Western conference. I can't remember what year that was.
00:13:57
Speaker
And the the big question about them heading into the post season where they didn't make a deep run was, do they have, do they have a primary goal scorer? And then you've got one primary goal scorer and we think, well, is that enough? Do you need two? And then, then LAC have two primary goal scorers. And the question is, well, do they need three?
00:14:12
Speaker
I don't think so. I think LAFC are going to be just fine in the attack. my My question about LAFC heading into the playoffs and the reason why sort of like danced around some of your questions and and really don't have an answer that I feel super convinced on for the question you asked about who's going to win the West in the regular season anyway, it's because as I think about LAFC and not just the regular season, but beyond that,
00:14:31
Speaker
And I think about what their playoff hopes could look like. They just haven't played anybody good since Sun got there. Now, that's that's a bit of hyperbole. They actually have, I think, played three pretty pretty good to actually quite good teams. they They had San Diego where they lost that game but played pretty well.
00:14:44
Speaker
They lost that game 2-1. They had the the draw in Chicago, and that's when Sun made his debut. So maybe we throw that one out or or you can toss it in, whatever. Sun doesn't play that whole game, doesn't start that game. And then they've got a game away in Dallas, in Frisco, and they don't win that game either. I think they they draw that game.
00:14:58
Speaker
So they had three cracks at like decent teams, like teams are going to be in the playoffs, certainly. and And they haven't won any of those games. And the games they have won have been been against like truly poor teams where I think about ah beating San Jose for two. they They put up four goals on ah RSL and back to back games and then three on St. Louis.
00:15:14
Speaker
And then they beat Atlanta over the weekend. I want to see LAFC play somebody before I feel really strongly about their chances. I still think this team is really, really good. And that's why I'm still so, so bullish on them, even with that lack of success against good teams since son has arrived.
00:15:29
Speaker
And i I look at this team and I think John Thornton gets a ton of credit in general around the league. Certainly in in the media, I think he gets a lot of credit among people that are inside of and MLS as well. And in those circles, so ah somehow it's not enough, man. and Like, like John Thornton and Neil McGinnis and the rest of that front office there.
00:15:44
Speaker
They have adapted this squad so effectively from one window to the next one injury to the next. I mean, they have Jeremiah there. They're missing two players right now, two starters, the season ending injuries. They're starting number six and they're starting. They're probably the best center back in Aaron Long, although I'm not like it as big of an air long guy as some. But that's that's a big deal.
00:16:04
Speaker
And i'm I'm talking about Vancouver and Columbus and and Minnesota and all these injury problems and how that could affect their seasons. Nobody talks about that with LAFC. That hasn't even been a ah point of discussion because they have built such what what seems to be such an effective, deep squad, frankly, that I don't know outside of Seattle.
00:16:20
Speaker
There's another team in MLS that has quite as much depth that you feel really good about playing in a big moment as LAFC. but I'm not worried about them, although I i am like 3% worried that that when they meet a good team or series of good teams in the postseason that they might just not know what to do with themselves.
00:16:36
Speaker
Yeah, I think that is that that is, you know, I think you're right. Like, this is a very, very good team.
San Diego FC's Expansion Success
00:16:42
Speaker
And it is kind of an interesting little note that these top teams in the West all seem to be missing really important key parts. ah You know, the Sounders have been with, are currently missing Iemar Gomez-Andrade.
00:16:56
Speaker
They have missed, Jordan Morris has been in and out of the lineup. ah Basically, every key piece that, you almost every key piece the Sounders have, have missed, you know, some part of the season.
00:17:08
Speaker
And you can kind of just go down the list and everybody is sort of dealing with this to varying degrees. And it is kind of a ah fascinating thing to see how that ends up ultimately ah impacting the way the season plays out.
00:17:20
Speaker
ah San Diego FC, I think we you've written a lot about San Diego FC. I think that by any any metric, any any reasonable metric, this has to be considered an almost wildly, in in literally unprecedented level of success that they've enjoyed in their expansion season.
00:17:42
Speaker
And I think it was you who said something along the lines, like maybe we need to change the way we look at these expansion teams. That it's not, that we sort of assume that the expansion team build is inherently difficult,
00:17:58
Speaker
But yeah I think I'm pretty sure this was you that I heard. Yeah. talking about this onacwises with tom yeah Yeah. Okay. And you were talking about how they actually have some advantages and building from scratch is sometimes better than having to rebuild a team that has all these existing, you know, if you do it right,
00:18:14
Speaker
There are some inherent advantages. And San Diego seems to have really exploited all those advantages, especially in that they had this very clear vision of what they wanted to do.
00:18:25
Speaker
And they just didn't deviate deviate from that. And I think you can maybe argue that that maybe bites them in the ass a little bit when they when they let Giloski leave. ahloki leave Because they sort of were saying, look, we're not goingnna we we have other ideas for what we want to do at this position, and he just doesn't fit it. And even if it's a relatively cheap price, we're not going to bring him back. and and But it is kind of funny to think, they in terms of this year, they'd be much better off if they kept him, right? i mean that's Oh, yeah.
00:18:56
Speaker
That's undeniable, right? Yeah, no doubt about that. And the situation was, as I'm sure many listeners know, that Oloski wanted a raise to stay around in San Diego. And Tyler Heaps in that front office decided that they didn't want to give him the raise that he wanted. And so he goes off to Philly and Philly sign him, which is kind of funny to all of us because Ernst Tanner doesn't spend a lot of money on players. Right. So we know it wasn't a lot of money. Doesn't get...
00:19:18
Speaker
Exactly. So, you know, it's not like a a top of the market sort of of rate that Milan Oloski is getting, but it still sounds like it's more than than Tyler Heaps in that front office wanted to pay. And in some ways, I i feel for Heaps because the sample size was basically zero for Oloski, right? I mean, he scored double digit goals in 500 minutes or something absurd. And you think that can't continue and it hasn't, but it hasn't like not not continued by very much. I mean, he has still been amazing for Philly and is now like playing out a key role for them in a different position and very much seems to be a very good and MLS player.
00:19:47
Speaker
So they've got to be feeling that one a little bit. But man, what is that? Like the only thing they've done wrong all season long? mean, it is so impressive what they've done. san Diego took advantage of every edge that they get. And and I think we all we all underestimated what this team was going to look like by by a lot. I think I had them just just inside the playoffs in the Western Conference in my preseason predictions.
00:20:09
Speaker
Thinking that they had a lot of pieces that I really liked. Both the DPs looked really good in Dreyer and Lozano. Luka De La Torre was a basically can't miss MLS center mid. Anibal Godoy is a capable player in midfield. Yepe Tershkov looked looks pretty good.
00:20:21
Speaker
My concern was about the back line. um and And that is something that has chopped and changed quite a bit this season. But I didn't expect their top super draft pick in Mano Dua to suddenly become one of the the flashiest center backs in Major League Soccer. I didn't expect Chris McVay to look like a very capable center back, although neither of those guys were perfect against the Dynamo over the weekend.
00:20:39
Speaker
I didn't expect them to pluck Luca Mabito out of relative obscurity in LAFC. And now he's, he's at the U 20 world cup. I mean, like there's just so many of those things that I didn't see coming that I don't think anybody saw coming.
00:20:49
Speaker
They're the best expansion team in MLS regular season history. i think you could make an argument that in like factoring in all the eras, they might already be the best expansion team in MLS history. I know that that takes some shots at the 1998 Chicago fire who do end up going and and doing the double that year. They win MLS cup. They won the open cup.
00:21:05
Speaker
It's a very different time. And I think succeeding in MLS now in some ways is harder now than it was then. take it. Take it, man. I feel like it's hard to compare anything to 90. It is. I mean, the ri and you sort of mentioned this on the on the show with Tom that it's – just hard to call that ah and an expansion team when the entire league was effectively. years expansion yeah Yeah. They come into year three.
00:21:28
Speaker
So it's like, okay, yes, they, they are technically the best expansion team. They'll probably never be topped if you use them as the, as the bar, but in the modern era of MLS, I think it's basically them LAFC and the Sounders in terms of the, the best ah debuts, the Sounders are the only one that actually ah won a trophy their first year.
00:21:48
Speaker
But, you know, and I and i will say the Sounders were sneakily close to winning the Supporters' Shield that year. they you I think they lost out by just a point or two. ah But the point totals were also way low. Like, it wasn't even on a points per game basis. It was just a much tighter rate. Like, it was not the same thing.
00:22:06
Speaker
I think I feel okay saying San Diego is, this has been the most impressive. Certainly, since I've been paying attention. This has been the most impressive expansion. it's been It's been amazing to watch, man. like They deserve so much credit for everything that that has gone on there. I mean, Dreyer, if Lilo Messi's not the league, Dreyer probably wins and MVP this year. If Jesper Sorensen is not doing what's happening in Vancouver, then Mikey Varas probably wins coach of the year. At the very least, he's in the discussion. He'll probably get a lot of votes, Mikey Varas.
00:22:34
Speaker
Yeah. think I think my vote probably tends to push towards Sorensen, but I haven't fully made up my mind on that yet, and I'm willing to be swayed. I mean, there's there's just so much to like about this San Diego team. They found talent from places that we didn't think they would.
00:22:47
Speaker
Their style has been on point from the jump in that. no Not style. People talk about this all the time and it sometimes it frustrates me. Style is not something that you want to have just to say that you can you can play this like romantic whatever version of soccer that we philosophize this sport over time. i don't even know if that's a word. It sounded good when I said it, though. um Like we've we've we've like romanticized. There's there's a better one. That's a real word for sure.
00:23:09
Speaker
This game because for sure, because we just have over time and it's played everywhere and and it has that quality to it. And so people talk about style like that's like that's all that matters on its own. Well, style is a means to an end. And the end of having a style that everybody understands on your on your team had executed is that everybody's on the same page. And when you know what what I'm going to do as a podcast guest and when you know what my next move is going to be, that allows you to plan the next question better. And all all these things. Right.
00:23:34
Speaker
If you're on a soccer team, and you can make quicker decisions. That's going to make life harder for the defense. And when you can make quicker pressing decisions, that's going to make life harder for the for the opposing attack. It is a means to an end in San Diego have reached that end. Now they still have some rough edges and that they are at times as a consequence to how they want to play still a little loose on the ball and they give it the ball in bad spots. That's certainly happening. It's Houston.
00:23:54
Speaker
I don't know. I don't believe that they have the defensive chops that Seattle or Vancouver or l LAFC or Philly, or maybe even a couple of other teams, Nashville in the East, maybe NYCFC have, I think they're, they're very much in that next year or two down from those groups, but,
00:24:08
Speaker
There's just so little to nitpick with San Diego in in the short term and any frankly even less to nitpick in the long term. Yeah, and I always i think what where I come down on them is they could have they could finish – I guess they could still technically finish fourth, but they could finish have finished fourth, fifth, even sixth.
00:24:24
Speaker
And I think if you take everything else that they've done, it would still be an impressive launch. Yes. one ah Because they just have, like you said, they've had this commitment to playing a certain way that is effective. And that is really what it's about. It's not, can you string a bunch of passes together? It's, can you, can you play with a, a real focus that is clearly building towards something?
00:24:48
Speaker
ah I will, I am very interested to see how this plays in the playoffs. I realized that, you know, it's, the the playoffs are, they are, they're different. They just are different. It's harder. It's, it's, you just don't find as much space and, and teams are are approaching these things differently, especially the three game series where you you have to play the same opponent back to back to back, but potentially, and, and it's going to be just interesting to see how this, how this plays out.
00:25:14
Speaker
But, Either way, it's just been very, very impressive to see what they've done, ah to see how they've handled themselves against the LAFCs, who they've matched up really well with.
00:25:26
Speaker
ah But yeah, i'm i come I just keep coming away just ultimately very impressed. I've been saying this for a while. i I do think a long playoff run for an expansion team can sometimes be...
00:25:41
Speaker
a double edged sword and that you set this bar that ends up being almost impossible to clear. Like it's nice to have something to build off of and to build from like, if all you can do is win champions league in order to improve on their previous season, that's, or when MLS cup, that's a tough one to clear.
00:25:57
Speaker
Yeah. And I think we saw this kind of with Atlanta too, right? Where they won MLS cup in year two. And it's almost been sort of like this yoke around their neck in terms of,
00:26:08
Speaker
well, this is now our standard. So everything we do has to be compared to this amazing, you know, 2018 season that frankly might never be equaled. what What I will say on that is, i mean, odds are against San Diego having this season that they've had this year next year. Right. I mean, odds are that they'll do worse is is a simpler way of saying that.
00:26:27
Speaker
um At the same time, i am really bullish on on the long term for this team because their academy has just started. um They've already shown an unbelievable ability, the entire front office to go out and sign youth national team level players.
00:26:41
Speaker
from all sorts of places. Like the fact that heaps and Boris both have U.S. soccer connections from time at the Federation, I think really matters. Boris is a former U-20 coach. I mean, they go out and grab Pedro Soma from Spain and they go out and grab this right back, whose last name starts on and I don't know how to pronounce it. He started over the weekend and he's played a bunch of of minutes for them this season, at least relative to expectation.
00:27:02
Speaker
They plucked him out of of like the youth levels over in Germany. He's a U.S. youth international. Luca Bambino, already mentioned, David Vasquez from Philly. Like the list goes on and on of these guys. They've got in given real minutes to who who weren't even on the roster when the season started. That's Oscar Verhoeven's been out injured, but they got him from San Jose.
00:27:17
Speaker
i mean, it goes on and on. ah When they actually start churning out their own players from their own academy, which is in a great area, by the way, to all of the players that they've already got and shown an ability to go out and find, i am um really high on what the future could be like for them. Yes, there'll be a dip. Fans have to be rational. We know fans aren't very good at doing that. So so that that is what it is. But the other thing I wanted to say, because you mentioned what this looks like in the playoffs,
00:27:39
Speaker
In the short term, I tend to think that people make a little too much of, ah well, this style doesn't tend to work in the postseason or that style doesn't tend to work in the postseason. And this is done with zero. i want emphasize zero statistical searching on my part.
00:27:53
Speaker
But I know Doyle talks about all the time, like we we've seen the Red Bulls playoff ah streak shows that they can't go in and win in the postseason with a high pressing model. And my sort of thought on that is, well, Philly high pressed a bunch in 2022 and we're like one kick of the ball away from winning MLS Cup.
00:28:05
Speaker
And they almost won the double that year. Like they were a really good team. And at a certain point, variance kind of plays its its part. For San Diego, I don't think they should be worried about how their style trends in the translates in the postseason. Because who have the last two MLS cup winners been?
00:28:18
Speaker
Well, last year it was the LA Galaxy who who exclusively used the ball up until they lost Ricky Puj. And the year before, it was Wilford Nonsens' Columbus crew who used the ball more than basically any team we'd ever seen MLS until San Diego came along. So I think they have every chance to make a deep run in the postseason. Again, i think the top of the West is so incredibly difficult to call. I do not think there's almost anything that separates basically any of those top five teams. I think San Diego very much have a shot to win
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00:30:57
Speaker
Well, let's dig into this top five notion
Seattle Sounders' Defensive Analysis
00:31:00
Speaker
a little bit. I tend to agree with you. I feel like the Sounders, if nothing else, I think they showed what their ceiling can be when they won League's Cup. I mean, it was clearly like this is a team when they're on, when they're playing well, they can play with anybody. Now, we saw the last four or five games where they have struggled a bit more to close out teams, especially. I don't think they've necessarily been bad in most of those games, but they do seem to have a tendency to give up ah late to make mistakes late in games that are a little baffling.
00:31:30
Speaker
ah But i I still do tend to believe that this defense is good, even though it's essentially the same defense that was the top defense in MLS by both the real numbers and the ah underlying numbers. Each of the last two seasons, the underlying numbers still say that they are a very good defensive team.
00:31:49
Speaker
And for whatever reason, they just keep shooting themselves in the foot, whether it be, you know, red cards like they picked up against Portland or penalties like they penalties and red cards have just been.
00:32:01
Speaker
this constant for the Sounders this year that sort of baffles. It's been a little baffling for me as someone who's watching it, but as an outside, you know, I'm, I'm looking at this every day, but as an outsider, what do you, you clearly like something that you're seeing with the Sounders that, that wants you to raise them into sort of, you know, like kind of this elite level of the Western conference.
00:32:23
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I love the way that you phrased that, Jeremiah. Have we seen what their ceiling is? I think that their ceiling is crazy high, and we saw how good they were in League's Cup Final against Inter-Miami. I mean, they were they were awesome in that game. It wasn't maybe the scoreline flattered them slightly because Miami did have some looks in that game, but...
00:32:40
Speaker
They were really good, like really, really good in that game. We saw how they can play up to the level at the Club World Cup, and and that didn't go maybe how they would have wanted, but but still a very respectable outing from from the team in that instance.
00:32:52
Speaker
i am I am basically willing to chuck everything from the League's Cup Final until the end of the season, end the regular season, out if if that's what someone wants to do. For Seattle, like like the emotional energy that went into that game seemed to be really great, and maybe there's a learning experience there for Hey, you got to get up, but also we're not done. Like this, this is not our final final. It's it's just a final.
00:33:12
Speaker
That's a hard line to to straddle, man. Like I don't know how to teach people that I don't know how to manage that on my own, let alone communicate it to others in that situation. But I am willing to to chuck the rest of the regular season out and believe in this group that they know how to get up for the games when they matter.
00:33:25
Speaker
I think we have enough evidence of this club and and a lot of these players. that says they can do that. And even beyond that, they have not been nearly as as bad as the results between League's Cup final and and finally this win over Portland that gets the monkey off the back, right? They have not been nearly as bad as those results have shown. They have made mistakes.
00:33:42
Speaker
Everybody in MLS makes mistakes. A lot of them. Every team. ah it It is a little again, there's a little variance in when those mistakes get punished and when they don't against the Galaxy, they got punished. Schmetzer was was displeased with some setups off of defensive throw ins after that game. And there have been all those little details that maybe, again, haven't been quite right after you burn so much emotional energy in the final.
00:34:01
Speaker
the The other thing besides the ceiling for Seattle that that seems so incredibly high, that is incredibly high. It's as high as any team in MLS, I think. The other thing is that they just have so many stinking good players. Like ah ultimately the roster is so absurdly deep that you can go and, oh, you're missing Obed Vargas, who's been really, really good in MLS this year.
00:34:19
Speaker
Yeah, no problem. Like Rusnak has played in the eight before a bunch of times. He can go and start there. The red card wasn't fortunate, whatever, right? I mean, like, like oh yeah, great. Latte Suess played the 10 and Pedro's better this year than he's ever been. He'll be on the left.
00:34:30
Speaker
I think in some ways this team just looks better this year than it did last year to me. And we haven't seen the full group of this team all year long. But there is there's way too much talent in here. And we've seen way too many good moments for them to make me think that this team is anything but a top tier contender in the West.
00:34:46
Speaker
Yeah, what gets the thing i like about this team is, you know, last year, the thing that was holding them back was an offense that was really never got fully going. ah They were they got OK on set pieces, but from open play, they were struggling from the beginning of the season all the way to the end.
00:35:06
Speaker
And this year they've turned it around and they've actually been one of the better teams in open play. ah Looking not at set pieces and penalties, I think the Sounders are fifth or sixth in both ah the underlying numbers and the and the real numbers in terms of goal scoring.
00:35:23
Speaker
which ah and ah and And that's come from a variety of places. you know You've got Danny Masofsky banging in goals for fun. you got ah osa a de rosario You've got And that doesn't even include ah the League's Cup and where they really ah they really showed off their depth, I thought, in League's Cup.
00:35:40
Speaker
ah But i'm I'm with you. I do like this team. I think that if they can you know just sort of if they can get healthy and get some rhythm going, they could be dangerous.
Minnesota United's Playoff Prospects
00:35:50
Speaker
And it seems like they have – it looks to me like they are on sort of a ah collision course with Minnesota United, a team that's beaten them twice this year, but I would say maybe less than convincingly ah beaten them in both of those games.
00:36:07
Speaker
How do you see matchup? Like, are you convinced that Minnesota United can keep doing this thing that they do? I know they they actually, you know, they looked OK. I'm sorry. they They dominated Sporting Kansas City, but Sporting Kansas City is yeah about as dead as they can be.
00:36:22
Speaker
ah Yeah, that that's well said. um First of all, Seattle should be hoping that they're on a collision course from Minnesota instead of LAFC, I think. and And from what we said, I think we both expect LAFC to climb climb a little bit, right? um ah for For everything I said about LAFC, about being 3% worried that they'll hit a good team and not know what to do, there's maybe a bigger chunk of me that thinks when they hit a good team and the game opens up a little bit. And Seattle might not be the right team for that to actually happen against, given how Smechner likes to be pragmatic in those moments.
00:36:48
Speaker
Man, when LAFC hit a team that's willing to give them some space, I i might suggest running for the hills and hoping that that works out along the way. four It's a scary team. It's a scary team. For Minnesota, I...
00:37:01
Speaker
i don't I don't know what to make of this team, man. I have to hedge towards I'm worried about them because I think it would be foolish not to be a little bit worried about where they're at at the moment. But I think the set piece stuff can continue even without Oluwache and even without Yeboah.
00:37:14
Speaker
and And we don't know for sure that Yeboah is done for the year, but it doesn't seem like he's going to be able to play a huge role. Maybe maybe caveat that. I don't know exactly what's going to happen there. I think the set piece stuff can continue. They are so incredibly good at that.
00:37:26
Speaker
I am worried about this team losing a of their ceiling defensively, that they won't be able to press as effectively from the front. It's not that they're an all-out pressing team in every moment, but they press a lot in the final third, and they sit really deep in other moments. so and And when they press, I think they are, and Eric Granzi's talked about this, they have not seen as much success in the press since they have had to reshuffle the attacking personnel due to injuries and LOSA leaving.
00:37:48
Speaker
And then when they do sit deeper, now they cannot transition nearly as effectively because they've lost their two best transition attackers. right in, your bow and Oluweshe, especially Oluweshe. I mean, he was the best attacker in this team.
00:38:01
Speaker
Pereira and Ludd are very good players. Bangi Hwanglane is a very effective transition player for an outside back, but now he's maybe being asked to play higher up the field or to play more centrally. If that's the look in the any given game, they're just not as good of a team now as they were before.
00:38:14
Speaker
the MLS playoffs are not so long that that variants could not get them all the way to the final. And, and their very specific skills are um very real and could indeed get them there.
00:38:25
Speaker
But again, I kind of, I think what I said earlier sums it up well in that I think of the five teams, I think they're number five. and this is sort of separate question, but one of the things that I've always found very interesting is there's this sort of insistence that Eric Ramsey is this hot coaching commodity and mit and i I'm sure he is, but I am curious, like the ah people in England really just like, are they in love with the idea of a guy who sets his team up to have 30% of possession and try to score some goals on seven. Like, I guess maybe that's like useful for a relegation fight, but that does not strike me as sort of like the coaching genius that gets you moved up in the world. Like I, I, I, there's a world for, you know, a lot of pragmatic coaches have gotten a lot of,
00:39:11
Speaker
you know, a lot of juice at it, but this, I always questioned the idea that this is like some exciting coaching prospect. It's like, yeah, i mean, he figured out a thing, but is this what gets you the next job? I don't know.
00:39:22
Speaker
Well, and the crazy thing is he's figured out a thing and it's worked all year. So, I mean, maybe maybe we do need to give a little bit more credit to what that looks like because no, nobody's been able to stop it. um I mean, I think there's, there's a line in here somewhere about how dire lower level in English soccer is to watch that Ramsey's style would fit right in.
00:39:39
Speaker
I mean, it's bad, man. I also think ah the fact that he was at Manchester United matters a lot yeah to a lot of these clubs. And I mean, his his profile, just for pretend you've never watched Minnesota United play soccer under Eric Ramsey. Yeah. his His profile of young, well-spoken, sort of dynamic personality who speaks multiple languages, came up in the Manchester United system, um but kind of right...
00:40:01
Speaker
Right as right before things were were getting a dumpster fiery there. And then moves to America, which like to all these English people was like, wow, you know, that's that's a bit beneath you. But but like he's had a lot of success and dominated there. And so that's that's got like a lot of ah appeal.
00:40:16
Speaker
And I think he does start to look like a pretty nice candidate for a lot of these jobs. And the interesting thing is I've never spoken to Eric Ramsey. I don't get the sense that this is like his way of playing.
00:40:27
Speaker
I get the sense. And I hope you have more about this backheeled later, later in the year. I get the sense that this is probably coming part from Ramsey and in part from upstairs and it's been working and they've decided we got to make this our thing and just, just absolutely ride it out.
00:40:42
Speaker
And I give them credit for that. I think Ramsey probably would tend to be a bit more possession-y than we've seen. Not a lot, but at least some, um but that's, that certainly not going to happen this year. So kind of a money bowl approach, which is not so much that there's a specific philosophy, but there is a ah finding the the undervalued asset or under you the overlooked ah totally advantages that you can gain and maximizing on those no matter what those may be. And if it happens to lead you to long throws and 30% of possession, so be
00:41:13
Speaker
so be it Right. and And Ramsey, I think, I think talked to John Mullen, the guardian earlier this year and and basically said, you know, if we didn't go long on every set piece, like every, every set piece they get near midfield, Dane St. Clair trots up and and just smashes it into the 18.
00:41:27
Speaker
If they didn't do all that stuff, cause time sticking off the clock there, they would have, I think he said like, you know, 10% more possession per game. I think that's, that's way too high, but that is, there's some truth to that, right? If they didn't go so extreme and all these things,
00:41:38
Speaker
they would have more of the ball and and maybe we would think about them in a slightly different way, but I i have to imagine their effective game time, like the amount of time the ball is in play yeah in Minnesota games is the lowest in the league by a huge margin. And so that does kind of mess with their numbers a little bit. You look at what what makes Minnesota United so special beyond all of the the tactical stuff that makes them an outlier, right?
00:41:57
Speaker
Is that the recruitment has been really good as well. Like they have a lot of good players in this team and who I think could be adaptable to play in a different way. And that's why I'm not willing to close the book on, Oh, all of a sudden, yeah, They can't transition quite like they could before. Well, Robin Ludd's still a really good player.
00:42:11
Speaker
And Joaquin Pereira had suitors from Europe and and was the subject of like an $8 million bid or something crazy from a club in Turkey. Like they have real, real talent in this team. it looks like they've hit already on at least one of the guys they brought in in the summer.
00:42:23
Speaker
and And they've got good production from basically every spot on the field. And oh, by the way, Dane St. Clair might be the best goalkeeper in MLS this season. So... Again, they're not the team that I'd be most afraid of, but doubt doubt them and sort rule them out. I think at ah your own, ah what am I looking for? I talk for a living. just Just don't do that. I wouldn't do that if I were you. Do something else.
00:42:42
Speaker
Nailed it. It's been a day. Absolutely. First try. Yeah. Dane St. Clair for what it's worth. Dane St. Clair, I think is my goalkeeper of the year. ah Spoiler. I think so. Yeah. ah So of the, let's call it the, the other five teams, six teams that are still,
00:43:01
Speaker
competing
Dallas FC's Strategy Without Lucho Acosta
00:43:02
Speaker
for a playoff spot uh is anyone in there notable like it you sounded like you kind of like dallas you you are you feel like dallas might be the one and but is that the only team that you think is even really worth talking about it at this point Peril was the word I was looking for before, by the way. So I did get there. i did get there eventually. um just Just a slight delay.
00:43:22
Speaker
Yeah, Dallas are the only other team that i'm I'm even like a little scared of. And I'm not i'm not that scared of them. But what Dallas have done since Lucho Acosta left has been has been awesome. So they have not lost a single game since Lucho Acosta last played for them.
00:43:34
Speaker
They've gone eight straight unbeaten. Unbelievable. Yeah, it is unbelievable. And Eric Quill, it's all coming too late for him to be in the coach of the year conversation. But Eric Quill adapting his style and and saying, hey, guys, we're going to go and and defend in our own third every single game. I think they had they hadd some absurdly low possession percentage in their win over the Galaxy ah over the weekend. I'm trying to find what it is on the fly. 37%.
00:43:54
Speaker
thirty seven percent So in that in that run, thank you for finding that, that is still the fourth highest possession percentage that they've had. the fourth i mean, like like they've had so many games underneath 37% possession. They have basically camped out in their own third of the field.
00:44:10
Speaker
in every single week During this unbeaten streak, to be clear, what you're yeah right you're talking about the in the eight games that they've gone unbeaten, this was the fourth lowest, and it was at 37%. Yes, they've only had three games where they've had more of but in this run, only three games so they've had more than 37% possession.
00:44:27
Speaker
Like every other game has been below that mark, 34, 35, 36, 35. They have just sat their third years. they have just sat in their own third for Huge chunks of matches at a time.
00:44:37
Speaker
And you know what? It's working. And it's not like, I'm not trying to say that this is some mind boggling tactical creation for Merrick. Well, it's not right. But right what it's done is it's, it's helped compensate for a roster that frankly is no good.
00:44:49
Speaker
Like the roster in Dallas is terrible. Um, Sebastian Ibiaga, who is like barely an MLS level center back in my mind. He leads this team in minutes. Well, this Bubakar, a Colorado Rapids cast off is, is a starting center back for this team.
00:45:02
Speaker
Uh, they're starting ah a 19 year old Brazilian kid that they brought in on a U22 deal. Kaike, uh, for big money who so far is not good. Uh, it's a good thing for him that development is, is not linear and he could turn out to be a great player, but he's not there yet. Certainly he's starting for them in central midfield. It's just a bad roster.
00:45:18
Speaker
And because they sit so deep, that means they put their bad players in in fewer bad spots because they're less isolated. And so they have more help as a team that can defend as a team. And oh, by the way, when they do need to go and attack, Pitar Moussa might be the best player that nobody's talking about in Major League Soccer this season where he can go and and create chances for others as a nine, but also is an unbelievable box presence and in such a well-rounded player. He's been a smash hit, one of their only smash hits Dallas for for years and years now.
00:45:43
Speaker
That recipe of sitting deep and then attacking through Moussa Not a great trophy-winning recipe, but could it be a recipe for a first-round upset? Maybe. At least more than any of these other teams. That's for sure.
00:45:54
Speaker
Yeah, 18 goal. If he wasn't... ah Well, okay. ah Maybe not in the MVP consideration, but if he wasn't on such a bad team, he would probably be getting some best 11 shouts.
00:46:06
Speaker
He might get some as it is. ah Yeah, you know, its this is an even crazier thing. If you go back to the last time that Luciano... ah Acosta actually played. So before this is he didn't play for a few games after ah before he actually got transferred.
00:46:20
Speaker
That was a 2-0 loss to LAFC. They've only lost once since he stopped playing. And that was a a four to three loss to New York city FC, wild game that they lost in New York city. is Other than that, so they've just been on this really impressive run that they have undeniably gotten better.
00:46:42
Speaker
Once Acosta got out of a, got out of the team essentially. Yeah. And I, at least on FB ref, Acosta played in that NYC FC loss. So the last, at least okay what I'm looking at is since he stopped playing for them in any capacity, not just starting in any capacity, they have not lost a game.
00:46:56
Speaker
um And that, that may happen sooner rather than later. They've got the galaxy up next, which is a winnable game on decision day. But the overall year is impressive and it gives them a blueprint for next season, whether or not the front office can can land the targets needed to make this set up work.
00:47:12
Speaker
Or maybe Quill wants to play a different way. And this is just his his break glass in case of emergency tactical choice. All that stuff is is possible. But man, it's it's at least made something interesting at the bottom of the West because I know the East is all booked up in terms of playoff spots. There's room for some shuffling there.
00:47:26
Speaker
The West has some wiggle room at the bottom, but I just find it difficult to get excited about any of these other teams making the postseason. I mean, just watching RSL and Colorado try to make their way in San Jose, I guess they're still involved in this fight.
00:47:38
Speaker
I just am not moved by any of those teams at the moment, but Dallas, at least a little bit, they they kind of move me right now. I mean, they could jump to six. I mean, that's not out outside of the possible possibility ah that they could get as high as six. So they're they're currently eighth right now.
00:47:53
Speaker
They can. I guess they still haven't technically punched their ticket, but they have no, but they're two games left. Yeah, I think they need one point. yeah it looks like they probably need... Oh, no, they probably need two points. so ah But either way.
MLS End-of-Season Awards Discussion
00:48:05
Speaker
All right. Well, ah before we get out of here, do you want to go through some of your thinking on the ah the ballot for end-of-season awards just got given to us ah last week?
00:48:17
Speaker
I have not cast it yet. Just actually before we got on, I started... going through it to see where I was. And so far it seems, you know, I'm right now, I'm on defender of the year just to give you an update on where I am.
00:48:32
Speaker
but So I'm still on the first page. I think I'm still on the first page of, of, uh, voting, but so far it seems pretty straightforward. You know, I'll just, I'll tell you where, ah where I am Newcomer of the year feels like it's gotta be drier, right? Like he,
00:48:46
Speaker
he would be an MVP candidate if it wasn't for messy, who I think is probably going to end up winning MVP, but he 17 goals, 16 primary assists. This is a spectacular, this is like a great season by any, and by any metric, it's a ah frankly unbelievable season, especially for an expansion ah expansion team.
00:49:05
Speaker
Yeah, very much so. Dreyer is, I think, think there are two that are really easy this year. MVP and and newcomer of the year, I think are are pretty easy choices. And Dreyer is the obvious newcomer and he would be the MVP if Messi wasn't here in my mind.
00:49:17
Speaker
I think if you take Messi out of Miami, that team is, is like maybe not even a playoff team in the Eastern Conference. It seemed like a disaster to me without... Messi. Yeah, i I completely agree. He in in like every definition, we go through all these different definitions of MVP and oh, how do you decide? What does it actually mean? Well, you got to take the player out of the team and think about how they would do or or no, you don't have to. i mean, there's so many different ways that people twist themselves up and not about this.
00:49:40
Speaker
Miami are a good team. ah They've got a chance to win MLS Cup. Messi's amazing. He's the most talented player in the league for one. And he's probably the most valuable if you want to use that very strict definition as well. yeah He also has 24 goals and 14 assists in 2200 minutes. So like he's, he's doing the business no matter how you like, we don't need to overthink this. He is having ah absolutely unbelievable season. He has more goals and assists combined.
00:50:09
Speaker
He has five more goals and assists combined than anyone else in the league right now. And, and dryer is the only one that is even sniffing him. Uh, That said, let's see. where all where we ah so new the i was the this was i was actually pleased. I don't know how long they've been doing this.
00:50:25
Speaker
But Comeback Player of the Year, they seem to have narrowed down the the qualifications for Comeback Player of the Year. There's only like I think there's only like eight players that are even nominated this year, which I find frankly refreshing because it used to be that comeback player of the year could be coming back from anything you wanted.
00:50:44
Speaker
Bad season, hangnail. But all these players are came back from apparently pretty serious injury. ah and they could.
00:50:56
Speaker
Yeah, OK. And honestly, I found this one tough in part because They narrowed it down so much that there weren't like a lot of obvious candidates. But ah Danielle, the the quarter the ah the quarterback, the goalkeeper for the Earthquakes is who I have right now.
00:51:12
Speaker
But the other ones that are nominated Connor Antley, Kyle Duncan from DC United, Kyle Duncan from the Red Bulls, Lawrence Inali from Houston, Nick Hagelin from Cincinnati, Pablo Ruiz from RSL, and Richie Larea from Toronto FC.
00:51:27
Speaker
Yeah, it's it's not like the most inspiring group of players based off of of total talent. I think Daniel very fine choice. This is the first time I've even cracked open my ballot because I just said I'll look at it after after the the season actually ends.
00:51:39
Speaker
I think I think yeah i'm a lot I think I think we can make it through decision day and go through that way. Absolutely. I completely forgot this award existed. um I think it kind of has to be between Daniel Hagland, Larea and Inali probably is is one of those guys. Yeah.
00:51:52
Speaker
I don't i mean Larray is still not not played like a ton this year. i honestly cannot remember what his injury was before. Shame on me. um But but we'll see. I think Daniel's the one who's been regularly starting out of all these guys and been playing at a fairly high level. He seems like the sensible choice.
00:52:08
Speaker
And then young player of the year, Diego Luna is who I have. It seems like Obed Vargas is nominated. There's a few other ah Jack McGlynn is nominated. There's a few other kind of notable players, but Diego Luna feels like to me, the one who fits best. And I even say that as a Obed Vargas truther.
00:52:25
Speaker
I think I had, so I had Obed as my top 2,222 player. Now Luna, I don't believe was eligible for this, this year's 2,222 list. Finn Sermon also, by the way, not eligible pull in Timbers center back. um Keith Kosigan mentioned on the, on the broadcast of the Sounders Timbers game this past week that Phil Neville had, ah had gotten in the mentions of, ah I think he said prominent MLS journalist. It's a very kind way to refer to me because Phil Neville's up in my, in my ex mentions, like whining about Phil, about Finn Sermon, not being on the list. I can't vote for Finn Sermon. It's too old, bro.
00:52:54
Speaker
It's not my fault. it's a A very good center back. I'm probably one of the five people on the planet this year outside of the city of Portland. Who's praised Finn sermon. And you're yelling at me, bro. It's not my fault. I don't make the rules anyway.
00:53:05
Speaker
I don't think David Luna is eligible for, for 2222, but I think he's a very reasonable choice for young player of the year. The other ones that would tempt me. Cause I haven't decided yet. The other ones that really tempt me, we've Argus and Alex Freeman.
00:53:16
Speaker
I think unless unless I can yeah think of somebody that I'm, I'm obviously missing. Olotho Makanya has been really good at center back for the union. There's a few other of these guys that I think have, have shouts here, but, uh, Luna is a fine choice as always for like most things in life, I think.
00:53:31
Speaker
Yeah. Uh, and then goalkeeper of the year. I think we already talked about this, but I think Dane St. Clair kind of does it for me. I did think it was i like an interesting little note, uh, ah why am I blanking on the Colorado Rapids coach's name?
00:53:45
Speaker
ah Chris Armis. Chris Armis said that Stefan underlying numbers say he's the best goalkeeper in the year. i was like, oh, is that true? i know historically that's definitely not the case.
00:53:56
Speaker
And I know he started the year very well. He is nowhere near the best. under he like mid He's like like, what are you talking? This is like when, uh, you hear coaches talking about, oh, the underlying numbers say we're the best team at MLS and you go look it up and it's like, what are you talking about? Like, no what underlying numbers are you referring to? They got their own, they got their own system in Colorado. They're tracking things in that in the Rapids way.
00:54:18
Speaker
yeah exactly.
00:54:22
Speaker
Yikes. And then we will go through this whole list, but I i don't know Do you have a favorite? We were we were either we' were also talking about how defender of the year still yeah feels kind of up for the up for it.
00:54:34
Speaker
ah You said MVP is sort of your is is messy. like kind of easy. ah Any other awards that you feel like you are, or who's in, do you have a best, you who's in your best 11 right now? I guess that's what we'll go with this next.
00:54:49
Speaker
Yeah. Let me, let me rattle off some names because I haven't constructed this full thing, but I think St. Clair would be in goal. At center back, and i'm I'm sort of thinking through a lot of these guys across the back line as potential Defender of the Year candidates, I think you're looking at at some combination of Tristan Blackman, Jakob Gleznes, and Jackson Reagan, potentially, and unless there's like an outside contender there that I haven't thought about quite enough. But ah I'm guessing I'm going to pick between those three guys for two spots because I'm a best 11 should be sort of reasonable soccer lineups Yeah. Kind of guy. So I'm not just tossing three center backs and yeah, I'm not, I'm not doing that. That's that ain't going to happen. um
00:55:23
Speaker
So I am, I'm open to two of those guys being in the middle of my back four. Kai Wagner is the obvious left back pick and he's a guy who I'm still tempted by for a defender of the year, by the way, I know that that he wouldn't win it based off of his defensive chops.
00:55:36
Speaker
ah don't I don't know how we're supposed to vote about that. no nobody Nobody ever votes for fullbacks for those things. so I feel like I shouldn't either. But is that just, is that herd mentality? Should I should be different, Jeremiah? i don't I don't know what to do with that. For Defender of the Year, you're saying? Yeah, for Defender of the Year. Because Kai Wagner has been amazing this year.
00:55:51
Speaker
Well, I know a couple years ago, he was, that was sort of when they, when Philadelphia was destroying team six, zero every game, I feel like that year, Kai Wagner was getting a lot of discussion at least. And I think glassness ended up winning that year. So it was sort of, maybe it was a, ended up being kind of a moot point, but I, I feel like for defender of the year, they should be a defender first, even though fullbacks get kind of screwed kind of in the same way that, that defensive midfielders get like, I feel like a defensive midfielder,
00:56:22
Speaker
deserves to be considered for defender of the year although they're not even don't even think they're eligible no they're not over the year so you're you're saying it's like a fact of life sort of like that it's effective that's just how it is like you know yeah all right right like it's same thing you know it back in in the baseball when I was really into baseball there was always this debate where their pitchers should even be eligible for MVP because they have they have the Cy Young should they why should they be eligible for ah mvp They only play every four days or whatever it was.
00:56:48
Speaker
ah But yeah, I just kind of feel like there's some things that are facts of life. Pitchers should be considered for MVP and center backs are your defender of the year. That's just unfortunately the way it is.
00:57:00
Speaker
But i where I think it really gets where fullbacks get really screwed is in best 11 because the temptation is always to just... list a bunch of center backs as your best 11. And then oftentimes we won't have any fullbacks or sometimes even any defensive midfielders in the best 11, which to me is silly. Like, what are we like?
00:57:19
Speaker
What's, and I guess that gets to the, what is the point of a best 11? But I do feel like there should be at least one fullback and at least one defensive midfielder in anyone's best 11. I completely agree. I mean, I think frankly that you should always have two fullbacks and two center backs until until teams just stop using back four setups because you don't get the fullbacks to get love any other way. I think that's pretty much the only way, as you said, that that actually can happen.
00:57:42
Speaker
I'm very satisfied by that defensive player of the year explanation. I think I think you've just fully swayed me away from Kai Wagner. You just shouldn't play fullback. You know, that's you, you, you did this to yourself when you decided to play that position and didn't work it when your coach continued to put you there. I think that's just how it is.
00:57:56
Speaker
um This is the cost. Right back. Wagner's the left back in my best 11 and it right back. It's either Alex Freeman or Andy Nahar. Haven't decided yet. Yep. It's for Scott. ist Is it the base my midfield? but Christian Roldan is almost certainly in my midfield, although I reserve the right to change that.
00:58:09
Speaker
Evander is probably my attacking midfielder. And then in my front three, I've got messy dryer, Maybe Buonga, maybe Surridge. ah Probably Surridge and Buonga ends up missing out just by virtue of Messi and Dreyer existing.
00:58:24
Speaker
But I haven't decided fully. So part of what got me thinking about this was ah your colleague, Ben Wright, actually tweeted out a image of what he thought would be his best 11, like without going through the actual ballot.
00:58:38
Speaker
And he he noted that a is perfectly what he called is perfectly reasonable. Best 11 was not even ah possibility. And I haven't. This is what got me. I haven't gotten far enough to figure out why it's not possible, but it assume it's because of the way that they assign positions to players that you couldn't have this mix. But he had like a perfectly reasonable 4-2-3-1 sort of formation that I guess is not really ah allowed and the and in the way that MLS sort of assigns positions to various players.
00:59:08
Speaker
Yeah, you only get three forwards. And I think Ben wanted to sneak, ah which which seemed fair. I think he wanted to sneak Dreyer and Buonga on the wings, Surge up top and Messi underneath. And all those guys are listed as forwards in in the roster. And so I think he's a bit perturbed by that, which which is fair enough, actually. Like I was kind of razzing him a little bit because i I'd seen this and he he and I were chatting about a little bit.
00:59:29
Speaker
I was razzing him before I saw what the lineup was. And he was whining about not being able to put four forwards in the team. And I was thinking, well, dude, you my my whole thing is that it's got to be a reasonable lineup. And then they send it to me and I apologize. it's very it's I think it's reasonable.
00:59:40
Speaker
It's probably still a little little light defensively to get away with and in some respects. But that team would be would be reasonable, perfectly reasonable for a best 11. Give us more freedom, MLS. Please?
00:59:51
Speaker
Please? Yeah, I think the the the real trick there is that they have Dreyer and Messi both listed as forwards, who I think you could argue our o in the modern way that we use midfielders sort of like could be, you know, it's like on paper, you can see messy being, I mean, messy feels like a 10.
01:00:13
Speaker
Uh, anyway, we don't need to get too deep into that. Well, thank you so much for doing this, Joe. Uh, I, I think that this is going to be a fascinating
Conference Depth Comparison
01:00:22
Speaker
season. It feels, I know that the conversation out there is that the East is this powerhouse and the West is sort of just like this scrappy bunch of underdogs. But I don't, I don't know that that's really how this is going to play out. I feel like agree the top four or five teams in the West can hang with the top, whoever comes out. I mean, the reality is that it's not, i that's not what, like it's going to end up being,
01:00:46
Speaker
one of the top teams from the West and one of the top teams from the East, and they're probably going to match up pretty well. you know like it's like I completely agree. like I think the framing is is wrong, and the nuance is the East is is crazy deep, like probably historically deep this year. like One through nine are are all teams that...
01:01:04
Speaker
Frankly, I mean, even Chicago, like they're at their best. They're scary. So the East is deep and talented at the top. The West is not deep. No depth in the West after the first five teams. But the first five teams are every bit good enough to win MLS Cup.
01:01:17
Speaker
So, yeah, there is once we get past round one of the playoffs, it's going to be exclusively like very good teams remaining. I mean, barring barring some upset at West. Yeah, I would agree with that. ah The East is it is, I would be actually curious.
01:01:31
Speaker
I would imagine that the the team that misses the playoff, like the 10th place team in the East, will almost certainly have the most points of any 10th place team in MLS history.
01:01:43
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I haven't looked at it, but it has to be right. That has to be right. Like I, I haven't looked at it either, but I just feel like that that's almost a, a given, uh, you know, right now the 10th place team in the wet in the East is the Red Bulls at, well, 43 points. Maybe doesn't sound that and maybe nine low, but maybe it's ninth. and then the ninth But the crew the crew are ninth with points.
01:02:03
Speaker
That's crazy. Yeah. ands the creamy The crew have not been at their best. I know you were trying decrescendo this thing. The crew could win MLS cup. Like I'm not, I'm not backing that they got Rossi and Zawadzki back of the weekend defensively. They've not been as good, but Zawadzki gives them a little bit more there.
01:02:16
Speaker
I mean, even even in their still semi banged up form, I'm not ready to count the crew out of of winning this thing. So it is, yeah, the East is insane in how it is structured, but the top of the West is, is every bit toe to toe with the top of the East. I agree.
01:02:29
Speaker
I agree. ah But that's that's probably a good place to to call this. ah But that said, backheeled.com, I want to just put this pitch out again. it it Obviously, subscribe to backheeled.com, but if you want to do a double dip thing, you can become a an advocate or above on Sounder Heart, and that includes a membership at Backheeled. Just to give you a heads up, we have to manually do this, go give us a little bit of time but uh it's it's worked out so far i think we have we have a few dozen people that have picked this up uh and it it seems like it's ah it's been a nice little partnership it's been great
Partnership Promotions and Podcast Sign-off
01:03:08
Speaker
uh sharing with you we we are gonna do hopefully more stuff as we get into the playoffs we tried something a couple weeks ago you guys had this really great uh christian ruled on was christian rolled on or obed vargas
01:03:20
Speaker
Christian Roldan story, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think the one I'm thinking of that we sort of did a little content share was ah look at the best defenses in MLS. At least that's the one I'm thinking at the moment. Yes, yes, that's what it was. That's what it was.
01:03:32
Speaker
ah Yeah, but I really like being able to do this kind of stuff where we give sort of like a teaser and say, go finish reading this on Backfield and become a subscriber. I think you guys do great work there. ah you You've got in some some really talented people to help right there.
01:03:46
Speaker
ah It's, I think... The world of in what I love right now about the state of soccer media is that there's always really interesting independent voices and you are right there at the top. So I just want to give another plug to backheel.com and of course your podcast, ah which, you know, doesn't take a lot of your time.
01:04:04
Speaker
ah what I mean, that's pretty much the whole pitch, man. What you said earlier was just like so nice and like so much more generous than the podcast. I think you said gives you really helpful insights for your daily life. And that's just not true. um But but, you know, if if you want to listen to a podcast about soccer for 10 minutes on Tuesdays and Thursdays, you absolutely can. Darn it.
01:04:21
Speaker
I mean, there's worse ways. There's a lot oh it's a lot of worse ways to spend 10 minutes on. That's a great point. That's the new. I'm going to update that subscription, that description right now. Nailed it.
01:04:32
Speaker
Perfect. All right. Well, ah thank you so much for doing this, Joe. Obviously, you follow Joe on on Blue Sky as well. ah And i think you you probably got one of those fancy blue check marks by now.
01:04:45
Speaker
I'm guessing. I did. It turns out all you have to do is apply for it. um I don't know. I did the same thing. So it's it's there. it's It's fancy and it's blue. So all everything you said is is just 100% correct. Absolutely. Add Josie Lowry on Blue Sky.
01:04:58
Speaker
Thank you. i was I was kind filibustering there because i was like, I do not know exactly what his hand is. That's hot, man. but There's too much stuff to remember. There's too much stuff. Exactly. All right. Well, we're going to get out of here. Thank you for listening. I'm Jeremiah Shantz. I'm going for Joe Lowry of Backheel.com. This was Nos Adientes, part of the Sounder Heart Podcast Network, and we will catch you next time.
01:05:50
Speaker
Let's go at Sounders.