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Rio Matchett: 'Graceland Too' by Phoebe Bridges
92 Plays8 months ago
‘You’ve just got to keep walking.’ Says Rio, ‘Surviving is giving yourself permission not to thrive.’
Are we spoiling you with the wisest guests on any podcast? Probably. And here’s another one. We hope you enjoy this beautiful conversation about friendship, loving someone through their darkest moments and being on the other side.
Rio Matchett lives in Leeds and works as the New Work and Learning Producer at the Leeds Playhouse. She gained her PhD in literary modernism and queer theory from the University of Liverpool in 2022 and now leads the MA in Dramaturgy at Leeds Conservatoire. As a writer, Rio was recently shortlisted for the Fitzcarraldo Essay Prize, and as an academic, has spoken about her research at institutions including the University of Oxford, the Università IULM Milan and the Sorbonne
Show notes:
Instagram: @riomatchett
Help us a grow a community of survival song listeners by joining us on over on Substack:
https://survivalsongs.substack.com/
'Graceland Too' by Phoebe Bridges can be found on our community playlist on Spotify along with our listener’s Survival Songs. Check it out and add your own!
This episode contains small portions of ’Graceland Too' by Phoebe Bridges . Survival Songs claims no copyright of this work. This is included as a form of music review and criticism and as a way to celebrate, promote and encourage the listener to seek out the artists work.
Find out more about Phoebe Bridges here:
https://open.spotify.com/artist/1r1uxoy19fzMxunt3ONAkG?si=ffx0BC6bSSew9cvOMPnOIA
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Transcript
Introduction and Concept
00:00:01
Speaker
I'm Lydia. I'm Ed. We're friends with a playlist for everything. And it turns out, we both have one called survival songs. And he got us thinking, what are other people's survival songs? So we thought we'd find out. Welcome to Survival Songs. A podcast where each episode our guest tells us about a song that gets them through the best and worst of times. Sensitive topics might be discussed. So look after yourself. The show contains portions of copyrighted material. We'd love for you to support and celebrate the artists by streaming, downloading and buying their brilliant music.
Join the Community
00:00:35
Speaker
And go give our guests a follow on social media.
00:00:38
Speaker
Help us grow the community of Survivor Song listeners by joining us over on Substack and add to our public playlist on Spotify. Links are in the show notes. We hope you enjoy the show.
Introducing Dr. Riau Matchit
00:00:49
Speaker
Hello and welcome to Survivor Songs. My name's Ed and today's guest is Dr. Riau Matchit. Riau lives and works in Leeds and is the new works and learning producer at Leeds Playhouse. She gained her PhD in literary modernism and queer theory from the University of Liverpool in 2022 and now Leeds and the MA in Dramaturgy at Leeds Conservatoire. She's also a massive advocate for new writers, ideas and companies here in Leeds. We're going to speak to Rio in a minute, but before we do, we're going to hear part of her survival song. This is Graceland Two by Phoebe Bridges.
00:01:29
Speaker
She could do whatever she wants to do She could go home, but she's not going to
00:01:48
Speaker
So that was Graceland Two, the survival song choice of our guest today.
Phoebe Bridgers and Graceland Two
00:01:53
Speaker
Dr. Rio Machit. Hey, Rio. Hello. How are you doing? All right. I'm good. I'm really good. Thank you. Thank you so much for joining us. So ah when did Graceland Two first come into your life? When did you first hear it? And what was your experience when you first heard it? I guess I am quite embarrassingly came to Phoebe Bridges on TikTok during lockdown. and There was a very specific dance that the kids were doing to motion sickness, um which is one of her better known songs. um And I was at the point of hysteria in lockdown when I was learning dances from TikTok um and and found this song in it. And it was one of those that and really
00:02:35
Speaker
spoke to a ah feeling that I'd had and not been able to put into words motion sickness um and I loved it and then went on a kind of Phoebe Bridges deep dive and stuck with her, stuck with her music and then later down the line heard Graceland too and again one of those songs that I just felt I felt like it was written for me and for my friends and which is the best kind of art and yeah Yeah, and what was the kind of initial emotion when you heard it? Can you remember, was there a point where you were like, oh my God, you really sort of connected with it? I think there are two sides to it. So I think the idea of the bit where she talks about being no longer a danger to herself or others.
00:03:32
Speaker
We'll talk about this more, I'm sure, but mental health problems really run in my family. That's that's a big part of our lives. um And then I suppose what the song is about for me is friendship um and about loving someone through their periods of darkness. And then those those first kind of moments, the other side of it, when you go Oh my God, we were not quite in that darkest place anymore. We've got we've got through the other side. um And I think that that's what it really captures for me. That's this little moment of just being able to breathe out because it's not all perfect, but we're not in the the worst place anymore.
00:04:11
Speaker
Yeah, I think that breathing out thing's really by like pertinent, right? You know, sort of like, i think I think anyone who's been through mental health crisis kind of can really recognise that idea of like, that moment, it's not like, oh, everything's in Shannon Rose's, but like, just nothing, but there is that kind of like, that grayness is lifted, right? And I think it really captures that, this song really captures that moment of like, yeah, that kind of like, oh oh shit, things do get better. Yeah, totally. But in it also I loved it in a way that's kind of um really not sentimental. Like, you know, they all go hang out and get high um and just eat a bunch of crackers on the floor. that's That is such a kind of beautiful, and yeah, image of a friendship in a way that feels really real and not sort of overly saccharine.
Defining Survival and Mental Health
00:04:59
Speaker
Yeah. It's an interesting, i and you've kind of answered it, but like, what does survival mean to you? Like with this, of it's a you know, because it's obviously we talk about survival songs, but, and I suppose for the different guests we've had on, that idea of survival so felt different. And so I suppose, how did you interpret it? Oh my gosh. What a good question. um I guess survival for me means walking in the direction, walking towards having no fear. and Um... And it's not necessarily about ever getting there. um But I think survival is the process and the intention to keep walking in that direction. and Because I think we sort of sold this idea that like hey happiness is like a destination, right? But this idea that we're going to arrive at happiness, but actually, it's happiness is the time we walk through. And it's the strength to keep walking once you've been through the happy bit, right? That sort of like, oh, I know that I've just been through happy town, but now I've got to keep going, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And knowing that when you're in those the really shitty moments, you've just got to keep walking. um and And it is shit. ah It's really hard. It's really hard sometimes. But I really believe that everything passes. And sometimes all you can do is is hold on. and Survival is giving yourself permission not to thrive all the time, and just to keep existing until you become thriving again.
00:06:29
Speaker
That's brilliant. Oh, that's really, I've not heard it put like that. That's really great. From permission not to thrive is, I think why I love it is because we live in this sort of like hustle culture, right? And you know, especially in the arts, which, you know, we both work in this idea that we have to hustle all the time. And we're like, you know, like have to be busy all the time. Productivity and that kind of toxic productivity is so real. And if you're not busy, you're somehow failing. And and if you're failing, you're sinking. Totally, totally. And I guess particularly were thinking about mental health, you know, i um I think there are lots of mental health issues, mental ah illnesses, and which are
00:07:09
Speaker
it's helpful to kind of view through a and ah medical model. and But a lot of them, I think, are just products of the world and the systems that we work in. and and I think a lot of what we call mental illness um often is quite a rational reaction to an irrational world. yeah Yeah, it doesn't work. and Then we have to have a word for when people can't live with the fact it doesn't work. um and All the you know layers of systemic privilege and opportunity, and and things that come with that. um You know, like, sanity or insanity is is a descriptive word rather than prescriptive, right? It's the thing that we've all, as a society, decided at any point is not the norm, um which is why those definitions change. You know, less than, what was it, 50 years ago, being homosexual was but insane. You would be diagnosed as insane.
00:08:01
Speaker
um And it's society that kind of changes and keeps moving those goal posts. And I think what this song does is it takes you to a place that kind of removes all that noise, like those simple, that like the sitting in the crackers, like driving in the car, that kind of putting the radio on, singing loud. It's like, it's such a direct channel to the basics that make you so happy because it's always those stuff. It's never the kind of like the big like things that you think are going to be life change. It's always like, I'm here with the people I love most and
00:08:33
Speaker
Just things are okay. Yeah, totally that totally that and I think like joy and laughter are two of the biggest and political tools we have And I'm one of the most loving things you can do for a friend It's just a like be joyful with them and laugh um and sometimes that's really hard when they're not feeling in that place But the things that I really remember um as being the great acts of love from my friends that I've been on the receiving end of. um A lot of them were you know the moments when they kind of quietly sat with me in the dark times, um but more of them actually are the the silly ones. um that's That's the gift, I think, of friendship, is is being able to just be silly with someone.
00:09:22
Speaker
I read a really great book about, i ah by Ed Zwick about ah kind of creation and kind of film filmmaking. And he talks about how a film could never be too funny. And the reason why he thinks that is because the minute you laugh, you let everything go. And like you're most vulnerable when you when you're laughing, not when you're crying, but when you're laughing. when you kind of I love as a concept and and and you know i'm having kind of worked on some great shows where those kind of your emotions are all and you know like and shows that you've been sport brilliant sport of of you know like Ava and um and The Lighthouse both of which are brilliant and and heartfelt but really funny in places and silly and and and I think when you give people permission to laugh it allows them to then open up and feel so much more
00:10:13
Speaker
And this song like is a real kind of like celebration of that kind of that stuff, right? Yeah, and I love i love how i and it sort of represents being on both sides of that friendship, um being the the person that has been sectioned or or deeply unwell or whatever it is, and and the moment of kind of stepping back into the world, but also being the friend waiting for them on the other side. And that moment when your friend steps back into the world with you, I i just, yeah, I think it's beautiful. um I listen to it whenever I feel like far away from my friends who have been there with me.
Friendship, Joy, and Survival
00:10:46
Speaker
Oh, it's really, so it's like a kind of like a literally a direct line to them.
00:10:50
Speaker
Oh, 100%. And when I listen to it, I picture really specific friends. you know I think about my friend, Ruth and Martin, and and I could list off a you know a whole reel of names um because it feels such a literal depiction um of kind of moments in our lives over the last 10 years. I always think songs have a moment what that you're waiting for. There's a line or like a guitar phrase. what Is there just a bit where you every time you go just it takes you there, it connects you? Um, I really love the line. She knows she lives through it to get to this moment.
00:11:31
Speaker
Um, because God yeah, like I. I have such a beautiful life. I have such a rich life full of such interesting and compassionate and exciting people and moments. Um, and I'm so, so grateful to my younger self for surviving. Um, and I wish, I wish I could go back and tell her like, there will be so many moments, um, that
00:12:04
Speaker
there will come a tipping point when the dark stuff, and you know, it's not even that it doesn't define you. It's that it's kind of irrelevant because it was so, um, you know, you live through it to get to this moment, but actually it's not this moment. It's these it's constant. Um, and I really, I think, I think it's a muscle to kind of practice seeing those moments and naming them, um, just saying out loud to yourself, God, I'm so happy. Um, I'm so happy. Um, I think you can almost like have love's dog yourself i'm into feeling it, but you you will every time the sun shines and you go, God, I don't hate being alive, um every time you you know someone makes you laugh, I'm so happy. um Yeah. Yeah. ah ah It's interesting I hadn't really thought of the song about actually someone talking to themselves and now you put it out, it's like, oh yeah, it's not necessarily talking to someone else, it's actually she's talking to herself.
00:13:00
Speaker
both It's both, I think. I also do it with friends. um We do a thing every year ah where a bunch of my friends who were with me and supported me when I was sectioned. and And at New Year, every year, we take like six bottles of Aldi Prosecco onto the beach in Liverpool. um in Crosby so you can see all of the fireworks reflecting off the mersey um and we all just sing in a big circle and drink all of this you know shitty prosecco from the bottle um and we all snog each other and it's it's gorgeous um and often i'm like god we we live through it for this and everybody's got you know their stuff everybody's got their their thing that they had to get through their things that they have to get through um but those moments i'm like yeah that we live through it for this
00:13:47
Speaker
I think what I continually love about
Reflecting on Personal Journeys
00:13:50
Speaker
survival songs is that every, every song just takes people to so many places. And I feel like, like, so thanks for like taking me on your, like your journey. I really appreciate it. And yeah, is there, what are you up to at the moment?
Current Projects and Podcast Support
00:14:03
Speaker
Tell me what's happening. um this week and This week I'm in R and&D, Research and Development, so sort of pre-rehearsals, for a murder mystery play that has integrated British Sign Language and audio description and we're playing with the idea of delivering
00:14:21
Speaker
the clues in those different languages, so different portions of the audience get different clues at different times. and Turns out it's incredibly complicated. Not sure, but um yeah, really interesting idea. And really fun as well. We've talked a lot about, and and I really see this in in my role and as a kind of producer and programmer. Audiences just want joy at the moment. People really want to just have a nice time and a bit of escapism. um And a merge of mystery is a really fun example of that. so It's just a romp. And I think particularly, you know, when we think about access, it's very tempting to sort of get holier than thou about it and and make it really moralistic. We're all just having a really silly time playing with mustaches. It's great. Obviously, because mustaches are the best thing to play with. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. um Everybody wants to be Poirot. Exactly. Quite right. um Thank you so much for joining us and we'll see you soon. Thank you for having me. Take care.
00:15:26
Speaker
We really hope you enjoyed the episode. If you want to support the podcast further you can choose to upgrade your subscription on Substack but most of all we just love it if you told your friends about what we're up to. Thanks for listening.