Transcript
Danny Price: everybody, welcome to episode 11 of the Table Talk Recap Podcast. We did skip last week. um I'm personally on vacation with my family, so wasn't able to record last week's ah message, which is fine. It was preached by Eli, it's good message, and we're moving forward. We're not going able to build that go over that one, unfortunately. So um Shane's preached this last sermon on Sunday. Shane, do you want to talk about it a little bit?
Danny Price: Just because it wasn't a normal message in the sense that we're not teaching through like a Bible book or anything. um It was kind of more like you said, like a State of the Union. want to talk about that a little bit?
Shane: Yeah, it definitely was kind of more a state of the union address, you know, kind of where we were at a church, what the big needs are, what some of the exciting things are, where we're growing together.
Shane: what that growth means. um You know, I, I did ah kind of, I would, I would kind of say like the first 15 minutes was more of a sermon based on, you know, being aligned with the mission of Christ that we take, um use the power of the Holy Spirit through the power of the Holy Spirit. We take the the message of the gospel um,
Shane: to our community to the end to the ends of the earth so uh we kind of hit that and then i kind of looked at like what that means for us you know as a church how are we gonna how are we what do we need from people if we're going to be able to do that like what do we need to see the rest of the body doing we can't all fall on the shoulders of you know 10 20 even know 50 liters so
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: you know fifty liters so
Danny Price: Right. That makes sense. And it was good. Were you ah at all nervous just about having to talk about that kind of stuff? You know, it's not like it's all and that's not all fuzzy rainbows, so to speak.
Shane: Yeah. No, people.
Danny Price: Was it was it were you nervous about bringing up some of that stuff?
Shane: yeah Yeah, I'm always I wouldn't say I'm nervous as much as I am Really, I'm probably more focused than I am on the average Sunday about choosing my words and being more clear about what it is we're asking.
Shane: um Because, yeah because when you're asking for people's
Danny Price: Not vague. Yeah.
Shane: time and finances, you know, yeah they you need to be really clear about why, you know, and, and what that looks like and, and make sure you're not doing it in such a way that it's guilt ridden or that it's shame induced, you know, but at the same time, not, like you said, not sugarcoating it.
Danny Price: Sure.
Shane: So.
Danny Price: Right. No, it's not something easily sugar-coated, or shouldn't be at least. so um So the questions I had, I sent them to you. They're not, and I mean, everyone will notice notice this just from, you know, the...
Danny Price: what we're talking about. None of this is like super theologically deep. It's more Mountain View specific, which is fun because I think both of us enjoy talking about Mountain View. Obviously, you know, it's your baby. So you you love this kind of stuff. um But just for those of you listening, just little preface. This is as much like a deep theological discussion is more just like the nitty gritty of the church and kind of stuff going on with it. So which is fun. um Let's jump right in. So What do you think has it been the biggest way that you've seen MBF grow throughout the years?
Danny Price: And i that's a very vague question. You can take that any which direction, but what's the biggest way that MBF has grown? No.
Shane: Yeah, I mean, it's a huge question because, right, I mean you have so many areas of growth. um I always kind of break the church into kind of three areas that I think I might have even talked about this at some point, that exaltation, edification, and evangelization.
Shane: um
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: You know, so ah worship, you know, worship, discipleship, and um and you reaching the world, you know, and
Danny Price: yeah
Shane: I would say we, I've seen so much growth in the discipleship area in that, like when we first came here, there weren't a lot of people that I would have said like, Hey, you know, I would, we could have them be a leader in the church or a ministry leader, a small group leader, um anything like that, because we just didn't have it, you know? And, and now I, we have seen people raised up and do that, you know? And I think of like,
Shane: Someone like Lindsay Jefferson, who who teaches classes now, who got baptized here, you know, on different, you know, just different people. I didn't think that through.
Shane: So I don't, you know, have bunch of names right now, but but there are people like that.
Danny Price: No. No, you're...
Shane: So it's fun to see that.
Danny Price: Well, Sarah, I mean, Sarah Hall, like being on staff, yeah.
Shane: No, yes, Sarah Hall, that's a great example. You know, I mean, raised up here and now she's our worship the leader. And, um you know, so, yeah, no, definitely, you know, and um Stephanie Luke, who does our transitions class and sings on the worship.
Shane: And there's Stephanie Williams, last name Williams.
Danny Price: Yeah, Stephanie Williams now, yeah.
Shane: ah That's a hard one for me. um And then. um Yeah, so we've seen seeing people grow. We're definitely seeing people grow, disciples grow. um But at the same time, we've also seen a lot of um of growth. And, you know, we talked about we in the last three years, we've baptized well over 100 people, you know. And um so we're seeing people come come to the Lord, and and that's exciting.
Shane: Yeah.
Danny Price: No, that's really good. I and intentionally left that question vague so that you could take it different directions. ah That's cool. Yeah, um Mountain View has been growing in a lot of ways. That's really cool. um So on and for those of you listening, it's going to be confusing what I'm going about to talk about because he threw up a bunch of numbers, like statistics from the last three years.
Shane: Okay.
Danny Price: And that was kind of what a lot of this sermon was focused on. um And I don't have those numbers in front of me. i probably should have. But of those numbers, I noticed there was like a you know there's been a lot of growth um you know, and just people attending, how much of that do you have any idea in terms of the breakdown?
Danny Price: Is that kids growth? Is that adults? Is that all the above? Do you know like where we're growing the most?
Shane: Um, yeah, I mean, the one of the the great things about our church, and I think it's a sign of a healthy church is we're seeing it pretty much across the board. Like, I can't go to one area and go, Oh, well, you know, this area is just killing it so much. And that's where all of our growth is coming from.
Shane: Um, you know, for in case there is anyone that didn't hear it, um what we talked about was in 2022, we were right at under two, under 300 people.
Shane: And now we're ah over 600 people. um and So, oh you know, we've, we've doubled in growth in these three years. And, um,
Shane: I would say that it's very family driven. i know we had, we're averaging like 110 children in the, you know, under, under fifth grade and under about a hundred on Sunday.
Danny Price: For real? i didn't know that. Oh my gosh.
Shane: Yeah. So very family driven or that's where we're seeing the most, but we also have, empty nesters and retired people. and um And the great thing I'm super excited about is we're seeing a lot of young adults recently that we didn't used to see. um I would say on any given Sunday, we have, you know, 20 people in their early 20s, you know, that are are showing up and um probably actually more, well, more than that if we're counting like singles and married. um So, you know, that's exciting to me to see that as well.
Danny Price: Okay, that's good. that's That is a good perspective, I think, that you don't want growth. Or not that you don't want it, but it it would be strange if we were just getting a ton of retirees or something. Or if we were only getting families that were like you know with young kids only and no one else, it would definitely point to just that we're not lacking.
Danny Price: I don't know what to say lacking in an area, but that there's not that that fullness. It's kind of cool when you have the community that you're part of represented in the church um and vice versa.
Shane: Yeah, I think I was just saying, yeah, it depends on the community, right?
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: If we were right in the middle of a retirement center, then I would say, well, that'd be weird if we had, you know, didn't have a lot of retirees.
Danny Price: Right. Yeah.
Shane: um But, you know, so, but I even still think there's a blessing in being in an area where there is a lot of diversity in ages because it, I think just like in your family, it's good to do, to have your grandparents around and the young grandchildren around and all that.
Shane: It, that we learn from each other in our different age groups. And we, and, you know, so it is a benefit um of being in an area where there's diversity in ages like that.
Danny Price: Yeah, no, that's that's really good. um So in the sermon you talk, which i you know I think other people have used in the past, you know giving of your time, your talents, and your treasures, um and you know specifically talking about serving and getting involved.
Danny Price: ah I guess my my question is, and I... I'm coming at this from the perspective of someone that maybe is newer or fresher to Mountain View, have has not been here before, or hasn't been attending for a very long time. But where are the areas would you say that they, that someone would be needed? Because I think the easy answer is, well, they everywhere needs somebody, but even if that is the answer, how do I know where I'm needed?
Danny Price: So I'm, let's say I'm, you know, I'm me, I'm a 30 year old dad of two. um Is there a place? Is it is that the app? Or do I talk to somebody? where should Where should I go? How do I know where to get involved?
Danny Price: what And even if I don't even know my own strengths yet, and I'm not 100% sure, we'll talk about that in a second. But just like, where is the where are the needs?
Shane: Well, for the for the next few weeks, one of the cool things is we literally have a display in the lobby that shows you exactly how many needs we have in each area.
Danny Price: that's cool. Go ahead.
Shane: Yeah, so people that are coming on Sundays, um it'll probably be up for the month of September at least. you know And if you look at that, you will see the biggest need is in the area of children and youth.
Shane: um
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: And you know because you we want to do a good job with them. And like i said, i with that number I just gave out, You know, you want probably one adult to every 10 kids to really have a good program going.
Danny Price: yeah
Shane: So, you know, with that that's a huge need. And that's right in front of people on Sunday mornings for the next month or so. Now, after that, we actually do tend to move. We want to move to a display that just kind of has all the needs out there with cards. And so we're going to we are going to start that that will help.
Shane: But we also have the app, like you just said. And I I know we say it a lot. I i feel like we sound like a broken record. but If you go to the app, you can pretty much find out anything you need to know about how to get involved, where to get involved, what's happening, all that.
Shane: So that's another way. And then, you know, third way is we are constantly offering the 101, Pathways and classes.
Shane: and the one on one go talks a lot about where the needs are in different way and helps you get plugged in right away. then the 201 is kind of for people who have gotten past that phase. And like you said, maybe they don't really know their gifts, but they really kind of want to serve in an area where they're like, I feel like God gifted me in this.
Shane: um So we help them discover that. And then we kind of try to help you place be placed through that.
Danny Price: That's cool. So pathways 101 and 201, you guys do that. Remind me again, that's... When on Sunday? That's different Sundays throughout the year.
Shane: One-on-one is every month, um once a month during second service. You get free lunch included. And it's, um yeah, and it's, um I want to say it's like the third Sunday.
Danny Price: Free lunch.
Shane: It's either the first or, no, it's first. It's the first Sunday of the month because we just had, we had it Sunday. We had nine people in it on Sunday. And in 201, we only do like once a quarter because we're not trying. It's not as many people moving through it.
Shane: um But you'd have to look. It's always advertised on the app. And and it's usually advertised in the bulletin like two weeks before it's coming.
Danny Price: yeah
Danny Price: Right. So if you're listening and somehow you don't have the app, you should have the app. And like Shane said, I think they talk about it from the stage every single Sunday. And it's Like i I know people might be resistant to that, like, oh, technology.
Danny Price: And this is one of those situations where i I totally am behind and understand where people are like saying that technology ruins, you know, and your phone ruins things and relationships. But this is one of those situations where it's a tool that is, I think, being used really well from Mountain View's perspective. So it's the Church Center app, which is not Mountain View specific.
Danny Price: So many churches around the country use the Church Center app. But when you log in to the Church Center app, you can actually pick your church. And if you are attending multiple churches, I just found this out the other day because we visited a church where we're doing a vacation.
Danny Price: There's other churches and you can actually have different profiles. So like if you attend a church part time, you don't just have to pick, you know, your quote unquote home church. You can have two or three churches kind of in the lineup that you can like scroll between. So that way, if you're like, what are they doing? You know, because I'm in so-and-so town for this, you know, these few months. so um But yeah, if you guys aren't on it, really get on it.
Shane: Yeah.
Danny Price: it's it's ah It's the easiest way to get plugged in.
Shane: I actually have six profiles.
Danny Price: You what?
Shane: I have six profiles of different churches.
Danny Price: Do you really? Oh, that's cool.
Shane: Yeah. And I don't even go to the ever go to those, but yeah I just like to see what we're doing.
Danny Price: Right. No, but but you like, yeah, you check them out.
Shane: Yeah.
Danny Price: Yeah, no, that's cool. But yeah, no, it's, and I understand, again, if you're resistant to technology, that that's that's hard for you to do. But man, it just to know what's going on, and then if people need to get a hold of you, it's an easy way. If you don't have their phone book, it's like having a directory, which do churches still do directories anymore?
Shane: Not, I don't know, some of them do online directories.
Danny Price: Like the old with the pictures and anything?
Shane: Some of them do online directories um where you can do that.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: And it's something we could do down the line if we want to. But yeah, the other thing I'll just say to that real quick with the app, I know the resistance of it. the It's less personal in some ways. But in some ways, it's more personal because it it makes it so much easier for us to make sure Names don't get lost when people sign up for something that it's boom, it's right there.
Danny Price: yeah
Shane: They don't, you know, shoot. remember as a, when I was a youth pastor and we would have events coming up, you know, it was, i would do to have to have a booth every Sunday and then make sure I had volunteers manning it to do registrations or whatever.
Shane: Or I literally just would have people come up and handing me money with a little registration slip. And I'm putting it like trying to figure out where to put it, you know, it was,
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: It really helps with all that keep everything um streamlined.
Danny Price: Yeah, no, it's, it's intentionality in a good way. And it's, it's used.
Shane: Yeah.
Danny Price: I think it's a useful tool. Um, but cool. So yeah, download the app and get it. If you don't, I'm sure most people that are listening to a random offshoot podcast from Mountain View probably already have the app, but just in case you don't probably should get the app.
Danny Price: Um, all right. So talking about, um, giving or actually really quick going back you want don't have to go really far into this. I did put on the, at the end of that last question about serving. If you don't know your strengths, is there like, I know there's the shape test. There's other things.
Danny Price: Is there like a test that you recommend or a way of quote unquote, figuring out your gifts? Or is that just something you just, you know, as you slowly get older, you kind of start realizing what you're good at. Is there a way that was easier for some people to kind of understand that like a test or kind of online assessment?
Shane: know i I think the shape test, which we give at 201, 201, we have people take the shape test. I think the shape test is a great way because it it has a little bit of spiritual gifts, but also has like your experiences and what what God has done through those and you know all that to kind of help you hone in.
Danny Price: Okay.
Shane: but But some of it does come down to, i think, just get out there and start serving. you know, uh, be a greeter.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: And if you're like, I get no joy out of this, it's not fun. Like I, I don't like talking to people. Okay. Well then let's, let's start talking to someone about maybe, you know, move on and do the coffee ministry where you don't really got to talk to people.
Shane: You just make the coffee and you're, you know, you're, you're, you like cleaning and you're, or if that's not the case, come down to the church once a week and start, you know, helping with maintenance for a few hours a week and, you know, ah come down once a month, you know, whatever, you know,
Danny Price: nothing
Shane: I think the main thing is if people start serving and then they're, you know, just being at all inquisitive, you you can pretty quickly within a year of serving, you can find where you, where good at and where you're going enjoy.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Danny Price: Yeah, right. and Yeah. And even to that though, I would say you're going to enjoy serving and I, you know, and I serve, I do, I'm running sound often on Sundays, but there's times where I don't want to get up early and don't want to do it, but it's, you still do it because it's the whole thing is you're serving.
Danny Price: It's not for yourself.
Shane: yeah
Danny Price: So you can get, I think it's, it's good to get enjoyment and fulfillment out of it and have a good time with the people you're with, but it's not, it's not only about that, I guess. I just wanted to throw that in there.
Shane: Yeah. Yeah, that that is a really good point. I mean, it really is.
Danny Price: Unfortunately, it's not. Yeah. Um,
Shane: It's a generosity attitude, just like with giving. You know, there's going to times where you're going to why am I doing this?
Danny Price: Yeah.
Danny Price: No, a hundred percent, hundred percent. um So going on to giving, i know these these these, these are poignant questions, but what are your thoughts on percentages of giving?
Shane: Enjoy it.
Danny Price: um Do you support, or of do you see any reason to have like a hard, fast, like percentage, like I give 10% on the gross or on the net or whatever. yeah, and If you're interested in giving and you're not really giving right now, how do you set that how do you set that up in your life and start building that habit and building that discipline?
Danny Price: Especially if you've never given to anything before. And when I say giving, I don't mean just a lump sum. I mean like consistently. it's i think it's a lot easier in our mentality. but Like, yeah, I gave to that church or I gave to that organization just a little bit.
Danny Price: But to set up giving for consistency's sake, that's difficult. So, so how do you talk? Do you, do you support ah percentage? And then if so, or if not, then how do you, how would you start building that discipline in your life?
Shane: I support a percentage in as much as it helps us create a habit of of generosity. um So if I don't, for I'll just tell you, like for me, for exercising, if I don't commit that I am going to work out 20 minutes a day,
Shane: If I just kind of have it like, you know what, I'm i'm just going try to work out.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: Well, what happens is I almost never work out.
Danny Price: Yeah, right.
Shane: But if I commit, I'm going to work out 20 minutes a day. i I do it. And, you know, and I could say, and, you know, I'd i'd love to get where i'm working out 35, 40 minutes a day. But I also know, like, you know what, at least I'm doing 20. And guess what? When I do 20, sometimes I do 30 and 45.
Shane: um
Danny Price: yeah right
Shane: And, you know, so it's that taking and making a commitment to something, some sort of percentage. Now, and the tithing argument, that's a whole nother thing. I i support 10% because I believe that's a good rule of thumb.
Shane: um I think, you know, Tanya and I started at, we started at 2%, but very, very briefly. I upped it to three very quickly.
Shane: And, you know, when I kind of it took me like a year per percent to get to where I was giving 10 percent.
Danny Price: yeah
Shane: I'd been a believer for a couple of years at that point, you know, but I just it was that was a really hard one for me, you know, and um it was hard for me to put my mind around. And so it was never taught to me or really or anything. So anyway, I.
Shane: um But now, you know, we got to 10% and we now it's like 10% is kind of our, we that's what we do. And then we look for things sometimes to give on to on top of that, on top of that 10%.
Danny Price: Yeah. Yeah.
Shane: um So, and, and, you know, I think for a lot of people, I'm sure there are some people listening to this that make less than I do, but I guarantee you a lot of people make a lot more than me and they're, they use the excuse.
Shane: Well, i just, there's, I don't make enough to do that.
Danny Price: yeah
Shane: Um, and I, and Tanya and I were doing it when we were making a lot less than we are now and God still provided for it. The other thing is I, I don't necessarily think a lot of people say, well, that's the law, the whole 10%, the tie that's from the law.
Danny Price: yeah
Danny Price: Right.
Shane: Problem with that is we have examples of people giving a tithe before the law was created. Like Abraham, Abraham tithed, um,
Danny Price: you know
Shane: and before the law was even created. um We see, yeah.
Danny Price: And after. And after 2.
Shane: and And we see Abel's gift was um accepted over Cain's because Abel gave his first fruits. He didn't give like, oh, I've got some leftover here. I'm going to give to the, you know, um and there's a couple of places where you see a tithe were in the old Testament before the law was actually created.
Shane: I think Jacob even tithed.
Danny Price: Interesting.
Shane: yeah, So I don't really hold to that. Like, well, that's the law. um
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: And I do think it's a matter of being generous. And I think in America, we're we're pretty... we're pretty ignorant if we're thinking that two or 3% of our income is, is super generous for most of us, for most of us, you know, we're talking a single mom who's trying to just get by and, and I can think, man, I, I, in fact, I just talked to a single mom on Sunday and told her, I appreciated her faithfulness because I know she's a waitress.
Danny Price: Yeah, right.
Shane: She's got two kids. She has no family in town to help her. And she writes, ah check I have no idea how much it is, but she writes a check to the church every month because Michelle pointed it out to me like, hey, she's giving like that.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: So I just I just told I said, look, I have no idea what you're giving. But the fact that you are making sure you do it every month, I think in your situation, that's that's faithfulness.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Danny Price: yeah That's really cool.
Shane: And um so anyway, I think
Danny Price: That's really cool.
Shane: good
Danny Price: No, going to say that's really cool. And i I know where people are at, especially in my generation, like the millennial generation. I think a lot of people think that the church is all about... it's all a money-making scheme.
Danny Price: And if you knew the back door of how a church operates or any you nonprofit operates, you just, maybe not any nonprofit, most of the good nonprofits.
Shane: oh Most. Don't say any. Yeah, that's the problem.
Danny Price: I can't say any.
Shane: There's 5%.
Danny Price: That's the thing is there, exactly. There's a couple that, that create a really bad name and you see in the news of like misuse of finances and embezzlement, but, for the most part, a lot of these local churches that are Mountain View size or even a little bigger are just, they're squeaking by and most of their staff are vastly underpaid for the amount of work that they're putting in. And that's the other thing too, is I think,
Danny Price: a lot of people would make the assertion, well, you know, and i we joke with you, with you about this all the time, but like, you're not really working. You're just like, you're just teaching and you know, that's easy, right? Like all you would do is work on Sundays. And I really would encourage if you are struggling, if you're listening and you're struggling with that and you're like, I i want to give to a church or I want, I want to want to give to a church and I'm just not feeling it because I'm afraid of where the finances are going.
Danny Price: I mean, I'm sure Shane would sit down with you, but yeah, I mean, if you take a little bit of a longer look at where the money's going and how underpaid a lot of the staff are, but also how stretched thin and how much they're doing with so little in terms of money.
Shane: Yeah.
Danny Price: I mean, it's, it's amazing. I mean, as an organization, and I know I I'm sort of at this because I know this is how big Canyon is too, but, I mean, we're stretching dollars to make it go so far.
Danny Price: um And it's being handled responsibly. And so if you're worried about that, I would say talk to Shane. I didn't throw I wasn't part of one of the questions. I'm just throwing that in there. Cause I know people get weird about that.
Shane: yeah and And or talk to one of the shepherds.
Danny Price: So.
Shane: And, you know, and you even said, you said most of the staff are underpaid.
Danny Price: Or the shepherds. Yeah.
Shane: I would say, definitely say all. And I would also say that that is almost every church I'm aware of. they You know, that we're underpaid.
Danny Price: Yeah. There's those random like huge names that are getting paid a lot, but it's not that's not normal.
Shane: And, you know,
Shane: Yeah. Yeah.
Danny Price: That's not normal.
Shane: And even them, if you look at what they I mean, I'm not saying that pastors should make some of the money that most, but mostly even the big names, they get, they get very, very healthy salaries.
Shane: But if you compared the amount of responsibility they have, to
Danny Price: Hmm.
Shane: to other people that have that kind of responsibility, I guarantee you they're probably still maybe in the bottom 10% of those salaries.
Danny Price: Right.
Shane: but But, you know, like, so I'll just really clearly say for MBF, in case people are listening, I mean, if people are curious, the no one on MBF staff
Danny Price: Right.
Shane: makes as much comparably with our experience level or our responsibility level as much as a teacher at in Wasatch High School makes. If you compare it our responsibilities are a level someone working for the school district, we make under what the school district pick gets paid.
Danny Price: And teachers are considered to be underpaid anyways.
Shane: And teachers are considered, you know, barely getting by so.
Danny Price: So, right.
Danny Price: And that was a little tangent. I wanted to shoot off on that just for a second. Cause I know I didn't, I feel like you would be uncomfortable saying that for yourself, but I can say that as a, just a regular attender of mountain view. And then also, I also work for a nonprofit, but those dollars get stretched. Like someone's giving and it's that, that money is going to good stuff.
Danny Price: Um,
Shane: Yeah.
Danny Price: Which is um so let's see here.
Shane: Yep. Yep.
Danny Price: look at my questions. This is you know pivoting it again to something totally different. But goal-wise, looking at Mountain View Fellowship, where... Do you have any goals? And I know I'm sure you do, but in the next five to 10 years, what are some things that you are trying that you want to see from Mountain View?
Danny Price: And I left it blank. I left it kind of blank on this. It could be tangible stuff, I guess, like numbers, like hard numbers. Like we want to go to this many people or just in general, like in a specific general area.
Danny Price: How do you want to see growth? and are And are there, where are the goals that you want to see and in a general sense? So like, I mean, I don't know what that, what that would be, but just like, deeper spiritual relationships or something like that. But what are some, ah you can do the five year, your, your mark and maybe the 10 year mark, but what are some things that are out there that you really want to see from Mountain View?
Shane: um I would say, you know, on the non-tangibles, and and yet we try to always look at is there ways to measure it some level, is just deeper discipleship. we As much as I have seen people grow, we'd we'd like to see people engage past Sunday mornings more.
Danny Price: Hmm.
Shane: um to grow. i feel like we have about 25, maybe 30% of our congregation does a great job of engaging with things that help them grow and feed themselves.
Shane: And we have a lot, at least as far as I can see, that that don't take those steps.
Danny Price: Mm-hmm.
Shane: and And we're trying to figure out how do we help people take those steps. So that's probably one of our biggest goals is what systems and and tools and resources can we put in place to help people take baby steps so that they can start to see what happens when they actually are growing in a deeper level. Because, you know, people get excited about Sunday morning because they, man, they,
Shane: If you haven't grown spiritually yeah on a Sunday morning, you start growing spiritually and you get super excited about it. But then eventually that wears off um because you need to, you need to start doing things on your own to take that deeper.
Danny Price: yeah
Shane: And um so that would be a big tangible as far as numbers and numbers of baptisms and um all that. I'll be honest. I mean, we've, we've surpassed the numbers that I ever thought this church would be my, my goal was, you know, and what's that?
Danny Price: Really? i said really. I'm like, you usually dream really big with that kind of stuff, so actually surprises me.
Shane: Well, I do. But when ah and when I talk, I guess the last three years, that's changed. But for the first 10 years or so, my goal was to get the church.
Danny Price: Okay.
Shane: I thought if I can get this this church to 500 people ever before I retire, then it will be then it will sustain and be it will move past me Um, churches under that, they have a hard time because of moving past the, that like continuing to grow and do better after the pastor leaves, if they're not at about that stage.
Danny Price: um
Danny Price: Yeah, I see what you're saying.
Shane: So, so that was kind of my goal.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: And we're like, we're past it. And I'm, haven't, I'm not, unless God does something, I'm nowhere near retiring. So, um, so do we,
Danny Price: Right. um unless god's death Unless God does something.
Shane: um but You know, takes takes away my voice or something.
Danny Price: Yeah, right. Sure.
Shane: So, yeah, so I would love to see us. I think we're on track between here and um Wyoming, our other campus, which we have mentioned on here before. um We're on track to be over 800 by this time next year.
Shane: um i think but with andbi it with a Heber, I could easily – I'd like to see us – ah be over seven, I personally, ah just just this campus, be over 700 by next year.
Shane: um
Danny Price: Oh, it that reminds me. Those numbers, that was not Mountain View included. a Mountain View, Wyoming.
Shane: Oh, the numbers I gave, you know, honestly, I would have to look and ask Michelle um average.
Danny Price: the The Gateway... The Gateway Campus?
Shane: I don't think they were because, um, I think if you count, it seemed the six, ah the 609 seems a little high for here. and know we've had a few weeks like that, but it, it takes into account Easter and Christmas, which always knocks the number.
Danny Price: Oh, yeah, which bumps it up like crazy.
Shane: so So that I'd have to ask her if that included them or not.
Danny Price: Interesting. I totally thought forgot to ask about that anyways.
Shane: Um, Yeah. um So anyway, all that to say, numbers wise, I'd love to see that. Even baptisms. I mean we've baptized in this three years. We baptized more people than we baptized the first 10 years.
Shane: um So that's exciting. But yeah, as far as other things, I mean, I want to see us have a Latino speaking ministry. I mean, Spanish speaking ministry for Latinos, 11% of the Hebrew Valley is Spanish speaking as their primary language.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: So i would love to see that. I mean, you and I, we've talked a lot about with the new high school going in. i want to see us have a big ministry to youth. I feel like that's an area we we really can grow in is our is our youth ministry.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: We've seen a lot of ah movement though. I mean, they had 42 junior hires this last weekend. i mean, this last Wednesday.
Danny Price: For real? 40?
Shane: They had 42 junior hires, just junior hires. So, um yeah.
Danny Price: That's crazy.
Shane: So, you know, there's some things like that I think we can see. um You know, and then know ah I've always kind of had a heart for the campusing thing. And I'm kind of starting to think, OK, is it time for us to look at another campus?
Shane: So there's all there's a lot stuff like that.
Danny Price: Yeah, there's a lot of stuff in the works.
Shane: And I didn't break that up into five and 10.
Danny Price: That's cool.
Danny Price: No, that's fine. That's fine.
Shane: I would say the Spanish speaking, though, and the high school ministry, doing those two things really big, i that for sure within these five years. um
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: And a preschool. That's another thing. We are at the beginnings of the work of working on a preschool. We're going announce that at yeah at the church.
Danny Price: At the church. Like it would be at the church.
Shane: We're going announce that this Sunday.
Danny Price: Yeah, okay. ah really that's That's cool.
Shane: Yeah.
Danny Price: um The church we visited here in Michigan where we're vacationing, um they actually do that. They have like a preschool daycare that runs... um and the during the week at the church. And I think there's a lot of crossover with, um, people that go, to there's a ton of crossover with people that go to church and send their kids there. But then a lot of the staff, there's like some, there's come crossover with who teaches.
Danny Price: Um, and they seem like they're doing, they're doing cool with it. So that'd be cool.
Shane: Cool. Yeah.
Danny Price: That'd be a cool thing, especially just, I know when, you know, when parents are trying to fit find a place to send their kids, it's cool if they're sending them to a, I don't know, a reputable place that's taking care of their kids. Well, um,
Shane: yeah
Danny Price: There was a question that I had and I totally spaced it that had to do with that. And I'm going have move on because I totally forgot. Oh, with a numbers, I don't want to get too bogged down with that. But is it do you think it's OK and healthy for a church to have numbers goals as in terms as in terms of like X amount of people by X amount of years?
Danny Price: Is it, do you think you can get too swept up and just whatever it takes to get to hit hit quote unquote, hit your quota? Or is that, do you think it's not an issue? And maybe that's not an issue for you personally, but do you know if it's an issue for other pastors? Because i I could see how if you start once a church, you know, because there is elements of a business in a church because just the way it has to operate.
Danny Price: But I could see how there would be issues when you're trying to take, you know, a church, a community of believers and can make it completely,
Shane: Yeah.
Danny Price: monetized and, you know, business, businessified, if that's a word. And all of a sudden you're like, we got to hit the quotas. We had, we said we were going to get to a thousand by so-and-so year. So we got to get to a thousand, whatever it takes. and then you start cutting corners.
Danny Price: Do you, do you see that happening with other pastors? I guess is the first part of that question, but then is it, is it wrong to measure numbers or to want to have more numbers? What do you think about that?
Shane: I would say, yes, you see it happening. And yes, all of us are susceptible to it. I'm not going to leave myself out of that. um
Danny Price: Hmm.
Shane: And you do have to be careful. I think you have to balance between you want to see the kingdom of God grow. and you and you're willing to do whatever that takes.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: And like it or not, numbers gives us ah ah some indication. is not the only way to know, but it gives us some indication of what we're doing.
Danny Price: Right.
Shane: um But yes, you can get way too caught up in it. um
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: I don't like to get caught up into looking at the numbers every week kind of thing. Like I i like to just kind of know more like, If I look at the last six months, have grown?
Shane: Okay, cool. You know, you know,
Danny Price: Yeah. But you're not like every single week, like, Oh, what what did we do wrong? We had 10 people less that service.
Shane: Yeah, know.
Danny Price: but ten people you Yeah.
Shane: You'll be manic depressive if you every week or basically, you know, because, you know, Easter, you're going to be on cloud nine and the week after you're going to feel horrible because all those people came to church there one time.
Danny Price: Yeah. Right.
Danny Price: Uh-huh.
Shane: they're not coming back.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: um So, no, yeah i don't think you should too focus on it.
Danny Price: Hmm.
Shane: But but I think it's also not wrong to to have an idea of what's going on with it.
Danny Price: Yeah, that's a good answer. ah Yeah, because I could see, and I know this is the case at camp, like working for Big Canyon, is we measure, I mean, Brian, my boss, is just he's really detailed and really good with numbers, and he'll do all the, like, you know, it's not like a profit and loss statement, but it's very similar, but it has to do with, you know numbers, ah camper nights, and bed nights, and all this stuff, and it's really fun to get into the numbers, but...
Shane: oh
Danny Price: It's easier for us because we're a little bit more of that business side. um You know, we're more like a parachurch ministry, but for the actual church, I think that could be, that that'd be tough for me personally, because I love numbers and I love diving into that stuff. So I think for me, it'd be really hard to not want to measure success just based off of the numbers completely and wanting to get more, even if it was a good,
Danny Price: even if it was a good, what's the word? Good motivation. Like you said, like, you know, you want people to come into the kingdom of God. But at the same time, I think for me, at least I know that would be a struggle. Like, well, we were not there yet. Like we got to get, we got to hit more. We got to hit more.
Danny Price: That's tough.
Shane: Yep.
Danny Price: So anyways, um moving on.
Shane: Yep. Absolutely.
Danny Price: um Do you, and I guess this is a vague question a little bit, but I'm hoping this gives you some things to talk about. Do you think Mountain View does a good job of, showing its vision and casting its vision to its, and the whole vision and mission to its members?
Danny Price: And if so, where could we improve with that?
Shane: I would say we do a better job than a lot of churches. I don't think we do a great job at it, though.
Danny Price: Got it.
Shane: and Unfortunately, a lot of churches aren't really good at it. So um I you know, there are some churches I so i look at and go, man, they just kill it. They do that so well.
Shane: um So, you know, but we're not quite at that level. I think we keep it in front of people, but not like we should.
Danny Price: um
Shane: You know, ah you hear this all the time in leadership circles. you You want when it comes to your key things, you want to sound like a broken record.
Danny Price: Yep, yep.
Shane: I don't feel like we do. um You. I feel like we do because it's always in my head, but I, you forget how quick vision leaks.
Danny Price: Right.
Shane: And when I say vision leaks, I mean, not that it's in a good way, it, it, it goes away.
Danny Price: it It deflates.
Shane: Like people just deflates really quick.
Danny Price: It deflates, yeah.
Shane: So I want to get, we want to get better at it. we we actually have a few things like we have some big vision. We have a couple of vision things we're putting on the wall this week, actually. Um,
Danny Price: Oh, cool.
Shane: Yeah, so we're we want to be better at using visuals within the lobby. ah You know, we do, you know, I know every week we talk about we want to be a place to help for people for people to meet Jesus and live free. I mean, I feel like people hear that a lot.
Shane: um You know, do we explain it very well? No, you know, there's so there's things we get better at.
Danny Price: Right, yeah. OK. Cool. Last question, kind of a bonus question. So we we talked about three services and then maybe going there in January. What are you most nervous for in going to three services?
Danny Price: Is there, what are the growing pains that we're going to get by going to three?
Shane: Probably what I'm most nervous for is failing.
Danny Price: Well, okay.
Shane: You know, yeah ah yeah we, well, it's seriously though, because, not because it just, it, if if you try it and it doesn't go, you just can't get that to fill.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Danny Price: It's going to be hard to do it again.
Shane: Yeah. Ever doing it again is almost, yeah it pretty much guarantees like, okay, now we got to wait another two years.
Danny Price: Yeah. Yeah.
Shane: um So, you know, so we're going to be very careful with that. um And, and then all, you know, just, it's a lot of work.
Shane: It's just, you know, 95% of the people, 98% of the people that are doing stuff on a Sunday morning for services are volunteers.
Danny Price: Yeah.
Shane: You know, we have a few people that are doing stuff to organize, but, um you know, you're, it's a lot asking a lot of volunteers.
Danny Price: Yep.
Shane: So I'm hoping that,
Danny Price: No, that's that's valid.
Shane: i'm hoping that some of the people who are not really plugged into doing like sacrificing much can kind of give a little bit in this, these, this area and say, you know what, if it'll grow the kingdom by 200 people, then, then it's worth it.
Danny Price: Yeah, no, that's really cool.
Shane: So,
Danny Price: Awesome. Well, cool. I think that rounds this out for the episode. We're pretty much done. um Hope you guys enjoyed this. Again, fully knowing that this is not a fully, you know, super deep theological. This was more just talking about Mountain View specific things.
Danny Price: And remind me, Shane, next week is pretty much the same thing too because it's anniversary Sunday next week, correct?
Shane: Yeah, next week is – so the way I said it on Sunday was this week was about the what, we're like what we were asking of people. This coming week is the why.
Shane: Why are we asking it?
Danny Price: Cool.
Shane: And guys we're going to share so some cool vision stuff.
Danny Price: Awesome.
Danny Price: Awesome. I'm really excited. It'll be fun. And then we're jumping into Ephesians after that. So that'll be really fun to dive back into scripture. So anyways, cool.
Shane: Yep.
Danny Price: Awesome. Hope you guys are enjoying this again. Sorry for taking a week off. We didn't lose too many listeners and that you guys are still still sticking with us. And yeah, we'll see you guys next week. Bye-bye.
Shane: All right, thanks.
