Transcript
Speaker: Thanks for tuning in to the Loser Kid Pinball Podcast.
Speaker: We are on episode 139.
Speaker: With me, my co-captain, as always.
Speaker: Scott Larson.
Speaker: And I am Josh Roop.
Speaker: And Scott, before we get talking about the wide array of notes that I've jotted down for our wonderful episode, why don't you tell us about our sponsor?
Speaker: Well, so there's Flipping Out Pinball.
Speaker: So if you want those new JAWS accessories, if you're a completionist and you need to have every single thing for your JAWS,
Speaker: Then go ahead and they have armor kit.
Speaker: They have the topper, which we'll talk about.
Speaker: And the side art, the internal art, the holographic image that has Jaws coming out and eating you.
Speaker: Just ask Zach about it.
Speaker: He'll set something up.
Speaker: So go ahead and contact Zach and Nicole Manny at Flippin' Out Pinball, and they will hook you up.
Speaker: I want to give a quick shout out to their technician, Greg Bone.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Had some issues with Jaws.
Speaker: And it was as simple as like, just leave the game on for like five or six hours.
Speaker: It was just like, as you're playing, it says SD card validation error or something like that.
Speaker: Oh.
Speaker: And so he's like, yeah, just leave your game on for like five or six hours.
Speaker: Turn it off.
Speaker: And then play it again.
Speaker: See if that does it.
Speaker: And if not, swap out the card.
Speaker: If not, then we'll go further.
Speaker: And it was cool because like I did that and then I forgot that I'd done that.
Speaker: And then he followed up.
Speaker: He was like, yeah, he's like, hey, tell me about it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So like I love customer service like that.
Speaker: Like they're making sure you're getting taken care of.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So just a shout out to Greg.
Speaker: So Greg, Greg's a good guy.
Speaker: So everyone is down there.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So before we get going, okay, well, may this is part of getting going.
Speaker: obviously we did the stern tour right we did yeah and i feel bad because no one's really maybe someone's talked about this maybe triple dream um but at the end of the tour dwight sullivan pulled us aside and he said it would be a huge favor to me if you tell people if you're coming to expo this year go to dwight's he does he does a game show every year
Speaker: And last year, wasn't it Saturday?
Speaker: Did he say it was Saturday?
Speaker: It's Saturday.
Speaker: It's always like the last one on Saturday.
Speaker: And it's a game show.
Speaker: And like a couple of years ago, it was like family feud style.
Speaker: This one is let's make a deal.
Speaker: He did it last year.
Speaker: And they give away immaculate prizes.
Speaker: They gave away a freaking Mando topper this last, this last.
Speaker: Yeah, no, Dwight's a good guy.
Speaker: And he, okay, if you, if you question anything about Dwight's commitment to pinball and his enthusiasm, then go to this because you will see he does not hold back.
Speaker: He is all in and he's super excited about everything.
Speaker: And it's just funny to me because Dwight's like a really, really lovable guy.
Speaker: Like if you don't know him on a personal level, go to pinball expo, get to meet the man, buy him a cookie and he'll love you for the rest of your life.
Speaker: Like, it's funny because I did let's make a deal.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And I ended up with some extra tickets, but I didn't have enough to get like the banner or something like that.
Speaker: And I just went to Dwight and I was like, Dwight, come on, dude.
Speaker: Like I'm, I'm like, I'm,
Speaker: five ticket shorts or whatever.
Speaker: And he's like, no, no ticket, no, you know, no banner.
Speaker: And it's funny because I just thought I'm the kind of guy like, what's the worst that's going to happen?
Speaker: If you ask, they're going to say no, you know what I'm saying?
Speaker: So, okay.
Speaker: You said no.
Speaker: Cool.
Speaker: So I walked off.
Speaker: Dwight comes up to me at the stern tour.
Speaker: He's like, Josh, I just, I want to tell you, I'm really sorry about telling you no.
Speaker: Oh, that's Dwight.
Speaker: You're good.
Speaker: He's like, Oh, that makes my heart feel better.
Speaker: And I was like,
Speaker: You were worried about that with me?
Speaker: I just asked you.
Speaker: I'm pretty sure this is a Wayne Gretzky quote, where he's, you miss 100% of the shots you don't take.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: So, you know, it's, okay, the bottom line is they can always say no.
Speaker: But no, he's a good guy.
Speaker: Yeah, and people don't get offended if they have to say no.
Speaker: You know what I'm saying?
Speaker: So definitely go to Let's Make a Deal.
Speaker: He definitely makes it entertaining and worthwhile.
Speaker: And to be blunt, you're going to be tired of playing pinball.
Speaker: And so go in and take a little decompression game show.
Speaker: It was pretty fun.
Speaker: I think Dwight purposely didn't pick me.
Speaker: And I was saying some pretty random stuff.
Speaker: Because that's the thing.
Speaker: They come into the audience.
Speaker: He picks people from the audience, right?
Speaker: And so if you dress up, it gives you a better chance.
Speaker: You know, there's just different things.
Speaker: And Ellen and I were sitting there and we were joking back and forth about some stuff.
Speaker: But I think at one point, he asked, like, tell me something unique or interesting about yourself.
Speaker: And I just yelled out the first thing that came to my mind.
Speaker: I was like, I've got a third nipple.
Speaker: Do you?
Speaker: No.
Speaker: Yes, no, maybe.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And Dwight must have heard me because he went to a turn.
Speaker: I think he saw me out of the corner of his eye.
Speaker: And then he turned back like,
Speaker: Yeah, I'm not acknowledging that.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: I didn't know about your thriple, but okay.
Speaker: Yeah, my thriple.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I didn't know it either until after I got married and my wife works at the OB and explains.
Speaker: She's like, yeah, that's- Okay.
Speaker: If you have like a mole that's on your nipple line, that's actually a high possibility.
Speaker: It's not functional, just so you know.
Speaker: No, no, it's not.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: We're moving on.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: You brought it up.
Speaker: You brought it up.
Speaker: I did bring it up.
Speaker: I did.
Speaker: I'm going to regret this for the rest of my life.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Which side is that on our left or right?
Speaker: I can't remember.
Speaker: I think the left.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: As he checks himself.
Speaker: It's tiny.
Speaker: It's seriously, I thought it was like a freckle for the most part of my life.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: You know what I'm saying?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Anyhow.
Speaker: Meanwhile.
Speaker: Let's talk about the thing that everyone's just ranting and raving about right now.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Jaws accessories.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So what these revealed yesterday, there was a two minute sizzle reel.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: What they show the shooter rod in our art blades, top speaker lights.
Speaker: And they showed a side armor side armor.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Which is pretty much the Ellie, but in black instead of white.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Which is great.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: What are your, what's your initial thoughts?
Speaker: Scott.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I'm going to save the topper for last because I think that's where we're going to get a lot of our juice.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: I'm, I'm a little, okay.
Speaker: I actually do like that.
Speaker: The side armor is similar to the LE.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: I do like that because in many ways it feels, I I've never understood this, but like on, I,
Speaker: Godzilla LE.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: You see the side armor and then you see the LE and you're, and you're asking yourself, why didn't the LE have this side armor?
Speaker: Because it's cooler.
Speaker: You think this is cooler than the white?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: No, no, no.
Speaker: But what I'm saying is this is similar.
Speaker: Like, you know, it has the bite out of it.
Speaker: It gives a little bit, you know, so it looks cool, but it doesn't like upstage the, uh, the LE.
Speaker: I think the LE is great.
Speaker: And the bottom line is if you want to powder coat, um, that and make it white and, but this one also has, uh, like the jaws logo in it.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: So does the, um, does the LE have that?
Speaker: You know, we really should have done our research.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: No, no.
Speaker: Legitimately.
Speaker: I, I don't remember seeing the Ellie having that.
Speaker: I, I don't remember it either.
Speaker: Cause that, that's the thing that jumped out at me.
Speaker: What jumped out at me is that I was like, Oh, that's interesting that there's even like something a little, um, like more custom on that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, so that, that surprised me a little bit, but I don't think it's a huge deal.
Speaker: And so that was, that was my question is that, is there a, is there a big enough difference on this?
Speaker: Um, I think so.
Speaker: I mean, they, the one they keep showing it on is the premium and I think it looks really great with the blue.
Speaker: Sure.
Speaker: And with, um, Brody harpooning Bruce.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Um, no, I agree with you.
Speaker: I feel like this one pops more than the white.
Speaker: Yeah, it's, but you know, it's so that's the only thing that really surprises me because in some ways when you have the LE
Speaker: you kind of expect that you're going to have the best version of everything, right?
Speaker: Well, so that, that's what surprised me a little bit about Godzilla.
Speaker: Is that the, is the King Ghidorah?
Speaker: Is that what it are?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It has that.
Speaker: It looks three headed like the high.
Speaker: It looks really cool on the side armor, but it doesn't seem to have that same pop on the LE.
Speaker: So I was wondering now having a jaws logo, is that a,
Speaker: Big deal or is it kind of hit or miss?
Speaker: I didn't think that was as much of a big deal.
Speaker: So I just pulled up the Ellie on pin side and you're right.
Speaker: It doesn't have the job.
Speaker: Doesn't have it.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: That's what I thought.
Speaker: But then again, but then again on the side art, you've got a massive logo that says jaws right below the bite.
Speaker: So it would it be like the teenage meat to Ninja Turtles top or where it has turtles turtles.
Speaker: Yeah, it probably would have.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So at least on the premium, you don't have jaws on the side.
Speaker: It's literally just Brody fighting the shark.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So,
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: So there's that.
Speaker: I think I agree with you on this.
Speaker: I personally do like the black better, but I do think the white pops really well on the Ellie because of the way that it's a lot of blue.
Speaker: And so there's, yeah, I think honestly, I think the Ellie art was kind of done around the white trim.
Speaker: Yeah, but didn't Michael also say it was kind of from an underneath, like an under the sea view?
Speaker: Yeah, yep.
Speaker: So it makes sense to do it that way.
Speaker: So I think it's nice.
Speaker: It doesn't feel like it's upstaging the LE, but it does give a different option.
Speaker: $250, is that too much or just right?
Speaker: If you powder coat a game, how much does it cost?
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I've never power coded three years.
Speaker: 300 bucks.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So if, if you go to the effort yourself to take all your, take all your armor off and you have to take it in powder coat it.
Speaker: So if you are upgrading the look of your game for about 300 bucks to, you know, so shipping with tax or whatever, that's about right.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's, it is totally a luxury purchase.
Speaker: There is no need to buy these unless you really like the look of them.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Uh, but they are kind of fun.
Speaker: Like I got, I got the, um, the B Arthur Katanas for Deadpool.
Speaker: Nice.
Speaker: And it's just a very small thing.
Speaker: Um, it's a way of, of accessorizing.
Speaker: If you want to do that, I don't think it's required for this one, but you do notice it, especially with the shark bite on it.
Speaker: Yeah, definitely.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: There are people even selling like aftermarket, you know, basically knockoff side armor with the bite out of it.
Speaker: And I bet those are 150 or something like that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So for an officially licensed product.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: You're not doing too bad.
Speaker: It's fun.
Speaker: That's the only side armor I've ever bought is for the Deadpool.
Speaker: but I'm glad I have it.
Speaker: It's Deadpool is one of those games where I really don't think I'll sell it because it is, it is a fast, fun, short game.
Speaker: Yes, it really is.
Speaker: It's a good game.
Speaker: All right, let's move on.
Speaker: Let's move on.
Speaker: I would say thumbs up.
Speaker: Good price.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Uh, inner art blades.
Speaker: Um, I, if you've listened to this podcast before, I assume you have, I'm not, I'm not a huge fan of inner art blades.
Speaker: Like they're good.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I like art blades.
Speaker: So I, I'm an art blade guy.
Speaker: I'll, I'll let you say your piece and then I'll tell you why you're wrong.
Speaker: I do like that.
Speaker: That adds more ambiance to the game.
Speaker: I will give it that.
Speaker: I just think that mirror blades gives more pop to a game.
Speaker: And I, I just haven't felt like there's a game where the art blades are better than the mirror blades for the game.
Speaker: That's just me.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I, uh, I had mirror blades on Iron Man and the mirror blades looked really good.
Speaker: You have them on your attack from Mars.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Maybe not your medieval madness.
Speaker: No, no.
Speaker: Medieval madness, I don't.
Speaker: I actually still have the black on my medieval madness.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I'm looking over there.
Speaker: Cactus Canyon has the inner art because it came with it.
Speaker: And I believe that's mirror blades on Monster Bash.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: So it's, I do like inner art because it feels when I put them on my Spider-Man, it really made the game stand out because it felt like you were entering Spider-Man's world because it had the
Speaker: buildings on both sides and it looked really cool.
Speaker: So I do like that.
Speaker: And I also like that they made it environmental.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So that was my issue with Mandalorian because Mandalorian, the,
Speaker: the blades that they're selling.
Speaker: And usually they're selling something that's different than the, than the LE, right?
Speaker: That's the whole point of an LE is you get something exclusive that is not available to other people.
Speaker: Usually it's comparable though.
Speaker: So like, you know, for like turtles, the inner blades were, were comparable to the LE.
Speaker: They weren't the same, but they were comparable.
Speaker: I didn't like Mandalorian where it had the faces.
Speaker: I thought that looked weird.
Speaker: It didn't feel environmental.
Speaker: It felt like, Hey, here's a billboard for faces of Mandalorian characters.
Speaker: Um, so I do like these, uh, because they do have that, um,
Speaker: that sea look and it flows with the, with the play field because the play field is, is an ocean.
Speaker: And really if you're looking for a visual impact, a hundred bucks.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's a pretty cheap upgrade.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's a cheap upgrade for that relatively.
Speaker: I know this is all subjective, right?
Speaker: Like, okay, but a hundred dollars is not, that is not unreasonable.
Speaker: It's sorry.
Speaker: It's just funny because it reminds me of a story at work.
Speaker: I fixed someone's air conditioner.
Speaker: It was like $95 with the part and everything.
Speaker: I was pretty proud.
Speaker: They're like, so what is my cost?
Speaker: And I was like, you got out relatively cheap.
Speaker: It was $95.
Speaker: And they looked at me and the homeowner says, man, you must wipe your butt with $100 bills.
Speaker: I was like, no.
Speaker: I'll do it with this one.
Speaker: $95 is expensive to me.
Speaker: And I was like,
Speaker: Oh, okay.
Speaker: Well, I mean, this is an apocryphal story, but it's told in various forms, right?
Speaker: Where a person takes in their car or, you know, a nuclear sub or whatever, whatever it is that I guess making this funny sound.
Speaker: I don't know what's going on.
Speaker: So they call the technician technician comes in, looks at it and,
Speaker: And pulls out, you know, pulls out a hammer or a wrench or whatever.
Speaker: And like gets in there for five minutes, turns a few things and then says, okay, that'll be, you know, $10,000 or whatever the money is.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And he's like, oh my gosh, that's stupid.
Speaker: I could do that.
Speaker: And he's like, I want an itemized bill.
Speaker: And he's like, okay.
Speaker: And so, so he itemized it, you know, the technician, he or she.
Speaker: And says, you know, turning screw or tightening bolt, $5.
Speaker: Knowing which bolt to tighten, $10,000.
Speaker: You know, it's kind of along those lines.
Speaker: And I've used this, I've joked around because there's a lot of times in my job where I'm watching surgeries happen.
Speaker: I, I, yeah, there's a little more at the beginning, a little more at the end, but for the most part I'm there.
Speaker: And I, I was joking about that with one of the surgeons and the surgeon said, actually, you're not compensated for what you do.
Speaker: You're more compensated for what you know, because if something happens, then you spring into action and you can say, and you can do something.
Speaker: So it's, it's similar to if I hire a heating and air conditioning person that comes over and
Speaker: and they fix something in two minutes.
Speaker: Great.
Speaker: Because I didn't have to spend five hours trying to figure out what it was.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Let's, let's move on to the shooter rod.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: You're grabbing a barrel.
Speaker: And honestly, hasn't this been floating around as a, as like, like mod thinkers have been making this thing.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I went, no, I get, okay.
Speaker: I'll, I'll go first on this.
Speaker: I actually don't like the aftermarket shooter rods.
Speaker: I don't.
Speaker: They feel different.
Speaker: They shoot different.
Speaker: And I've always been frustrated from an engineering standpoint that there is when you pull back the rod, there's a conservation of momentum that when you're moving a mass forward and it hits a silver ball, it's going to transfer that momentum to the ball.
Speaker: This may be a little deep in the woods.
Speaker: But it's really hard to get the same sort of mass in an aftermarket shooter rod because it's usually heavier.
Speaker: And they've had problems with this.
Speaker: Like I bought the little egg thing for Avengers Infinity Quest.
Speaker: And I hate it because it's too heavy.
Speaker: It doesn't actually work with the spring associated with the rod.
Speaker: And from an engineering standpoint, it frustrates me because you should compensate for that.
Speaker: That is an easy play testing.
Speaker: To be blunt, I'm pointing now, okay?
Speaker: So I bought the shooter thing for Rush, which is cool because it has the little flash thing, okay?
Speaker: So on YouTube, you can actually see it behind me, okay?
Speaker: The thing is enormous.
Speaker: It's like a hostess cupcake.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And if you pull it all the way back, it does not go.
Speaker: The ball does not fly all the way around.
Speaker: Now, the skill shots on Rush are short plunges anyway, so it's not as huge of a deal.
Speaker: And I only bought it because I wanted to be a completionist for Rush because I got the topper, I got the LE, I got that.
Speaker: Because it's your favorite.
Speaker: Rush is your jam.
Speaker: That's my band.
Speaker: I'm good with that.
Speaker: And the topper actually looks really cool.
Speaker: It was kind of expensive, but it looks really cool.
Speaker: But the shooter rod, I bought that really to be a completionist, but it's not as good as the original.
Speaker: The original is better, and Avengers Infinity Quest had the same issue.
Speaker: I'm not sure why they make these rods that are significantly heavier than what the spring supports.
Speaker: And this could be an easy play test, like put it in one of your games and just see if it works.
Speaker: It feels like it's phoning it in a little bit.
Speaker: So I don't know if this one's going to have the same problem, but I typically don't like the feel of aftermarket ones.
Speaker: Well, and my question too is, I don't know how much of this is being produced at Stern.
Speaker: If I, and how much of it's outsourced.
Speaker: Maybe.
Speaker: Cause like this, this is one thing Gomez talked about, right?
Speaker: On our, on our interview with him is like,
Speaker: Well, if they do an order for like a thousand of these, they can do cheaper price on the topper.
Speaker: But then if they only do an order of 200 of them, like the, you know, cause they're, they have to get the product from different people and stuff like that.
Speaker: So I don't know how much of this is actually a scale.
Speaker: I mean, obviously we we've seen that with, if you're making 5,000 games or a hundred games, you're the car, the, the bill of material is going to be,
Speaker: different so my my question is i wonder if they even do i wonder if this is one of the things where it just gets shipped to stern in a box it's ready to go and they just ship it out or if they actually manufacture in a house i feel like i suspect i suspect it's made outside i think so too and it's it's a simple question it's it's designed by someone who's associated with the license yeah
Speaker: They design it, they ship it out.
Speaker: The person makes the cast of it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But it is a mechanical part.
Speaker: It doesn't feel that the mechanical considerations are going into the shooter rod the way it should be.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: And that directly interacts with the game.
Speaker: So I intentionally did not buy it for Godzilla.
Speaker: Same here.
Speaker: I don't buy them at all because just because of what you just said, they're 150 bucks.
Speaker: I feel like they, they hinder the game instead of enhance the game.
Speaker: I just don't feel like it's a smart investment over my other shoulder though.
Speaker: I'm pointing to the Jurassic park one.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Which, which is really cool looking.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's, it's kind of ridiculous.
Speaker: It is cool looking because it lights up, but really everybody on Jurassic parks just hitting the button to auto launch it.
Speaker: It's true.
Speaker: Alrighty.
Speaker: The speaker light system.
Speaker: And this is new for Jaws, but I think this is going to go on most games moving forward.
Speaker: It should also go back to some of their previous games, I believe.
Speaker: I hope so.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I'm going to go first on this one.
Speaker: I think, first off, I think this is a brilliant idea.
Speaker: You know, pinball collectors, we like shiny, bright things.
Speaker: And this is shiny, bright.
Speaker: It interacts.
Speaker: I haven't seen this in person yet, but the way that it does the radar and ties in with the actual fish finder in the game, that's really cool.
Speaker: The blood effect, it does that.
Speaker: I just think this is a really cool idea.
Speaker: And the thing I love about this is because it is universal from game to game, I feel like it's going to be more readily available, unlike some of these other products.
Speaker: It's pretty much like the Rush Expression Lights that I don't even know if they finished making.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so that's the thing is like when you make a product where it can be made from game to game, like a shaker motor or an Expression Light Kit for your speakers, I think it's a simple way to enhance your game.
Speaker: I mean, let's be honest.
Speaker: Mod makers have been doing speaker light expression.
Speaker: They've been doing speaker lights for a little while now.
Speaker: So this isn't a shocker, but it's cool that it's integrated into the game.
Speaker: I think, personally me, $200 isn't terrible.
Speaker: I feel like that's on par with some of the other mod maker speaker kits, and you get more interaction with this.
Speaker: So I think this is, if you're looking for a great addition to your game, I think this is good bang for the buck.
Speaker: What do you think, Scott?
Speaker: I, okay.
Speaker: I do agree by, by the way, I did just, just out of curiosity, I went and looked, do you remember how much the shooter rod is for jaws?
Speaker: I don't.
Speaker: Oh, one 50, one 50.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Do you know how much it was for Avengers?
Speaker: Not a clue.
Speaker: One 80.
Speaker: Oh, really?
Speaker: So that's interesting.
Speaker: They dropped price on that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And actually I'm looking at their,
Speaker: I'm looking at Stern's website as we speak.
Speaker: I'm looking at flipping out.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All the pricing there.
Speaker: Your Rush Shooter Rod's there.
Speaker: Your cupcake.
Speaker: Your light-up cupcake for $140.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And so the Jaws.
Speaker: So that's interesting.
Speaker: There is a little bit of a...
Speaker: I want to say dynamic pricing, but maybe a special pricing on that.
Speaker: And the, okay, I will say the one that the shooter rod that does look really boss though, is the black night sword rage one.
Speaker: Oh yeah.
Speaker: It looks cool.
Speaker: It's so metal.
Speaker: It looks really cool.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And, uh, and so that would be something I would get.
Speaker: So case by case basis.
Speaker: So I thought that was interesting.
Speaker: And the topper for Avengers and Fendi quest was seven 50.
Speaker: So that's interesting.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Uh, speaker lights.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Pinball is visual.
Speaker: And part of the reason why you buy something that's above the pro model is usually scratching that visual or that interactive itch.
Speaker: Because what it does is it, it combines to the experience.
Speaker: I mean, there's a reason why I will typically buy toppers because they do provide extra little cool bling things.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it's, you usually don't see it when you're playing the game, but people who are walking down, they, they see it and they was like, wow, this looks more dressed up than a typical thing.
Speaker: Speaker lights.
Speaker: Also, I haven't got them for a Godzilla, but my question now is, do I get the interactive lights that, you know, that will come, that will come back to Godzilla or do I get the burning lights?
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Have you, have you considered either one for your Godzilla?
Speaker: I haven't.
Speaker: Honestly, I put in the speaker kit, the upgrade.
Speaker: And ever since I did that, I just, I didn't know if I could or not.
Speaker: So I just really haven't pursued it.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Because you wanted better sound on Godzilla.
Speaker: Oh yeah.
Speaker: I got the pin woofer.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Amazing.
Speaker: If you're looking for a kit,
Speaker: It's the way to go.
Speaker: Seriously.
Speaker: I'm totally considering that for, for Godzilla because that's, you know, that's kind of a forever game.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: It's, it's going to be the, it, it already is, but it will be the next medieval madness, except there won't be 3000 of them.
Speaker: There'll be 15,000 of them around.
Speaker: Oh yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: No, I agree.
Speaker: They'll be making this one for a long time.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So it's Jaws.
Speaker: I like it because the, again, it's a visual cue, the interaction.
Speaker: And that's what we noticed when we were looking at John Wick between the, the pro, the premium and the LE, the LE had the expression lights and, and it had the speaker lights.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it did make a difference.
Speaker: Like you could feel more, more connection with the game.
Speaker: This is getting back to the success of Guns N' Roses from Jersey Jack, where it is, it is a show.
Speaker: It's an experience.
Speaker: And this brings that all to a certain game.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: The moment everyone's been waiting for, we did talk about the price is 200 bucks on the speaker.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that's not okay.
Speaker: Really?
Speaker: I'm putting any sort of accessory under $250.
Speaker: It's certainly not a need to have, but they're fun.
Speaker: And if, if you're, if you're buying a machine, that's seven to $9,000 really economies of scale.
Speaker: That's not that much.
Speaker: Okay, let's talk topper.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: You want to go first?
Speaker: You want me to?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: That didn't sound like a... It's so frustrating.
Speaker: It's so frustrating because we did talk with George Gomez about toppers.
Speaker: And this will get to the end.
Speaker: I actually did bring up when he talked about toppers and prices and I said, okay, however...
Speaker: You did make a really boss topper for $450 with black night swords of rage.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You're selling the same topper for $1,500.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like that is okay.
Speaker: It doesn't cost that much.
Speaker: Like it didn't triple in price.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So you can't see it, but I'm, I'm looking over my computer and that's where my CGC wall is.
Speaker: So I'm looking at your basement.
Speaker: So I know what you're looking at.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know exactly where I am.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So I'm looking at, so go with me on this, Josh.
Speaker: I'm looking at the attack from Mars topper.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: That's awesome.
Speaker: I would say arguably that's the best looking topper ever.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I, I would not disagree with you there.
Speaker: And you have the eight, the interactive alien.
Speaker: I, it is really good looking.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: You have the medieval madness, which doesn't move, but it has lights.
Speaker: It's good.
Speaker: Sculpt is really cool.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So you have monster bash, which again is similar to the medieval madness topper.
Speaker: It's 3D.
Speaker: It's beautiful, but it's stagnant.
Speaker: Beautiful.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It doesn't move.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: It does have lights on it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Then you have the, okay.
Speaker: Then you also have the cactus Canyon topper, which, which is definitely a rival to attack from Mars for how cool it is.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You could even argue that it's, but I personally like the attack from Mars better.
Speaker: But, and then the level of, the level of interactivity though, to the cactus Canyon is just.
Speaker: Oh yeah.
Speaker: No, no.
Speaker: It's a game in itself.
Speaker: Absolutely.
Speaker: And there's a reason why people will, will shy away from the SSE, which is kind of funny because it's, it really is the same game, but they want the topper.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: The topper for medieval madness.
Speaker: When I upgraded, so I bought a standard edition medieval madness, you know,
Speaker: 10 years ago or whatever.
Speaker: So when I upgraded to their, you know, the, the, the fake Royal edition.
Speaker: So I got the speaker light.
Speaker: I got, yeah.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: So it, that total package cost me, um, $1,500.
Speaker: And you've got more than just a topper.
Speaker: You got, yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And I may get wrong on this, but the topper, I remember being around $600.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Uh, some sounds, maybe with inflation, it could be $800.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But now I'm looking around at the other toppers that I have in my basement, which visually look really good.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So I have Beatles, which is one of the plastics, isn't it?
Speaker: It's, it's flat plastics and they're on like little springy things.
Speaker: So when you shake the games, the heads like bounce up and down.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Beatles bobbleheads.
Speaker: Beatles bobblehead dolls.
Speaker: This is Cousin Brucie talking about.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: It's like the bobblehead on Deadpool.
Speaker: The Deadpool bobblehead.
Speaker: You have Wizard of Odds, which came with the game.
Speaker: It's right there.
Speaker: It is just a sheet of plastic and it has a light.
Speaker: Now you have the Rush Topper, which is 3D interactive.
Speaker: However, I will point out it's 3D-ish.
Speaker: Because you have the cutout gears that interact and move, which is a cool look.
Speaker: It also feels a little bit like an upgrade from a 2D one, but it doesn't, it still feels a little bit planer.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I'm still having bought the Iron Maiden one, partly because I'm,
Speaker: I'm wondering, you're holding out.
Speaker: I'm just, I'm trying to justify the price on that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I get you.
Speaker: Uh, God's okay.
Speaker: Godzilla, George Gomez even said that they took a lot of crap for God for Godzilla.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And okay.
Speaker: Let's examine the Godzilla topper.
Speaker: It looks cool.
Speaker: It is interactive.
Speaker: There are lights you can see behind me.
Speaker: You can see Godzilla blowing that, uh, that plume of smoke and blowing up the tanks.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So there's a lot of lighting interaction.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: If you look at it for the parts though, it's the same Godzilla action figure actually in the game.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like literally the same one.
Speaker: the, the cloud thing is, yeah, that's, it looks cool when it's on, it looks cool, but it does not look great when it's off.
Speaker: No.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So the cloud thing is, is 3d injected and molded, but the tanks are there too deep.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And you look at, at the Jurassic park topper and,
Speaker: It's cut out 2D planer stuff.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So that's my long-winded analysis to say there's a big... This has been topper talk with Scott for the last five minutes.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But go with me on this, though.
Speaker: Everybody can look at the CGC toppers and say there was effort there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like they put forth their best foot.
Speaker: Like they made sure the toppers looked great.
Speaker: Doug Duba is, is arguably very OCD when it comes to his product.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And it does show in their product, right?
Speaker: It takes them a long time, but when they come out, they typically are very well made.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: The quality is great.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Except for the Pulp Fiction that the head was falling off when it created Logan Arcade.
Speaker: But, okay.
Speaker: So the long way I'm telling you this is that I see two equivalent products here.
Speaker: And the price is roughly similar, but it feels obvious that the construction, the thought process going into visually creating a topper is different for CGC than it has been for Stern.
Speaker: Stern feels very much like a Walmart end cap that is over some DVDs that are selling.
Speaker: Yeah, it kind of does.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Now that I say it, you can't unsee it, right?
Speaker: You can't unsee it.
Speaker: And so tell me like now they have tried to disguise it a little bit by putting fancy lights in it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: By making it interactive for every Scott, everything in pit ball, throw lights at it, throw lights at it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so it does help.
Speaker: The lights do help.
Speaker: It feels a little bit like they're disguising the lack of materials that go into it though.
Speaker: So is this leading up to, you're going to tell us how you're going to feel about this jaw stopper now?
Speaker: So the Amity one.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: To be, you know, when I saw it, do you know what I thought?
Speaker: I thought it was an LCD screen.
Speaker: And that's what I thought too.
Speaker: I thought it was an LCD screen.
Speaker: I'm like, Oh, actually.
Speaker: So they'll throw, they're throwing movie clips up there and that's kind of cool.
Speaker: And that's, yeah, you already have the interactive screen in front of you, but having an LCD screen up there, which by the way, does not cost a lot of money.
Speaker: No.
Speaker: Like putting that LCD screen makes it feel more expensive.
Speaker: Then when I found out it was like, oh, it's a lenticular topper.
Speaker: So it's like one of those 3D sticker things that you get where you look at one way and it looks this way and you look at the other way.
Speaker: And, and for the person listening, I was going to say lenticular is like,
Speaker: Art, if you have a, like, if you look at from, you angle it from the right, it's one way.
Speaker: And then if you angle it from the left, it's a different way.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: It's you made them in grade school, like where you'd make a fan.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And then you folded it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You folded it.
Speaker: And then you, yeah.
Speaker: So if you look at it from the right side, it looks like a young man, but you look at it from the left side and it looks like an old, you know, something like that.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Stuff like that.
Speaker: So it's kind of an optical, it's basically an optical illusion.
Speaker: depending on how you're looking.
Speaker: And so on one side, it has the welcome to Amity.
Speaker: On the other side, it's actually, and by the way, I had totally forgotten about this.
Speaker: I was asking our group chat with the Triple Grain guys this morning, but like, is that like,
Speaker: I totally thought that the shark, you know how people take screen grabs and then use like Microsoft paint or whatever, and they like draw something on there.
Speaker: I totally thought it was a meme.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I thought it was a meme that someone had done and they said, no, actually that's in the, in the movie.
Speaker: And so I actually, I thought you were pulling my leg.
Speaker: I was like, Scott, really?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, I totally did not because I haven't seen Jaws in, you know, the last time I saw Jaws was seven years ago or so.
Speaker: It was re-released in the theater.
Speaker: And so I paid and I saw it in the theater.
Speaker: But I totally had spaced that part because it does look like one of those homemade mean things.
Speaker: And another thing too, you don't own Jaws, right?
Speaker: No, I don't.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So you get a pass there as well because keep going.
Speaker: Cause that plays into what I'm going to say.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Cause I, I have yet to buy jobs.
Speaker: That's the only Elwin aside from the, the bond Elwin I don't buy.
Speaker: So it seemed to fall in the same trap as before.
Speaker: It's, it's cut out plastic with lights and,
Speaker: with an interesting optical effect that kind of disguises that there's not much there.
Speaker: And for $1,000, now, 250 and below, you know what, that's, do whatever you want.
Speaker: I actually, I just barely picked down, like I have mods that I haven't installed in my games yet.
Speaker: So the one that I picked up, and I'm going way over time on this, I need to give Josh equal time.
Speaker: I just brought down the Stumbler mod
Speaker: for Godzilla that that is the sign which is really cool looking it's amazing yeah it's cool looking that was 250 or whatever it was okay would you have bought that thing for a thousand dollars Josh you know me in months probably not
Speaker: probably okay okay i feel like it's justified more with that it's but it's the same thing it's a 2d thing that that makes it look really good with a light show and you buy it for 250 and it's actually 3d because he does 3d make this stuff so it takes a 2d thing converts it to a 3d sign that has all these sides and it also has an interactive light show so it was upgraded on all levels
Speaker: And still less than 250 bucks.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: You have a topper that has a plastic sheet that was cut out.
Speaker: And so it's not 3D, it's 2D, but it's disguised as 3D because it has some lights on there.
Speaker: Now, visually from far away, you can get away with it.
Speaker: You can.
Speaker: But when you start looking at a critical eye, you really do feel like they're phoning in their toppers.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: I'm out.
Speaker: I've said my piece.
Speaker: Go ahead.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So I first saw this topper and I agree with you.
Speaker: The first thing I thought was, oh, this is an LCD screen because that would be really cool.
Speaker: And then as it went on, I was like, oh, this is lenticular.
Speaker: It's whitewater.
Speaker: Granted, there is some LEDs in the sign and the sign, it sounds like it's tied into kind of like the expression light.
Speaker: So it does do sonar and stuff like that.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Whatever.
Speaker: I just, it's the same thing as Ninja Turtles.
Speaker: So I know you don't own Jaws, but right below the topper is the exact same on the premium.
Speaker: Sorry, let me put that caveat.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: On the pro, not on the Ellie, but on the premium right below this topper is the exact same sign in the artwork.
Speaker: to the right forgot about that and then if you go down past the lcd screen back in the very back the signs there as well and okay so it's theme integrated i'll give it that i will give it 100 percent that
Speaker: But it becomes this like, how many times can I see the sign?
Speaker: Jaws, jaws, jaws, jaws.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it's definitely integrated into the game as well because you see the scene where if your ball drains, then all of a sudden the mayor's fighting with Hooper about the sign needing to be.
Speaker: And so you see the sign again.
Speaker: I know it's a very pivotal moment in the movie.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: but my only thing is this is the only thing I could think of is like the reason they probably did this is because it had already been pre like this artwork had already been pre approved a couple of times, obviously in the game.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So I wasn't that hard to be like, we're going to put this on top of the game as well.
Speaker: And the license was like, go for it.
Speaker: You know what I'm saying?
Speaker: And that's probably honestly why it got revealed within six months of the game.
Speaker: We're that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: We're definitely peeking behind the screen and saying, okay, okay.
Speaker: We have no inside information on that.
Speaker: The thoughts of Pinterkid Pinball podcast or that of the podcast is not necessarily of Sturm Pinball.
Speaker: Not expressed by the express consent of Sturm Pinball.
Speaker: Okay, so I'll give you this.
Speaker: Okay, I'm not a topper fan.
Speaker: They're cool.
Speaker: Don't get me wrong.
Speaker: I love the toppers on all my CGCs.
Speaker: That's what ruined me because it came with the game.
Speaker: I didn't have to pay extra and they looked freaking amazing.
Speaker: They do.
Speaker: And so when you're telling me something that doesn't come with my game, that's going to cost me, this one's a thousand dollars or, you know, look at, uh, the, the Foo Fighters one just got revealed.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That one's $2,000.
Speaker: I just, I, that's when I'm like, you're a thousand to $2,000 towards another game at this point.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I just, I, I, I just don't want it.
Speaker: And then when you have this come out, it's just not, it feels uninspired maybe, um,
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Like I said, I will give it credit for it is definitely on theme and it integrates in the game.
Speaker: I just, like you said, I feel like it phones it in a little bit.
Speaker: So no shot at anyone.
Speaker: It's turn.
Speaker: I just, it's not.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But this is okay.
Speaker: We have to look at this, right?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And we have talked about how I used to be an L E pinball buyer all day long.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Guess what?
Speaker: I am now a premium pinball buyer.
Speaker: I'm not going to make the mistake to project my buying habits and my demographics on the entire pinball spectrum because a lot of fans do that.
Speaker: A lot of fans say, I'm a 49 year old white dude into dad rock.
Speaker: Like, why are you doing anything that's not in my demographic?
Speaker: I'm like, actually, because you can't just cater to one demographic.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: However, I am also really on the fence on topers now, like you, you have to really.
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker: Impress me to, to justify the price because once you're in that thousand dollar range, you're right.
Speaker: You're, you're pushing over 10% of a game.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it doesn't bring 10% of fun.
Speaker: It doesn't.
Speaker: So I have a couple of thoughts on this as well.
Speaker: So I heard a word today.
Speaker: I was listening to another podcast that isn't about pinball, shocker.
Speaker: And you used a word and I texted it to you.
Speaker: You're probably like, why the heck did you just text me that?
Speaker: Yeah, I was wondering, yeah.
Speaker: I didn't want to forget it.
Speaker: Habituation.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I did not just swear.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But if you look at the definition, it pretty much just says that we're so used to whatever it may be that by time something else comes out in that same genre or whatever, you're so desensitized you don't think it's exciting anymore or it's not new anymore.
Speaker: And so I use this word because I feel like we have habituation already.
Speaker: In a community, if you've been in this hobby for a while now, you definitely have this.
Speaker: And you're comparing topper to topper.
Speaker: Really, let's take it away and you look at just this topper.
Speaker: I know it's hard for us to do because we've seen all this.
Speaker: We've seen a lot of toppers, yeah.
Speaker: If you saw this was the very first topper you've ever seen in your whole life, how cool would it actually be?
Speaker: And we're going to take price off the table at this point.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Would you be excited to see this?
Speaker: Like if you saw this topper, would you be like, Whoa, this is like the coolest.
Speaker: And it's hard because like I said, we, I've been in the hobby for over a decade now and you've been in Scott for at least seven years, something like that.
Speaker: Six years.
Speaker: I'm over a decade.
Speaker: You're over a decade as well.
Speaker: I'm over a decade.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So it's, I guess my, my, my statement I'm going to make right now is we need as a community,
Speaker: I get being critical of this stuff.
Speaker: Are we complacent?
Speaker: Is that what you're getting at?
Speaker: We're so used to it that it no longer makes us excited?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And if you want to vote, then do it with your wallet.
Speaker: That's the best way to do it.
Speaker: Personally, I feel like we've just discussed about this.
Speaker: I don't think Stern actually makes these in-house.
Speaker: And really, their biggest moneymaker are the games.
Speaker: And so this is more of a love letter to the community.
Speaker: Like,
Speaker: you want to pimp out your game, we're making this stuff for you.
Speaker: But it's like no love loss if they don't make a ton of these because really they're just shipping it out to someone else to make them, right?
Speaker: So, anyhow, that's my point.
Speaker: I just, I think that we've...
Speaker: If it comes down to it, in my opinion, it's not worth it.
Speaker: It's not going on my game.
Speaker: If it's, as a mutual friend of ours says, don't yuck someone else's yum.
Speaker: If this is your yum, cool.
Speaker: If not... Yeah.
Speaker: The only thing we can talk about is, is it worth it to us as a personal buying thing?
Speaker: Now, I also... There are things that I have paid money for that would be considered extravagant or I...
Speaker: I bought a rush LE like sticker price.
Speaker: I didn't get any discount on that.
Speaker: I got sticker price.
Speaker: I paid sticker price for everything.
Speaker: And that was within my wheelhouse.
Speaker: But I know that some people it's like, no, I'm not going to do that.
Speaker: But that that's what you need to consider though, is there are going to be overlaps.
Speaker: There are going to be people who will buy things all the time.
Speaker: regardless of price.
Speaker: And there are also going to be people who, um, who they're very price sensitive and even a hundred dollar increase in something is going to be a big deal.
Speaker: Sorry for the loud thought.
Speaker: I just dropped my phone.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: I've had enough of Jaws accessories and whatnot, and we have so much more on our notes.
Speaker: What would you buy?
Speaker: Let's, let's just say you do own Jaws premium and I, I will get Jaws premium at some point.
Speaker: What are the things that you would consider putting in your game?
Speaker: The buoy of death from Stumblr.
Speaker: Which is awesome.
Speaker: I think it's cool.
Speaker: Someone has said, though, the DMD doesn't really match the 70s vibe.
Speaker: I think it's still cool.
Speaker: Okay, but you could also just turn that DMD off.
Speaker: Even Davey said that.
Speaker: Honestly, I think if anything out of this package, I'm going to grab...
Speaker: I would consider the speaker light system and probably the pinball armor.
Speaker: That was the two things I would consider.
Speaker: I would consider the inner art blades and the speaker lights.
Speaker: If I had to pick the ones that I would spend my money on, that's what I would pick my money on.
Speaker: But I'm not going to begrudge someone if they said, no, I want everything.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I'm going to rapid fire these.
Speaker: You're a, okay.
Speaker: Dutch pinball, Alice in Wonderland.
Speaker: How do you feel about it?
Speaker: Don't care.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And legitimately this is there.
Speaker: They're trying to milk the J pop thing for, for everything it's worth.
Speaker: Yeah, but it's weird because it was a foam core.
Speaker: This concept probably didn't even... This was a napkin sketch.
Speaker: Yeah, it really was.
Speaker: This was not even a fleshed out game.
Speaker: This was sold 100% on Zombie Yeti's art because it looked really cool.
Speaker: It's just weird to me.
Speaker: It's really... And they're not even using Zombie Yeti.
Speaker: He's not associated at all.
Speaker: Absolutely.
Speaker: But it shows that art and in the 90s, when I was actually into comic books, like early 90s, and this is the Todd McFarlane's.
Speaker: This is the Rob Liefeld, like the guys who made like Deadpool, the original guys.
Speaker: Jim Lee was a huge artist and people would buy their comics based on the art because it was just visually so different than any comic books before.
Speaker: However, eventually people just kind of got tired of it because there wasn't much story there.
Speaker: And I would feel the same way about Alice in Wonderland.
Speaker: You have a foam core idea from J-pop.
Speaker: J-pop obviously needs a team to make up for his many deficiencies.
Speaker: 100% agree.
Speaker: I do not consider World Cup soccer a J-pop game.
Speaker: I know his name is on it.
Speaker: The general concept was him.
Speaker: I really feel like that is a Larry DeMar game.
Speaker: Yeah, it's 100% a team game.
Speaker: Like, there's no way that that was J-pop.
Speaker: So if you haven't listened to our Larry DeMar episode, it's amazing.
Speaker: And he does talk about how J-pop actually left early because his father was having some issues, health issues.
Speaker: And so they pretty much did the rest of the game.
Speaker: I don't know how much...
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I will point out too, you are a hundred percent right.
Speaker: Then there, there is creep and expectations.
Speaker: Like I, now I, I don't have a super old game behind me.
Speaker: I mean, the oldest one I have is really, um, wizard of Oz.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Which, uh, but if you look behind you, you see, you know, an EM, you see a world cup soccer and then you get into your sterns.
Speaker: So yeah, it's going to look different.
Speaker: I will point out to the, um,
Speaker: Getting back to is the topper going to wow you?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: The whitewater topper is awesome.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: It also, if they put out the whitewater topper today, they would charge a thousand dollars for it.
Speaker: Oh, easily.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that is not a thousand dollar topper.
Speaker: Same with the, same with Adam's family.
Speaker: It's a cool topper, not a thousand dollars.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Pedretti.
Speaker: They've officially announced Funhaus and it's been shown.
Speaker: What do you think?
Speaker: You know, I'll let you go first.
Speaker: You have a lot more connection to Funhaus than I do.
Speaker: Um, I don't think we've talked about this yet.
Speaker: So personally, I love fun house.
Speaker: It's one of the games that got me hooked on pinball.
Speaker: It might not be one of the first ones I played, but it's definitely one of those ones.
Speaker: I was like, holy crap.
Speaker: This is so cool.
Speaker: You're it's you.
Speaker: And we talk about world under glass.
Speaker: This is like, it's a toy story.
Speaker: It looks like a toy under the glass.
Speaker: It's Rudy is making fun of you.
Speaker: You're interacting with Rudy.
Speaker: I'm excited.
Speaker: I'm nervous.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: Pendretti has said that they will be using planetary pinball parts.
Speaker: So I know that they have higher quality to the part.
Speaker: Um, these are being made in Europe.
Speaker: I don't know if we're allowed to say when they start shipping, I'm not going to do that to the person.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: The bottom line is they will be coming out sometime.
Speaker: Yeah, they'll be coming out.
Speaker: They should be shipping this year.
Speaker: I'll just put it like that.
Speaker: Cause that gives some leeway.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: I personally don't like the Ellie artwork.
Speaker: I find it weird that like the gopher's eyeballs are popping out.
Speaker: Everyone else is popping out.
Speaker: It's a mismatch of things.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: I don't like the fact that there's like bride of pin bots in the R and right.
Speaker: I did.
Speaker: It's like, this is fun house.
Speaker: This is like, why, why are we, why is this like a love letter from all the Valley Williams stuff?
Speaker: That's just me.
Speaker: Like if I were to buy this, I'm definitely going classic every day.
Speaker: I've heard very terrible things about the 2.0 code and people have actually said, no, we're not buying the LE.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So far I don't think they're done with the code.
Speaker: They're not done, but it's been out for at least three years now.
Speaker: You remember you and I both played it.
Speaker: Oh, you're talking to Rudy's nightmare.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: This is the exact same code.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh, who knows?
Speaker: Maybe they can tune it up a little bit.
Speaker: I thought Mark Silt did a good job with the voice and I think he had a very big hurdle to go over.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's not the original, but he was going for something different.
Speaker: And I think he did a great job with the way he went with it.
Speaker: He's going for creepy clown.
Speaker: Overall, honestly, I think this was a brilliant move to make this game.
Speaker: They're selling better than wick.
Speaker: I know that for sure.
Speaker: It's just an all-around... I don't know.
Speaker: Like I said, personally me, I'm debating if I want to... This is a game I'm seriously considering buying, but I recommend to everyone, go out, play it, fill the quality.
Speaker: Yeah, play it first.
Speaker: Especially at Expo, I'm going to be asking questions.
Speaker: I'm going to ask them to lift the hood.
Speaker: I want...
Speaker: I don't want my love for fun house to outweigh becoming a box of problems.
Speaker: Does that make sense?
Speaker: Oh, a hundred percent.
Speaker: Are you, uh, okay.
Speaker: Do you get pause at all from a European manufacturer versus someone in the States?
Speaker: Yes and no.
Speaker: Yes, because it is in Europe.
Speaker: And if I have issues, it's a different country.
Speaker: I know how Australia and Canada feels, I guess.
Speaker: Well, at least Canada is right there.
Speaker: But the other thing, too, is the point of contact is the pinball company in America.
Speaker: And I know that they're going to make things right.
Speaker: Also, the parts are readily available in America because of planetary pinball.
Speaker: So, yes, I am a little concerned.
Speaker: Because it's in Europe.
Speaker: But no, there's already plenty of this stuff in America that it's, and I think if there is an issue, I can reach out to the points of contact, like flipping out, and they'll take care of it.
Speaker: And it won't be like six to eight weeks to get my part.
Speaker: I think I'll be able to get it here.
Speaker: So you like that there's some teamwork approach is what you're saying.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: So it's a little different than maybe like a highway pinball or, you know, we, we all know there's, you know, Haggis is alone down in, in Arizona, in not Arizona, in Australia.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Arizona is in the United States.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So yeah, that's, I'm a little, it does give me a little bit of pause just because I've never owned a pin ready game.
Speaker: However, you are correct in that it is a great theme that does have longevity.
Speaker: I'm not a huge Pat Lawler fan, so the games don't connect with me as they would with a lot of people.
Speaker: But I can definitely see the marketability of it.
Speaker: And there are people who really do connect with that theme.
Speaker: And it is a great home theme.
Speaker: Like if you're, if you're putting a game in your home, there's going to be no questions about that unless you have like, you know, creepy doll vibes.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: Alrighty.
Speaker: Next on the list, uh, Harry Potter's jump in the line.
Speaker: Eric, many are on design?
Speaker: Question mark.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Do you think they would, aside from maybe Steve Ritchie,
Speaker: you can't imagine them going with anyone.
Speaker: I, Eric has designed their biggest selling game.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So it was gums and roses.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And there, there certainly were some built in advantages with that.
Speaker: I just find it interesting that Mark Seiden has been there for a while now and granted, like he's working on his game and like, if they're taking more time to, to champion him and get him up and going awesome.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: I, sorry, you're leading this.
Speaker: I apologize for cutting you off, but no, I think really Eric's the go-to guy, right?
Speaker: Like there's no, I would be surprised if it weren't Eric, I guess I'll put it that way.
Speaker: Yeah, I agree.
Speaker: I would be very surprised if it was more exciting.
Speaker: The, the question I have, and this is okay.
Speaker: I'm going to go back to the topper thing.
Speaker: If you're going to buy a topper, would you buy a topper from Stern or would you buy it from CGC?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: You're going to buy the CGC one.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: If you're a, and,
Speaker: you could argue that if you are going to buy a game, you have to, you do have to factor in, okay, Elton John's a fun game.
Speaker: I don't know of anybody who's played it that says, yeah, I don't like this thing.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: If it came out at a price point that was equivalent to Stern, do you think that would have been a big seller?
Speaker: Possibly.
Speaker: I think it would have been.
Speaker: I think it would have been.
Speaker: I, I,
Speaker: I can tell you for a fact, for me, I would buy it.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: If a premium were in the 9,000 range, I'd buy it and put it in my basement because I'm old enough that I remember when those songs came out.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: And that is something that is fun.
Speaker: It's, it's a great shooting game.
Speaker: It's a proven layout.
Speaker: So the, their problem has always been price.
Speaker: It's, it's, I'm sorry, it's just too much.
Speaker: And I'm hoping that I'm wrong.
Speaker: I'm hoping that people say, well, you don't know the, the numbers and it's selling gangbusters and there's going to be tons of them maybe, but,
Speaker: there's a big difference between selling a billion guns and roses at 9,500 versus 10,500, depending on when you put in your order versus their last two releases or three releases, which are toy story, Godfather and Elton John.
Speaker: I guarantee the volume they sold of the last three are significantly lower than what the other is.
Speaker: Now,
Speaker: Maybe the price increase makes up for the lower sales units.
Speaker: Plus you're not, you're not, you don't have as many people hired on if you're making less units.
Speaker: You're actually saving some money that way.
Speaker: There's some economics to it.
Speaker: So yeah, there are definitely things to consider and maybe it makes more sense for them because if you look at a, like an economics curve at some point,
Speaker: you're going to make the same amount of money at a higher price versus a lower, you know, a lower price versus high volume versus higher price and low volume.
Speaker: There is a kind of a break even point where you're actually making the same for making less, less units.
Speaker: And they would know that I wouldn't.
Speaker: I, I doubt that they were considering lowering the price because we all know they have Harry Potter and they are going to want a premium price for Harry Potter.
Speaker: So that that's, uh, they seem to be writing out the higher price option.
Speaker: So, um, does it make sense that they would move up Harry Potter?
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I think the reason being, especially where you've had Godfather, Toy Story and Elton John, and it's no secret.
Speaker: There are still distributors holding on.
Speaker: Well, new inboxes.
Speaker: They're still holding.
Speaker: Like, what was it?
Speaker: Was it JJ from game exchange that posted on Facebook like six months ago?
Speaker: I've got Toy Story still in stock.
Speaker: Make me an offer.
Speaker: And I think this was brought up because it's like, there's supposed to be like, there's an honorary number, right?
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But when the product's not selling and distributors are sitting on, it's not just the money that they fronted up front.
Speaker: They're holding on to stock, and that's an area that could be taken by another game.
Speaker: But you're not supposed to go to that number because you could lose business from that.
Speaker: Like, J.J.P.
Speaker: could be like, you know what?
Speaker: If you can't honor the deal that we've made, you can no longer be a distributor.
Speaker: It just seems very much like, I don't give a crap.
Speaker: If you don't give a crap, I need to move these.
Speaker: You know what I'm saying?
Speaker: How many times have you seen, hey, we found these.
Speaker: these open boxes.
Speaker: We had five new boxes a week ago, but now we have five open box deals.
Speaker: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker: Which is a, which by the way, is just a way they can skirt the bottom line.
Speaker: They, they basically opened it to ensure it was intact, but they never actually unboxed it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Moving.
Speaker: I'm sorry.
Speaker: This is a very, I feel very long winded tonight.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So moving up, Harry, um,
Speaker: maybe.
Speaker: And that would be, that would tell me that Elton is winding up if that's the case.
Speaker: Now the, the next rumored thing that was supposed to be coming out with JJP would be possibly like,
Speaker: uh matrix right that's that's been the long-standing rumor and if that's the case maybe they're trying to distance themselves from john wick john wick and i hadn't thought about that now that yeah that's that was totally my thought is that okay do they want to have two keanos come out now you also have to assume that harry's done yeah and i i don't know if harry's done
Speaker: I can't remember.
Speaker: It was like mother day last year that they announced that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, so I, sorry that Joe cam and cow.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Joe said maybe, who knows?
Speaker: Who knows?
Speaker: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So I want to point out one really quick thing and then we're moving on.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: For those, cause I keep being asked this because people think I know stuff.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So I'm just gonna say this publicly.
Speaker: If you do the math people, you,
Speaker: JJP has been very spot on for every nine months right now.
Speaker: Going back there for the last three releases.
Speaker: So if you do nine months, because Elton John was released in October of 2023, if you do nine months, that means the next JJP game should be shown next month.
Speaker: Soon, yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I would lay money on it.
Speaker: I think I have not been personally told that it's being released that month.
Speaker: It would make sense though.
Speaker: It would make sense for JJP to release things a lot faster and get
Speaker: you know, basically doing these exclusive games that are higher priced, that there is kind of a built in exclusivity if you only make them for nine months and then move on.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: So I think, I think we see this in the next nine months.
Speaker: Worst case scenario.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I can't guarantee it's Harry Potter, but I, the next GHAP I want to say is, is next month's release.
Speaker: Worst case scenario is,
Speaker: September.
Speaker: We see it at Expo.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I, I, it's definitely, I, I would probably say August.
Speaker: I really would.
Speaker: But that, that would make sense.
Speaker: So there's probably going to be other things that you're going to be dealing with too.
Speaker: Like Stern, Stern's rumored like black and white Godzilla coming out could also take something.
Speaker: Or Stern's rumored Metallica.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: There's a lot of rumors out there or, you know, Jack Danger's next game and,
Speaker: And some, you know, some, so you're always going to be competing with different releases.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Let's move on to, Oh, and the other question too, is I keep getting a lot.
Speaker: Do you know which game's coming next from Stern?
Speaker: I, if I were, if I were to see where the smoke from the fire is coming with all the rumors and stuff like that, I bet you July it's Metallica.
Speaker: I bet actually, I know that I don't think so.
Speaker: I don't think July is Metallica.
Speaker: Well,
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: This is your thoughts.
Speaker: Go ahead.
Speaker: Go ahead.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: This is Josh's thoughts.
Speaker: July's Metallica.
Speaker: October is actually an X-Men 97, which is a Borg, which is a remake of X-Men.
Speaker: And then I think in December, January, we see Jack Danger with Pokemon.
Speaker: This is all speculation.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And I also want to put the caveat too that I do know that people, Gomez did say on Joel's interview with him, Joel from the triple drain and flipping out and all that stuff, that Jack Danger is next in the pipeline.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But yeah.
Speaker: So that's my thought.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Would you want to, did you want to hurry and throw that out before I move on to the next?
Speaker: Well, I would just say, I think there,
Speaker: I would say odds are very good that they're going to do a black and white Godzilla.
Speaker: There's odds are that would, that would come out and kind of like a Lucy or a cat woman edition or something like that.
Speaker: I have a good, I have a feeling though that Borg's game coming out would be Metallica.
Speaker: So I think that's their, that's their vault edition that's coming out because the, there are some things that they could possibly be doing with the new, like with the spike three system.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And there is a question that you could, you could ask, there are systems that have been, you know, backwards compatible.
Speaker: Like if you buy a video game, right.
Speaker: So sometimes when they have some backwards compatibility,
Speaker: if they were using Metallica as a test case to see if they can just run older code without having to update everything.
Speaker: So that seems to be the tea leaves for me on that.
Speaker: Is it possible that...
Speaker: that the X-Men 97 project may come up at maybe.
Speaker: I just, I don't feel the appetite for X-Men to get re-released because it wasn't really a big seller back in the day.
Speaker: And Rush is basically a better layout than X-Men and it's still very similar.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's the only reason I'm like, maybe not.
Speaker: But another reason I'm saying X-Men 97, we've brought this up before.
Speaker: If you do the math, it seems like once a year, Stern is doing something from Disney.
Speaker: That could be Marvel or whatever it may be.
Speaker: Whether it's a rerun, whether it's...
Speaker: uh, you know what I'm saying?
Speaker: And so, um, it's been, it's been a minute since we've had a Disney license property, uh, revealed from Stern.
Speaker: I'm trying to think of the last time we even saw one was, uh, um, Oh, Venom.
Speaker: Sorry.
Speaker: So Venom in October, I guess hasn't been that long then.
Speaker: Uh, I guess, why did I forget Venom?
Speaker: Why did that leave my conscience?
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: We know because Venom is typically a more, um, location game.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's a location game.
Speaker: So,
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Maybe, maybe not then.
Speaker: Well, yeah, I don't know.
Speaker: We'll see.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: My next, my next quick one, American pinball, David fix was on pinball news.
Speaker: He pretty much confirmed cuphead is next and we'll be out by expo.
Speaker: As long as it's fully baked, they're not going to rush it, but it sounds like they're on a time crunch.
Speaker: And after that,
Speaker: I'm sorry.
Speaker: I didn't listen to the full episode.
Speaker: Supposedly he man.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Masters of the universe got brought up as well as the game after that.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: And I want to say they said franchise on the art for that.
Speaker: So thoughts.
Speaker: Cuphead's a bad thing.
Speaker: It's I like it.
Speaker: I'm excited to see a cuphead.
Speaker: It's a more than barbecue.
Speaker: It is a, okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Barbecue.
Speaker: I mean, yeah.
Speaker: Um, cuphead it's, it's, I'm sorry.
Speaker: Barbecue is a, it's a puzzling theme.
Speaker: I guess I'll put it that way.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Um, the cuphead is just so focused.
Speaker: It would be like, okay.
Speaker: I know that Rick and Morty seem a little, uh, like sub genre.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Cuphead is definitely sub sub genre.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's very niche in a very niche.
Speaker: Really?
Speaker: You are a targeting, a very narrow demographic.
Speaker: I mean, it would be like me thinking like, I think venture brothers are hilarious because it's just making fun of Johnny quest the whole time.
Speaker: Oh yeah.
Speaker: 100%.
Speaker: But I, okay.
Speaker: I would be shocked if they said there's a venture brothers pinball machine coming out.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And, and so you're, you're really, if you're trying to go for themes, you want to go for the broadest appeal.
Speaker: So would you take a cuphead or GI Joe?
Speaker: Me personally, probably cuphead.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Well, you gotta understand though.
Speaker: I've played the video game.
Speaker: I love the video game.
Speaker: Sure.
Speaker: My family has all watched cuphead on Netflix, all three seasons.
Speaker: And again, this is me getting out of my demographic, right?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I'm, I'm, I'm solidly in the 45 to 65 demographic.
Speaker: Like I, I have no connection to cuphead at all.
Speaker: You said cuphead was a rumor and I had to ask who was that.
Speaker: Watch, seriously, watch Netflix, the Netflix series.
Speaker: It's really good.
Speaker: It's really good.
Speaker: He-Man.
Speaker: He-Man's a great thing.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh yeah.
Speaker: It is a great theme.
Speaker: Like of all the, of all the eighties cartoons, He-Man's probably the best one.
Speaker: Really?
Speaker: So I would choose He-Man.
Speaker: I would move He-Man up because he,
Speaker: okay, I'm just looking at an amateur revenue stream.
Speaker: I don't see too many American pinballs getting sold.
Speaker: So if you're going to go big, I would go with He-Man.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: But if Cuphead, you're doing these small runs and you can just throw out 300 of them and call it good, sure, why not?
Speaker: But He-Man would be where you'd want to go.
Speaker: Alrighty.
Speaker: So I was listening to Clicked at Gamers podcast.
Speaker: They just released an episode on Saturday.
Speaker: If you haven't checked it out, it's pretty much a fan episode.
Speaker: It's a bunch of emails because the music, the news has been slow.
Speaker: So there was a gentleman I want to say by the name of Steven that had wrote in asking some questions to EGP.
Speaker: And I actually wanted to answer two of these because I felt like the first one we do a lot.
Speaker: And then the second one,
Speaker: We do interviews, and so I felt like it was may not directly pointed at us.
Speaker: But we have more guests than your average podcast, your average pinball podcast.
Speaker: And we could give a little more insight from a personal standpoint.
Speaker: So the first question we're going to go with is,
Speaker: Why do podcasters talk about other podcast hers?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Or podcasts.
Speaker: Do you want to go first on this one, Scott?
Speaker: Sure.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: The, the nice thing about podcasters is there is definitely some cross pollination.
Speaker: We are friends with many of the podcasters and we listened to many other podcasters because they have different styles.
Speaker: Like we have our own style.
Speaker: You know, this is, and we've, we've talked about this before.
Speaker: How do we want to run a show?
Speaker: And the bottom line is you and I talk regularly on the phone.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And this is, this is basically a phone conversation.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So it's, it's easy for us to translate that into a podcast because you as the listener are the, the silent third person in our conversation.
Speaker: And it's, we try to take it very casual, like you're invited to come, you can, you can contribute, you can agree, you can disagree with us.
Speaker: But that has been our approach.
Speaker: Other shows are definitely different.
Speaker: They have different approaches.
Speaker: And so one of the reasons why we do talk about others, in some ways, it would be to, hey, they may have a different take.
Speaker: Like if you want competitive pinball,
Speaker: Then you probably want to listen to a podcast that talks about tournament pinball.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know, and, and, you know, triple drain has tournament pinball players in their final round has tournament tournament pinball players in there.
Speaker: You know, these are things slam till slam till absolutely.
Speaker: The, those guys are, all of those guys are better pinball players than me.
Speaker: I am the collector at home who dabbles around in playing.
Speaker: So one of the reasons why is because we are also fans of different shows because they offer something that we don't.
Speaker: But it's also good to get different perspectives too.
Speaker: If you keep going down the same rabbit holes, then you do start getting a little tone deaf and siloed into your own point of view on pinball.
Speaker: And this actually brought up that this was reflected back on me.
Speaker: One time was I was in a chat one time when I was talking about, I was basically railing on topper prices.
Speaker: And I said, they would make a lot more money by selling more toppers at a cheaper price.
Speaker: And this is Josh Sharp, who's an accountant.
Speaker: And he fired back.
Speaker: He's like, the only thing you don't have behind your assumption are any numbers.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that did hit me to say, you know what, you're right.
Speaker: I'm not an accountant and I, I don't have a business major and they, they are crunching the numbers and it may not be valuable price for me, but it could be for a lot and a lot of people.
Speaker: And so that keeps me in check.
Speaker: That's one of the reasons why.
Speaker: Also another reason why, because it's fun.
Speaker: Like these are our friends.
Speaker: And I, I don't really feel much competition about other people's numbers because that's, I'm doing this for, for fun.
Speaker: We're not making any money on this.
Speaker: The reason I shout out other podcasts is because a lot of times I'm listening to them.
Speaker: They bring up stuff that I appreciate and make me see from a different perspective or get that, get my brain turning and going, Oh, Hey, I hadn't thought of that.
Speaker: And so, um,
Speaker: I also recommend people because if you're listening to us and you enjoy us, we're, we're usually an hour to an hour and a half every two weeks.
Speaker: You're usually looking for something else to listen to as well.
Speaker: I, that's why I recommend triple drain.
Speaker: That's why I recommend eclectic gamers or the pinball show or, uh, you know, we're all kind of similar vein.
Speaker: Like obviously like slam tell.
Speaker: Silver ball chronicles.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: and I enjoy slam tilt.
Speaker: I think that's the thing is like, these are people that I know and I respect not only on a friendship level, but from a podcasting level.
Speaker: Like I know that,
Speaker: The quality of content you're going to get from them is good.
Speaker: I don't really... So one thing they had mentioned is they said that podcasters mention other podcasters because it brings credibility to their own podcast.
Speaker: I don't fully get that.
Speaker: I'm not saying... I don't mention Triple Drain every episode because I feel like I'm riding on their coattails and it gives me credibility to lose your kid.
Speaker: No.
Speaker: I literally do this because...
Speaker: I like those guys.
Speaker: We have, we talk to them outside.
Speaker: We even have newcomers like Don.
Speaker: Don's new to the, and Don is, he is podcasting
Speaker: a lot.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: A lot.
Speaker: I don't know how he does it, man.
Speaker: He does.
Speaker: And he has a different style too.
Speaker: He's like a solo stream of consciousness talker, which is different.
Speaker: If you, I, uh, Ron and Bruce are hilarious at slam tilt.
Speaker: They're definitely a little more irreverent.
Speaker: And so, you know, I, I laugh when I, when I hit them and I also appreciate a Buffalo bin ball.
Speaker: They, they definitely have, uh,
Speaker: a very professional show.
Speaker: They have more of a group mix show.
Speaker: And there are a lot of their takes that I agree with.
Speaker: There are a lot of them that I don't too, but it's good to see different, different perspectives.
Speaker: And it's.
Speaker: Well, even like Vic VP, like I'm glad that Stern had, you know, he reached out and got to do the John Wig stuff.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I, I really like his stuff.
Speaker: I'm glad that like, I didn't know who he was before the Stern stuff.
Speaker: And you know what?
Speaker: We've talked behind the scenes.
Speaker: He's a really cool dude.
Speaker: He's a nice guy.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And he's definitely addressed us because there's like, well, okay, so I have a Godfather pinball machine.
Speaker: So, so we, we were actually weren't criticizing him having the pinball machine behind it was just more of, that was an interesting take from Stern to choose him because, you know, the,
Speaker: True, but he did have a valid point of like, he wanted to prove that I have pinball.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so, and another thing too, I think we criticize too much when like with Vic, he's like, I've only been in this like a year and a half, two years, if I remember correctly.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, when I was only in a year and a half to two years, like my perspective was entirely different than it is today.
Speaker: And so, and I don't disagree with him.
Speaker: Like virtual pinball, like you might not like it.
Speaker: You might love it.
Speaker: The thing about virtual pinball is I can play
Speaker: thousands of games all in one cab.
Speaker: I can still work rule sets.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so is it the, is it authentic?
Speaker: No, like it's not,
Speaker: Well, who's to say?
Speaker: I will say there seems to be a progression, right?
Speaker: And this is where people, I think, justifiably bust David Fix a little bit when he says you shouldn't have an opinion unless you've been in pinball for five years.
Speaker: I'm like, no, actually, you can have a pinball if you've never played a game because the market is going to be continually growing.
Speaker: or shrinking and you want it to be growing.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's all subjective.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Second question.
Speaker: Why are the interviews so softballed questions?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And well, okay.
Speaker: And we have talked a lot behind the scenes on this.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And I will put it out there that how many interview shows that
Speaker: are aggressive to the audience person that they have invited on.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And think of it.
Speaker: So any, any show that invites someone on the only one I could possibly think of is possibly David Letterman had a little more bite to him when he had people on, but in many ways, the, the interviewee was in on it.
Speaker: You know, when, when Dave would go after Richard Simmons and I know I'm going way back,
Speaker: But Dave would make fun of Richard Simmons nonstop.
Speaker: But Richard Simmons was kind of in on the shtick.
Speaker: But most of the time, when you look at The Tonight Show, you look at Jimmy Kimmel, you look at Stephen Colbert, you look at any sort of show that invites people on, you have to at least have some respect for the guests.
Speaker: And if you bring them on and you're toxic to them, then you're not going to get good quality stuff.
Speaker: And that's the first thing you want the interviewee to feel comfortable.
Speaker: You want them to feel engaged.
Speaker: Now, are the questions all softball?
Speaker: No, I think there are some that we want to talk about the products and we want to bring out information.
Speaker: But there are things that we will ask that focus on, okay, this is a controversy that has been floated behind the scenes.
Speaker: Do you care to address that?
Speaker: Do you care to talk about that?
Speaker: And at least give them a forum.
Speaker: Sometimes they want to talk, sometimes they don't.
Speaker: And there are some that we have interviewed some people where we have cut out a few questions because they were uncomfortable with it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But so you can't sustain a show if you are being, if, if you are not inviting a guest to your house and treating them with respect.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: So I want to pull up one.
Speaker: I don't like to bring up usually like trolling comments.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But there was one from, I can't remember if it was our Stern factory or if it was the Gomez interview.
Speaker: It was the Stern factory.
Speaker: And I'll say why the gentleman had said,
Speaker: I bet no one had the cojones to ask why the LE prices are so ridiculous in your conference call room.
Speaker: And then used it to explain like, that's why we know you guys are softball or whatever.
Speaker: And the funny part is I had responded and I said, actually, we did.
Speaker: Someone did bring that up.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Brought up in the conference.
Speaker: And if you listen to our episode with Gomez, we brought it up there as well.
Speaker: And they both gave answers and the dude never responded back.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Here's the thing.
Speaker: Some of you people out there that you're listening, do a little bit of research before you think before you speak.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: After let me now moving back onto the interview stuff.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: What I found refreshing with Gomez, Gomez said to us, you hear it in the Joel interview, he said it to us before we started, ask the hard questions.
Speaker: Worst case scenario, I say, I can't talk about that.
Speaker: Okay, cool.
Speaker: I love when my interviewee is enthusiastic.
Speaker: This is going out to a lot of you.
Speaker: If you're listening, if we ever invite you on,
Speaker: If you're enthusiastic about your product and you're open about your product, it makes the interview so much funner and easier to listen to and people engage more.
Speaker: And the reason I bring up the Gomez interview is because it exploded.
Speaker: 12,000 listens between all of our platforms together in less than a week.
Speaker: It blew.
Speaker: It was crazy.
Speaker: Sorry, that and the John Wick release episode with Davey.
Speaker: I got to put that caveat.
Speaker: I apologize.
Speaker: But there was a lot of listens in like a week.
Speaker: It was insane.
Speaker: But the reason I bring that up is because we have had interviewees in the past where we have asked questions.
Speaker: We've asked questions that are floating around right now about their companies that have been asked, like, why is no one asking this question?
Speaker: It's because we've asked it.
Speaker: And I get one of two responses.
Speaker: The first response is, I can't talk about that.
Speaker: You got to drop it and you got to cut it from the interview.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Thanks.
Speaker: You want me to leave that in there?
Speaker: Because all they're going to say is, I can't talk about it.
Speaker: You drop it and take it out of the interview.
Speaker: What does that benefit you at all?
Speaker: To bring more speculation?
Speaker: I don't get it.
Speaker: The second thing is, we did ask a question that I didn't think was to, I thought the company would want to get ahead of what was being said.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: The interviewee stood up, said, if these are the kind of questions that are going to be asked, I do not want to be in this interview.
Speaker: And I said, okay, we won't ask that question.
Speaker: You're welcome to sit down.
Speaker: We'll talk about what you want to talk about because it's a really weird dynamic.
Speaker: I can ask those questions all day.
Speaker: But if I don't have an interview, it's a waste of my time.
Speaker: It's a waste of your time.
Speaker: It just...
Speaker: It doesn't benefit anyone at that point.
Speaker: Yeah, it might sound softballed, but I don't know.
Speaker: It takes time to set these.
Speaker: It's not just like I call up Gomez and say, hey, it's three o'clock on a Thursday afternoon.
Speaker: You got time?
Speaker: You want to do this?
Speaker: No, it takes weeks.
Speaker: It takes at least a week of planning.
Speaker: We line these up.
Speaker: We come up with the questions.
Speaker: A lot of times we will send the questions over prehand just to say, hey, this is what we're going to be covering.
Speaker: If there's anything on here you don't feel comfortable with, please let us know.
Speaker: A lot of times they don't care.
Speaker: It just, so there's the insight.
Speaker: That's the making the sausage.
Speaker: So a lot of you people out there are like, why is it so softballed?
Speaker: There are interviews that are very softballed because that's all we're getting out of the cut.
Speaker: That's all we're getting out of the interviewee.
Speaker: Well, okay.
Speaker: Not all questions are really considered softballed.
Speaker: True.
Speaker: And it's subjective, right?
Speaker: Like, right.
Speaker: It's very, very subjective.
Speaker: We do bring up, we bring up a controversy about theme.
Speaker: We bring up controversy about the bottom line is if we want to invite people back onto our show, you have to show some level of respect.
Speaker: And so they felt that they were respected when they were on the show.
Speaker: And sometimes they don't have good answers for the hard questions or at least answers they can discuss.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I've heard of people that have done the interview and they've essentially tricked the person into answering a question they didn't want to ask.
Speaker: Or they pushed out the interview even though they've been asked to cut it.
Speaker: That's just not my stick.
Speaker: That's not my thing, guys.
Speaker: I respect the people in this industry from smallest company to biggest company.
Speaker: It is what it is.
Speaker: Personally, to the gentleman that asked this question,
Speaker: Start up a podcast.
Speaker: Start asking people to come do interviews.
Speaker: Invite people on and then be mean to them.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Good luck.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And see how long you last.
Speaker: And like, and seriously, I encourage anyone out there that's listening.
Speaker: If you want to do a podcast, it's super simple.
Speaker: We do it through Zencaster.
Speaker: You get two weeks like free, whatever you do, do it on your phone and try it out.
Speaker: Like that's the thing.
Speaker: Like you, just like Scott said earlier, you miss a hundred percent of the shots you don't take.
Speaker: I really encourage it.
Speaker: Like if this is something you want to do, then do it.
Speaker: I think it's hard.
Speaker: I think.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: There's a reason why people who tend to have a more critical take, it tends to be a solo show.
Speaker: Look at them.
Speaker: They tend to be solo shows.
Speaker: And they tend to be a little bit of a, a stream of consciousness or a rant.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Now, not, now, not everybody who falls into that category does that.
Speaker: What are you saying?
Speaker: Why are you saying this about Don?
Speaker: Why don't you just publicly call out Don?
Speaker: Don's a nice guy.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: No, but there are some who that is kind of their lane.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Is they typically take a very critical view of the industry and they, they take a very cynical view of it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And to be blunt, that's not my style.
Speaker: Like I, I, I'm in pinball because I'm, I enjoy it.
Speaker: I, it still is a hobby that I enjoy.
Speaker: I don't,
Speaker: view it as nefarious or mean, even though some people that's just what they want to hear.
Speaker: Cause trust me, if you have a total take on, okay, I have certainly gone that direction with deep root because I felt that they had burned so many bridges.
Speaker: They deserved it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: They, they had it coming.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, but for the most part, we do have very good relationships with the, with the manufacturers and the designers.
Speaker: And that's the reason why we can still get people on the show.
Speaker: Yeah, and that's why they give us tidbits and morsels too that everyone rants and raves about for the next six months as well.
Speaker: And so I think, okay, personally me, there's too much complaining in this hobby.
Speaker: Like either pick up a shovel and start like helping, like start work or it just, my thought process is like, there's a lot of squeaky wheels out there and I know like the oil gets the squeaky wheel, right?
Speaker: my recommendation is start coming up with solutions.
Speaker: If you don't feel like something's being done right, recommend something.
Speaker: Say, hey, I noticed that you're doing this.
Speaker: Have you thought about doing it this way?
Speaker: That's my thought process.
Speaker: I guess that's just who I am.
Speaker: And the other thing too is a lot of this doesn't get to me.
Speaker: And the reason being is, I know I've talked about this before, but I was in a touring band for a few years.
Speaker: But my hometown that we played out of
Speaker: When we played shows, it wasn't like I could play all shows with pop punk.
Speaker: We were pop punk.
Speaker: We were very much in the vein of like All Time Low, Green Day, Sum 41.
Speaker: That was our jam.
Speaker: That's what I enjoyed, slightly leaning towards emo.
Speaker: So when we played shows, there was like deathcore metal that we'd had.
Speaker: There was rappers in our town.
Speaker: We played the show with what we had because people aren't paying tickets just to come see us.
Speaker: And it also builds community, yada, yada, yada.
Speaker: But the thing is, is I didn't get offended when a kid came up after we did the show and was like, you guys should sound more death metal.
Speaker: And I'm like, well, why?
Speaker: What makes you think that I should sound more death metal?
Speaker: He's like, well, because I love death metal.
Speaker: Okay, you do.
Speaker: But I don't want to play that.
Speaker: I want to play the music.
Speaker: I don't want to play.
Speaker: It's like the feedback that we should swear more on our podcast.
Speaker: I'm like, yeah, it's not really our state.
Speaker: And there are tons of podcasts.
Speaker: Go ahead and listen to them.
Speaker: That's just my style.
Speaker: So my point being is, is if you're going to criticize someone for what they're doing or who they are or whatever, may stand back and consider like that's their lane.
Speaker: And that's the thing that they've chosen to do.
Speaker: There's a reason behind what they're doing.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like if there's like good constructive criticism, awesome.
Speaker: Like, like the, this is how I feel like you could improve your show, but to change who you are, because I don't fit in with what you think it should be.
Speaker: Uh, sorry.
Speaker: I just not happening.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I guess I had to learn that growing up when you're touring and stuff like that.
Speaker: And people are like, you're good.
Speaker: You should just be more metal or more ska or whatever.
Speaker: It's like, cool.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like I wouldn't mind having some of those elements, but I'm not changing everything we've produced.
Speaker: It's just, it's weird to me.
Speaker: And I get like a lot of people don't get that.
Speaker: Uh, but yeah.
Speaker: And if you've lasted this long, Josh is now going to take off his shirt and show us his third dimple.
Speaker: I am not, but I wanted to, I want to wrap this up with doing a couple of shout outs.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I know we've already done a ton of shout outs.
Speaker: Uh, I've had this concept.
Speaker: I've been thinking about this a lot.
Speaker: Um, there's a lot of times like we've talked about on the show, we get into our lane.
Speaker: We very much listen to certain podcasts or certain, uh, we don't hear about certain podcasts, uh,
Speaker: I'm starting up a small segment.
Speaker: It's just going to be like a couple minutes of that.
Speaker: Content creator of the episode.
Speaker: I don't care if you're doing YouTube.
Speaker: I don't care if you're doing podcasting.
Speaker: Even if you do 40,000 posts on Pidside and you feel like you should be recognized for your voice because you are literally creating content because you're on a forum creating content.
Speaker: So if you feel like you should be...
Speaker: You should be heard.
Speaker: Recognized if you want to be recognized.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And we don't talk about you or whatever.
Speaker: And maybe we don't know who you are.
Speaker: Send us your information.
Speaker: I want to listen to you.
Speaker: The first one I'm going to bring up is technology connections.
Speaker: This was actually brought up to my attention by
Speaker: Uh, the HVAC technician that trained me, I had never actually listened to technology connections.
Speaker: It's a YouTube channel.
Speaker: Uh, it's very much like heating and air conditioning or TVs or stuff like that, but he's actually been doing pinball for, he's doing a series on pinball.
Speaker: And the cool part is, is like the very first episode he did about like what makes pinball tick or whatever, 2 million views.
Speaker: So this dude obviously has a following.
Speaker: It's doing really great.
Speaker: But I actually didn't know about this.
Speaker: And it's obviously people, other people know about this.
Speaker: If you haven't checked it out, very well done.
Speaker: And there's, I want to say there's three episodes so far out for the pinball stuff.
Speaker: So check out technology, technology connections.
Speaker: The second shout out I want to give Todd, not Todd.
Speaker: I apologize.
Speaker: Shane told,
Speaker: If you've ever heard of a band called Silverstein, he is the lead singer of that band.
Speaker: A Toronto-based emo band, very metal mixed with some screaming, good stuff.
Speaker: Very punk rock as well.
Speaker: He has a podcast called lead singer syndrome.
Speaker: If you haven't checked this out, it's very cool.
Speaker: Some of your favorite rock bands, or he even covers array of different bands, but he brings the lead singers on.
Speaker: They have a discussion.
Speaker: They talk about, you know, behind the scenes, may some crazy stuff you didn't know he's done.
Speaker: He's been doing it for nine years now, and he has a wide array of a ton of singers, dudes way into pinball.
Speaker: I didn't know this, but like a month ago,
Speaker: we get a follow on Instagram.
Speaker: Like Shane told main singer, Silverstein, wait a minute.
Speaker: And so I clicked on it.
Speaker: It's like, is this legit?
Speaker: And it was the blue, the blue check mark and everything.
Speaker: And I was like, like, I grew up on discovering the waterfront, an amazing CD.
Speaker: If you haven't heard it very good.
Speaker: If you're, uh, their newer stuff is, uh, not as email.
Speaker: Let's put it that way, but the newest stuff, check out, burn it down or break, uh, bad habits, fantastic songs as well.
Speaker: But, uh,
Speaker: I was like, I got to check this out.
Speaker: Like this is shit.
Speaker: So I finally messaged him this last week and we're going to have him on and he's going to talk about pinball because the dude loves pinball.
Speaker: And so I think this is awesome.
Speaker: This is, this is, it's just cool.
Speaker: Like listening to this dude.
Speaker: And then he's like, yeah, I love your guys's podcast.
Speaker: So I'm excited.
Speaker: So if you haven't checked, there's two, there's two content creators.
Speaker: both that deal with pinball, but maybe not actually talk about pinball.
Speaker: Technology Connections doing their pinball segments and then Lead Senior Syndrome with Shane Told.
Speaker: All right, Scott.
Speaker: Sorry, I kind of took over there for a minute.
Speaker: No, it's all good.
Speaker: I talk way too much most of the time, so it's good to listen to someone else.
Speaker: And if you made it this far and you want to email us, because I bet we're going to get some negative comments on this episode.
Speaker: It's all good.
Speaker: You know, the best part about emails is I never see them.
Speaker: I know you don't.
Speaker: And the funny part is, is there's some ones that we get.
Speaker: I'm like, yeah, I'm just throwing that one away.
Speaker: And they're like, I joke about it to your weeks.
Speaker: And you're like, we got an email about that.
Speaker: And I'm like, yeah, do you really want me to read it to you?
Speaker: It's kind of stupid.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: He tells me the good emails that Josh is my filter.
Speaker: So he keeps my sunshine going.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, and honestly, we get a ton of positive feedback.
Speaker: And so like when you get like two or three bad things, like,
Speaker: That's how I feel.
Speaker: You still hear those louder.
Speaker: Or we might make fun of you because we don't really swear and I don't drink.
Speaker: You know, Scott, you get him at Expo.
Speaker: Yeah, right.
Speaker: I'm drinking my water right now because I'm working tomorrow.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: But anywho, if you want to get a hold of us, Loserkidpinballpodcast.gmail.com.
Speaker: If you want to get a hold of us on the socials, at Loserkidpinball, we're on X, Instagram, Facebook, Facebook,
Speaker: threads uh twitch tick tock yeah all that stuff and sorry some of it i don't do jack with like i think our tick tock we like released like three episodes at expo last year and that that was it so um but yeah if you want to get a hold of us that's the way to do it also hit up silver ball swag thank you to i'm going to say
Speaker: We don't get names of who buy our product, but it tells us the location.
Speaker: So the gentleman that bought the men's shoes, Loser Kid shoes in gray in Tennessee,
Speaker: you're gonna be the coolest guy in Tennessee.
Speaker: So, or maybe it's a woman that buys men's shoes.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: So, uh, yeah, silver ball swag.com slash loser kid.
Speaker: Uh, get some shoes, get some swag, get some shirts, uh, sterns all covered in our loser kid attacks logo that was done by Michael Bernard.
Speaker: Thanks, Michael.
Speaker: Uh,
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Scott, give us our last words.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I'm starting to look forward to pinball expo.
Speaker: I'm really wondering what you guys are thinking.
Speaker: So hopefully we'll get some feedback to see what you guys are hoping to see at expo.
Speaker: And I'm definitely going to hit up.
Speaker: Let's make a deal.
