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Ep 9. Disobedient Fabrics: A Journey in Smart Textiles with Linda Worbin (Part 1)
209 Plays6 months ago
Welcome to the No Ordinary Cloth podcast, where we stitch together a tapestry of textile innovations one episode at a time. Today, we're joined by Linda Worbin, a pioneer in Smart Textiles. Join us as we explore the past, present, and future of this dynamic industry.
Linda Worbin, a Material and Innovation Developer based in Sweden, brings a wealth of experience to our conversation. With her background as a former professor at the Swedish School of Textiles and a visionary in the industry, Linda's journey spans over two decades of exploration and development in Smart Textiles, and offers valuable insights into the evolution of Smart Textiles.
In this episode, Linda reflects on her journey from academia to industry, sharing insights that have shaped the field and inspired many to follow in her footsteps. From dynamic textile patterns to the importance of collaborations, Linda's perspective provides a roadmap for future advancements.
Smart textiles, or e-textiles, offer intriguing functionalities that vastly differ from conventional textiles. Imagine fabrics that respond to environmental changes, altering colour or texture in real-time, or clothing that monitors vital signs and alerts you to potential risks. These innovations not only redefine our wardrobes but also revolutionise our everyday lives.
Join us as we follow the footsteps of someone who envisions the future of fabrics.
Episode Highlights:
- Linda's journey from academia to industry
- Insights into dynamic textile patterns and the need for collaborations
- Preparing the next generation of textile makers
- The mindset of a pioneer in Smart Textiles
- Linda’s life and influences
Join us as we weave the future together—a future where innovation knows no bounds and an ordinary cloth becomes a canvas for extraordinary possibilities. This is the No Ordinary Cloth podcast.
Connect with Mili Tharakan
Insta: @noordinarycloth
Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mjtharakan/
Cover art: Photo by Siora, Photography on Unsplash
Music: Inspired Ambient, Orchestraman
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Transcript
Introduction to the Podcast and Guest
00:00:02
Speaker
Welcome, everyone. It's lovely to have you here. This is Millie Tarakin. Today, on the No Ordinary Club podcast, we're going to delve into smart textiles. And if you know anything about me, you will know that this is the world that I live and breathe in. And joining me today is one of the true luminaries in the field, Linda Warpin.
Understanding Smart Textiles
00:00:22
Speaker
If you're not familiar with smart textiles or e-textiles, maybe imagine a realm where fabrics are not just threads, but a platform where technology meets tradition to create textiles that can sense a touch or a heartbeat. It could respond to sound or movement. It can change shape or color. It can listen and speak and so much more. Now, this is the world that Linda opened up for me through her
Linda's Impact on the Smart Textiles Field
00:00:49
Speaker
work.
00:00:49
Speaker
And she has been pioneering this frontier since the 90s, challenging us to reimagine the possibilities of textiles through her groundbreaking work. But what makes this episode truly special for me is that Linda isn't just a guest. She's a dear, dear friend, a fellow traveller on the winding road of discovery in smart textiles.
00:01:10
Speaker
Together, we've witnessed the evolution of this field over the last two decades. Gosh, that makes me sound so old, but that's what it is, I guess. And today, we invite you to join us in a conversation that goes beyond technologies or new materials.
00:01:26
Speaker
Here we reflect on the landscape of an emerging field really, looking back to what has been achieved, but also looking forward to where it can go next. Linda discusses her motivations that led her to work in dynamic textile patterns, her passion for materials, her reflections on moving from academia into the industry, and also equipping the next generation of textile makers to think more collectively about the future.
Personal Stories and Inspirations
00:01:53
Speaker
But this isn't just a conversation about work. We get intimate with Linda as she shares about learning weaving from her grandma, what gives her energy when times are tough, and what made her cry when she bought her home in Buros in Sweden. From her days as a professor at the Swedish School of Textiles to her current undertakings in the industry, Linda's insights are inspiring, practical, and applicable to anyone who's stretching the boundaries of their fields.
00:02:20
Speaker
Whether you're a recent graduate or have a few years under your belt, this episode has a wealth of wisdom. Through Linda's experiences and reflections, we gain a rare glimpse into the mindset of a true pioneer, a journey marked by curiosity, passion, perseverance, and a lot of fun. So stay with us as we do a bit of time travel both into the past and the future where we unpick the seams of smart textiles and stitch it back together again for you.
00:02:49
Speaker
Hey Linda, I am just so thrilled to have you on this podcast. You have been my partner in crime in the world of smart textiles and we've been through some of the highs and lows in the industry. And so this is a conversation I've been waiting to have since I first thought about making a podcast really. So I'm thrilled that you're here.
00:03:10
Speaker
And I don't know if you remember, but we first met on a very cold and rainy evening, probably in November in Manchester in 2003. That was over 20 years ago. I can't believe we've known each other for so that long. And at that time you were just getting started with Smart Textiles. And I was a student at the Manchester Met doing my Masters in Textiles. And you came there to present at a symposium about Smart Textiles.
00:03:39
Speaker
I remember that evening so clearly because I was absolutely blown away by your work, by you, your approach to making smart textiles, how you thought about it. And you really opened up a world of possibilities for me that I didn't know existed.
00:03:57
Speaker
I knew about Smart Textiles before that, but you really gave me something so tangible and showed me what it could become. Honestly, you've been one of my greatest inspiration and journeying with you over the last 20 years has taught me so much. So I'm really excited to dive in with you and reflect on your work and the industry, and also maybe think about what the next 20 years might look like. How do you feel about that? Thank you, Mille. Yeah, it's so great to take the time to be here to reflect.
00:04:27
Speaker
together with you. And yes, I remember this evening in Manchester. It was fantastic. It was really like throwing myself out in the cold water with what we had and to be brave and share really openly. And I was so thankful that people were so curious and were
00:04:53
Speaker
so open about what we had started to explore in Sweden at that time, because it could have been received totally differently. And of course, there were a lot of things that needed to be improved and changed. But what we really were, yeah, I think we had ourselves been really full of inspiration.
00:05:18
Speaker
to be able to spark this inspiration amongst others. That's really great. So I really remember us in the discussion there and I was so happy that you were really so just as curious as I and you also saw the possibilities because I think we really were
00:05:42
Speaker
in the beginning of, yeah, visualizing a new future for textiles. So like a kind of science fiction. Yeah. Oh, I like that.
00:05:57
Speaker
Yeah. Can't believe it's like 20 years, more than 20 years ago. And that's what it is, Linda. I don't think sometimes you realize you were such a pioneer. You were really one of the early people who started in this industry. And you were also someone who was very keen on inspiring others and enabling others to come into this industry and to explore it in the way
00:06:22
Speaker
Your work made people curious, your work made people want to explore these new materials and see what was possible. And I think that really reflects your understanding or how you visualized the beauty and the aesthetics and the functions and the possibilities and your thinking. I think that's what really inspired me is how you approached these new materials and technology was what really got me on board.
00:06:46
Speaker
Do you remember what that was like or where that started, where that came from?
Innovations and Collaborations
00:06:51
Speaker
Yeah, I have a background from this, also from the textile design education, and I was trained in traditional constructing and designing more traditional textile expressions and materials. In the end of the 90s, when the last textile industry were also moved,
00:07:13
Speaker
away from Sweden. Of course, there is still some textile industry in Sweden, but not as much as it have been. So that was also quite sad to see. I was really in that shift when the last huge industries moved more east. And I started to also to question what I had learned during the years in the education when it comes to production,
00:07:40
Speaker
And maybe I were not thinking about overproduction, but I were more questioning why I should design another beautiful textile when we already had some money. Because I was like, am I really allowed to do this only because I like to do it so much? Is that enough? I don't know if that is enough, really.
00:08:05
Speaker
And at the same time, I also started to see, yeah, but textiles is actually more, yeah, a good quality textile and a good expression. That is also something that becomes more rare. So it were more about also moving forward with changing the visual expressions in a really quick speed. So it were maybe not so much about the actual textile construction and the material itself, but
00:08:33
Speaker
I were more reflecting over that it had something to do more with trance that it should
00:08:38
Speaker
carry a new color, a new visual expression. But that was like end of 90s. And I felt this is not going to last. I don't want to contribute only to that. I want something else. Could we do it in a different way? And at the same time, I got my first mobile phones. And so that was really long time ago. I feel so old. Being true, the big change is there. And at the same time, I had the mobile phone.
00:09:07
Speaker
I could only send text messages, no pictures, no colour, like nothing else. So that was like pure, pure information. And then we had the textiles where we were encouraged to feel it with a lot of visual expression, but maybe not so much a carrier of
00:09:27
Speaker
information or function and so on. So I started to play more in my mind with what could happen if we could also have a textile that could more interact with the surrounding or change instead of being replaced. So could the textile itself maybe hold different expressions? Because it were actually not like an
00:09:55
Speaker
a new textile that were needed because it were torn out or so. It was more to please something else.
00:10:04
Speaker
So how could we then bring in change and could then the visual also be a carrier for something else? But this was very unshaped questions really. But I remember I started to do then a project with textiles that could interact with the light conditions in the surrounding. They changed color.
00:10:30
Speaker
during the day. Of course, most textiles change due to shadows and sunlight or interior, but we are very much in this static inside, more or less more static than outside. But I started to explore the interaction with the surrounding, first around the textile with light and temperature and movements, from the wind to enhance the feeling of the wind even more, or how we could
00:11:00
Speaker
could bring in more values in the textiles. But a big motivation were really to see if we could find ways of using less material but have more change, more visually change. And then I had a chance to meet with a group of people at the Interactive Institute in Gothenburg, really
00:11:24
Speaker
crazy people that changed my world and fantastic, amazing people that I'm really thankful for that period in my life when I were working together with them. And we did a lot of basic research experiments with starting to connect interactive textiles where the idea of interactive textiles was together with IT at that time. So that was something
00:11:53
Speaker
basic research projects to open up the field of textiles and the information technology. Can you just for the listeners explain a project, just what the research project might have looked like or what you mean by IT and textiles or what materials used? One of the first examples we did together there were a pair of interactive pillows. So I had a pillow
00:12:22
Speaker
in my house and then my mum had the other pillow in her home. And when I was leaning against my pillow or hugging my pillow, the visual expression changed in my mother's location. So I came to Interactive Institute with a lot of different textiles that could light up
00:12:47
Speaker
change color due to temperature or a different light. And then when I met all those fantastic people there, we started to explore how, how IT could be like merged with those textiles to see what happened. And the interactive pillows were then one of the examples. So there we worked together with a group building
00:13:11
Speaker
the first smart apps for controlling the home environment, like controlling your electronic equipment in the house. And then we started to open up and see how could add on textiles. So we had the more soft
00:13:26
Speaker
both a more soft interface and we also came more closer to to the human because we text us is also so connected to be close to us and to touch and feel and it's more emotional than like a refrigerator for example of course it's also
00:13:45
Speaker
Very good, good innovation and it's really, I really love my refrigerator. But in a very different way compared to other objects and materials. So I think that was a very interesting time for me when I saw that the textile could be filled with
00:14:10
Speaker
information in a new way. It could be filled with information about what my mother did, for example, if I placed the pillow in her home, because these interactive pillows came in, we did them in pairs, so I could hold one and my mother won and living on distance, we could start a new way of interacting, more sharing the presence
00:14:38
Speaker
over distance. So that was really interesting to work together with people in exploring that new technology and then connect it to textiles. And that also made me look at what I had learned in the education in a new way, because I had been trained in designing more static expressions. Of course, textiles always change over time, more or less, but
00:15:06
Speaker
That's an expected more aging of the material and the usage. I were starting to see or understand was that I could actually design a textile with the intention to change over time, back and forth many times. And then I also realized that, yeah, but the color and form that have, from an educational perspective, the color and form,
00:15:33
Speaker
have mainly been training about designing a stripe pattern that were intended to be striped. But here, with integrating a material that could change and react depending on the surrounding conditions, we could also have expressions that were more growing or changing over time. So playing with the change, so it could be circles that were irregular, that could have a more rapid
00:16:02
Speaker
expression or maybe broken up in disharmony or creating one big shape. So it was really more like a really high resolution textile display in a way. So when I started to see that, okay, everything I learned here in my basic education
00:16:25
Speaker
were really good. But today with the new materials, there is actually a totally different new dimension to it, the more temporal dimension and the change and the evolution of a pattern that could appear over time. So I also saw that a pattern is a textile expression is not ready when it comes out from production.
00:16:53
Speaker
as a ready product or as an artwork. That was in the past, but now it's more about when it's produced and done, it starts to act and show different expressions over time. That was also a big shift in the mindset. Then I had no idea that it would be possible to do a PhD within textile design at that time, but then
00:17:22
Speaker
I slowly started to realize that, yeah, maybe that could be actually one way to explore this area further. I was really privileged also because I had met Los Halanas. He later became my supervisor when I took my PhD studies. And my whole thesis were about exploring different kinds of like dynamic
00:17:50
Speaker
textile patterns and expressions. So both how to construct them and also how colour and form could be built up and designed in a different way when using interactive materials. Yeah, so that was really great. It was a fantastic time. And there, that's also during that period when I met you. Yeah, actually maybe just before I started my PhD studies.
00:18:17
Speaker
So we had some first examples and I think it have always been very inspiring for both us in the team working, but also for other people to have this physical, visual example that people can get their own experience from. I think that have been a strength in all the projects I've been a part of because it really challenged our understanding and perception of textiles because it acts so totally differently.
00:18:47
Speaker
I remember one of the first projects I was running, I called it like textile disobedient. Because I felt that, okay, how can I start to
00:19:03
Speaker
to get to know those new materials in a textile context. Because, yeah, the material needs to be handled in a different way, really. So that was a lot of fun. I can see your passion for textiles itself. Where did that come from? When did you first sort of realize this is a discipline that you wanted to explore as a career? Do you remember how you got into textiles?
Experimentation with Materials and Techniques
00:19:29
Speaker
Yeah, actually, that was through
00:19:33
Speaker
are the materials. I have been asking myself that also why textiles, but what I like is really because it's much about the choice of the material and then it's a technology, how to, or technique, how to put together the material to construct something. Before I started to study textile, I were studying jewellery
00:19:58
Speaker
and learned a lot about metals. Right, I didn't know that. Yeah, metals and also photography. And I experimented quite much over the techniques, so to say. So I, I were bringing in a lot of metal in
00:20:17
Speaker
textile constructions. I remember, yeah, one of my first weaves where actually I were playing with or bringing up some memories from my childhood and I were working with forks. Oh, wow. Right. Yeah. So, and I were like hammering them up, making them really flat. And I were making, constructing a weave out of them, almost like a
00:20:46
Speaker
like a protection or like a really hard method, armor, yeah, exactly, like a body armor. And playing with these everyday objects, playing with the hard material in a soft construction, so really turning things around and then continue to play with pictures from forks and made them into stripes and
00:21:13
Speaker
we're putting them into a textile construction. So I were really playing around with different materials and different objects that have a special importance or create special memories in me. So I have always liked to challenge, I think you could say a bit challenge or challenge the border of material and the technology.
00:21:43
Speaker
So yeah, just to see what happens. I'm very curious. When it comes to materials, when I get materials in my hands, something happens.
00:21:53
Speaker
I think this is what really connects us. We just love to sort of, we get excited about materials and see how much we can push it and stretch it, but working within that textile construction processes. I did embroidery with, again, remembering memories, trying to translate that. I did embroidery with spices from my mom's kitchen.
00:22:24
Speaker
So yeah, I can see, and yeah, I think for us, anything that can communicate what we want to express, yeah, it's any material that we can get our hands on. We'll then start manipulating that. And it's interesting that you already sort of worked with metal because eventually smart textiles is so much about these sort of conductive threads and, you know, metallic threads in a way. So in some way you sort of brought in that world of yours into textiles as well.
00:22:52
Speaker
Yeah, that's true. The weave with spices. I can really see what the fantastic kitchen curtain that could be with the smell and you could just rub it a bit and get it into your soup and the chocolate. Exactly. I think that it has something to do with the everyday, the touch, the everyday experience, and then also building
00:23:22
Speaker
a new context I think because the textile technology itself is in a way bridging past and present and bridging the future also. So I think actually I can see it more now when looking back to it that it is really about finding a way
00:23:44
Speaker
going forward, meeting the future, but also to bring in the past and the history and to anchor it in something known. Because if we are just meeting
00:23:56
Speaker
using new technology, it's so hard to understand and to understand the new material. So maybe for me to anchor it in something more traditional. I think that's why it was very interesting when you mentioned about textiles being carriers of information, which it was traditionally, if you look at traditional embroidery in Sweden, India, those embroideries weren't just aesthetic patterns. They showed, you know, someone's
00:24:25
Speaker
status in society, their marital status sometimes, where they're from, what culture, what religion, it reflected so much. Yes. And at the same time, the messages that the textile communicate with us today is that it is industrialized, it's global,
00:24:45
Speaker
It's quite uniform. It's about speed and uniformity. So that is one part of the story that it's telling today. And at the same time is the whole technology that is the carrier of the digital technology is so much stuck in these hard materials. It's really like we are stuck in the screens. And so I think maybe
00:25:14
Speaker
It's also been a way to find a way forward. And I also remember what influenced me a lot when I started to work at the Interactive Institute around 2000.
00:25:30
Speaker
the 90s were also, I got hold of paper about the Coopers on soft electronics from MIT. So that was really an important source of inspiration for me that we really
00:25:46
Speaker
took to us and continued to build on. Fantastic. So you started your PhD exploring dynamic textiles. What was some of the learnings that you had and conclusions that you came up with by the end of your PhD? Of course, a lot of design examples that were showing new possibilities for how textiles could
00:26:10
Speaker
changing visual expressions and how things that could be carriers for other kind of information. But also to start to build a color and form from static to dynamic. So I always try to do
00:26:25
Speaker
design examples to work with very simple geometry, circle lines, and so just to also build on that knowledge. So they could also see what were happening. So I didn't do like examples of products or applications, it were really experiments with the dynamic form. And then
00:26:54
Speaker
For some of the experiments, the interaction were also needed to be highlighted or directed or it would need to put it in a context like the interactive pillows, for example, that you need also someone to lean against something or to hug something or to carry around something. So it was more about starting to understand dynamic form.
00:27:18
Speaker
really and but at that time in my thesis actually i get really inspired to go back and look and dig in this a bit more now with this with a new perspective so yeah let's see what i'm seeing that as well yeah now i remember why i started all of this yeah that's good yeah so good so it's a
00:27:46
Speaker
Because sometimes when you are in the middle of something, it's so hard also to get it all out, to really see what is it really about. So that's also why I was so happy when you were.
00:27:59
Speaker
reaching out to me about this. Now what else? We learned towards the end of my PhD studies we started to get quite some attention both nationally and internationally and the interest to buy things that we
Industry Interest and Challenges
00:28:17
Speaker
did. I remember some architect planning a big building in
00:28:21
Speaker
in the desert somewhere. And they had seen a project we did at the Interactive Institute for optical fibers in the tic side construction, and we had solar panels onto it. So it should be like a one self-supporting system for light. And they called and asked if they could have like 10,000 square meters. And then they asked like, yeah, and what colors can we get them in? And I was like,
00:28:48
Speaker
Okay, I have a couple of students knocking my door outside and we have made one square meter of this of this fabric but I can give you the phone number to the company here in Sweden where we were doing this research project together with so they were interested for it and then and also for the interactive pillows a lot of
00:29:16
Speaker
people with beautiful stories like a boy moving away from his girlfriend for for some reason and then he were contacting me and oh I would really like to give this to my girlfriend when I go travel away where can I buy them and I was like oh I have I have not really been thinking I
00:29:41
Speaker
should get this kind of questions. I were not really expecting this. And so I were not so prepared for how to handle this. But they did a couple of industrial collaborations, both to see and learn about what would happen when we bring in different of conducting materials and methods into the text. That's not really on you today. But at that time, it was more to see how
00:30:11
Speaker
How could that be done? And if we're working, of course, that can be solved. But then there were more, I think a lot of people could see the potential and were comparing some of the examples we did with someone were turning the colors down on the first, yeah, the computer screens,
00:30:39
Speaker
they could not really see the importance of having color of a computer screen. Yeah. But you don't know in the beginning. So people were also comparing some of the experiments we did with that. But we cannot neglect this. We cannot turn this down. This is really the future. But we don't know how to do it.
00:31:09
Speaker
have the capacity or the knowledge about bringing in electronics as an active part in the textile construction. So I think what, so one result were really to open up our imagination for what could be done. And then I think it's more, yeah, also as a way of understanding technology and materials,
00:31:34
Speaker
in new ways, bringing past and present and future more close.
00:31:41
Speaker
together. So I think it's research wise, the first experiments we did in Peru and Sweden, I think it was very positive that we were a group of people that were really interested in those questions. So we became a group where you also were a part of the team at one point and the group. And I think that was
00:32:09
Speaker
really important that the circumstances to be able to go in depth, to look in depth here were there for us and then to connect it both to education and also to industry. We are really, I think it's still in the beginning. I think we were really eager to see results early, but I don't think you can really push out
00:32:38
Speaker
applications. I think there must be a need. It's about the new system really. It's a totally new system. It's a new way of manufacturing, using and then it comes also into legislation and world standards. So it's something quite challenging because it is
00:33:02
Speaker
a textile, but it's also electronics. And then I think at some points, my experience is that it also got stuck in between. Is it a textile? Is it an electronic? But that's not an interesting question, actually. This is it. Can this be useful? Where can it fill a gap? Can it fill a gap? Because I can see that this could be
00:33:30
Speaker
contributing to sustainability in that sense that it's actually performing more from less materials. Maybe you could program your textile to express differently instead of changing it. So it's actually suggesting to get more from less material. And today, in a time when we are communicating responsible usage of materials,
00:34:00
Speaker
resources. This is too far away, I think. I think people tend to see that, yeah, but that will consume
00:34:10
Speaker
electricity, that is bad. That will mix metal and cotton, that is bad. Yes, we don't have solutions for everything yet, but it's also interesting to start to think about how we can do things in a different way. Because we also use a lot of resources to do textiles and textile objects and products that holds one expression or one function. But
00:34:40
Speaker
What if we had something that could more change over time and adapt to different circumstances? That could also contribute and give an impact on how we use resources. To be more aware of how we use our resources, I think.
00:35:01
Speaker
When you started doing this in the early 2000s, I could definitely see that there was the excitement and everyone was imagining what is possible. And it was a very energizing stage in the exploration. What were some of the challenges back then that you might've faced? Were there challenges? No, I think it was just, we just had so much fun. Amazing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think we, uh,
00:35:31
Speaker
Of course we had struggles, but that was fun. We were more there too. We were curious and we had the chance to explore.
00:35:42
Speaker
things in a new way. And I think that was really, really great. So I feel really privileged to have that experience really. That was really great. I think more of the challenges started to come when we as researchers were more pushed and questioned about applications and products, because there I can see a bit of gap actually that we need
00:36:09
Speaker
Now I'm talking more on a more high general level that I think could be needed to be what could be improved also in Sweden when it comes to research infrastructure and the connections between industry and universities to also prepare the industry more as a receiving partner and also the universities also receiving needs and also share
00:36:39
Speaker
in a new way. So I think both, there is like being a research receiver is for the industry to prepare for and also to share needs and values and experience with each other more, to be able to move things to the market. That cannot be down to the single researchers or to a single industry. It's really a big movement.
00:37:05
Speaker
I think that's what the Smart Textile Design Lab was almost set up to do, isn't it, at the Swedish School of Textiles that tried to create that space, both for the researchers as well as for the industry to come and see what's happening, bring their needs. And I feel that plays that role a lot more today, maybe. Yes. I think it's happened a lot of things there. So it's really interesting to see how it's moving. And I think for healthcare, for example, there is
00:37:34
Speaker
It's a more clear need than for maybe more in fashion and so where it's not really found its way. After several years of working in academia, you were a professor there, you were deep in your research.
Transition from Academia to Industry
00:37:52
Speaker
Somewhere, I don't know which year, you sort of decided to move out into the industry, which is a big step. So what was the motivation or curiosity there to step out of academia?
00:38:04
Speaker
were of course several different reasons. I was really curious to see if and how things could be scaled up and moved because I could really see some potential but also research resources and competence were really needed to do that. That was a task I
00:38:27
Speaker
got in the industry to explore what and how smart access was you could contribute to a whole interior more. And what were your expectations at that point from the industry? What were you hoping for?
00:38:41
Speaker
Actually, I thought that there were more strategic ideas and knowledge about moving forward. But yeah, we really need to take small steps. It's something so totally different. I came and just...
00:38:58
Speaker
the first years in the industry were actually more or less just continuing doing research projects, I think, and more. You were more about sharing the research results and the findings we had done, so more about building this, like understanding for textiles and share what new materials were out there, and also starting to listen in to
00:39:25
Speaker
to the needs and so it really takes time. Yeah. I mean, I think in that way we've traveled similar parts. I also sort of moved out of academia and very curious about what could this become in the real world and joined the industry. Yes. And now again, looking back, seeing how naive I was in a way, thinking the industry was where I was.
00:39:51
Speaker
So I went there running at 300 miles an hour, you know, just ready to kind of really take on and bring a product to market, which like you said, there needed to be baby steps and that big gap. Yeah. It really changed the dynamics a lot. I think the first year was going at 300 miles and then realizing, okay,
00:40:16
Speaker
We need to slow down and we need to bring people along. Even today, the industry, I mean, you would think, gosh, it's been 20 years. Everyone should be up to speed, but we still have to bring people along. And this is where I've seen many people really struggle in our industry and probably in others as well. When research moves into industry, it's at very different places. How do we kind of find a common ground?
00:40:43
Speaker
You need to spend time to find that connection, like you said, build those relationships, bring possibilities from both sides to the table and then move forward together rather than one running off ahead. Exactly. And I think I was running. I'm still running. Yeah.
00:41:10
Speaker
But I'm also learning to calm down a bit now, but also to bring other people along. I think it's more about people than materials, actually. The material is the easy part. It's to get the people on board. It's the really challenging part. And also be really brave in also
00:41:37
Speaker
questioning and really understanding what will the consequences be if we bring this also to the market when it comes to bringing in like both building on to the existing systems we have today and also bringing in a new system. How much is the technology today or is it ready or what? Yeah, so I think it's also about accepting that the timing
00:42:04
Speaker
also needs to be right.
Conclusion and Future Teaser
00:42:07
Speaker
Linda and I had so much to talk about that I have published our conversation in two parts. So hopefully this is a little easier for you to listen to as two episodes. So join us in part two as we continue this conversation on how to equip the next generation of textile makers and also managing expectations in the industry, the future of smart textiles, as well as stories about Linda's gang of girlfriends from her childhood and her love for gardening.
00:42:33
Speaker
Make sure to stage the end of part two with Linda as I make a special offer that is only valid till the end of May. So listen in for that and join us in part two to find out more.