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The Resilience Route: Flexibility and Growth with Yifat Baror
101 Plays8 months ago
In this episode of "Resilient Revenue," host Jane Serra speaks with Yifat Baror, Chief Growth Officer at OSA Commerce. Yifat shares her journey from founding a retail chain to leading growth in the e-commerce sector. She emphasizes the importance of adaptability, the role of relationships in career progression, and strategies for driving revenue in challenging times.
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Transcript
Introduction to Resilient Revenue
00:00:01
Speaker
Welcome to Resilient Revenue, a women in revenue podcast series designed to magnify the voices, victories, and valuable insights of trailblazing women in revenue-generating roles. Each episode will showcase stories of resilience, mentorship, and self-advocacy. You'll learn exactly how these remarkable women are breaking barriers, redefining success, and showing us the transformative power of unity within the tech industry.
00:00:31
Speaker
So join us as we embark on this enlightening journey toward equality and empowerment in the world of resilient revenue.
Host and Guest Introduction
00:00:42
Speaker
Hi, everybody. Thank you for joining us today on Resilient Revenue from Women in Revenue. I'm the host for today, Jane Serra. I'm a VP Marketing at Just Do Know. And we are going to be talking to Yifat Barur, who is the Chief Growth Officer at OSA Commerce, which stands for Just Learn This One Step Ahead Commerce. Love it. So Yifat, thank you for joining us today. Excited to dive in.
00:01:08
Speaker
Thank you. Thank you for having me. So happy to be here. You guys are doing important things and bringing important topics to the table. Thank you. Thank you so
Yifat's Career Journey
00:01:17
Speaker
much. One thing I always love to ask guests is if you could tell us a little bit about how you got into the world of revenue. I know that you've been in biz dev marketing and thoroughly on the entrepreneurial side of things.
00:01:29
Speaker
We'd love to hear a little bit about your first job in this industry and just how you got to be Chief Growth Officer at OSA. Yeah. In my early 20s, I lived in Europe and I fell in love with all the lifestyle, boutiques, and stores. That inspired me. Don't know how it happened, but that sparked me to start my own business. I created this whole chain of retail stores and a distribution business and a private label that we manufactured.
00:01:58
Speaker
So, I really fell into retail but also to e-calls because it was at a time where this talk, I'm talking 20 years ago, started and we were doing all the things without really knowing that we were doing them. So, pop stores and email blasts and digital newsletters, that's how it started for me and I was able to exit with that business.
00:02:21
Speaker
and then transitioned to another company in this space that I had their international business and brought partnerships to the United States under brands and retails.
Importance of Relationships and Networking
00:02:32
Speaker
Love that. Thank you. Has there been any kind of change or something unexpected that happened along your career path that helped bring you to where you are today? Or has it been kind of following exactly where you saw a need for your services and interests and what you could do next?
00:02:50
Speaker
Honestly, relationships, obviously, the industry has changed as you well know, and that created enormous opportunities for innovation, but it's the people. You meet people along the way, and sometimes you don't know what that would mean, and another door opens, and that sort of, if you give, you take chances, you take that opportunity, then it takes you in different paths, and that's sort of what happened to me.
00:03:15
Speaker
love that. Everything always comes down to relationships, right? Which is why communities and networking are always so key, especially for women, just to be able to support each other. So true. And one thing I've been thinking is as chief growth officer, what are you seeing
00:03:32
Speaker
work right now. For OSA or for clients and partners, what do you see driving revenue right now? It could be channel, go to market strategy. Curious, I know a ton of our listeners are going to be in the revenue space and it's a tough year. It's been a weird few years for everybody. Curious if you have any insight on what's working.
Adaptability in Changing Markets
00:03:52
Speaker
I think, you know, it has been a tough year and I think part of it is being flexible in times like this. So you can have a very strong vote on market and it might've been on point when you put it together, but part of
00:04:07
Speaker
To deal with situation like this, you have to sometimes pivot within your go-to market. You have to be flexible and you have to read your clients. Your client or ICP is changing, right? Your ideal customer and you might have to tweak things. So I think my advice is really to listen, understand your audience,
00:04:26
Speaker
get as much feedback as you possibly can and then see where that takes you. Yeah. It's so true. Being flexible is just a number one necessity for everybody in marketing, sales, CS right now, because everything's just constantly changing and fluctuating.
00:04:44
Speaker
And is there anything kind of on the flip side that is not working? And just in 2023 and foreseeable future, you think from a growth perspective is just done with, at least for now.
Shifts in Customer Demands
00:04:58
Speaker
You never know for a longer period, but anything that you think is
00:05:01
Speaker
I think, I don't know how to say done. I mean, I can tell you that some of the ads like that were working really, really well, previous years, I think that there's a decline. But part of it, it's not going to be used anymore. It's just like you have to understand what's the purpose. And I think the purpose is shifting. And also, I think companies and customers are
00:05:24
Speaker
requesting much more today. They want facts. They don't want a sales pitch. They want to see what can this do to me and my business, especially as it relates to revenue. What are the attributes? How can I save money? Simple as that. We like to say that our platform pays for itself because we were able to basically show through the platform at OSA that they're great savings. That yes, you pay for this platform. It's a SaaS.
00:05:50
Speaker
a subscription-based payment, but you're getting so much more in logistics savings and revenue increase. And that's what our partners really want to see today. Yes. So showcasing that ROI from the get-go. It's no longer only in the Bofu stage or when you're deeper in the sales conversations, you really have to show that ROI at least potential right off the bat.
00:06:15
Speaker
Absolutely. That's really interesting because everything's so up in the air and with the economy the way it is, people are scaling back or watching their budget or really just watching every dollar more carefully so that ROI conversation comes in handy a lot sooner.
00:06:33
Speaker
And in our space, as you know, there are so many technologies. So in B2B marketing, it's hard for them. They're looking at all these solutions. They don't know most of the times to filter it out. So if you can show those savings and you can show that ROI, then you're putting your company at the top.
00:06:50
Speaker
Yeah, really good tip for everybody to consider how they can focus on that Bofu, typically Bofu topic that's now really going up to the top.
Team Focus and Company Culture
00:07:01
Speaker
You also mentioned being flexible and the flexibility, which is such a good word for this year, right?
00:07:07
Speaker
I'm curious on the leadership side of things. Because it's such a strange time, really the last few years, how have you kept your team focused and performing or how have you seen that being done well? And really how have you kept them happy, right? Because it's such a strange time, flexibility probably comes into play on that side as well behind the curtain.
00:07:29
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Flexibility, adaptability. For us, it's part of our values. So myself and my two other co-founders, it was very important for us from the get-go to align the company's mission also to our values. So part of that is being innovative, right? We're a tech company.
00:07:47
Speaker
We want our people to be innovative themselves and bring that daily to their workspace. So I think if you spark that in people and you really listen, you take their feedback, you take their creativity and innovation, it provides you that flexibility because you're fueled by ideas constantly. So even when the market is changing constantly, you have people who are thinking outside of the box. So true.
00:08:17
Speaker
and
00:08:18
Speaker
I love the innovation component and focusing on your values. How do you keep yourself and your team motivated when let's say if numbers aren't aren't being hit or exactly some companies they are and that's amazing. Any company is hitting their numbers and even staying stagnant. It's just a win this year. But for any companies that are not, do you have any tips or advice for staying motivated yourself and keeping your team feeling motivated as well?
00:08:48
Speaker
Absolutely. First of all, we're a startup and I worked for startups my entire life. So it goes up and down, up and down. So you have to have a winning mindset. I think that if we create a culture that accepts challenges and sometimes failure and learns from those
00:09:04
Speaker
challenges and mistakes and keep that unique winning mindset, then you can do anything. And if your people feel like that's true and your leadership acts within that, they're going to obtain the same mindset.
00:09:19
Speaker
Part of it is really, I always tell my team, you know, going through this from a very early age, when I had big wins in my business, I used to remind myself and say, this too shall pass, even when it's a win and it's great. Because when you have a failure, you have to tell yourself the same thing, this too shall pass because we tend, as you win, to take our failures in a much harder and heavy way and not be so forgiving.
00:09:44
Speaker
So, I think when you say that in both situation, it keeps you honest, right? It's kind of like, okay, all is good. Two more is in the end. Yeah. I love that. It's a clear...
00:09:56
Speaker
picture where on either end it's going to pass, right? Positive or negative. Celebrate the wins and learn from the failures, but it's okay to fail and just keep on moving as long as you learn from it, right? From both sides. And also culturally, if you do have failures and every company has those, how do you treat that internally with your team? How do you talk about it?
00:10:18
Speaker
Are you blaming people? Are you finding even a solution mindset? And I think for us, it's very important in our culture to create that solution mindset. We're flexible, we're adaptable, things go wrong, that happens, how do we fix it? So we create that culture of fixers, which I love that. And we think that we have a really good company in that sense. We were there to fix things for our customers and just make it better, but we have to do it also internally within our own team.
Remote Work and Creativity
00:10:48
Speaker
That's amazing. My husband is a developer and one of his titles in the past was solutions architect. And I just love that title, right? We all have to be a solutions architect to some degree within whatever field we're in or role we're in. I feel like that's part of the responsibility.
00:11:05
Speaker
And someone, an old boss once told me, don't come to me with problems, come to me with problems and solutions to the problem so we can discuss, right? So it's always being solution minded and learning from the good and the bad. That's what managers love. Someone who can come and point out maybe an issue, but already is ready to solve it. That's the best you can wish.
00:11:28
Speaker
Yeah. Have you found any, on the leadership side, continuing down that path, any trials or tribulations with remote work or hybrid work? I assume, is those the hybrid or remote to any degree? Hybrid. We have half of the company is in Israel, so our R&D is completely in Israel. And then we have some people in our office in Atlanta, but also many of our people, our marketing and sales are all over. So am I.
00:11:55
Speaker
I think it's hard. I mean, for us, we're kind of used to it. But yeah, it's hard in a way that it just, again, you have to be creative. How are you building those relationships, even if you don't sit in the same office space? So we really work at it. We get together, we talk.
00:12:12
Speaker
I think visuals are very important, not just you have to put your camera on, you have to see what you're talking to. You can only have meetings that are related to work as well. You have to create spaces where you have conversations, like someone brings a topic and you just connect over that topic. And we do that a lot, which I personally love and I would do more of.
00:12:32
Speaker
And I think you need to know your people better. You create those connections in a deeper way. Yeah. It's so important to, I mean, for fully remote companies, you still have to kind of make the Zoom world feel like the real world, like you're in person, which is hard to do. Cameras help a lot if everyone's willing to turn them on.
00:12:52
Speaker
There were times when we started, we hired someone, we worked with them for almost a year, but because of COVID, there were no events. And suddenly you go to an event and then you see this guy and he's like so tall, if you couldn't imagine. And it's very funny when you get to meet finally face to face.
00:13:10
Speaker
Yeah, so funny. I'm curious, I know the industry that you're in with supply chain and e-comm, we've talked about this a little before the bikes came on, but it's a male-dominated
Role of Mentorship and Advocacy
00:13:21
Speaker
field. Is there, A, I'd love to hear more about just how you've risen to where you are today in such a male-dominated field, and B, how you think about passing that forward to any of your female employees and team members?
00:13:37
Speaker
So I think in my entire career, I sort of fell into places where it was male dominated. And I had really great women mentors. And I'm very, very grateful for that because that taught me a lot about leadership and also how to support one another. And that's very, very important to me. I'm very passionate about it. I have three daughters. I tried to show them exactly how those relationships are so important in life and in the workplace.
00:14:06
Speaker
And I'm also lucky to have male counterparts who believe in me and understand the complexities and really give me a lot of respect and a strong voice in our industry. And so my co-founders have been amazing and that's part of the reasons I'm part of that team. It's because of the personalities.
00:14:28
Speaker
Yeah. Are there any ways? Because the allies are so key. I'm reading a book right now. I think it's called Machiavelli for Women. And it's all about, well, one piece that I just listened to, Audible is my jam. It's most important to find allies who will speak up for you and for you to speak up for others, especially when you're thinking about other women. Because when you speak up for yourself, unfortunately, it still comes across as
00:14:57
Speaker
crass or right if you're the bossy boss and dominating versus helpful. But if you're sticking up for someone else, it's understood and accepted. So having that support system is so key. Is there any way that you've identified these allies? It could be male or female, but how do you identify going into the right company or choosing the right partner, knowing that they're going to be those allies that you're looking for?
00:15:26
Speaker
I think that, first of all, you bring a really important point. People need advocates. It's not just women, I think. In every workplace, you have to create those relationships. Somebody will care enough, understand you, mentor you, and push you forward. Behind closed doors as well, right? That's important and never know what's happening there. I think it's all about building relationships. So, coming open-minded and seeking even a mentor when you're going into a new company,
00:15:55
Speaker
Somebody that you can really learn from but can also advocate for you. That's how I would do it. And that's what I try to do for people also that work with me. And just get yourself a network of people who support you. It doesn't only have to be in the workplace. I would say friends from different industries that you can call when you need advice. It's very important.
00:16:19
Speaker
I heard somebody coined this, I don't know if it was coined by this person, but I'm a personal board of directors. It sounds like that's why you're talking about as well, this network of people and friends in the industry and outside who you can go to and they can be your advocates and your sounding boards and
00:16:37
Speaker
your board of directors per se. Yeah. It's so true. I have a group of friends that really are of women who are in different industries, all in leadership roles. And we all seek each other's advice on our weaknesses when things go well, when things don't go so well, when we have challenges. And it keeps you honest also because they know you. So they know how to read the nuances of what you're saying. And I think that's amazing to have.
00:17:07
Speaker
Love that. Is there anything that you look for in having built this personal board of directors and this group of friends who you can trust for feedback who are kind of in a leadership position, if not the industry? How have you gone about building it? Does it just come naturally or are there kind of tips looking back that you can give people who haven't yet built any listeners that haven't yet built their board of director?
Building Authentic Networks
00:17:34
Speaker
think really be open to it and try and support others. Come from a place of honesty and good and things sort of tend to open up and when you're authentic,
00:17:47
Speaker
when you're meeting people, they tend to be authentic with most of the time. So I felt like in different places in life when I met different people and I have relationships going 20 years back that I've kept and some relationships that I just created this year from even short encounters, but you have that chemistry. Yeah, people want connections, especially after the few years that we've had. So just about being authentic and open and it creates opportunities.
00:18:17
Speaker
Yeah, keep an eye out for that chemistry and kind of trust your gut for this one. And don't be afraid to also, if you meet someone and you want them to be an inventor, the way for younger people, I say like, be direct, don't be apologetic about it. I think, you know, if you come with confidence and you say what you need and what your expectation, the other sides respect that.
00:18:40
Speaker
Yeah. For anybody who has approached you to be a mentor, maybe there's someone listening right now who really would love to have you as their mentor. How do you recommend they approach you or somebody else to be there just direct? Or is there a way that always warms your heart?
00:18:58
Speaker
LinkedIn just be direct and open. And yeah, I've had that happen. And it's a great way to meet younger people as well from different places in life. And I love that. If anything, in my journey, you can help someone. I'm all for it. Love that. And on the flip side, I know we have a lot of listeners who are people that are members of Women in Revenue who are senior leaders already and
00:19:26
Speaker
want to be in this organization to give back? Is there anything you can share that as a mentor yourself and lifting up other women and that you've gained from those relationships?
00:19:37
Speaker
Oh, all the time. I mean, first of all, you learn from each other. I learn from different situations. Also, people share with me and I also learn how we can do better and the challenges that people face. Sometimes my challenges are very different than someone else and it kind of opens your eyes also to understand how to hire. I think just being in these conversations and how to go about hiring and opening the doors to people that maybe
00:20:06
Speaker
don't get those opportunities so adequate. But that's also part of listening to understanding how to do better. How can we improve as a company? Yeah, amazing. I think as a woman, there's often a comparison piece that comes up and
00:20:22
Speaker
I've sensed this a little bit in my career in the past where instead of lifting each other up, it feels like you're competing with other women who are maybe in a similar group to you or similar level. So I always try to break down that barrier myself and talking to others just
00:20:40
Speaker
how can you putting in your mind or planting that seed of how can I help other women and help lift others out up and not see them as competition? I don't know if this is just a female thing, but I do sense the competition piece at least earlier in my career. I sensed it more where there's that threat with somebody else, maybe because there's fewer slots available. I don't think it's a competition. I think it's something that we were taught to think, but I think it's a new thing.
00:21:07
Speaker
And I don't think it had anything to do with between being women to women. I actually, in my old career, right, I only had one situation where I felt that all the women leaders I worked with were amazing and supportive and really wanted to push me forward. So I think it's an ego thing. And men definitely have that too. But once you put your ego aside and you understand how to support others and part of building that is even with feedback, you know,
00:21:36
Speaker
If you have somebody working for you, it doesn't matter, men or women, you want to be able to give their feedback.
00:21:42
Speaker
public, not behind closed doors and really shine a light on that, right? And I think when you act like that as a leader, especially with women, then you see that you have a support system. So it sort of eliminates all that competition and negativity and really creating a solid group that works together and wants each other to be successful.
Fostering Positive Work Environments
00:22:08
Speaker
Yeah, amazing. I mean, everything just works so much better when we collaborate and help one another. And this sounds very frou-frou, but it's putting the right vibes out and putting positive vibes so that that comes back your way too. So just helping each other and creating that flywheel of advocating for each other and assisting. Exactly. One thing I wanted to chat with you about going kind of back to the revenue side of things,
00:22:33
Speaker
Chief Growth Officer, very well-known term. I'd love to kind of pick into two things, a little bit about what gross means to you and what it includes on your team. And then there's been a lot of talk about Chief GTM Officer lately in my circles, like a Chief Go-To-Market Officer. I'm curious your thoughts on that term being coined and how that, if it's one and the same with Chief Growth Officer in your mind.
00:23:00
Speaker
I think it is. I think, you know, I'm responsible for marketing and sales, investor relations. I think basically that puts our name out there in a strategic way. And I think it does it all together. It does it all together. And I think once you put sales and marketing also under the same umbrella, those teams tend to really align well.
00:23:23
Speaker
a mutual goal, same leadership. So it helps with the moving pieces, I think. We move very, very fast because we're a lot. Everybody has the same vision. And I think, you know, go to market again, because you need that flexibility today, there's a real benefit that that's also under the same umbrella in leadership.
00:23:45
Speaker
which is a perfect segue into sales and marketing alignment. We all know that that's key for success, but how have you achieved that or any kind of tips for everybody on achieving sales and marketing alignment and why is it so important for the whole company's success?
00:24:05
Speaker
You can't have one without the other. They have to be tied in. And it's a lot about communication and not blame. I've seen, I've worked in other companies where it was always like sales blaming marketing, marketing blaming sales. Here it was very, very clear to me that we needed a cohesive voice that really is aligned between both departments. And I have amazing ZPs on both sides and they just work really, really well together. And again, it comes from a cultural aspect.
00:24:35
Speaker
Yeah, I believe like when you have that winning mindset, even if you disagree on certain things and strategically you have to shift, especially in a startup changed so much within six months, once you have that winning mindset and you are working as one unit, things tend to be okay. You get to your goals and everybody share the same goal. I think that's the most important thing. And then it's not your team, my team.
00:25:03
Speaker
Everybody's doing it together. Agreed. The same aligning on goals seems like the foundation and collaboration. And in a quote on another, if you have things, you know, I always say like, even if marketing is doing something that doesn't really, really require sales feedback, right?
00:25:23
Speaker
Show them, share with them, let them be your advocates as well and part of the process. And I think having that collaboration really, really helps. Yeah. How do you foster that culture of collaboration and alignment between the teams? Is it with meetings or in-person get-togethers? What tactics have worked for you?
00:25:44
Speaker
Yeah, so because we're remote, it's a lot of meaning that we get together, not just to discuss the business, but also different topics. Listening to each other, asking questions about things that are happening in our personal lives and being open, how you make real connections, right? To know, okay,
00:26:02
Speaker
something going on in my colleague's life that I should know about his kids, what's important to them, the animal that they love doesn't matter. And I think that's part of it. And we were lucky enough to travel for events in recent months. And I think that
00:26:18
Speaker
really build strong relationships. Because when you get together face-to-face and you've built something already virtually, then it's really, really fun. And we really enjoy the one thing I love about this company and I tell the teams always, I am so happy when I go to meet them. And to me, a huge win. Just you enjoy that time with people and you value the people you work with.
00:26:46
Speaker
When you actually get that time to meet IRL in real life, nothing beats it, especially after the pandemic. I feel like we value it so much more now because we didn't have it for so long. Is there any way you recommend just maximizing that time together? Or how do you split the productive work meetings versus the get to know you face-to-face time?
00:27:12
Speaker
work hard, I'm a very hard worker, work hard, we play hard, go out, go to a show together, we do something together that makes, creates that bond of fun. People who are connected to each other and care about each other will work harder for the sharing goal. That is it. Yeah, they care. So they care and then they're your ambassadors. That's the company's ambassador that you sent out there.
00:27:40
Speaker
How important do you see, you can really think of this from a B2B and a B2C perspective because of your role, like your company itself is B2B, but you work with e-com companies, so B2C. I'm curious how you see, you mentioned like advocates and they're your ambassadors. How do you see the role of the internal team as advocates and ambassadors?
Internal Advocacy and Representation
00:28:02
Speaker
Has that strengthened over the past few years or how do you value that? Are internal teams unique?
00:28:08
Speaker
Yeah, internal ambassador. I think very much so. And it's something that also in my leadership, I work with my people because they say like, let's say you have a sales guy, he's selling it to the prospect, but you have to sell also who you are and what are your values within the company and shine light on other skill sets that you have.
00:28:30
Speaker
And sometimes people don't know, you know, they don't know how to go about it. It's also a skill to develop. And I think it's very important, especially for people who are thinking ahead of in their career. I definitely on my one-on-ones with people, I have something called coffee with each part where I get together with
00:28:45
Speaker
different people in the company to really understand what's important to them. What do they want to do in the next five years? How do they see their career path? And by understanding that, A, you can get a lot more from the people you work with and get them to be much happier because they're doing something that's valuable to them and their path.
00:29:10
Speaker
Yes, I love that coffee with Yvette. That's such a great idea and just picking their brain because from our conversation, the word values keeps coming up and I love that because it seems like everything on the sales marketing performance side of things and the internal culture and collaboration side, it all comes back to values at the end of the day.
00:29:31
Speaker
And I love that you're finding out your team members values too, because the company might have a set of values and that's really important to share with the team and make sure everybody's on board. But each individual has their own set of values that are layered on top of that to get to know.
00:29:48
Speaker
Yeah, and it trickles down, you know. I'll give you an example from last week. One of our sales guys was traveling to meet a client and one of the women that was working on the operational side was traveling to meet him and he went to pick her up from the airport and then
00:30:04
Speaker
he sent an email to the entire company shining light on her and how amazing, professional she was in those meetings. And that's again about giving that feedback publicly and putting somebody up. Now he didn't have to do it, right? And we definitely didn't tell him to do it, but that's the culture that I'm very proud of. And that was amazing to see.
00:30:29
Speaker
I love that. I've always had in my past companies, I've used Slack for so long now, I can't imagine not using it, but we've always had a winning channel. So you share team wins or shout outs or kudos. It could be named different things, winning, kudos, shout outs, but just recognizing team members and giving them that kind of credit and just
00:30:51
Speaker
Yeah, credit and value for what they've done for you and just shouting them out publicly, like you said. It's just so heartwarming and really gets you invested in the company, I find.
00:31:02
Speaker
Everybody likes recognition, right? Like it's the human being. It's like we hate that. It's much nicer to wake up to a company and work hard when you're feeling valued. Yes, so true. Again, value, it comes... Your values and feeling valued, right? Yeah. It's the feeling that really matters.
00:31:26
Speaker
Mm-hmm. So true. Recognition is so, so key I found at different companies because if you don't feel that recognition, you slowly kind of separate from being attached to the company. And you have resentment and all sorts of negativity starts. Yeah, maybe that's a bumper sticker. Lack of recognition leads to resentment, right? So true.
00:31:51
Speaker
I'm going to put you on the spot here, so feel free to skip. We can edit this. But I'm curious if you can walk us through any career hurdles you've had along the way that have taught you just a major life or career lesson.
00:32:04
Speaker
So in terms of revenue, let's take it to revenue. There we go. Back in the day, I was working on one of the ventures that I was working on. We were creating an app for e-commerce with a lot of very luxurious brands. And the downfall hit between 2008 to 2009. So we worked really, really hard. We created this beautiful thing, put a lot of money and effort into it. But then the downfall.
00:32:34
Speaker
The financial downfall happened and it was like it was not working. It failed miserably. We weren't able to read the market. We invested in the wrong type of brands and it just backfired completely. And we lost a lot of revenue to a point where we thought the company was going to shut down.
00:32:52
Speaker
So again, through that challenge, what do you do? Like, what do you do? Okay, after the disappointment and hardy and wasted dollars in time, what do you do? And we decided to shift very, very quickly and reach out to brands who are more affordable. And we shifted the app in a way that would be more accommodating to what was happening financially in the market. So we were actually able to save it, but it was very of our time and it taught us a big, big lesson.
00:33:23
Speaker
in terms of when things hit, A, you can't be prepared for everything. And you have to, again, it's not about having a plan B because I don't really like having a plan B. I don't think that sets you up to success sometimes, but I think being flexible and really listening to the market is super important.
00:33:47
Speaker
That's why I said go to market has to sometimes be there. And so things change. So true. I mean, I wrote down so many notes from everything you just said, because if anything, the past few years have told us that we never know what's going to get thrown at us, right? It's the pandemic and then different politics and horrible things across the world. And now with the economy, it's just you never know when you have to have that flexibility and be able to pivot.
00:34:16
Speaker
I wanna double click on no plan B. That's so interesting to me and I already love it. But if you could tell us a little more about why you don't believe in having a plan B. I think a lot of us tend to do that and say, oh, okay, if this doesn't work out, I'll do this, I can shift to that. And it sounds good on paper, right? Having hair, do you have other plans?
00:34:38
Speaker
Mentally, and this is just personally for me, mentally, I feel like that takes that winning mindset a little bit down instead of saying, no, this is how I'm going to do it. I could be flexible in it. I can adapt. I can listen and learn, but this is the plan. I am committed to a plan.
00:34:56
Speaker
Yeah, it's different than saying I have another, you know what I mean? Yes, I love that. And it's just such a slight mindset
Commitment and Resilience
00:35:03
Speaker
shift. Like you want to be open to pivot and alternatives and maybe you're floating different alternatives in the back of your mind, but far, far back so that you don't detract from that winning mindset. I'm going to adopt that myself. That's such a good idea.
00:35:18
Speaker
Because it can, it can just take away from you being all in on this idea, right? But instead you should work on a resilience. I feel for a lot of people it gives you the excuse. Okay, but I have another plan. So if this is too hard, this is too much for me, I have another thing I can do. Yeah, and you might pivot too soon.
00:35:38
Speaker
right? And go, that's so interesting. And it's funny because our podcast is resilient revenue, right? So it's all about working that resiliency muscle really that we all have. Instead of having a backup plan that you might pull out too soon, it's instead building your muscle on the resilient side to be able to pivot in the moment if need be and hopefully you won't even need to.
00:36:02
Speaker
And we live in a time, think about it, that everything is so fast and dynamic and changes. It's almost people don't want to commit for the long term. There's a lot of easier, faster solutions that you can shift and change. That's not necessarily how you get to the big way. Yes. So I love that. And another thing in the world of revenue, right? Pivot. There's so many leaders who are very quick to pivot because the numbers, like looking at the numbers, which we need to do, we need to analyze performance.
00:36:32
Speaker
But how do you find a balance between pivoting when it's the right moment after enough time is provided to see out a campaign or a new initiative versus pivoting too soon out of fear? The way to eliminate fear is by using data. Get as much data as possible to support your ideas or throw them up based on the data. It has to have some numbers attached to it because if not, then we're just acting emotionally.
00:37:04
Speaker
So true. And I've been surprised before. I thought, let's say something would be amazing and great. And then I tested out and I see the metrics. I'm like, oh, no. And it can, it's going to happen. Both wins, right? But you have to handle the longest high risk.
00:37:21
Speaker
Is there the answer and I'm sure is going to be a dependence because it has to depend. But this makes me think testing wise, right? Let's say ads like meta ads, there's a learning phase, really all ads, there's a learning phase in the beginning. And you kind of have to see that through and see performance after the fact. Is there a time period you go by for different tests and something new that you're trying out?
00:37:46
Speaker
based on the hypothesis, like how long do you give it before pulling the plug on something to see if it's not working? I'm pretty fast with ads because A, we're a startup, so we don't really know what works, what doesn't work. So it could now be on a monthly basis. I try and keep on a monthly to kind of see the whole reporting and A-B testing that we've done.
00:38:06
Speaker
But also, sometimes the decision, even if the numbers are not the best, it depends what in the numbers. Because as you know, sometimes it might not have provided a lead, but it might have gotten you a lot of clicks or followers on LinkedIn. I don't know. So it depends. Are you looking for brand awareness? You have to look at the whole picture, in my opinion.
00:38:27
Speaker
I would say for me, 30 days is like I can make decisions really based on that data. Interesting. And it depends on your goals, right? So you have to go back to making sure you have clear goals from the beginning. So with ads, just to keep that example, if your goal was lead gen and your ads are bringing in a ton of impressions, but not the leads that you're expecting,
00:38:50
Speaker
You can pivot one of two things, right? You can test a different lead gen campaign, or you can pivot your goal to being, if this is warranted, awareness. Yeah. Exactly. It's all about what you're trying to achieve. So you have to pivot sometimes even that. Yeah.
00:39:06
Speaker
Interesting, because there's really this side, right? Yeah, really interesting.
Self-belief and Support Systems
00:39:10
Speaker
If we could go back in time and you could speak to yourself just starting out 2025, 30 years ago, I'm making that up. I want to say you said 2025. What would you say to yourself just starting out getting into revenue and with your entrepreneurial spirit? Is there anything you would tell your younger self?
00:39:33
Speaker
Yeah. Trying to be more confident. Attaching yourself to people who give you confidence.
00:39:43
Speaker
It's really important that people, you know, the people that you attach yourself to, because it really can go both ways and make sure it's the good kind of people who want you to be successful and just believing in yourself, really, because there's a lot of people there that might not have the same talent that you have, but they believe in themselves more. They have more confidence and they're gonna make it.
00:40:09
Speaker
It's a lot of work. Yes, it's a process. A work in process forever, right? For life. Yeah, for life. I read somewhere recently that confidence is actually an external thing. And we always attribute it to an internal, like, oh, that person's so confident, right? It's like an internal attribute or characteristic that they have.
00:40:30
Speaker
But in fact, it's something that's built externally from our network and those we put around us because that as you grow up, you're hearing this, you're hearing it can go too far with ego, but you're hearing these accolades or positive reinforcement that pushes you further and further and it builds that confidence slowly over time. So it seems to come back if you believe in this, it comes back to the network, the importance of having a good solid network around you that is cheering you on and
00:40:59
Speaker
and helping you grow. Exactly. I mean, think about our kids when they try swimming and if somebody's cheering and their family's like, go, go, you can do this, you can do this. The fear is eliminated. They have confidence. They see it every day with my daughter and then suddenly she can go and do it, right? It's the same thing. It's just the same thing. We all deny.
00:41:19
Speaker
Yeah, and you see that smile on their face, like you see them light up when, I mean, it's a little bit, the light isn't as bright as an adult, right? As you get older, it's not as visible, our feelings on our face, like it is with toddlers or kids, but you see that when they get that burst of confidence, it's such a, like seeing that in your own child just warms your heart too and gives you that glow.
Balancing Workload and Empathy
00:41:41
Speaker
So if you can do that for people, even in addition to your kids, just your core group of friends and colleagues,
00:41:47
Speaker
imagine where they can go and how they can grow at your company or wherever they are. I love that. And as a sign off, I'd love to know if there's anything else that we didn't yet touch on today that you'd love to kind of leave our audience with women who are in
00:42:04
Speaker
CS and sales and marketing and growing in their careers, whatever stage, there's any kind of learnings that you can share from your career path thus far. I had a Stanford professor in the Baba sheet that said, busy is the new stupid.
00:42:20
Speaker
So that really resonated with me. I think it really made an impact on my life after he said that. And we all juggle so many, many things between especially women. We wear so many hats and it's really challenging. Just be kind to yourself. Be kind to yourself. Remember to give yourself the time you need. You know, mental issues are a big thing.
00:42:47
Speaker
the last few years, we need to take care of ourselves better, to take care of our teams better, to listen to people, see where they're at. Again, looking at KPIs is important, but look at who you're working with, pay attention and
00:43:03
Speaker
That's the what's going to make your company successful, the people, and how they are in their daily lives matters. I love that. Bringing the heart and the humanity back to revenue because it helps across the board. Amazing words of wisdom. Thank you so much, Yifat, for joining us today on Resilient Revenue. It's been a pleasure having you. If anybody wants to connect, where do you recommend them doing so and reaching out to you?
00:43:29
Speaker
LinkedIn is great. You can message me on LinkedIn. You can connect. Feel free to chat. We'll include the link in show notes. Thank you. And for anybody who would like to just help us grow the show, like, comment, share with a friend, review, we're growing every day and the community and this podcast. So thank you again, Yufa, and thank you everybody for listening. Thank you. And that wraps up another episode of Resilient Revenue.
00:43:57
Speaker
These narratives are more than just personal triumphs. They embody the collective journey that we undertake as we strive for a future where every woman, no matter her career stage, location, industry, or demographic profile, has the opportunity to excel in her chosen field. Women in revenue exists because we know amazing things can happen when driven, talented, bottom-line-oriented women are fired up and collaborating to grow their careers and organizations.
Joining Women in Revenue
00:44:27
Speaker
We invite you to join our amazing community of 7,000 plus members. If you'd like to become a member for free, head on over to womeninrevenue.org to join today. See you next time on Resilient Revenue.