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Episode 198: Carmen Sederino and the Illuminated Story that helps leaders share their message
195 Plays1 year ago
Carmen is a business and marketing professional, with over two decades of experience across a multinational enterprise. Although quite an introvert, Carmen discovered a love of acting at an early age before formally training at Monash University completing a Bachelor of Performing Arts with Honours. About 6 years ago, she combined her business experience and acting training to found Illuminated Story and has never looked back since. Carmen absolutely LOVES coaching experts like you so that your message is not only heard but felt by your audience and you can leave your mark on the world.
Timestamps:
[2:00]How does one go about the business being a storyteller?
[5:45] How do you explain being an introvert but being comfortable talking in front of thousands of people?
[7:40] What sectors do you work with?
[13:40] Where you start helping people structure their story?
[19:00] How did you find your clients?
[32:00] If your business had a character or personality who would it be? And what is your destiny with the business?
https://illuminatedstory.com.au/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/public-speaking-coach-presentation-skills/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/illuminatedstory
https://www.instagram.com/illuminatedstory/
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCyNYLjN-FCMDfYRARLz-TAQ
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Transcript
Introduction to Entrepreneurial Journey
00:00:02
Speaker
The Entrepreneurial Journey podcast. We're talking business and building a culture that's kick ass. Where we make it happen, grab your seat, let's have a blast. At the Entrepreneurial Journey podcast.
00:00:22
Speaker
If you love the entrepreneurial journey, how about subscribing and giving us a five-star review? Wherever you get your podcasts, follow or subscribe and give us a positive review so more entrepreneurs out there don't need to feel alone. Thanks.
Meet Carmen: Overcoming Technical Hurdles
00:00:41
Speaker
oh ah go can it too Hooray, welcome to the entrepreneurial journey podcast. We have ah had to move to Zoom because Zencast was at work. The Wi-Fi gremlins ah are busy today, messing up our recording, but I wanted to it she introduce you to the amazing Carmen. Hello, Carmen. First of all, what a fabulous name. Thank you, Rebecca. And thank you for having me on the show.
00:01:13
Speaker
It's an absolute pleasure. Now, Carl Benham, do you like me or your surname? Sedarino? Is that how you pronounce your surname? Yes, Sedarino. Well done. It's Italian.
00:01:31
Speaker
Italian. I was hoping it was Italian. I'm learning Italian on Duolingo at the moment and and I'm just about to join the Italian Institute in Edinburgh. So, there we go. Wow. That's amazing. Congratulations. I'm sure you know a lot more Italian than I do because it's my husband's name.
00:01:58
Speaker
Fabulous. Right.
Carmen's Evolution: Shy Child to Entrepreneur
00:02:00
Speaker
Now, Common, you're a storyteller. ah How does one go about creating a business, being a storyteller? What's that pathway like?
00:02:17
Speaker
Really good question. Well, I like to think of myself, but ah yes, we absolutely help clients tell stories. And more than that, we help them put together a full presentation or or public speech, which certainly involves a lot of storytelling. um And how I got here, well, i I actually was a very, very shy child who somehow ended up being on stage in theatre. and So my teachers, I always remember them saying to my parents, I can't believe that's coming up there because I was one of the quietest child in the classroom and I would get very embarrassed if I had to be up in front of the class. But you could put me on stage in front of hundreds or thousands of people and I would absolutely shine.
00:03:05
Speaker
So I had this love of theatre from, you know, eight years old all the way through high school and ended up doing a degree at university in performing arts. It was called a Bachelor of Performing Arts at Monash University in Melbourne, Australia.
Why Leave Corporate for Entrepreneurship?
00:03:21
Speaker
And my dream was to become an actor. and That didn't come to fruition. I did a few little bits and pieces here and there, but I wasn't really satisfied keeping my days free for auditions and waitressing at night time or doing whatever job I could do to keep that flexibility in my day.
00:03:42
Speaker
So I ended up working for a large corporate company and I just found myself being promoted through the ranks into different positions. And on reflection, I realized that it was my communication skills and ability to speak out to groups of people that led me into those leadership roles. And um in the end, I was in sales and marketing roles within that company running national and international teams. After I did that for 18 years, I decided that I needed a challenge and I thought, why not go and run my own business and become an entrepreneur after having a very safe six figure income with cars and phones and computers all provided for you.
Illuminated Story: Helping the Confidently Insecure
00:04:29
Speaker
Let's go and just leave all of that and have nothing.
00:04:33
Speaker
and have the challenge of trying to to start that from ground up. and And my passion was to help others who are generally brilliant at what they do and have a great gift that they should be sharing with the world. But for whatever reason, either don't have the confidence or the skill to get up and be able to, um I call it being able to and you know shine from the inside out. So illuminate their story, hence the business name, illuminated story out to the world and share their messages with impact and ah be the leader that they were destined to be.
00:05:18
Speaker
Wow. That's from being so shy to performing in front of thousands of people. the Mel B from the Spice Girls talked about that on a podcast I was listening to the other week. She said, and
00:05:34
Speaker
I'm hopeless one to one or in a small group but put me in front of thousands, tens thousands of thousands. I couldn't get my head from that at all because that's some people's worst nightmare, isn't it? What do you think that was about, Carmen?
Introverts on Stage: A Paradox Explained?
00:05:53
Speaker
It is an interesting question and it's one I've definitely reflected on. And I think if you look at a lot of and actors, famous people like um Mel B that you were talking about and a lot of very good actors are actually introverts. And for me, it was about when I was up on stage, I was actually playing another person. So it wasn't me up there being exposed and being seen, it was somebody else. And I think for me, that was the big difference.
00:06:26
Speaker
And so when I got into the business and I ended up, first of all, in a state role within Australia where i I all of a sudden did have to speak out to groups of people, I felt just as awful as a lot of my clients do now. I felt sick. I felt like, oh my goodness, can I do this? Because that was me. That was me up there instead of the character. And so it was the skill set that I'd learned through acting that I was able to bring through and and help myself ah gain the confidence. And I think once you gain the skill, you can become confident in something. So I had the skills already. I just needed it to tap into them and and use them in that different setting and be comfortable within myself that I did know what I was talking about. And I did have a message that I could share.
00:07:19
Speaker
Yeah, I relate to that. I can stand up and talk all day long about culture and business coaching, NLP, all the rest of it. I don't like talking about myself. It's bizarre. I completely understand that and get that and relate to it. Okay, so what kind of people do you work with then?
Imposter Syndrome: A Silent Struggle
00:07:42
Speaker
Oh, I'm very lucky to work with a really diverse and types of people. Generally, they're people already in senior leadership, um wanting to either sort of solidify where they are and, and have the skill set they think they should already have in that position. um Or they're wanting to set themselves up for the next thing. So for instance, I spoke to a man today who is a chief financial officer for a large business in Australia and he wants to become a group CFO in the future. um It's so interesting actually that people can find themselves in these very senior positions and I'm quite sure their staff would think they're confident and that nothing could rock them.
00:08:33
Speaker
And yes, their true feelings are quite different to that. And even though they might be doing it, they don't enjoy it and it can cause a lot of anxiety. And and they truly believe because generally people in those positions are very um driven people. they're They're determined, they're driven. And so they're determined and driven that they can do this better and they can be more inspiring. And and that's why they come and and do work with us.
00:09:05
Speaker
Yeah, a lot of ah women talk about having imposter syndrome, but and and my experience as a coach,
00:09:15
Speaker
I find it equally prevalent amongst men. It's just, they don't talk about you. and And you're absolutely right. A lot of people in these sit senior positions, and because they're so highly skilled at the thing that's got them to where they are. But all of a sudden, like you describe a group role as very, very different set of skills you need. to run a group finance director role and because it it becomes so much more about communication and so much less about data or analysis and spreadsheets.
00:09:54
Speaker
It's so true. I agree with you on both points because I have a lot of men that um work with me because I mean, the numbers are still unbalanced in those senior positions. There's still a lot more men in them than women. I think women are just more open about their vulnerabilities and the fact that they do feel like they don't belong or they have that in foster syndrome. But when you talk to men and they open up to you and and you you allow them to feel comfortable and to be vulnerable with you, then absolutely they're going through exactly the same feelings and emotions. It's just maybe not as acceptable for them to express that in a more public forum um as it seems to be yeah with women.
00:10:41
Speaker
um and And yes, so i one of the women that I have worked with, so she found herself in the managing director's chair. And this reminds me of what you were just saying about the technical skill. So her, she was a trained engineer. That was her background. And she's ended up in this managing director's role. And she said to me, Carmen, it wasn't through. at leading
From Fear to Confidence: A Client's Transformation
00:11:01
Speaker
the teams. It was because I was really good at just sitting in the background and getting the work done. And slowly I just started you know climbing this ladder. And then all of a sudden I've ended up in this position where I have to be able to speak out in various um forums and to variant various audiences.
00:11:23
Speaker
um And she actually found herself in this meeting room one day where there was 40 people in the room. And when it was her turn to speak, she couldn't do it. So she pretended she had a phone call and left the room. Oh, bless you. Yeah. which was well very sad and and incredible. So when she rang me, she told me this story and she said, I know I can never do that again. and And what was even more interesting was that when she was younger, so when she was in university, she was up on stages talking in front of people and she didn't really have a problem with it. So we had to sort of work through where in her career this came from. And I guess the other challenge with leaders is that as you do, um
00:12:07
Speaker
move up the ladder, you also start delegating more and more tasks. And so some of the things she would delegate would be the delivery of speeches and presentations. And I think the the more you do that and separate yourself from it and the less practice you're getting, the more your confidence levels really drop. um But she did amazing and she ended up saying yes instead of no to the industry events and forums she was being invited to speak at. And so she didn't just get good at speaking in front of 40 people internally. She was speaking to hundreds of people. at industry conferences and sharing her expertise and especially in the women's forums that in a ah sector like engineering where it's still very heavily male dominated, she was able to show other women that you can succeed in those types of careers, which is very inspiring. Yeah, that is really inspiring. And where when you're helping people kind of structure their story, where do you begin?
Starting the Storytelling Journey
00:13:12
Speaker
and Good question. So i I call it starting in the middle. um We have a system, we call it an x-ray system and there's a seven step method and it starts with brainstorming. So in terms of their whole message, not necessarily just one single story, but the whole message they want to share with their audience, really letting yourself just figure out first of all, what do you need to share? And of course that's based on who you're talking to and what they need from you and what your purpose is and all of those sorts of questions that you need to answer.
00:13:47
Speaker
But just letting yourself brainstorm that information without opening a PowerPoint slide deck or any type of computer, just letting yourself think first and getting that core message down and then figuring out, well, how do I bring this to life in a way that's really going to resonate with the people I'm talking to? And that's where you can tap into some of those personal experiences and stories that will help um connect, I guess, to the audience that you're talking to. um and And that's how we start building their stories. and And once they sort of shape the message of their story, we look at, okay, so how could we make this even more emotional for the audience? And that's where you might tap into the senses and um really work on the way of describing the situation or the story so that people listening can really picture it and feel the story and the emotions that um were attached to it.
00:14:53
Speaker
Thanks for listening, everybody. Did you know at Trichress we've built a kick-ass culture, coach and consultant program? So if you're a business coach or consultant and you're looking for something new, add to your toolbox or even escape the nine to five, join us at our next event. Links in the information on the podcast. See you there. Yeah, you've hit on the emotional side of things. I run a leadership
00:15:23
Speaker
grand And the second to last session is about getting your message across because the a present patient. And we spend a lot of time at the Bay and want your team of one to follow you in a certain direction. Emotion. The message is in emotion. and It's not logic. You know, it it's not a 12 point plan. It's for it is for quality, whatever the emotion you want to invoke.
00:16:10
Speaker
What kind of reactions do you get when you start talking to really sounds like very high profile leaders like you got to talk about emotions now. How do they react to that? ah Well, it's interesting. I was working with, so I have um two streams of clients. I have private clients like the high level leaders we were just talking about who come in of their own choice and we work together privately. And I also do work with corporate companies. And what you were talking about reminds me of a group I worked with recently, and they're small groups, you know, a maximum of six in the room so we can really tear things apart and and dive into it together.
00:16:47
Speaker
um And they were all men and they were all in in senior leadership positions. And one of them said, I did a presentation recently and I got the feedback that I i really missed the mark. And it seems I needed to add in some more stories and into into what I was saying. And I was trying to teach them how to be a leader. And so we'd gone through all of my frameworks and you know taught him how to build a good message. And then he delivered it the next day. And he started his presentation because I always say, start with a bang, like start with a story or some kind of hook that's really going to grab people in. And so he started by talking about his honor and how she was
00:17:31
Speaker
his leader in his life and all the lessons he learned through the way that she led the family. And he had us in hook, line and sinker. And he was able to hook back, loop back to that story throughout various points of his whole presentation. And at the end, he sort of looked at us all like, was that too much? Like, did I give too much away? Was it a bit too mushy? And the feedback from the other men in the room as well was like, that was amazing. And I said to him, if you want to resonate with your people, you just showed them you're actually a human being.
00:18:12
Speaker
and that you feel the same way that they do and you have challenges just like they do. And now they can relate to you and they're far more likely to want to follow you to wherever it is you want to take them. Yeah, they want to. they Yeah, they want. decisive leadership and they want to feel safe and secure. So they don't want anybody who's too wobbly, but they're in those moments. They want to know that you feel the way they feel about things that are universal. And they go, oh yeah, yeah are like you say, you are a real person after all. And I love the Italian word for grandma being nonna.
00:18:49
Speaker
ah yes And it's just, it's just a beautiful word. If I ever have another business, I'm going to call it not
00:18:59
Speaker
um um So I love the fact that you've structured your business in this way. You've got a really nice mix of private clients and corporate clients.
Building a Client Base: Networking & Connections
00:19:11
Speaker
And a lot of, we obviously we train a lot of business coaches. So a lot of them will be going, well, Carmen, how did you find your clients? How did you get started? That's the $64 million dollars question. What are your insights for that? ah Yes, it is the $64 million dollars question, isn't it? Because when you've come from a large business where you've got ah a big job, but it's not your job to go out and get the clients and to running your own small business where all of a sudden if you don't get clients, then you realize you don't get paid. It's definitely a very big shift and change.
00:19:46
Speaker
um So I would say for the first 18 months when i I first left the business from day one, like literally, I finished working in my job on the 31st of July 2018 and on the 1st of August. 2018, I had meetings lined up with prospective prospects to try and generate some sales. But I joined networking groups. So I joined local networking groups and went and hound the pavement and stood up and did my pitch and all of the different groups and um tried to find connections of similar people that you know we could refer to each other and all of those sorts of things. so
00:20:30
Speaker
That was probably the first 18 months. I was very lucky. I had a couple of people that reached out to me who had worked in the same business that I worked in and had gone and and done their own entrepreneurial journey. And they recommended me to a couple of businesses that they already had as clients, which was very helpful. Although I found myself in those first 12 months at least taking on jobs that weren't exactly what I set out to do, but I could do them and I was going to get paid for them. So so I took them on and I said yes.
00:21:05
Speaker
And then at a certain point in time, I made a decision that I had to stop that and I had to really hone in on exactly why I left to do this. But after that, I felt that I'd i'd started to generate some potential clients who could give repeat business and and be good future clients.
Pandemic Pivot: Business Goes Online
00:21:27
Speaker
And then COVID-19 hit and in Melbourne, Australia, we went into what became about a two year lockdown.
00:21:36
Speaker
yeah So lead generation changed significantly and because you could no longer go out and see people to to network and generate business. And I guess for what I did as well, there was a belief at the time that you can't coach someone in public speaking virtually. it It was very much an area where the world hadn't realized how much you can do in virtual settings at that point in time.
00:22:09
Speaker
So it took a while, but um I put myself through a course to learn how to network via LinkedIn and to generate leads via LinkedIn, ah which became a very, very good platform for my business. And for the first time, I put myself out on social media because believe it or not, I'm a trained actor. I'm teaching people how to speak in public, but I did not want to be on social media platforms.
00:22:39
Speaker
and um So I was not generating any leads that way, which was just crazy. So COVID forced me into doing all of those things that I should have probably already been doing and to learn how to do it well, which completely changed my business. And the front room of my house, which was a spare bedroom, became a studio, which is where I'm sitting now. And I've got multiple cameras and TV screens and lights and sound desks and all sorts of things. And I'm very lucky now that I can serve as clients not only all over Australia, but anywhere in the world that is the right time zone for when I want to be coaching people.
00:23:21
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. It makes such a difference. I love the the journey you have described is is exactly the journey that a lot of our coaches go through. They've left the corporate. They realize they've got to go out networking, which they're fine with and they'll do. And and they then they realize they've got to go on social media and a lot of them have a real mental block about social media. And you've just got to get over it, haven't you? If you want for that social media and out of all the social media, LinkedIn, you know if you're a business coach, that's where your clients are, is the most benign of them all.
00:24:07
Speaker
It's very friendly. You're not very often going to get a horrid comment. You know, in all the years I've been in it, maybe I've had two or three, maybe four horrid comments. That's it. And and I think it's very well moderated these days. So even even now, I don't think you would get those actually, because it is very well moderated. So it's the safest of all. yeah yeah Yeah. I know Tammy in America, yeah she she said she wasn't going to go on to LinkedIn because every time she went on, somebody asked her out on a date and I went, I think it's changed just now. Hopefully no that's not still happening. but
00:24:56
Speaker
No, not so much. You can get some subtle messages where you think, do they want to meet for business or just coffee? But you can sort that out pretty quickly. And I think only offering virtual meetings initially until you've sorted out what business you will be doing can can help with that. yeah um But I remember the coaches I had that taught me LinkedIn to start with, when they first said, you've got to post and you got to do this, I was like, oh, goodness. Anyway, they're like, just do a video and send it to us and we'll check it before you post it. So I was like, all right. So I did my first video and they're like, Carmen, for goodness sakes, just post it. It's amazing. like Just get your your your content out there. And then I started doing it every day. So I post five days a week. They're not all videos, but at least two or three of them are. And it has been the best billboard for my business, especially because of what I do. There's not one sales call I have that's a lead that's come off LinkedIn, where the person doesn't say to me, I've watched your videos, or I saw that video the other day, or I saw this video, and now I have have to ask them which one.
00:26:08
Speaker
Yeah. and Because the other great thing with LinkedIn is that people aren't on there constantly like they are other platforms. So you can actually regenerate videos that you've done and post them a few months later. And it doesn't matter, which is quite different to an Instagram or a TikTok or a Facebook. And you're right, the the it is so much more professional and friendly. I've had some very awful comments via Facebook. And when I first started and doing some ads on Facebook, i was I thought, oh goodness, you know, this person doesn't even know who I am. I'm a real person. yeah And the type of things I would say sometimes are really awful. But I guess you have to
00:26:50
Speaker
just think it's either not even a real person, it's potentially a robot, or it's, you know, it's somebody that has so much time on their hands that they're able to think about writing a comment like that, which is not your general population. So you just need to not worry about it, not even respond to it and just respond to the ones that look like they actually deserve a response. Completely and utterly. Those ones just go in the idiot pile and yeah never to be thought of and certainly to be blocked. Yes, definitely.
00:27:29
Speaker
And yeah, the population who are really thoroughly, what's the vision for it? Sorry, Rebecca, can you just ask that one more time? Yeah, it's all right. Where are you taking the the business? What's the vision for it?
Expanding Horizons: International Ambitions
00:27:51
Speaker
Thank you. I would love to service so many more clients than we are currently. So my vision is to scale the business and to have more coaches because obviously I can't do that with just myself.
00:28:10
Speaker
um I have support at the moment from an admin point of view, but my vision is to build a team and to definitely have someone taking over um the sales and marketing components of the business, which as you would know is a and solo printer or pretty much solo printer. That takes up a significant amount of time within your week. yeah um and then yeah And then to have other coaches and and specialist coaches. So I would call myself a generalist in this area. I've already partnered with a specialist voice coach who's coming in to do some sessions for me. I'm speaking to someone at the moment about
00:28:49
Speaker
specifically storytelling and having someone come in to really help craft some some very clever stories. And we also help with impromptu speaking, especially with leaders that just have to you know respond to messages on the spot often. So I run some of those sessions at the moment and I can absolutely see that I could hire someone to do that too. So really building a team around me and being able to service ah multiple countries. At the moment, we've opened ourselves up to, obviously, Australia, where we're based, New Zealand, Singapore, and West Coast of the US. So we're trying to really find those time zones that really fit into our daytime hours here. And then I think the sky's the limit because of the world we live in and how small we are now as a world in terms of being able to do business and talk to each other like we are.
00:29:47
Speaker
While I'm in Melbourne, Australia and you're in the UK, it's it's um pretty incredible. So I think that the skill set of being able to really resonate with people and share to large groups is so enormous. And it's and I meet with so many ah clients and potential clients who clearly are very good at what they do but just don't have this skill. So to be able to get the message out there, first of all that it is a skill. It's like learning how to ride a bike or play sport.
00:30:25
Speaker
And once you practice something and learn a skill, that's when you become confident in it. I think there's a myth about public speaking and presenting that you're born this way and you know some people just have it and some people don't. And I guess like anything, while some people enjoy it more or maybe um seem to develop a skill quicker than others, it doesn't mean that you can't learn it if you want to, if you want to put the work in and do that.
00:30:57
Speaker
Yeah, completely and utterly agree. So my dogs just wandering around. The thing about my podcast is my dogs usually get involved at some point during the podcast. i have don I've decided to to not be up. Well, I've got two ones, a cross between a Tibetan and a working Cocker. He's the youngest one. He's Monty. And then I have a little one called Eddie, who's a cross between a Tibetan and I have an ease. He's nine now, actually, Eddie. What's the time I tried to keep them out and then I thought, no, they're just going to become a feature of the board. I love that. Very cute.
00:31:41
Speaker
Absolutely. absolutely I'm busy building myself a little studio slash library in one of the kids, my old two old kids have left home. So I've commented ah my son's old bedroom to that. So that's being done. So soon we'll be moving into the library. and matt I may ban them there from from the studio.
00:32:03
Speaker
Right, OK, so Carmen, if your business had a personality or a character, either who would it be or how would you describe it? Oh, um do you
Illuminated Story: Inspiring Warmth and Class
00:32:16
Speaker
know what? Before I left the large business, when i when I was leaving, it was all announced and I was creating the brand, Eliminated Story. It wasn't created yet. I went to the marketing agency and I had, you know, but some of those words I sort of had, but they put it together for me, the words, Eliminated Story. And I said, I want the brand to be warm. I want it to be classy, but warm is is what I said.
00:32:43
Speaker
because you can associate classy with cold a lot of the time and sort of snobby. So I wanted it to be classy and warm um and and I guess to to be able to inspire any type of behavior type or personality. So it doesn't matter whether someone comes to me and says, I hate this. I feel anxious. I'm very introverted. I don't like speaking out. Or they come to me and say, I love being in front of the room. I just want to get really good at it. We want to be able to service both types of people. So warm and classy is a limited story. I love that. And my last question, that's very recent question. What do you think your purpose or your destiny is?
Role Model for Women: Balancing Gender Equality
00:33:35
Speaker
Do you know, that's such a hard question to answer and I think about it all the time. and who My latest answer, yeah because I think it can change, is to be a... Yeah, to be a role model for others, especially women. So when I was in my large job, I was in a leadership position and I had, I have two children. So they were babies at the time.
00:34:06
Speaker
I went back to work when they were both six months old because I wanted to keep my leadership position and there wasn't the um flexibility that there is today post COVID times. it There's a lot of flexibility and um all the rest of it. And there were certain things that happened within the business that I led the way in. So for instance, they used to just pay you out all of your holidays and long service leave when you went on maternity leave. And I went to payroll and I said, oh, I didn't want anything paid out. They're like, well, that's just what happens when you got maternity leave. I said, well, that's really sending the message that I'm not coming back and I am coming back. So can we not do that? Oh, I don't know. Well, let me check.
00:34:51
Speaker
you know with HR and I went to HR and they're like yeah we'll just change that rule so but no one had said anything prior and ah there was quite a few things like that that I i feel like I helped pave the way for which helped future women and so I think showing women especially that if you want to be in leadership and you want to have a seat at the table, then you have to develop this skill set and you have to have a voice. And so that is definitely something I'm very passionate about. And one of my
00:35:28
Speaker
visions or goals in life. And on the other hand, I have two sons, so I don't have any daughters, I have two sons. And so I think it's really important for us to balance all of these messages and make sure that men aren't getting left behind, and that we are creating balance, not another inequality, shifting the other way. Yeah, yeah ah completely. I have two daughters and a son. So yeah, and I have a brother. I'm in business with him and I'm married to a man, my husband. So yeah, it's having that awareness that it it's balance. And actually women and men need different things in the work play.
00:36:12
Speaker
you and that's okay because men can't have babies so we you know and men don't go through menopause so you know we need different things and that's still okay that we can provide that in the workplace we just have to think about it a bit harder than than we do and and that's all it takes so I don't think we need anything Militancy we don't need to get angry with anybody we just need to work towards like you said doing simple things that people go and never really thought about that you know it's yeah lots of series of baby steps I think creativity
00:36:53
Speaker
creativity amazing Creativity, communication and and to not blame anyone for the way it already is because whoever put the rules in place probably wasn't trying to make it hard for anyone. They just thought it was the right thing to do at the time. Totally. Yeah, totally agree. Amazing. Carmen, thank you so much and thank you for your patience with our internet gremlins. My pleasure, thank you so much for having me on and I hope that all of the answers have come across with our internet challenges and we'll be able to put something great together for your audience. Wilt Allison is a superb editor and she'll make it all gorgeous, so thank you so much. I don't know, Wilt, I wish you the best of luck with your business.
00:37:44
Speaker
Chris Taylor is building a business around social selling and he's doing it in power but partnership with one of our previous podcast guests, Nick Jones. And together they're launching something that they tell us is very special. So find out how Chris got to where he is today, how he built Most Fortune and and why he's doing what he's doing. He's also about to go off traveling around the world as part of that business launch. fascinating insights into where this guy takes.