Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Gotta Talk Fast! Let's Discuss Sonic the Hedgehog 3 (Spoiler Review)
29 Plays1 day ago
In this episode, Satsunami and Andrew discuss their thoughts on the hit video game film Sonic the Hedgehog 3. But did it deliver on the hype? Did any of the predictions from our previous episode come true? And what happened when Andrew met a Sonic fan in real life?! All of this and more into our review of Sonic the Hedgehog 3!
This podcast is a member of the PodPack Collective, an indie podcasting group dedicated to spreading positivity within the podcast community. For further information, please follow the link: https://linktr.ee/podpackcollective
Where to find us:
Check out all of our content here!
Support Us:
Patrons:
Super Pandalorian Tier:
- Battle Toaster
- Sonia
- Ghostie
- Cryptic1991
Red Panda Tier:
- Greenshield95
- Danny Brown
- Aaron Huggett
Free Members:
- Middle-aged Bodcast
- IRIDYSCENZIA
- Rob Harvey
- Aaron (Super Pod Saga)
- Billy Strachan
Use my special link zen.ai/chatsunami and use chatsunami to save 30% off your first three months of Zencastr professional. #madeonzencastr
Create your podcast today! #madeonzencastr
Stay safe, stay awesome and most importantly, stay hydrated!
Recommended
Transcript
Andrew's Sonic Dilemma
00:00:01
Speaker
Well, Andrew, are you ready? I dunno. Feels a bit tiring. Maybe I'll give the season a miss. Only the perfect episode could bring me back. Aw, come on! What can I do to convince you to come back onto the show?
00:00:13
Speaker
Maybe i say a Zelda month? nah. Double your salary? You don't pay me. Oh yeah, neither do. What about if we dress up as hedgehogs and destroy a killer space station?
00:00:23
Speaker
Wait a second, you just want me to do an episode on Sonic, don't you? Haha, you know me so well. Well, let's stay safe, awesome, and hydrated. Don't tell me you already prepared a catchphrase.
00:00:36
Speaker
Heck yeah, Dad. And everybody loves it.
Andrew's Sonic Movie Experience
00:00:40
Speaker
Welcome to Chatsunami.
00:00:45
Speaker
Hello everybody and welcome to another episode Chatsunami. My name's Satsunami and living and learning with me is none other than the hedgehog expert himself is Andrew. Andrew, welcome back.
00:00:59
Speaker
Gotta speak fast. I like it. Approved. but Yeah, how are you doing today? I'm good. I just recently came out of the cinemas watching the brand new Sonic the Hedgehog movie and was probably the oldest one there that didn't have kids so that was an experience but yeah a lot of fun yeah you have no idea how much i can relate to that sentiment as someone who went to the early showing of this film yeah It's a sobering experience. For the record, and your honour, for the record, I did go with my partner to see this film, but we were probably the oldest other than, of course, the parents that took their children, who were very unenthused by the film, but we will get on to that later. The parents of the children. little column A, a little column B, you know.
00:01:43
Speaker
It was a bit of a mix, except for the one child that i have to shout out in this episode who, when Shadow the Hedgehog popped up on screen, yelled out, Look at Shadow! Which, honestly, I think we were all thinking that at that point. But anyway, yes, of course, today we are talking about the utterly hyped, utterly fantastic Sonic the Hedgehog 3. But before we get on to talking about this film, and I have so much to gush over about this film as a Sonic fan, I know, shock horror, I am indeed a Sonic fan.
Andrew's Sonic Movie Journey
00:02:13
Speaker
Next week, water is wet and Andrew is a Zelda fan. You know, other shocking news incoming. But before we get into our thoughts on the film, I've got to ask you, Andrew, what's your experience with the Paramount Sonic the Hedgehog films? Because I'm going to be honest, they were quite controversial. And I mean that in the loosest term possible, but they were quite controversial when they were teased with the ugly Sonic model, then the actual film came out. What was your experience? Did you watch them at the time or are you a new believer? yeah
00:02:44
Speaker
i'm certainly a new believer i remember all the kind of discussion controversies around the ugly sonic when he was first debuted and then the quick back to the drawing board better fix them in post design of sonic that is what was in the main talking point around him and it took a very long time till i eventually watched the movies the first one came out the second one came out and it wasn't until around midway through this year that i watched the first one and i enjoyed it i was like actually this is is this is a very cute movie i think this is this is quite fun and i encouraged my partner i said hey i think you would enjoy it we should watch that together and so i re-watched it with a few months later and she enjoyed it and i said all right well i think i'm going to try and see this third one that's coming out in december so this was around october november time i said i want to watch the second one now so i can be kind of prepared for it.
00:03:33
Speaker
And so we then watched that one and to be honest, I had less enjoyment with that one than the first one. I still think it was a decent movie, but I tolerated it as a whatever kind of thing. And then was ready and raring to go for the third one. I was actually quite excited for it. I didn't have the same kind of history with Sonic as you did, but I still a fan
Satsunami's Sonic Game History
00:03:50
Speaker
of Sonic. I knew the games, knew the characters, all those things. I watched the cartoon, at least one of the cartoons when I was a kid. But yeah, what about yourself? My story begins in 1995, Nobler. When you were three?
00:04:01
Speaker
When I was three, no. Actually, in all seriousness, it probably would have been... Maybe 1999? Whenever Sonic Adventure came out for the Dreamcast, because it was actually my brother if who had it, he did have the original for the Sega Genesis and everything. I liked it enough, I watched the cartoons growing up, but i think Sonic Adventure was the turning point that sealed the deal for me, where I was like, oh my god, this is so cool, and don't worry, Pandalorian listeners who have heard me talk about this a million times, you can indeed listen to our Sonic Month episodes, and ironically enough, we recorded the Sonic Month episodes with our mutual friend Adam.
00:04:38
Speaker
We ended up talking about the films, the first one and the second one, and I have to say I wasn't really too interested and this will sound really weird because I'm a massive Sonic fan but when the first film came out I heard about Ugly Sonic and everything I really wasn't that interested. I kind of thought did I want to watch it? Nah probably not and actually didn't watch it until I want to say Quarantine covid time you know like 2020 maybe early 2021 max if i might have been late 2020 but genuinely i had zero interest in this film and then i watched it and i'm gonna be honest i thought the first one was okay you know was very by the books it was cookie cutter well not cookie cutter but you know i mean it was very buddied cgi animal road trip film you know like the smurfs or hop Hop is what came to my mind.
Satsunami's Sonic Movie Expectations
00:05:30
Speaker
I had listened to your Chatsu short, spoiler-free review of this, and when were talking about the Buddy animated friend movie, I was like, I've not even seen it. But the first movie that comes to mind for some reason is Hop.
00:05:40
Speaker
Yeah, it's always Hop. I don't know why. Is that also John Marsden? Oh, James Marster. Yeah, think so. Yeah, he's like the main guy in that. Not the rabbit for legal reasons. but Yeah, is him. It's Russell Brand, isn't it Yeah, sadly. Sadly.
00:05:56
Speaker
but Fortunately, he is not in this film right enough. But yeah, remember watching this film and i again, I thought, yeah. it's okay and then I was semi excited for the second one because I heard the second one was going to lean a lot more into the games and things and the lore behind that and I thought okay I'll do it and unfortunately I got struck with a really bad stomach virus. I don't know if I told you this story. don't know.
00:06:21
Speaker
My partner and I were ready to go see it. I booked the tickets and yeah then I got struck with this a really terrible bug so I couldn't go to see it Sonic and opening day. So I was avoiding spoilers like the plague. But I remember Adam telling me, oh, by the way, see, when you get to the end of this film, you are going to be so happy at this film. So I was really excited to see it. We eventually got to see in the cinema. Again, i was probably pushing the average age of the room up.
00:06:49
Speaker
Lots of kids standing in there and flossing. And spoilers for the second film, but the end, you know, we get introduced to Super Sonic and everything and the Chaos Emeralds. And that honestly that blew my mind. I was like, oh my god, they're finally going there. But then when they introduced Shadow in the post-credits scene, that made me lose it. I was like, oh my god, this is going to be such a peak film when the third one comes out. And of course, it was weird because they were saying, oh, it's going to be in 2024. It's going to be ages away. And time is a flat circle these days. But yeah, ah for two years, genuinely, there was nothing on this film, by
Sonic 3 Marketing Critique
00:07:24
Speaker
the way. And you'll know how rabid some Sonic fans are.
00:07:27
Speaker
any scrap of promotional material and they were there posting it all over the place like leaks for happy meal toys leaks for scripts that kind of thing they were trying to post everything but it was all very much a nothing burger and then it wasn't until 2024 the knuckle series came out i'm going to be honest i would not really recommend the knuckle series did you see anything about it i don't really know much about the knuckle series no it kind of just passed me by and i didn't have paramount plus and so didn't really have a way of watching it and wasn't interested enough to find it by alternative means yeah i don't know it's one of these shows that you watch it and then you go who was this made for because there's a distinct lack of knuckles and more of a focus on the human characters let's say and their bowling tournaments i'm not even making that up by the way that is genuinely what happens so weird but we didn't really get any trailers or any spoilers until the last month of sonic coming out yeah it was just it was bizarre i mean it was a really weird way to market it because we had nothing and then all of a sudden paramount and everybody distributing it just threw all of the trailers at our faces and then there was almost like an overload where it was kind of spoiling things that probably shouldn't have been you know like robotnik working with sonic but we're finding out that robotnik was alive in the first place you know that kind of thing so maybe it was a bit much but I mean before we get into it what did you think about the marketing did you notice it or yeah I mean a lot the marketing was around Sonic being in it sorry well I would hope so
00:09:01
Speaker
A lot of the marketing was around Shadow being in it, and then also you would see the dance scenes, of the dance with Gerald Robotnik and Eggman a lot. Those are the two main things I knew about the movie, that Shadow was in it, about the Gerald Robotnik stuff.
00:09:13
Speaker
Well, it was then very weird how they try to keep that it was Gerald Robotnik kind of a secret throughout the movie, because i was like, all the marketing has been very much showing off the fact that Gerald Robotnik is in this, and that he is also played by Jim Carrey. Yeah, I'm going to be honest, I don't know how I feel about that. Say without any further ado, will we just jump in to fly to the moon and take down this space station, as it
Podcast Promotion and Patron Shoutout
00:09:34
Speaker
were? Yeah, I think there's no other place to go but up. And of course, we will be right back after these transmissions. Welcome to Chatsunami, a variety podcasts that discusses topics from gaming and films to anime and general interests.
00:09:47
Speaker
Previously on Chatsunami, we've analysed what makes a good horror game, conducted a retrospective on Pierce Brosnan's runs James Bond, and listened to us take deep dives into both the Sonic and Halo franchises. Also, if you're an anime fan, then don't forget to check us out on our sub-series, Chatsunani, where we dive into the world of anime. So far, we've reviewed things like Death Note, Princess Mononoke, and the hit Beyblade series. If that sounds like your cup of tea, then you can check us out on Spotify, iTunes, and all good podcast apps.
00:10:16
Speaker
As always, stay safe, stay awesome, and most importantly, stay hydrated. Greetings! My name is RoboticBattleToaster. I'm a variety game streamer on Twitch. There, I play a range of both multiplayer and single-player games.
00:10:29
Speaker
You can also find me on Twitter and in my Discord server, where you can vote what games I play. And, of course, join in on the fun and back-and-forth banter in a relaxed and safe environment. I hope to see you there. So, without any further ado, let's get back to Chatsunami.
00:10:44
Speaker
Ta-ta!
Sonic 3's Themes and Conflicts
00:10:45
Speaker
we are back. So, Sonic the Hedgehog 3 is a very interesting film plot-wise, because, as we were talking about before, the first film is very much buddy road trip film. The second one kind of leans more into the games, and it has to try and...
00:11:02
Speaker
Again, realism's the wrong word, but it has to be a lot more grounded in comparison to what they could get away with in the games, you know, with the spin dashing and whatnot. But for the third film, it almost feels like a Dragon Ball Z film at times. It focuses, of course, on, and if you haven't seen the marketing for this film, it was very heavily advertised. It follows the story of, well, Sonic and team coming across a new alien life form called Shadow the Hedgehog, of course, which that five-year-old was very enthusiastic to let all of the cinema know when i went to see this he of course breaks out looking for revenge and along the way he teams up with a very interesting group of villains i want to say but we will of course get on to that i don't want to make it sound more dramatic than it is it's like a story of loss and revenge and things but there are some really heartfelt scenes in this film surprisingly isn't there yeah there are some very sweet scenes even just from the very very start of the movie with the celebration of his sort time on Earth and family he's now made.
00:12:03
Speaker
And then they have a different side with Maria and Shadow. There's lots of very heartfelt moments throughout. Yeah, because i just want to touch on that about Maria and Shadow. In all seriousness, going to the games, the relationship between Maria and Shadow is like a very core aspect of that character. Did you know much about this before you went into the film? I had some understanding of the Maria and Shadow relationship prior to going into this.
00:12:28
Speaker
just based on the games I played and the cartoon series. I was very young at the time, so I didn't fully understand what the deal was there i don't think but i'm pretty sure they were both in space for the most of it, not in this bunker. They definitely changed that for the film. Again, the think it's going to this idea they wanted to keep it a little bit more grounded, which... Quite literally. Yeah, quite literally, which kind of defeats the purpose when they end up in space anyway, so I don't know why they didn't just have a space station. I guess they needed a reason to explain why people haven't questioned this giant space laser just floating in the sky previously. That's not a space station. That's an ESPN satellite.
00:13:05
Speaker
but Ah, okay. 50 years ago? Yes. They also changed a really weird thing about Maria's backstory, and I don't actually know if they alluded to it or if it's like deleted content or whatnot, but honestly, some of my favourite bits of this film was the flashback scenes.
00:13:25
Speaker
And I kind of wish at times we got a little bit more of it, because again, going back to the game, Shadow is really defined by the loss of Maria, because what ends up happening is, you're completely right, they live on the Space Colony Ark, it's called, and Maria is suffering from this autoimmune disease that basically the reason she lives there is a think it's easier for her to live there with her grandfather and of course she plays with Shadow and whatnot but then what ends up happening is the station ends up getting raided by GUN, the military of this film and of the games and then Shadow and Maria are trying to escape. They end up shooting her which became a bit of a meme within the fan base because I think when you think of Sonic you think of vast blue hedgehog, oh look at the rings, Green Hill Zone and
00:14:15
Speaker
And then you've got this really dark story in space where children are getting shot in the face, you know, it was quite dark. So I think a lot of people were expecting that to happen in the film, which it technically does, but not obviously in the same way, because there is no way in hell this film would be a PG if it was.
00:14:33
Speaker
Yeah, she dies from an explosion, doesn't she? Yeah, they shot the glowing orange barrel, didn't they? Yeah, it was a very video game moment of like, oh no, not the radioactive exploding goo. My eyes, the goggles do nothing.
00:14:46
Speaker
I didn't quite understand in the movie what the motivation for Gerald Gottlank was like, we have to go What was the explanation for that? Yeah, I don't know.
Exploring Gerald Robotnik's Character
00:14:55
Speaker
I think he just wanted to get Shadow away. And again, you'll hear this a lot in the episode, Andrew, apologise in advance, but in the games, Shadow is made from alien DNA. Why he turns into hedgehog, I don't know. That was a Sega decision. But in this film, because Sonic and Cole are already technically classified as aliens, because they're from different planets, I think that they just stuck him in a comet and just... threw him to space and he wanted to try and get him out of there. That's one of the problems that I did have with these flashback scenes because later on, not to spoil too much for the finale, but later on you see how devastated Gerald Robotnik is about the loss of Maria.
00:15:36
Speaker
But I just wish there was more time to build up that relationship between the two because obviously, you know, a grandfather is going to be very devastated if the grandchild is taken from them like that. But I just wish there was more There was a moment at the very end where Gerald said to Ivo, you're no Maria, and clearly showing he always prioritized Maria and Maria is only one that mattered to him. But we didn't see him and her interact at any point in the flashbacks except when they were running away. And there was no real dialogue between the two of them. Maybe there were some deleted scenes. during the flashbacks where they were interacting more.
00:16:10
Speaker
All we see really of Gerald is him being a bit of an asshole. An asshole on the same kind of level as Ivo. And so we don't really see that humanity to him that would endear Maria to him. And so I think that was lacking from the movie. that We kind of just got the comedic and dastardly villain side of Gerald Robotnik, but we didn't get to see him caring for Maria. That underpins a really severe problem that i have with the film. Overall, I genuinely think that this film is a great watch and everything, and I think that Sonic fans, non-Sonic fans, you are going to enjoy it. But I feel as if, and I don't know you felt the same way, and it sounds so weird to say it like this, but this film, and I think it's a problem for the entire series, not just this film, but I feel as if the film is too afraid to be serious at times.
00:16:59
Speaker
It doesn't ruminate on the scene or it doesn't say, all right, this is a terrible thing that's happened. They always have to throw in a quip or a joke directly after it. I don't know what your thoughts are about that. That's unfortunately what movies are like now. Yeah. It's very much a not wanting to rest on an emotional kind moment for more than a few seconds that you immediately want to be like... Don't think about this thing that made you sad just now.
00:17:24
Speaker
Here is funny fart noises. lot of movies are aimed at a younger audience. That is what they're now. And like kids like that. We're adults. These movies aren't made for us. We're never going to get the Citizen Kane Sonic movie. That's not what's going to happen. It's a movie for children and we take what we can from it and we enjoyed it. I can live and hope, damn it. Yeah.
00:17:45
Speaker
Sorry, go on. The yeah film noir Big the Cat. Oh, God, doing but don't. Don't give me hope here. Someone get James Cameron on the phone. It was 7pm and Froggy was missing. Who should I have to put up with?
00:17:58
Speaker
ah I put my cigarette out on the wind cell, looking out into the dark night again. When will that Froggy come home? I'm sorry to think he'll never come home. I don't even know where I am. Did you hear about that, by the way? This is a complete side tangent, but did you hear he was supposed to be a cameo in the second film? No. Yeah, no, Big the Cat was supposed to be a cameo. What context?
00:18:20
Speaker
I think they were supposed to have a skeleton at one point. Jesus Christ. Yeah, that's exactly my response to it. was like, oh, that would have been cool. Big the Cat was going to be a cameo. And I was like, yeah, it was just going to be Skeleton. i was like, what? What the hell is wrong with you? Thank God they cut it, mind you. Because we're going to get peak, obviously, with Sonic 4 when he inevitably comes up as the big bad. But ah for legal reasons, that's a joke. He's not in this film, unfortunately. Those kinds of characters, you'd imagine you want to see to Sonic 5. either that or when they start branching out into more tv series i think they'll probably get his own spin-off series oh god that would be so good no it wouldn't oh it would it'd be so bad much just like an angler fishing show with big the cat who would you even get to voice big who would your dream casting be for that no pun intended dream casting ha ha nicholas cage nicholas cage that would be
00:19:14
Speaker
I could see that working. I've gotta get you, Froggy! Tom Holland. Oh no, please. he is turning into the Chris Pratt. Zendaya to play Froggy. That'd be amazing.
00:19:27
Speaker
You'd be like Vin Diesel playing Groot. She used to make ribbit noises. They can't just use one ribbit noise. She used a unique ribbit noise every time. For every language. Yeah. What does a frog sound like in Spanish? rubito. A rubito. But anyway, our fan fiction aside, I have to say, and again, you're going to hear this a lot about the games versus the movies. And don't get me wrong.
00:19:46
Speaker
I do appreciate that the movies are trying to do their own thing and everything, but For the games, you can see that Gerald Robotnik, he was very much a lot more a straight character in comparison to the goofy antics of his, what I say, grandson? Ivo Robotnik. Whereas in this, they seem very much on par until it's suddenly inconvenient. And I know people have said, oh, was just he was manipulating his grandson by acting like an idiot and things. No, I disagree with that, Clay. I think they are supposed to be pretty much identical. Because that whole dance sequence in the middle, there is no way you would put that on as an act to get someone on your side. See if you were trying to get me on your side to blow up the planet, would you do a dance sequence like that with me? or Yes. This is a hypothetical question for legal reasons.
00:20:35
Speaker
but it did seem a bit goofy. And this is something that Adam and I talked about when we were speculating about what the third film would entail when we were reviewing the second film. and And I don't know, i kind of wish that they cast a different actor for Gerald Robotnik. What do you think about that? like I think Jim Carrey did a great job as both, but I don't know. what I don't think that they could have had the serious with the comical with that character. What are your thoughts? No, I think they did the right thing. liked...
00:21:04
Speaker
how they portrayed Gerald in every way but what I said earlier about the need for a bit more of emotional moment with Maria. i think without that, it just becomes the same character and you don't really gain that kind of motivation for his revenge. You're completely right. Literally and figuratively, you did have two of the same characters on screen.
00:21:23
Speaker
It almost reminds me of, and I think it's just because I've watched this film recently, but have you seen Trolls? The first one... Yeah, uh-huh. I have with my pieces a long time ago, yeah. You know that really awkward scene where it's like they ask that troll why he doesn't sing anymore, and then he just yells about one of his relatives dying out of nowhere? It turned into a meme, but you know at the end where he's like, oh, you're no Maria to Robotnik and everything? and you're thinking, I mean, that is a cold line, that is brutal, but there's not as much weight behind it, other than obviously assuming that they had a very good relationship and even the exposition that they said, oh, it brings her everywhere, etc.
00:22:00
Speaker
But the other weird thing about it is, and I don't know if you felt this way as well, no worry, I do have positives about this film, but did you feel the pacing, at least in the first half of the film, was like really off? Like it was very slow. No, the opposite. It was really fast, but not in a good way, quite choppy. I can't say I noticed that. I don't think it was badly paced. They kind of jumped from the forests to they're now in Tokyo a little bit. Well, I wouldn't say it's the worst pacing I've ever seen in a film, because I have seen many terrible films with significantly worse pacing, but it's just, I felt as if, and maybe it's because I've seen the trailer so many times, but it felt as if it was almost like a checklist of, oh, look, you're Sonic. in the forest now here's sonic in tokyo oh now this character's dead like when they went to the chow cafe which have to admit i did appreciate because of the chow gardens and the games and everything think that's the closest we're ever gonna get to having the chow gardens back
00:22:56
Speaker
either in the games or the film but i thought that was a really cool callback but then they had that meeting with the gun general literally it was a poochie moment where it was like i must go the script is telling me to and it's like general walters or whatever his name is died on the way back to i don't know the chow cafe you're like yeah and i know they obviously have to keep it going quite fast i had seen the chow garden promo stuff prior to the movie but when he said we need to go somewhere safe I thought they were going to go to Olive Garden maybe the sponsorship for that's run out maybe for those who aren't aware there was a weird multiple callback joke in the first Sonic movie about Olive Garden being an amazing place to go and the general gives Tom and Maddie a gift card to Olive Garden and it's not even like a large gift card it's like $20 something
00:23:45
Speaker
It is a funny joke, but at the same time, it's clearly product placement. You're like, eww. Yes, it's very much a case of Paramount. use that That's probably how they funded the redesign for sonic they're like shit Call all the random chain Italian restaurants you can think of. We need some money for this project.
00:24:02
Speaker
you know what's a crime, actually? That they didn't get at the Sonic restaurant? People have mentioned this before, about how has there not been a collaboration? I guess there was already maybe a legal back and forth with the Sega and that restaurant chain, so they might not have the best of terms with each other. I'm not going to lie, for the longest time I genuinely thought that they were linked together in some way. Yes, when I first heard of the restaurant chain I thought that it was linked to Sonic the Hedgehog and quickly learned soon after that that was not the case. I went to one actually in the went run in Vancouver.
00:24:34
Speaker
was alright. And again, both of us being of course British and you being in Canada, we don't really have as many of these restaurants. Well I say that, but there's a lot of American restaurants now coming over. Like Taco Bell's only just came over in the last couple of years. Denny's as well, which was not well received. We even got a Popeye's here at one point. All three of those things you've mentioned are terrible.
00:24:56
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. Why they're coming, I don't know about. You know what I mean in no end? Do tell. We got Prêt-a-Manger over here. And I was like, we've got a million terrible coffee places over here already. Bring Greg's. Why no Greg's?
00:25:09
Speaker
I want Greg's. I don't know, maybe Greg's just needs a flag. He'll just go to America and be like, okay, this shop's ours. And then they'll just expand like a, I don't want to call them a parasite, but you know what mean? Well, that's the thing. Like, sounds like the perfect match for North America. i do not understand how handheld meat pies haven't become such a popular option.
00:25:27
Speaker
And but it just isn't. There just is nothing like that. It's terrible. Anyway, next week's episode will be a chouch on why there's no pies in the America. Yeah, I don't actually think there's much product placement as far as I remember. I could be totally blanking out American-centric stuff, unless there's one where Sonic looks down at the camera and drinks out a Pepsi can or something, or goes to Pizza Hut. But yeah, going back to that particular scene, yeah, I just kind of felt as if they didn't really linger on it. And then, of course, they introduced, what's her face? Was it General Miller or something like that? I can't even remember. It was a very familiar name to me. I felt like I've heard that.
00:26:05
Speaker
in like a game maybe i don't know i couldn't recognize her at all because the thing is with gun they're very much a side antagonist next to eggman it doesn't matter whether you're playing as team dark or team sonic or whatever there's always going to be well not always but usually at the other end of you've got gun trying to prevent some kind of catastrophe which they do try to But I feel was ah especially for these films, they're kind of the comedic villains.
00:26:34
Speaker
You know, you've got the serious villain in Gerald, and then you've got the Team Rocket, or not Team Rocket, but you know i mean, the bumbling ones. Director Rockwell. Director Rockwell, that's it, thank you. I genuinely cannot remember her name because she kind of just appears and then disappears. And no offence to the actress because she does is a good job, all things considered, with her character. Yeah, Kristen Ritter is there in the movie. She doesn't really do anything particularly interesting, but the role is recall for it. And again, it's a kid's movie. Although then again, she has the butt of a very funny politically incorrect joke. Do you remember that?
00:27:08
Speaker
No, which one was that? When they are trapped in the gun vault and Robotnik says, oh I can't believe this, obviously meaning that he can't believe i've got caught. And Gerald saying, I know a woman in the military. Oh, right, yeah. The way I spat my drink, I'm not gonna lie, I did not expect a joke like that in this film. I was like, oh my god. Yeah, I guess it's supposed to be like a fish out of water, kind of, he's from a different time kind of thing.
00:27:35
Speaker
But it also seemed kind odd because he also seemed to have been keeping up movies and TV shows the last 50 years, it's not like he's completely ignorant of how times have progressed because he had watched all the things that Ivo had brought up to him when they were going back and forth on references. I feel as if with Gerald there is a lot of inconsistencies and again that this is obviously nitpicking because at the end of the day I think overall he was done quite well but there are a lot of inconsistencies that they don't know whether to make him this evil scientist or this kind of broken genius or they just want him as the kind of funny parallel to Robotnik. kind of feels all over the place but again i think it holds together just enough you know that way that it is not enough for me to go oh the film's ruined you know Gerald and never again kind of thing but yeah speaking of that though can we go on to a positive here about both the actors and the voice actors for this film yeah for sure because I have to say I think
00:28:29
Speaker
everybody did a fantastic job. We've of course got Ben Schwartz back as O'Shaughnessy as Tails, Idris Elba coming back as Knuckles as great as ever. Colleen is the only one who's reprised from the games as well, isn't she? Yeah, i don't know how to feel about like there's a whole discussion about this with celebrities taking over voice acting jobs and I feel as if that's probably only going to get worse when Sonic 4 comes out.
00:28:58
Speaker
They'll get in a actor or an actress to voice these new characters rather than, I don't want to say a proper voice actor or voice actress because I do think that the characters here, they do a fantastic job as is because we've also got Keanu Reeves who debuts as Shadow and I have to say, I thought his shadow was pretty good in this. Yeah, to be honest, I knew it was Keanu Reeves going in, but couldn't have told you that from just how he sounded. i think that he took over that role very well. Keanu Reeves is a pretty old actor now, yeah but he didn't sound like an old actor was playing that role. He sounded very much like he fit in with the kind of young voices of the other characters. Likewise with Idris Elba, Idris Elba's knuckles sounds quite childlike, which I think is very impressive for, again, an actor who probably is a similar age, if not even older, than Keanu Reeves.
00:29:43
Speaker
And the thing I do love about this film, at least behind the scenes, that they all seem to be really enjoying themselves with it. You know, you've got Idris Elba, I've seen him behind the scenes with the big knuckles gloves that he's wearing as he's doing the voice recording. Yes. love that again Keanu he is just absolutely throwing himself into it even at the premieres and things like that you can tell they're all really excited to be there you know that way you get press releases and things and obviously we don't know the actors personally or anything but you know when you get really awkward ones where they're all kind of sitting around and it's like oh tell me about this film and they just kind of want to get it over with as soon as possible yeah they don't really have much passion for the project Yeah, where they're just like, oh yeah, it's a film, and then they bring out any excuse about, oh, it's a dramatic thriller, blah blah blah, but for this one, genuinely, they do seem to be absolutely having a ball with it. I think they're absolutely amazing. The one standout that I want to shout out as and I think his name is Lee Majdub, who plays Agent Stone. Yes.
00:30:50
Speaker
He loves that role. Oh, yeah. I saw a post recently about how he was having a private screening and that he goes and meets the fans and that kind stuff. I'm sure this is the biggest project that he has done. can't say I know him from any other role, so it might be that thinks this has made his career. But I've not seen any of the actors quite as into their role as he is. Would you believe? think he was in Assassin's Creed at one point. Oh, like the Assassin's Creed movie with... Oh, no, the game. Oh, the game. Oh, he was a voice actor. yeah no he was in the assassin's creed's mirage which i'm going to be honest i haven't followed assassin's creed for a hot minute but he was in that he was also in star wars outlaws as well well oh dear that game didn't get received particularly well he's mostly a voice actor from the looks of things oh he was in the dragon prince as well i did see that at the right top yeah i don't know that character though wife i watch dragon prince i'm very into it he might be that it's a character we've not met yet because we've not finished the latest season it just came out quite recently we were busy over christmas time Busy watching Sonic 3, of course. Of course, I'm too busy watching Sonic 3. Yeah, no, he seems to have been in a few things when say voice acting, which is interesting. In all seriousness, I do love how passionate he is about it, because as you said, he does really communicate a lot with the fans, and I've seen him do a lot of collaborations with them. as well like a lot of the bigger sonic creators there's a guy i can't remember his name think it's jack botnick or something like that it's a guy who dresses up as egg man but you know the old egg man with the big circular body and everything and he's moaning about not having a chaos emerald and then all of a sudden leave mad student comes out of nowhere and just gives him the emerald and then he says oh where's my latte and he sulks off saying it's never enough for you I think those kind interactions and things and the positivity that he brings to the fan base is just absolutely incredible to see because when I saw the first film, he wasn't bad, but he was just kind of there beside Jim Carrey. I don't think he did a bad job or anything, but it was the second film where he really came into his element and of course by the third one. I'm not going to lie, one of his scenes actually made me tear up, but we will get on to that. The only other thing that want to praise, before we talk about the finale, the only other thing I want to praise about this film is just how dedicated it was to the amount of references and easter eggs. Did you pick up on a lot of these when you were watching it? I'm sure I picked up some of them.
00:33:06
Speaker
It did make me smile seeing some of the easter eggs. I can't think of them the top head right now because it's been like a week since I saw it. There was a lot of moments where i was like, oh, this is a very nice kind of homage to the games do you have any in specific that you want to reference well at the beginning you've got the you know at the end of certain stages we had the sign it's been yeah that was one of my big ones that really made me smile when he did that there was also a lot of references and callbacks for obvious reasons to sonic adventure 2 which I absolutely adored.
00:33:36
Speaker
This is me going into full fanboy mode here. At the very beginning, when we open up with Shadow and Maria, and Shadow thinking back to his time with Maria, and she's playing Love and Learn, which is the main theme of Sonic Adventure 2, my god, the smile on my face, it did not go away for a good while. I was just like, oh my god, that is... Perfect.
00:33:55
Speaker
There was also a quote, see, when they were in the helicopter and Sonic says, no food or movies, we're out of here. That's, of course, a nearly word for word quote of what he says to the gun, the helicopter, and, again, Sonic Adventure
Game References in Sonic 3
00:34:09
Speaker
2. There's just a lot of references to that game. And honestly, I loved every single one. There was also, you know, the bio-wizard, the big lizard that you have to fight in Sonic Adventure 2? Made of, like, water? No, it's the one that attaches itself to the space station at the end of the game. Oh, yeah. Well, apparently there was a reference to that, which I didn't pick up on initially, but as you know when they're watching the kaiju movie, apparently that was meant to be the bio-lizard, and I thought, oh, okay. Okay, fair enough. Yeah, really blink and you miss it kind of scene, but genuinely I thought all of those were absolutely fantastic, and of course they finally got the music score right. Yes, I want to touch on that just briefly. Better than they had done for previous movies, they understood the sonic assignment for the music. Particularly when they jump out of that helicopter down to Tokyo and you've got this butt rock playing. It felt very sonic-y.
00:35:00
Speaker
Sonic game. It got me very hyped up as like a 29 year old man in the cinema. Did you pick up the song that was playing on Robotnik's, I want to say handphone, you know, when he's on his phone?
00:35:11
Speaker
Yeah, is is it the Green Hill music? No, it's his theme from, again, Sonic Adventure 2, where it's literally called Eggman. And it was played for literally two seconds, but was just like, oh my god, they did it. But they didn't, of course, play more of it, which was a bit of a sin. the music that Maria was listening to was The Shadow, was that not also a reference to something?
00:35:33
Speaker
I think, but could be wrong. The thing about these films is at least for the first one, they barely had any music from the games. The second ones, they kind of had touches of it. They had a little bit more, but not as much. And then in the third one, this one, they have Again, I wouldn't say they overwhelm you with it, but they do have a lot more gaming scores on it. But then also they have to put in their own outdated songs, like g when Robotnik and Gerald are dancing and they have that song, which is, i don't even know, I can't remember what that song's called, but that is definitely A, not a Sonic song and B, not really a new song, is it? No, I can't.
00:36:13
Speaker
think of it i remember when adam and i were discussing the second one and he was really angry or not angry but annoyed because they had uptown funk and it and he couldn't understand why that was the song that they chose considering at the time of that film coming out i think it came out in 2015 i want to say that's all or really really early in comparison to when the film came out two years ago so or technically three years ago but yeah i think uptown funk came in like 2013 That movie came out in what, 2021, 2022? 2022, yeah. Yeah, so at that point, nine-year-old pop song. Who are you aiming that towards? I mean, again, maybe the children liked it. But the children wouldn't know that song, though. In the Knuckle series, it atrocious for that, because as far as I remember, I don't think they have any songs from the games but i kid you not here they get to this vegas bowling ring or something can't remember where is it's like nevada or somewhere but they end up playing robbie williams let me entertain you for one of the characters coming in and i remember just sitting there thinking who is this for is essentially the question because i mean kids won't know this song and the people who are old enough to know it probably won't be watching this and the ones that are i'm sorry you had to suffer through it and but the music choices I have to admit are a bit bizarre except for one major one and that brings us on to the finale so are you ready to dive into this?
00:37:37
Speaker
I am but I have one quick question about is in the Knuckles series where Wade says like flames of disaster that is the one yeah Okay, because I was waiting throughout this entire movie for that scene. I thought it was going to be in this movie for some reason. And I was like, that doesn't happen at any point. Where are the flames of disaster? you want to know a fun fact about that? The flames of disaster in relation to the games? What? So the flames of disaster comes from Sonic 06.
00:38:03
Speaker
Amazing. The best game. Well, of course, but you know what's even worse about it? The Flames of Disaster isn't a Knuckles move or anything. It's basically the combination. Like, there's a huge war reason. But anyway, it's a huge cataclysm event where if these two deities combine together, then these Flames of Disaster literally destroy the entire world. So when the Knuckles series came along, and again, spoilers for the Knuckles series, they had the one episode which, ironically enough, is the best.
00:38:32
Speaker
episode of the series where they have Wade dressed up as Knuckles and the rest all of them are puppets and they have the main antagonist from or one of the main monsters from Sonic 06 browsing Facebook marketplace and that's where Knuckles learns the flames of disaster. exactly. I wouldn't know how to respond to that either. Why are you to watch the series? Is it worth watching? Well, it's got Michael Bolton singing at one point.
00:39:01
Speaker
i mean do love me some michael walton i genuinely don't know i mean not to shout myself out here but i do have an episode of chat to shorts on it i'm gonna be honest i don't know who the show was for because sonic fans are gonna be confused non-sonic fans think are gonna be even more confused it's like a kids friendly kind of show yes kind of there's no kids in it is it just adults and knuckles isn't in it very much from what understand Yeah, because it's expensive. But what's actually hilarious is, if you're looking behind the scenes for it, they obviously have to have a stand-in to get the actors to look in the right direction. And in some scenes, he's just a puppet. It's the same with Shadow in this film as well. You see Maria holding the tank. And behind the tank, Shadow is a muppet. And it is amazing. And that's what people are saying. They're like, release the puppet. Cut off something. Honestly, if the Muppets did Sonic, I would be 100% behind it. I think I must have said this in our previous Muppets Action's Car episode. There needs to be more Muppets movies. Oh, there does. Muppets in general, yes. But like Muppets making their own version of existing properties needs to happen more. And if Sonic is the first one, I'm down. Gonzo playing Sonic, amazing. You know that show that's on Amazon just now, think it's called Secret Levels, where it's like an anthology series for video games, and they take a random video game and then they create a short 10 minute film, or wouldn't say film, but you know, a 10 minute episode based on that game. They should do that with the Muppets.
00:40:30
Speaker
They just choose different games. And instead of being hyper-realistic motion tracking and whatnot, they should just have the Muppets instead. Anyway, sorry, they getting off topic, but our shattered dreams aside, yeah, will we go on to the finale of this film, aka the point that I utterly fanboyed out? Yeah, let's go to it.
00:40:49
Speaker
Yeah, because of course you get that really weird scene where Sonic gets the Chaos Emeralds from Wade, the flames of disaster Whipple. He's playing a hockey with it. Because I think the reference when Knuckles says, oh, I left it with a very brave warrior. Again, weirdly enough, that's a reference to the Knuckles show because Wade wants to be the bowling champion or some rubbish and he teaches him how to become a warrior. And honestly, I'll send you the link where to see it, by the way. It's just, it's weird. So he gets the Chaos Emeralds, he tries to beat down Keanu Shadow, and of course Shadow is taking none of it. Shianu. Shianu, exactly. I did actually like the, and don't know if this was intentional or not as a reference, but there's a scene where Supersonic is trying to absolutely hand his ass to him, but then Shadow knocks the Chaos Emeralds out of him. I know, was like, Jesus, that was extreme. I don't know if that's a reference, though, to Sonic 3, because at the very beginning of Sonic 3, the one for the Mega Drive, there's a scene where Super Sonic, at the very beginning, he's flying through Angel Island, and then Knuckles comes out of nowhere and punches the emeralds out of him. So I don't know if that was meant to be a kind of cheeky nod to that or not. Maybe not. think should have done that move where he, for no reason, just flips and kicks the back of Sonic's head. We're waiting for that for the fourth film. who isn't he does that too it's a time travel yeah it's little bit time traveling hedgehog aka trunks the hedgehog yeah he is trunks isn't he they love being dragon ball because they've already got the goku and virginia-ness and the super seagull and all that kind of stuff honestly you should have been on the internet at the time when sonico 6 came out and silver dropped because amount of dragon ball references and things that came out it was beautiful going on to the finale we've of course got the big fight that they've advertised Very heavily, surprisingly, where they're fighting across the world. And it is very Dragon Ball-esque. It's actually a lot more Dragon Ball than Dragon Ball Evolution. Oh, yeah. They pulled it off very well, actually. Surprisingly so. And I know technically you could say, oh, it's because it's animation, but they still have to, relatively, again, be a bit grounded when they're trying to fight
CGI and Live-Action Blending
00:42:57
Speaker
one another. That's something want to touch on just very quickly as well. Over all three of these movies, they managed to pair... computer-generated animation with the live-action setting better than I think I've seen least from any movie in the last decade. It fits so well whilst having beautiful vibrant colors. When the three of Sonic, Knuckles, and Tails are on screen, it should look wrong with these super vibrant colored CGI animals in a realistic setting, but they fit so well. It looks beautiful. The colours are beautiful. was pretty in awe of how well they managed to do this and that it becomes a template for how you can incorporate video game adaptations like this.
00:43:34
Speaker
Yeah, really surprising how good this film looks because even at the very beginning where Shadow fights the G.U.N. agents and everything, again, you know it's obviously a cartoon hedgehog but you can kind of believe that he's there in the scene. It doesn't feel as if you get the really dodgy animation and whatnot, and even when he's standing in Tokyo and he's got the wet fur and whatnot. And funny enough, they actually reference, see the Shadow of the Hedgehog game, something didn't bring up earlier, but see the scene where he beats up Team Sonic and then Sonic collapses in front of him and he's holding the gun.
00:44:07
Speaker
The actual, well, the laser gun, obviously they have to have. That's taken from the intro of Shadow the Hedgehog, fun fact. Yes, so he has the gun, he has the motorbike and stuff, that i thought that was very... that seemed to be a reference as well that i thought was fun. What is with his teleportation powers?
00:44:21
Speaker
So, I don't know how they're gonna explain it in the movie universe, but it's basically he can harness the power of the Chaos Emerald. That's what it is in the games, that he takes a Chaos Emerald, yells Chaos Control, and that means it means he can manipulate time and teleport in places. Oh, right, okay.
00:44:40
Speaker
So I thought he was just like Sonic was running fast as well, but just edgy. But he can actually manipulate time with chaos energy. I think in the films, they just say he's got a lot of stored up chaos energy. Like with Sonic, you know, when his eyes turn blue in this one, which is something they've only started doing. Weirdly enough, they did that in Sonic Frontiers, where his eyes turn blue. If you get the maximum amount rings, and then you can go faster and things like that. It's interesting they're going that route. I didn't expect them to copy it. film for that but yeah it's probably just that that he's just got a heck of a lot of energy he's got the zoomies is what i'm saying the chaos zoomies to be able to do that kind of thing but of course because of that at the very end you've got the fight between them and it looks absolutely gorgeous and then you've got shadow and sonic
00:45:28
Speaker
fighting one another and it's probably the best part of the film if not one of the best parts where after this fight and Shadow starts goading him and mocking him saying kill me because I killed your friend even though he didn't because again PG film and then they have a really nice heart to heart on the moon which I never thought they would do But actually, that was a scene that I didn't tear up, but my partner teared up at that because they brought back, i can't remember but the exact quote, but you know, about the stars, even though they might be dead, their light still shines and everything in relation to Maria. It was actually really... quite beautiful for that i genuinely i was really taken aback because i thought see when they want to be serious without you know being uber dark and edgy they genuinely can be serious which they do kind of spoil later on but before we get on to that particular scene because i think you know the scene i'm going to talk about what did you think about that whole sequence see when they finally get together and then they you know they do the predator hand clap
00:46:28
Speaker
and they turn super together other than the fact that looks absolutely incredible what were your thoughts on that? my first thought was how do they breathe on the moon? think that's established in the games but why? i don't know yeah I i was thinking initially I was like oh okay they're in their supersonic kind of mode that probably protects them allows them to breathe in space. And then they were just like chilling there, not in super sonic mode. And i was like, oh, so they can just do that then. But no, when they both sort teamed up, went all super sonic-y and went and tried to stop the laser beam, it was a very cool scene. It was pretty hype. And then they teamed up with Eggman pushed the laser beam away from the Earth. And it then chops off the bottom of the moon. Nothing was mentioned after that. So that, A, would affect the tides and make tsunamis and stuff happen. Chat tsunamis, if you will.
00:47:13
Speaker
but Very good. And B, are those moon bits that are just going to fall onto into the Earth now and cause a similar level of destruction to what you just avoided? Ah, it's fine. ah Because, to be honest, I thought that this is something, again, that happens in Sonic Adventure 2, where Dr. Eggman gets control of the Space Colony Ark and he fires the Eclipse Cannon into the moon. It's a low-powered setting because he puts in one Chaos Emerald. He's like, hey guys, check out what I can do. And he fires it at the moon as a kind of warning and then blows up a huge chunk of the moon, which is such a cool scene. But of course, in this film, they get rid of the Space Colony arc completely and then they just have a super weapon under the Thames River. Don't know how they feel about that, I'm going to be honest.
00:47:56
Speaker
Yeah, I also questioned how they managed to build that. I get it's a sonic foam and everything, suspension of disbelief. Oh, there's a super weapon, but under London? Really? London? Famously, there's an underground rail network down there, so it'd be pretty difficult to fit in a secret base where your giant space thing is, which had to be less wide than the width of the Thames River, though, so it can't really have been that big. But then you see it, and it's massive. Oh yeah, it's like the size of London.
00:48:25
Speaker
Although what I did love, and I was actually creeped out by it, was see the broadcast that they do from the yeah ah from the news anchors, and it's like, ah, that's great journalism there, where it's like, okay, nobody panic, guys, but there's a super weapon that's just been stolen. We're all gonna die.
00:48:42
Speaker
How you doing? And I thought, Jesus Christ, they are really not calming people down there. Yeah, and they were like, everyone stay inside. I'll be honest, I'd probably ask them to evacuate, maybe go to a bunker or something. going to be honest, Chief, I don't think that's a great idea. of That scene where they shoot them in, I genuinely thought they were going to shoot them in before that scene.
00:48:59
Speaker
And I know it's a reference to the games and everything, but they also show it in the trailer. See, you're saying all these things have given away, but I didn't see any of this. Again, I think it's more a paramount problem with their PR that they give you nothing and then they give you too much if you keep looking at it. And I know obviously I could avoid it by not watching it, but if you're constantly exposed to these particular trailers, there's a lot that they reveal that they probably shouldn't. have but yeah going back to that obviously gerald has that really cruel line of saying oh i never loved you oh maria was better than you and everything which i thought was really chilling and i thought oh this is going to be a really again emotional moment you cut between quite possibly one of the coolest things that sonic has ever produced versus one of the lamest things that sonic's ever produced as i said you've got the predator high five And they turn super and they destroy all the robots, which again, they are modeled after the ones from the games, the GUN robots.
00:49:57
Speaker
And it was so damn cool. And you've got live and learn blasted
Team-Up Scenes vs. Inconsistent Tones
00:50:01
Speaker
in the background. I was just so happy. And then my happiness reached a crescendo and it reached a peak. And then it immediately dipped when I saw Jim Carrey spanking himself. I do have say that was very weird scene. I'm not quite sure why they did that. I mean, I still laughed, but I laughed quite confused, you know, that way where you're like, that was a choice. I just hated that whole sequence, you know, when it kept cutting back Robotnik versus Gerald and they were using the nanobots as arachnid. you're like why are you fighting like a mantis versus a scorpion why did that have to be the climax of the film i mean don't get me wrong i did find it funny the way gerald died in it where it was very much as if a fly was being swatted or zapped rather but yeah i did not like that i felt as if it was a bit much oh yeah that was very odd scene the way praying mantis versus
00:50:51
Speaker
scopion thing it was a very weird back and forth fighting and again then you get the two coolest scenes with sonic and shadow teaming up posing for posters and the camera and everything and then it cuts back to them and you're just like i don't want to see this because something didn't notice was they definitely seemed to be moving away from the human characters did you notice this and by human characters i mean like tom and maddie and wade especially but you know they were moving away from those kind of characters except for obviously the main scene where they infiltrate gun but did you notice that yes that was good because that was main criticisms in the second one we spent so much time with Maddie's sister Rachel I don't care about her she was funny in the small clips we had over in the first one the amount of attention we gave to her and her relationship with that agent was so bizarre and then i was like oh we've not had her in this movie at all that's great and then for some reason Maddie turns into her is she made an agent at the end of the second one or in the agent of knuckles thing is that I have no idea genuinely that confused because I know her partner is a gun agent but I don't know she was Yeah, need why would you impersonate her? Fortunately, don't really get to spend a lot of scenes with those human characters. And I have to say, even the ones that we do spend with Tom and Maddie, aka Donut Lord, at least they didn't feel like they overstayed their welcome. Yeah, they kind of allowed the other characters showcase a bit more. that we As you say, we weren't bringing them into quite the same level of spotlight, which was nice that we are moving away from the need for that, that we can just kind of let the CGI animals do their thing. Because, I mean, to be honest, in my ideal vision of a Sonic film, I really wish they would just go all into the world of Sonic. Like into Morbius?
00:52:39
Speaker
Mobius. Mobius, sorry, into like Mobius. I got really bad. It's Mobian time. time! Garagol Mobius. More like that. Because the games do kind of play about with humans in the world of Sonic, along with the anthropomorphic creatures.
00:52:55
Speaker
But at the same time, you know, it's kind of all fictionalised and whatnot. So having the real world and having to apply realism to all these cartoon hedgehogs and echidnas and foxes and whatnot, it kind of limits it in the way. but for what the film set out to achieve, especially with this film, I do think that they incorporated it in a really interesting and quite a good way. Especially when it came to the finale, where Shadow decides to push the space colony away, Robotnik ends up getting blown up for, what, the third time?
Emotional Depth and Character Portrayal
00:53:28
Speaker
That's funny. Okay, maybe the second time. In the first one, he gets sent to the Mushroom World. You you kind of be like, all right, he was pushed into the Mushroom World. He didn't die going into there. But the second one, he died. And the third one, he died. And apparently he's to come back for the fourth one, or at least Jim Carrey wants to. Which will be amazing if it does, to be honest. But... I have to admit, I got quite misty eyed over that scene, and I can't believe that was the scene that got me, because the Maria one, you know, when they're talking about the light dying and everything, that was quite emotional. But see, when he was giving Agent Stone nice words of encouragement, saying Slaskin, buy and whatnot i think that just caught me off guard because and the again the agent stone isn't sonic character he's not part of the games or the extended lore or whatever yet can't believe i'm making this comparison but he's almost become like you know harley quinn and batman that they've become such a popular character in one medium that you kind of hope that they appear in other things what want agent stone to appear in the games
00:54:22
Speaker
Well, I honestly wouldn't mind if he did, to be honest. You know, in Sonic Adventure 2, where you choose different teams, like Team Sonic, Team Shadow, like Team Agent Starrows. Honestly, I'm all for Team Latte. Let's go.
00:54:35
Speaker
I do think that he does have a good enough personality to be able to be at least endearing, because we have had that the past with, I think it's Sonic Satiem, where had Eggman as just this horrible, horrible overlord, and you had, think his name was Snively, and there was this really weird person who just followed him around, and he was Robotnik's assistant. So, I mean, there's a precedent there. He could have easily been in it, but genuinely, going back to that scene, I genuinely thought that was so heartbreaking. But you know, as soon as that scene's over, you know that he's going to be coming back anyway. I think it was just the fact that the two characters are just so well portrayed. Because I have to say, I didn't really expect to like Jim Carrey as Robotnik initially. You didn't? When I heard he was going to get cast, I kind of thought, oh, it's going to be Jim Carrey as himself. It's not really going to be Dr. Eggman, it's going to be Jim Carrey, and he's going to be, oh, look at me, I'm Jim Carrey. But
00:55:31
Speaker
The way he changed it and made it his own, he's very much his own Eggman, but I have to admit, I really like the way he plays Eggman, especially, although it was a bit of a disgusting scene, but you know when he's watching the telenovelas and his giant egg crab, I think it's called, which have to admit that was a pretty funny scene but I actually don't know and this is something I don't know if you've seen the meme about Shadow Latinas have you seen this? Shadow Latinas? no Shadow and Latinas there was a video made by someone called think it's Jet his name is but he does a lot of dubs of clips from the Sonic games and he puts his own jokes over it like Sonic and Shadow fighting one another yelling that it's pronounced gif not jif etc you know like really silly shitpost videos but one of them was shadow is fighting sonic and sonic says why do you want to go to mexico so bad and the punchline is just shadow turns around and says because sonic i just love latinas and then he just disappears and that joke honestly grew arms and legs oh god that triggers me so bad because why
00:56:39
Speaker
When my wife, my sister-in-law and I were heading to Toronto for Fan Expo this past summer, there was a gentleman at the train station with us while we were waiting for the train to go to Toronto who was also going to Fan Expo and was trying to sort of start a conversation with us, particularly me. He clearly was a bit neurodivergent and he kept trying to talk about his interest in Sonic. Well, trust him as me in disguise, though.
00:57:06
Speaker
Particularly, he was talking about how he wants to be a voice actor. Some of his favorite bits are from this one video thing. And then it was that exact reference you just made about the Latinas thing. And he said it to so loud right next to us in a very crowded area. And like it was such a weird, gross thing to say. i was like, oh no, people are going to think I'm with him. And they're going to think yeah and I'm also enjoying the Shadow X Latinas community. beauty goes Oh, okay, please leave. Yeah, that's what that's from. Because I have to say, i don't think even the guy who made it expected it to take off. I think it was, you know, one of those things where you post it online and you go, oh, what a funny video. That's never going to be mentioned again. And then...
00:57:52
Speaker
Of course. Unfortunately, with the Sonic fan base, if they, and no offense to the Sonic fan base, because I made several episodes on the series, and I'm sure you're a bunch of lovely folk, but when they get their hands on a particular joke that they really like, it's never going away. The other one was that Snapcube dub, which I don't know if you've heard about it, but by chance was this gentleman talking about pissing on the moon? I think it was only the Latinas one that i remember.
00:58:20
Speaker
so i don't know A lot of Sonic fans reference that particular dub. To the annoyance of some other fans, but that's a whole other conversation. It's like a bridged almost dub of the game for Sonic Adventure 2. It's a very interesting artifact, let's just say. don't know if that was meant to be a joke when Shadow's getting into the telenovelas and things, or it's just like a really, really weird coincidence.
00:58:45
Speaker
Although I do a love his line, see when Agent Stone turns around says, come on, we're going to make Glock. shadow turns around and goes revenge guac then eventually going off of that the world is saved and everything they have the party and everybody for some reason was really angry about the credit song i don't know if you saw that no there's any discourse about that i think it was just a vocal minority where they're like oh it doesn't fit blah blah the usual but then of course we've got the after credit scenes which before we finish up will we talk about them briefly yes I should prefer saying i only saw one of them but I did read what the second one was after that because I had to leave the cinema to meet up with people and also I was desperate for the toilet by that point. This is a running theme with you isn't it?
00:59:29
Speaker
I did go to the toilet once during the movie so I didn't want to miss a single single bit of it i had drunk and obsce amount of soda so I was like I need to go so bad it was touch and go towards the end of that film genuinely do you just go into the cinema and you're like your largest coke please just the size of your head I went to the cinema with my wife and her family they went to go see Wicked and their movie was like an hour longer than mine and so we timed it so that my film was my film screening was one that started an hour later than theirs and so I had to kill an hour prior to that so I went to get some food and had a drink
01:00:02
Speaker
And then went to the cinema and got my popcorn and and drink. And the drink machine was out of Coke. I had get Fanta. I was like, all right, whatever. And then by the time the movie was about to start, I'd already finished my drink. And i was like, oh, crap. So I had to run out. I ran out and managed to get a Coke, get back in the theater and sit down before the film started. And so I had essentially three things of soda over the course of the film. And so I was needing to pee real bad. Push your mess, Saruman. Yes.
01:00:28
Speaker
um There was no Sonic miss. The only thing I missed was Shadow picking up his rings at the second end credit thing. I saw the first one, which involves Sonic finally doing his race again, and then defeating the Metal Sonics, which I thought were they were going to tease a new big bad. like, oh, that's weird that they bring in this key villain for an end credit scene here, but he's already going to face off against him, but then just easily defeat him. And then Amy arrived and smashed up all the extra Metal Sonics.
01:00:52
Speaker
So we got the introduction of Amy, which is pretty cool. Do you know the confirmed voice actor for Amy is? No, as far as I know, and that's something that was kind of alluding to before about future voice actors and actresses.
01:01:04
Speaker
I genuinely think they're probably going to go the celebrity route. I kind of hope they don't, but you know what it's like, see, for these particular films. You know that they're obviously going to try and get a celebrity as long as they obviously have the budget for it. But I don't know if they'll get the actress from the games or, yeah they're just going to get, I don't know, I don't even know who they would cast. I hope it's not someone like Scarlett Johansson or something they just kind of pluck out of a hat. Jennifer Lawrence. Oh no, Chris Pratt. Hey, it's me, I'm Amy.
01:01:36
Speaker
And Zendaya is Amy. said yeah Oh no, oh no. Andrew, you've probably willed one of the worst things in the universe. to reality there it will be zendia won't quite possibly but what was quite funny is i was thinking earlier about the muppets version of sonic miss piggy is amy that'd be amazing frank oz but yeah what are your thoughts on that though for amy's voice acting frank oz other than frank oz don't know it'd be nice if they got like an actual voice actor person to do it rather than just standard Anya Taylor-Joy and then so be it. No offence to her, she's a good actress but I don't know if I could cope with another film like that.
01:02:17
Speaker
but She was pretty medium as Peach. Oh shoot, she was Peach, wasn't she? Yeah. And of course Chris Pratt as himself, I mean as Mario. Okay, so I was very much on board with the hating Chris Pratt as everything train but his Mario was pretty good. See, in all seriousness, as much as a meme as that is, he actually was pretty decent. He wasn't that bad.
01:02:36
Speaker
Anya Taylor-Joy was pretty eh as Peach. Seth Rogen was pretty eh as Donkey Kong. Oh no, he really was as Donkey Kong. Otherwise, voice acting wasn't that bad in that movie. Seth Rogen to play Amy. Seth Rogen to play Big the Cat. Oh no, please don't boil that into the world, please. Froggy. You know they would as well. name Big the Cat a stoner. What if they made Big the Cat Jack Black or something? He's too energetic to play Big the Cat.
01:03:02
Speaker
I yearned for the frogs. Oh, good. One of the things that I'll be interested in for Sonic 4 is what directions. they're gonna take it especially with metal sonic because usually metal sonic he is voiceless but there's a kind of variation of him called neo metal sonic which is essentially just metal sonic with more spikes on his head and he's got like a kick-ass cape honestly it's so edgy but it's so damn cool but he has the voice so i'm assuming they're gonna go that direction maybe were they gonna have one metal sonic controlling them all like ultron because for the third film you could tell that they were obviously taken from sonic adventure 2 the second film they were definitely taken out from sonic 2 and sonic and knuckles for the fourth film obviously it's way too early because this film doesn't come out until 2027 so we have two years left to wait for this film but at the same time i don't know i don't know if they're gonna base it on Sonic CD which is where Metal Sonic came in initially it's gonna be interesting but before we wrap up though what are your predictions though say for the fourth film what are you areling to predictions and your and your thoughts in terms of where they're go with it I don't know, because my kind of knowledge of Sonic is pretty waned over the last couple of decades. I would have been able to quote various other kind of storylines and villains that we could go down the route of, but I don't really remember much anymore. They've explored a lot of the ones am aware of. I think maybe something more to do with Knuckles' Echidna, Temple prophecy kind of stuff, maybe. Introducing people like Silver might be an option. Going back to Mobius.
01:04:40
Speaker
as you'd mentioned, would probably be a decent one. Because ah as you say, we've won three movies and we only were in Mobius for five minutes of the first movie. So with Amy coming in and Tails came over as well. So there must be, oh, they have the rings, I guess. They can just go back anytime. I suspect Amy's going to come over and be like, we need your help. You need come back to Mobius kind of thing.
01:04:59
Speaker
That makes the most sense to me. I did also think that one way of them getting Eggman to survive would be the explosion in the Eclipse Cannon was like maybe charged like chaos energy and teleported him to Mobius or something like that. Because if they're gonna base it off of Sonic CD then the interesting thing about Sonic CD is that they introduced time travel. it which sounds like such a weird thing but there was signs that you could run by and if you run by them fast enough then they either transport you to the past or the future and depending on how you complete the level you can either get a good future or a bad future so the good future would be all the flowers sprouting up oh it's a utopia the bad future would be that it's a complete wasteland it's all robotic and things So I'm wondering if they're doing a thing like that where whatever planet Amy's going to come from has been overrun with Sonics, or hedgehogs, as it were, metal hedgehogs, because there is that throwaway line in Sonic 3 where it says, why do you look like me? So I don't know if they're going to explore hedgehog lore.
01:06:01
Speaker
as it were more or they're just gonna do their own story because mean time travel obviously that would bring back Eggman as it were from the Eclipse canon so there's always an out for them there's always an out for particular characters getting killed off except for Gerald Robotnik obviously like he's gone I think he's genuinely gone for good That's my kind of prediction. Because, say in all seriousness, I genuinely thought they were going to bring in Silver for the end of the third film.
01:06:30
Speaker
No, they can't bring in Silver before bringing in Amy. I'm surprised that we've not seen Rouge the Bat by now, to be honest. Well, there's still time. I think we're gonna see Rouge in the next one. Yeah, probably. I think with Amy, we'll see Rouge. I think Rouge is going to encounter Shadow and they'll have team up.
01:06:44
Speaker
because i think it was meant to be a and again it's all rumors but i think it was supposed to be like a tv show foreshadow that they were planning on doing i don't think they actually you know i've put pen to paper on it yet but i think that is the way they're gonna go to have a series in between films which i would be on board with but i'm to be honest, I just did not like what they did with the Knuckles series. I thought it was quite bizarre and just very aimless in comparison to the films for obvious reasons. What actually did surprise me, and this is a complete side tangent as well, is i think it was called Dark Shadows. It was three animated shorts that were made for the promotion of Sonic X Shadow Generations, the video game, and those were incredibly
01:07:30
Speaker
incredible genuinely those were really good really well animated fitted into the lore of the universe and everything and i just wish we had more of those kind of shows but see to be honest as a kind of concluding point i do think that the films are doing a good job as it is i like the way that they're going with it but I think that people have to realise, myself included, is that these aren't the games. They're basing their stories off the games and things but they're very much doing it in their own way which is a very sonic thing to do I have to say but it'll be interesting to see I think where they take it from here whether they are going to follow the games or they're just going to go off the wall and do something completely different but yeah what are your final thoughts
Franchise Evolution and Future Excitement
01:08:14
Speaker
on that? Not so much more than what we've already said. Just I think that just kind further exploring the Sonic world and Sonic characters, I think that's just going to be the direction we're now going be going. I think we've set a standard with the third one of returning to more of the game-like storylines. And that we're kind of, again, as we were talking about, heading further away from the human characters and kind of getting more into the Sonic characters. I think we'll be seeing more of that to come. And honestly, if you haven't seen this film and you're curious and you don't mind the spoilers you've just heard there, definitely go see this film. Because genuinely, it's honestly amazing how far this particular film franchise has come in the past couple of years. Because, as we said before, you started with the buddy road trip, along with the ugly design, you thought there is no way this is going to take off, it's just going to be relegated to the footnote of terrible video game adaptations. And yet, now four years later, are technically six years later, god, that's depressing. Six years later from when they released the first Sonic film, we've now got a franchise that is very, very sh strong. And...
01:09:19
Speaker
Honestly, it'll all be interesting to see where they go from here. Whether they go the Disney route. it Just start pumping different shows and different characters and to see how far they'll take that particular aspect. But you know Can't wait for it. Genuinely can't wait for it. In case anybody was wondering, yeah, absolutely love this film. Go watch it. Without any further ado, Andrew, thank you so, so much for on this episode to discuss Sonic 3. No problem. I'm glad I finally got do a Sonic episode with you you. know it's a topic that is dear to your heart, i' but so I'm glad got to be a part of it. Yeah, it's been a long time in the making, hasn't it? We've been talking about it for ages, and I'm like, you know, Father Ted, the go on, go on, go on. Before we wrap up, where can these amazing Pandalorians listening find your content? Pandalorians can find me on many previous episodes of Chatsunami. We've done lots of episodes, including several Christmas-themed episodes and whatnot recently, and other themed month episodes we've got. And also, you can find myself, Satsunami, Mara McAllister, and Robotic Battletoaster on the D&D role-playing podcast series Stop, Drop, and Roll Initiative, which can be found, again, where all good podcasts are, and on Twitter, at SDRiPod.
01:10:30
Speaker
So please do follow us on there. And without further ado, you want to do some more plugs, Satsy? Oh, I would love to. So yeah, as Andrew was saying there, if you want to check out more episodes from ourselves, then you can check us out on our website, chatsanami.com, as well as all good podcast apps.
01:10:46
Speaker
I just want to shout out are our amazing Pandalorian patrons, Robotic Battle Toaster, Sonya, and Ghostie. Thank you so, so much for supporting the show. Honestly, it means the world to us. But if you would like access to exclusive episodes, early access, behind the scenes footage, then of course you can check us out on our Patreon page, patreon.com forward slash chat tsunami. But until next time, thank you all so, so much for listening to this episode. Stay safe, stay awesome, and most importantly, gotta go fast.
01:11:16
Speaker
I was going to say live and learn, but that's just as good. But most importantly, stay hydrated.