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Ghostbusters 2
210 Plays1 year ago
After saving New York City from a ghost attack, the Ghostbusters -- a team of spirit exterminators -- is disbanded for demolishing parts of the city during the battle. But when Ghostbuster Peter Venkman learns that spirits have taken an interest in his son, the men launch a rogue ghost-chasing mission. The quest quickly goes awry, landing them in court. But when the ghosts turn on the judge, he issues an order allowing the Ghostbusters to get back to work.
Release date: June 16, 1989 (USA)
Director: Ivan Reitman
Budget: 25 million USD
Distributed by: Columbia Pictures
Based on: Characters; by: Dan Aykroyd; Harold Ramis
Box office: $215.4 millionSHOW NOTES:
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Transcript
Introduction and Context
00:00:00
Speaker
All right, listeners, welcome back to Matt Goes to the Movies.
00:00:05
Speaker
Rob and I are here to talk about Ghostbusters 2 getting ready for the release of Ghostbusters Frozen Empire.
00:00:14
Speaker
And, you know, Rob, we mentioned on the last episode where we reviewed Ghostbusters.
00:00:22
Speaker
Well, not the last episode, but when we reviewed Ghostbusters that, you know, I remembered Ghostbusters 2.
Production Challenges
00:00:31
Speaker
probably seen it more than the original Ghostbusters.
00:00:34
Speaker
But man, let me tell you, 1984 is when the original came out.
00:00:40
Speaker
Huge hit, highly successful.
00:00:43
Speaker
I was not aware.
00:00:44
Speaker
Five years later, 1989, Ghostbusters 2 comes out.
00:00:49
Speaker
But rewatching it and doing research, I was not aware of the absolute just chaos that
00:01:01
Speaker
That it was to get this movie done.
00:01:05
Speaker
And I don't know if you know about all of that.
00:01:09
Speaker
But man, this thing, what should have seemed like a slam dunk, which it kind of was that they wanted to get a sequel.
00:01:17
Speaker
But the amount of things that happened in between that time for this to come out.
00:01:23
Speaker
is absolutely fascinating to me.
00:01:26
Speaker
This faced such a struggle to get made that I was, I couldn't stop reading about some of the issues.
00:01:35
Speaker
Um,
00:01:37
Speaker
Does that make it, you know, does it still hold up as well as I remember?
00:01:42
Speaker
That's what we're here to talk about.
00:01:44
Speaker
And really, you and I have never talked about this movie.
00:01:47
Speaker
So I'm really curious to get your thoughts on it.
00:01:50
Speaker
But there's a lot of fascinating stuff here.
00:01:54
Speaker
Yeah, there's some reshoots that had to happen for some poor screening tests or test screening results, I guess.
00:02:03
Speaker
What's interesting is that, you know, we kind of feel like these first two movies are just iconic.
00:02:10
Speaker
We kind of almost look at them as unimpeachable if you just sort of casually bring them up to somebody.
00:02:15
Speaker
because people like the goofiness, the fun, they like the song, they like the proton packs and the jumpsuits and Ecto-1 and all that and Slimer and the toys.
00:02:29
Speaker
And we remember all of that fondly.
00:02:32
Speaker
It was interesting to realize that the studio didn't really see this as a success and completely submarined any chances of a third one.
00:02:43
Speaker
And it took
00:02:44
Speaker
You know, it basically took until they made a video game out of it before the ideas that they had for the third film were able to be acted on.
00:02:52
Speaker
Called it a franchise killer.
Does Ghostbusters 2 Hold Up?
00:02:55
Speaker
This one.
00:02:56
Speaker
Which it's not like it's not bad.
00:02:59
Speaker
No, called it a franchise killer with this movie.
00:03:06
Speaker
Now, again.
00:03:08
Speaker
is it as good as the first one?
00:03:12
Speaker
I, I think that's up for debate.
00:03:13
Speaker
I think there's some things that work, work really well in this movie.
00:03:18
Speaker
I do think knowing what I know now today, there's certainly some spots where you can see like,
00:03:26
Speaker
I can kind of see where the movie falls apart a little bit.
00:03:30
Speaker
And it loses some of its, it loses some of its footing reading the behind the scenes stuff.
00:03:35
Speaker
And what audiences said to test screenings.
00:03:40
Speaker
I can see some of that, but to, to call this.
00:03:44
Speaker
And it certainly, if you go and look it does have some very poor reviews for this movie, but yeah,
00:03:53
Speaker
A franchise killer.
00:03:55
Speaker
I mean, you can't argue with the fact that another one didn't come out until 2016.
00:04:00
Speaker
So you can't argue with that.
00:04:01
Speaker
Um, but in my eyes, this in no way is a franchise killer.
00:04:07
Speaker
In fact, I had very strong feelings when this movie first started.
00:04:12
Speaker
It was like, this is funny.
00:04:13
Speaker
This has everything that I wanted.
00:04:16
Speaker
This has everything that I remember.
00:04:18
Speaker
Um, yeah.
00:04:21
Speaker
In a Ghostbusters movie.
00:04:23
Speaker
And again, I was just really, really surprised to read some of the stuff that I did.
00:04:29
Speaker
Now, there's some faults.
00:04:32
Speaker
But to call this a franchise killer, I am.
00:04:35
Speaker
I'm really shocked by that because I do feel this is a very, very strong.
00:04:41
Speaker
Entry for Ghostbusters.
00:04:42
Speaker
I feel this is a good movie.
00:04:44
Speaker
I did get enjoyment out of this.
00:04:46
Speaker
I had a great time watching this movie.
00:04:48
Speaker
I think that.
00:04:51
Speaker
There is one aspect of this film that it's kind of a big ask to get an audience member to just get over the idea.
Plot Issues and Audience Challenges
00:05:01
Speaker
It is the elephant in the room, I believe, when it comes to this movie.
00:05:06
Speaker
And really, so many things that happen, so many scenes rely on this idea that it's...
00:05:15
Speaker
you really have to just be having fun with it and, and forgive it because the movie wants you to believe that everything that happened in the last five years, since the first film, people have forgotten about like people like didn't believe, or don't think the stay puff marshmallow man that just walked around and drip marshmallow everywhere.
00:05:36
Speaker
Like that didn't happen.
00:05:39
Speaker
Like there's the scene with the judge where he doesn't believe in ghosts.
00:05:44
Speaker
What the hell do they think happened when these guys were so active?
00:05:48
Speaker
They were on TV all the time with their ads.
00:05:50
Speaker
They were on the cover of Time magazine.
00:05:52
Speaker
They were on the cover of all of these magazines.
00:05:54
Speaker
There was one point they had so much work coming in that they were on the clock 24 hours a day, and they hired Winston on the spot in the last movie.
00:06:01
Speaker
They had so much work coming in.
00:06:06
Speaker
And so much of this movie is based on the fact that people don't believe that this stuff actually happened.
00:06:13
Speaker
And that is the single biggest obvious glaring problem that happens with this movie that it makes you just ask the question, how did they think they were going to slip this past an audience?
00:06:25
Speaker
It is such a miss.
00:06:27
Speaker
I enjoy this movie so much.
00:06:28
Speaker
I had fun with this, but to ask an audience to just forgive this piece of it and just go with it and believe that that's
00:06:36
Speaker
that could happen is, is a major, major issue with this film.
00:06:43
Speaker
Yeah.
00:06:43
Speaker
You know, and that's the thing is I think they do a really, well, I don't think they do a really terrible job of explaining.
00:06:52
Speaker
And I think that's part of maybe the reshoots or just some of the script changes because of the fact that like, when you look up this movie, the,
00:07:05
Speaker
you know, it's not only the fact that it's like, okay, they, you know, yes, there's some people that don't believe them.
00:07:14
Speaker
There's some people that, you know, they're called a fraud and things like that.
00:07:17
Speaker
And it's like, well, wait a minute.
00:07:19
Speaker
Like, how are you called a fraud?
00:07:21
Speaker
But then there's other people who are like, well, yeah, you're the Ghostbusters, but whatever.
00:07:27
Speaker
And the way that the description of this movie is, is, you know, and this could have been something to really like explore.
00:07:36
Speaker
And that would have been cool.
00:07:37
Speaker
Yeah.
00:07:39
Speaker
But it doesn't do a good time frame of really saying how long it's been since the Ghostbusters, you know, from Ghostbusters one to two, because it was five years for the movies to release.
00:07:53
Speaker
But Rob, correct me if I'm wrong.
00:07:55
Speaker
The movie never specifies that they actually treat the time frame between one and two as the actual timeline for the movie.
00:08:04
Speaker
It's been five years in New York city since the ghostbusters actually saved it.
00:08:09
Speaker
I thought I saw a title card at the beginning that said five years later, I thought they had something.
00:08:15
Speaker
Okay.
00:08:15
Speaker
Maybe I, maybe I missed that.
00:08:17
Speaker
I feel like, and maybe that's a, you, you, you blink and you miss it moment.
00:08:21
Speaker
And people didn't pick up on that.
00:08:23
Speaker
You were refilling your ecto cooler.
00:08:25
Speaker
Hi C. Right.
00:08:26
Speaker
There you go.
00:08:27
Speaker
But also too, they don't really point out the fact, unless I miss this as well, which I don't think I did.
00:08:34
Speaker
The city like sued the Ghostbusters like people sued the Ghostbusters for property damage and things like that.
00:08:41
Speaker
And they were actually like they were barred from doing any investigating.
00:08:47
Speaker
Like that's not made a point in the movie at all, which could have been a great addition.
00:08:55
Speaker
It really isn't.
00:08:56
Speaker
I think it's maybe slightly alluded to.
00:08:59
Speaker
Like if you read between the lines, you really only get that if you start doing reading about this movie or looking at synopsis and things like that.
00:09:07
Speaker
It's not expressly stated.
00:09:10
Speaker
in the movie you have to look elsewhere to really get that and honestly it doesn't really make sense because um would they would the city just have rather them do nothing and just let the stay puff marshmallow man and you know just take over like that was better like all of the places were being haunted and things like that that was better for them like what you know what rob
00:09:32
Speaker
we laugh, but look at the way New York city is run.
00:09:37
Speaker
And probably the answer is yes.
00:09:39
Speaker
Like, yeah, it would be an improvement at this point.
00:09:43
Speaker
Like, you know, um, but you know, starting off again, because maybe the timeframe is weird.
00:09:50
Speaker
Again, there's that question of like,
00:09:53
Speaker
okay, they're doing birthday parties for the kids, but the kids don't really like the Ghostbusters.
Humor and Character Interactions
00:10:00
Speaker
Like, wait a minute.
00:10:01
Speaker
What, how are these kids not just going crazy over the Ghostbusters?
00:10:05
Speaker
But because it's so, you know, it's so vague as to the timeframe and what has actually happened to the Ghostbusters.
00:10:16
Speaker
There is some, there is some questions, but yeah,
00:10:20
Speaker
you know, then you get in and again, even when this movie started and we get introduced back to Dana and things like that, there's some really funny moments.
00:10:30
Speaker
And, you know, the stuff with her and Peter Venkman, when they first go to the apartment, it's funny.
00:10:39
Speaker
Like it's very casual and very subtle, but like,
00:10:44
Speaker
I'm like, yeah, there's there's humor here.
00:10:46
Speaker
There's there.
00:10:46
Speaker
There's good humor.
00:10:47
Speaker
He's not a frickin pervert and a creep right now.
00:10:51
Speaker
Like they have like it seems like they have a general like a genuine connection.
00:10:57
Speaker
And when he's like, I'll tell you what, when they're looking at the baby because they're going to investigate because there was the paranormal activity.
00:11:04
Speaker
And Peter's like, he's ugly.
00:11:07
Speaker
Was his father ugly?
00:11:09
Speaker
Did his father, did his father stink too?
00:11:11
Speaker
Like, it's funny because they don't overdo it.
00:11:14
Speaker
It's just, it's one line.
00:11:16
Speaker
They move on.
00:11:17
Speaker
She doesn't like acknowledge them.
00:11:19
Speaker
And like, she just kind of ignores it.
00:11:21
Speaker
It's like, no, that that's actually funny.
00:11:23
Speaker
Like this movie to me, this movie actually starts off pretty strong and it doesn't taper off until a little bit later.
00:11:34
Speaker
But this movie has a very strong start, I thought.
00:11:38
Speaker
I agree.
00:11:39
Speaker
And I think that when Venkman and Dana are kind of having that little exchange back and forth, you get the feeling that there are unresolved feelings that they both have for one another.
00:11:53
Speaker
And that sense of what could have been.
00:11:57
Speaker
They both wish that it would have ended differently or that maybe they themselves would have done something differently.
00:12:03
Speaker
you definitely get that feeling that is present in that scene and it's really effective.
00:12:08
Speaker
And,
00:12:09
Speaker
you know, again, watching these guys, you know, having to do birthday parties and the kids calling them frauds.
00:12:14
Speaker
It's just like, okay, kid, you were definitely old enough to remember when they were like working around the clock, exterminating ghosts, the way that, you know, current like exterminators in New York city do with rats.
00:12:26
Speaker
Like nobody would doubt that, that, that the rat exterminator exists.
00:12:29
Speaker
Like these guys were doing that.
00:12:31
Speaker
And there was, there was a stay puff marshmallow man, like walking down the center of town that exploded.
00:12:38
Speaker
Right.
00:12:38
Speaker
Well, you know what?
00:12:39
Speaker
And to try to pretend that that didn't exist.
00:12:42
Speaker
Cell phones.
00:12:43
Speaker
Nobody could record it, really.
00:12:45
Speaker
I know this was before YouTube, but seriously, like, you know, like, again, I just keep coming back to that.
00:12:51
Speaker
There's multiple scenes that rely on people doubting that these guys are actually experts in their field and have saved the city and possibly all of humanity for all we know.
00:13:07
Speaker
It just...
00:13:09
Speaker
It's really a major, major problem.
00:13:12
Speaker
And it's hard to get over, except that you're kind of just having fun with this, these characters and these guys.
00:13:19
Speaker
Do you know where they missed a major crossover here?
00:13:21
Speaker
I just thought about this.
00:13:22
Speaker
Ooh, what?
00:13:25
Speaker
Men in black.
00:13:28
Speaker
They, they, they, they wipe the city, man.
00:13:33
Speaker
They like the ghostbusters and men in black exist in the same universe.
00:13:39
Speaker
It's headcanon now.
00:13:40
Speaker
Yep.
00:13:41
Speaker
Headcanon.
00:13:42
Speaker
Um, but you know, one of the things too, that was a big
Vigo and the Climax
00:13:49
Speaker
criticism of this movie and still is, is the main villain Vigo.
00:13:55
Speaker
Um, not really intimidating, not a challenge.
00:13:59
Speaker
Um, I did find it funny that doing research that the person who originally, um, um,
00:14:07
Speaker
voice Vigo found out when he went to the release that his voice was dubbed over by another actor.
00:14:15
Speaker
And he didn't know that.
00:14:16
Speaker
And he stormed the frig out of the premiere.
00:14:18
Speaker
Wow.
00:14:20
Speaker
Um, but I guess it was so hard.
00:14:23
Speaker
He, he said he made comments of this, that he had some sort of a busted lip that caused his speech to be very, very hard to hear.
00:14:33
Speaker
And they had they almost had the same exact name.
00:14:37
Speaker
It's very funny if you go research it, but never told them they still paid them, but never told them that he got voiced over and found out in the premiere.
00:14:48
Speaker
when he was watching the movie that he got fricking that he got cut.
00:14:53
Speaker
Um, that's like finding out you got traded on Twitter, you know, if you're a professional athlete and having to find out like that.
00:15:00
Speaker
So, um, I found that kind of funny, but you know, yeah, let's face it.
00:15:07
Speaker
Not, you know, not the strongest villain.
00:15:10
Speaker
Um,
00:15:11
Speaker
I don't think really when you go back and you watch Ghostbusters one, they're like, oh, he wasn't really that difficult for the Ghostbusters to defeat.
00:15:21
Speaker
It really kind of follows the same pattern as Ghostbusters one.
00:15:25
Speaker
It's not like they had to put up much more of a fight against Stay Puft Marshmallow Man.
00:15:32
Speaker
And, you know, what's it called?
00:15:35
Speaker
Dozer.
00:15:36
Speaker
Zool.
00:15:36
Speaker
Sorry.
00:15:37
Speaker
Well, yeah.
00:15:37
Speaker
Zool.
00:15:37
Speaker
Right.
00:15:38
Speaker
Yeah.
00:15:41
Speaker
But I just that part, I'm like, OK, like maybe he wasn't as interesting, but I certainly don't feel like they put up any more of a fight, especially watching these movies so close together.
00:15:56
Speaker
I don't know.
00:15:57
Speaker
Did you feel that?
00:15:57
Speaker
Like it felt like it was 100 percent had the same takeaway.
00:16:01
Speaker
We didn't really get into it with the first review, but I really did feel like the main boss fight was somewhat anticlimactic in the fact that like
00:16:10
Speaker
oh, we just crossed the streams and now that's going to fix all our problems.
00:16:15
Speaker
That sort of was a weak point.
00:16:18
Speaker
And to a large extent, I felt like the final battle here also was a bit anticlimactic.
00:16:24
Speaker
Our heroes weren't overly tested.
00:16:26
Speaker
There was no...
00:16:31
Speaker
you know, real threat, I guess.
00:16:35
Speaker
Perhaps it was a function of the limitations of visual effects that they couldn't do an all-out brawl the way you would probably expect to happen in a film today.
00:16:47
Speaker
They were kind of limited with what they had to work with for a supernatural character before it really stretched credulity.
00:16:55
Speaker
But it did still feel anticlimactic in both cases.
00:16:59
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely.
00:17:01
Speaker
It really did.
00:17:01
Speaker
And like you said, I mean, what could you do to make that, you know, more interesting?
00:17:07
Speaker
But I did really like...
00:17:13
Speaker
you know, Janos.
00:17:14
Speaker
Um, I did like Vigo's sort of what's the handler.
00:17:20
Speaker
If you want to call him that, um, I did find it really funny.
00:17:25
Speaker
It's towards the end of the movie.
00:17:27
Speaker
I actually really laughed at this.
00:17:30
Speaker
Because I was like, yeah, you'd kind of feel you feel like characters would feel the same way.
00:17:36
Speaker
He's sitting there and like the pentagram circle and Vigo's talking to him.
00:17:42
Speaker
And he's like, I Vigo is like, yes, I like and it's he says it very low.
00:17:47
Speaker
So it's like you could kind of miss it if you're not paying attention to the movie for a second.
00:17:51
Speaker
Yeah.
00:17:53
Speaker
But I love how he's like, yes, I know.
00:17:55
Speaker
I've heard it.
00:17:56
Speaker
You like, cause he repeats the same thing every time he talks to him and he's just kind of over it.
00:18:02
Speaker
He's like, just, all right, tell me what you want me to do.
00:18:05
Speaker
You don't have to tell me that you ruled the world in 1800 or like all this other stuff.
00:18:10
Speaker
Like I found that really funny, actually.
00:18:12
Speaker
It is a, it is a funny moment.
00:18:14
Speaker
And it also occurs to me that, um,
00:18:16
Speaker
In this universe, Sigourney Weaver only seems to have men populate around her that are creepy.
00:18:23
Speaker
Right.
00:18:24
Speaker
It just seems like every man she comes into contact with all of a sudden just is a creeper.
00:18:29
Speaker
And it's just I feel bad for her character.
00:18:32
Speaker
Right.
00:18:33
Speaker
Yeah.
00:18:33
Speaker
No, it's like, geez almighty.
00:18:35
Speaker
Yeah.
00:18:37
Speaker
But I did find his character, like I found his character kind of funny because again, I found that that was very realistic that, you know, you've had that and you probably know people like that where you're like, yeah, I know.
00:18:49
Speaker
Like you, you've told me this, like get to the point.
00:18:54
Speaker
Yeah.
00:18:54
Speaker
Like, oh, geez.
00:18:55
Speaker
Like, I don't mean to be rude, but oh my God.
00:18:57
Speaker
Like, did you actually forget that you told me or like what?
00:19:00
Speaker
Like, but so I found that funny.
00:19:04
Speaker
And again, there's little, you know,
00:19:07
Speaker
There's other lines, too, where I'm like, yeah, this movie still retains very good humor.
00:19:12
Speaker
You know, the court scene where, you know, the ghost pop out and it's like one, though, I'm sorry.
00:19:18
Speaker
The judge doesn't see that frickin ectoplasm start frickin bubbling like it's on a stove.
00:19:25
Speaker
Like, give me a break.
00:19:26
Speaker
Like you're looking in the direction of the Ghostbusters where the frickin slime is.
00:19:32
Speaker
There's no way so much wind blowing through there.
00:19:34
Speaker
You could almost start a tornado.
00:19:37
Speaker
Like there's no way you're not seeing that.
00:19:38
Speaker
But he's like, just do something.
00:19:40
Speaker
And then he's like, no, he's like my clients like that would be exposing themselves.
00:19:44
Speaker
And then there's Peter.
00:19:45
Speaker
It's like the line.
00:19:46
Speaker
Yes, it's true.
00:19:47
Speaker
this man has no dick.
00:19:49
Speaker
Like he's like, and you don't want us exposing ourselves.
00:19:53
Speaker
I'm like, no, this, this retains.
00:19:56
Speaker
It was funny.
00:19:57
Speaker
The humor.
00:19:58
Speaker
And again, I feel like it does sort of, you know, it, it falls up not it.
00:20:06
Speaker
No, that's, that's way too strong.
00:20:09
Speaker
It does lose some momentum getting towards the third act.
Missed Opportunities
00:20:14
Speaker
Especially because it becomes even,
00:20:18
Speaker
it becomes even more of a question of like when they first go to see the mayor and he's like, you buddy of all people should be like, shit, if these guys have a hunch, I should probably listen to it.
00:20:31
Speaker
And I feel like it kind of, you know, starts to lose some steam, especially right there in that, in that moment, because you're right.
00:20:41
Speaker
It's like, I could see a couple of people, um,
00:20:45
Speaker
But because you're always going to have those, you're always going to have people like that.
00:20:50
Speaker
No matter what, if this life has taught us anything, there are people that you could walk up, slap them in the face, and they will deny it till the day they die.
00:21:00
Speaker
No, that never happened.
00:21:02
Speaker
What are you talking about?
00:21:03
Speaker
Like, like, there are just there are people like that.
00:21:06
Speaker
But when they came and he basically treats them like they're crazies off the street.
00:21:12
Speaker
That's where I'm like.
00:21:16
Speaker
really buddy?
00:21:17
Speaker
Like, come on.
00:21:20
Speaker
It's like they just completely forgot.
00:21:22
Speaker
And that's where, again, it's, it's hard to praise the things this movie does well because that courtroom scene, you're right.
00:21:28
Speaker
It's hysterical.
00:21:29
Speaker
How does the judge say he doesn't believe in ghosts?
00:21:32
Speaker
I do enjoy this scene in the mayor's office.
00:21:35
Speaker
It's generally pretty funny.
00:21:37
Speaker
It's followed up by the scene in the psychiatric ward that's actually really funny.
00:21:42
Speaker
And I feel like it's a great encapsulation of what's great about this movie.
00:21:46
Speaker
And yet it still represents what is worst about the movie.
00:21:49
Speaker
Why would this medical staff not believe them?
00:21:52
Speaker
And why would they not immediately know who these guys are?
00:21:55
Speaker
Right.
00:21:55
Speaker
And it doesn't hold up.
00:21:57
Speaker
No, because the thing is, too, that.
00:22:01
Speaker
That courtroom scene is before they talk to the mayor.
00:22:06
Speaker
So how the hell does he not know that they just busted fricking ghosts in the courtroom?
00:22:11
Speaker
That would be everywhere.
00:22:13
Speaker
Yeah.
00:22:14
Speaker
Yeah, even before TikTok and Instagram reels, I feel like the mayor would get a call.
00:22:21
Speaker
I feel like somebody would phone his office.
00:22:23
Speaker
Well, that courtroom is basically destroyed.
00:22:27
Speaker
And more than likely, that courtroom is probably in the same giant goddamn building that the mayor's office is in.
00:22:36
Speaker
Yeah.
00:22:38
Speaker
It's probably in the same goddamn building or it's on the same strip, at least in New York City.
00:22:43
Speaker
Those places are usually closer together.
00:22:45
Speaker
A courtroom of that size and that magnitude is usually pretty close to that.
00:22:50
Speaker
Yeah, it's hard.
00:22:53
Speaker
Again, it stretches the credulity so much that you as an audience member kind of feel like your intelligence is being insulted, that they want you to believe that these characters are doing that.
00:23:05
Speaker
As soon as you have something weird, like the first time something kind of weird goes on, why are these guys just not immediately on retainer?
00:23:14
Speaker
Right.
00:23:14
Speaker
Hey guys, we got, we got that thing again.
00:23:17
Speaker
Like, you know, why is their research not being funded?
00:23:21
Speaker
Like, yeah, exactly.
00:23:23
Speaker
Why are they doing children's parties as opposed to like building the next generation proton pack?
00:23:30
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, it's, you know, that is part of, I mentioned this when we reviewed Ghostbusters 1, but that is, and again, it's just some, it's a crazy fan theory, but it's just, it's always fun to see some of these, but that is the fan theory that the reason this movie is the way that it is, is because the Ghostbusters are actually dead.
00:23:50
Speaker
Um, and this is, this is them in their own heads.
00:23:56
Speaker
Create, like creating this.
00:23:58
Speaker
Um,
00:24:00
Speaker
But again, that's like, that is one of the fan theories that's out there is that the Ghostbusters actually died in that first movie and that battle.
00:24:09
Speaker
That's why everybody treats them like they're crazy because nobody like it's just a whole new thing.
00:24:17
Speaker
I think some fan theories can be kind of fun, but this one feels like it falls into the Jar Jar has secretly been a Sith the whole time, where you have to come up with a fan theory to explain away something that's actually pretty awful.
00:24:29
Speaker
Right.
00:24:29
Speaker
That should have been super easy.
00:24:32
Speaker
Now, one thing that I will say is I do like, and again, it's especially...
00:24:38
Speaker
And they wanted to dig more into it, and I would have really enjoyed that.
Themes of Negative Emotions
00:24:43
Speaker
But the idea, as many rewrites and things and chaos that this movie went through to get made, one of the main thoughts about this movie, and right from the beginning, was they wanted to explore the...
00:25:01
Speaker
the thought of the like negative emotions and they wanted to have it across multiple cities.
00:25:07
Speaker
They actually wanted to make this out of New York.
00:25:10
Speaker
Um, there, there were a lot of different treatments for it, but there was always the underscore of just the effect of, um,
00:25:21
Speaker
negative people being around negative people and what the consequences are of that.
00:25:28
Speaker
Um, I thought that was, I think that's a really interesting concept.
00:25:32
Speaker
It's even more relevant now in today's age.
00:25:36
Speaker
Um,
00:25:37
Speaker
But I do like that.
00:25:40
Speaker
I thought that was and I do.
00:25:43
Speaker
I think that's a good theory in the in the background here of this movie.
00:25:48
Speaker
Now, it's not as fleshed out as it probably could be.
00:25:52
Speaker
But I do like that is, you know, the undertone of the story is that's how these things are happening is because, you know, it's
00:26:01
Speaker
busy, busy, busy, go, go, go.
00:26:03
Speaker
You're a piece of crap.
00:26:04
Speaker
I'm a piece of crap.
00:26:05
Speaker
Like, oh my God, I can't believe you cut over into my lane.
00:26:08
Speaker
That's going to cause my whole day to be fricking ruined.
00:26:11
Speaker
Like, you know, all of this negative stuff that we'll sit there and go, oh my God, I can't believe it.
00:26:18
Speaker
It's like, okay, well that took 10 seconds out of your day.
00:26:21
Speaker
Is that really that big of a deal?
00:26:22
Speaker
Like everybody, you know, I'm, I'm certainly that way sometimes now, like, all right, everybody, let's just calm the hell down.
00:26:30
Speaker
Yeah, we certainly live in a world where many people are only happy if they're angry.
00:26:36
Speaker
And that's kind of sad.
00:26:39
Speaker
They live in these echo chambers where they only have their viewpoints reinforced and they only get their news from the propaganda machine that reinforces their worldview and keeps them angry.
00:26:51
Speaker
about the other worldview that exists, not understanding that there's more than two options as far as like worldviews that a person can have.
00:27:00
Speaker
But it's, it's, we, it's very easy.
00:27:03
Speaker
If, if you're the kind of person who wants to live in an us versus them kind of world, it's very easy right now to do that.
00:27:11
Speaker
If, if you want to, and there's, there's people who are only happy when they're angry and it feels like, well,
00:27:18
Speaker
I don't know that you could make this movie with this sort of setup today because it would almost feel a little too on the nose.
00:27:25
Speaker
I, I, yeah, I think, I think this would be divisive if this came out today.
00:27:29
Speaker
Yeah.
00:27:31
Speaker
Yeah.
00:27:34
Speaker
Yeah.
00:27:34
Speaker
I think you're very much right about that.
00:27:39
Speaker
But again, I'll stand by it.
00:27:41
Speaker
It's,
00:27:43
Speaker
you know, I think it's a very interesting, I think it's a very interesting concept that they did have for this.
00:27:49
Speaker
Um, now, you know, another thing too, I just, the song, Bobby Brown, take control when that's like, there is, I feel there's a lot of good in this movie.
00:28:02
Speaker
And even when that song started playing, I was like, oh man, like, okay, like I'm back into it.
00:28:08
Speaker
Like I enjoy this movie.
00:28:10
Speaker
Um,
00:28:13
Speaker
I just, I don't understand.
Franchise Evolution and Nerd Culture
00:28:17
Speaker
And again, maybe because I'm seeing it so far removed from when it first came out.
00:28:27
Speaker
I really don't understand the negativity.
00:28:30
Speaker
Yeah.
00:28:33
Speaker
Towards this movie.
00:28:34
Speaker
Because I. Again.
00:28:36
Speaker
I had a really good time with this.
00:28:37
Speaker
The Statue of Liberty.
00:28:38
Speaker
Now.
00:28:39
Speaker
I will say that.
00:28:40
Speaker
I did.
00:28:41
Speaker
Doing research.
00:28:42
Speaker
There was a scene.
00:28:42
Speaker
That was cut.
00:28:43
Speaker
That actually explains.
00:28:45
Speaker
How they learn.
00:28:46
Speaker
How to manipulate.
00:28:47
Speaker
The slime.
00:28:48
Speaker
With positive thoughts.
00:28:49
Speaker
And things like that.
00:28:51
Speaker
That really.
00:28:52
Speaker
Goes into.
00:28:53
Speaker
And how they could control.
00:28:54
Speaker
The Statue of Liberty.
00:28:56
Speaker
But I. I like that scene.
00:28:58
Speaker
I thought that scene was cool.
00:29:00
Speaker
I like.
00:29:01
Speaker
I enjoyed it.
00:29:02
Speaker
I mean, they controlled the Statue of Liberty with the NES Advantage pad.
00:29:06
Speaker
I actually had one of those.
00:29:09
Speaker
It was awesome, especially for the 1942 and 1943 aviation games.
00:29:14
Speaker
You pretty much needed that because it had the slow-mo button on it, and that was the only way to get through some of those old games.
00:29:20
Speaker
Kids these days, they don't understand how hard video games used to be, so I'm just going to go ahead and tell anybody under the age of 30 to just get off my lawn right now, just for a moment here if I could.
00:29:30
Speaker
But like,
00:29:31
Speaker
Original Nintendo games were not always intended to be able to be beaten.
00:29:38
Speaker
Like they made all the levels, but you didn't always see them.
00:29:41
Speaker
In fact, you rarely beat original Nintendo era games.
00:29:46
Speaker
And that NES Advantage pad was like the only way you could do it because of the slow-mo button on it.
00:29:50
Speaker
So that's how they control it.
00:29:52
Speaker
You just plug that in.
00:29:53
Speaker
But you're right.
00:29:54
Speaker
It's it's I did notice that.
00:29:55
Speaker
Like, how did they they have the positive gel?
00:29:57
Speaker
Where did they get that from?
00:29:58
Speaker
Like, that was never really fleshed out.
00:30:01
Speaker
And just the whole concept of bringing the Statue of Liberty to life in the hands of lesser filmmakers.
00:30:08
Speaker
This would have fallen absolutely flat.
00:30:11
Speaker
But here it's just bonkers enough to make sense and be effective because it's fun.
00:30:19
Speaker
Yeah, right.
00:30:21
Speaker
Exactly.
00:30:23
Speaker
But still, there was no... There was nothing in this movie that made me sit here and go, I would have ever said this was a franchise killer.
00:30:36
Speaker
It really is just kind of crazy to me.
00:30:39
Speaker
With everything that got sequels from then, 1989 to 2016...
00:30:50
Speaker
to me for this movie to sit there and not get anything until that, you know, remake, remake, reboot, whatever you want to call it.
00:31:03
Speaker
Um, they've made 37 fast and furious movies just in that time span alone.
00:31:07
Speaker
Spider-Man 47 times and Batman 823 times.
00:31:08
Speaker
Like, and, and yet it took this long to get ghostbusters back.
00:31:11
Speaker
Like,
00:31:20
Speaker
Yeah, it was it just it really is baffling to me that this didn't get after watching it, because, again, I remember this movie well.
00:31:30
Speaker
There's certainly some things I was like, OK, yeah, I can see that after doing research.
00:31:34
Speaker
But again, at the end of the day, I had fun with this movie.
00:31:38
Speaker
I don't know.
00:31:39
Speaker
There's nothing glaring that sits there and makes me go, oh, man, this is this is bad.
00:31:46
Speaker
Yeah, I thoroughly enjoyed my watch earlier today.
00:31:50
Speaker
I watched it with my son and I just looked over and when the credit started to roll, I said, hey, bud, you know, what did you think?
00:31:55
Speaker
He's like, oh, I really liked it.
00:31:56
Speaker
I said, well, what did you think compared to the first one?
00:31:58
Speaker
Because we had just seen it together, you know, last week.
00:32:01
Speaker
And he's like, yeah, probably wasn't as good, but I still really liked it.
00:32:05
Speaker
So I that's, you know, tipping my hand a little bit.
00:32:08
Speaker
But yeah, that's where I'm at with this one.
00:32:11
Speaker
Yeah, you know, the thing is, too, with this, it did come out, and they made mention of this.
00:32:21
Speaker
You know, Batman did come out as well, and they do make mention of the fact that people were, you know, maybe looking for something a little bit, maybe darker in tone.
00:32:34
Speaker
Yeah.
00:32:36
Speaker
But, you know, one of the things that I thought was really interesting in terms of like home video and stuff like that.
00:32:47
Speaker
When Ghostbusters came out on VHS, it was $90.
00:32:53
Speaker
Oh, my God.
00:32:56
Speaker
In today's money, that has to be at least four or five thousand.
00:32:59
Speaker
Like, like it is insane.
00:33:02
Speaker
Like, yeah.
00:33:04
Speaker
That, like, holy cow.
00:33:10
Speaker
I would like to see... I've never seen any deleted scenes from this movie or anything, and I know that they have them on, like, the 4K release of it and everything like that, but I would be interested to see some of the deleted scenes that are actually on that.
00:33:29
Speaker
Yeah.
00:33:32
Speaker
So...
00:33:34
Speaker
you know, I'm, I'm not sure, but Rob, anything else that you have about, um, this movie before we head into popcorn time?
00:33:43
Speaker
I have one final take on this movie before we rate it.
00:33:46
Speaker
And it's something that occurred to me, um,
00:33:49
Speaker
during my, my watch of this film earlier tonight.
00:33:53
Speaker
And quite simply, we really owe the Ghostbusters a lot.
00:33:58
Speaker
They were the first, as far as I can figure.
00:34:01
Speaker
And I, and I thought about this all night.
00:34:04
Speaker
They were the first nerd superheroes that I could think of.
00:34:09
Speaker
They made it cool to be a nerd long before anybody else did.
00:34:13
Speaker
I mean, we've talked about this a lot on air.
00:34:15
Speaker
What,
00:34:17
Speaker
the 2012 Avengers film meant and things like, uh, Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings trilogy and how kind of like, you know, it's actually cool to play D and D now where that, that was never always the case.
00:34:32
Speaker
Um, comic books are cool now in ways that they, they weren't always necessarily cool.
00:34:36
Speaker
Like Batman was cool.
00:34:38
Speaker
The Punisher was cool, but like,
00:34:40
Speaker
Dr. Strange wasn't cool.
00:34:42
Speaker
Like, you know, there was Spider-Man was kind of cool.
00:34:45
Speaker
Superman was kind of cool, but like obscure characters, less popular characters are never cool.
00:34:51
Speaker
And, and way before all of this stuff was mainstream, the ghostbusters were the original nerd superhero team.
00:35:02
Speaker
And I think we owe them a debt.
00:35:05
Speaker
Yeah, that's, that is a very, very good point.
00:35:08
Speaker
I like that a lot.
00:35:09
Speaker
Um,
00:35:11
Speaker
They certainly were insanely popular.
00:35:16
Speaker
There is no doubt about it.
00:35:17
Speaker
Still are, you know, getting ready to release a brand new movie.
00:35:25
Speaker
And yeah, one that I'm really looking forward to and, you know, really looking forward to.
00:35:35
Speaker
getting to review Ghostbusters afterlife and Ghostbusters answer the call, uh, to see where those movies stand.
00:35:42
Speaker
Cause I, when Ghostbusters afterlife came out, I was a huge, huge fan, had a lot of things to say about it to some friends.
00:35:52
Speaker
Um,
00:35:53
Speaker
really enjoyed it and really looking forward to getting a refresher on it and going back before, uh, the new one comes out.
00:36:00
Speaker
So let's, uh, let's go to popcorn time.
00:36:03
Speaker
Let's grab some buckets and I will just go first.
00:36:07
Speaker
Uh, I do think there are some, like I said, there are some flaws with this movie.
00:36:12
Speaker
Uh, there's some things that could have been explained a lot better that would have made this, you know, not perfect, but,
00:36:22
Speaker
But right there with the first one, I think they explain.
Final Thoughts and Ratings
00:36:26
Speaker
I think they get away from the fact that people, you know, doubt the Ghostbusters.
00:36:30
Speaker
I think you get away from that.
00:36:33
Speaker
I think maybe you still go with the plot that they were sued and they are, you know, I still think you could have gone with that.
00:36:40
Speaker
Like, you know, the the city is so.
00:36:46
Speaker
Whatever, you know, you could have gotten there was, you know, you could have done a lot of things rolled into that.
00:36:52
Speaker
There was a new mayor and the new mayor sued them because of the damage to the city.
00:36:56
Speaker
And, you know, whatever else the case may be, I still think you could have kept certain elements, but explaining it better would have put this movie and more clearly defining the amount of time that had transpired from movie one to movie two.
00:37:14
Speaker
That would have put this right with the first movie, but they don't do that.
00:37:19
Speaker
Now, I still had a great time with this movie.
00:37:23
Speaker
I still think there's a lot of good humor.
00:37:25
Speaker
I still think there's a lot of good chemistry with the cast.
00:37:28
Speaker
And I give this movie four buckets.
00:37:32
Speaker
Yeah, I'm not far off.
00:37:34
Speaker
I think it's not missing much to be equivalent to the first.
00:37:37
Speaker
It's not the first movie.
00:37:39
Speaker
It's not that far off either.
00:37:42
Speaker
And I think there are some people that definitely can't ignore some of the issues like, you know, again, trying to pretend like these major events didn't happen and everyone's all of a sudden now denying that those things happened.
00:37:54
Speaker
It is it is very bizarre because it's a central.
00:38:00
Speaker
piece of multiple scenes in this movie that require you to believe that that's what's going on.
00:38:06
Speaker
So I think I went four and three quarters for the first one.
00:38:10
Speaker
I'm at four and a quarter for this.
00:38:13
Speaker
I enjoyed it.
00:38:14
Speaker
I would watch it again in the future.
00:38:15
Speaker
I will watch this again in the future.
00:38:18
Speaker
I had a good time watching it tonight.
00:38:20
Speaker
I anticipate each time I rewatch it, I will also have a good time.
00:38:24
Speaker
Yeah, no, absolutely.
00:38:25
Speaker
This is the, this is one that I would watch.
00:38:28
Speaker
So really glad.
00:38:30
Speaker
And coming up next will be Ghostbusters answer the call one that Rob, it'll be the first time that you have seen this.
00:38:38
Speaker
It'll be the second time that I have seen this movie and we will see what our thoughts are.
00:38:45
Speaker
And maybe my thoughts have changed on this.
00:38:49
Speaker
So listeners, I,
00:38:51
Speaker
Thank you for joining us for this episode.
Listener Engagement
00:38:54
Speaker
Make sure to click the show notes and figure out exactly how you can interact.
00:39:00
Speaker
But Rob, just in case, why don't you tell the listeners where they can go and interact with the show?
00:39:06
Speaker
Listeners, you can find Matt Goes to the Movies everywhere you are on the internet.
00:39:11
Speaker
That place you downloaded this episode from, you know what you can do?
00:39:14
Speaker
You can go ahead and hit like and subscribe.
00:39:18
Speaker
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00:39:21
Speaker
You can also head over to podchaser.com.
00:39:23
Speaker
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00:39:28
Speaker
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00:39:36
Speaker
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00:39:39
Speaker
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00:39:42
Speaker
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00:39:44
Speaker
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00:39:45
Speaker
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00:39:49
Speaker
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00:39:50
Speaker
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00:39:53
Speaker
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00:39:54
Speaker
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00:39:56
Speaker
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00:40:00
Speaker
Just the initials for Matt Goes to the Movies at podcast at gmail.com.
00:40:06
Speaker
Send us your thoughts.
00:40:07
Speaker
Send us your power rankings.
00:40:08
Speaker
Which Ghostbusters film?
00:40:10
Speaker
Rank them all.
00:40:11
Speaker
Tell us what you like.
00:40:11
Speaker
Tell us which ones were the bottom.
00:40:13
Speaker
We're happy to hear from you.
00:40:16
Speaker
And yeah, we love hearing from the listeners your thoughts on individual films or episodes as a whole.
00:40:23
Speaker
Perfect.
00:40:24
Speaker
Absolutely.
00:40:25
Speaker
Listeners, thank you so much for joining us.
00:40:28
Speaker
And we are going to be back very soon with more reviews.