Transcript
Speaker: Action! Welcome to the Captains & Coaches Podcast. We explore the art and science of leadership through the lens of athletics and beyond. I'm your host, Tex Quilkin, and today i got a fun, impromptu episode, which one of those where I was having a great conversation with two amazing coaches,
Speaker: I had my media kit with me. We're going to turn it into a podcast. So this is me at a Coach's Mastermind. I'm sitting down with CJ Appenzeller and Coach Vinnie Maltz, both alums of the Captains and Coaches podcast. I'll link those up in the show notes, their previous episodes.
Speaker: And... Our conversation was anchored around hype. Is fake hype real hype? What does the authenticity of leadership bring? Is that loud person in the locker room tooled up and equipped to actually spark it.
Speaker: And we, this is a fun one to watch on YouTube, because we're lounging on a couch and CJ had a suite for his family, for this mastermind. We set up on so the suite couch, just like Matt and Shane's secret podcast, And very fortunate if you're a fan of that show, you're going to enjoy this conversation. It's that same lens where we get into some radical banter with two guys from Philadelphia philadelphia drinking some Wooters and doing that thing. So I had a lot of fun with this one.
Speaker: I did my best to just set them up and set them free because they are world-class coaches working with a lot of pros. in the world of baseball, in the world of professional hockey. So I don't want to delay anymore. Let's hand it off to these guys.
Speaker: Here we go. Ready, ready, and break. a Let's start the pod. And welcome to the Captains and Coaches podcast. We explore the art and the science of leadership the lens of athletics and beyond. I'm sitting here with CJ Appenzeller. I got ahead of my Zs.
Speaker: active personal training in ATS systems. And your mission is to train 1 million people in South Jersey? 1,000 people a month in, month out. There you go. In South Jersey. Check that out. Episode 3 of the Captains and Coaches podcast at the same hotel.
Speaker: Yeah, just in a much less cool setting. This is big dog setting now. Big dog setting. We're in the presidential suite at the Hyatt Regency. We've done it.
Speaker: We made it, baby. We did make it. And also joining us, Vinny Maltz, the author of the book on mindset. That's a nice little intro. And host of the... It's currently Evolving Athletes Podcast. Evolving Athletes Podcast currently.
Speaker: Yeah. So, gentlemen, something's been, i guess, scratching an itch. I have the four I's in team, and I'm exploring. And CJ and I were sitting together at our event here, and one popped out to me. It's motivational inspiration. Inspirational motivation.
Speaker: That's one of the most difficult things for a team captain to step into. It's the first expectation that head coach has for them, but the most difficult expectation. skill, tool, behavior for them to evolve.
Speaker: And something that pisses me off more than anything, and this goes back to my high school football days, is fake hype is real hype. So coaches try to over pump you up and they, we know the truth despite what our coach is trying to lead us to.
Speaker: And then going into college athletics, you got the captain that is shortened sprint. You got the person, the the loud person in the locker room. I won't call him the captain. They're shortened sprints. They're waiting till rep 10 to actually try and win that one.
Speaker: And then they're the loudest person pregame. But the guys I know, we all know. So... what is this like why are they getting loud what's the origins of this what are they trying to do are they trying to paint this picture that is above their performance y'all have been to the top help me understand what this loud mechanism is and how can we help prepare people to truly be inspirationally motivated to lead them?
Speaker: Well, I think the loudness, right, it's part of the culture of what are we supposed to do? I think a lot of people are used to, right, the usual, this is the way everyone does it, right? So you kind of go off of how you were coached and what you think inspiration and motivation is. So if I hype you up, it's gonna get you going.
Speaker: And it's interesting you bring it up, because ironically enough, I went nerding out on this about like four or five months ago on psychological safety inside of a pro environment. because what I started to find out was like, so Amy Edmondson's work was very corporate structured, right? And once she went in, but I wanted to know like all right, well, this is good from a team lens in terms of corporate environment, but we need the athletic lens. We need to understand better through there. And what I found through that research was actually competency and alignment did a lot more in a pro environment.
Speaker: to actually bring together than psychological safety. Safety's good, it's important, like, that I feel i belong, I'm safe in the environment, all that stuff, but really it's the competency and alignment. And so when you talk about motivation, inspiration, i think that gets lost, right? It depends on, when you're talking high-level environments,
Speaker: inspiration and motivation naturally happen within the environment when you're around other competent people, when we're aligned to the same message. Because what's gonna happen, on the days when we're exhausted, we still have to show up.
Speaker: And so there's more of those days when you're a high performer or a high performing team. There's way more of those days. So like the hype stuff, it's cool. it Again, it feels in the moment, oh, that's nice.
Speaker: But when it naturally occurs, when it naturally happens, because we just won a huge game, or practice something happens, somebody made a play like, oh it's a emerging property.
Speaker: So that's a much more natural way of hype actually happening where an inspiration, whereas when you try to go in, you're like, all right, I'm gonna i'm gonna fake it. I'm gonna pull out this energy to create it.
Speaker: High performing people are like wild animals. Like i can tell I can tell in five seconds you're faking it. Like you can tell right away, right? Whereas if you're talking to a youth group that's like, look who I'm talking to and they're doing it, their lenses aren't sharp enough to know what's fake, what's not, like they haven't seen it. But people that are pro or college level, like higher level, like you now have that sense. You've been around there for so long. You've got the 10 years of mastery from a youth through high school. Like you you have enough of a, okay, this is real or not.
Speaker: And so when you start to do that fake in front of people and it's that that's supposed to come out, you you smell it right away. It's like, nah, versus when it just naturally occurs, there's more power, there's more to the memory, it it's certain you core memories. You start to dig into that.
Speaker: So I think that's what gets lost a lot of times is that we think by faking it it's actually doing something because it's what we perceive. But in reality, it's an emerging property where just by us being who we are with competency, with alignment, and when those moments align and everyone's doing their job, yeah, we feel we feel awesome from that.
Speaker: So it emerges hype and no how a but all that stuff. Yeah, let's go. Versus the other way, which is just Fugazi. It's whatever. Fugazi. hes bugazzi Fugazi. Yeah.
Speaker: yeah So interestingly enough, this is something that, you know, you mentioned it as a skill and I like the concept of that. And I like what Vinny's talking about too. the the most The most organic version of this is in that moment, is in the emerging um the emerging circumstance, right? It's bubbling, bubbling, and then it runs over. i do think as a leader, there are times when I can't wait for the emergence.
Speaker: i need to I need to instill, right? So then I start to think about like, well, where does it all stem from? I think it stems from care, right? And and I mean this in, you know, and I don't mean to be very, to our point about Fugazi, I don't mean to be very Fugazi or very, you know, ephemeral, like you out in space somewhere.
Speaker: I mean to be very tactical in that if we're in alignment, if we care about where we're trying to go, if we have vision that is shared, amongst team, then for the leader, we have to think about the two components of what we're actually trying to do, right? Inspiration and motivation. And think either or in isolation is not as useful.
Speaker: So inspiration to me, Latin root to breathe into, right? For me, that's the emotional stirring. How can I stir the emotions of the team, of the group?
Speaker: And then the motivation piece, again, a Latin root, right? To move, sick, how do I create actual action? So in a business setting, it's, hey, do we have a vision and a mission that we're all on?
Speaker: If yes, box checked, cool, I need to bring that up. I need to stir that pot a little bit. I need to re-engage with it, right? Maybe that's storytelling, right? Maybe that's just simple reminder of actual mission and vision, right? Aside from objective metrics that we get stuck on so frequently.
Speaker: And then it's like, okay, I need to be clear with no ambiguity about next action, right? That's the motivate part. I think so often this like lack of authenticity in this eye, as you, as you put it right, in inspiring motivation, the lack of authenticity really shows in the fact that when we close this loop, the loop is closed with ambiguity.
Speaker: Do it. Do what? What are you trying to discuss? Come on. Yeah, come on. yeah Be better. It's like none of that is objective. So I can't provide that objective next action, it's going to be really hard to close this loop effectively.
Speaker: And it all comes back to care. Do I care about what we're trying to accomplish as an organization? Do I care about what we're trying to accomplish as a team? If I don't, I will be found out.
Speaker: If I don't, I am being less than authentic when I spread that message. And to your point, everyone has the meter. Everyone has the gauge. And it immediately, that alarm, you know, kind of sounds. So that's my thought.
Speaker: And coaches going come back to, well, course I care. The clear is caring. So are of these expectations are aligned for the team? The mission, vision, values is that everyone's on either aware of it or hopefully on board with it. yeah So the challenge I run into with teenagers is they don't know how to express excitement or it's not cool if I celebrate one of my teammates.
Speaker: Because if somebody does something awesome, they're resentful, they're mad it wasn't them or potentially they're thinking about themselves in the next play. Yeah, stop glazing.
Speaker: Stop glazing. yeah Yeah. Glazing has become one of my new favorite words. Yeah. And i just beat the dead horse to death until they realize how stupid that is. Yeah. So.
Speaker: Now, what are some opportunities within the walls of training, whether it's practice or within the weight room, that we can teach these guys how to celebrate so then they're not afraid to look for small wins in training and practice?
Speaker: Awesome. So I'll start. I got the bike and then we'll flip it back. I'll be short. But I think for me, leadership, and and we talk about this as a team quite a bit, leadership starts from the front. And what I mean by that is like, if you're not willing to set the example of what you're actually looking for and set the expectation of what you're actually looking for, you'll never get it. So I think it's up to us. And so often, you know, how many of us have been coaching for 10, 15 years, years, whatever it is spend a lot of time in the trenches.
Speaker: It's very easy to forget to highlight the first, you know, in the weight room, the first barbell back squat someone does. The first, you know, PR they hit. It's very easy to forget that.
Speaker: It's kind of like, yeah, that's what I do. You know, I'm a coach. This happens all day long. But if I can't highlight that moment, if I can't, for lack of better terms, glaze that athlete, right? Get him a little bit fired up.
Speaker: right celebrate it publicly about you know this milestone, whether he believes it or not, then I'll never get it out of the rest of the guys. I'll never do it, it just won't happen. So how do I find opportunities to do that? From a team perspective for us in the business, we are constantly, every single week, celebrating wins multiple times per week, on purpose. I want my entire team to see me really highlight the effort, and mostly effort by the way, effort-based metrics of my staff.
Speaker: right Hey, we celebrate, one of our principles, right hard hat mentality. We celebrate putting on your hard hat. We celebrate working hard when it's not perfect. We celebrate consistency many, many times over intensity. So if I can't set the example for that, I'll never get it out of the gas. That's, I think, the the biggest thing for me.
Speaker: I love that. I think it comes, out Eager, 10 to 25? Yes, David Yeager. Yeager, yep. So, Capitans Coaches Podcast alum, 63, four-ish.
Speaker: We're gone. Hook it up. So, right, talks about how that teenage time, right, when they're coming in, how important it is that respect and status, right, are the two big, you know, key indicators, right, through that process. So you have to include that into the variables, right, of like, right, how are we going to get that across?
Speaker: So one of the ways that was interesting that I created, that I had utilized, that had lot success with players, was I was trying to get them to work hard. And and the assistant coach on the team, know, he was a former head coach. NHL player and all stuff. So we're sitting there and going like, doing the usual stuff. This was like whatever it was, you know, 17, 18 years ago.
Speaker: Screaming, yelling, yelling, yelling. Come on, come on, come on, come on. Finally, it hits me on It was like the competitive cauldron thing. You know, it was just like, all this I was just like, you know what? Let's just create competition within every drill and keep a scorecard.
Speaker: So bam, two on ones, one on ones. I just gave creative stats on it, right? And that was it, just boom, boom. Then at the end of practice, put it up in the locker room on the wall. It looked like youth kids at a tournament going in. These are all 16, 17, 18-year-old players. Youth kids going up and looking, trying to get over each other.
Speaker: who made it and they're sitting there and they're watching, right? So there's the status thing that you kind of replicate right in front of them where now it's like not only are they seeing where do they fit, but then it's like, okay, there's the ones that are like, oh yeah, I'm at the top or the ones at the bottom are like, I'm not going back there.
Speaker: So the assistant coach was shocked at how, when we went back the next day, how much harder everybody went. And he's like, that is crazy. Like the effort significantly changed, no more yelling.
Speaker: So from then on, we didn't have to yell anymore because it was like, it was taking care of it itself. So I think it's figuring out the conditions, right, of where meeting high school age, this is where they're at, right? And understanding that component of it because the biggest part of his work, right, was understanding, hey, when you have high love, high standards,
Speaker: That's what we all want from that 10 to 25 age. We want like as competitors, if you show me high love and high standards, where it's like, hey, this is what gonna be. So what naturally emerges from those conditions, right, is like when you create that, now it allows it to naturally emerge of using those conditions to, wow, like, okay, the status is there. Like, now I got respect. Now we're naturally, yeah, let's go. Now it's naturally occurring because of these things we've set up, right? Of the competitive cauldron. you know you're You're trying to align it in a natural organic way as opposed to us trying to infuse it. So that was kind of like the biggest part that learning through as a coach was realizing like, wow, fighting for that skillset from a leadership standpoint is so important. But most importantly, the love is being put into doing the research to understand that.
Speaker: right Really trying to make sure who ah who are we presenting to? Because presenting it in that mode, that's what I'm trying to create from a high school age. But if I'm doing that with older players, well now there's gonna be more clarity on, okay, so what are we trying to achieve?
Speaker: So within the context of practice or whatever it is, Now I might get more detailed and nitty gritty is, hey, we're now older, the details matter significantly more. When you're younger, you want them to learn and compound the ideas of the details, but you know that's not gonna be perfect, but it'll be good enough to win games and be successful.
Speaker: Once you get older, now everyone's become legit, like everyone's good, the details matter significantly. Like any young pro knows this, like, what are you learning as a young pro going in with the veterans? The veterans are, wow, they're so meticulous on every little thing where it's like, oh, I wanna work up to that one day. So it changes, right, of what we're presenting in the material, but fundamentally it still comes back to the same idea of the respect and status and how you create conditions around that, but that's coming from love. That's at the core of like, it's like I love this so much that I'm building upon that.
Speaker: And two questions aligned with that. Freshmen looking up to seniors. They don't wanna see them uncool, so they don't wanna glaze. They don't wanna praise, they don't do anything.
Speaker: They don't wanna mess up, so they're so internal that they're afraid to be external whatsoever. So then what would be our leadership role and position to help these guys break through their shell?
Speaker: And even if you're not ready to call out a senior, you can still celebrate what they do successfully. Yeah, ironically enough, it was yesterday you guys see Billy Madison was on the tour last night. He's playing up here all the time. Exactly. So literally I just go right to that place of like, all the cool kids pee in the pants. Well, that's what makes you That's what makes you. Exactly. So who would eat 30 bag? Yeah.
Speaker: So it's the same idea, right? It's like he comes out and he leads by example and he shows like yes, right? And now everyone's peeing their pants. That's great Funny aside we used to in college like run our our college camps for kids and make extra money and like fundraise for the program We were joking around quoting Billy Madison, and I was like, to randomly to one of my teammates, like, who would steal 30-bag lunches?
Speaker: And one the little kids just looks at other coach and goes, Clarence. And like, call out one of our teammates. So he he would assume one of our teammates would steal lunches.
Speaker: So that's the inside joke that we continue to tell it to this day. It's awesome. 20 years later. but That's all you have. Every captains and coaches podcast listener knows. That's awesome.
Speaker: that's awesome So, but fundamentally, right, that's the biggest part of why consistent conversation about those moments is so important with the leaders, right? So the seniors are letting them know, like, this is how we want to lead by example. So for you, it's understanding, like, because sometimes, right, seniors might not have that. They know, but, like, it's uncomfortable to them, too, because it's still, they're not at that stage yet where they're in their 20s and they've really matured and they understand, like, no, this is what we do. Okay, there's a standard we're committed to. I don't care if it looks cool or not. This is what we do.
Speaker: So it's having that conversation with them from the mentorship at the top, from the coaches to be able to say, hey, this is the kind of culture we wanna run. You work through it, but it's your responsibility to take on that as these freshmen are coming up and they feel weird about the celebration and we're getting each other going, hey, go in there. you know Create the energy. And so if you feel naturally with it, be you, do you. You know how silly I've seen you a couple times when you got silly and stuff like that? examples. Like, you yeah, yeah, be that guy. Just that's what I want to see who you genuinely are.
Speaker: Now it gives them a framing, right? Relatable. It's natural. Okay, yes, I've done that. I can relate to that. And now I have this commitment. You give them responsibility. or Any leader loves responsibility.
Speaker: It's like, okay, and again, clarity. It's like, oh, okay, this is what's expected of me. Okay, this is what you want from me, awesome. So I can implement that more. So I think that's a big part of the process, right? Inside of that is making sure that if we're gonna lead by example through that process, it's knowing each different stage of coach passing down information to leader, leader feeling comfortable, okay, you gave me permission, awesome, now I'm gonna lead the way and show the young bucks, like, it's cool. Like, it's cool to drive into this.
Speaker: I love that. Actually, yeah. So for me, if I'm in that exact same situation and I'm trying to inspire and motivate simultaneously the freshmen to have that celebration idea, I'm gonna find examples for them, like Vin said, and I'm also gonna stack the deck. Right. So this is essentially what Vinny was saying, like a little bit more tactical.
Speaker: I'm going to pull that leader aside, whoever that guy is. Right. And we all have that guy in the locker room or that guy in the huddle. We know who he is. And even if it's maybe a little uncomfortable for him, I might ask him to be a little inauthentic in the moment to set a standard for the team.
Speaker: right Hey man, I need you to celebrate this really hard. And I know that's not, I know you're a guy who shows up and gets stuff done, which is actually funny enough why I'm calling on you to do this, because it's a thing we need done as a team.
Speaker: It doesn't show up like an objective goal or steal or a save or whatever, but it's gonna show up in a much bigger way over the course of a season or over the course of your time here. So I think for me, I'm stacking the deck from a tactical perspective. I'm picking that guy and I'm asking him to set this example for us.
Speaker: Then from a staffing level, because really, you know, Athletes are taking their cues from their coaches, right? A coach that flies off the handle, what are their team what does their team do? Flies off the handle, right? So I'm going to probably stack the deck in multiple ways. I'm probably going to ask my junior coaches to call out the head coach in a way that is respectful and elevating, but also shows like, hey, there's a power dynamic there that's okay. There's a lateral accountability, which is how we talk a lot about. There's a lateral accountability there that's okay.
Speaker: And or a celebration laterally that's okay. That must be what we do. People like us do things like this. So I'm living that example through the coaching staff, and then I'm stacking the deck from a team perspective.
Speaker: And then pulling that back to the team, we know freshmen will get called up for playoff time to be bodies on the bench that are that hype.
Speaker: And the beauty is when you're on the field in the moment, you don't know if it's fake or real. You hear them cheering your name. let's go and it's it's time so aiming to help them understand like fake hype is not real hype but there's moments of the game and by the playoffs we know how to get loud height and celebrate so tool i got that i love is called motivation drill so it's uh... it's sprint mechanics were accelerating ten yards decelerating and then if i'm not running i'm cheering group ten guys together split the teams each captain owns a line
Speaker: So they're practicing and some captains hate it because they're still in this mode where all eyes are on them and they feel everyone's looking at them and they don't want to be silly and loud.
Speaker: But then the aim and not all kids get there is to get out of your shell, get silly and loud because you're going to be on the sideline. That's the beauty of lacrosse is we exchange fast. So you're going have your moment where you're silly, loud, hype.
Speaker: But the dude on the field is focused and serious and still hears people celebrating for him. So there is method to the madness. Yeah, that's this that's said principle, right? The specific adaptation to the imposed demand. I am specifically applying this add ah this stimulus, right? The stimulus is like, you need to cheer in this moment. You need to be okay celebrating your team.
Speaker: And eventually i get the adaptation I'm looking for. I'm okay. I know how to cheer. It sounds silly to us. I know how to cheer and I know when to go. And that's a moral principle, right? If you take it from strength and conditioning, that's exactly it psychologically.
Speaker: It's the same thing I love. What'd you call the principle? No, no, that oh that' specific. messages Yeah. post men know There's a like a psych version of that, but yeah. Yeah, psych version. You can...
Speaker: you can spit your opinion. Yeah, so like, yeah, let me go through it. but i'm gonna find But no, no, exactly. But no, what I'll say is the relatability. That's what i love about it is like, and I think that's the biggest part right there is like, how much are we you know extracting from different relatable concepts? But what you're doing is you're creating the environment of, hey, you know what? You're gonna feel what this is gonna feel like psychologically, the uncomfortable. Everyone, we always talk about becoming comfortable with being uncomfortable.
Speaker: So the fact that you're taking them under a controlled environment to work through that that process. And the irony is what'll happen is You know, come back to me with psychological, but like on that side of like what happens when you create those conditions and they're going through that practice of, okay, I'm releasing the tension, quote unquote, right? There's the reversal of it where because I'm going through this adaptation the moment, okay, this uncomfortable right weird. It's weird. It's weird.
Speaker: But then when the moment really comes, when it's real pressure's on, this is the cool side of the other way from a mental standpoint that we don't realize enough is we're not putting enough of these situations where let's just practice. That's what, that's at the heart of what so much visualization is, the whole point, a big part of affirmation, right? Like, you know, you get into the neuroscience even more, vagal tone, vagus nerve, of like why the breathing or yelling or or you sang in the shower and you feel amazing afterwards.
Speaker: Well, yeah, it might feel weird you doing it, but literally there's a nervous system impact of if I actually start to yell, you know, cheer and do that, even though I um feel uncomfortable underneath the hood.
Speaker: And it's like, this feels weird to do it. By actually yelling with your teammates in a group environment collectively, right, all the flow, state research shows, it's a connection of all of us together. Now you're putting out this voice. Ah, ah, ah, now breathing mechanism that will use, but it's always under the same category.
Speaker: Now when that goes out, now suddenly you're feeling this uplifted naturally, you created it through the you know adaptation, but you don't recognize like by doing those reps, then when the moment comes and the heat is on, you'll naturally feel like yeah let's go and now you're going to be under the under the circumstances you're going to want to share more because you worked out the mental part of this is stupid and the story was different but the actual physiological response changes because it's like that's always right and everything from the nervous system it all works in the body up right So it's like, if you get control of this by, hey, you know what, override it. Yeah, yell, scream. You're actually teaching it for in the real moment that now I'm comfortable with it because now my body and the adrenaline and everything's kicking in and I'm feeling good about it. Let's go, the serotonin, all fun stuff, you know, dopamine and bam, we're going.
Speaker: yes So I think it's all that combo, right, that starts kick in. So... So my fear is when people hear that, when leaders hear that, right? Macho, us macho leaders, you know, gym guys, training guys, sports guys, they're going to say that's silly.
Speaker: and And, you know, i I think back to a younger version and of myself to not meme myself, but I was so much younger, like, you know, but I think back to a younger version of me as a leader, and I'd probably be saying the same thing. So to that end, i just want to really quick comment on,
Speaker: The number one goal of a leader in an organization is to resource the team. that's That's the number one goal above all else. Our number one goal is to win. Well, the way to win is to resource your team.
Speaker: this These are resources. Whether or not you want to call them hard or soft skills or put them in a separate category to your objective metrics, that's up to you. But these are resources, right? And what what the research suggests is, and this is is kind of like what my dissertation is on. This I was alluding to earlier. What the research suggests is that a job as a whole is significantly less stressful and or and more fulfilling when a individual is resourced appropriately. Mm-hmm.
Speaker: So do you want to make the job for your team really hard? Do you want to set unclear expectations or expectations that they're simply not resourced to hit? Probably not. So as a leader, resource your team, resource your guys, give them the opportunity to work through this, get the bad reps, quote unquote, out in front of the team in the trusted environment. So then we go out on the field. It's second nature.
Speaker: And that's a skill that's skill in and of itself, right? It's wild to me how often I've seen in in the pro realm of the resourcing of you learning the skill set of what's required for the job. Like we have the temperament for it. We're always pushing to get better and understand how to better.
Speaker: Where so many coaches get caught up in is they just wanna teach the sport and be better at teaching the sport. and they're not realizing, yeah, but as a leader, your job is also from a resource standpoint is, okay, how do I infuse more of this other stuff when this all exists in this, we're three living examples, successful, when we do, why? Because we're using these types of resources into our process. So you can't turn around and say, no, this is all BS and it's soft skill.
Speaker: It works, like we actually use it when we're under stress, when we're feeling exhausted, we're using these principles and tactics and we're watching it work in real time, right? the That simple example of the competitive cauldron.
Speaker: On one of the days I remember being exhausted and i was like, all right, well this is gonna work and is it helped to alleviate by having those in place. So I couldn't agree more that on the resource part, it was like massive, that's skill and of itself for leaders.
Speaker: Yes, and when our X's and O's, coordinators and coaches get frustrated and unfocused of why this isn't working, we usually are the ones that then lead them out to, back to the people or the the scenarios, the expectations.
Speaker: To close it down, there is a price for pretending. Our objective, and you mentioned definition of leadership, being resourceful, yep that puts them in a position to truly believe.
Speaker: So from your experience and your perspective, what is that price of pretending? And where can we learn to just put down our egos, our guard, or being too cool for this and getting the reps at leadership? Because motivation, inspiration, leadership, it all takes reps.
Speaker: Yeah, I think the the price of being less than your full authentic self is actually worse than losing. It's losing repetitively and slowly.
Speaker: So it's like everybody knows this, right? If if we're sparring, right? If Vinny and I are sparring and Vinny's going to choke me out, I would much rather head and arm get sunk in and I tap versus he cooks me for three and a half, four minutes and then slides the choke in. right I'd much rather get the loss and get the lesson versus suffer.
Speaker: And I think the the the cost to being less than your full authentic self is suffering. Because now I have to put myself in an environment that I don't necessarily necessarily believe in and do something that I don't necessarily feel like is true and meaningful.
Speaker: And that suffering in and of itself is not worth It's not worth the moment of whatever it is, the moment of leadership, the moment of feeling silly, the moment of being less than or the moment of ego death, right?
Speaker: I think in many, many ways, you're much better off looking for the answer and the lesson rapidly versus being inauthentic and suffering. Yeah, nailed it. I always come back to like when you bring up meaning, right? It's Viktor Frankl, man's search for meaning.
Speaker: The core of it, right? He's in the worst conditions, conditions right? Going through the Holocaust and just like watching people just die around him and you're just like, but in his mind, there's there's a bigger purpose here. There's something on the other end of this that's going to happen.
Speaker: And that's what gets lost when it's fake. When you're in an environment, you can feel, what's the point? If this is all just for performative and this is all bunch of nonsense and I'm not going through a real suffering where even if we're failing to the point of like, yeah, we're suffering, but we're suffering in a real state where, man, we're really trying to figure it out and we're not getting clear with one another. And this is just better opponents and they're just better than us and it's like, well, how do we get better? And what do we need to do to get better? You're missing out through the meaningful part of it.
Speaker: of actually getting to the source of, you know what, even though i'm suffering on the back end of this, I'm still learning lessons from it. Something's gonna come out on the other end. So the very idea of there's a meaning, there's a lesson. A lot of times people, right, it's like, oh, I don't believe in that stuff. I have higher power. and say And I just sit there and laugh and just like, what is the core of why so many human beings across the board feel like this means something to me. What is that as a human being? Like, you want to call it emotion? Like, no, like there's a purpose and a greater power where now the suffering is worth it. I don't even care how much I'm suffering. Like as a parent, right? We know that feeling right away. It's like, you really don't understand how like unconditional love where you're like, okay, yeah, I'm willing to die for this person.
Speaker: That doesn't ah like, at least for me anyway, it wasn't until like, But yeah, my first child was born, I looked at it, was just like, after a while, you're just like, wow. Like I literally, if anything, you start to think about, know these thoughts yet, but you start to think about, man, where if somebody comes in the house? What if this happens? It's like, yeah, I'm just gonna do this. i I'm gonna grab them. I don't care. They shoot me. Like it's just weird. You mean every day? like Are you talking about my bedtime?
Speaker: But it's like weird how naturally these thoughts, I'm like, why am I thinking this suddenly? And it's like, because there's a meaning now greater. And that's the stuff that you know we're always learning. And I fall back and as a parent where i'm just like, where is this coming from? And it was just like this natural law of meaning.
Speaker: It's just like, okay, if the suffering gonna happen, here's what gonna But I'm clear on that because of this higher power that's like, man, this this has a purpose. Like I gotta take care of, i love ah love her so much. I love him so much. Like it's like, no matter what happens, like this is gonna get taken care of. I'm like, what is that?
Speaker: What's happening? And that's what we're trying to, in team setting, what we're trying to do is provide the squeeze up. This is the concept. We provide the squeeze up for that, right? And when I say squeeze up, so a few years ago, maybe five or six, we had a naval operator from the SEAL teams come and speak to our team. And you know they're asking them, the kids are asking crazy questions, of course, right? like you ever You ever kill anybody? like Immediately, right?
Speaker: And they're like, what's the scariest thing? And he said, he was like, the scariest thing is before the squeeze up. And was like, I'm not sure exactly what you're talking about. like I'm going to be honest, I'm not an operator. goes, well, the squeeze up is when your partner, the guy behind you in the stack before you enter a house, squeezes your shoulder, it's go time.
Speaker: And I said, that's the scary part. He goes, no, that's what you're misunderstanding. It's before. It's before we have the trigger, before we have the moment where, hey, we're going, it's real now, it's live now.
Speaker: The scary part is the not knowing. The scary part is the suffering before you know.
Speaker: Yeah, and <unk> to wrap it all up, we need reps celebrating one another. And the the big objective here is through being silly, through being loud, we're getting reps when it doesn't count for when it does,
Speaker: we are prepared to have each other's back. And the beauty is I want my teammates to be friends. Like we can run in different social circles. Yep. But we're on the field and the phones are away. Like we're having a great time.
Speaker: And that takes time within the practice. That's we have a whole year to bring to to to form the storm to norm and and perform together.
Speaker: It's Tuchman's five rules of building a gym. That was pretty strong, yeah. I didn't come up with it. That's your goal. like a big thing, like if they learn to celebrate one another and become friends, then once sport ends,
Speaker: then we're maintaining the celebration. Or if we are in high school still, and there is conflict at the Taco Bell, I'm speaking from experience here, I can talk trash on you guys, but the moment somebody else tries to, I have now the courage and the reps to stand up.
Speaker: Because what we see in a lot of high school is, the negative forces of somebody else is speaking negative about somebody else you want to jump in or be quiet. But I have 100 reps now celebrating all I can stand up and I have the confidence to do so.
Speaker: Yep. So whether in social or confrontation, we've been through it together and that's how we have real height. So if there are external forces and I gave a ah talk of my alma mater to close this down years ago and I stole this from there's a book called Halftime and he had you draw a fence and the what is in your fence there's going to be a bunch of noise on the other houses up the block outside your fence you're not going to worry about it.
Speaker: When we're in a team setting or household or a family environment we're just worried about what's going on in our household within our fence and we can observe and look around but we know it's going to hold us together and that's the expectation whether it's twitter social whatever when we're on a team no matter what anybody else says that takes time
Speaker: Any closing thoughts as you share your socials where people can continue to learn y'all because well-known? Yeah, no, that was great. I love this topic. We could definitely continue to riff. But, yeah, you can find me at um the gym websites, atsstrength.com, activepersonaltraining.com, and on Instagram at appyhour.
Speaker: So, happyhour with no H in front. A-P-P-Y. Right there on the ass cheeks. Yeah, it's Instagram. It's at Coach Finney Maltz. And then we actually did the website now. It's Coach Finney Maltz.com. So we just got that done. i think Which is printed on the back of the next phase here. oh we Yeah, Amazon link is on there on the Instagram page and all that stuff. And in the show notes. Yeah, exactly. So, gentlemen, we've got get back to the show. Yes.
Speaker: So, thank you all for tuning in. Thank you for a mind-bending conversation, as always. Thank you. that will take us home. And see you. And see you.
Speaker: How we doing? Great. I wish we had more time. I know.
Speaker: Yeah, good.
