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Nos Audietis, Episode 276: Sometimes the bear eats you
53 Plays7 years ago
The Sounders are coming off a 1-0 loss at home to Real Salt Lake, which leaves them at 2-6-2 on the season, but even more alarmingly 1-3-1 at home. That record includes a rather astounding four shutouts, more than Brian Schmetzer had experienced during his entire tenure as head coach before the start of this season.
Things aren’t looking so hot, to say the least. And we figured that rather than focusing on what is wrong with the team, we also wanted to try to get a sense of how this is affecting the mood in the stands. Jeremiah and Likkit discussed this, while also taking questions from our listeners.
This week's music: RVIVR - "Ocean Song", Perry Como - "Seattle", RVIVR - “The Tide”, Woody Guthrie - "Roll On Columbia"
Thanks to James Woollard, Sounders Public Address Announcer, for doing our sponsor reads. You can follow him on Twitter at @BritVoxUS - if you're looking for a British Voice to advertise your business or non-profit, please reach out to him.
Want to hear the music from the show in their glorious, full versions? Check out the Nos Audietis playlist on Spotify!
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Transcript
Introduction & Sponsorship
00:00:00
Speaker
This episode of Nos Adieres is sponsored by Full Pool Wines. Full Pool Wines are based in Seattle, owned and operated by Sanders fans, and have been sponsoring Nos Adieres since 2011. They offer the best boutique wines of the world to members of their mailing list, with special focus on their home, the Pacific Northwest. Their model is simple. One, they email compelling offers.
00:00:23
Speaker
Two, you request bottles that sound appealing. And three, your wine arrives at their soda warehouse and is ready for pickup or shipping. Their soda tasting room is also open to the public. If you're interested in joining their mailing list or learning more about them, visit fullpaulwines.com.
Podcast Introduction with Seattle Sounders
00:00:42
Speaker
Hey, this is Christian Roldan. And Jordan Morris from the Seattle Sounders Football Club. And you're listening to There's No Study at Discs.
00:00:58
Speaker
The blueest skies you've ever seen are in Seattle And the hills the greenest green in Seattle Like a beautiful child growing up
00:01:17
Speaker
Welcome back to another edition of Nos Arietes.
Recording at Hellbent Brewery
00:01:20
Speaker
This is episode 276, and we're recording on Thursday, May 31st at Hellbent Brewery in Lake City. I am Jeremiah O'Shan, and joining me today is the one and only Lickett Pee. Aaron said he's too busy to record this week, so we're taking the opportunity to hang out in one of Seattle's soon-to-be gentrified neighborhoods.
00:01:36
Speaker
We also felt like we needed to record this week, given the state of the team.
Seattle Sounders' Challenging Season
00:01:40
Speaker
The centers are coming off of 1-0 loss at home to Realsall Lake, which leaves them 2-6-2 on the season. But even more alarmingly, they're 1-3-1 at home. That record includes a rather astounding four shutouts more than Brian Spencer had experienced at CenturyLink during his entire 10 years head coach before the start of the season.
00:01:57
Speaker
Things aren't looking so hot, to say the least. And I figured that rather than focusing on what is wrong with the team, I also wanted to try to get a sense of how this is affecting the mood in the stands.
Fan Frustration and Attendance Issues
00:02:07
Speaker
That's where Lickit comes in, as he's the one among us who probably has the best sense of his fellow fans are feeling right now. So, Lickit, what's the sense you get from 131? A lot of...
00:02:20
Speaker
Doubt, I guess, is probably a good way of putting it. That seems fair. Yeah. It was miserable, let's say, just in the last game there, watching the stands. I personally didn't want to be there. I just was watching them. It just felt like they were going through the motions. Didn't look like a lot of passion. Urgency, really. And a lot of frustration, I think, in the stands, I should say.
00:02:48
Speaker
And one of the things that struck me is, you know, I talk about this a little bit in my column this week, but almost every week, I would say, especially when any time the team is bad, and this goes back years, is that 10 minutes before the game, someone will tweet it, sound apart, man, the stands are looking really thin today, or someone will come up to me and be like, especially on the way journalists will be like, oh,
00:03:10
Speaker
this looks like a thin crowd and then invariably once the game is five ten minutes in it looks like it always looks and I think this week that was even more understandable given that there was the Champions League final right before this game it was a beautiful Memorial Day weekend
00:03:27
Speaker
Not at all surprised that there was a late arriving crowd. And I should say that anywhere you look, it looked like how you would always see it. But what I did see was a little different. And I don't remember the last time this happened. I'm sure it's happened before.
Lack of Creativity and Strategy
00:03:39
Speaker
But I looked up in the stands around the 85th, 86th, 87th, late in the game.
00:03:44
Speaker
And there were large swaths of empty seats. Now, this is a 1-0 game. It's not over, but it's just like there was this, and the centers did not have a shot after the 83rd minute. We also didn't have a shot after the 75th minute. The last 10, 15 minutes of that game were just boring. And the crowd was thinning out. People were just like, I got better things to do on the Saturday before Memorial Day. I'm not sure. I remember the last time that happened.
00:04:14
Speaker
I don't and I noticed the same thing and I actually noticed I had made a comment to myself that people a lot more people were walking out and they weren't just going to the bathroom or something that they were literally leaving yeah but it didn't seem like there was less people in the stands or anything that just like literally like like you were saying like after the 80th minute like I checked out I just was watching just like I never leave early but I'm just like I
00:04:37
Speaker
I just want this to end, don't go to extra time, don't add any time, you know, no injuries, just, let's just go home. Yeah, I mean, I don't remember the last time that it felt so hopeless at the end of a game. And, you know, and I was thinking in my head, like, looking, like, after the game, I was thinking, well, you know, Lamar Nagel had that header off the post, and that was kind of late. It was, it was like the 65th minute. Yeah. Like, there was this, like,
00:05:05
Speaker
Stretch of action like around the 65th 70th minute where there's like centers had some Some momentum and it looked like something was maybe going to happen, but then it just died Well, they had that one did it was a niggle to they like slid at a ball in the middle of the box maybe yeah, and they Jordan McCrary had a volley that came off of a Waylon Francis cross kind of way but that was again it must have been before they I mean the last shot they had was a
00:05:30
Speaker
the right
00:05:43
Speaker
what we're used to seeing. And I think that Brian Spencer was being accurate when he said that he felt like the fight was there. And I think that you saw that in the duels and all that, those kind of things. But we just saw absolutely no ideas going forward.
00:06:00
Speaker
I mean, it's like if you hire someone to do drywall in your house and they send the new guy to do it, he's going to try his ass off, but he's not going to be the guy that's going to do the perfect job.
Critique of Coaching Decisions
00:06:11
Speaker
That's what it felt like. It was just like, those guys are out there doing their best. But that feels like it may be his personal experience. Maybe. Maybe. Maybe.
00:06:19
Speaker
No, I agree. I agree. And it was just one of those things where, you know, at the end of the game, you sit there and you go like, well, let's see, what, what, what do they do? What, what did Schmetzer do? And his first sub was to bring in
00:06:34
Speaker
Wainland, granted this was in the first half, and I should say that I thought for the first 30, 35 minutes, the sounders looked pretty good. You know, with Hondual Bwana and Megaswold Icrum both attacking and supporting Quinn Dempsey, I thought that that was working pretty well. But then once Bwana went out, shortly after Bwana went out, just every bit of momentum died. Wainland Francis replaced Bwana, who apparently has a sprained foot.
00:07:03
Speaker
And there just was all of a sudden the sound just went from attacking and trying to work the ball into the box to being satisfied with crosses. And it just seemed to suck all the energy out. And then the real head-scratching substitution, I thought, was bringing in Jordan McCreary from New Who. I thought New Who was having an OK game. I don't know. I don't know.
00:07:27
Speaker
was good or bad necessarily, but that they would bring in a second pullback in order to push, like when your best offensive idea is to push Kelvin Lierdom into the attack. So then you have two guys who aren't going to beat anyone off the dribble, who are just going to send in crosses.
00:07:42
Speaker
and you're, who are they sitting in crosses to? Clint's, you know, I think Clint did an okay job, given his task of, you know, like, he was a number nine, but he can't, he, you're, if you're looking for Clint Dempsey to be the holdup guy, the most creative guy, and the goal scorer, that's just too much to ask. It's not gonna work.
00:08:00
Speaker
That's the one thing that you can say if you look from the stands that I noticed was that it didn't look like when that injury happened to Bona and they brought in that sub. From that point on, it just looked like the team was either confused or wasn't buying into the strategy that Smits was going with for the coaching staff, to be fair. It looked like they were kind of going through the motions after that. And I don't know if it was connected or not, but that's what it felt like. Yeah. And so I think not surprisingly,
00:08:28
Speaker
And it's been, you know, like I use the Sounder art comment section as somewhat of a barometer. Now this is not obviously 100% accurate. We have lots of people who don't attend games who, you know, but I think that there's a pretty good cross section of the representation of Sounders fans there.
00:08:47
Speaker
And there's just this sense of real palpable frustration. And I don't want to say it's the worst it's ever been. I remember 2013 when everyone was kind of turning on each other, and there was a lot of divisive things going on with the team and in the center's community. And so I don't think it's the most toxic it's ever been, but it does seem like there's this sense of,
00:09:15
Speaker
real genuine frustration and I think that it gets tight. I don't think it's fair to put it all on Garth, but I do think that there's a lot of it is like Garth's hiring has been seen as maybe an easy to identify symbol of
Garth Lagerwey's Tenure Under Scrutiny
00:09:33
Speaker
change.
00:09:33
Speaker
And so, you know, you look at, you know, there's still people that are upset about loss. There's still people that, you know, like, there's all these things that people are still upset about and they get kind of brought up. But I don't know. I mean, what is your, do you think that the Sounders community is particularly divided right now or is it just like real frustrating?
00:09:56
Speaker
I don't think it's divided, I think it's just the same frustrations. They're just coming to boil now, again, fairly, in some respects, but I don't think there's a division more than just more voices are being louder than... And I'll say that one of the scary things, it's, you know, I think scary is the right way of putting it. I said this is an election year for Garth. He is gonna be up for...
00:10:21
Speaker
for what confidence or no confidence quote. And I think one of the things that's kind of scary to me as a fan of the team, but also someone that's covering it, is I wonder if the general frustration, whether it be with ticket price increases, with Ross or whatever, you see all this stuff thrown in there, is that if people are going to kind of see this as a referendum, not necessarily on the job that Garth has done, but on a referendum on the state of the club.
00:10:50
Speaker
Right. Yeah, I mean, that's that that's ultimately what it's going to come down to. Right. And in the general, the general public, the Joe fan guy is only going to be either you're going to not care or they're going to be like, oh, you know, my tickets went up. Right. And I think that's what's scary is that the people who are inclined to vote are the people who feel passionately
00:11:11
Speaker
about this one way or the other. And when Adrian was up for election in 2012, he passed with something like 90% confidence or some astounding level of support. And I think there was some concern that maybe that wasn't going to go that way. But ultimately, this was a team that had shown improvements that was still fun to watch. And that was moving in the right direction in a lot of ways.
00:11:41
Speaker
And I think if there's anything that's fair to say about Garth's tenure is that it's hard to see the underlying and consistent system that, like, I think a lot of us inside can look at the academy and say like, oh, they seem to be doing a lot better. They seem to be attracting better talent. There seems to be more cohesion organizationally.
00:12:05
Speaker
S2 I think has much more clear eat like I know there's frustrations over the turnover and the other things But I think most reasonable people would look at s2 and say like well clearly they're
00:12:17
Speaker
focused on bringing in players that have potential to help the first team. There's a clear long-term vision for the entire club and most fans really don't care about
Concerns Over GM Vote and Ticket Prices
00:12:30
Speaker
that. Right, and I think that's where the difference is that at the first team level this idea that you know like Garth came in especially in 2015 talking about how look
00:12:39
Speaker
I've never had a team that's so dependent on two people, which was Oba and Clint. And you set about changing that and trying to kind of create this plug and play mentality. And I don't know that we're A, much closer to that, but B, I don't know what the
00:12:55
Speaker
general philosophy is when they're bringing in players and I don't think that they've done a bad job bringing in players. I just don't know that I see this consistency and that I see that because they've been kind of in some ways I think it's a it's very it's impressive that he's been able to take lead the sounders to two straight endless cups. Well in a lot of ways doing a rebuild.
00:13:16
Speaker
but on the other hand here we are in 2018 and i think that it's not like there's this obvious crop of like well in two years we're just gonna be great right we're kind of like stuck between we're still stuck between kind of like a rebuild and a rebuild right and there's a sidebar there when you brought up
00:13:35
Speaker
the two cup appearances and the one win. I feel like a lot of people are only going to vote on the negative stuff and not give him enough credit for that part of the job. He should get credit for part of that. It's his club per se. If you're going to give him negatives, that's positive on his side too.
00:13:55
Speaker
I feel like it's crazy to me to think that the Sounders fans could essentially send out a GM who was brought in clearly with the directive of winning MLS Cup. And I think that it's a lot of revisionist history for people to act like at the end of 2014 everything was great and everyone was happy.
00:14:18
Speaker
hey if we win the supporters shield every year and don't win MLS Cup we're going to be satisfied because what I like I think like Aaron and I talked a lot about how in a lot of ways winning supporters shield is more fun when you collectively like you look at it as a season-long journey yeah but at the same time there was a palpable sense of disappointment a palpable sense of frustration a palpable sense of are we ever if we can't do it with this team can we ever do it right
00:14:46
Speaker
and then to get to that mountain top in 2016, granted not by winning the supporter shield also, but I think I'm still kind of amazed at how many people act as if they were happier at the end of 2014, they were happier at the end of 2016. They kind of forget where we burnt out of the playoffs that year, right? Like they're all excited, everyone's excited, we won the shield, yeah, but then it's like, hey, then playoffs.
00:15:11
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. It's kind of like, I'm not sure how close you follow the Mariners, but like when they had that historic season, and then they just went out in the first, it's like, why does that first part matter more than burning out of the playoffs and not getting to the ultimate goal, right?
00:15:28
Speaker
I mean, and I think the argument that we made back then was, look, I had 34 weeks that I enjoyed, or I had 38, 39, 40 weeks that I enjoyed, and then it was one week where I really didn't. But at the same time, that whole off-season, I think there was a lot of frustration, and I think that if you had told anyone,
00:15:49
Speaker
Any Sounders fan at the beginning of 2016, look, you're going to win MLS Cup one of these next two years. You're going to go to two finals. But then in 2018, you might have a rough year. I think everyone would take it. Everyone would take it. And so I'm a little surprised at how mad and how frustrated and how quick to completely dismiss the last two season successes that have been.
00:16:15
Speaker
But I think what scares me more, whether or not you think Garth has done a great job or not, is do you really think... I'm very curious to find out what people think is going to happen if we fire Garth.
00:16:33
Speaker
then what are we going to get at the end of that? And who's going to, like, I mean, I guess you could say, well, I think Chris Henderson will take a job and I think he'll do great. But does Chris Henderson want that
Fan Vote and Its Implications
00:16:41
Speaker
job? Yeah, that's a great question. I don't think he, I don't know if he does or not. Who wants the job knowing that you can take your team to two straight MLS companies in one bad year? And that's the other thing, who, who in their right mind is going to come here and want that job where you're like, well, you know, like a couple of years, you could get up to vote because if people don't like you, then you're going to get, you're going to lose your job. Yeah, you better time your bad season. Right.
00:17:01
Speaker
right exactly it's like i mean i get i get why there's that gm vote and it makes a lot of sense in some regards but like i mean you really have to use that power for the right reasons well and i think that there is this sense that well we have this right we should use it and if we're not going to use if we're not going to if we're not going to
00:17:22
Speaker
like use it now when you're gonna use it and i think that that maybe misunderstands which i think the point like if you look at what things like like when uh when this was created when drew carrie had this idea it wasn't
00:17:40
Speaker
I'm frustrated with the team today. I don't think this team has a direction. He was talking about the Cleveland Browns who have been bad forever and have been complacent and there's a sense of complacency and it's like how can you think the Sounders are complacent when they went...
00:18:01
Speaker
You know, unless it's all about signing DPs, unless it's all it's about, I don't see how you can look at this organization and see complacency. It's just, I think a lot of people just see like, oh, we didn't sign that guy, or we missed out on a window because they don't care why we missed out the window. It's just, we didn't sign anybody in this window. We saw everybody else sign somebody. Why aren't we signing someone? It's like, well, we are trying to sign someone, but it's not happening in this window. It's like, well, that's disappointing. I'm mad.
00:18:26
Speaker
And it's a little scary to think that there are fans who are so wrapped up in the ability to sign, that it's really, for some fans, it's about signing players and not about winning champions. Yeah, yeah. Like, would you really be satisfied if we signed Zlatan? Like, would that fix your issue? And we were still in the same state. It was still in the same state. Like, would that really make you happy? Like, some people, that might make them happy.
00:18:53
Speaker
I don't know. And I think that there's an intellectual dishonesty because I don't think that fans are frustrated and they want someone to aim their frustrations.
Reflecting on Fan Dissatisfaction
00:19:07
Speaker
And my hope is that when it comes time to actually vote that they take a step back and they say, why am I frustrated? Am I frustrated because I don't believe in this GM? Or am I frustrated because the team didn't perform as well as I thought they would?
00:19:21
Speaker
And I think, I'm frustrated, I think you're frustrated, I think anyone that's a Sounders fan is frustrated right now. But the question is, and I realize that there's not a lot that fans can do, and this vote is something fans can do, but is that the thing that's gonna actually make us better? I don't think it is. No, I agree with that. And I can't really...
00:19:58
Speaker
you know,
00:20:01
Speaker
I guess that's fair, but it's just a weird way of looking at it, I guess. Maybe it's good for Garth to feel some pressure. This summer, if they go out and they sign, they make two big signings, and who knows if they would have done that. I tend to think that they're going to make those decisions independent of the axe being held over their head.
00:20:24
Speaker
pushes them to spend a little. Maybe Adrian is encouraged to spend a little bit more than he would have otherwise if he knows that it could cost Garth his job. I think we can all agree that, at least when we've discussed it, we can agree that them not signing someone to replace Morris in this past window, that was a mistake. I think it was certainly a mistake, and I think it was one that's very easy to second guess, and I think it's one that... I think it's important
00:20:53
Speaker
for us, and I don't want me to cut you off, but I think it's important for us to be honest and say that you can believe that not signing someone was a choice. Was a choice, but not simply a cynical decision of being like, I don't care what happens in front of the season. Right. They made a choice. It didn't work out. We still feel it's a mistake. I think it's, I don't know if that used the right word, but to think that
00:21:17
Speaker
You want a GM like I guess my point is is they he's already laid out his plan of long-term visions Like I want to bring a DP and I want to bring a tan player in and if that happens in the summer That's fine. He laid out his plan. Do you want a GM that just like just says? Oh Well, I'm just gonna scrap that plan cuz fans are mad and right we didn't we just need to sign one guy It's like do you really want a GM that's just gonna turn out a dime like that? I mean I get the point where I
00:21:39
Speaker
you want to sign a player and they should have but the long-term plan is like that's what people made it sound like it's like oh screw the long-term plan we need a guy right now it's like
00:21:50
Speaker
I would run, I want a GM that's going to be more long-term like focused. Right, now granted if we come into the summer we sign a Nelson Valdez analog, I think there's going to be a lot of understandable anger and maybe at that point I would be like, okay maybe it's time to vote this guy out. Then you judge, then you judge for it, right?
00:22:14
Speaker
You know, it's going to be interesting. It will be interesting to see how this summer affects ultimately the way people receive this because the GM's job is not just to sign designated players. It's to make a competitive team and I think that that's what they've done.
00:22:35
Speaker
There's a limit to that. At some point, you need to put up or shut up. But they've gone down three windows without signing a DP. It's led to some understanding. Sure, sure. But look who our DPs were on one end. It's like those guys, those aren't replacement level DPs or anything like that. No, I mean, the circumstances that led us to overcoming Martin's were not
00:23:03
Speaker
are not common. I mean, Oba was really, a lot of ways, that was a perfect player to sign at that time. I think that the decision to let him go, totally understandable. But you also knew what you were getting into when you signed Oba. And so, yeah, he was a hell of a player. But he also wasn't someone who you could afford to build around because
00:23:30
Speaker
And if you were looking for an actual oboe replacement now, you would have to build a team around that. That would be really hard to do, and that's not a one window building process. I totally agree. Well, that's probably a good place to call this a segment. We have a bunch of questions that we're going to be able to take. You're listening to no study at this.
00:23:55
Speaker
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00:25:32
Speaker
All right gonna put you on the spot here golfer dav golfer dav or Dave o2 Probably golfer Dave no either Just discuss just discuss how depressing things I've looked so far and provide any possible ideas on how it gets better I need help
00:25:51
Speaker
Yeah, I mean it's not an easy decision. I do think that I'm in an easy solution. I think that if this team can get healthy, I really do believe that the talent on the team when healthy is
Injuries and Hope for Improvement
00:26:07
Speaker
And I think that's the part where it frustrates me because at the beginning of the season, I was pretty bullish on the talent the team had. And I didn't think they needed to absolutely, without question, add more talent. Because I thought they had a pretty talented team coming into the season. You know, if Victor Rodriguez and Will Bruin can get just those two, they can get healthy.
00:26:33
Speaker
I mean, that's just two big additions. And neither one of those players were available. If Nico Lidero ends up getting cut from Uruguay, which I think would be awful for him personally, I would feel bad for him. But I do think he'd be motivated. And I think that you bring in those three players over the next few weeks.
00:26:55
Speaker
I mean, I think the Sounders are going to be able to get results. And I think Victor Rodriguez is an under- He's good. Yeah, he's really- I mean, I can really think that his absence has been underrated. And I think a lot of my confidence going into this year was predicated on the belief that Victor Rodriguez was going to be healthy and ready to go. Yeah. I mean, a healthy roster, if you look at it beginning of the season and the guys they added on top of it, you had to go in the season feeling pretty good. I mean, until Jordan Morris got hurt,
00:27:24
Speaker
I thought this roster looked really good. I thought going into the season Jordan Morris will ruin as your top two forwards is almost an embarrassment of riches. Yeah, that's good. And I don't think you necessarily needed a number nine at that point. Clearly they need one now.
00:27:43
Speaker
But I was really, and that's what I think is so frustrating about this, is that I was really, really excited about seeing this team. And then, like, you know, if I was in, like, on, you know, up until the point Jordan Morris got hurt.
00:27:59
Speaker
I think I would have been, I was 100% on board with the decisions the team was making. Now, there were two and a half months between Morris being hurt and the window closing. I think that's where the issue is. But I really do think that if they can get reasonably healthy, they'll still be fine. It's just that their margin for error is getting really small. Very small. Very small.
00:28:20
Speaker
OK, next question. I am 333. If we miss the playoffs, is Smetcher gone? What if we come in last? Is Clint done? I guess that's three questions. What if we come in last is probably not necessarily a separate question. But I will say that given what we know today, which is Clint's a very limited player,
00:28:43
Speaker
We don't know who's there to support him. It's hard for me to see a scenario where Clint's back next year. And I don't think that it, I think it's a little much to say that it was a mistake to bring him back at all this year. But I think that we need to have realistic explanation about what he can do. And what he can't do is be the main guy on all this. The Schmetzer,
00:29:10
Speaker
If we miss the playoffs, it's hard for me to see him coming back. I think that I'm a huge fan of Spencer's. I really like him personally, and I would be really sad to see him leave my hope. I think the best case scenario, like, Luna, I mean, if he turns the season around and they go on to win Emma's Cup, he'll be back. I don't think that's a controversial thing to say.
00:29:38
Speaker
But I would have a hard time imagining a scenario where he's back if they miss the playoffs, unless it's like a great rally at the end of the year. But I would like to think, I still think, even though it's kind of unprecedented, I'd like to think that there's a possibility of him being in the organization, even if it's not a separate organization. As a side question,
00:30:04
Speaker
If they miss the playoffs and Garth decides to fire Schmetzer, how much of the blame is going to go on? Do you think Garth has the stones to fire Schmetzer at the end of the season before the vote?
00:30:17
Speaker
Well, the vote luckily is before the end of the season, right? Sure, sure. And this is another thing I will say, is that if you are, like I feel like there's this division that's starting to crop up that it's either like, you're, and it kind of like, and it was kind of the same thing as Siggy, where it was like, either you believe it's Spencer's fault or you believe it's Garth's fault.
00:30:39
Speaker
And if you leave it to Garth's fault, you want him fired. Well, I have bad news. Chances are, if Garth is not back at his gym, Spencer's not back here. And so if you're going to vote to fire Garth, understand that you're probably also voting to fire Spencer. That said, I don't think
00:31:09
Speaker
Garth would fire Spencer before the end. Right. Under almost any circumstances. Right. I agree. I agree. Let's see. Next question. A-bomb AD. Can you make a case for going all-in in the US Open Cup as the only path to getting back to the CCL? Or is sixth place in the West more realistic as a path?
00:31:31
Speaker
So he's saying do you pursue open cup win to get CCL or do you pursue sixth place to get the playoffs?
00:31:53
Speaker
the early rounds of the Open Cup are going to be kind of what they are regardless. I don't think the Sounders are going to sacrifice games in the next few weeks to pursue an Open Cup victory. Now, if they make it to the quarterfinals and they've been losing
00:32:09
Speaker
all these MLS games in the meantime, I could see them changing as like, look, this is the one thing we have left to play for. Because I do think when you lose a couple, two, three more games in a row, I think it's going to be mathematically very difficult to make the playoffs. And I think that it's at that point proven to change your focus.
00:32:31
Speaker
But I actually don't know that the Sounders necessarily want to be in the Champions League next year, given the way that the season has played out. And so if they are in the Champions League as a result of winning the MLS Cup,
00:32:44
Speaker
great let's do this we'll have a fun you know it's like we'll do this again right and in fact some ways this season will just bolster the idea that you can start slow and you can recover right right but I don't think getting into the Champions League via open cup and missing the playoffs
00:33:02
Speaker
is a preferred outcome, frankly, for the centers. Like, I would love winning another Open Cup. There's a lot of reasons to want a roof of that. It's fun winning anything. So I'm not saying that it's a bad thing, but I don't know that organizationally that's, like, making Champions League, I don't think is the goal next year. It's finishing the season as strong as you can. Yeah, yeah. I mean, especially after this year, where it's like, there's a short enough off-season, and then with Champions League on top of it, like, do they want another,
00:33:31
Speaker
But I don't know that many fans would be like, frankly, the fans like there would be some fans like I think we would all enjoy an open cup run. I don't think we should. I don't think anyone at the center's front office is under the impression that winning Open Cup is going to save anyone's job. No.
00:33:47
Speaker
Because at the end it's it will still be it will be like it's like winning in some ways It's not that different than winning Cascadia Cup. It feels great. It's a nice thing to be able to say you won I think it's a nice trophy. I love it I think the tournament's a lot of fun, but no season do you go into it at the beginning? I'm saying I want to win open cup or I want to win Cascadia. Like those are just secondary goals
00:34:08
Speaker
I mean, that's fine if that's what you want, but that's not anything long term for your team. And if you're voting, on top of that, if you're voting against Gharas because of these, and he wins those two, and you vote for him because he wins the Open Cup, then your priorities are kind of backwards. I mean, the Open Cup is great. Like, it's great to be able to look back on the seasons and be like, yeah, if someone's won four Open Cups, it's not nothing. But like, it's not winning them one's cup. It's not winning even support a shield. Right. It's secondary. Right, right, right.
00:34:39
Speaker
Let's see, Kenwise2020S, pick our first realistic multi-goal game where we will win at home. In my opinion, I'm not sure it's easy as DCU if Nico isn't back. Yeah, I mean, I would think that that's the obvious. DCNet United is the next center's home game. It's probably the worst team that they're going to face at home for the foreseeable future. If they don't get multiple goals in that game,
00:35:08
Speaker
it's fair to wonder like when when are they right right and i'm not sure i don't know i don't know i mean if you can't score multiple goals against rsl who is not a good road team you can't score multiple goals against cc united i mean you might be looking at september yeah like when the team's all healthy and ready to go yeah like that's i'm
00:35:32
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, RSL, when they came in, they were already pretty injured and depleted. Yeah. And we couldn't score against them. Of course. And given all this, what I think is probably funny, there's a part of it that thinks the Sunners are going to win this week, not because it makes sense. Right. But because it makes no sense. Yeah, yeah. It's kind of like that LAFC game where they went down there and was like, they should not. They're playing this good. Or the Toronto game. Or the Toronto game. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:36:00
Speaker
Let's see, Jeff Nothen asks, how much impact does being at the bottom of the standings have on a DP wanting to play here, signing, i.e. not wanting to play for a bottom team?
00:36:09
Speaker
I don't think it has any, I don't think any DP looks at the standings before they sign and says, oh this is the team. I think what they look at is, you know, they've probably visited, they know what the atmosphere is like, they know what the organization is like, they know what the history is like. I think designated players are probably pretty
00:36:31
Speaker
inclined to look at the current state of the team no matter what it is. It would be like this is temporary. What have they done in the past? What do I think they're going to do in the future? What's fan support like? What are the facilities like? I would say that if there's a thing that's hurting the sounder's chances, it's much more along lines of
00:36:51
Speaker
How nice are your facilities than where you are in the standings? As a player, probably you're going to be more impressed with that they've been to back-to-back finals rather than they're struggling in the season. Honestly, I would imagine most DPs don't even know where they are. That's just not how they look at it.
00:37:13
Speaker
the right
00:37:44
Speaker
Chris Seattle asks what teams should I be watching this World Cup for our shiny new striker?
00:37:50
Speaker
Peru, I would say is a good one to be looking at. I would say Tunisia, potentially. I would say Chile, potentially. I'd say those are probably the teams to be looking at. Just to pull the ones out of my off-talking head. That's quite some clues there. All right, let's see.
00:38:17
Speaker
I think this is our last question, actually. MuffinTopModel asks, which is worse for a club? Frustration or apathy? Oh, apathy is clear. And I will say that I think it's actually an important distinction.
00:38:32
Speaker
I think that the worst thing, I would be much more worried about the long-term health of this organization if people would just stop caring. If there weren't people stomping up and down, and so I guess in that way,
00:38:50
Speaker
like if for instance like if the comment section just died on sound or heart that would be more concerning than it would make my life easier but it would be more concerning than if people were just raging right right similarly i think it would be much more concerning it is like if we get to the point where in the 15th minute of a game
00:39:12
Speaker
, and
00:39:31
Speaker
you know how and the sounders don't ever share that information right but they know how many people walk through the gates yeah they know how much beer sales there have been they know how much concession sales they know all these things that these aren't things that i have access to or that they are inclined to share but they are absolutely important metrics that determine how passionate fans are how strongly they feel and i think that anger is a much preferable emotion
00:39:56
Speaker
to apathy, and now don't get me wrong, am I gonna, as a journalist and as a fan and as someone who tries to make sure that accurate information is out in the world, am I gonna ignore when people are essentially making up facts, like the other day I was looking, I got into this, or I chimed in on a Twitter discussion when someone said Adrian dropped out of the GM role as soon as his vote was up for election, and it's like,
00:40:25
Speaker
No, no stood for election in 2012 two years later. He stepped down. Yeah With two years left to go before his next vote so I'm definitely gonna and so I'm inclined to want to set the record straight similarly this idea that Garth hasn't done anything this year right is just not accurate. They signed to Tam players. Those are players that
00:40:47
Speaker
As far as I can tell, that's money that came out of the sounder's pocket in order to pay for it because it was part of the discretionary TAM fund. So it's like there's areas where I feel like inclined to correct wrong information, but I do think that the anger in and of itself
00:41:04
Speaker
is a sign of health and that people care. I mean, I haven't been around long enough to really understand Mariners fandom, but I get the sense that maybe there is a lot more apathy after 35 or 40 years of not making it to the World Series.
00:41:24
Speaker
but yeah so I mean I don't think that the anger is necessarily bad it's just that I think it's important for us to be angry about real things and not be angry about things that we've conjured up in our head yes at least at the end of the day your anger is real but
00:41:41
Speaker
Like, make sure you're directing the anger at the right things. Right, because it doesn't help if you're angry about things that didn't actually happen. Right. Right. Right. Like, we don't need to make up reasons to be mad. There's plenty of legitimate reasons to be mad. There's lots of reasons to be mad, yes. Exactly.
00:41:59
Speaker
All right, that's it. All right, well, that's awesome. Thanks to Hellbound Brewing for unknowingly hosting us. Hopefully the background audio was not too distracting for you. It's a Star Wars pinball. Yeah, it is nice to actually be looking at someone when we're recording as opposed to...
00:42:21
Speaker
secret of the trade. We do many of our recording sessions. Most of our recording sessions are done remotely, and we are online, as the kids say. Yeah, it's been fun just to actually listen to the conversation, other than just to tune you out most of the time. Right, exactly, which I know you're very guilty of doing. So anyway, thanks to our sponsors, Focal Wines, Verity Credit Union, Queen Anne Acupuncture,
00:42:49
Speaker
And, of course, our broadcast partner, BoostJumper Studios, who provided the equipment that we used to record this particular episode. So, thanks a lot to listening, to all your listeners. And I am Jeremiah Chan, sending off on behalf of Likit. This is no sardietes. Remember, you'll never be alone.
00:43:10
Speaker
Green Douglas fir where the water's cut through. Down to wild mountains and tangents you flew. Canadian northwest to the ocean so blue. It's Rollong, Columbia Rollong. Rollong, Columbia Rollong. Rollong, Columbia Rollong. Your power is turning our darkness to dawn. Rollong, Columbia Rollong.
00:43:51
Speaker
We love you. Let's win another one!