Transcript
Speaker: Welcome to Resilient Revenue, a women in revenue podcast series designed to magnify the voices, victories, and valuable insights of trailblazing women in revenue -generating roles. Each episode will showcase stories of resilience, mentorship, and self -advocacy. You'll learn exactly how these remarkable women are breaking barriers, redefining success, and showing us the transformative power of unity within the tech industry.
Speaker: So join us as we embark on this enlightening journey toward equality and empowerment in the world of resilient revenue.
Speaker: I'm your host, Kacen Gortensen, and today I'm joined by Vabez Cooper from Demand Base. And today we're going to talk about influencer marketing. Thank you so much for joining us. Thanks, pleasure. So first, just to start, we'd love to hear a little bit about yourself and hear a high level of your career path.
Speaker: Awesome. I'm Vavas, I'm from demand -based, and I handle the influencer marketing campaigns over we here, the post -production, a little bit of social, and that is somewhere that I would love to see myself go. More in influencer marketing for sure, because people connect with people, and it's super, super interesting. When we do all of these different campaigns, what works, what doesn't work, so I'm hoping that is where I go in the future, excited.
Speaker: No, I love that. So I feel like a lot of people talk about influencer marketing, but not everyone actually understands what it is. Would love to hear from someone who's actually in influencer marketing. What exactly is it? so marketing is just like i said people connecting with people It's very easy for brands to promote themselves like, hey, we have the software. It's pretty cool. But when let's say an employee says it or somebody like you and me say it, you know what? You should totally check this out. It's like a reference.
Speaker: It adds that trust factor because then you're like, OK, like I know about this company, I've heard about them and they do great, but it's just that extra added value. OK, I know about them and this is what they do. And now I can put my trust into them. Because so many times people invest a lot of money, a lot of dollars into a software only to figure out that, oh, this is not what we wanted.
Speaker: But when somebody tells them that, you know what, we had a similar problem and this software helped us to solve that problem, it just adds that layer of trust. And sometimes what we observe now is people just go behind people with a lot of followers. And sometimes people who are inf influencers aren't really using the product. So that credibility is being challenged now.
Speaker: So you have to be very careful about who you choose to be your influencer. Is the person actually somebody who can help build that trust with your audience? Yep, that's what I feel influencer marketing is all about. I love that. But so you bring up an interesting point. What's the difference in influencer marketing versus just really good customer advocacy?
Speaker: It's more of an overlap, you can say, but in an influencer, that person may or may not even be a a user of your product. Like we do these lists at demand -based and not everybody who we select on our list.
Speaker: is a demand -based customer and when we give them that authority you know what you're somebody who can influence it actually motivates them to use the product as well okay they've chosen me but let me see before i go in and deep dive and tell my audience to use something it is okay let me see or what they do or how they're solving like an x problem and that is how they also start to become like a customer if things go well but a customer advocacy is like the person's already there and they may not even influence at times like they would just be like yeah this is a software that we use all the time it does the work
Speaker: And they're not like in there to actually motivate people unless somebody is a die -hard fan. So yep, you've got to try this. We've had some customers who when they switch their jobs, they have all these things in their interview. Oh, is your company ready to change their tech stack? So we have those type of customers as well. But again, like every other company would have customers would who would just be like, it's there. We're using it. It's good. It's doing the job.
Speaker: Also, sometimes I feel like sometimes people would need like that motivating factor. Okay, you know what? If you're ready to promote us, we would give you like a coupon or we would give you an extra month, like a month free or like a trial version. So there's that give and take that happens that also creates that difference because the person's already in touch with us. and We can solve them better. We can understand them better. Okay.
Speaker: They're with the product day in and day out, so they know what exactly is working, what's not working, what are the bugs that they're facing. But an influencer can sometimes be a brand new person who has never used our product, and we need to showcase them that, hey, this is what we do, and we would love for you to like use our product and then influence others to do the same.
Speaker: Perfect. No, I love that. I'm picturing some Venn diagram of you're trying to influence them to want to use the product. They may already be using the product or no, they're not going to use the product. So in all of this, I would love to hear how you became so passionate about influencer marketing.
Speaker: So I was a very social girl, social media, and we were just shifted to this brand new concept called influencer marketing. We had no clue. It was all new. And we started doing these campaigns. We learned about what it was and we started like executing these campaigns, which is when I started to realize that, okay, there's more than just a tag, okay, this is demand basis page, or this is like an X company's page. And people would like visit, they would engage, some posts would do well, some wouldn't. But when I started realizing that, hey, hold on, this is people connecting with people.
Speaker: And this is such a B2C concept, but it's not anymore. Like when we first heard it, we were like, we're connecting to businesses. And slowly we realized that this is such a wrong concept because people still connect with people. And that is when I was like, okay, there's more. And we had done a campaign where we said that demand base has a unicorn AI solution. And we had sent people unicorn pinaras.
Speaker: And that campaign was a huge hit. And that is when I started to realize, okay, you know what? These are humans and we can be like all nice and like like in a bow tie and all of that. But at the end, these are people who are decision makers and they want to solve real problems that they are actually facing.
Speaker: So it's all nice and cute when we say, oh, we have this and we have that. And with all of those fancy words or like business jargons, but when we chat with them, they are, they are like raw with emotions as well. Yep, this is not working and you got to do something about it. So that is when we started to figure out, okay, this is a problem that we won't always be able to identify if we're just like approaching them as a brand.
Speaker: So that is what was like exciting and we learned so many new things. And now, influencer marketing is like everywhere. There's this thing called influencer marketing and SEO now. So it's actually dug that deep. So it's really interesting and I'm sure there's so much more that B2B can do. But yeah, just have to wait and see. No, I love how it's... 100 % you're right. It's people connecting with people, but I also like that you're approaching it. It's also evolving just as much as every other facet of marketing and of business. Yep. True. No, I love that. So would love to know also how you're measuring the revenue of all of this.
Speaker: So honestly, the revenue in influencer marketing campaigns is measured by just super cliche stuff. We give like an influencer links. We give them discount codes, promo codes. We check out the likes, the reach, the engagements, but the actual beauty of this is something that cannot really be measured. Like we've had people come up to us who turned into customers way later. They were like, oh, we saw this post once by this X person who I think you had selected on your list. And that is how I came to know what demand base is all about. And I just read up about them and I took the demo and all of that stuff.
Speaker: So sometimes we've already done the campaign like months ago or years ago, and it actually takes that much amount of time because again, like budget constraints at that point of time, the problem was not there for the product and number of factors. And it just like clicks like, oh, I remember seeing this and I remember seeing that. So actually that is where like the actual beauty lies. And brand awareness is something that is so difficult to measure. Okay, we launched a campaign and we got X number of website views over the blog, which is really good. And we saw X number of people arising and all of that stuff.
Speaker: But is that really why they came? Or is there something that they just wanted to read up and go? They haven't really turned into customers. They've just like just like seeing what's happening or they just found a creative really interesting and they want to read up more about it.
Speaker: So it's hard, it's really hard to measure that, but most immediate things that could be measured is the engagement rates, the likes, comments, reaches, and, yep, website views. And if you have given them like promo codes or like links, affiliate links, that's all that is can be measured in short term. Yeah. Do you have a hard time when it comes to annual budgeting, justifying your how you're going to add FEND to those influencers or your programs because of that? Yeah, initially we had, but luckily now that we have a more wider approach to it and leadership that understands that yep, this is something that is really crucial, it becomes easy.
Speaker: But yeah, it it did have challenges ah when it was started. it ever It was new and it was uncertain. And it was like, we don't know. And it looked like a lot of challenging waters to cross. But yeah, we're happy that we're on the other side now. But yeah, with somebody who is starting out, it can get challenging to prove that. Oh, you were in a lucky spot to have leaders that understand now.
Speaker: You could only imagine for those who are just trying to start out how hard that would be to overcome, especially with some of those, to your point, cliche metrics. And I cliche using your words, but we've all been there as this media girl myself. So they may be cliche, but they are the closest to measure. So yeah perfect. I would love to know what is your biggest piece of advice for people who want to get into influencer marketing or get started with the program?
Speaker: Honestly, just go right in and test every campaign that does come into mind and that you feel is feasible because of course there are budget constraints and end number of factors that play a role, but please do dive in, explore it. The other advice that I would give is don't just run after big names who have a huge following because sometimes they're not exactly really good for your brand. They would promote literally anyone and everyone. So try to identify people who resonate with your brand, whose audience resonates with your brand, and who would genuinely put that effort into understanding what your brand does, what your brand wants.
Speaker: And the biggest among all of these is do not tell the influencer what to write, how to approach the hits audience, what graphics to use. You can give them guidance, because that's obvious. like You can guide them like, hey, these are our brand colors, or this is how we would want you, like the tone, et cetera. But if you're telling the influencer everything to the team,
Speaker: it's your campaign's not going to do well because you're controlling things and you cannot control someone's audience because they are that person's audience because things resonate with them because of them because of their tone because of how they put treat them and if we jump in and destroy that. It's like, no, this is not going to work. So listen to what the influencer has to say back. And yeah, target niche influencer who would actually go out there and help you versus just big names.
Speaker: Perfect. Thank you. So I'm hearing a bit of authenticity matters. Yes, for sure. A hundred percent. Because we have been there as well where we've been like, oh, this person has so many followers and it will be so good for a brand. And that's OK when you have that type of a campaign. But eventually they would literally promote anything and everything. I would still follow them for like content. But there have been times where I've been like,
Speaker: It's too spammy a profile now. And no thank you. So yeah. but Perfect. No, I love that. So one question more for you. This can be about influencer marketing or more you personally. But we'd love to know more, what does resilience mean? Wow. I think it means you should take one step back to take two steps forward. man Because we are faced with any difficult situation, work, personal life. We need that time to absorb it and just be like, okay, like this is where I am, and I need like a clear headspace to find solutions. If I'm going to jump right in,
Speaker: I would take a lot of like emotions with it and we don't want that. So it would be nice to just take a step back and be like, okay, this is what I'm feeling right now and let it just be done with and then your mind space is clear. And so you can take decisions that are not hastily taken or not like super but overly emotional based. Because if you do that, it's not going to really help you. And it would hurt people around you sometimes, be it professional or personal. So it's always good to be like, okay, that's my goal. And I'm over here and it's frustrating because I want to reach there. And it's natural to feel that for sure.
Speaker: But if we just breathe in that time and take a step back and maybe evaluate or write things down, because this is how the saying goes. Like when you write it down, half the problem is solved. So when you write it down, sometimes you feel like, Oh no, what am I thinking? This isn't.
Speaker: a clear picture. So then you'll be like, okay, I assessed all the options and this is what I feel now and I'm in a more calmer space to take better decisions. And that is when you are like, okay, like not just going with the wind and stuff like that. Yeah.
Speaker: I love that because I think too often our gut reaction is to just charge in and solve the problem. And so taking a step back, assessing the situation and looking around. Yeah, I really love that. Take a step back to go two steps forward. Yeah, perfect.
Speaker: Thank you so much for sharing a bit with us today about influencer marketing and what resilience means for you today. But if anyone has more questions about influencer marketing or just wants to chat, feel free to reach out to her on LinkedIn. You can find her there. But really want to thank you for your time and joining us. Thank you. Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker: And that wraps up another episode of Resilient Revenue. These narratives are more than just personal triumphs. They embody the collective journey that we undertake as we strive for a future where every woman, no matter her career stage, location, industry, or demographic profile, has the opportunity to ex excel in her chosen field.
Speaker: Women in revenue exists because we know amazing things can happen when driven, talented, bottom line oriented women are fired up and collaborating to grow their careers and organizations. We invite you to join our amazing community of 7 ,000 plus members. If you'd like to become a member for free, head on over to womeninrevenue .org to join today. See you next time on Resilient Revenue.
