Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
S02E20: Affirmingly Analyzing Andor Season 2, Arc 4
21 Plays8 days ago
It's a wrap on quite possibly the finest Star War ever. Join Bob, Ben, and Phil in breaking down the grand finale and segueing right into Rogue One. We have friends everywhere... so come join us!
Join the Short for a Stormtrooper community!
Discord: https://discord.gg/a89TD3XdFX
Email: SFASpod@gmail.com
Recommended
Transcript
Processing the Series Finale
00:00:01
Speaker
It's the finale of Vandor. We are still kind of processing it. Let's go. Aren't you a little short? Aren't you a little short? Aren't you a little short for a stormtrooper?
00:00:14
Speaker
Okay, gentlemen, before we start, a quick programming note. I had promised that we would share the second part of our conversation about episodes. I got to do the math.
00:00:25
Speaker
Seven, eight, and nine on Thursday of last week. Unfortunately, I've been traveling and I brought it's not that I brought the wrong computer. It's that the audio files that I thought I could get to over the cloud are actually sitting locally on my computer at home.
Delayed Discussion Announcement and Apology
00:00:45
Speaker
So I'm going to have to repost that after I get home, which is going to be sometime next week. So that's going to be a bonus episode. So. Apologies to you, but mostly apologies to our listeners who are just waiting with bated breath for next step. I'll bet they can't wait to hear what's next.
00:01:05
Speaker
Well, let's get to what's next.
Discussion of Episodes 10-12 and Future Plans
00:01:07
Speaker
What's next is episodes 10, 11, and 12, which we watched. And then we followed up with the watching of Rogue One. So we're going to start our conversation with that. And again, the plan is we'll go for two episodes and hopefully one will publish on Tuesday and one will publish on Thursday. I'm just not going to set any guarantees because I'm on the road.
00:01:28
Speaker
Okay. But I think I can do it this time. I think I can do this time. All right, let's get to it. We've already a minute and 20 seconds into this. Who wants to start?
Impactful Moments and Series Commendation
00:01:37
Speaker
I have five words.
00:01:39
Speaker
oh Bring them on, Phil. Rebellions are built on hope. Oh, what a moment. right Man, so good. And that is admittedly from the last section of episodes that we talked about, seven through nine.
00:01:54
Speaker
But it comes up again in Rogue One. And man, does it have additional context to it now? with everything that we know happened on Gorman and Cassian saying that. It really it really does hit different. um you know There's a lot to get to, I think. There's a lot I want to talk about, but in the sake of time, I'll just say, you know well done, Andor. I do really think that they stick the landing here as much as they can, given kind of the circumstances of it being a prequel series to a larger movie.
00:02:24
Speaker
um The Luthan episode is great. I think, really powerful, well-executed backstory.
Standout Episodes and Emotional Sequences
00:02:30
Speaker
I love the details in it, especially like the flashback sequences that Larissa originally looked like they're shot on film in contrast to like the digital.
00:02:38
Speaker
it's really interesting to have visual element to the flashback. um Clea absolutely destroys in the hospital scenes. So good. um Literally and figuratively. Literally and figuratively like destroys.
00:02:51
Speaker
um eleventh episode is really good. But man, the 12th episode, so good. i mean one the raid on the safe house and the shootout and K2SO coming to save the day.
00:03:02
Speaker
So good. um And just like a really emotionally charged episode. And we'll talk about a little more, but man, just that gut punch of seeing Vix with the baby, knowing that we know how Cassian's journey ultimately ends in Rogue One.
00:03:16
Speaker
I was like, oh, why'd you do that to me, Andor? um and And, you know, Vel said val says to him in, I think it's episode 12, maybe, don't wait too long to reach out to Bix.
00:03:29
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. And she clearly knew what was up. Right. He waits too long. Yeah. So sad. Yeah. but So that's definitely on the punch list. I agree.
00:03:40
Speaker
um Ben, let me get your take and then I'll kind of give you a quick overall read.
Tension Building and Emotional Investment
00:03:45
Speaker
Yeah, I'm not going to make this a long list. I think Phil's got covered the greatest hits here we need to we need to zoom in on. But I felt when I watched all of this as though you could feel all the tension in this thing that's been this kind of slow build.
00:03:59
Speaker
think if it's kind of coming to a point like a pyramid, you know, at the top of that pyramid is Rogue One. And Rogue One is just a nonstop. If you think of it in the context of the Andor series, you know, it is like having those high tension, high action episodes, like all rolled into one movie right then as the whole story.
00:04:21
Speaker
So I thought, gosh, it's really a kind of a neat extension. And There's some stuff in Rogue One that, boy, it just hits different now, doesn't it? It does. i'll I'll just pick off the, since we haven't talked about it last, yeah, I'll pick off my list is that the bit where Andor says to Jyn Erso, you know, we've all sacrificed for this, you know? Right.
00:04:44
Speaker
Like, you feel the weight of that in a way that you just didn't then. Yeah, because we've seen it now, right? Or um I think we might have chatted about this earlier, Ben, just you and me privately, is that I've been in this fight since I was six years old.
00:04:57
Speaker
Right. Now we saw how that actually started, and you can really empathize even more with him now. Exactly. Yeah. I will tell you, kind of my overall take is...
00:05:10
Speaker
I acknowledge that I have recency bias. I also acknowledge that I just have Star Wars bias in general, but seriously, I came out of episode 12 thinking, i don't know that I have ever been as emotionally invested in a story and the characters in it ever, you know, Star Wars or not.
00:05:31
Speaker
um I have never felt so connected to characters and, that started That started for me with episode 10. Well, i mean, it's through the whole show, but it started now with episode 10.
00:05:44
Speaker
And it didn't take long from the beginning of that to kind of see where this was going to go, right? Right. you know It's like, okay, we're starting to get, finally, backstory on Luthan and Clea.
00:05:58
Speaker
And are we really going to invest an entire episode just on them? And then if we're going to do that, something it is going to go down. And like from then on, it was just dread for me.
Character Analysis: Luthan and Clea
00:06:11
Speaker
You know, because again, Luthan, character of questionable morals, absolutely no question. But I just love the dude. I would want the dude on my side.
00:06:22
Speaker
And um i think that when um when he was being interrogated by Dedra and she thought she was being so clever in the gallery.
00:06:33
Speaker
And then, you know, he had his back to us. And I realized at that moment, I was like, i've literally I literally, think, said out loud, oh, no, Luthan. You know, like I couldn't help it It was so, so investing. But I just loved that moment to not only tell his whole story and kind of bring closure to his story, but expand the world for Clea.
00:06:57
Speaker
And now we see even more than we did before. What a pivotal role she had in the formation of the rebellion. And in a lot of ways, she is kind of, you know, she is the brains behind Luthien in a lot of ways. She's doing a lot of the back work. And I think throughout the series, because think Luthien gets more screen time, it sort of seems like he's the one pulling the strings, which to some degree he is, no doubt.
00:07:19
Speaker
But I don't think until like episode 10, do we really like truly see what Clay is capable of? She sort of gives hints of it throughout the series. but We really get a chance to see it in episode 10.
00:07:31
Speaker
Yeah, and I've been kind of asking myself through this entire season two, who really is in charge between Clea and Luthan? You know, I mean, who who really is calling the shots?
00:07:42
Speaker
And I think we saw, especially in the back... um in the the flashbacks when she was a little girl and doing that bargaining for the first time and clearly being a better ah trader than Luthen was that, yeah, she really had what she needed to call the shots and and make things happen, even if Luthen probably sometimes thought that he was he was in command.
00:08:07
Speaker
I feel like I also want to highlight that these are the
Themes of Suffering and Sacrifice
00:08:11
Speaker
episodes. You remember a few episodes back, we were talking about how we're seeing all the different ways in which people are suffering and sacrificing on the rebellion side and that we're gonna at some point get the turn the moment where their fortunes are expanding where things are going better for them and so forth and i think we started to see it at the end of the last sequence of episodes as mon mothma escapes where you know if things had been going downhill she would have been captured and so forth yeah but no she escapes and
00:08:44
Speaker
Luthan has this climactic, this is something I really want to spend some time on today. Luthan has this kind of climactic conversation with Deidre. Deidre has a climactic conversation with Krennic.
00:08:55
Speaker
a There's so much great moments that you've been waiting for, for this whole thing that are so heavy is the wrong word. Significant, maybe ah yeah just powerful.
00:09:07
Speaker
And so it's so satisfying to see all that stuff pay off. And then the very last bit we get is is the very opening scene of Rogue One. Right.
00:09:20
Speaker
Yeah. I think, you know, I'll say just a little mean, Krennic, that sequence with Dedra, when he is getting all up in her personal space and is like, I know we don't have visuals on, but when he touches the top of her head, it is just a crazy scene. And just a note about Dedra.
00:09:40
Speaker
I couldn't be happier where she ends up. I'm sorry. i was I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Can we just, and you know, this family friendly show, of not going to, you know, any expletives, but man, I was like, great.
00:09:50
Speaker
You know what? She can go, she can go there and she can be in prison in the, un yr in the uniform with a little orange stripe. I was like, yes. Um, And you know interestingly enough, and I'm sure this was an intentional choice by the showrunners and creators, that we don't see any of her actual reaction or emotion about Cyril.
00:10:13
Speaker
like it Like shown on screen, right? right Whether or not she actually had any because she's heartless is up for debate, I'm sure. Didn't we get her, though, when she had her hands shaking? It was after the Gorman massacre. Yeah.
00:10:26
Speaker
i don't think of but I don't think she knew that Cyril was dead yet. I don't think we get anything about her with Cyril in particular, if if my memory serves. So that's something I was like, really? Really? Nothing? I don't know you talked about. I think, Bob, maybe you said last time or maybe the episode before.
00:10:40
Speaker
She loves him as much as she is capable of. Right. And I don't know how much she's capable of emotionally by this point. Yeah, I agree. If this was a Battlestar Galactica podcast, we could say she can go frack herself.
00:10:56
Speaker
So I was super happy seeing her sitting there on you know one of those prisons. Maybe it was Narkeena 5. Maybe it was just a clone of that. But thinking of her spending the rest of her life basically...
Character Dynamics and Confrontations
00:11:09
Speaker
building components for i'm guessing like this is now headcanon i'm extrapolating when luke destroys the death star about a week later right death star 2 better start building there yep and so she is probably going to be doing that for the rest of her life you know there's ah there's a really interesting thing that i hadn't really noticed uh i can't remember if i saw this from somebody in interviewer commentator lately but There's a really fascinating thing about what happens with her story.
00:11:39
Speaker
When Krennic comes in and reads her the riot act, you know what he's so mad about? He's so mad that she put all the pieces together. He says that thing about her being a scavenger, yeah you know?
00:11:50
Speaker
And it's like, if she hadn't been there doing that what she was doing, trying to put all this stuff in one place, Lonnie couldn't have transmitted it to the rebellion. And then they wouldn't have had all of that other stuff happen, right?
00:12:01
Speaker
Deidre ultimately creates the information package that's necessary to see the whole picture. And if she had just done the job they asked her to do, yep wouldn't happened.
00:12:13
Speaker
That's right.
Rogue One Connection
00:12:15
Speaker
That's right. That's a great point. I heard a little behind the scenes, by the way, I heard that Krennic putting his finger on her head like that, ah completely improvised by Mendelsohn.
00:12:29
Speaker
That's great. the script. And i think I saw Tony Gilroy say he was actually there for the shooting and he was like, oh, that's amazing or something like that.
00:12:40
Speaker
You know, really, really good stuff. Really good stuff. I'll say one thing, and I know we'll probably transition soon into Rogue One. Well, I'll say maybe maybe two things.
00:12:50
Speaker
yeah ah One is that I wouldn't even call it a gripe, but it's like just a little bit, and it just sort of has to do with like, and again, I'll say I really think Endor Six is landing, given what it is, which what it is is a prequel series to a feature length movie.
00:13:05
Speaker
where in my opinion, Cassian is like lead 1.5 slash the second lead. I really feel like Rogue One is Jyn's story. So my one like little gripe pushback against the ending, and again, I don't think there's anything could have done any better, but it feels like kind of the showrunner is saying, you know, Rogue One is kind of the end or finale because it leads directly into Rogue One, right? Kind of Cassian's story ends there.
00:13:30
Speaker
but he is not the main guy in the story. I mean, he is one of the main guys, but again, I really feel like Rogue One is Jin's story. And the fact that in some ways the Endor finale is a little bit quiet, a bit of a quiet transition when they take off and they're going into the events of Rogue One, it just feels a little bit like very kind of subdued, which maybe it's what they were going for, but that's kind of my one thing against it.
00:13:52
Speaker
That, That being said, I will say, and Ben, I think you maybe said this over text, which is that seeing cast the beginning of Rogue One feels like a magic trick. It was so cool to see that after having just watched two seasons of Andorra.
00:14:07
Speaker
Well, and i it's not just Cassian. It's where they leave things with Saw Gerrera. Sure. It's all of these little sort of details. If you start watching all the people you're going to see in Rogue One as they end up in Andor, you're like, oh, that's, yep, that fits, that fits, that fits. And the whole thing sort of has this really wonderful hand in glove thing, which is, it's why that thing i was saying earlier about this kind of thing coming to a ah point with Rogue One, like it's a very smooth pyramid.
00:14:32
Speaker
There's no kind of bumpy transition between the the series and the show. Okay, we're going stop there for now, and we will have part two of the conversation on Thursday.
Conclusion and Listener Engagement
00:14:42
Speaker
I promise this time. So come back then. In the meantime, hit like, hit subscribe, tell your friends.
00:14:47
Speaker
May the Force be with you. We'll see you soon. Who's that mindless choice to do? Podcast, hope you see them through. Star Wars is your favorite in it. Let's chat for 15 minutes.
00:14:59
Speaker
Aren't you a little short? Aren't you a little short? Aren't you a little short for a sporn trooper? Aren't you a little short for us?